Definitely. You need to brake hard a couple of times to fully bed new pads into the rotors even with the real things. No point in doing that with PETG and GF-nylon which melted faster than this could happen but CF-nylon looked like it could handle it.
@@MadScientist267 Those would be cool to use in a Go-kart or something similar, considering they ere able to stop a 2,000lb Lada. They should have no trouble stopping something weighing only 300lbs. Would make for a great replacement in systems where they no longer produce the pads, or something to save some money on
@@3n3ly7m9 It's less the weight and more the energy in play. A car and a gokart will be using radically different amounts of energy. The only problem with printed brakes that I see is in the very nature of both anything [plastic] printed and the idea that brakes produce lots of heat. In a nutshell, "heat melts the filament to begin with, and brakes make more heat than that"... if you think fade is bad with traditional materials...... So to deal with a car, you'd make them bigger, and for a gokart they wouldn't need to be as robust... but both cases would need a way to deal with heat buildup. Brakes get hot enough just in normal driving to turn those into soup just like the hot end did to make them... Not an effect that will be visible with just a single run like in the video. I do think it would still have use but I'd want to see a set absolutely tortured before I trusted the idea to do anything real. The gokart? Haha why not, go ahead and print em on up... I'd roll those.
@@MadScientist267 Yup! Heat's the real killer here! It IS supposed to melt with high heat or your 3D printer couldn't use it, and brake pads produce a LOT of friction heat! Those special plastic filament materials are made with strength in mind and NOT really heat resistance. They are getting better and better though and hopefully something with BOTH properties in mind will eventually be available to try on "crazy" experiments here soon! 👍👍
I work with plastics, that glass filled nylon is really durable, it is used for the chassis of some car vacuum cleaners, and even more stressful applications. I'm most impressed with Lada brake pad retainers, that's a very easy change, I wish American cars had that!
Those pad retainers are only easy when they're not rusted shut, then they're a nightmare. Haven't owned a Lada, but a Mazda i had used a similar retaining mechanism, and i had to take the car to a shop where they pushed the pins out with a hydraulic press and even that took ages.
Injection molded plastic with glass/carbon filling is not really comparable to 3d filament "reinforced" with those. With injection molding, you use long strands that increase strength substantially by bearing the load. In 3d filament that prints out of 0.4mm nozzles, the strands are chopped to such tiny lengths that they're basically dust and don't actually carry any load. Mechanical properties testing of these materials reveals that they're very marginally better than plain plastics, if at all. Carbon filling greatly increases UV resistance but beyond that it's a huge waste of money.
@@michaelbuckerscarbon filling increases the stiffness of the part quite significantly. They also tend to do a bit better at higher temperatures and are more resistant to creep. Tensile strength is about the same, though.
3d printer tech is really useful , especially with the different materials that are possible. metal 3d printing can even made custom parts designed only for your specification
Porche 3D prints their racing pistons. The video is on TH-cam. It's cool how light they can make them with a honeycomb structure infill. No other manufacturing practice can make them that way. I find it very interesting and cool.
So watching this has the wheels in my head turning again, something that you could try to do is print out some cam shafts using the same material you used here, maybe even try printing out a timing chain it’s self, I really appreciate you guys, you are doing stuff that I’ve always dreamed of doing but I never had the funds to do it, watching you guys doing this stuff makes me proud and saves me money 😂 thank you all for doing what you do, I always look forward to seeing the next video
Assuming any material would be strong enough, the temperature would be too and would twist soon as it hits glass transition temperature. Polycarbonate might be strong enough, glass transition tqemp 147 Celsius
@@King_Flippy_Nips Not really sure how dense it is with carbon though. It is still some kind of meltable polymer base material though or it couldn't be printed.
You should try printing a clutch pad, and maybe even consider exotic filaments, such as brass-filled, stone filled, and ceramic filled filaments! If you do that, please use a hardened steel nozzle, or your brass one will die!
The more I watch these videos, the more I want a Lada :) I dont care if they are not fast, not luxery. I just want to ride it. Everything is so mechanical, I love it.
Very cool video! I love 3D printing and it's cool to see that you're trying it out. Please test the Ultran pads again after being broken in, it would probably show us better results since there would be more contact surface. As for new ideas: How about making a wheel? The rims could be carbon-reinforced nylon and the tires could be black TPU.
@@XdewGaming if you use carbon fibre with the fibres made from glass created in a vacuum chamber the glass strands will be stronger than steel since the vacuum pulls out the air bubbles and moisture which is what makes glass brittle, glass itself can be stronger than steel.
