Since a year I watch your video’s. I’m from the Netherlands. Really love your way of (complete honnest) communication. Also like your other colleagues that tested the Chinese clones. Because of you, and your TH-cam colleagues, I said goodbye to my Linn Intek amp, that I owned over 30 years, and bought the D5 PRO + Cary SLP-90. Did an upgrade with NOS tubes of Philips. WAUW! I was for decades in audio heaven but now I’m in audio walhalla. I listen to all kinds of music (accoustic, pop, indie, electronic…) Thank you for all your insight in these video’s. Rest of my set up. Linn Nexus loudspeakers (also over 30 years and first owner, still love them), Denafrips Ares II dac, Bluesound Node (130) with upgraded linear power supply. I will post my comment also with your Cary review.
It really does sound incredible for so little money! I have had tens of thousands of dollars of gear through here, and if you would have told me a $900 all in investment would have given me the sounds I am hearing right now, listening to a bit of Miles Davis, I would have said you are crazy. ;-) Very Happy!
I bought this dual mono amplifier a few months ago. It truly is an amazing detailled and relaxed sounding amp. Deep, dry and powerfull but very precise bass sound. Midrange is full and very nicely produced. High range is very very nice. It drives my Heco Mythos 500 high end speakers through a passive pre-amplifier very very easily.
Given that power consumption it will cost it's purchase price in annual electricity consumption with only modest usage (at least in the UK). The orphanage can kiss your donations goodbye but if the winter is harsh, you can invite them round to warm themselves beside your new amp. Honestly, it looks great. Enjoy.
Thanks! I was actually thinking about that a few days ago and I will definitely do that, I've ordered better fuses, opamps are already here, plan is to replace them as this is modding 101 - no soldering skills required - and do listening session and then a video with info on what I've learned :)
So Christmas came early, and the D5 Pro arrived today. Packaging was excellent. Weighty quality is what strikes you first. Quality switches and connectors. Sound on startup was good, slightly edging my Adcom GFA555. Somewhat disappointing considering the reviews. I am now 90 mins onto listening and it just keeps opening up further and further. I am now delighted with the purchase. Listening to "Matsuri No Genzo" by Sakura Sakura i am realising that this amp is pretty special. Thank you for your review. I need to send you a beer. 🍺
So I bit the bullet and ordered one of these and have had it for a few days now. This beast is absolutely stunning, the best power amp I have owned bar none. I am fronting it with the Dared MC-7P Tube Preamp and the combo sounds amazing. I also picked up a couple of pairs of the TODN Silver Plated OCC 16 Strand Interconnects to go with and they completely opened up the sound I was getting originally. I am shocked at the difference they made. Thanks again for the awesome reviews!
@@k4syx I am more than halfway there then I think. I just got those silver power cables you reviewed recently as well. I didn't notice any sonic differences really, but I will do some swaps after 150 hours or so.
I bought one of these after reading the positive reviews on Aliexpress and after seeing this clip. Mine is linked to a Quad Artera pre-amp and drives B&W Nautilus 805 stand mounts. My initial response was hugely disappointed due to overly forward and muddy bass response. I don't know if my experience is shared but it took two hours of continuous play before the base settled down and for veil to be taken off the music. I know that new amps need a burn in time but it didn't have time for that... As others have said, these amps run hot and need a well ventilated space. After two hours run time the difference was like night and day. The base response settled down and no longer dominated the music. Clarity, detail, midrange and tonality are stunning and it confirmed what I always suspected, which is that there was untapped potential in my B&W Nautilus speakers. I really can't explain the change because on first impressions, this wasn't an amp I'd be living with; two hours later , with the amp hot, best amp I've ever heard.
@@joemalone7385 and it will be even better after something like 250h of burn in! Yes it needs some space to vent the heat, but it's not that bad as some class A monsters :) Enjoy it, 805's are stunning speakers!
@@k4syx I'm well past my 200 hours burn in period, and happy to say that this amp is stunning in its depth of presentation and clarity. I feel like I've got an amp I've have had to pay thousands for, but for £500. However, the upgrade bug is dangerous, after having the same system for over 20 years, everything but the cd player is now getting changed. Waiting for some new Stradivari Amorat floor standers to be delivered. I'll keep the 805's set up in another room.
well i got it last night jammed it in my system straight away my god mate its just the best by far of anything if heard at anytime in my life it kicks ass and my kef104/2 i sware smoke came out of the port at first lol,imaging is mind blowing just everything is so so perfect ,im deeply grateful of you to review this magic amp thankyou x1000000..
Thanks for the great review. Had always wanted to try one of these low cost amps but don't have confidence on the sound quality so this review provides a good starting point.
@@Cenkolino Well, i wanted to know how many how many capacitance was used since they are so enormous, because i was building a class AB amp. It took the guy 16 years to invent this circuit and now people are cloning it. The real thing has 24 carat gold bars over the capacitors. even the glass plate was engineered so it doesn't harm the electronics inside (vibrate, etc).
@@AnalogDude_ Please be realistic in the world of audio...if it was retail/MSRP $50,000.00 and dealer price $23,000.00 and you hope that $500.00 end user price could compete or let say 90% performances to the real one, are you dreaming ? $50,000.00 price was over than 10 years ago and $500.00 price is in the year 2024 !!!😊
I took delivery of one of these clones a month ago, and this is my review of it so far. For reference, my system consists of an all Linn Akurate setup, DS Streamer/1, Preamp, and 2200 Power amp. The speakers are the world Audio Design KLS6's from HiFi World magazine. These are a DIY design I built in the mid 90's and upgraded a few years ago with a new tweeter, crossover design and components, and cabinets. I'll caveat this my saying this is how it sounds in my system with my speakers in my room, so what I hear may not be what you here. Long story short, this clone is amazing. In just about every parameter used to describe audiophile sound, in what I'm hearing it matches the Linn 2200. For a start the overall tone is identical, soundstage, transparency, detail, space around instruments and voices, transient speed, all match the Linn in every way. There are two differences, the clone has a slightly warmer sound, with more body than the leaner drier Linn, so bass is a little fuller, and treble is a touch smoother. Also the volume levels between bass and treble frequencies is better balanced, so overall it's an easier amp to listen to in my system, and for that reason I prefer it to the Linn. At 1/10th the price of the Linn it's a serious bargain, and the fact that it looks like a Linn Klout from the 90's is a bonus.
I don't understand something - you say it is the best sounding amplifier you've ever heard and you intend on keeping it. BUT, you have stated in other review that you only use balanced connections which this unit doesn't have xlr inputs. Is there not a sonic improvement in using balanced connections would you think? If so, is there an XLR version link to buy from that you would recommend?Or will this be a good enough amplifier for me even though it has only RCA inputs? I ask because it looks like I will be returning the E405 I purchased for refund because of it being faulty, and am looking for another different amp to replace it. I really liked the sound qualities of the E405, especially the way it slightly smoothens and softens the S sounds in vocals. Does this one or any other power amps you've reviewed have the same qualities?
My whole setup is balanced, but SQ is my ultimate goal so if RCA here sounds better then I will use SE :) All good amps have no sibilance, if you experience it sometimes you may have somewhat sibilant speakers
Using a Valhalla 2 as a preamp, the amp rocks and rules over the few amps I own. It pushes my 4 ohm elac floor speakers with some beautiful articulation. Thank you for your review and intro to Frank (subtitled). $535 shipped and I made sure to get the exact amp you reviewed.
I recently bought a recommended Cary set and this amplifier but I have a small problem with turning on, the amplifier sometimes turns on the first time but mostly only on the second time, did you have similar experiences?
Mine's operating fine. Had this issue with my Bryston. Contact the seller QUICK before Chinese new year holiday begins or you're going to get crickets for at least a fortnight! Get warranty support. Let everyone know how you get along.
Does it happen when you power them on in the right sequence too? (meaning preamp first, wait for like 20-30sec, then power amp?) D5Pro has a very sensitive protection circuit that gets triggered easily via preamp start. But all in all its a well known and recommended by all audio manufacturers to turn source first, then preamp, then power amp at the end. And power them off in reversed order, power amp goes off first then preamp and then source last. have you tried that?
@@k4syx Yes, I always turn it on according to this procedure. I changed the power cable to a regular one and other better shielded interconnects between the amplifier and the preamplifier and it seems that the problem is gone. The preamplifier has about 60 hours of play and the amplifier 30 hours. Damn, but it plays well! I also had the Leema Tucana 2 and Rose RA 180 before, but this clone is better than them! my reference is line magnetic 219ia and I still have to compare both but I already know it will be a tough fight. My speakers are Goldenear triton reference, Dac is Line magnetic 32 streamer ifi zen stream.
@@rogdar5767 this means that there was some problem with the cable, its good that you've found it this was before anything bad could happen (some small intermittent short probably?)
I brought this amp on the strength of the review and was blown away by it. At first, I thought the amp was beautiful tonally but too polite and lightweight, until I realised that impression came from being used to amps that were just a little bit strained or lacking in bass control. I've owned Quad 909s, Teddy Pardo Monos, Goldnote PA10, Michell Alectos and a Pass Aleph in my time. All were highly enjoyable amps but this beats them all. For under £500. Don't hesitate to buy one of these. Can't see how you can go wrong.
I own a Quadd 909 (refurbished, upgraded a bit). Can you tell me how these compare please? What I especially like abou the Quad is that it produces a full bodied sound even at low volumes. Is that true vor this clone too?
@@WhiteRvssian2023 I always liked the Quad for much the same reason and especially because the sound was always tonally pleasant, if not the last word in grace or resolution. The D5 Pro is so amazingly graceful and controlled, so delicate and coherent, that you think that it is too polite, at first. Then you slowly realize all those other power amps you owned sounded slightly chaotic. The D5 is the best money I've ever spent in hi-fi in thirty years. I can't imagine what you would have to spend to beat it with Western hi-fi products. A Sugden Masterclass has a lot of the same effortless power and grace but I don't recall it having the D5 Pro's micro-dynamic resolution and tonal shading. The Pass Aleph matched the sheer resolution of the D5 but sounded clinical by comparison. My strong advice is to buy the D5 Pro. You can thank me later! ;)
New subscriber I enjoy your content. Looking forward to more on this DartZeel NHB-108 clone I'm seriously considering buying one myself. LOL will need a preamp for it what would you suggest?
I was going to purchase this power amplifier based on your review of this amplifier. It’s Black Friday sales but I’m going to hold off until your review of the NHB-108 Pro Stereo Hgh power amplifier comes out as I think that will be tad better and it has balanced output as well, which makes it more versatile.
@@k4syx a local dealer has a pair of Kef ref 5 metas ex demo for $25k NZ reduced from $42k, which I can no way afford, but I have been dreaming of pairing those with this amp. Keep buying those lottery tickets I guess
QUESTION : Got mine from the same store. I love it. My slow start is with a green color 'round ' little transformer. I wonder why a have that version. Not the little black square one like yours.
Interesting, probably different batch of slow start circuits. I envy you a little because round means toroidal and that would be quieter and better than block one that I have ;)
I just did it. Ordered the Pro version. Could not resist it after watching your video. Now I just have to wait for a hole month... By the way you have a splendid channel. So informative. I can't wait for new videos to turn up 👍
Thanks & greetings from Romania. After watching your review i have ordered the amp. Received it 5 days ago, sounds great, tube like, non fatiguing, best 500 Euro ever spent!
Hi, I did investigate quite a lot and found many different versions of it: D5, D5pro, D9 and a "Version 4" with a integrated preamp and one with a volume knob... Do you have any idea on what version the "Version 4" is based on? Not sure if the preamp is done well and introduces noise + there is no spec on the frequency range. It says -20kHz, but as Frank tested it goes up to more than 300kHz. So, I am pretty confused. Currently, I am tending to get the D9 with XLR inputs + will add a preamp in case I need it. It is foreseen to serve the front speakers of home theatre. Unfortunatelly, the speakers (4Ohm) go down to 2Ohm and the AVR can't handle it. Nobody seem to share information on how good the NHB108 can handle 2Ohm. I hope that it can do it... Appreciate any comment... thanks
Hi! Before I bought my D5PRO I asked the seller for the advice on the sound quality, I was also wondering which clone will be the best. The recommendation was to get D5 but to make sure I will choose D5 Pro variant. I specifically asked about XLR version but Kevin from Funkenya pointed me towards D5 Pro, though XLR version is more expensive and would mean more margin for him. As for the impedance, as I wrote in one of another comments here, my Ascents drop to as low as 1.2 Ohm and the amp passes this test with flying colors retaining all openess and transparency in the treble. So - don't worry :) BTW quality AVRs handle 2Ohms with no problems - like my CA 751Rv2.
@@michaelcampbell9459 sound quality. And I asked about that because as you say, XLRs are always or almost always better (as long as the setup is fully balanced)
Hello and thank you. It’s a beautiful piece of workmanship. I can only criticize that the RCA input wires are too close to the transformer wires. Maybe you could replace them with shielded cable.
Yes I was thinking about replacing them with something better in future anyway, something like solid silver in teflon. Could be shielded also. But at the moment I don't feel the urgent need if you know what I mean. It sounds so great!
Please tell the actual specs for the transformer. I might get one and take out one channel to make two monoblocs (I don't mind buying two identical looking silver chassis too!). I suppose I need to buy a soft relay module too.
Which preamplifier would you recommend for the NHB 108 D5 pro? I saw that stores that offer the NHB 108 also sell various preamplifiers. Do you have any experience with these Chinese preamplifiers? I will be grateful for your help.
Check my other videos in my channel and look for Cary SLP-90 that has "D5Pro soulmate" in the video title :D Its my standing recommendation for excellent setup :)
Hi fi zone, have a question for ya about setting up hi fi Amp: dartzeel d5 pro Pre amp+ dac: theta ds pre Speakers: holographic easy to drive, can't remember the name. Recommend me speaker cables plus interconnects. Thank you
I just discovered your channel. I hope that you keep covering and explaining the design of different Chinese replica amps, preamps, dacs, etc etc. by the way , is there any chance you could or would cover replica chinese speakers? such as for example the Oatlon WZ-801F speakers which are an almost exact copy of the B&W 804 D3
Speakers are tempting and I was thinking about them, but the shipping costs are crazy! Also, I think speakers are more delicate and I'm kinda afraid they'd get here broken. But I've read some very good opinions on both fake and some local brands speakers.
Thanks! As for the caps - Im not sure I personally would go for it. Elnas are good, Vishays are good, but I see them as same or very similiar lever caps.
Hi, thanks for the video. I've got a quick question if you don't mind. I'm currently making a replica of a ATC SCM 50 from aos. It's a passive studio monitor. It's a 3 way system, where the bass driver is 200watts at 4ohm, the mid is 200watts at 16ohms and the tweeter is 50w at 4ohms. Is this amplifier powerful enough to drive a pair of the replica I'm building, and 2nd question, is this amplifier brutally true sounding and not coloured. I will be using this amplifier solely for studio mixing and mastering. Would like to hear your thoughts on it. Thanks
Yes this will be ok to drive them with 150W per channel. It's also very clean without colorization, no artificial warmness or dryness. I think you'll like it because of dynamics and amount of detail it can reproduce.
