Andrew Garfield no, piccolo trains constantly and so do Tien and they are both weak compered to everyone else. Gohan with one day of training wen from piccolo level to around god level. And in the manga it was worse he got a gigantic boost after a short time of training. And broly went from base vegeta to needing a fusion to take him down in one fight
@@REALETH3REAL Yup, what can you do when even the people that write you don't want you to succeed? This is like God having some irrational vendetta against this one guy...
Gohan has always been my favorite character, they did him so dirty by making him weaker. Nowadays, in the recent series, he doesn't even feel that important anymore. He's just there in the background like a side character and it makes me so sad.
@@MoeBogardI want a new story tbh. Goku and Vegeta being the strongest is cool and all, but it's been like 20-ish years now. It would really change the pace if let's say, Yamcha made a wish to turn himself into a Saiyan. Could be an interesting redemption arc.
How could Goku, post Buu, not even have gotten 40-50× stronger in base from Namek? Why is Krillin afraid of guys he never had any problems taking out with ease as early as late Saiyan - early Namek? How can Gohan struggle to become SSJ after a few years of relative inactivity, yet still perform better than Piccolo who gets bodied by fucking Shisami? How could one of the Z fighters not singlehandedly obliterate all of Frieza's men with one blast? How can Roshi be fit to participate, but not Yamcha? Let alone Goten and Trunks. How can Blue Goku not only fail to detect, but get absolute laid out by a laser pistol from a complete nonentity? How can Blue Vegeta not expect or react to Frieza trying to blow up Earth right in front of him and then instantly die? How can Krillin barely avoid a bullet and get hurt then clash with Blue Goku? How can Super Goku be affected by weapons kid Goku wasn't? This is why there are so many ludicrous misconceptions about the scaling, it's all over the place.
i think they wanted to make it more about execution and technique hence why they didn’t include trunks and goten in the ToP, both super saiyans and stronger than someone like Tien, Krillin, Roshi, but weren’t included due to their lack of experience and drive. I think it’s counter intuitive from DBZ cause we were made to believe power levels meant something, but in Super it’snnot about that. I think they did this because they realize they can’t just keep raising power levels forever because it would get repetitive and too many characters would get left behind and they’d have to make new characters.
Yamcha needs to talk to gohan...just be like " gohan.. step your game up...if i had the potential you have i would train every day until i was strongest in all of the multiverse...I'll do beerus like that saibamen did me."
Im still convinced that if Gohan had kept training after he beat cell then he would easily surpass Goku, i get that he doesn't like fighting, but as a sayian it would make way more sense for him to man up, its more like Gohan slowly became more and more human over time which is really weird.
And living around Chi Chi for 7 years WITHOUT his father's influence. She ruined him just like she did Goten. Their family is of fighter ilk , not scholar
@@VegitoBlackk wait a minute, vegito black, that would be the fusion of a zamazu thats taken goku's body and a zamazu thats taken vegeta's body, i godda admit it seems like vegito black could easily get stronger then mastered ultra instict goku.
But its stated by toriyama that gohan is actually the strongest non fused character at the end of the buu arc. Him not keeping up with the training after the cell saga didnt make goku the strongest character at the end of dbz. Dumbass fans hated the idea of gohan becoming the lead and toriyama pussied out at the end though...
Great video I never thought of the hidden power growing and the useable power getting weaker aspect. I also agree with the mind aspect. I think it was you that said if you are thinking negatively you won’t be as powerful as if you were thinking positively. Again big ups for a well thought out vid
Once Gohan switched to CrossFit he lost all his gains. Good thing he has the natty Namekian Piccolo to help him snap out of it. Harold Vanhuge Muscles The Angry Austrian
I feel like hes a way more intelligent fighter now though. He dropped the ego, and is putting all that brain power to work that he spent years trying to attain. Dude has power and is pretty smart to boot.
@@MsMRkv It appears Gohan continued his reconditioning in the 18-19 months between RoF and US. We only saw two scenes of any training, but since we rarely see Gohan in that timeframe there is a lot of time in that span. The fact he was back to muscles and SSJ2 level by the time of US Arc shows he spent some of that time working out.
I don’t care if he stopped training for a while, it makes NO sense that gohan as a child reached a level of mastery over the super saiyan form that he could maintain it all day with no conscious thought or stamina loss, even being able to sleep in it yet he went to not even being able to maintain the form at all. Imagine that with any other skill or ability. Like, imagine if someone was an absolute piano prodigy who could play entire symphonies without even thinking about it and then after a hiatus being unable to play hot cross buns.
As for your Piano example ! That actually happens in real if If a Rapper stop rapping for years and then he decides to wrap again he will have to get back into the feel of it he would have to to get back use to It ! If you played the guitar but u stop and haven't played in 10 years then once you pic it up again you wouldn't be able to play every song u once knew with perfection you would have to get use to it Again ! However i agree with you on Gohan there's no way in hell he should have trouble transform into an SSj2 again nor should he be weaker granted of course his power shouldn't increase either well maybe by a small margin but yeah " I Agree " there's should be no way in hell his power decrease that much !
Lucifer PitchBlack There is a huge difference between “not being able to play every song you once knew with perfection” and not being able to play AT ALL. Gohan went from literally being able to maintain Super Saiyan in his sleep to pretty much not being able to go Super Saiyan at all.
Gohan would be a beast... if he just weren't Gohan. Could you imagine if a character like Babidi (or Emma Frost in Marvel) seperating Gohan from the limiting beliefs and self doubt that hold him back?!?
@retsaM innavoiG not anymore apparently. during TTOP he told goku he wants to work on getting an even stronger from thats completely different from the super saiyan forms.
Shame looking at Gohan drawn so powerfully at the end of the Buu saga and then him as a thin twig in a track suit. It's a visual representation of how botched Super is. Gohan, chastised for not keeping up his training and seeing what that almost cost the world, then goes back to not training again. It seems the longer Super is in the rear view mirror the more I wish it never was. It was ok and had its moments past the horrible Resurrection F saga, but it's not worth it. I say again, the best part is the music.
I feel like we can only wait until the moro arc and the next one after that is animated bcs its safe to say the storytelling from the moro arc alone is actually really good toyotarou stepped up his game.
The fact the DB writers are trying to downplay how much of a BEAST Gohan was in the Buu saga. Which the BoG couldn't have been that many years after Buu. I cannot believe Vegeta closed the gap to Ult Gohan. The writing after Z has gotten so bad it's laughable. Idk anymore
Vegeta getting mad surpassed super saiyan 3 Goku who has been training since the buu saga and Vegeta makes Beerus bleed, Vegeta also took a full punch from Beerus to the face while Goku got tapped twice.. It's complete BS not even too talk about Gohan..
@@powerjolt7215 Super powers along qas even worse then the Buu saga. I can believe a rage boost can do alot so vegeta temporarily being stronger then goku is somewhat ok i guess lol.