Need to use a thermoset resin instead of thermoplastic. Like bakelite, impregneted with the dust from around your bench grinder, but a higher ignition temperature & will not melt! 3D print a mold for it… …then melt the thermoplastic mold to remove & test the JB Weld brake pad.
i scanned my engine bay with photogrammetrie and build a pre turbo intake for my nissan s13 in CAD. worked out great! material is ASA, so i'm a little bit worried about heat. but so far it holds up, no racetrack use yet, just some german autobahn runs and couple of burn outs haha
as usual another great video with you guys having fun , but i agree do not use the petg pads. anyway do some more testing the ultran pads they look like you could have something there. your videos are a breath of fresh air keep them coming its a pleasure watching them all kudos.
I pause at 1:12 I don't see these working Plastic will melt to make them the heat will destroy them This may very well be the most dangerous vid garage has made
I think PLA would have done better then PETG. PETG is kind of soft and rubbery compared to a good hard PLA, even though PLA glass transitions at a lower temp.I'm constantly impressed with some PLAs out there.
3D Print Caliper Piston with this carbon re-enforced stuff. What if you got a nitwit breaking their piston but they don't want to buy a whole new caliper? Just 3D print the piston ;)
carbon reinforced valves, pistons, or rods would be interesting to see, valves or pistons might melt though, but who knows for sure. Aluminum valves survived after all.
cut a grove in the best set and then put a strip of winter tire tread in it, The soft rubber should hold onto the rotor and the plastic pad part should be good to hold it, Not to big a strip or the rubber will just lock up the wheel rather than slow it
You should try and 3D print as many individual parts of a Lada as realistically possible and assemble the car with as many of those pieces as you can to see how much weight it would cut down on the car and how strong it would be overall :)
I've done a lot of FDM printing work and I'm not sure what "Ultran" is but it sounds like carbon fiber ULTEM, which is PEI in an ULTEM resin. That would make sense. It has great heat resistance and the CF improves its already decent strength and stiffness. It's not easy to print though, needing nozzle temps approaching 400C and a heated chamber. I thought he also referred to it as a Nylon at one point, which is possible but doubtful. It's no surprise glass fiber nylon was worse. Any benefits and whatever added "friction" it has would be irrelevant here. I'd expect even CF nylon to be better, assuming they used PA12. Nylon in general would quickly soften but I doubt PA6 would be much better than PETG in this case. For comparison, typical PETG's glass transition temp isn't even half that of ULTEM and gets slippery so no surprise it smeared like a candle. I don't even know why they bothered. Straight ABS would likely have been better than PETG. I've seen a type of PEKK with a ceramic additive that would be very interesting for this but it's not cheap.
It had no relation to Ultem, it was just regular old carbon fiber nylon with a regular temperature resistance (IE not high enough for this application).
Hm, wonder how 3d printed wiper blades would work for cleaning the windshield during a rainstorm with the different materials. Wiper blades these days don't have the quality that they used to once have and don't last nearly as long either.
this experiment makes me want to see how 3D printed Transmission gears hold up, maybe possibly be valid alternative to keep manual transmissions going after parts are gone.
Wish the Ultran pads got tested a second run, to see if they had better performance broken in.
*Definitely*
I don't see it as a replacement for cars but in smaller and lower speed/stake use cases, absolutely
Definitely. You need to brake hard a couple of times to fully bed new pads into the rotors even with the real things. No point in doing that with PETG and GF-nylon which melted faster than this could happen but CF-nylon looked like it could handle it.
@@MadScientist267 Those would be cool to use in a Go-kart or something similar, considering they ere able to stop a 2,000lb Lada. They should have no trouble stopping something weighing only 300lbs. Would make for a great replacement in systems where they no longer produce the pads, or something to save some money on
@@3n3ly7m9 It's less the weight and more the energy in play. A car and a gokart will be using radically different amounts of energy.
The only problem with printed brakes that I see is in the very nature of both anything [plastic] printed and the idea that brakes produce lots of heat.
In a nutshell, "heat melts the filament to begin with, and brakes make more heat than that"... if you think fade is bad with traditional materials......
So to deal with a car, you'd make them bigger, and for a gokart they wouldn't need to be as robust... but both cases would need a way to deal with heat buildup.
Brakes get hot enough just in normal driving to turn those into soup just like the hot end did to make them... Not an effect that will be visible with just a single run like in the video.
I do think it would still have use but I'd want to see a set absolutely tortured before I trusted the idea to do anything real.
The gokart? Haha why not, go ahead and print em on up... I'd roll those.