Many thanks for the informative review. Did you ask this seller about a possibility to add 12V IN trigger? Seems its only one stuff which stops me to buy this amp.😊
Hi Great review Thanks a lot In previous comment you suggested to use DAC DO200 hdmi interface for signal hdmi out from my Onkyo nr656 Where is the volume control ? Do I need to include preamplifier between DO200 and D5PRO? If so, what do you suggest ? A low cost clone could do the job ? Accuphase C3850 clone ? Best regards and thanks for your help
@@brunodelacour8976 Hi! DAC will act as volume control as you may use it as a preamp - it has variable volume output. So no preamp needed, it will save you some money!
Great news I just need to connect my hdmi output arc of my Onkyo videoamplifier to an hdmi splitter, one connection going to the videoprojector and the other to the hdmi input of DO200 and that is all? It will not take benefit of the ARC device ? Thank you so much for your support
Hello, I’m just starting my 2 channel journey and had a couple noob questions. I’m leaving the home theater for the 2 channel realm 👍🏻. Is there away to have a 2.1 or 2.2 two channel system where your able to raise and lower the subwoofer 🔊 output from my sitting position? My wife and I use or music room to now also watch movies. I’d say we are a 80% music and 20% movies couple👍🏻. I’m looking at the following purchases. D5PRO Carey SPL-90 Or very possibly the Zerozone TP3255 with the Carey SPL-90 looks like a great setup as well.
If youd want to change the sub volume alone, then youd probably need a sub with a remote for 2 channel audio setup. the usual way is that sub volume stays the same relevant to the main speakers volume level to be coherent all the time. So IMHo the only way would be to get the sub with remote control (or via app)
Still alive and kicking :) I always do a two weeks long burn in. This is good reliability test as they are running 24/7 playing music with speakers connected. Compared to that, regular listening later is nothing :D
There is an upgraded D9Pro and I am keen to try as it has balanced inputs. However, solely on value, would I be better off just getting the D5 or D5Pro in your opinion?
@@RyanChoo I was actually asking about that owner of the shop I got my D5PRO from and he said, that for pure sound quality, D5 Pro (specifically PRO, not regular D5) will be better than D9 with XLRs
Mine has just been delivered, in exceptional condition, packed really very well, from start to finish 3 weeks and 3 days . I will leave it until tomorrow to try, it's a bit cold here at the moment so let it acclimatize.. Ok two days in and still have goosebumps, what an amplifier sensational sound, and it just gets better every time I switch it on .. The description is spot on ..
Just had my first of very many hours with this beauty. WOW and again WOW. Absolutely superb sound. Beats my other power amps completely (£800-£2000). In fact they are crying. Where have my speakers gone ?
@@k4syx 2hrs in now and I can see great big Tannoys in front of me but it feels like I could move them out and the sound would stay the same...I have a lot of music to listen to. Will have to work out toilet arrangements as I am not moving for a while. Amp nirvana. Thanks for your detailed review and recommendation.
@@WhiteRvssian2023 As loud as I can without waking everyone. You can use the trick Ive shown in other video on burning speakers silently - check that out
Did some research. There is a Model One version of this amp which was around $18,000 (USD) and a Model Two which was around $65,000 (USD). The layout of this clone is more like the Model One which is still a great value. Second, it appears this is a Class AB amp with the first 20 watts biased for Class A which explains commentary I found on it running hot.
It's not that hot actually. It was like 51C on radiator fins when running 24/7 which is okayish, definitely not something that will give you burns. But it's a big, solid case and it WAS 150W when idle :)
@@k4syx My comment was based on one of the few customer reviews posted on this clone where I found it. Even at $18,000 original cost, getting a clone for $500 would be a fantastic deal. And you would expect an amp with a Class A bias to run a little hot and draw a lot of current while idle.
@@ccdccd8615i bought one fter this review and it takes 150W on iddle, I live in USA which means I have 115v mains. This takes over 1amp at iddle, in music easy comes up to 2Amp usage (I used simply power meter between mains in and wall outlet)
@@yellow_noise3 I live in hot Texas and can't even do any tubes due to A/C bill, is this thing going to heat up my room too much? Can it be turned off so no power usage in idle and then turned on a few minutes before sitting down to listen, or should this amp be left on always? I've had A/B amps but never any that starts in class A like this one does. I'm currently running class D for less heat but not completely happy with sound on these Fosi V3 monos into Magnepan 3.7i, even with upgraded Muse 2 opamps.
@@michaelcampbell9459 You can cut it off from power and give it about 10 minutes to warm up when you decide to listen to it ;) No need for standy wasting your money :)
Out of curiousity, I ordered the combo to hear for myself if there was any value to be reaped from AliExpress hifi gear. I'm waiting for the SLP-90 to arrive - in the meantime the D5 Pro is here. I can 'see' why you recommend a pairing with a tube preamp. In my neutral and resolution oriented system, the vocals/mids from this amp sometimes sound a bit small in size/pushed to the background a little compared to the other bands, in fact the depths of the instruments in the soundstage have changed quite a bit from my reference power amp,. I'm not sure what to make of it. It's a complete departure from the reference amp and the amps in the other two systems I have. The bass is warm which gives this amp a bit of a lowercase V type sound. Tubes would warm the mids up, I presume. It has things going for it. The level of clarity and transparency is good, especially for an amp at this price. My favourite thing about the amp is that it is quite punchy and dynamic and causes things to pop up in high relief. I guess that's another way of saying that it sounds holographic. It sounds like music is being played live in front of you, as opposed to being just a recording. As for the cons, I can't help but feel like there are some microdetails missing. But otherwise, once I've lived with it for a bit longer - and listen to it with the SLP-90, the jury is still out for me.
Thanks for sharing! Have you let it play for 120-150h? It does change after that (and interestingly can sound a bit worse at something like 90h, no idea why)
Dear, I am a wondering what to do when there is a problem while there is no garanty. Sending back to China or finding someone nearby? Love your reviews. Thanks! James
Hi James! I would get one to some local workshop. Both channel boards and power boards are exactly the same so its easy to find the fault by comparing readouts from both. I know that its possible to buy whole amp board from sellers in China to replace left or right channel too. The last thing I would to is to ship it back, the shipping prices from EU to China are insane.
@ Thank you. I adore your tests and just ordered the dartzeel pre. Just for comparing with my bryston bp 26 preamp. I will do the same with the Dartzeel power amp.(compare with bryston 4b st)
I'm a transaudio FM255 preamp and T7 power amp owner. Super happy with the sound. I'm confident to buy from transaudio. Thanks for educating us about the parts.
Does the FM255 have op amps or other mods available? It's hard to understand these transaudio pre-amps. The Master C3.9 (Cayin Clone) has op amps listed and sockets shown in pics. Can't tell on FM255
It sounds great :) Very clean and detailed without being too dry. Base is quite quick and agile with good weight and slam. Mids are absolutely glorious and the highs are very well extended with lots of details. I'm using it with my musical paradise preamplifier (heavily modded) , it's a great match in my opinion as one might think.... usually it's a very good combo, i mean for solid state amp with a tube pramp. 😊
@@ilanspiro1645 The MP701mk2 is fantastic. What have you done to yours? Does this Clone need higher gain tubes and dip switch settings? I use mine with a Bryston 3Bsst and lower gain output/inputs. 🎵🎶🤫🎶🎵
Thanks for introducing this amplifier to me. I bought one with the pass P17 clone. I love it. Do you know if it auto changes it's output when connected to 4ohm speakers from 8ohm . Or do we need to change a setting inside? I couldn't find any references in any videos online!
Still excellent and going strong. And I use it as baseline in my all preamp reviews so thats probably the highest praise. 8 months? Was it so long ago already?? :)
AliE has a wide selection of this amp some of which are priced in the $4000-6000 range, featuring a much more authentic clone with enormous bus bars for the filter caps and ground planes. The $6k model is fully balanced so it doubles the number in input and output boards which raises the cost. These look to be extremely SERIOUS amps, and are priced accordingly.
@@rontoolsie yes I've seen them, there are also even pricier clones of other amp types, but then with 6k we're slowly getting into ridiculously expensive territory again :)
@@k4syx i think it may be 3x as good for 6x the price...in the days of diminishing returns, that may actually be great VFM, especially when we spend 100s of $ to get a few % improvement.
The philosophy of the original is to have as few components as possible. A balanced version negates that and in the average home, there is no need for balanced designs. Unless there's 20+ metres of cable between the pre and the power amp.
Wow. I'm putting this on my shopping list. This is class A amp, right? And the difference between standard and pro version is the slow start feature that protects speakers? It's only a pitty they don't have balanced XLR inputs.
Got mine recently. Overall workmanship and sonic is good. The 18 (or maybe 20) gauge wiring from the power board to the amp board and back is embarrassing. 60V rails should get me about 180watt but that bottleneck is bothersome.
@@k4syx45 min on the bench and now it has much better connection between the cap board and the audio board. Sounds significantly better than before. Thankfully it’s got enough holes on each board for me to add solid core wiring to bridge the output, ground, +, and - rails. Now it sounds like a proper 180W amp.
Hi, Thanks for the very informative review. It makes me want to buy it. But, I'm uncertain if it will benefit me because I have a Yamaha Aventage RXA4A 110 watts/ channel avr that I would hook it up to the preouts of and for speakers I'll use Kef LS50 metas. I use a powered sub also that I cutoff at 40hz. I'm looking to get better sound at just moderate to a little high volumes in a small bedroom 10x15 feet. I'm looking to achieve smoother mids and highs, tighter bass, holographic immersion, natural sounding, etc. I already tried hooking up a NAD C298 but I could not hear a difference in sound quality at all except for seeming to sound a tiny bit rougher, edgier in the upper mids and highs so I returned it. I wonder if it was the work of the C298 magnifying those poor qualities of my avr dac, etc. So, I'm left now wondering if it was the class D NAD amp or my avr being the source or both. This amp while seemingly a really good value still represents a hefty investment to me and I can't afford to make a purchase mistake. Do you think hooking this amp up my avr will make my LS50 metas sound better in the ways you discribe here and in ways I want and even at lower listening levels or will I have to replace my avr with other source components to hear a worthwile benefit?
I would not use Yamaha as an input source to this amp (and NAD too). This is completely different level sound quality device. It eats raw my Cambridge Audio 751rV2 AVR (as 99% of other clones too) - and this AVR is one of the top of the line of all times AVRs when it comes to sound quality. It will sound only as good as the source and as long as your speakers are good, yamaha will be a bottleneck here.
@@k4syx Ok thank you. Would you mind recommending an appropriate source that has dsp, including bass management, has usb thumb drive and an optical input so I can listen to music from my thumb drive and also youtube music videos from my TV?
Are the LS50 Metas good speakers for this amp i wonder? All reviewers of this speaker are saying the more power their fed the better the sound. So, I'm suspecting my avr is not enoygh to reach their full potential. When you said "It eats raw my Cambridge Audio 751rV2 AVR (as 99% of other clones too)", in what way/s do you mean? Why would you not use a Yamaha RXA4A as a source? Is it because it will magnify sound flaws in the avr dac, etc or will it just not improve the sound or will it make it sound worse? Would you please offer me a more detailed explaination and maybe direct me to what I should pair it up with and why? I have it sitting inn my Aliexpress shopping cart and just not convinced one way or another. Hope you can help with this.
@@user-bf7no5sl9q OK so this is proper hiend amp. Its really, really good. It will show you its qualities with good speakers and good source. Your Metas are something that this amp can work with: though it will be happy to drive something like B&W Nautilus series too. But your AVR, as long as its ok for AVR, will not provide as good source signal as for example dedicated DAC converter. So you can use DartZeel in your setup, but the final sound quality will be limited by your yamaha. If you'll get better source in the future, you will see (hear :)) what this amp is capable of :)
@@user-bf7no5sl9q In my case something that fits all these is my fanless, passive i7 HTPC in microATX form factor. Dead silent, small, excellent as a source and very flexible.
Until recently in one of my systems I had Audiolab M-PWR power amplifier. It wasn't TOTL, but there was nothing to compare anyway. This is different league, it's better than my balanced driven twin Cambridge Audio Azur 851W in mono mode.
kupiłem tego klona z czystej ciekawości... nie opowiadasz głupot i to jest najważniejsze!! fajny kanał i dobrze gadasz . Jeszcze jedno tak Ci podpowiem bo też mam gustarda r26 i jeszcze kilka innych fajnych gratów, posłuchaj sobie z twoimi elektrostatami okto dac8, nie jest tani ale robi cuda zwłaszcza w górze pasma. U mnie z klonem dartzell pozamiatał a gram na spendorach sp2/3 a one nie wybaczają niczego. Pozdrawiam👍
Thanks! I've sold R26 and stayed with X26PRO. R26 was cool but electrostats exposed that's loosing some fine detail when compared to X26PRO. I guess I'm delta sigma guy :) A DartZeel - ten klon - zamiata ceną i jakością. Super że jesteś zadowolony!
Do you think that it make sense to buy the more expensive dartzeel clones, like the NHB-268? There are also many products with price tag between the d5pro and the NHB-268, that have circuits that looks much similar to the original dartzeel
@@raananberger6830 among the expensive Dartzeel clones you also have the even more dynamic NHB-368 (stereo)& NHB-468 Mono amplifiers those are even more dynamic!! It is even said better sounding than the original Dartzeel, but those clones are not cheap!!!
Hi, I just purchased a D5Clone, Which is not a NHB-108 Clone but a new amp based on the 108 circuite. The sound is as other bescrive, amazing. Nothing less. I have been in this interest in over forty years, and this amp is not only "good", but good in a seldom way, that often gives the listener an new and eye-opening experience. It is so clean, open and "big" musical authorative, that personally I have just been given the same by some high-end Accuphase classA amps. Very expensive. And some small upgrades, as silver internal cables, change the steel bolt in the trafos middle to a non magnetic bolt, glueing a heavey plate under the botton plate and with some glue that is flexible after drying and change the output speaker terminal to Quality types with less metal, will give even more real high-end sound. Even as standard, I will have this amp before anything under Usd 10.000,00. They drive my Mofi Soundscape 8 with high-ens bass, midrange, treble, big precise soundscape, dynamics and a twist of musicality. They do not make good sound. They let the music come through. There are just a sensitivity for hum, that do not come from the amp itself. But cables and source must be well earthed and not sending any electrical distorsion.
@@BowmanDk1 Love your review! One of the things I love about these clones is the fact that with small easy tweaks like that you can easily upgrade them! A few minutes for soldering and replacing something and they get even better! I'm also gonna try replacing DC servo opamps with something more modern and precise, I'm wondering about the results :)
None - in my experience pre causes loss of some fine detail from DAC. Over the years I've tried different preamps but it always ended the same way and I was going back to DAC volume control.
I ordered the Musical Paradise pre with the standard Hovland caps which suit my setup very well. I also tried the Vcap Odams but there are too trebly for my setup. Very satisfied with the MP-701 and D5 Pro combo.
These "Elna for Audio" caps can be purchased on your favourite portal. Surprisingly, they are not shipped from Japan and listed as unbranded further down in the description. Hope that sheds some light on the true origins of this feature.
Yes I've seen them there and that got me wondering. I went for it anyway because cap replacement with these boards is very easy so in time when I will feel the itch I can get something better locally (maybe even a bit higher capacity) and have fun replacing them :)
I would take a close look at transistors tbh, wonder how many of industry favourites, no longer manufactured for decades, miraculously found their way there. Im not saying the Chinese cannot make proper stuff, they can and do, but knock off is usually just that, a knock off.
