Its good to hear teaching on this issue that actually points to a solution rather than adding to the problem. It seems that many leaders are not interested in facing the hard truths about the "why and how" this is an issue. This leads them to, instead, attempt to invalidate and even ridicule those who are willing to bring up the issue or grab for scapegoats by which they can cast the blame on.
theres so much here, in no particular order... - for one, if we are believers in jesus christ, then church isnt where we go, but who we are. but years of tradition and religious manipulation of having to go to church has taught that church is in fact, where we go. - the next thing is that most, if not all american churches have no real idea what they believe, so if they dont really know what to believe, then they dont have any supporting doctrine of their faith. to say they that they believe in jesus becomes an empty faith. - due to the lack of sound doctrine, the church has become nothing more than any other social club, theres nothing that causes people to want to stay. - in reference to sound doctrine, there are biblical references to covenant, which is the entire basis for our faith in jesus, and not only that, but commands our faithfulness and loyalty to one another, but when that kind of life is not preached, the religious manipulation to go to church wears off and people eventually find somewhere else to socialize. - my personal issue with church is having to spend an hour or so listening to someone on a pedestal telling others what they think and suggestively telling others what they should think, but leaving no room for the church community to share its thoughts and ideas, which, is actually what the biblical church did, they shared as the spirit led amongst all believers teaching and equipping each other. - what really gets me is that every church has an unspoken mandate that we must absolutely attend their services before any kind of fellowship so to speak, but theres no biblical mandate for this. Hebrews 10:25 says nothing about sitting in pews while a speaker rambles on for an hour filling in a sunday morning time slot, but thats exactly what professional church goers have been taught to do. - so, if the church is who we are, and covenant based doctrine is what we are supposed to be taught to support our faith in jesus christ, then maybe theres no need to get people back in church, but instead, learning to be the church.
Covid has indeed caused low in person church attendance. It’s so convenient to watch services in the comfort of your home. In person fellowship brings so much more unity and closeness among the believers.
You wanna know what else Covid did? It showed that people who previously claimed that they didn't have time enough to read the bible, didn't read it any more during the lockdowns. Hmm.........
1. Lack of community - You seem to describe the idealistic Christian ‘community’ and say that it is ‘possible’. I’m not sure how this is a solution to the problem. Are you saying that people feeling a ‘lack of community’ are wrong? 2. Lack of confidence in institutions - You are saying that there a lot of people that lack this confidence, and that they should ‘come together’. Are you suggesting a new church of believers that can trust one another? 3. Moral and ethical issues - Very confused by this one in particular. 'Moral and ethical issues exist, they should not, so stop doing it'. That seems to be your resolution for the problem. I doubt that those complaining of hypocrisy in the church have any influence to ‘stop’ there from being hypocrisy. 4. Technological revolution - You apparently believe that the previous 3 concerns are not driving this item to be a problem. You probably have a point. I am sure that the ‘pew sitter’ would just as soon ‘check the box’ of having ‘done church’ from their couch as from the pew. However, I doubt any sincere believer with a desire to follow Christ was looking for an excuse to stay home. That is where I would suggest items 1-3 are pushing them there. 5. Low priority for church - Aside from reading why a person ‘should’ make church a priority, is there any way we could look at why they obviously are not making it a priority? Is there any possibility of actual ‘introspection’ when it comes to why the church is failing? It seems to me that you typically have 1 of 2 responses to this problem; either ‘let’s try to make the same thing more enjoyable/relatable’ or ‘the problem is those ‘other’ churches are changing to make the same thing more enjoyable/relatable so we aren’t going to budge!’. How about examining the entire tradition of church, including ‘untouchables’ like ‘preaching to believers’, etc., and , maybe quit telling people to deny their reality…for starters…?
Its good to hear teaching on this issue that actually points to a solution rather than adding to the problem. It seems that many leaders are not interested in facing the hard truths about the "why and how" this is an issue. This leads them to, instead, attempt to invalidate and even ridicule those who are willing to bring up the issue or grab for scapegoats by which they can cast the blame on.
theres so much here, in no particular order...
- for one, if we are believers in jesus christ, then church isnt where we go, but who we are. but years of tradition and religious manipulation of having to go to church has taught that church is in fact, where we go.
- the next thing is that most, if not all american churches have no real idea what they believe, so if they dont really know what to believe, then they dont have any supporting doctrine of their faith. to say they that they believe in jesus becomes an empty faith.
- due to the lack of sound doctrine, the church has become nothing more than any other social club, theres nothing that causes people to want to stay.
- in reference to sound doctrine, there are biblical references to covenant, which is the entire basis for our faith in jesus, and not only that, but commands our faithfulness and loyalty to one another, but when that kind of life is not preached, the religious manipulation to go to church wears off and people eventually find somewhere else to socialize.
- my personal issue with church is having to spend an hour or so listening to someone on a pedestal telling others what they think and suggestively telling others what they should think, but leaving no room for the church community to share its thoughts and ideas, which, is actually what the biblical church did, they shared as the spirit led amongst all believers teaching and equipping each other.
- what really gets me is that every church has an unspoken mandate that we must absolutely attend their services before any kind of fellowship so to speak, but theres no biblical mandate for this. Hebrews 10:25 says nothing about sitting in pews while a speaker rambles on for an hour filling in a sunday morning time slot, but thats exactly what professional church goers have been taught to do.
- so, if the church is who we are, and covenant based doctrine is what we are supposed to be taught to support our faith in jesus christ, then maybe theres no need to get people back in church, but instead, learning to be the church.
Covid has indeed caused low in person church attendance. It’s so convenient to watch services in the comfort of your home. In person fellowship brings so much more unity and closeness among the believers.
You wanna know what else Covid did? It showed that people who previously claimed that they didn't have time enough to read the bible, didn't read it any more during the lockdowns. Hmm.........
People are leaving the church because they feel like a audience member and not a participant, a audience to the ego of those in cliques.
1. Lack of community - You seem to describe the idealistic Christian ‘community’ and say that it is ‘possible’. I’m not sure how this is a solution to the problem. Are you saying that people feeling a ‘lack of community’ are wrong?
2. Lack of confidence in institutions - You are saying that there a lot of people that lack this confidence, and that they should ‘come together’. Are you suggesting a new church of believers that can trust one another?
3. Moral and ethical issues - Very confused by this one in particular. 'Moral and ethical issues exist, they should not, so stop doing it'. That seems to be your resolution for the problem. I doubt that those complaining of hypocrisy in the church have any influence to ‘stop’ there from being hypocrisy.
4. Technological revolution - You apparently believe that the previous 3 concerns are not driving this item to be a problem. You probably have a point. I am sure that the ‘pew sitter’ would just as soon ‘check the box’ of having ‘done church’ from their couch as from the pew. However, I doubt any sincere believer with a desire to follow Christ was looking for an excuse to stay home. That is where I would suggest items 1-3 are pushing them there.
5. Low priority for church - Aside from reading why a person ‘should’ make church a priority, is there any way we could look at why they obviously are not making it a priority? Is there any possibility of actual ‘introspection’ when it comes to why the church is failing? It seems to me that you typically have 1 of 2 responses to this problem; either ‘let’s try to make the same thing more enjoyable/relatable’ or ‘the problem is those ‘other’ churches are changing to make the same thing more enjoyable/relatable so we aren’t going to budge!’.
How about examining the entire tradition of church, including ‘untouchables’ like ‘preaching to believers’, etc., and , maybe quit telling people to deny their reality…for starters…?
*promosm* 😳