@@MadScientist267 Yup! Heat's the real killer here! It IS supposed to melt with high heat or your 3D printer couldn't use it, and brake pads produce a LOT of friction heat! Those special plastic filament materials are made with strength in mind and NOT really heat resistance. They are getting better and better though and hopefully something with BOTH properties in mind will eventually be available to try on "crazy" experiments here soon! 👍👍
I work with plastics, that glass filled nylon is really durable, it is used for the chassis of some car vacuum cleaners, and even more stressful applications. I'm most impressed with Lada brake pad retainers, that's a very easy change, I wish American cars had that!
Those pad retainers are only easy when they're not rusted shut, then they're a nightmare.
Haven't owned a Lada, but a Mazda i had used a similar retaining mechanism, and i had to take the car to a shop where they pushed the pins out with a hydraulic press and even that took ages.
Injection molded plastic with glass/carbon filling is not really comparable to 3d filament "reinforced" with those. With injection molding, you use long strands that increase strength substantially by bearing the load. In 3d filament that prints out of 0.4mm nozzles, the strands are chopped to such tiny lengths that they're basically dust and don't actually carry any load. Mechanical properties testing of these materials reveals that they're very marginally better than plain plastics, if at all. Carbon filling greatly increases UV resistance but beyond that it's a huge waste of money.
Toyota trucks use that caliper design, in the front. Way easy to replace pads on.
@@michaelbuckerscarbon filling increases the stiffness of the part quite significantly.
They also tend to do a bit better at higher temperatures and are more resistant to creep.
Tensile strength is about the same, though.
That's because Lada is based on a 1950's Fiat.
lets do a plastic brake test right in front of a pile on shipping containers... lol
3d printer tech is really useful , especially with the different materials that are possible. metal 3d printing can even made custom parts designed only for your specification
plus 3d print wax to cast metal is way easier than alternatives.
Bugatti makes parts for cars using 3D metal printing.
Porche 3D prints their racing pistons. The video is on TH-cam. It's cool how light they can make them with a honeycomb structure infill. No other manufacturing practice can make them that way. I find it very interesting and cool.
The G in PETG means Glycol, so it extrudes easier through the nozzle, it's pretty much a lubricant.
You can 3d print with normal PET, it's just harder to get and you have to print at a hotter temperature
So watching this has the wheels in my head turning again, something that you could try to do is print out some cam shafts using the same material you used here, maybe even try printing out a timing chain it’s self, I really appreciate you guys, you are doing stuff that I’ve always dreamed of doing but I never had the funds to do it, watching you guys doing this stuff makes me proud and saves me money 😂 thank you all for doing what you do, I always look forward to seeing the next video
Assuming any material would be strong enough, the temperature would be too and would twist soon as it hits glass transition temperature. Polycarbonate might be strong enough, glass transition tqemp 147 Celsius
Make brake pads out of cement. That would be fun. (Edit, how about made of JB-Weld high temperature?)
the carbon on steel backing plates would be interesting. or the carbon for the friction surface of a clutch disk.
yea, carbon almost doesnt have a melting point it is so high, it is the perfect material to use where high heat is involved
One of the most beautiful and enjoyable channels and the origin of your creativity. Greetings to you from Saudi Arabia🌹👍
I am very surprised by the carbon infused plastic. I didn't expect any to really work, nevermind working that good.
Looks like if they had time to seat in they would work as well as the original, at least for the first time or two you use it or until they get hot.
well carbon doesnt really melt, at least not at any temperature we can achieve which makes it the perfect material for high friction high heat tasks.
@@King_Flippy_Nips Not really sure how dense it is with carbon though. It is still some kind of meltable polymer base material though or it couldn't be printed.
@@D3M3NT3Dstrang3r Exactly. The binder it is in, nylon, melts at WAY lower temps. This is a joke
You should try printing a clutch pad, and maybe even consider exotic filaments, such as brass-filled, stone filled, and ceramic filled filaments! If you do that, please use a hardened steel nozzle, or your brass one will die!
I think they did something with making a clutch pad a while back. I think I'll go and maybe watch it again.....👍👍
Death to the brass ... and print quality .... whoops 😅
Funny how he fastened the seatbelt after PETG test hahaha
The more I watch these videos, the more I want a Lada :) I dont care if they are not fast, not luxery. I just want to ride it. Everything is so mechanical, I love it.
I've been enjoying these science videos, or what I call "what if" videos 😆! Keep up the awesome work, and look forward to future testing
Solid!
Top KEK!
Peace be with you.