@@paulb4661 I think Frank in his vid mentions that he checked them and found to be real. These are not some unique Sankens which reminds me that I was going to write them down and post that in description here
@@k4syx With these caps on board, I wouldn't be surprised, if transistors were just as genuine. They may not try to pass for Sanyos you mention, but whoever's behind the enterprise, cannot possibly run the assembly at a loss.
@paulb4661 they don't - I've asked about this and they said that businesses that are producing electronic devices for export are subsidied by the state. Which is worrying in the long run for various reasons. But this price is impossible even just for a case with toroidal transformer of that quality, not mentioning pcbs, all other parts and labour. And Omrons there are original, WIMAs are real (I'm using them locally TME or Mouser sourced so I can compare). Without subsidies explaining this that's just impossible. When I was deciding on purchase the final argument for me was that even if every single electronic part there was fake, it would still be a good deal for me even if I would have to replace all of them ;) I'll check the transistor types and add that to the description when I'll get home around Friday
Aaah thats pretty important thing. Measure your actual voltage if you can because in UK it can vary in different areas and get one that is closer to what you'll measure. You need to message the seller, they do these by order so getting one from eBay you should also be able to pick the right voltage version. Theory says 220 and 230 should be the same (within tolerance limit) but I was living near Cambridge for a while and I know thats not necessarily true...
Don't worry. The "200+" volts are all good upto 230-240. And since those climate idiots decided on wind power, you would be lucky to even get 220V from your plugs 😜
I purchased both, the DartZeel D5 Pro clone and the MF A1 clone. As both continue to “burn in” -here are my first impressions. (For reference, I have about 25 receivers/amps in my collection; my reference amp is a vintage Marantz 2252b that you can purchase for ~$USD 1600. This Marantz is exceptionally musical, open and clear. My reference speakers include an 8 foot tall set of Voigt Pipes and and Open Baffle’ (18 inch bass driver, 12 inch mid and two asd1001 tweeters): Compared to the Marantz both the the D5 and A1 are significantly more veiled ~40% less “open-transparent-clear” (mid range and tweeters). The D5 is about 10% better than the A1 - making the A1 clone the better purchase. I would say that both offer relative value, given the price. Sonically they both compare well to the Schiit Vidar. They are not giant killers. I would be looking at both as platforms for experimentation e.g. replace capacitors etc. Please share your experience with these!
@@JingoLoBa57 yes, it is not even close. The clone is now broken in. Personally I would not buy it again nor recommend it at all. Sorry, I had such high hopes based on this video.
I suspect you may not have a good preamp match.The Dartzeel copies seem to need a preamp with quite high gain.Without an active preamp they do not sound much good.THe FM155 copy preamp on high gain position work well with them.
Find a way to bypass the fake Elna caps. Place a 330-1000uF bypass cap to each. Space may be challenging. Also look at the 5 wires from the PS board to the audio board. 😢
I've been looking at these, there's several makers, but the one with the Pro version has my attention. I believe you have the pro version, it looks like a work of art! I wonder if it's possible to get it with balanced XLR inputs instead of RCA?
Yes it's the Pro version, most of the sellers have it in offer but you have to choose it as an option (default is D5 with lower price). I think the producer is one company and there are just many shops selling these. There are versions with XLRs but they are 3 times more expensive and they are looking like real DartZeel
@@k4syx I couldn't find a D5 that offered XLR, so I ordered the D5 Pro from FunKenya HiFi Store who seems to be a good seller. I also ordered their "Accuphase C245 Preamplifier Fully Balanced Audiophile HIFI Preamplifier Remote Control High end Home Sound Amplifier 1:1 Clone" which appears to be actually manufactured by BRZHiFi who are pretty well known for producing good quality HiFi gear. Now the waiting game begins :)
Can you provide a link to this amplifier? I prefer DIY and designing my own gear but given this is no longer protected by certain IP laws I would feel OK considering this amplifier. I built a clone Threshold amplifier with a BOM well North of this complete amplifier. Although I don’t know the overall quality of the parts in this amplifier it is still a good value considering the transformer, enclosure and PCB’s. Thank you.
Ahhh of course, that's not a fake so linking is fine, I've added the link to the description. And yes that's one thing I forgot to mention: the case, toroidal transformer and caps alone are already worth more than price for complete build here in Europe! That's why I've asked them how's that even possible
@@tommusikauswahl1066 No I have pure D5PRO without volume control. The seller I got that amp from said when I talked about his recommendation that the volume pot version uses MBL schema for pre, but that combination is not the best one (not really well executed for some reason) so he wasn't recommending that set at all. Don't know about pre yet. I have some ordered coming my way, including a few tube ones.
@@tommusikauswahl1066 I have the power amp with no volume control. I am using an Accurate R2R dac as a preamp also bought from Ali. It works perfect. The amp is of high quality and is dead silent. Sounds both powerful and delicate. It gets hot though so if you plan to buy it you need proper ventilation and don't put anything on top of it.
It was really good, that's why I went for burn-in. If something sounds bad right out of the box I'm either retuning it or selling, burn-in can refine things but never changes the overall signature much.
I ordered one on your recommendation (D5 Pro). It's very good. I'm driving a pair of Golden Ear BRX monitors and have it paired with a nice tube preamp. I've never had any exotic amplifiers in my system. So I've been used to good mid-fi (Yamaha, Cambridge Audio, Hafler, etc.) It is probably the best sounding amp I've ever had. However, I have found that the unit shuts down after many hours of play. Even if there is no signal going through it. When I first got it I left it running to burn in the electrical components. It shut down while at idle after about 5 hours. A few days later, it shut down after being used for about 3 hours while I was listening at normal volume. This weekend, I left it on and after 3 days, I woke up in the morning and it was off - but still warm - so it must have just recently shut down. The "on" button is still in the "on" position when I check it. I can turn it off then back on, and it starts and runs fine. What do you think is happening? I'm in the USA so sending it back is not an option since it cost me over $200 to get it here. Any thoughts?
There are two options: 1. Temperature. Try to measure it after a few hours. Or get the amp in place with good air circulation and remove top lid. If it will stay on, then you need to cool it down or provide better air circulation. 2. I've noticed that my DarZeel has very sensitive speaker protection. Its easy to trigger it via some preamps (like Jc2, with that one I need always to observe the right power on sequence). But I have no idea whats the rest of the setup you have. I would bet my money on option 1 if you were able to run it for 3 days in a row though.
How can anyone call this a clone. Dartzeel NHB-108 use only one pair out output transistors without any emitter resistors. This design use three complementary pairs WITH emitter resistors. The design of the Dartzeel output stage is a very important part of the excellence in sound quality and this design don't even try to use the same technology.
Well its not a 1:1 clone down to every single bit (though you can get these as well). This is cloned and then repurposed a bit and yes, the original or 1:1 clone will sound better - surely! But this one is great for what it is and for the price is simply amazing. Having bought this one, I am tempted to get 1:1 replica - right down to shape of plates conducting cap terminals. But I need my wallet to recover as I got A LOT of stuff lately :)
@@k4syx How can you tell on Aliexpress which one is 1:1 clone of Dartzeel? I was going to buy some of those Fosi ZA monos or Aiyama, but how does class D compare to Dartzeel clone?
@@JRadian DartZeel clone will be better, but way more expensive especially if you're looking for 1:1 clone. You can recognize them because they are called replicas, they look like the DartZeel (along with red eyes etc), they have top cover made of glass and internals look exactly like DartZeel original - you can find photos of original to compare
@@k4syx I just saw your review of Musical Fidelity clone. I need very little power because I will be powering my 110dB horns from 1kHz and up only. Just need few awesome watts.
@ I hope so! This may exceed in abilities the speakers I have. Is it it worth getting a good clone preamp, or will my Wiim Ultra work decently for now?
@@kirchgoens You'll be fine for now, but do get Cary preamp that I reviewed for it too when possible. Its just so much better (even better!) with excellent tube pre
@@k4syxMy clone arrived today. I’ve got it running with a pair of circa 1981 Walsh Ohm 2’s and a Wiim Ultra on Tidal. It sounds really nice. The Cary hasn’t arrived yet.
Hi I found your video very interesting and I am tempted to buy this clone. One thing is stopping me - the input signal cables! It looks like the connector on this equipment case is coaxial. What input cables did you use? And where can I get them? What is in the box when it is delivered? Is a power cable also supplied? I cannot find a manual for this amplifier in the Internet. Many thanks in advance! All the best, Rob in Switzerland
Hi Rob! It's using standard RCA connector so any RCA signal cable will do. Power is via standard IEC connector like in 99prc of audio equipment, so you'll be fine. There are no cables in the box however, you need to buy somey locally if you don't have anything unused around the house.
@@k4syx That's great! I have a very revealing system: Primare CD32, Topping D90 DAC, exposure XI+XII preamp, Exposure stereo VIII power amp, KEF Reference Three-Two with Townshend supertweeters. All anaolgue sgnal cables are Audioquest Earth, Speaker cables are Kimber Crystal 24 (like 12TC) Kimber power cables, dedicated power outlet. The exposure power amp is underpowered for the KEF speakers and I think I need more power and control. Otherwise I am very happy with the sound. Putting my speaker cables on risers made a surprising difference: faster attack and freer in the extreme high frequencies. I was considering two Fosi V3 monoblocks in Class D with two 10A power supplies but I think the character of the D5Pro will better suit my system. The exposure rolls off slowly around 100kHz so I think it will be a good match. All the best, Rob in Switzerland PS. congratulations on your great English - I found your sound review very nuanced!
@@k4syx Thank you so much! I have just realized that my speakers are rated at 4 Ohms and suited for amplifiers up to 300 W per channel so this seems a perfect match. I am hoping for more power and control in the bass which my Exposure VIII is a bit lacking with these speakers. I am looking forward to the palpable mid and also the extended highs which the KEF Reference Three-Twos with the Townshend supertweeters can easily reproduce. I'm glad I discovered your great channel! 🙂
@@k4syxHi! I bought it and it arrived 2 weeks ago! I AM VERY HAPPY WITH IT! It is an IMPROVEMENT on my 38 year old Exposure VIII stereo power amplifier which I think produced about 70W into 4 Ohms. I was not happy with the bass from my KEF Reference Two Three speakers because I think they are quite demanding (the back panel label says use amplifiers up to 300W into 4 Ohms) and the Exposure was a little weak. Now I can play tracks with very deep bass and can hear notes in my room certainly to 30 Hz more or less flat. The transparency is good and the -3dB rolloff at 300kHz is higher than the Exposure which is felt in transients and better imaging as well as much better depth information which was missing in my old Exposure. Remember my Kimber Crystal 24 speaker cable with WBT connectors is on 17cm cable risers which liberated the extreme top end and improved the sounds stage and transients. Thank you very much for your excellent video and your impressions which convinced me (with Frank's Werkstatt) to commit my pension money to a new amplifier! All the best and many happy hours of listening, greetings to Poland from Rob in Switzerland
I have been enjoying the sound from a pair of Fosi ZA3s with Sparkos op amps with a pair of Magnepan LRS and the Sound Artist LS5/9 clone.There is way more detail and resolution over the Schiit Vidar 2. I actually prefer the sound of the Vidar but the ZA3s are close plus with the added detail and clarity. Sounds like this might be a best of both worlds kind of thing.
Logans are also hard to drive. I have ZA3 lined up for review, I don't see it as being contender for D5 Pro, but I am very curious about it. No serious listening session yet (no time yet) but I love engineering on this small amp - I'll cover that in my review!
@@k4syxLooking forward to the review. I couldn't stand it though and went ahead and ordered one.🤣 I do see now there is another version available with XLR and a slightly larger case for better heat dissipation but it would wind up costing almost $400 more as that seller charges way more for shipping than FunKenya. Was able to score a $50 coupon. $581 shipped for this one. Cant wait!
Thank you to HiFi Zone for this video and taking the time to reply to so many comments. I also recently got a D5 Pro. Mostly out of curiosity and having read many hours of anything I could find about it. I already have many amps from Class D to 845 SET. As most on here already know, this amp is outstanding value. I would recommend it to anyone starting their hifi journey. I am also running it with ML ESL panels and would suggest pairing this with a tube preamp. I have one question - would anyone happen to have a link to a site with suggested mods to do? Ive cut and pasted and saved many comments and suggestions, but if anyone is aware of a thread or site detailing mods I would greatly appreciate a link! 😊
Hi there! I think most of info is here in the comments, I'm not aware of any info on the web on that subject (at least there was nothing when I was researching the D5Pro wondering if I should risk my money and buy it). As for the mods, I'd say capacitors mostly and input signal wires + soldering them directly to the board (being aware that it may make future disassembly harder). Also: speaker taps: you can get better stuff, but thats easy thing to replace. Maybe RCA inputs too. The amp boards themselves are good and I dont see any obvious things to improve there.
Love the video, what preamp are you gonna be using with this power amp? I'm considering moving at this direction as well and ditching my integrated amp in a favour of power amp + preamp.
Thank you! None at all actually: with electrostats I can hear the detail loss coming from placing pre between DAC and power amp. I've tried using pre a couple of times over the years, but I've always came back to simple DAC and power amp set.
@@k4syx that's interesting, but actually as per a rule of the thumb they say in the audiophile world less elements in the chain the better. How do you choose which seller to pick up from Ali? E.G the amp that you've featured is available in several shops with some minor differences in price.
@demart28 combination of the cheapest one with the biggest amount of positive feedback. A lot of guys from Germany had already bought this amp after Franks video
Sorry, no :( I'd love to someday, if there will be funds, explore more of these clone amps - but we'll see about that in future. Right now I need to slow down, my wallet's gonna have a heart attack soon;)
Hi, Interested in buying one of these but wondered if I can leave it on all the time (yes I know this is wasteful but I’ve had other class a/b amps that are designed to stay on).If not does it have a significant warm up time? Thanks in advance.
Hi! It warms up quickly, like in 10 minutes max. During initial burn in mine stayed on for 3 weeks in a row, so I guess you'll be fine (except for horrendous electricity bill and heat in the house)
I'm seriously considering buying this, but wondering how it would match with my Lyngdorf TDAI-1120, which can be used as a preamp. The analog output impedance is 75ohm. What is the input impedance of this amp? The original darTZeel I believe it's >30kohms in the RCA line.
There was a time about 5 years ago when I had an opportunity to buy some exotic fuses very cheaply (one of local audio shops went bankrupt and they were selling everything with like 90prc discount). I've found two things: 1. It works, but only in DAC and _only_ when listened through my custom Stax setup (it's even more transparent and resolving than my Martin Logan) - the effect is _miniscule_ though repeatable - and 2. Custom fuses do not always work as specced - may burn a little earlier (costly but safe) or a bit later (COSTLY and COSTLY and dangerous). So all in all - not worth the effort IMHO. Though if you have a company you trust, you have some money to burn because why not, and you don't have any other way to improve your system in a more significant way - then sure, why not. The only place I have "exotic" fuses nowadays are my two Gustard DACs and the fuses are made by Gustard too.
Hi to all Unfortunately my d5 pro after no more than 40 (in total) hours decided to shut its right channel light plus current. After i shut it down and powering it the right light indicator returned and so was the the music but it played with only 50 or so of loudness compared to the left channel that continued to work as intended. Does anyone had the same experience?? I don't know what to think/do😢 Maybe its just a matter of blown fuse??
Hello and thanks a lot for your reviews, I bougth a D5PRO clone after seeing your video (the integrated amplifier for available room rationale). As far as input binding post cables are concerned, they are thin but at this step of the chain, the signal is not yet amplified, so, isn't it normal ? As a comparison, when one rewires a turntable arm, the thinest cable with the least resistance is chosen. Something I miss ?