Exactly, there isn't any in-universe explanation for it, it's just bad writing, that people are still trying to rationalize it, with shitty theory and rhetoric is beyond me..
Xainfinen what are you guys talking about? It’s bad writing that Gohan stopped training cause he never wanted to fight and just wanted to become a schooler and have a family that’s bad writing?
@@jayglizzyxgaming8812 No, that's actually character development. I'm saying losing power from not training while being the super hybrid of an alien race that evolved to produce one of the most powerful beings in that fictional universe is bad writing. Not sure how you come up to that idea.... Gohan should never have regressed and would have naturally grow more powerful by going through puberty that's simply logical in-universe or out. Letting him be more powerful but stagnant and allowing the others to be above him when he's not angry would fit the current narrative without changing anything. The rest is just plot structure, not very difficult to adjust considering Dabura and Buu's abilities and Babidi's ship energy absorption mechanism. It's just come down to Toriyama's flaws that are equivalent to his talent and the weird fan base.
Cozmix Life He still had access to Potential Unleashed/Mystic, that form is stronger than Super Saiyan 3. Trunks didn’t even need Super Saiyan 2 to easily destroy the androids that killed future Gohan.
They shit on Gohan after Cell. Brought him back as "Mystic/Ultimate" then shit on him again before the T.O.P brought him back again. Then shit on him again during the T.O.P -.- He was my fave after SSJ2
Far too much to be believable. In the 7 year timeskip between Cell and Buu Saga while Gohan did get weaker he still retained his muscles and could still use SSJ1 with no problem while it took some trying to use SSJ2. By the time Buu saga ended Gohan training with the Z Sword had not only made him evem stronger than his Cell Saga counterpart but also had his true strength unlocked by Old Kai allowing him reach to reach the levels of power that would require a fusion to beat and yet just 4 years latter he somehow manages to lose so much power that not only does he loses his Ultimate Form but can't even us SSJ1 properly which i found to be a massive disservice to his character and even if he wasn't as inclined to fight as Goku and Vegeta one gotta admit this was pathetic from Toriyama. Even Masako acknowledges this in his video about plot holes.
Future Gohan wasn't stronger but definitely had more determination to become a fighter but without someone to train him and nudge him on the right path Gohan was unable to realise that there was a level beyond super sayian, we've seen Gohan have confidence issues which were probably way worse when everyone died and he kept getting just knocked around by the androids not to mention he didn't have quite as much innate sense as a fighter he was a good fight no doubt but just didn't have the right mentality in the future timeline to become a great fighter.
I like the idea that Guru unlocking Gohan and Krillin's potential on Namek didn't immediately unlock all the potential that they would ever have right in that very moment, but their potential keeps expanding overtime as they grow up and become better people, and keep quickly and responsively catching up to their new potentials. Gohan being essentially a Goku minus the insanity and a more well-balanced and stable personality, a normal human being, and after dealing with his underconfidence versus Cell and overconfidence versus Buu, and devoting to pursuits of the mind and humanitarianism and saving common people as a superhero, Gohan's potential is just off the charts; even if he has been out of commission for a while he can catch right back up to his new potential heights. I do think Gohan needs to reach a new visible design change for his new power level though, to convey that his ultimate form now is not the same as his ultimate form then. His ultimate form back in Buu was freaking godlike and he was still just playing around. They need to convey with more impact what it's like when he's NOT playing around. Harken back to Future Gohan's heroicness.
Too be honest i don't think gohan ever lost any power in dragon ball he just lost the stamina and therefore the ability too access that power a bit like you could train your body and get stronger then just stop training you might no actually get weaker but you deffinatly will loose the staminia to properly utilize it
Gohan reminds me so much of myself. Full of potential, but, hardly in the right mind state to deliver on that potential. As a martial artist, I have been falling off my training since this so-called pandemic.
*sigh* It's sad that we have to take this obvious case of bad writing as canon. There isn't any in-universe explanation or reason for it, it's just bad writing & illogical even in-universe, yet people still try to rationalize it to make sense of it smh.
Dragon ball doesn't have a definitive canon since so many retcons appear in GT/Super. If you want a definitive canon then that would be the original manga from Goku landing on Earth as a BABY too Goku flying off with Uub.
@MOHAMMED WALI Toriyama gave vague notes which the staff had to interpret into a story.. Toyotaro wrote the manga and added Vegito which the anime also did. And just because Toriyama writes something years later doesn't just magically make it canon. I mean Toriyama had Goku be a baby start off Dragon ball, but retconned him too be a 3 year old toddler who actually sees Bardock and Gine and cries about leaving. Bardock was also put in the original manga, but the one from the special. In the manga it's shown that Bardock had his red bandana which has the blood off his fallen ally (Tora I think was his name..) and he was shown in his armour from the special as well as during the rebellion. Also Dragon ball super was made years later about 20 I think and it completely contradicts end of Z (which is in the original manga) where Bulma says that they were in a time of peace for 10 years. I like GT, but it also can't be considered "canon" since fusion reborn is canon in that universe (fusion reborn is a movie that doesn't fit into dbz's lore. Wrath of the Dragon maybe.) So what I basically wanna say is don't be like supertards are and try too claim super as a canonical continuation of Dragon ball Z when it's a show made almost 2 decades later and contradicts the original main manga which Toriyama did write. Also minus sucks and contradicts the original manga so don't count it especially considering how it ruins Bardock (in my opinion) Alright I'm done.
@MOHAMMED WALI Just because fans accept it as a continuation makes it a continuation, but you are right its confirmed too come after the buu saga right at the start of the 10 year timeskip. Toei confirmed it a continuation which they also did with GT. GT had its problems yes too a lesser extent than Super, but whatever. It was a show which some people hated, some people liked and some loved specifically the Japanese version which had a different tone than Z had a darker tone. Most GT hate was because of Goku becoming a kid (an idea Toriyama loved and actually wished he thought off.) Most hate stemmed from the western audiences. Most fans hate super for a reason as well, but I don't hate it I "accept" it too some extent. Toriyama is said too be forgetful. Causing major contradictions too his original manga which is really annoying. Again Toyotaro writes the super manga and is supervised by Toriyama. The anime staff write the show with vague notes they get from Toriyama. The writer of the show also changes. Which is why the show continuity is so messed up. Toriyama has never used the word "canon" in his life. Yes dbs follows after dbs. (I don't know if it follows the manga or anime, but I'd say manga just because Vegeta goes God..) Lots of people agree with me that Dragon ball's only real canon would be the original manga/ that there isn't a definitive canon due too contradictions and retcons. And no I'm not being dumb I'm looking at Dragon ball from a reasonable point of view which you don't apparently..
@MOHAMMED WALI Ok most people don't hate super but dislike too put it lighter. Yes they do think super is silly and more childish and had poor animation. Things that changed when Black was introduced and onward, but you can't disagree with the fact that Super's sagas lacked connectivity and in some cases had bad writing and scaling. The movie was phenomenal. You're telling me that Super is canon, but that canon shouldn't be used and that everything can be canon for all you care... Ok... Agreed regarding GT being said to be a GRAND side story and super being said too be a continuation by Toei like they once said regarding GT, but whatever.
