E3D Tool Changer Update - Chris's Basement
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 18 ก.พ. 2020
- Just a quick update on how things are going on the E3D tool changer.
PrusaSlicer config:
drive.google.com/file/d/1XPrz...
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Thanks Chris, you've made me realise I don't need a tool changer in my life😀
LOL, probably a good choice!
This was a great video about some of the hiccups of the toolchanger. It was informational and not overly negative.
Some other youtubers just went on hour long rants bashing all of e3d's products.
Yeah, that helps no one. More tool changer stuff coming up soon.
Hi Chris,
Great update report Sir, I was wondering how you where getting on with this, whilst it's all way above my head, it's thanks to people such as yourself who help things such as this progress, I doubt if people hadn't of jumped in and purchased the first 3D printers and helped with things, we wouldn't all have the 3D printers we have now, I really wouldn't be surprised that after a few more years and a lot of hard work in the Tool Changer community, people will be buying these more than a standard 3D printer, so top marks to you and the rest of the changer community Sir...
All the very best...
Andy...
Thanks Andy, those are very kind words, I hope all this work helps for many years to come.
6:45 If you plan to install new Acrylic. Make large holes around the screws, install rubber washers there, and cover them with a larger metal washer. Or you may get one of those "cable guide" rubber washers that are used in the automotive industry.
If you plan to repair existing one - saw them off by 45deg, drill some holes near the edge and 3d print angle brackets that will have hooks to go through the holes in acrylic.
Great suggestion, thank you!
Thanks Chris for doing this project it’s something that I kind of wanted to do as well but I’m glad to see that you took it on and are taking the lead for those of us who don’t seem to have the time to do this. Thanks again so much awesome channel
Thanks David, that is exactly what I was hoping to do. I wanted to crack it open a bit and show the insides before others went to purchase them.
I'm glad you're not bashing it as I've seen another TH-camr who was looking at it as a finished product -- simply based on the price. I went a different direction with my multi head design. I build a quad independent extruder system, and to be honest the amount of slicer config you have is unnecessary. You can do all of that in the scripts. For fan.
Here is what I have in my free0.g : M106 P0 S0
then parking operation -- for me parking is quiet a bit easier since I don't have to disconnect a magnet or anything, just move the inactive tool to it's parking location.
free1.g has M106 P4 S0 and so on -- so you turn off the fan in each freen.g command then in postn.g you need to have
M106 R2 -- that command is how Duet RRF will resume your fan operation. That's all you need to do -- set your slicer fan to be at layer 2 or whatever as you would normally print, and then just let duet take care of the rest. So for my machine part cooling fans get turned off when the tool parks, and they resume when the tool gets active if it was previously set to whatever you set it at -- RRF will remember.
As far as tool cleaning, really can't see why that can't be done in the postN.g script either -- I have my own cleaning mechanism - since hotends are parked and need to be cleaned before resuming -- so first thing they do is clean themselves -- then continue printing. I look at it as everything special to the operation of the machine should be and can be done in the pre, free, and post scripts. My slicers config in S3D has one variance -- which is to make the tool do XY motion before it does the Z motion on toolchange (I personally think going the other way around is a bug in S3D)-- that allows for tool to return from the parking/cleaning phase and travel above the part and not hit anything or make a mess, really that's all the slicer adjustments I have to do, again because S3D is dumb to do it in reverse. Another trick to lining up toolheads is use a microscope camera under the tool at a known location, much easier that way to get offsets. I would not do a long bowden tube on a system where precise control of extrusion is necessary. But I learned that before I jumped into the quad.
Great comment, I am sure as I get into it more my config will become much more efficient, this was just how I solved it at first look. Great to hear that there are so many different tool changer projects going on. Thanks for watching!
This is similar to what I did. I added the Fans to each M563 command in config.g so they are bound to the tool. Then changed the M106 command in tpost.g to R2 instead of S255. That has them following what PrusaSlic3r sets the fans to so far.
How does this toolchanger disengage from the magnets after it slides the toolhead on the two parking posts?
Christopher Jones the toolhead uses a cam lock driven by a small stepper motor to secure the tool. There are no magnets on that side. The dock has a magnet that secures the tool to the dock.
Chris, good, balanced review. Many of your viewer such as myself are really interested in the advances in 3D printing, but this is way beyond my skills. Really glad you are doing it and sharing with us.
Thanks Dave, I just wanted to crack this open a bit and show the insides, more to come.
Just bought mine to learn ASMBL, it is a beautifully engineered and manufactured piece. I may struggle when I am dialing in but the potential is awesome.
Sweet! I really wanted to get one and try it, but the project list is just way to long. :)
You have a lot of hard work in front of you, sooooo! thanks for the heads up Chris!
Thanks Sergio!
Cool concept. I hope you keep updating us with where you are at with it. I want to hear more!