RCA single ended signal is differnt from turntable signals so this is normal, however you could replace it with some good quality RCA interconnect cable - short runs straight to the board. Thats one of my to-do mods :)
Great channel and great reviews! May i ask all of you that purchase that amp in which country you live in? Im from europe (Greece) and the european law says that products up to 150€ can delivered without extra fees... How much did you pay for that amp to delivered to your country?
Hi! Thanks! The law says that for the value above 150Eur the customs and VAT are added in the delivery country. In my case this was very small fee like 20USD for the Musical Fidelity Clone and ~35 for DartZeel. But in Greece this can be totally different...
@@subcoded no, I did not, here the value is assessed by customs based on invoice attached or if the value there seems to be lower than real via "expert assessment". This means that it's not always easy to foresee the exact value.
nice review that is not bias on brandname! I just placed an order base on this! I am new to this and wonder what do I do to burn in the amp if you can show me the processs? thanks in advance!
Thank you! Just leave it playing some music for 200-300h. I know, that's like 3 weeks. Turn the speakers so they will face reach other (close, it's ok if they touch each other) and connect one out of phase (red to black black to red) and second one in phase (red to red black to black). This way they'll play quieter with the same volume level. Or just leave them connected normally and playing with normal volume of your house is large enough :) You don't have to listen to them during that time. It's even better if you don't. Come back every 2-3 day to listen to some chosen song to you know and love and you'll hear the changes the burn in makes. They are small, but noticeable.
thank you! I hace newborn so I dont think I can leave it on for that long... is it the same if I just keep playing from time to time and will it be burnt in evebtually when the total hours add up? and you think this will last a long time? it's not made by big company so I would think quality control is not as good...
@@dtoe07toer29 @dtoe07toer29 you'll be perfectly fine and safe, burning in just by listening will work as well but will take ages. Suppose you'd listen to it for 2h every day, that gives 60 hours per month, that gives 300h after 5 months. If you'd do that every other day than you have 10 months. You'll be fine but it will take ages :)
uhm... 5 months not too bad haha but damn I just realize the amp does not have a volume! so doesn't my DAC... you think any decently cheap volume module like the Schiit would not kill the quality?
I've read some threads about it in a few different places. In general owners absolutely love it, including a guy who had his in repairs for like ten months (a line of unfortunate events) but would still repeat the process because of sound quality of the clone. Maybe in time I will bite the bullet and get one, if my channel will create some funds :)
Really great review with a comprehensive walk through of the internals. Wonderful to know that some of these great looking amps on Ali express are actually legit builds! Just wish they made a balanced version of this one as I’d be willing to pay for that added cost relative to this amps price. Would it be safe and/or still sound good and in phase to use xlr/rca adapters with this?🙏🏼
Yes that's what I was wondering too - if the build is ok. I wasn't really expecting to see it that good! There is a version with XLR and pre built in, but the shop told me that this one has best SQ due to simplest circuit. Maybe I will also look at some point at other offers for 1:1 clone (3x more expensive) with XLRs as this one is already a good indication that others may be even better
Thanks for the tip, as for replacing the short speaker cable, that seems unnecessary for such a short cable, it seems to me more than thick enough to have any impact. I might actually buy one to replace my old Yamaha full class A MX-1000 that consumes a unreasonable amount of electricity. It is on itself a marvelous sounding amp and the build quality is to die for. I will need to think about this. Do you have the ability to actually measure the performance of this amplifier the way it is done by Amirm of Audio Science Review? I'd love to see what factual numbers we can expect from this.
@olaf9938 Thank you Olaf, my German is a bit rusty but that's not a problem as captions are available. This was exactly what I was looking for. I'm even more tempted now. 😉
No unfortunately not, I could do basic power output measurements using my scope, but to be serious about it I would need something like AP that Amirm is using (or at least one of more better Cosmos ADCs) Maybe at some point in time, so far its a hobby for my free time so I have no professional measuring equipment
@@GauisHelenaMohaim You should be tempted ;) I know its a lot to read but do look in the comments for some info from guys who got one and compared with their current gear.
@@k4syxNo problem, that German gentleman measuments and circuit explanation gave us very good indication that this amp is more than capable and designed correctly.
I have purchased the FM300A Gold version with dual transformers now i am wondering if i should get this one instead, haven't received the FM300A as yet.
Unfortunately I don't know input impedance value. As for preamp, depends on your sound signature preference. Hard to tell. I'm usually dropping pre because I can hear with my electrostats slight detail loss vs going straight from the dac. But YMMV. There are many people asking for pre reviews so I may have one in future
Hi, love your site. I always wondered the quality of clone audio. I went to Allexpress to check out ordering the D5 Pro based on your review. I'm stoked! My question is, they listed several D5's with different prices and shipping costs. How does one choose? I'm concerned to go with cheapest as maybe they have lower QC. Any advice please. Live in USA
Hi! Thank you! I've added the link to the shop I got mine from in the description of the video - secure shipping with dhl or ups. There are two versions, regular D5 and a better D5 Pro that I've reviewed here.
@@randynielsen9894 Thanks and same here - my wallet is constantly in ICU :) You'll be fine with 110V, these (as all equipment) do have some +/- voltage margins.
That would be only D class amps. Tube, class A, class AB, class XD (Cambridge Audio) - all run warm. I'd say class AB isnt that bad, compared to class A or tubes :)
Hi mate great video i cant find the actual physical measurments of the amp you know width length height etc (they are not on the website), if you read this can you let me know thanks
@@k4syx Some sellers have upgraded the 330 to 370mm for better ventilation....are they the same otherwise? Is the XLR input just for convenience or truly balanced? Which vendor do you recommend? Thanks 😊
@@carlitomelon4610 Cant really comment on that as I dont have D9 available but these are good questions. adding xlrs just to have them converted to se is pointless
@@k4syx I can put multiple inpus on the external DAC and just use this as a pure Amp. That should do the trick. I hope I understood correctly what you are trying to say.
I’m interested in that comparison as well. Have a Linn Intek (for over 30 years now). The D5 Pro is on its way from China as we speak. Also purchased a Cary SLP-90 tube pre amp (clone). Also on it’s way. So exited how it will match my system (Linn Nexus loudspeakers, Bluesound Node with upgraded LPS and Denafrips Ares II dac).
I’m interested in that comparison as well. Have a Linn Intek (for over 30 years now). The D5 Pro is on its way from China as we speak. Also purchased a Cary SLP-90 tube pre amp (clone). Also on it’s way. So exited how it will match my system (Linn Nexus loudspeakers, Bluesound Node with upgraded LPS and Denafrips Ares II dac).
I have number 12 of the original run of 20(NHB-108A)and a '108B(both will be used for bi-amping). These clones may sound good but none have 50ohm connections that raise the SQ to greater heights! I also have the Mk1 preamp.
Please do share your insights when it will get to you,ok? (THANKS!). I am eyeing a clone thats descibed as 1:1 with BNC, SE and XLR inputs and judging via photos it does look very similiar to original amp!
I don't know the input resistance, sorry - I can measure input resistance for you when I get back from short vacation now. I'm using it directly with DAC - Gustard has good volume control built in. In my experience adding pre always results in some detail loss, but may warm up the sound. This one doesn't need this warming - it's great as it is
I recently saw the interior of the Dartzeel and it looks like it had two toroidal transformers whereas the D5 Pro has one? Is this true and if so how does that affect the performance?
I have a problem turning on the amplifier. The amplifier does not turn on the first time. I have to press the on button several times to turn it on. Can this quality problem be solved?
@ Exactly, its protection is highly sensitive (which is good as it protects the amp and speakers) and it gets easily triggered if the preamp powers up when D5Pro is already powered on
All power amps should be powered as the last device in chain, after preamp will stabilize. Read lower here my comment on sensitivity. I guess you are using preamp and you turn them both on at the same time?
Same issue here too, it is the protection mode. I have mine paired with the Cary clone and contacted the seller of the D5Pro. He stated it was the fault of the Cary as he Sid it is not "stable" and is causing the protection to be triggered. I just leave mine on, and I would recommend getting a fan, I use this one, found on Amazon, for $50, the AC Infinity AIRCOM S6 rear ventilation. It works.
Hi again, one of the channels has just shut down , the amp was turned on, without any music signal. Has anyone experienced the same? I would prefer to fix it, and not send it in return.
@@BowmanDk1 does it start again after power cycle? Maybe something had triggered protection. Have you checked the fuses on that channel if it doesn't power up?
@@k4syx Thanks for your good advice, I have turned it on again, and both channels works now. Only strange that it shut down without any signal. Do this amps need a dc power blocker? Thanks again, Best, HelgeH
@@BowmanDk1 there's a protection circuit that shuts the amp down (well the selected channel since there are two amps inside) in case of any problem. I've managed to trip that when I accidentally shorted outputs. It stays off until full power cycle.
I have the similar problem: the right channel is off. I tried to restart several times, but no signals come from the right side to the speaker. Fuse is changed. No idea what to do :((
I'm iching to order this amp today, not sure I should thank you for this expense😊😊 Which version have you got, D5 or D5 Pro? Thanks for the great content!
Since a year I watch your video’s. I’m from the Netherlands. Really love your way of (complete honnest) communication. Also like your other colleagues that tested the Chinese clones. Because of you, and your TH-cam colleagues, I said goodbye to my Linn Intek amp, that I owned over 30 years, and bought the D5 PRO + Cary SLP-90. Did an upgrade with NOS tubes of Philips. WAUW! I was for decades in audio heaven but now I’m in audio walhalla. I listen to all kinds of music (accoustic, pop, indie, electronic…) Thank you for all your insight in these video’s.
Rest of my set up. Linn Nexus loudspeakers (also over 30 years and first owner, still love them), Denafrips Ares II dac, Bluesound Node (130) with upgraded linear power supply. I will post my comment also with your Cary review.
Thank you again! Im really happy that these helped you! :)
@@k4syxHow can I make a donation to you?
It really does sound incredible for so little money! I have had tens of thousands of dollars of gear through here, and if you would have told me a $900 all in investment would have given me the sounds I am hearing right now, listening to a bit of Miles Davis, I would have said you are crazy. ;-) Very Happy!
I bought this dual mono amplifier a few months ago. It truly is an amazing detailled and relaxed sounding amp. Deep, dry and powerfull but very precise bass sound. Midrange is full and very nicely produced. High range is very very nice.
It drives my Heco Mythos 500 high end speakers through a passive pre-amplifier very very easily.
Okay I just ordered one of these due to your review and now the children's orphanage won't get my donation for the next year. I hope you're happy.
That's not fair, you should get another one for the children!
Given that power consumption it will cost it's purchase price in annual electricity consumption with only modest usage (at least in the UK). The orphanage can kiss your donations goodbye but if the winter is harsh, you can invite them round to warm themselves beside your new amp.
Honestly, it looks great. Enjoy.
Your greed is this video's fault?
I got a D5 Pro on order like many viewers. Would you consider a follow up video with little tweaks/upgrades you deem necessary?
Thanks!
I was actually thinking about that a few days ago and I will definitely do that, I've ordered better fuses, opamps are already here, plan is to replace them as this is modding 101 - no soldering skills required - and do listening session and then a video with info on what I've learned :)
@@k4syx Excellent thinking!!! 😊 😊 😊
So Christmas came early, and the D5 Pro arrived today. Packaging was excellent.
Weighty quality is what strikes you first. Quality switches and connectors.
Sound on startup was good, slightly edging my Adcom GFA555. Somewhat disappointing considering the reviews.
I am now 90 mins onto listening and it just keeps opening up further and further. I am now delighted with the purchase.
Listening to "Matsuri No Genzo" by Sakura Sakura i am realising that this amp is pretty special.
Thank you for your review. I need to send you a beer. 🍺
Thanks! It will get even better during next few days/weeks :)
So I bit the bullet and ordered one of these and have had it for a few days now. This beast is absolutely stunning, the best power amp I have owned bar none. I am fronting it with the Dared MC-7P Tube Preamp and the combo sounds amazing. I also picked up a couple of pairs of the TODN Silver Plated OCC 16 Strand Interconnects to go with and they completely opened up the sound I was getting originally. I am shocked at the difference they made.
Thanks again for the awesome reviews!
You're welcome!
The best part is yet to come after 120-150(?)h ;)
@@k4syx I am more than halfway there then I think. I just got those silver power cables you reviewed recently as well. I didn't notice any sonic differences really, but I will do some swaps after 150 hours or so.
I bought one of these after reading the positive reviews on Aliexpress and after seeing this clip. Mine is linked to a Quad Artera pre-amp and drives B&W Nautilus 805 stand mounts. My initial response was hugely disappointed due to overly forward and muddy bass response. I don't know if my experience is shared but it took two hours of continuous play before the base settled down and for veil to be taken off the music. I know that new amps need a burn in time but it didn't have time for that... As others have said, these amps run hot and need a well ventilated space. After two hours run time the difference was like night and day. The base response settled down and no longer dominated the music. Clarity, detail, midrange and tonality are stunning and it confirmed what I always suspected, which is that there was untapped potential in my B&W Nautilus speakers. I really can't explain the change because on first impressions, this wasn't an amp I'd be living with; two hours later , with the amp hot, best amp I've ever heard.
@@joemalone7385 and it will be even better after something like 250h of burn in!
Yes it needs some space to vent the heat, but it's not that bad as some class A monsters :)
Enjoy it, 805's are stunning speakers!
@@k4syx Thanks buddy... appreciate the comment and I'll feed back after that burn in time.
@@k4syx Does it get too hot to touch or just very warm on the side fins?
@@michaelcampbell9459 just warm to the touch, nothing that would burn your hands
@@k4syx I'm well past my 200 hours burn in period, and happy to say that this amp is stunning in its depth of presentation and clarity. I feel like I've got an amp I've have had to pay thousands for, but for £500. However, the upgrade bug is dangerous, after having the same system for over 20 years, everything but the cd player is now getting changed. Waiting for some new Stradivari Amorat floor standers to be delivered. I'll keep the 805's set up in another room.
well i got it last night jammed it in my system straight away my god mate its just the best by far of anything if heard at anytime in my life it kicks ass and my kef104/2 i sware smoke came out of the port at first lol,imaging is mind blowing just everything is so so perfect ,im deeply grateful of you to review this magic amp thankyou x1000000..
Enjoy it! Give it some burn in and it will get even better!
Next time don't jam it into your system, might damage something, anyway enjoy your music, keep jamming. 😁
Thanks for the great review. Had always wanted to try one of these low cost amps but don't have confidence on the sound quality so this review provides a good starting point.
I have it for a couple of month now. A german youtuber made a video and he was immensely impressed by its performance. Its an insane value for money.
Exactly, that would probably be Frank you're talking about.
i saw that video too and i talked with Dartzeel.
@@AnalogDude_ What did they say?
@@Cenkolino Well, i wanted to know how many how many capacitance was used since they are so enormous, because i was building a class AB amp.
It took the guy 16 years to invent this circuit and now people are cloning it.
The real thing has 24 carat gold bars over the capacitors. even the glass plate was engineered so it doesn't harm the electronics inside (vibrate, etc).