@MOHAMMED WALI I'll read the Moro arc cause I am interested in Vegeta's spirit control and yardrat training. Also did he actually use instant transmission? Cause that would be cool.
It all depends on the training. There's training to improve and training to maintain what was gained. Gohan didn't do either. Piccolo trains through mental training and multi-form sparring. But he only maintains and gradually improves that way. The most effective ways to quickly improve is by having a training partner or through new training exercises and techniques. That's how Gohan reclaimed the power he lost in a short span of time. I'd also include that his body wasn't a stranger to that power, and it quickly welcomed it back.
They could write him as an instable fighter who relies on his smarts instead of muscles alone. One that has the will to fight, but lacks the body, without training. Like able to use his Ultimate form for short spurts only. They could let him invent new techniques on the fly, or strategize for the whole team, replacing Piccolo, surpassing him. They literally don't know what to do with him.
Toriyama is to thank for this nerf sadly. He even said that upon developing gohan his intent was to have him take over in gokus stead but he realized that his character was a nerd basically and he didn’t fit the criteria of being top dog. It’s stated that by the end of the buu saga he was the strongest z fighter.
Not exactly because SSJ3 was going blow for blow but Kid Buu but Vegito DESTROYED Buuhan, like it wasn't even close... So I would still say that Vegito would be stronger. But you're right, there is NO WAAAAAAY that Kid Buu is stronger than Buuhan. He was even being held back by Fat Buu and SSJ2 Vegeta... Buuhan would kill them with one blow.
These analytical videos are hilarious. Power levels are an ass pull. they just make every character as powerful as they want and everyone has known that since this reboot. Trying to justify it is just tying yourself in knots.
@@VegitoBlackk Well it's essentially a state that allows him to grasp his full potential at any time and in base; thus eliminating his transformations. So as long as he can tap into that state, it should restore him to the peak of his full and ever rising potential which could explain why he was able to face Blue Goku - That's how strong he would have been with training. (LSM touched on this in the video actually.) So essentially, the potential unlock state is like a cheat code. I think it's ludicrous, but that's my best attempt at rationalizing this...
If you mean 'He'll never be the main protagonist' then I have to sadly agree. But then again, that one went south back in 1993. However, I actually felt the character was improved in some ways.
Instead of having a spirit bomb finish vs kid buu , they shouldve had Gotenks , gohan , vegeta , and goku all go at kid buu at the same time and all hit em with a beam struggle together for the win or they all use their finisher attacks at the same time . id much rather of had a finish like that as all 4 were really strong at that point and all had their individual chances against buu but couldn't finish it but when they all work together then they find a way to win . this is much better than asspull spirit bomb .
he did become a scholar so he does have to balance schooling and training so it's understandable that he lost some of his edge and has a child as well, gohan did keep up with universe 11,s top the next god of destruction in training
DB Super could've used Gohan a lot more and had him level up and should've been the one to aquire the Ultra Instinct power; Goku already had obtained the God mode so that became a character overkill in my opinion. Gohan could have tapped into the Ultra Instinct power making it the next level of his Mystic power with the help of Old Kai. Gotenks was forgotten I would've loved to see more of him but as I guess they weren't important characters. However, I fully stand behind my take on Gohan and I wish Toriyama would've had took Gohan more seriously.
You know what was a missed opportunity? Goku's children was reared mostly by Chi-Chi. Meaning what have they benefitted from except being weak half-saiyans? Chi-Chi is the death of Earth once Goku passes because going to school instead of training with Goku benefitted them absolutely nothing. Good job Toriyama! Nice message!
The scene with Beerus saying Goku couldn't beat Frieza in base really seemed like Beerus misjudging his power. Goku *was* pretty casual at that moment.
At the rate piccolo trains he if never Baden as strong as goku or vegeta he should know all of the top tier techniques in the universe he should be like a king kai or some shit
This was his dream as future trunks says gohan always wanted to be a scholar, the clip with trunks seeing future gohan fulfil his dream via gohan is aweosme
My power levels. ( I will do more along the way) RADITZ SAGA --------------------------------------------------------- Raditz: 1,200. Goku: 328 ( Vs Raditz ) Piccolo: 322 ( Vs Raditz Krillin: 228 ( Dbz ep 1. ) Gohan: 1,388 ( Rage ) Master Roshi: 145 ( Dbz ep 1. ) Goku: 408 ( Warp Kamehameha ) Piccolo: 1380 ( Special Beam Cannon )
Everyone Goku and Vegeta fought in Buu's mind in Z were mental projections from Buu's subconscious. Gohan's body was still bound. But still, it's a bit silly. But Dragon Ball is kind of like that. Toriyama always forgets things. Which is kind of the case with everything else you've stated.
To be honest, Goku and Vegeta were completely ruined by Dragon Ball Super just for "comedy" that isn't even funny for 10+ aged kids. You might remember that Super Saiyan forms would change the ones who use the forms to be more aggressive etc. which caused Goku (in the Buu saga) and Gohan (Buu saga too) be almost always serious, But once again, Super caused them not to be too serious since it wouldn't be as interesting, it was also for kids too. Gohan was ruined by Super too, because he could train every once in a while since he himself knew that he is pretty powerful, well he's smart obviously, or Super ruined him just so he wouldn't be too Overpowered because even they know Gohan would be too strong.
A work around for Beerus not believing Goku could beat Freeza is pretty simple... but not explained and needs more work arounds5 seconds after Beerus says it. Since Raditz showed up with his scouter to check power levels it’s been shown they can fluctuate. When Beerus says this to base Goku it’s probably true... if Goku stayed at that level without increasing power... But instead of increasing his power to show he can beat Freeza without transforming (which he should be able to) he transforms into SSj.
Actually during the time goku was facing fat buu he simply had to go super sayian 3 to even keep up. Gottens was already able to destroy fat buu and a fusion of buu and piccolo. Goku legit told gotten and gohan that they could fight of buu because he couldn't handle him. When goku was brought back he was confident that kid buu was a easy fight for him and how weak he was comparedto super buu. While gohan was able to destroy buu and gotten absorbed in his base form!
If Gohan trained for all those years(from the cell saga 2super) and maintained his full power he would probably be close to Jiren or if not he could probably just put a good fight.
It really does blow that Gohan is effectively the new Yamcha, a fighter who was badass when introduced and then made into a joke over time. It was effectively the Cell saga that really brought him out to his maximum, but then he lost it all in between then and the Buu saga. Now in super, he can barely fight at all. _"No, you were cool because of me!"_ -- Perfect Cell of the DevilArtemis Universe.