Thank you
You 've got a good sound in there. Good absorption. Sounds cozy. thumbs up
Thanks! Yeah, I have some heavy blankets up.
Respect Chris. Holy shit and I thought P2PP and Prusaslicer integration was a pain .... and that was easy!
Thanks man!
Thank you for the video, very informative retrospective view on the build process. Ever since I saw the E3D kinematic coupling tool changer concept on MRRF2018 I have been working towards replicating it but slightly different, one thing I did different was change the locking mechanism so instead of twisting to lock in place it uses the X Y movement to align (essentially) a cylinder into a ring. The ring gets inserted over the cylinder on the X movement then the ring retracts into the gantry (retracting mechanism) taking the cylinder and tool head with it. The benefit of this is there is no chance the print head will fall off due to misalignment when coupling or uncoupling. Cant wait to see your first motley material prints and whatever contraptions you come up with to mount to the thing!
Thanks Nick, great to hear you are creating another version, that's awesome.
And as always, thanks for all the info Chris. You rock!
Thank you!
Nice. Glad to hear about your research projects too.
Thanks James!
great video Chris, i see you have 24k subscribers now! Totally deserved man :)
Thanks Espen!
Chris i feel your pain. Been there did that building my own tool change but after a month its working like it should.
Thanks, good to hear you had success.
I was really intrigued by this machine and I am glad it was a few thousand or I might have bought it. I am nowhere near experienced enough to get it working and it would have become a paperweight. Awesome videos!
Thank you, at this point it is a beast for sure.
Thank you for the report. Now I want one.
😀 Thanks for watching!
Interesting project
Thanks for sharing your experience👍😀
Thanks Asger!
Thanks! Awesome on you for staying objective to the project and not bashing, this is something that I want to use but out of my current demand and skillset but as long as the platform is continuing to be developed, it could become common place.
Thanks Charlie, that is my hope, it should get easier and cheaper as we go.
@@ChrisRiley again thanks for bringing us along with you in this crazy awesome journey. I still want one but I understand more that it would be sitting there like my dual colored printer is.
Good info! Thanks for the update.
Thanks Joel!
Hey Chris, for your side pannels, if you don't already have them, find some 1/8th or 1/16th inch wide soft rubber grommets to put between the pannels and the frame. Even small vibrations over time, like when the print head is moving, can fatigue materials to the point where they become brittle.
Just got into 3d printing myself and am already looking at pie in the sky ideas about setting up a machine with a tool changer and a bed changer so I can batch out a couple hundred parts at a time (obviously there are many challenges with this, but it'd be boring if it were easy). Thanks for the review on the changer! I'll definitely have to look into it for the learning experience.
Thanks for the tip! I still need to fix mine up.
For those bowden tubes running from the spools to the extruders, you can actually get 3mm ID 4mm OD PTFE tubing that will reduce the amount of extra drag/friction in pulling the filament from the spool.
Great idea, I might have to try that.
At ~5:30 you can see that you have very little tension on your extruder which is most likely a big factor in your filament stripping. Good video though! I would love to see more on the printer.
Thanks! I have been messing with the tension a lot, haven't found the perfect setting yet.
Great Video, and some good information...
Thanks Mike!
Replace that lexan with 1\4 inch when you drill your holes secret when you get most of the way through finish in reverse prevents blow outs .👍😀
Good call, thanks!
I build my own printer with my own tool changer mechanism and marlin. Beside some tool change tests I still need to implement all the stuff required to keep parking positions and save zone areas, without the need of reflashing it all the time. Currently this all sits in a code script in octoprint, which is not optimal, too. Multi head support is really a challenge and needs to be done with care.
Great to hear you are working on your own project, very cool.
Your telling me it's too much hassle. When I'm out here designing my own tool changer for my dbot lol. I'm too broke for the e3d tool changer. Great video 👍
Thank you
you should try using a different nozzle size for each tool head.
That's a great idea, that might be a fun test.
The duet expansion rocks. I wish marlin Supported that
Same here, I an working on the BTT one, but it only has 3 extra drivers.
on my printer I used thicker acrylic with some of those squishy washers on both sides and just smashed the washers down on the inside with over-tightening. hasn't broken any in 2 years
Good call! I am still looking for someone to make me some replacements.
@@ChrisRiley Mine's not perfectly straight cuts but I just drew my cuts out with a straight edge & sharpie and cut it with a jigsaw. Got the acrylic from lowes
@@gg-gn3re Thanks, I might have to go that route.
awesome review.
What would you think about putting the extruders on a rail above the machine, so the bowden tubes can be shorter and wouldn't make a 180 degree turn? More like the arrangement you see on Delta printers?
I think it's a great idea. I want to switch out to a couple Hemeras.
Great video. Have you considered the ASMBL?