@@AnalogDude_ Please be realistic in the world of audio...if it was retail/MSRP $50,000.00 and dealer price $23,000.00 and you hope that $500.00 end user price could compete or let say 90% performances to the real one, are you dreaming ? $50,000.00 price was over than 10 years ago and $500.00 price is in the year 2024 !!!😊
I took delivery of one of these clones a month ago, and this is my review of it so far.
For reference, my system consists of an all Linn Akurate setup, DS Streamer/1, Preamp, and 2200 Power amp.
The speakers are the world Audio Design KLS6's from HiFi World magazine.
These are a DIY design I built in the mid 90's and upgraded a few years ago with a new tweeter, crossover design and components, and cabinets.
I'll caveat this my saying this is how it sounds in my system with my speakers in my room, so what I hear may not be what you here.
Long story short, this clone is amazing.
In just about every parameter used to describe audiophile sound, in what I'm hearing it matches the Linn 2200.
For a start the overall tone is identical, soundstage, transparency, detail, space around instruments and voices, transient speed, all match the Linn in every way.
There are two differences, the clone has a slightly warmer sound, with more body than the leaner drier Linn, so bass is a little fuller, and treble is a touch smoother.
Also the volume levels between bass and treble frequencies is better balanced, so overall it's an easier amp to listen to in my system, and for that reason I prefer it to the Linn.
At 1/10th the price of the Linn it's a serious bargain, and the fact that it looks like a Linn Klout from the 90's is a bonus.
@@johnthebimmerman1406 Thanks for sharing, that's amazing system you have and great sound description!
I don't understand something - you say it is the best sounding amplifier you've ever heard and you intend on keeping it. BUT, you have stated in other review that you only use balanced connections which this unit doesn't have xlr inputs. Is there not a sonic improvement in using balanced connections would you think? If so, is there an XLR version link to buy from that you would recommend?Or will this be a good enough amplifier for me even though it has only RCA inputs? I ask because it looks like I will be returning the E405 I purchased for refund because of it being faulty, and am looking for another different amp to replace it. I really liked the sound qualities of the E405, especially the way it slightly smoothens and softens the S sounds in vocals. Does this one or any other power amps you've reviewed have the same qualities?
My whole setup is balanced, but SQ is my ultimate goal so if RCA here sounds better then I will use SE :)
All good amps have no sibilance, if you experience it sometimes you may have somewhat sibilant speakers
Using a Valhalla 2 as a preamp, the amp rocks and rules over the few amps I own. It pushes my 4 ohm elac floor speakers with some beautiful articulation. Thank you for your review and intro to Frank (subtitled). $535 shipped and I made sure to get the exact amp you reviewed.
Thanks! I'm happy you like it. It's amazing, not only "for the money"!
I recently bought a recommended Cary set and this amplifier but I have a small problem with turning on, the amplifier sometimes turns on the first time but mostly only on the second time, did you have similar experiences?
Mine's operating fine.
Had this issue with my Bryston.
Contact the seller QUICK before Chinese new year holiday begins or you're going to get crickets for at least a fortnight!
Get warranty support.
Let everyone know how you get along.
Does it happen when you power them on in the right sequence too?
(meaning preamp first, wait for like 20-30sec, then power amp?)
D5Pro has a very sensitive protection circuit that gets triggered easily via preamp start.
But all in all its a well known and recommended by all audio manufacturers to turn source first, then preamp, then power amp at the end. And power them off in reversed order, power amp goes off first then preamp and then source last.
have you tried that?
@@k4syx Yes, I always turn it on according to this procedure. I changed the power cable to a regular one and other better shielded interconnects between the amplifier and the preamplifier and it seems that the problem is gone. The preamplifier has about 60 hours of play and the amplifier 30 hours. Damn, but it plays well! I also had the Leema Tucana 2 and Rose RA 180 before, but this clone is better than them! my reference is line magnetic 219ia and I still have to compare both but I already know it will be a tough fight. My speakers are Goldenear triton reference, Dac is Line magnetic 32 streamer ifi zen stream.
@@rogdar5767 this means that there was some problem with the cable, its good that you've found it this was before anything bad could happen (some small intermittent short probably?)
I brought this amp on the strength of the review and was blown away by it. At first, I thought the amp was beautiful tonally but too polite and lightweight, until I realised that impression came from being used to amps that were just a little bit strained or lacking in bass control. I've owned Quad 909s, Teddy Pardo Monos, Goldnote PA10, Michell Alectos and a Pass Aleph in my time. All were highly enjoyable amps but this beats them all. For under £500. Don't hesitate to buy one of these. Can't see how you can go wrong.
@@leeandrewclarke thanks for sharing, I love your review!
I own a Quadd 909 (refurbished, upgraded a bit). Can you tell me how these compare please? What I especially like abou the Quad is that it produces a full bodied sound even at low volumes. Is that true vor this clone too?
@@WhiteRvssian2023 I always liked the Quad for much the same reason and especially because the sound was always tonally pleasant, if not the last word in grace or resolution. The D5 Pro is so amazingly graceful and controlled, so delicate and coherent, that you think that it is too polite, at first. Then you slowly realize all those other power amps you owned sounded slightly chaotic. The D5 is the best money I've ever spent in hi-fi in thirty years. I can't imagine what you would have to spend to beat it with Western hi-fi products. A Sugden Masterclass has a lot of the same effortless power and grace but I don't recall it having the D5 Pro's micro-dynamic resolution and tonal shading. The Pass Aleph matched the sheer resolution of the D5 but sounded clinical by comparison. My strong advice is to buy the D5 Pro. You can thank me later! ;)
@@leeandrewclarke Thank you!
New subscriber I enjoy your content. Looking forward to more on this DartZeel NHB-108 clone I'm seriously considering buying one myself. LOL will need a preamp for it what would you suggest?
Thanks!
Check my video on Cary SLP-90 clone. Its like they were created to be a great match :)
@@k4syx Thank you very helpful
I was going to purchase this power amplifier based on your review of this amplifier. It’s Black Friday sales but I’m going to hold off until your review of the NHB-108 Pro Stereo Hgh power amplifier comes out as I think that will be tad better and it has balanced output as well, which makes it more versatile.
It's like it's crawling here. With that insane shipping speed that the store I chose has I will probably get that in February:(
@@k4syx It might arrive faster if they just tossed it in the ocean and let it drift there on the ocean currents lol
@@chrisharris1522 I can ALMOST ALMOST see mine, tracking says its in customs office ~25km from me. Still, it may take a month ;)
@@k4syx a local dealer has a pair of Kef ref 5 metas ex demo for $25k NZ reduced from $42k, which I can no way afford, but I have been dreaming of pairing those with this amp. Keep buying those lottery tickets I guess
QUESTION : Got mine from the same store. I love it. My slow start is with a green color 'round ' little transformer. I wonder why a have that version. Not the little black square one like yours.
Interesting, probably different batch of slow start circuits. I envy you a little because round means toroidal and that would be quieter and better than block one that I have ;)
I just did it. Ordered the Pro version. Could not resist it after watching your video. Now I just have to wait for a hole month...
By the way you have a splendid channel. So informative. I can't wait for new videos to turn up 👍
Keep us updated.
I'm considering the D5pro BC version....
@@20CycleMonger I promise. Today I ordered the Cary SLP-90 and 4 Psvane 12AU7-S. You will hear more after they are delivered and burned in.
Thank you! One month is not bad considering we are closing on December rush when everything ordered will be terribly delayed in shipment :)
@@Moe-DK Great setup. When it will be with you let it play for a proper burn in.
Then later on plan on some cable changes and you're set for life ;D
@@Moe-DKWhat do you think?
Thanks & greetings from Romania. After watching your review i have ordered the amp. Received it 5 days ago, sounds great, tube like, non fatiguing, best 500 Euro ever spent!
Thanks! Let it burn in for like 120h, you'll see (hear ;)) what its capable of!
How much did the shipping cost for you?
@@StaticLowLife My Ali shopping history says ~150USD
how much was VAT and Customs? Thank you
Hi, I did investigate quite a lot and found many different versions of it: D5, D5pro, D9 and a "Version 4" with a integrated preamp and one with a volume knob...
Do you have any idea on what version the "Version 4" is based on? Not sure if the preamp is done well and introduces noise + there is no spec on the frequency range. It says -20kHz, but as Frank tested it goes up to more than 300kHz. So, I am pretty confused. Currently, I am tending to get the D9 with XLR inputs + will add a preamp in case I need it. It is foreseen to serve the front speakers of home theatre.
Unfortunatelly, the speakers (4Ohm) go down to 2Ohm and the AVR can't handle it. Nobody seem to share information on how good the NHB108 can handle 2Ohm. I hope that it can do it... Appreciate any comment... thanks
Hi!
Before I bought my D5PRO I asked the seller for the advice on the sound quality, I was also wondering which clone will be the best. The recommendation was to get D5 but to make sure I will choose D5 Pro variant. I specifically asked about XLR version but Kevin from Funkenya pointed me towards D5 Pro, though XLR version is more expensive and would mean more margin for him.
As for the impedance, as I wrote in one of another comments here, my Ascents drop to as low as 1.2 Ohm and the amp passes this test with flying colors retaining all openess and transparency in the treble. So - don't worry :)
BTW quality AVRs handle 2Ohms with no problems - like my CA 751Rv2.
@@k4syx thank you very much for the answer! BTW I was thinking my Arcam 850 IS a quality amp, but I am proved wrong when operating my Sonics... ;-)
@@k4syx Did Kevin say specifically why he recommended RCA over XLR version as typically XLR is almost always better?
@@michaelcampbell9459 sound quality. And I asked about that because as you say, XLRs are always or almost always better (as long as the setup is fully balanced)
Hello and thank you. It’s a beautiful piece of workmanship. I can only criticize that the RCA input wires are too close to the transformer wires. Maybe you could replace them with shielded cable.
Yes I was thinking about replacing them with something better in future anyway, something like solid silver in teflon. Could be shielded also. But at the moment I don't feel the urgent need if you know what I mean. It sounds so great!
@@k4syx Sorry, I confused the input cables with the LED wires....🤭
Power amp. Gain is not high. No shielded signal runs required.
Please tell the actual specs for the transformer. I might get one and take out one channel to make two monoblocs (I don't mind buying two identical looking silver chassis too!). I suppose I need to buy a soft relay module too.
Sorry Ive just noticed you comment, I will check that for you today!
Which preamplifier would you recommend for the NHB 108 D5 pro? I saw that stores that offer the NHB 108 also sell various preamplifiers. Do you have any experience with these Chinese preamplifiers? I will be grateful for your help.
Check my other videos in my channel and look for Cary SLP-90 that has "D5Pro soulmate" in the video title :D
Its my standing recommendation for excellent setup :)
I considered this amp before eventually landing a Plinius integrated. Any plans to review the Silver Cloud power cable?
Well, more than plans actually as the review is ready, uploaded and scheduled for release!
@@k4syx Looking forward
Hi fi zone, have a question for ya about setting up hi fi
Amp: dartzeel d5 pro
Pre amp+ dac: theta ds pre
Speakers: holographic easy to drive, can't remember the name.
Recommend me speaker cables plus interconnects.
Thank you
I just discovered your channel. I hope that you keep covering and explaining the design of different Chinese replica amps, preamps, dacs, etc etc. by the way , is there any chance you could or would cover replica chinese speakers? such as for example the Oatlon WZ-801F speakers which are an almost exact copy of the B&W 804 D3
Speakers are tempting and I was thinking about them, but the shipping costs are crazy! Also, I think speakers are more delicate and I'm kinda afraid they'd get here broken.
But I've read some very good opinions on both fake and some local brands speakers.
So, another vendor offers Vishay power capacitor upgrade to the standard D5pro. Its the BC version for an extra $190.
Worth it?
Have a safe trip btw😊
Thanks!
As for the caps - Im not sure I personally would go for it. Elnas are good, Vishays are good, but I see them as same or very similiar lever caps.
Hi, thanks for the video. I've got a quick question if you don't mind. I'm currently making a replica of a ATC SCM 50 from aos. It's a passive studio monitor. It's a 3 way system, where the bass driver is 200watts at 4ohm, the mid is 200watts at 16ohms and the tweeter is 50w at 4ohms. Is this amplifier powerful enough to drive a pair of the replica I'm building, and 2nd question, is this amplifier brutally true sounding and not coloured. I will be using this amplifier solely for studio mixing and mastering. Would like to hear your thoughts on it. Thanks
Yes this will be ok to drive them with 150W per channel. It's also very clean without colorization, no artificial warmness or dryness. I think you'll like it because of dynamics and amount of detail it can reproduce.
Where are you sourcing drivers? Make a video of your build....
Many thanks for the informative review. Did you ask this seller about a possibility to add 12V IN trigger? Seems its only one stuff which stops me to buy this amp.😊
Thanks! No I wasnt talking about that. I myself am using Tuya smart plugs for turning my stuff on and off remotely
Hi
Great review
Thanks a lot
In previous comment you suggested to use DAC DO200 hdmi interface for signal hdmi out from my Onkyo nr656
Where is the volume control ?
Do I need to include preamplifier between DO200 and D5PRO?
If so, what do you suggest ?
A low cost clone could do the job ?
Accuphase C3850 clone ?
Best regards and thanks for your help
@@brunodelacour8976 Hi!
DAC will act as volume control as you may use it as a preamp - it has variable volume output. So no preamp needed, it will save you some money!
Great news
I just need to connect my hdmi output arc of my Onkyo videoamplifier to an hdmi splitter, one connection going to the videoprojector and the other to the hdmi input of DO200 and that is all?
It will not take benefit of the ARC device ?
Thank you so much for your support
@@brunodelacour8976 exactly, that would be all that you'd need, DAC will decode stereo audio stream and take care about volume setting.
Hello,
I’m just starting my 2 channel journey and had a couple noob questions. I’m leaving the home theater for the 2 channel realm 👍🏻.
Is there away to have a 2.1 or 2.2 two channel system where your able to raise and lower the subwoofer 🔊 output from my sitting position?
My wife and I use or music room to now also watch movies. I’d say we are a 80% music and 20% movies couple👍🏻.
I’m looking at the following purchases.
D5PRO
Carey SPL-90
Or very possibly the Zerozone TP3255 with the Carey SPL-90 looks like a great setup as well.
If youd want to change the sub volume alone, then youd probably need a sub with a remote for 2 channel audio setup. the usual way is that sub volume stays the same relevant to the main speakers volume level to be coherent all the time.
So IMHo the only way would be to get the sub with remote control (or via app)
So, it is September 2024 now. How is the reliability? (Many AliExpress audio products are notorious in terms of reliability.)
Still alive and kicking :)
I always do a two weeks long burn in. This is good reliability test as they are running 24/7 playing music with speakers connected. Compared to that, regular listening later is nothing :D
There is an upgraded D9Pro and I am keen to try as it has balanced inputs. However, solely on value, would I be better off just getting the D5 or D5Pro in your opinion?
@@RyanChoo I was actually asking about that owner of the shop I got my D5PRO from and he said, that for pure sound quality, D5 Pro (specifically PRO, not regular D5) will be better than D9 with XLRs
@@k4syx That is unbelievable and I'll go for D5PRO and it is cheaper than D9PRO! Thanks for showing us this gem! 😁
Mine has just been delivered, in exceptional condition, packed really very well, from start to finish 3 weeks and 3 days . I will leave it until tomorrow to try, it's a bit cold here at the moment so let it acclimatize..
Ok two days in and still have goosebumps, what an amplifier sensational sound, and it just gets better every time I switch it on .. The description is spot on ..