I have two questions I always assumed super buu was stronger than kid buu. Especially after absorption. And that's why Goku and Vegeta actually stood a chance. Is that not the case? When they did the ritual to turn Goku into a god, did the other saiyans lose any power? Which would mean that Gohan immediately became weaker than he already was.
At the part talking about Japanese mythology, that image is from Chinese Mythology...Sun Wukong the Monkey King, Great Sage equal to the Heavens...which is part of what inspired Goku's character himself. xD other than that little bit, I enjoyed this video and discussion about Gohan (my favorite DB character)
Regarding Vegeta saying Goku is the strongest fighter at the beginning of Super, it should be noted that Vegeta was actually dead while gotenks and gohan fought buu so he hasn't seen them fight at full power (unless you count "yo son goku and friends return"). He did, however, witness goku's ssj3 firsthand when the latter fought buu so that would explain his bias there
@@DerpaTure9503 Vegeta does also mention his brother in passing during the Broly movie. I'm not here to say whether or not you _should_ mark it as canon, only that one _could_ argue it is canon
I would’ve loved that gohan’s success and great power from the top in the manga would’ve translated to the anime, like you see the huge difference on how they portray Gohan in the manga and in the anime, the power difference is just too much!
I know this is old but: since you need to access the ultimate form like a super saiyan and he died. Not only should he have reverted to base but also the ideal of “if you don’t use it, lose it” it kind of makes sense his sheer lack of training (to rework his genetics like athletes and defaultly every 7 years for newfound potential) not only over 7 years would catch up to him for another 4 to 5 years. It’s not like for Battle of Gods we didn’t need the poster “corrected” from SS Gohan and how GT also used SS Gohan. Despite a guide saying he never stopped training after Z (most likely the 10 year skip) some content after Z like Yo Son Goku & Friends Return somewhat suggests he took it too easy after Buu just like Goten & Trunks. So I doubt he ever really stacked it but I also think it explains how Goku & Vegeta could surpass him in 4 to 5 years so quickly given how powerful Gohan should be in comparison if he took getting stronger and improving his battle prowess more seriously.
Very Long Story Short:They had to make very clear in Super that Goku is the main character, Vegeta 2nd main. To be fair, that would be helpful for new or casual viewers
Gohan and broly are characters we all know would literally shit on everyone if they got serious training from someone stronger then them.
If Gohan kept up his Gainz after Z the way we wanted him to, and kept training in Super, seeing Gohan vs Broly would've been cash money.
Especially if they fused
Harold would train them, but then he’d have to pay Toriyama royalties..
That’s basically the case for every character in Z
Andrew Garfield no, piccolo trains constantly and so do Tien and they are both weak compered to everyone else. Gohan with one day of training wen from piccolo level to around god level. And in the manga it was worse he got a gigantic boost after a short time of training. And broly went from base vegeta to needing a fusion to take him down in one fight
You would have thought what after the Buu Saga he wouldn't ever let himself get weak again. Yet he did
Yeh, seeing Gohan juggle being a father, husband, and defender of earth would've been a good story but I guess fuck me.
@@erhiueQWEF *and researcher
If anything, getting his ass kicked by Buu might have convinced him to quit fighting altogether.
@@erhiueQWEF Just If he even maintained it, say 1hr a day like all of us. At least he didn't get fat
@@agerard6297 Yes and no, Gohan has had many beatings in his life so I reckon he is use to it.
He didn't lose power, he lost *respecc*
Andrew Ace from the writers 💯
@@REALETH3REAL Yup, what can you do when even the people that write you don't want you to succeed? This is like God having some irrational vendetta against this one guy...
@@AndrewAce. but, like, everyone in the actual show still respects him. Even Beerus at the end of the TOP.
@@thegreatgmantheguy He was supposed to be team leader. What happened to that?
@@AndrewAce. Freiza called him captain in Gohan's last episode.
Gohan has always been my favorite character, they did him so dirty by making him weaker. Nowadays, in the recent series, he doesn't even feel that important anymore. He's just there in the background like a side character and it makes me so sad.
Yup same here
After taking off cell he kinda went down hill, almost like if he became gokus shadow instead of growing out of him, thats why teen gohan is so good
not just him every z fighter is a side character now.
@@MoeBogardI want a new story tbh.
Goku and Vegeta being the strongest is cool and all, but it's been like 20-ish years now.
It would really change the pace if let's say, Yamcha made a wish to turn himself into a Saiyan.
Could be an interesting redemption arc.
How could Goku, post Buu, not even have gotten 40-50× stronger in base from Namek?
Why is Krillin afraid of guys he never had any problems taking out with ease as early as late Saiyan - early Namek?
How can Gohan struggle to become SSJ after a few years of relative inactivity, yet still perform better than Piccolo who gets bodied by fucking Shisami?
How could one of the Z fighters not singlehandedly obliterate all of Frieza's men with one blast?
How can Roshi be fit to participate, but not Yamcha? Let alone Goten and Trunks.
How can Blue Goku not only fail to detect, but get absolute laid out by a laser pistol from a complete nonentity?
How can Blue Vegeta not expect or react to Frieza trying to blow up Earth right in front of him and then instantly die?
How can Krillin barely avoid a bullet and get hurt then clash with Blue Goku?
How can Super Goku be affected by weapons kid Goku wasn't?
This is why there are so many ludicrous misconceptions about the scaling, it's all over the place.
EXPLODE!!! ! Consistency has always been an issue with DB... it will forever drive you crazy
ohh yea the mystic form makes ssj much harder to transform
Yeah bulma was angry with goten and trunks. But not with roshi.
Android 17 and frieza are the worst cases tbh
Super is terrible. That’s why.
Super just completely destroyed power levels, none of it makes any sense. It's not even worth discussing power in Dragon Ball anymore.
Mr Jobocan to be fair the power levels stopped making sense after the frieza saga in dbz
MrJobocan how
MrJobocan and yes this does make sense
i think they wanted to make it more about execution and technique hence why they didn’t include trunks and goten in the ToP, both super saiyans and stronger than someone like Tien, Krillin, Roshi, but weren’t included due to their lack of experience and drive. I think it’s counter intuitive from DBZ cause we were made to believe power levels meant something, but in Super it’snnot about that. I think they did this because they realize they can’t just keep raising power levels forever because it would get repetitive and too many characters would get left behind and they’d have to make new characters.
Yeah because the does Goku has 150.000.000 or 160.000.000 ( a gun shot is 8) makes totaly more sin.
Yamcha needs to talk to gohan...just be like " gohan.. step your game up...if i had the potential you have i would train every day until i was strongest in all of the multiverse...I'll do beerus like that saibamen did me."
Wanna hear a joke? “Yamcha”
And it would work since yamchas gohans reel dad XD
"Hey Gohan, wanna go play professional baseball with me?"
Yamcha is just the greatest "best buddy" character for anyone, name one character that yamcha couldn't be friends with. This man befriended *FREIZA.*
@@RamielEdits I think beerus
Im still convinced that if Gohan had kept training after he beat cell then he would easily surpass Goku, i get that he doesn't like fighting, but as a sayian it would make way more sense for him to man up, its more like Gohan slowly became more and more human over time which is really weird.