Very cool video! I love 3D printing and it's cool to see that you're trying it out. Please test the Ultran pads again after being broken in, it would probably show us better results since there would be more contact surface.
As for new ideas: How about making a wheel? The rims could be carbon-reinforced nylon and the tires could be black TPU.
So you should have 3D printed rotors to try against the printed brake pads.
I think they will just break off when the real brake pads pushes on them with hydraulics
@XdewGaming Maybe, but it will be entertaining.
@@XdewGaming if you use carbon fibre with the fibres made from glass created in a vacuum chamber the glass strands will be stronger than steel since the vacuum pulls out the air bubbles and moisture which is what makes glass brittle, glass itself can be stronger than steel.
@@King_Flippy_Nips Carbon fiber is not made from glass
Need to use a thermoset resin instead of thermoplastic.
Like bakelite, impregneted with the dust from around your bench grinder, but a higher ignition temperature & will not melt!
3D print a mold for it…
…then melt the thermoplastic mold to remove & test the JB Weld brake pad.
Dayum... amazing... i love this type of channels !!
Maybe I am watching all your programs too much since discovering your channel ❤️ seem to remember a bright spot outside called the sun ;)
Hahahaaaa, Vlad... Hunting for Potatoes!!! 😂😂😂😂😂
3d printing is becoming pretty awesome ❤
Vlad discovered a seatbelt!
Id like to see copper pads or bronze pads would be cool and probably work well since there softer than steel and will still handle high heat
Make a six axle car with the very rearmost axle driven by external linkage like a train
Every few episodes, these guys get closer and dangerously closer to doing legit scientific research.
Print the rotor for a small blower or pro charger. Or even the entire thing. See if it speeds up that car.
Y’all should make a light 4 person pedal powered lada.
I've thought about trying to 3D print my own snorkel intake for my truck. You should try that and an intake manifold.
i scanned my engine bay with photogrammetrie and build a pre turbo intake for my nissan s13 in CAD. worked out great! material is ASA, so i'm a little bit worried about heat. but so far it holds up, no racetrack use yet, just some german autobahn runs and couple of burn outs haha
as usual another great video with you guys having fun , but i agree do not use the petg pads. anyway do some more testing the ultran pads they look like you could have something there. your videos are a breath of fresh air keep them coming its a pleasure watching them all kudos.
4:58 i like the fake "Diamond " Antenna holder named "Dianond"
😂 You guys are killing me!
Great work guys!
I'd love to see some 3D printed metal break pads, theres some 3D printers which can print metal instead of plastic.
Great content as always
Make the brake rotors from those same materials and watch them melt together as you brake 😂
Need repeat use on functional ones for brake fade testing
Need to do discs out of same material too then test both together
I also wonder if you print break shoes and test them , just a thought. maybe you could print a carb who knows.
What about gearbox syncrs maded in a 3d Printer? Sounds like a good idea
carbon fiber reinforced plastic, maybe put some steel rebar mesh inside the carbon pads, from cast plastic. try carbon/graphene mixed casein plastic
You could use the cross drilled rotors with those pads and try again
Nice work
Should try resin 3d printing. It uses UV LIGHT instead of heat to create the objects
I pause at 1:12
I don't see these working
Plastic will melt to make them the heat will destroy them
This may very well be the most dangerous vid garage has made
they could test making transmission axle , semi axis and other parts from that carbon reinforced plastic !
Carbon is used in brakes already so it's not a surprise they did well.
Something is going to be out of whack, you say? Perhaps Vlad?
It looks like lada brake pads can be changed with the wheels on?? If that’s a thing, Ladas are awesome!
Judging by some of the stopping distances - you could call them "G54 BrownStuffs" I'd be shitting myself testing them.
HAHAHA, I thought they'd all turn to snot . lol Surprising . :)
how about making brake pads out of different metals? Aluminum, brass, copper and so forth. like you did with the pistons.
I'd love to see Carbon Reinforced nylon gear set in a gearbox.
I think PLA would have done better then PETG. PETG is kind of soft and rubbery compared to a good hard PLA, even though PLA glass transitions at a lower temp.I'm constantly impressed with some PLAs out there.
Guys, you are crazy ... 😂😵💫
U should do a 3d printed rotor with the 3d printed brake pads
BMW furiously taking notes on how to make plastic brake pads to go with their plastic cars
You should try serrated tool steel pads or knurled.