I have, but haven't gotten around to it.
I'm currently building a Jubilee printer and I'm excited but nervous about all the gcode and config editing I'll have to do!
Good luck with your project!
I'm Glad I didn't buy one if I remember correctly E3D did the Big Box 3d printer and it used Acrylic sides and they cracked also.. Love your channel by the way...
Thanks Bob! Yep, Greg was the Bigbox guy as well.
Hi Chris, Thanks for your real opinion of the toolchanger. I'm also working on it, did you figure out how to tweek the travel speed after new tool has been selected? Thanks
Not yet, I did most of my changes in the slicer and Prusa slicer makes that really hard. I think it would be better to do that in the Duet config, but I haven't tackled that yet.
For the acrylic panels, I would recommend some type of 'U' clip that you can screw to the extrusion, and allow the acrylic sheet to float freely. Especially if the panels are cracking when you are trying to move the unit.
Odd question: Where's agood place to download the RepRap firmware from?
That's a good idea. You can get the Duet stuff here github.com/dc42/RepRapFirmware/releases and the old school stuff here. github.com/reprap
Or perhaps use a standoff a bit smaller in diameter of the plexi hole (or simply a longer screw) and have its length to be a couple millimeters longer than the plexi surface and use a rubber washer with a button head screw. The rubber washer will allow for the plexi to move. Better yet attach a sliding latch system like we use on PC tower cases. Probably can just use epoxy to attach the tabs on the plexi without it looking too ugly.
damn, you got yourself a nice printer dude... congrats... the only thing is that i would have loved to see it being implemented with klipper..
Thanks man! That would be pretty sweet.
Chris are you going to have step by step setup and configure the tool changer?
I would be a lot of videos, but I would consider it after I get everything up and working correctly.
and there is me here struggling to get my ender 3 pro to print at a reasonable quality...
The struggle is real, no matter what machine. ;)
Hi Chris, did you use Loctite on the screws to fix the acrylic plates? This causes cracks in the acrylic.
I didn't use any on the acrylic screws, but good thought.
Thanks for the information. I've purchased the e3d toolchanger bundle. I was wondering if you can open the prusa profile shown in this video to those who are e3d toolchanger users.
Ha, I thought I already did. Here you go. drive.google.com/file/d/1XPrz0lg12OSWIbVCVnMQ8DlHrobh7HaZ/view?usp=sharing
@@ChrisRiley Thank you very much.
Could you move the electronic panels etc to one of the side panels and mount the filament on the rear feeding directly into the extruder and remove one of the bowden tubes in the current setup?
You should have to change up some of the wiring, but yeah, I think you could make it work.
@2:22 The M566 value for E looks verly low with a jerk of 2 is this correct? Since I have also a bowden setup with a all metal hotend I wonder which settings are best with 700 mm bowden (M566,M203,M201). I think pressure advance will not work with low jerk values ( sorry for the bad english)
I would have to go back and take a look. Pressure advance probably won't work well with this much tube.
Chris, Am I seeing correct, frame is based on Core XY ? like the idea of the changer... one of the tools can of course also be a laser...
Yes, it is a core xy design. I really want to try pick and place, I just like watching them work. LOL.
T2 pickup is off in the x-axis. you may check this
Yep, it's all working well now.
You got macro g-code to work in PrusaSlicer?! I've yet to find a reference with upto date info or that gives working examples. Where did you find your info? I have an IDEX machine with purge buckets and I want to make some smart first layer purge and between layer purge and clean code.
I go by the slic3r manual, a few things are different, but most of them work. manual.slic3r.org/advanced/placeholder-parser
Sweet!! I have been trying to find this info as well.
Whadya think about a flex3drive for each head? That would deal with yer Bowden tube stuff. Maybe build a rack above for yer filament to shorten the length of the Capricorn tubes.
I think it's a good idea, but might introduce some other issues, depending on the drive design. If you get it setup just right it would be solid.
Chris Riley have you checked out the flex3drive? I’m thinkin of putting one on my prusa mk3s. That and a Hemera should almost double the speed.
@@tamvalley415 I have not, there are a couple that I would like to take a look at.
Actually no need for a hemera 😬
Well, glad I didn't hit Purchase... Haha! Like others, I have enough issues with my CR-10S that I maybe I should wait until this is a turn key system. Thanks for the video. I'll hit the Subscribe!
I totally get it, it's a bit of a pain. Thanks for the sub!
If this is SO complex, why aren't the stepper motors closed-loop?
Not sure really, they could be very easily.
Hmmm, IDEX system + toolchanger would be interesting to see
Now we're talkin! LOL
Exactly. Bowden is good for small 3d printers. But, its terrible for larger machines as the bowden tube gets too long.
Thanks! Agreed, we will see what I can change up.