And living around Chi Chi for 7 years WITHOUT his father's influence. She ruined him just like she did Goten. Their family is of fighter ilk , not scholar
@@VegitoBlackk wait a minute, vegito black, that would be the fusion of a zamazu thats taken goku's body and a zamazu thats taken vegeta's body, i godda admit it seems like vegito black could easily get stronger then mastered ultra instict goku.
@@Reppen555 you'd be right
But its stated by toriyama that gohan is actually the strongest non fused character at the end of the buu arc. Him not keeping up with the training after the cell saga didnt make goku the strongest character at the end of dbz.
Dumbass fans hated the idea of gohan becoming the lead and toriyama pussied out at the end though...
that was Akiras plan to make Gohan the main protagonist but nobody wanted that shit so he kept goku as the main
Great video I never thought of the hidden power growing and the useable power getting weaker aspect. I also agree with the mind aspect. I think it was you that said if you are thinking negatively you won’t be as powerful as if you were thinking positively. Again big ups for a well thought out vid
They made Gohan so strong a few hours before ToP, but imagine if he kept training the whole time.
Then you'd have Gohan from the Manga
I hate how he just re gained all his power in one episode, it doesn’t really feel “earned” or “valuable”
Vegito Black Exactly
EmJee I just told myself that he was in the chamber of time for a day/year
He would be stronger than Goku and Vegeta, for sure
Once Gohan switched to CrossFit he lost all his gains. Good thing he has the natty Namekian Piccolo to help him snap out of it.
Harold Vanhuge Muscles
The Angry Austrian
I feel like hes a way more intelligent fighter now though. He dropped the ego, and is putting all that brain power to work that he spent years trying to attain. Dude has power and is pretty smart to boot.
If he lost that much imagine how much the boost was when he beat Kefla in Super Manga
In the manga at least he was training before the ToP, unlike in the anime where he only trains for one day and gets crazy strong.
Astronomical
@@MsMRkv I don't think that's true. There is an episode at the end Gohan is training with Picolo way before the TOP.
+jovanbiljon He only trained a little bit and then he stopped. In the manga he was training a lot before the ToP.
@@MsMRkv It appears Gohan continued his reconditioning in the 18-19 months between RoF and US. We only saw two scenes of any training, but since we rarely see Gohan in that timeframe there is a lot of time in that span. The fact he was back to muscles and SSJ2 level by the time of US Arc shows he spent some of that time working out.
I don’t care if he stopped training for a while, it makes NO sense that gohan as a child reached a level of mastery over the super saiyan form that he could maintain it all day with no conscious thought or stamina loss, even being able to sleep in it yet he went to not even being able to maintain the form at all.
Imagine that with any other skill or ability. Like, imagine if someone was an absolute piano prodigy who could play entire symphonies without even thinking about it and then after a hiatus being unable to play hot cross buns.
As for your Piano example ! That actually happens in real if If a Rapper stop rapping for years and then he decides to wrap again he will have to get back into the feel of it he would have to to get back use to It ! If you played the guitar but u stop and haven't played in 10 years then once you pic it up again you wouldn't be able to play every song u once knew with perfection you would have to get use to it Again ! However i agree with you on
Gohan there's no way in hell he should have trouble transform into an SSj2 again nor should he be weaker granted of course his power shouldn't increase either well maybe by a small margin but yeah " I Agree " there's should be no way in hell his power decrease that much !
Lucifer PitchBlack There is a huge difference between “not being able to play every song you once knew with perfection” and not being able to play AT ALL. Gohan went from literally being able to maintain Super Saiyan in his sleep to pretty much not being able to go Super Saiyan at all.
@@Vgamer311 Yeah i know ! I also said i agree with You !
Gohan would be a beast... if he just weren't Gohan. Could you imagine if a character like Babidi (or Emma Frost in Marvel) seperating Gohan from the limiting beliefs and self doubt that hold him back?!?
Chi Chi ruined him
@@VegitoBlackk Gohan made his choice.
@retsaM innavoiG not anymore apparently. during TTOP he told goku he wants to work on getting an even stronger from thats completely different from the super saiyan forms.
Majin Gohan?
Majin Gohan sounds ridiculous yet amazing
Jiren and Goku looked at kefla and were like wo that booty fine as hell.
😂🤣
It is frfr.
Gohan: I wonder whats next for me?
Picalo: You peaked.
Gohan: What!
Picalo: you peaked.
Gohan: Bbbut I get stronger right?
Picalo; Yah..but..No
I prefer Ultimate Gohan / Buu Saga. Majin Buu: "You wanna fight me??" Gohan: "No. I wanna kill you." Videl "Gohan. Wanna date me?" Gohan: "No. I wanna f*** you." LOL
Wait did he really say that to videl? Lol
gb a abridged lmao
Shame looking at Gohan drawn so powerfully at the end of the Buu saga and then him as a thin twig in a track suit. It's a visual representation of how botched Super is. Gohan, chastised for not keeping up his training and seeing what that almost cost the world, then goes back to not training again. It seems the longer Super is in the rear view mirror the more I wish it never was. It was ok and had its moments past the horrible Resurrection F saga, but it's not worth it. I say again, the best part is the music.
I feel like we can only wait until the moro arc and the next one after that is animated bcs its safe to say the storytelling from the moro arc alone is actually really good toyotarou stepped up his game.
They just make characters stronger when they need to but never strong enough to matter unless your goku or sometimes vegeta
Nope. Only goku. Vegeta constantly gets cockblocked. Just like recently....
Akira should sell Dragon Ball rights to oda
@@yonkobuster112 Yh it don't work like that
The fact the DB writers are trying to downplay how much of a BEAST Gohan was in the Buu saga. Which the BoG couldn't have been that many years after Buu. I cannot believe Vegeta closed the gap to Ult Gohan. The writing after Z has gotten so bad it's laughable. Idk anymore
Vegeta getting mad surpassed super saiyan 3 Goku who has been training since the buu saga and Vegeta makes Beerus bleed, Vegeta also took a full punch from Beerus to the face while Goku got tapped twice..
It's complete BS not even too talk about Gohan..
@@powerjolt7215 Super powers along qas even worse then the Buu saga. I can believe a rage boost can do alot so vegeta temporarily being stronger then goku is somewhat ok i guess lol.
Guess you're right..
He lost all of his power and relevance. I thought was pretty obvious.
It's just terrible and sometimes forgetful writing.
Exactly, there isn't any in-universe explanation for it, it's just bad writing, that people are still trying to rationalize it, with shitty theory and rhetoric is beyond me..
Xainfinen what are you guys talking about? It’s bad writing that Gohan stopped training cause he never wanted to fight and just wanted to become a schooler and have a family that’s bad writing?