Thanks! It will get even better with some more time :)
Just had my first of very many hours with this beauty. WOW and again WOW. Absolutely superb sound. Beats my other power amps completely (£800-£2000). In fact they are crying. Where have my speakers gone ?
@@bongofury3176 Best summary so far :D
@@k4syx 2hrs in now and I can see great big Tannoys in front of me but it feels like I could move them out and the sound would stay the same...I have a lot of music to listen to. Will have to work out toilet arrangements as I am not moving for a while. Amp nirvana. Thanks for your detailed review and recommendation.
@@bongofury3176 Do let it burn in over few next nights if you can, it does change for even better!
@@k4syx Do you need to play them loud for them to burn in?
@@WhiteRvssian2023 As loud as I can without waking everyone. You can use the trick Ive shown in other video on burning speakers silently - check that out
Any suggestions for clone RCA connections between the D5 Pro and the Cary SLP-90 clone soulmate? It's a jungle out there...
Hi!
I've answered in your second comment :)
Did some research. There is a Model One version of this amp which was around $18,000 (USD) and a Model Two which was around $65,000 (USD). The layout of this clone is more like the Model One which is still a great value. Second, it appears this is a Class AB amp with the first 20 watts biased for Class A which explains commentary I found on it running hot.
It's not that hot actually. It was like 51C on radiator fins when running 24/7 which is okayish, definitely not something that will give you burns. But it's a big, solid case and it WAS 150W when idle :)
@@k4syx My comment was based on one of the few customer reviews posted on this clone where I found it. Even at $18,000 original cost, getting a clone for $500 would be a fantastic deal. And you would expect an amp with a Class A bias to run a little hot and draw a lot of current while idle.
@@ccdccd8615i bought one fter this review and it takes 150W on iddle, I live in USA which means I have 115v mains. This takes over 1amp at iddle, in music easy comes up to 2Amp usage (I used simply power meter between mains in and wall outlet)
@@yellow_noise3 I live in hot Texas and can't even do any tubes due to A/C bill, is this thing going to heat up my room too much? Can it be turned off so no power usage in idle and then turned on a few minutes before sitting down to listen, or should this amp be left on always? I've had A/B amps but never any that starts in class A like this one does. I'm currently running class D for less heat but not completely happy with sound on these Fosi V3 monos into Magnepan 3.7i, even with upgraded Muse 2 opamps.
@@michaelcampbell9459 You can cut it off from power and give it about 10 minutes to warm up when you decide to listen to it ;) No need for standy wasting your money :)
Out of curiousity, I ordered the combo to hear for myself if there was any value to be reaped from AliExpress hifi gear. I'm waiting for the SLP-90 to arrive - in the meantime the D5 Pro is here. I can 'see' why you recommend a pairing with a tube preamp. In my neutral and resolution oriented system, the vocals/mids from this amp sometimes sound a bit small in size/pushed to the background a little compared to the other bands, in fact the depths of the instruments in the soundstage have changed quite a bit from my reference power amp,. I'm not sure what to make of it. It's a complete departure from the reference amp and the amps in the other two systems I have. The bass is warm which gives this amp a bit of a lowercase V type sound. Tubes would warm the mids up, I presume.
It has things going for it. The level of clarity and transparency is good, especially for an amp at this price. My favourite thing about the amp is that it is quite punchy and dynamic and causes things to pop up in high relief. I guess that's another way of saying that it sounds holographic. It sounds like music is being played live in front of you, as opposed to being just a recording.
As for the cons, I can't help but feel like there are some microdetails missing. But otherwise, once I've lived with it for a bit longer - and listen to it with the SLP-90, the jury is still out for me.
Sounds like it needs to burn in.
@@mark120371ha ha. Literally was about the post the exact same thing.
Thanks for sharing! Have you let it play for 120-150h? It does change after that (and interestingly can sound a bit worse at something like 90h, no idea why)
I ran mine out for a few days, nonstop playing music and with the TV, and it only improves. I don't turn mine off either.
@@k4syx Only been around 50 hours so far, will see how it goes once it reaches 120+
I’d be thrilled for you to try test and review the other example DartZeel clone I linked for you. Thanks for your efforts.
I've added it to my bucket list - I was also wondering if other clones could be better.
JingoLoBa57 have you found any Dartzeel clones better than D5-Pro that worth trying?
Thanks
Dear, I am a wondering what to do when there is a problem while there is no garanty. Sending back to China or finding someone nearby? Love your reviews. Thanks! James
Hi James!
I would get one to some local workshop. Both channel boards and power boards are exactly the same so its easy to find the fault by comparing readouts from both.
I know that its possible to buy whole amp board from sellers in China to replace left or right channel too.
The last thing I would to is to ship it back, the shipping prices from EU to China are insane.
@ Thank you. I adore your tests and just ordered the dartzeel pre. Just for comparing with my bryston bp 26 preamp. I will do the same with the Dartzeel power amp.(compare with bryston 4b st)
@@2006Opelcorsa Oh yes please do and please share the results, ok? Thanks!
@@k4syx I will do. I play upgraded magnepans and I am very curieus about the results. All the best !
I'm a transaudio FM255 preamp and T7 power amp owner. Super happy with the sound. I'm confident to buy from transaudio. Thanks for educating us about the parts.
Can you do a test on the musical paradise pre amp. It seems to be an end game pre.
It's a great preamp, especially when considering all it's upgradable options
FM255 clone is complete trash!My old NAD wipes the floor with it!
The Musical Paradise pre amp and D5 power amp are a good match. The pre amp is very musical and good value for money.
Does the FM255 have op amps or other mods available? It's hard to understand these transaudio pre-amps. The Master C3.9 (Cayin Clone) has op amps listed and sockets shown in pics. Can't tell on FM255
Thanks!
Thank you!
Ok... ordered, will report my experience when arrives.
Many thanks for all those great reviews.
No problem, please share back! :)
@ilanspiro1645 --- Well ......how does it sound ?
It sounds great :)
Very clean and detailed without being too dry.
Base is quite quick and agile with good weight and slam.
Mids are absolutely glorious and the highs are very well extended with lots of details.
I'm using it with my musical paradise preamplifier (heavily modded) , it's a great match in my opinion as one might think.... usually it's a very good combo, i mean for solid state amp with a tube pramp.
😊
@@ilanspiro1645
The MP701mk2 is fantastic.
What have you done to yours?
Does this Clone need higher gain tubes and dip switch settings?
I use mine with a Bryston 3Bsst and lower gain output/inputs.
🎵🎶🤫🎶🎵
Thanks for introducing this amplifier to me. I bought one with the pass P17 clone. I love it. Do you know if it auto changes it's output when connected to 4ohm speakers from 8ohm . Or do we need to change a setting inside? I couldn't find any references in any videos online!
I'm happy that you're happy :)
No you don't need to change anything - it's solid state and just accepts bigger load and works with it :)
How does the Pass P17 sound?
I ordered a D5Pro yesterday. I'm excited about receiving it.
you'll love it! (I know I am not helping with that comment :D)
What do you think?
It’s been 8 months since you posted this video. What’s your long(er) term impression? Still working as expected?
Still excellent and going strong. And I use it as baseline in my all preamp reviews so thats probably the highest praise.
8 months? Was it so long ago already?? :)
AliE has a wide selection of this amp some of which are priced in the $4000-6000 range, featuring a much more authentic clone with enormous bus bars for the filter caps and ground planes. The $6k model is fully balanced so it doubles the number in input and output boards which raises the cost.
These look to be extremely SERIOUS amps, and are priced accordingly.
@@rontoolsie yes I've seen them, there are also even pricier clones of other amp types, but then with 6k we're slowly getting into ridiculously expensive territory again :)
@@k4syx i think it may be 3x as good for 6x the price...in the days of diminishing returns, that may actually be great VFM, especially when we spend 100s of $ to get a few % improvement.
The philosophy of the original is to have as few components as possible. A balanced version negates that and in the average home, there is no need for balanced designs. Unless there's 20+ metres of cable between the pre and the power amp.
Wow. I'm putting this on my shopping list. This is class A amp, right? And the difference between standard and pro version is the slow start feature that protects speakers? It's only a pitty they don't have balanced XLR inputs.
It's class AB, Pro has slow start, more capacitance and additional pairs of transistors for more power.
Got mine recently. Overall workmanship and sonic is good. The 18 (or maybe 20) gauge wiring from the power board to the amp board and back is embarrassing. 60V rails should get me about 180watt but that bottleneck is bothersome.
I'm looking at it as an opportunity do diy this amp to my standards/liking with the wiring of my choice :)
@@k4syx45 min on the bench and now it has much better connection between the cap board and the audio board. Sounds significantly better than before. Thankfully it’s got enough holes on each board for me to add solid core wiring to bridge the output, ground, +, and - rails. Now it sounds like a proper 180W amp.
@@johnsonwu126 Splendid, I'll have to try it with mine, thanks for sharing!
@@johnsonwu126
Make a short yt vid?
@@carlitomelon4610 th-cam.com/users/shortsv9UjPYlfFL0?si=lxIrEPz9VzU81OTt
Hi, Thanks for the very informative review. It makes me want to buy it. But, I'm uncertain if it will benefit me because I have a Yamaha Aventage RXA4A 110 watts/ channel avr that I would hook it up to the preouts of and for speakers I'll use Kef LS50 metas. I use a powered sub also that I cutoff at 40hz. I'm looking to get better sound at just moderate to a little high volumes in a small bedroom 10x15 feet. I'm looking to achieve smoother mids and highs, tighter bass, holographic immersion, natural sounding, etc. I already tried hooking up a NAD C298 but I could not hear a difference in sound quality at all except for seeming to sound a tiny bit rougher, edgier in the upper mids and highs so I returned it. I wonder if it was the work of the C298 magnifying those poor qualities of my avr dac, etc. So, I'm left now wondering if it was the class D NAD amp or my avr being the source or both. This amp while seemingly a really good value still represents a hefty investment to me and I can't afford to make a purchase mistake. Do you think hooking this amp up my avr will make my LS50 metas sound better in the ways you discribe here and in ways I want and even at lower listening levels or will I have to replace my avr with other source components to hear a worthwile benefit?
I would not use Yamaha as an input source to this amp (and NAD too). This is completely different level sound quality device. It eats raw my Cambridge Audio 751rV2 AVR (as 99% of other clones too) - and this AVR is one of the top of the line of all times AVRs when it comes to sound quality.
It will sound only as good as the source and as long as your speakers are good, yamaha will be a bottleneck here.
@@k4syx Ok thank you. Would you mind recommending an appropriate source that has dsp, including bass management, has usb thumb drive and an optical input so I can listen to music from my thumb drive and also youtube music videos from my TV?
Are the LS50 Metas good speakers for this amp i wonder? All reviewers of this speaker are saying the more power their fed the better the sound. So, I'm suspecting my avr is not enoygh to reach their full potential. When you said "It eats raw my Cambridge Audio 751rV2 AVR (as 99% of other clones too)", in what way/s do you mean? Why would you not use a Yamaha RXA4A as a source? Is it because it will magnify sound flaws in the avr dac, etc or will it just not improve the sound or will it make it sound worse? Would you please offer me a more detailed explaination and maybe direct me to what I should pair it up with and why? I have it sitting inn my Aliexpress shopping cart and just not convinced one way or another. Hope you can help with this.
@@user-bf7no5sl9q OK so this is proper hiend amp. Its really, really good. It will show you its qualities with good speakers and good source. Your Metas are something that this amp can work with: though it will be happy to drive something like B&W Nautilus series too. But your AVR, as long as its ok for AVR, will not provide as good source signal as for example dedicated DAC converter.
So you can use DartZeel in your setup, but the final sound quality will be limited by your yamaha. If you'll get better source in the future, you will see (hear :)) what this amp is capable of :)
@@user-bf7no5sl9q In my case something that fits all these is my fanless, passive i7 HTPC in microATX form factor. Dead silent, small, excellent as a source and very flexible.
would be interesting to compare it with hegel or audiolab
Until recently in one of my systems I had Audiolab M-PWR power amplifier. It wasn't TOTL, but there was nothing to compare anyway. This is different league, it's better than my balanced driven twin Cambridge Audio Azur 851W in mono mode.
I had the M-PWR Audiolab because i had the M-DAC. M-dac was a good one in it's time but the M-PWR was ... erm ... rubbish.
some other stores sell a D5PRO and a more expensive D5PRO BC model - do you know what is the difference? Thank you
Ordered one, everything is made in China anyway. Gotten a few things off Ali, no issues. Going to use my 6000a as preamp, thanks
I think in time you may outgrow your Audiolab, D5Pro will be a good base for new system :)
Thanks!
Thank you!!
kupiłem tego klona z czystej ciekawości... nie opowiadasz głupot i to jest najważniejsze!! fajny kanał i dobrze gadasz . Jeszcze jedno tak Ci podpowiem bo też mam gustarda r26 i jeszcze kilka innych fajnych gratów, posłuchaj sobie z twoimi elektrostatami okto dac8, nie jest tani ale robi cuda zwłaszcza w górze pasma. U mnie z klonem dartzell pozamiatał a gram na spendorach sp2/3 a one nie wybaczają niczego. Pozdrawiam👍
Thanks! I've sold R26 and stayed with X26PRO. R26 was cool but electrostats exposed that's loosing some fine detail when compared to X26PRO. I guess I'm delta sigma guy :)
A DartZeel - ten klon - zamiata ceną i jakością.
Super że jesteś zadowolony!
Do you think that it make sense to buy the more expensive dartzeel clones, like the NHB-268? There are also many products with price tag between the d5pro and the NHB-268, that have circuits that looks much similar to the original dartzeel
Im wondering about that too. If ill rebuild my purchase budget Im intending to find out as there is a lot of higher tier clones available.
Those are indeed more dynamic, more headroom
@@raananberger6830 among the expensive Dartzeel clones you also have the even more dynamic NHB-368 (stereo)& NHB-468 Mono amplifiers those are even more dynamic!! It is even said better sounding than the original Dartzeel, but those clones are not cheap!!!
@@Gypsyking64530 Did you compare them ?
Hi, I just purchased a D5Clone, Which is not a NHB-108 Clone but a new amp based on the 108 circuite. The sound is as other bescrive, amazing. Nothing less. I have been in this interest in over forty years, and this amp is not only "good", but good in a seldom way, that often gives the listener an new and eye-opening experience. It is so clean, open and "big" musical authorative, that personally I have just been given the same by some high-end Accuphase classA amps. Very expensive. And some small upgrades, as silver internal cables, change the steel bolt in the trafos middle to a non magnetic bolt, glueing a heavey plate under the botton plate and with some glue that is flexible after drying and change the output speaker terminal to Quality types with less metal, will give even more real high-end sound.
Even as standard, I will have this amp before anything under Usd 10.000,00. They drive my Mofi Soundscape 8 with high-ens bass, midrange, treble, big precise soundscape, dynamics and a twist of musicality.
They do not make good sound. They let the music come through.
There are just a sensitivity for hum, that do not come from the amp itself. But cables and source must be well earthed and not sending any electrical distorsion.
@@BowmanDk1 Love your review! One of the things I love about these clones is the fact that with small easy tweaks like that you can easily upgrade them! A few minutes for soldering and replacing something and they get even better!
I'm also gonna try replacing DC servo opamps with something more modern and precise, I'm wondering about the results :)
Can you share the link of the amp you got.