I wonder why the acrylic is cracking. Is it due to vibrations in the aluminium frame? I find this strange, because my old anet a8 has an acrylic frame and its pretty much in mint (frankenstein modded) condition.
I don't think its the vibrations, but the frame not being rigid enough translating the forces at play to the acrylic.
Yep, the frame has just enough back and forth motion to press on the acrylic panels. I think that is the issue.
Your cracking plexiglass, over sized holes with hard rubber washers on both sides.
Good call, still looking for someone to cut me some new ones.
What firmware is it ? Great video
Thanks! This is REPRAP firmware.
Use "polycarbonate" instead of acrylic. 👌
A lot stronger and not as brittle as "plexiglas" (acrylic)
Good idea.
@@ChrisRiley They now ship with Polycarbonate
Do you still own an E3D tool changer and if you do, do you use it?
I do and yes, I do. I don't get as much time to work with it as I would like to. It's a great testing platform.
Link to the silicone brush please.
Here you go. StarPack Premium Silicone Basting Brush - High Heat Resistant to 600°F, Hygienic One Piece Design, Pastry, Grill & BBQ Brush (Gray Black) www.amazon.com/dp/B07HDYHGKW/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_gIyuEbY96CD7R
Chris Riley thanks
I bet you're the reason facebook randomly recommended that I join this group lol
LOL, maybe. ;)
you should do as much as possible scripting in the firmware, not the slicer. makes things easier on the way :)
Yeah, I need to go back and work on that.
I can't even afford a 300$ ender 3 let alone a 2000 pound tool changer motion system xD
I hear ya, ;)
I can't see it being useful as anything but a 3d printer or laser cutter almost all other styles of cnc require substantial rigidity that corexy will never provide (but great review and summary )
Thanks Jason, I would really like to see it do pick and place.
This machine is cool but I do not need so many tools. I dream of IDEX
IDEX is always good! ;)
Universal dove tail 3D Printers tool change adapter, manual.
www.cgtrader.com/.../universal-dove-tail-3d...
Advantages?
Yes: one can change various printing heads, manually, on printers that were never made to accomplish this.
Unlike the versions you can buy ready made, this is more compact, easy to install on a vast range of models with minimum tweakening, and you print it yourself mirrored or straight as needed.
It has (Tada....) a Z axis sensor slider support adjustable as needed to the micron height by twisting a screw... Bye bye sensor adjusting headache.
I wanted to see this, but the link didn't take me to the model .
@@ChrisRiley I tested the link and it took me to the entry page of the portal of CG trader, but sercing with the title of the tool, I got it in the search results, y the way, there was only one search result turning up...vol
Anyway I got you another portal link, hope it does soemthing.
Give your self a even bigger headake put a mmu on one of the tool changer heads 😂
LOL, and a Palette.
@@ChrisRiley i was surprised to see the titan fail with so little load of only PTFE tubing. Since its bowden i guess you can swap out the 20mm nema 17 and use a larger fuller size nema. Also reposition the motor closer to the print area shortening the bowden tube (this is my next mod, putting the extruder on the right z axis on a cartesian printer). I have been testing TPU on a bowden its been going rather well.
@@Side85Winder Yeah, I want to compare them to some others, just to see what is going on here. I also have a ton of silcer tweaking to do.
I let the back spools go straight up into the Titan it works a lot better. It has at times been a head scratcher but I’m enjoying the tinkering and it definitely has improved my firmware knowledge 😅
Want some update in 2023
I'll see what I can do.
Or check the Jubilee 3d printer with a tool changer github.com/machineagency/jubilee th-cam.com/video/7jGilt5ijQo/w-d-xo.html :)
That looks sweet!
awesome …. tool changer ……. mechanical I can do ……. getting pumped … here we goooo ……. uh huh ...uh huh …… OHHHH NOOOOO …… he's going to do it ….. stop cuz NOOOOOO …. and then he said it ….the word …...CODE ……. lights going dimmer …… here I g plunk
LOL, yeah, that hardware is really cool....code always ruins it.
"It will print .. but the quality isn't great". WTF is the point of this then?
It's really for tool changing, lots of setup to get right.
E3D is so disappointing. They sell Tool Changer as a complete kit and didn't even provide firmware with basic configuration?
It's really not a kit, it's just parts, they do have the basic firmware, just not all the unique bits you will need.
@@ChrisRiley It is still a convenient way to put all the responsibility and troubleshooting on the user. I was hoping it will be closer to the Prusa kit.
Thanks for the video. This is not for me. Hey, Alex Kenis just released a video on his bowden tube experiments and some may help you here on print quality.
Thanks Mark, I will go check it out, I haven't caught up on those lately.
This would not be a product for me ... Don't have that much time to hack around on it .. For the money, to me, it is not there yet. I like the concept, but not the steep learning curve
Understandable.