@@jayglizzyxgaming8812 No, that's actually character development. I'm saying losing power from not training while being the super hybrid of an alien race that evolved to produce one of the most powerful beings in that fictional universe is bad writing. Not sure how you come up to that idea....
Gohan should never have regressed and would have naturally grow more powerful by going through puberty that's simply logical in-universe or out. Letting him be more powerful but stagnant and allowing the others to be above him when he's not angry would fit the current narrative without changing anything. The rest is just plot structure, not very difficult to adjust considering Dabura and Buu's abilities and Babidi's ship energy absorption mechanism. It's just come down to Toriyama's flaws that are equivalent to his talent and the weird fan base.
Gohan is that character on every fighting game, that didn't deserve to be nerfed.
Love these videos bro!!!
In the first two arcs of DBS, Tien was stronger than base Gohan.
Raditz was probably stronger than base Gohan in early Super.
Whattt
Epotheros Thats not even possible
@@chasify642 actually it is think about if you think about
Cozmix Life He still had access to Potential Unleashed/Mystic, that form is stronger than Super Saiyan 3. Trunks didn’t even need Super Saiyan 2 to easily destroy the androids that killed future Gohan.
Great point in bringing up the TOEI Haxxed Goku being very likely to be the continuity DBS based itself on. Good stuff!
4:05 thank god someone on TH-cam finally gets it ...also saiyans get stronger when they’re reborn so that explains it
They shit on Gohan after Cell.
Brought him back as "Mystic/Ultimate" then shit on him again before the T.O.P brought him back again. Then shit on him again during the T.O.P -.- He was my fave after SSJ2
Far too much to be believable. In the 7 year timeskip between Cell and Buu Saga while Gohan did get weaker he still retained his muscles and could still use SSJ1 with no problem while it took some trying to use SSJ2. By the time Buu saga ended Gohan training with the Z Sword had not only made him evem stronger than his Cell Saga counterpart but also had his true strength unlocked by Old Kai allowing him reach to reach the levels of power that would require a fusion to beat and yet just 4 years latter he somehow manages to lose so much power that not only does he loses his Ultimate Form but can't even us SSJ1 properly which i found to be a massive disservice to his character and even if he wasn't as inclined to fight as Goku and Vegeta one gotta admit this was pathetic from Toriyama. Even Masako acknowledges this in his video about plot holes.
I agree.
I love that Shawn Michaels bit
EXPLODE!!! ! Stop starting shit
EXPLODE!!! ! I now I’m just saying don’t piss them off
2:37 beerus face here always gets me 😂😂
Simple, he lost all of it. He’s basically a human
Future gohan was stronger than this gohan it's kinda sad how he died
Nope, never.
Future Gohan wasn't stronger but definitely had more determination to become a fighter but without someone to train him and nudge him on the right path Gohan was unable to realise that there was a level beyond super sayian, we've seen Gohan have confidence issues which were probably way worse when everyone died and he kept getting just knocked around by the androids not to mention he didn't have quite as much innate sense as a fighter he was a good fight no doubt but just didn't have the right mentality in the future timeline to become a great fighter.
Yea he lost a arm and I feel he got humiliating death, being scorned with no choice
Future gohan was weak af. He couldnt even beat 18!
Infinus YT idk, thats kinda hard to say, considering everytime he fought the androids it was 2 on 1
I like the idea that Guru unlocking Gohan and Krillin's potential on Namek didn't immediately unlock all the potential that they would ever have right in that very moment, but their potential keeps expanding overtime as they grow up and become better people, and keep quickly and responsively catching up to their new potentials. Gohan being essentially a Goku minus the insanity and a more well-balanced and stable personality, a normal human being, and after dealing with his underconfidence versus Cell and overconfidence versus Buu, and devoting to pursuits of the mind and humanitarianism and saving common people as a superhero, Gohan's potential is just off the charts; even if he has been out of commission for a while he can catch right back up to his new potential heights. I do think Gohan needs to reach a new visible design change for his new power level though, to convey that his ultimate form now is not the same as his ultimate form then. His ultimate form back in Buu was freaking godlike and he was still just playing around. They need to convey with more impact what it's like when he's NOT playing around. Harken back to Future Gohan's heroicness.
Gohan would’ve been the strongest if he didn’t stop training
yeah
Yamcha could've been stronger than krillin/Tien if he did not stop training
@@caktikoid1372 man i really wonder why
Them not doing Gohan vs Kefla in the anime and giving it to goku was bullshit, we were robbed.
Too be honest i don't think gohan ever lost any power in dragon ball he just lost the stamina and therefore the ability too access that power a bit like you could train your body and get stronger then just stop training you might no actually get weaker but you deffinatly will loose the staminia to properly utilize it
Gohan reminds me so much of myself. Full of potential, but, hardly in the right mind state to deliver on that potential.
As a martial artist, I have been falling off my training since this so-called pandemic.
Wow I’m watching this early. Faster than Gohan losing respect.
By who?
The Great G-man The Guy the writers
I relate a lot to Gohan. I’ve always doubt myself and have never been too confident in myself.
*sigh* It's sad that we have to take this obvious case of bad writing as canon. There isn't any in-universe explanation or reason for it, it's just bad writing & illogical even in-universe, yet people still try to rationalize it to make sense of it smh.
Dragon ball doesn't have a definitive canon since so many retcons appear in GT/Super. If you want a definitive canon then that would be the original manga from Goku landing on Earth as a BABY too Goku flying off with Uub.
@MOHAMMED WALI Toriyama gave vague notes which the staff had to interpret into a story..
Toyotaro wrote the manga and added Vegito which the anime also did.
And just because Toriyama writes something years later doesn't just magically make it canon. I mean Toriyama had Goku be a baby start off Dragon ball, but retconned him too be a 3 year old toddler who actually sees Bardock and Gine and cries about leaving.
Bardock was also put in the original manga, but the one from the special. In the manga it's shown that Bardock had his red bandana which has the blood off his fallen ally (Tora I think was his name..) and he was shown in his armour from the special as well as during the rebellion.
Also Dragon ball super was made years later about 20 I think and it completely contradicts end of Z (which is in the original manga) where Bulma says that they were in a time of peace for 10 years.
I like GT, but it also can't be considered "canon" since fusion reborn is canon in that universe (fusion reborn is a movie that doesn't fit into dbz's lore. Wrath of the Dragon maybe.)
So what I basically wanna say is don't be like supertards are and try too claim super as a canonical continuation of Dragon ball Z when it's a show made almost 2 decades later and contradicts the original main manga which Toriyama did write. Also minus sucks and contradicts the original manga so don't count it especially considering how it ruins Bardock (in my opinion)
Alright I'm done.
@MOHAMMED WALI Just because fans accept it as a continuation makes it a continuation, but you are right its confirmed too come after the buu saga right at the start of the 10 year timeskip. Toei confirmed it a continuation which they also did with GT.