Yes please share which amp and store, Thanks.
Great review thanks for sharing, I would be curious to know what pre amplifier you are using?
None - in my experience pre causes loss of some fine detail from DAC. Over the years I've tried different preamps but it always ended the same way and I was going back to DAC volume control.
I think the Musical Paradise pre amp is a good match
@@sebastianlunoe it's on my radar for the second half of the year - it's quite expensive
I ordered the Musical Paradise pre with the standard Hovland caps which suit my setup very well. I also tried the Vcap Odams but there are too trebly for my setup. Very satisfied with the MP-701 and D5 Pro combo.
@@sebastianlunoe that's the preamp that the shop recommended as great pairing. It's on my bucket list once my wallet recovers from recent stroke
These "Elna for Audio" caps can be purchased on your favourite portal. Surprisingly, they are not shipped from Japan and listed as unbranded further down in the description. Hope that sheds some light on the true origins of this feature.
Yes I've seen them there and that got me wondering. I went for it anyway because cap replacement with these boards is very easy so in time when I will feel the itch I can get something better locally (maybe even a bit higher capacity) and have fun replacing them :)
I would take a close look at transistors tbh, wonder how many of industry favourites, no longer manufactured for decades, miraculously found their way there. Im not saying the Chinese cannot make proper stuff, they can and do, but knock off is usually just that, a knock off.
@@paulb4661 I think Frank in his vid mentions that he checked them and found to be real. These are not some unique Sankens which reminds me that I was going to write them down and post that in description here
@@k4syx With these caps on board, I wouldn't be surprised, if transistors were just as genuine. They may not try to pass for Sanyos you mention, but whoever's behind the enterprise, cannot possibly run the assembly at a loss.
@paulb4661 they don't - I've asked about this and they said that businesses that are producing electronic devices for export are subsidied by the state. Which is worrying in the long run for various reasons. But this price is impossible even just for a case with toroidal transformer of that quality, not mentioning pcbs, all other parts and labour. And Omrons there are original, WIMAs are real (I'm using them locally TME or Mouser sourced so I can compare). Without subsidies explaining this that's just impossible.
When I was deciding on purchase the final argument for me was that even if every single electronic part there was fake, it would still be a good deal for me even if I would have to replace all of them ;)
I'll check the transistor types and add that to the description when I'll get home around Friday
I live in the UK, i have noticed that Ali Express has a choice of 230 volts, while ebay has 220 volts, i don't know why this is the case.
Aaah thats pretty important thing. Measure your actual voltage if you can because in UK it can vary in different areas and get one that is closer to what you'll measure. You need to message the seller, they do these by order so getting one from eBay you should also be able to pick the right voltage version.
Theory says 220 and 230 should be the same (within tolerance limit) but I was living near Cambridge for a while and I know thats not necessarily true...
Don't worry. The "200+" volts are all good upto 230-240. And since those climate idiots decided on wind power, you would be lucky to even get 220V from your plugs 😜
@@k4syx Ok thanks, supplier has actually shipped 230 volts version, so just awaiting delivery, thanks for your help, much appreciated.
I purchased both, the DartZeel D5 Pro clone and the MF A1 clone. As both continue to “burn in” -here are my first impressions. (For reference, I have about 25 receivers/amps in my collection; my reference amp is a vintage Marantz 2252b that you can purchase for ~$USD 1600. This Marantz is exceptionally musical, open and clear. My reference speakers include an 8 foot tall set of Voigt Pipes and and Open Baffle’ (18 inch bass driver, 12 inch mid and two asd1001 tweeters): Compared to the Marantz both the the D5 and A1 are significantly more veiled ~40% less “open-transparent-clear” (mid range and tweeters). The D5 is about 10% better than the A1 - making the A1 clone the better purchase. I would say that both offer relative value, given the price. Sonically they both compare well to the Schiit Vidar. They are not giant killers. I would be looking at both as platforms for experimentation e.g. replace capacitors etc. Please share your experience with these!
@@mcroeser interesting comments re ‘veiled’ esp in comp with a vintage 2252B as I assume you mean.
@@JingoLoBa57 yes, it is not even close. The clone is now broken in. Personally I would not buy it again nor recommend it at all. Sorry, I had such high hopes based on this video.
I suspect you may not have a good preamp match.The Dartzeel copies seem to need a preamp with quite high gain.Without an active preamp they do not sound much good.THe FM155 copy preamp on high gain position work well with them.
Find a way to bypass the fake Elna caps. Place a 330-1000uF bypass cap to each. Space may be challenging. Also look at the 5 wires from the PS board to the audio board. 😢
When you say they compare well to a Schiit Vidar, do you mean they sound better than the Vidar, or almost as good, or what?
I've been looking at these, there's several makers, but the one with the Pro version has my attention. I believe you have the pro version, it looks like a work of art! I wonder if it's possible to get it with balanced XLR inputs instead of RCA?
Yes it's the Pro version, most of the sellers have it in offer but you have to choose it as an option (default is D5 with lower price). I think the producer is one company and there are just many shops selling these. There are versions with XLRs but they are 3 times more expensive and they are looking like real DartZeel
@@k4syx I couldn't find a D5 that offered XLR, so I ordered the D5 Pro from FunKenya HiFi Store who seems to be a good seller. I also ordered their "Accuphase C245 Preamplifier Fully Balanced Audiophile HIFI Preamplifier Remote Control High end Home Sound Amplifier 1:1 Clone" which appears to be actually manufactured by BRZHiFi who are pretty well known for producing good quality HiFi gear. Now the waiting game begins :)
Hi I have purchased the D9 addition it comes with both XLR and RCA
@@tatherton124 yes, I'm wondering how it compares to D5PRO. Shop that I got my D5PRO was recommending it over D9 for pure sound quality.
@@tatherton124 How do you like it so far and what other amps have you compared it to?
Can you provide a link to this amplifier? I prefer DIY and designing my own gear but given this is no longer protected by certain IP laws I would feel OK considering this amplifier. I built a clone Threshold amplifier with a BOM well North of this complete amplifier. Although I don’t know the overall quality of the parts in this amplifier it is still a good value considering the transformer, enclosure and PCB’s. Thank you.
Ahhh of course, that's not a fake so linking is fine, I've added the link to the description.
And yes that's one thing I forgot to mention: the case, toroidal transformer and caps alone are already worth more than price for complete build here in Europe!
That's why I've asked them how's that even possible
OK please supply link to order one of these thanks!
I've added the link in the description of the video
I pulled the trigger for the D9 version with XLR input. I will report back my impressions after i receive it!
Yes please share!
I am also courious for the XLR Version. Do you have a Version with Volume Controls added? Which Pre-Amp do you want to use?
@@tommusikauswahl1066 No I have pure D5PRO without volume control. The seller I got that amp from said when I talked about his recommendation that the volume pot version uses MBL schema for pre, but that combination is not the best one (not really well executed for some reason) so he wasn't recommending that set at all.
Don't know about pre yet. I have some ordered coming my way, including a few tube ones.
@@k4syx MP 701 included?
@@tommusikauswahl1066 I have the power amp with no volume control. I am using an Accurate R2R dac as a preamp also bought from Ali. It works perfect. The amp is of high quality and is dead silent. Sounds both powerful and delicate. It gets hot though so if you plan to buy it you need proper ventilation and don't put anything on top of it.
I wander how did it sounded right out of the box compared to after burning in.
It was really good, that's why I went for burn-in. If something sounds bad right out of the box I'm either retuning it or selling, burn-in can refine things but never changes the overall signature much.
Thanks ;)
I ordered one on your recommendation (D5 Pro). It's very good. I'm driving a pair of Golden Ear BRX monitors and have it paired with a nice tube preamp. I've never had any exotic amplifiers in my system. So I've been used to good mid-fi (Yamaha, Cambridge Audio, Hafler, etc.) It is probably the best sounding amp I've ever had. However, I have found that the unit shuts down after many hours of play. Even if there is no signal going through it. When I first got it I left it running to burn in the electrical components. It shut down while at idle after about 5 hours. A few days later, it shut down after being used for about 3 hours while I was listening at normal volume. This weekend, I left it on and after 3 days, I woke up in the morning and it was off - but still warm - so it must have just recently shut down. The "on" button is still in the "on" position when I check it. I can turn it off then back on, and it starts and runs fine. What do you think is happening? I'm in the USA so sending it back is not an option since it cost me over $200 to get it here. Any thoughts?
There are two options: 1. Temperature. Try to measure it after a few hours. Or get the amp in place with good air circulation and remove top lid. If it will stay on, then you need to cool it down or provide better air circulation.
2. I've noticed that my DarZeel has very sensitive speaker protection. Its easy to trigger it via some preamps (like Jc2, with that one I need always to observe the right power on sequence). But I have no idea whats the rest of the setup you have.
I would bet my money on option 1 if you were able to run it for 3 days in a row though.
@@k4syx SOunds reasonable. I'll keep an eye on it and see how it goes. In the mean time, it sure sounds great! Thanks for the great recommendation.
How can anyone call this a clone. Dartzeel NHB-108 use only one pair out output transistors without any emitter resistors. This design use three complementary pairs WITH emitter resistors.
The design of the Dartzeel output stage is a very important part of the excellence in sound quality and this design don't even try to use the same technology.
Well its not a 1:1 clone down to every single bit (though you can get these as well). This is cloned and then repurposed a bit and yes, the original or 1:1 clone will sound better - surely!
But this one is great for what it is and for the price is simply amazing.
Having bought this one, I am tempted to get 1:1 replica - right down to shape of plates conducting cap terminals. But I need my wallet to recover as I got A LOT of stuff lately :)
@@k4syx How much are the 1:1 clone? Link?
@@k4syx How can you tell on Aliexpress which one is 1:1 clone of Dartzeel? I was going to buy some of those Fosi ZA monos or Aiyama, but how does class D compare to Dartzeel clone?
@@JRadian DartZeel clone will be better, but way more expensive especially if you're looking for 1:1 clone. You can recognize them because they are called replicas, they look like the DartZeel (along with red eyes etc), they have top cover made of glass and internals look exactly like DartZeel original - you can find photos of original to compare
@@k4syx I just saw your review of Musical Fidelity clone. I need very little power because I will be powering my 110dB horns from 1kHz and up only. Just need few awesome watts.
Ben ook heel benieuwd wat de D9 zal brengen🙏of zelf een tokban goldmund telos 590?☺️
I have Teloses on my list, but these are EXPENSIVE!
Absoluut ☺️ een kleine €2000. Bedankt voor alle fijne reviews tot nu toe,echt super interessant.
I took a chance and just ordered one with an $80 coupon for the 11/11 sale.
There is a chance that you'll like it so much that you will send these 80usd to them later in envelope ;D
@ I hope so! This may exceed in abilities the speakers I have. Is it it worth getting a good clone preamp, or will my Wiim Ultra work decently for now?
@@kirchgoens You'll be fine for now, but do get Cary preamp that I reviewed for it too when possible. Its just so much better (even better!) with excellent tube pre
@@k4syxMy clone arrived today. I’ve got it running with a pair of circa 1981 Walsh Ohm 2’s and a Wiim Ultra on Tidal. It sounds really nice. The Cary hasn’t arrived yet.
Hi I found your video very interesting and I am tempted to buy this clone. One thing is stopping me - the input signal cables! It looks like the connector on this equipment case is coaxial. What input cables did you use? And where can I get them? What is in the box when it is delivered? Is a power cable also supplied? I cannot find a manual for this amplifier in the Internet. Many thanks in advance! All the best, Rob in Switzerland
Hi Rob!
It's using standard RCA connector so any RCA signal cable will do. Power is via standard IEC connector like in 99prc of audio equipment, so you'll be fine. There are no cables in the box however, you need to buy somey locally if you don't have anything unused around the house.
@@k4syx That's great! I have a very revealing system: Primare CD32, Topping D90 DAC, exposure XI+XII preamp, Exposure stereo VIII power amp, KEF Reference Three-Two with Townshend supertweeters. All anaolgue sgnal cables are Audioquest Earth, Speaker cables are Kimber Crystal 24 (like 12TC) Kimber power cables, dedicated power outlet. The exposure power amp is underpowered for the KEF speakers and I think I need more power and control. Otherwise I am very happy with the sound. Putting my speaker cables on risers made a surprising difference: faster attack and freer in the extreme high frequencies. I was considering two Fosi V3 monoblocks in Class D with two 10A power supplies but I think the character of the D5Pro will better suit my system. The exposure rolls off slowly around 100kHz so I think it will be a good match. All the best, Rob in Switzerland PS. congratulations on your great English - I found your sound review very nuanced!
@@RobWhittlestone Thank you again! I think you'll be happy with D5PRO, especially in a such great system!
@@k4syx Thank you so much! I have just realized that my speakers are rated at 4 Ohms and suited for amplifiers up to 300 W per channel so this seems a perfect match. I am hoping for more power and control in the bass which my Exposure VIII is a bit lacking with these speakers. I am looking forward to the palpable mid and also the extended highs which the KEF Reference Three-Twos with the Townshend supertweeters can easily reproduce. I'm glad I discovered your great channel! 🙂
@@k4syxHi! I bought it and it arrived 2 weeks ago! I AM VERY HAPPY WITH IT! It is an IMPROVEMENT on my 38 year old Exposure VIII stereo power amplifier which I think produced about 70W into 4 Ohms. I was not happy with the bass from my KEF Reference Two Three speakers because I think they are quite demanding (the back panel label says use amplifiers up to 300W into 4 Ohms) and the Exposure was a little weak. Now I can play tracks with very deep bass and can hear notes in my room certainly to 30 Hz more or less flat.
The transparency is good and the -3dB rolloff at 300kHz is higher than the Exposure which is felt in transients and better imaging as well as much better depth information which was missing in my old Exposure. Remember my Kimber Crystal 24 speaker cable with WBT connectors is on 17cm cable risers which liberated the extreme top end and improved the sounds stage and transients.
Thank you very much for your excellent video and your impressions which convinced me (with Frank's Werkstatt) to commit my pension money to a new amplifier!
All the best and many happy hours of listening, greetings to Poland from Rob in Switzerland
I have been enjoying the sound from a pair of Fosi ZA3s with Sparkos op amps with a pair of Magnepan LRS and the Sound Artist LS5/9 clone.There is way more detail and resolution over the Schiit Vidar 2. I actually prefer the sound of the Vidar but the ZA3s are close plus with the added detail and clarity. Sounds like this might be a best of both worlds kind of thing.
Logans are also hard to drive. I have ZA3 lined up for review, I don't see it as being contender for D5 Pro, but I am very curious about it. No serious listening session yet (no time yet) but I love engineering on this small amp - I'll cover that in my review!
@@k4syxLooking forward to the review. I couldn't stand it though and went ahead and ordered one.🤣 I do see now there is another version available with XLR and a slightly larger case for better heat dissipation but it would wind up costing almost $400 more as that seller charges way more for shipping than FunKenya. Was able to score a $50 coupon. $581 shipped for this one. Cant wait!
@@taho88 How does it compare to your ZA3 and Vidar 2? How to find the balanced version?
@@taho88How does the D5 compare to the Fozi’s?
Thanks
There is MASTER Edition D9PRO version now with upgraded components.Apparently this version does not get hot.