Love your videos 🤩 can you try to run a diesel engine on jet fuel as both types of fuel are flammable if pressurized
3D Print Caliper Piston with this carbon re-enforced stuff. What if you got a nitwit breaking their piston but they don't want to buy a whole new caliper? Just 3D print the piston ;)
carbon reinforced valves, pistons, or rods would be interesting to see, valves or pistons might melt though, but who knows for sure. Aluminum valves survived after all.
You should try this with yhe drilled rotor experiments
Ehat if you had drilled and slotted rotors to keep cleaning those burnt plastic pads?
friction causes heating causes melting plastics :)
extreme heat resistant plastic work best
Glass pads would be interesting.
Prusa has filament with Tungston in it
cut a grove in the best set and then put a strip of winter tire tread in it, The soft rubber should hold onto the rotor and the plastic pad part should be good to hold it, Not to big a strip or the rubber will just lock up the wheel rather than slow it
Tire would be on fire in seconds
You should try and 3D print as many individual parts of a Lada as realistically possible and assemble the car with as many of those pieces as you can to see how much weight it would cut down on the car and how strong it would be overall :)
no? plastic is extremely expensive in terms of weight. sheet metal and fibre panels are probably 30-40 times lighter per strength than plastic
3d printed tire rims, 3d printed differential gears, 3d printed driveline, 3d printed valves! That's all for now!
I've done a lot of FDM printing work and I'm not sure what "Ultran" is but it sounds like carbon fiber ULTEM, which is PEI in an ULTEM resin. That would make sense. It has great heat resistance and the CF improves its already decent strength and stiffness. It's not easy to print though, needing nozzle temps approaching 400C and a heated chamber. I thought he also referred to it as a Nylon at one point, which is possible but doubtful.
It's no surprise glass fiber nylon was worse. Any benefits and whatever added "friction" it has would be irrelevant here. I'd expect even CF nylon to be better, assuming they used PA12. Nylon in general would quickly soften but I doubt PA6 would be much better than PETG in this case.
For comparison, typical PETG's glass transition temp isn't even half that of ULTEM and gets slippery so no surprise it smeared like a candle. I don't even know why they bothered. Straight ABS would likely have been better than PETG.
I've seen a type of PEKK with a ceramic additive that would be very interesting for this but it's not cheap.
It had no relation to Ultem, it was just regular old carbon fiber nylon with a regular temperature resistance (IE not high enough for this application).
@@mjodr Thanks. I've never heard of Ultran but that makes more sense.
3D print an entire engine rebuild
PETG may as well have been a couple slices of mousetrap cheese for all the good they did... :P
3d print an entire car
What's up with the sea cans at the end of the runway😅
they should have made a few passes, instead of just one. would have seen the guy with the squirts come out of the outhouse a few more times.
Guy master mechanics it love show keep up great work
Would love to see it if the brakes ad x2 calipers on eatch side of the front discs tonsee of it'll give it dubble brakein power 😉😉😉😉😉😉
How about making a piston made of plastic ?
How about some 3-D printed rims?
Hm, wonder how 3d printed wiper blades would work for cleaning the windshield during a rainstorm with the different materials. Wiper blades these days don't have the quality that they used to once have and don't last nearly as long either.
Next try different types of cement for brake pads.
Next Project... 3D Print your own LADA
Did you knew that Lada is an owner and main engineering contributor of Mazda
Make the rotor out of brake pad material or better yet a clutch disk and use metal brake pads.
Why not try cross drilled or slotted pads?
How about try using a parachute on the back of a lada for brakes?
and what about 3D printed rotors with stock pads (these 3 different plastics but instead of using it for pads, use it for rotors)
Be good to see matching printed discs
1.07% success!
New title for this video: What happens if inkjet printer cartridge manufacturers start selling brake pads?
Notification squad Have a nice weekend!🔥🔥🔥
What does the Ultran print cost.
What is the cost of proper pads.
Does it only have front brakes? Or just leave out them switching out the rears
For Sale: Lada - New Brake Pads 😉
Maybe make oil pump gears out of the carbon reinforced nylon and see hoe they go.
4:50 bad english translation😅
Do metal sintered pads, order them if you dont have the tech to make them.
this experiment makes me want to see how 3D printed Transmission gears hold up, maybe possibly be valid alternative to keep manual transmissions going after parts are gone.
Transmission gears will never ‘be gone’
BecUse it’s just metal stock with part of it removed.
Transmission gears will never ‘be gone’
BecUse it’s just metal stock with part of it removed.
Transmission gears will never ‘be gone’
BecUse it’s just metal stock with part of it removed.
Redo video. You can print metal and ceramic pads as well as bedding the pads for a second run.
Lets see how long a ulltran engine block holds up!