GT had its problems yes too a lesser extent than Super, but whatever. It was a show which some people hated, some people liked and some loved specifically the Japanese version which had a different tone than Z had a darker tone. Most GT hate was because of Goku becoming a kid (an idea Toriyama loved and actually wished he thought off.) Most hate stemmed from the western audiences.
Most fans hate super for a reason as well, but I don't hate it I "accept" it too some extent.
Toriyama is said too be forgetful. Causing major contradictions too his original manga which is really annoying.
Again Toyotaro writes the super manga and is supervised by Toriyama. The anime staff write the show with vague notes they get from Toriyama. The writer of the show also changes. Which is why the show continuity is so messed up.
Toriyama has never used the word "canon" in his life. Yes dbs follows after dbs. (I don't know if it follows the manga or anime, but I'd say manga just because Vegeta goes God..)
Lots of people agree with me that Dragon ball's only real canon would be the original manga/ that there isn't a definitive canon due too contradictions and retcons.
And no I'm not being dumb I'm looking at Dragon ball from a reasonable point of view which you don't apparently..
@MOHAMMED WALI Ok most people don't hate super but dislike too put it lighter.
Yes they do think super is silly and more childish and had poor animation. Things that changed when Black was introduced and onward, but you can't disagree with the fact that Super's sagas lacked connectivity and in some cases had bad writing and scaling.
The movie was phenomenal.
You're telling me that Super is canon, but that canon shouldn't be used and that everything can be canon for all you care... Ok...
Agreed regarding GT being said to be a GRAND side story and super being said too be a continuation by Toei like they once said regarding GT, but whatever.
@MOHAMMED WALI I'll read the Moro arc cause I am interested in Vegeta's spirit control and yardrat training. Also did he actually use instant transmission? Cause that would be cool.
This dude explains so well thats y im going to subscribe
It all depends on the training. There's training to improve and training to maintain what was gained. Gohan didn't do either. Piccolo trains through mental training and multi-form sparring. But he only maintains and gradually improves that way. The most effective ways to quickly improve is by having a training partner or through new training exercises and techniques. That's how Gohan reclaimed the power he lost in a short span of time. I'd also include that his body wasn't a stranger to that power, and it quickly welcomed it back.
now I know why teachers tell us to keep practice, practice, practice and practice
If he continue training After the Battle with Cell he will be stronger than goku
They could write him as an instable fighter who relies on his smarts instead of muscles alone. One that has the will to fight, but lacks the body, without training. Like able to use his Ultimate form for short spurts only.
They could let him invent new techniques on the fly, or strategize for the whole team, replacing Piccolo, surpassing him.
They literally don't know what to do with him.
I always felt like goku got a lot of zenkai boosts after he got revived in buu arc .
Toriyama is to thank for this nerf sadly. He even said that upon developing gohan his intent was to have him take over in gokus stead but he realized that his character was a nerd basically and he didn’t fit the criteria of being top dog. It’s stated that by the end of the buu saga he was the strongest z fighter.
If Kid Buu is stronger than Buuhan, than SSJ3 Goku would have to be stronger than Super Vegito. Im sorry but that's just impossible.
Not exactly because SSJ3 was going blow for blow but Kid Buu but Vegito DESTROYED Buuhan, like it wasn't even close... So I would still say that Vegito would be stronger. But you're right, there is NO WAAAAAAY that Kid Buu is stronger than Buuhan. He was even being held back by Fat Buu and SSJ2 Vegeta... Buuhan would kill them with one blow.
Yeah, Buuhan is the strongest buu.
These videos are so fun to watch
He lost his power because he had to focus on his family
Toriyama mentioned that Gohan was the strongest unmerged fighter at the end of Dragon Ball Z, even stronger than Goku SSJ3.
Tiago Beça no he didn’t, that never happened
@@jayglizzyxgaming8812 But he is right , Gohan is the strongest not merged fighter in dbz
none of that matters now does it?
Really good video love the work
These analytical videos are hilarious. Power levels are an ass pull. they just make every character as powerful as they want and everyone has known that since this reboot. Trying to justify it is just tying yourself in knots.
I’m a new subscriber. Really dig your videos. Loving the topics and the debates
Why’d they just make gohan such a lame throw away garbage unlikeable nerd character
That’s one way to describe him 😂
Dude went from “don’t fuck with me 😎💪”
To “please stop fucking with me 🥺🙏”
None, actually, he lost a form for a while, but not power
I actually have a minor theory on his "Ultimate" state as to why he can always remain at peak power while in it...
@@AndrewAce. Well...let's hear it
@@VegitoBlackk Well it's essentially a state that allows him to grasp his full potential at any time and in base; thus eliminating his transformations. So as long as he can tap into that state, it should restore him to the peak of his full and ever rising potential which could explain why he was able to face Blue Goku - That's how strong he would have been with training. (LSM touched on this in the video actually.)
So essentially, the potential unlock state is like a cheat code.
I think it's ludicrous, but that's my best attempt at rationalizing this...
Andrew Ace that theory is not ludicrous lol
@@jayglizzyxgaming8812 It's probably just the fact that we have to make theories at all rather than having it explained to us that bugs me.
Dude went from ripped to a stick real quick
Quit making these topics about Gohan he will never be great again it's that simple
Someone didn’t read the super manga
@@sonshawnzy9975 Insert Kefla whining in the background
I do agree to an extent. His character being destroyed is much worse than his actual power having declined.
If you mean 'He'll never be the main protagonist' then I have to sadly agree. But then again, that one went south back in 1993.
However, I actually felt the character was improved in some ways.
Son Shawnzy one good fight doesn’t make him great again cause after top he probably went back to not training
Instead of having a spirit bomb finish vs kid buu , they shouldve had Gotenks , gohan , vegeta , and goku all go at kid buu at the same time and all hit em with a beam struggle together for the win or they all use their finisher attacks at the same time . id much rather of had a finish like that as all 4 were really strong at that point and all had their individual chances against buu but couldn't finish it but when they all work together then they find a way to win . this is much better than asspull spirit bomb .
he did become a scholar so he does have to balance schooling and training so it's understandable that he lost some of his edge and has a child as well, gohan did keep up with universe 11,s top the next god of destruction in training
Gohan was my favorite in DBZ. It’s a damn shame what they did to my boy.
when beerus examined goku, goku was in a supressed base form not his actual base form
Any proof of that?
“You and I...”
Buddy I was never apart of any of that
Another Goathan video. I'm cool wit it
DB Super could've used Gohan a lot more and had him level up and should've been the one to aquire the Ultra Instinct power; Goku already had obtained the God mode so that became a character overkill in my opinion.
Gohan could have tapped into the Ultra Instinct power making it the next level of his Mystic power with the help of Old Kai.
Gotenks was forgotten I would've loved to see more of him but as I guess they weren't important characters.
However, I fully stand behind my take on Gohan and I wish Toriyama would've had took Gohan more seriously.
Gohan doesn't like fighting ,when will gohan fans understant that.
Everytime i see these kinds of videos im saddened because teen gohan was my favorite character 🤧
You know what was a missed opportunity? Goku's children was reared mostly by Chi-Chi. Meaning what have they benefitted from except being weak half-saiyans? Chi-Chi is the death of Earth once Goku passes because going to school instead of training with Goku benefitted them absolutely nothing. Good job Toriyama! Nice message!
9:17 I’m proud of you guys. Well done.
hey Mike! What about another Q&A? =D
The scene with Beerus saying Goku couldn't beat Frieza in base really seemed like Beerus misjudging his power. Goku *was* pretty casual at that moment.
9:19 You guys cant do this. I WILL bust out the HBK dance no matter where I'm at.
At the rate piccolo trains he if never Baden as strong as goku or vegeta he should know all of the top tier techniques in the universe he should be like a king kai or some shit
This was his dream as future trunks says gohan always wanted to be a scholar, the clip with trunks seeing future gohan fulfil his dream via gohan is aweosme
My power levels.
( I will do more along the way)
RADITZ SAGA
---------------------------------------------------------
Raditz: 1,200.
Goku: 328 ( Vs Raditz )
Piccolo: 322 ( Vs Raditz
Krillin: 228 ( Dbz ep 1. )
Gohan: 1,388 ( Rage )
Master Roshi: 145 ( Dbz ep 1. )
Goku: 408 ( Warp Kamehameha )
Piccolo: 1380 ( Special Beam Cannon )
Everyone Goku and Vegeta fought in Buu's mind in Z were mental projections from Buu's subconscious. Gohan's body was still bound.
But still, it's a bit silly. But Dragon Ball is kind of like that. Toriyama always forgets things.
Which is kind of the case with everything else you've stated.
To be honest, Goku and Vegeta were completely ruined by Dragon Ball Super just for "comedy" that isn't even funny for 10+ aged kids. You might remember that Super Saiyan forms would change the ones who use the forms to be more aggressive etc. which caused Goku (in the Buu saga) and Gohan (Buu saga too) be almost always serious, But once again, Super caused them not to be too serious since it wouldn't be as interesting, it was also for kids too.
Gohan was ruined by Super too, because he could train every once in a while since he himself knew that he is pretty powerful, well he's smart obviously, or Super ruined him just so he wouldn't be too Overpowered because even they know Gohan would be too strong.
A work around for Beerus not believing Goku could beat Freeza is pretty simple... but not explained and needs more work arounds5 seconds after Beerus says it.
Since Raditz showed up with his scouter to check power levels it’s been shown they can fluctuate. When Beerus says this to base Goku it’s probably true... if Goku stayed at that level without increasing power...
But instead of increasing his power to show he can beat Freeza without transforming (which he should be able to) he transforms into SSj.
Actually during the time goku was facing fat buu he simply had to go super sayian 3 to even keep up. Gottens was already able to destroy fat buu and a fusion of buu and piccolo. Goku legit told gotten and gohan that they could fight of buu because he couldn't handle him. When goku was brought back he was confident that kid buu was a easy fight for him and how weak he was comparedto super buu. While gohan was able to destroy buu and gotten absorbed in his base form!
If Gohan trained for all those years(from the cell saga 2super) and maintained his full power he would probably be close to Jiren or if not he could probably just put a good fight.
@MOHAMMED WALI ikr XD
It really does blow that Gohan is effectively the new Yamcha, a fighter who was badass when introduced and then made into a joke over time. It was effectively the Cell saga that really brought him out to his maximum, but then he lost it all in between then and the Buu saga. Now in super, he can barely fight at all.
_"No, you were cool because of me!"_ -- Perfect Cell of the DevilArtemis Universe.
I have two questions
I always assumed super buu was stronger than kid buu. Especially after absorption. And that's why Goku and Vegeta actually stood a chance. Is that not the case?
When they did the ritual to turn Goku into a god, did the other saiyans lose any power? Which would mean that Gohan immediately became weaker than he already was.
At the part talking about Japanese mythology, that image is from Chinese Mythology...Sun Wukong the Monkey King, Great Sage equal to the Heavens...which is part of what inspired Goku's character himself. xD other than that little bit, I enjoyed this video and discussion about Gohan (my favorite DB character)
Regarding Vegeta saying Goku is the strongest fighter at the beginning of Super, it should be noted that Vegeta was actually dead while gotenks and gohan fought buu so he hasn't seen them fight at full power (unless you count "yo son goku and friends return"). He did, however, witness goku's ssj3 firsthand when the latter fought buu so that would explain his bias there
@@DerpaTure9503 Vegeta does also mention his brother in passing during the Broly movie. I'm not here to say whether or not you _should_ mark it as canon, only that one _could_ argue it is canon
Even gohan in gt was more badass then gohan super
I wished Chi Chi was more like Bulma .. her character is mad annoying
Piccollo needs to shower and brush his teeth all the yr he’s been around he hasn’t done either of them in his whole mfing life
saitama trained for months and all he do is chores still op.
I would’ve loved that gohan’s success and great power from the top in the manga would’ve translated to the anime, like you see the huge difference on how they portray Gohan in the manga and in the anime, the power difference is just too much!
I should know, but my scouter broke from the high power level.
Let this be a lesson, college will make you weak.
Watching Super just broke my heart cuz they disrespect my Gohan like that 😭
I know this is old but: since you need to access the ultimate form like a super saiyan and he died. Not only should he have reverted to base but also the ideal of “if you don’t use it, lose it” it kind of makes sense his sheer lack of training (to rework his genetics like athletes and defaultly every 7 years for newfound potential) not only over 7 years would catch up to him for another 4 to 5 years.
It’s not like for Battle of Gods we didn’t need the poster “corrected” from SS Gohan and how GT also used SS Gohan. Despite a guide saying he never stopped training after Z (most likely the 10 year skip) some content after Z like Yo Son Goku & Friends Return somewhat suggests he took it too easy after Buu just like Goten & Trunks.
So I doubt he ever really stacked it but I also think it explains how Goku & Vegeta could surpass him in 4 to 5 years so quickly given how powerful Gohan should be in comparison if he took getting stronger and improving his battle prowess more seriously.
When gohan was a teenage boy he was a badass a god with the ssj2 but when super started the fuck happen to gohans badass moments
As Tywin Lannister once said: "A tremendous amount..."
The Tarble Special has SS Gotenks fail to save the day where SS Goku succeeds after 2 years of training
To be fair, Gohan is not a full blooded saiyan. He was probably never meant to be the next Goku. He's just Gohan.
What if goku and vegeta used the potara earrings against beerus
I think that the fact that Gohan is half saiyan/human explains a lot of his struggles in combat
Very Long Story Short:They had to make very clear in Super that Goku is the main character, Vegeta 2nd main. To be fair, that would be helpful for new or casual viewers
Gohan went from badass to not badass to badass again