Yes I think its d5Pro with balanced line Burr Brown receiver for XLRs. And it does have larger chassis so thats better for heat dissipation
I own one and yes it still get hot even with the upgraded chassis1
@@leslylacombe1444 I bet is hyped! 😅
Thank you to HiFi Zone for this video and taking the time to reply to so many comments. I also recently got a D5 Pro. Mostly out of curiosity and having read many hours of anything I could find about it. I already have many amps from Class D to 845 SET. As most on here already know, this amp is outstanding value. I would recommend it to anyone starting their hifi journey. I am also running it with ML ESL panels and would suggest pairing this with a tube preamp. I have one question - would anyone happen to have a link to a site with suggested mods to do? Ive cut and pasted and saved many comments and suggestions, but if anyone is aware of a thread or site detailing mods I would greatly appreciate a link! 😊
Hi there! I think most of info is here in the comments, I'm not aware of any info on the web on that subject (at least there was nothing when I was researching the D5Pro wondering if I should risk my money and buy it). As for the mods, I'd say capacitors mostly and input signal wires + soldering them directly to the board (being aware that it may make future disassembly harder). Also: speaker taps: you can get better stuff, but thats easy thing to replace. Maybe RCA inputs too. The amp boards themselves are good and I dont see any obvious things to improve there.
Love the video, what preamp are you gonna be using with this power amp? I'm considering moving at this direction as well and ditching my integrated amp in a favour of power amp + preamp.
Thank you!
None at all actually: with electrostats I can hear the detail loss coming from placing pre between DAC and power amp. I've tried using pre a couple of times over the years, but I've always came back to simple DAC and power amp set.
@@k4syx that's interesting, but actually as per a rule of the thumb they say in the audiophile world less elements in the chain the better. How do you choose which seller to pick up from Ali? E.G the amp that you've featured is available in several shops with some minor differences in price.
@demart28 combination of the cheapest one with the biggest amount of positive feedback. A lot of guys from Germany had already bought this amp after Franks video
@@k4syx I'm in between the one above and the clone of FM Acoustics FM300A do you have any thoughts on the latter, Thanks?
Sorry, no :(
I'd love to someday, if there will be funds, explore more of these clone amps - but we'll see about that in future. Right now I need to slow down, my wallet's gonna have a heart attack soon;)
Another good review.. thanks for your continue gem discovery
Thank you!
Hi,
Interested in buying one of these but wondered if I can leave it on all the time (yes I know this is wasteful but I’ve had other class a/b amps that are designed to stay on).If not does it have a significant warm up time?
Thanks in advance.
Hi! It warms up quickly, like in 10 minutes max.
During initial burn in mine stayed on for 3 weeks in a row, so I guess you'll be fine (except for horrendous electricity bill and heat in the house)
@@k4syx Great. Thanks for replying so quickly.
I'm seriously considering buying this, but wondering how it would match with my Lyngdorf TDAI-1120, which can be used as a preamp. The analog output impedance is 75ohm. What is the input impedance of this amp? The original darTZeel I believe it's >30kohms in the RCA line.
100k :)
I think there was some info on Lyngdorf pairing in the comments here (but dont kill me if Im wrong and youll dig through all of them)
@@k4syx Thank you! I'll try to find them. I did see a video of someone using this amp with Lyngdorf TDAI-3400 and it sounded amazing!
I was wondering about fuses. Do you use "special" fuses? Any thoughts?
There was a time about 5 years ago when I had an opportunity to buy some exotic fuses very cheaply (one of local audio shops went bankrupt and they were selling everything with like 90prc discount). I've found two things: 1. It works, but only in DAC and _only_ when listened through my custom Stax setup (it's even more transparent and resolving than my Martin Logan) - the effect is _miniscule_ though repeatable - and 2. Custom fuses do not always work as specced - may burn a little earlier (costly but safe) or a bit later (COSTLY and COSTLY and dangerous). So all in all - not worth the effort IMHO. Though if you have a company you trust, you have some money to burn because why not, and you don't have any other way to improve your system in a more significant way - then sure, why not.
The only place I have "exotic" fuses nowadays are my two Gustard DACs and the fuses are made by Gustard too.
Hi to all
Unfortunately my d5 pro after no more than 40 (in total) hours decided to shut its right channel light plus current.
After i shut it down and powering it the right light indicator returned and so was the the music but it played with only 50 or so of loudness compared to the left channel that continued to work as intended.
Does anyone had the same experience??
I don't know what to think/do😢
Maybe its just a matter of blown fuse??
Hello and thanks a lot for your reviews, I bougth a D5PRO clone after seeing your video (the integrated amplifier for available room rationale).
As far as input binding post cables are concerned, they are thin but at this step of the chain, the signal is not yet amplified, so, isn't it normal ? As a comparison, when one rewires a turntable arm, the thinest cable with the least resistance is chosen. Something I miss ?
RCA single ended signal is differnt from turntable signals so this is normal, however you could replace it with some good quality RCA interconnect cable - short runs straight to the board. Thats one of my to-do mods :)
Great channel and great reviews! May i ask all of you that purchase that amp in which country you live in? Im from europe (Greece) and the european law says that products up to 150€ can delivered without extra fees... How much did you pay for that amp to delivered to your country?
Hi!
Thanks!
The law says that for the value above 150Eur the customs and VAT are added in the delivery country. In my case this was very small fee like 20USD for the Musical Fidelity Clone and ~35 for DartZeel. But in Greece this can be totally different...
@@k4syx I guess you knew the cost before ordering the unit by contacting customs offices or they informed you when it arrived? Thanks in advance!
@@subcoded no, I did not, here the value is assessed by customs based on invoice attached or if the value there seems to be lower than real via "expert assessment". This means that it's not always easy to foresee the exact value.
@@k4syx Oh! IC! I hope the "expert" is not an expert ta all 😂... i'll pull the trigger and i wish myself good luck 😶
nice review that is not bias on brandname! I just placed an order base on this! I am new to this and wonder what do I do to burn in the amp if you can show me the processs? thanks in advance!
Thank you!
Just leave it playing some music for 200-300h. I know, that's like 3 weeks. Turn the speakers so they will face reach other (close, it's ok if they touch each other) and connect one out of phase (red to black black to red) and second one in phase (red to red black to black). This way they'll play quieter with the same volume level.
Or just leave them connected normally and playing with normal volume of your house is large enough :)
You don't have to listen to them during that time. It's even better if you don't. Come back every 2-3 day to listen to some chosen song to you know and love and you'll hear the changes the burn in makes. They are small, but noticeable.
thank you! I hace newborn so I dont think I can leave it on for that long... is it the same if I just keep playing from time to time and will it be burnt in evebtually when the total hours add up? and you think this will last a long time? it's not made by big company so I would think quality control is not as good...
@@dtoe07toer29 @dtoe07toer29 you'll be perfectly fine and safe, burning in just by listening will work as well but will take ages. Suppose you'd listen to it for 2h every day, that gives 60 hours per month, that gives 300h after 5 months. If you'd do that every other day than you have 10 months. You'll be fine but it will take ages :)
uhm... 5 months not too bad haha but damn I just realize the amp does not have a volume! so doesn't my DAC... you think any decently cheap volume module like the Schiit would not kill the quality?
@@dtoe07toer29 some kind of passive preamp or maybe your source has volume control? Like your streamer maybe or PC (which is source iny case)?
@k4syx Very useful review! Have you encountered the 1:1 clone somewhere and where?
I've read some threads about it in a few different places. In general owners absolutely love it, including a guy who had his in repairs for like ten months (a line of unfortunate events) but would still repeat the process because of sound quality of the clone.
Maybe in time I will bite the bullet and get one, if my channel will create some funds :)
I have the clone with pot and one without pot. Both sound superb, using it with a cloneFM225…. Sound is superb, can post pics if you want
@@jean-pierrescherer8250 yes please! Can you take photos of pot version: how's the pot connected? Just after inputs?
Really great review with a comprehensive walk through of the internals. Wonderful to know that some of these great looking amps on Ali express are actually legit builds! Just wish they made a balanced version of this one as I’d be willing to pay for that added cost relative to this amps price. Would it be safe and/or still sound good and in phase to use xlr/rca adapters with this?🙏🏼
Yes that's what I was wondering too - if the build is ok. I wasn't really expecting to see it that good!
There is a version with XLR and pre built in, but the shop told me that this one has best SQ due to simplest circuit.
Maybe I will also look at some point at other offers for 1:1 clone (3x more expensive) with XLRs as this one is already a good indication that others may be even better
@@k4syxI saw a 1:1 clone and it was only 50% more expensive. It was around $750.
@@ccdccd8615 that's cheap! Any chance for link?
The D9 Pro is the balanced version.
@@leslylacombe1444 I think the d9’s might not have been available until recently? Unless we weren’t looking in the right direction 👍🏼
Thanks for the tip, as for replacing the short speaker cable, that seems unnecessary for such a short cable, it seems to me more than thick enough to have any impact. I might actually buy one to replace my old Yamaha full class A MX-1000 that consumes a unreasonable amount of electricity. It is on itself a marvelous sounding amp and the build quality is to die for. I will need to think about this. Do you have the ability to actually measure the performance of this amplifier the way it is done by Amirm of Audio Science Review? I'd love to see what factual numbers we can expect from this.
Hope you understand German. He gives a full insight on preformance technically.
th-cam.com/video/Od4e51LmIwk/w-d-xo.htmlsi=6YsfJbkiXfNzy6VM
@olaf9938 Thank you Olaf, my German is a bit rusty but that's not a problem as captions are available. This was exactly what I was looking for. I'm even more tempted now. 😉
No unfortunately not, I could do basic power output measurements using my scope, but to be serious about it I would need something like AP that Amirm is using (or at least one of more better Cosmos ADCs) Maybe at some point in time, so far its a hobby for my free time so I have no professional measuring equipment
@@GauisHelenaMohaim You should be tempted ;) I know its a lot to read but do look in the comments for some info from guys who got one and compared with their current gear.
@@k4syxNo problem, that German gentleman measuments and circuit explanation gave us very good indication that this amp is more than capable and designed correctly.
I have purchased the FM300A Gold version with dual transformers now i am wondering if i should get this one instead, haven't received the FM300A as yet.
Its different: they have different sound signatures but both are excellent: what music genres are you listening to?
@@k4syx Mostly smooth jazz.
@@anthony2010707 Then get FM300A as its cheaper and smoother! :)
I think i will be parting with the FM300A, just to get the Dartzeel, just the colour and wife factor led to my decision. 😮
@anthony2010707 WAF should never be underestimated, it's one of the most important audio gear parameter
Would this pair well with a tube preamplifier like the Audible Illusions M3? What is the input impedance of this amp? Thank you
Unfortunately I don't know input impedance value. As for preamp, depends on your sound signature preference. Hard to tell. I'm usually dropping pre because I can hear with my electrostats slight detail loss vs going straight from the dac. But YMMV. There are many people asking for pre reviews so I may have one in future
Hi, love your site. I always wondered the quality of clone audio. I went to Allexpress to check out ordering the D5 Pro based on your review. I'm stoked! My question is, they listed several D5's with different prices and shipping costs. How does one choose? I'm concerned to go with cheapest as maybe they have lower QC. Any advice please. Live in USA
Hi! Thank you!
I've added the link to the shop I got mine from in the description of the video - secure shipping with dhl or ups. There are two versions, regular D5 and a better D5 Pro that I've reviewed here.
@@k4syx I only see a few w/115 voltage. Is 110v ok for us use? Thanks so much. You do a fantastic job. I'll be broke in no time!
@@randynielsen9894 Thanks and same here - my wallet is constantly in ICU :)
You'll be fine with 110V, these (as all equipment) do have some +/- voltage margins.
Sounds like a winner, except the heat. Are there any keepers that run cooler?
That would be only D class amps. Tube, class A, class AB, class XD (Cambridge Audio) - all run warm. I'd say class AB isnt that bad, compared to class A or tubes :)
@@k4syxAny specific AB replica amp you deem worthy? Thanks for the reply.
@@HotSause look at the review of the DartZeel clone I've posted a few weeks ago. Highly recommended, amazing amp!
Does it power off automatically , if there is nothing playing ???
No, it doesn't. Old school without any additional sensing circuits.
Hi mate great video i cant find the actual physical measurments of the amp you know width length height etc (they are not on the website), if you read this can you let me know thanks
Color: Black or Silver (optional)
Dimensions: 430 * 330 * 130MM
D5PRO Net Weight: About 16KG
@@k4syx
Some sellers have upgraded the 330 to 370mm for better ventilation....are they the same otherwise?
Is the XLR input just for convenience or truly balanced?
Which vendor do you recommend?
Thanks 😊
@@carlitomelon4610 Cant really comment on that as I dont have D9 available but these are good questions. adding xlrs just to have them converted to se is pointless
So, what a "high gain" rating for a preamp that's suitable for this amp? How about a preamp based on the PASS P1.7 circuit?
Havent heard that one (yet). I think its on my list, build with silver case and two knobs that are not exaclty symmetrically placed and blackstripe.
Hello there.... I stumbled across your video while searching for an amp upgrade. Is this better than Cambridge Evo or NAD C298 ???
Yes, I think so, but this one is pure power amp with only one set of single ended inputs, remember about that.
@@k4syx I can put multiple inpus on the external DAC and just use this as a pure Amp. That should do the trick. I hope I understood correctly what you are trying to say.
@@tango_gru Yes exactly, that's what I meant :)
Just ordered one in black 230v.
I'll be back with a review, and how it compares with my linn 2200 power amp in my all linn Akurate system. 😮
Yes please do! Thanks!
I’m interested in that comparison as well. Have a Linn Intek (for over 30 years now). The D5 Pro is on its way from China as we speak. Also purchased a Cary SLP-90 tube pre amp (clone). Also on it’s way. So exited how it will match my system (Linn Nexus loudspeakers, Bluesound Node with upgraded LPS and Denafrips Ares II dac).
I’m interested in that comparison as well. Have a Linn Intek (for over 30 years now). The D5 Pro is on its way from China as we speak. Also purchased a Cary SLP-90 tube pre amp (clone). Also on it’s way. So exited how it will match my system (Linn Nexus loudspeakers, Bluesound Node with upgraded LPS and Denafrips Ares II dac).
@@k4syx My review is up.
@@olaf9938 My review is up.
I have number 12 of the original run of 20(NHB-108A)and a '108B(both will be used for bi-amping). These clones may sound good but none have 50ohm connections that raise the SQ to greater heights!
I also have the Mk1 preamp.
Please do share your insights when it will get to you,ok? (THANKS!).
I am eyeing a clone thats descibed as 1:1 with BNC, SE and XLR inputs and judging via photos it does look very similiar to original amp!
@@k4syx Which Store?
@@zombielandiii2711 This unit here: s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_DdcnISz
What pre do you recommend? Do you know what the input impedance is? I am thinking to run a tube pre if possible. Thank you
I don't know the input resistance, sorry - I can measure input resistance for you when I get back from short vacation now. I'm using it directly with DAC - Gustard has good volume control built in. In my experience adding pre always results in some detail loss, but may warm up the sound. This one doesn't need this warming - it's great as it is
@@k4syx Thanj you. My dac has no volume control but my streamer has a remote control volume. I might try it.
I recently saw the interior of the Dartzeel and it looks like it had two toroidal transformers whereas the D5 Pro has one? Is this true and if so how does that affect the performance?
the original has two, clone has one with two windings. Two would be better of course but the price would be higher (and shipping too!)
@@k4syx Many thanks :-)
I have a problem turning on the amplifier. The amplifier does not turn on the first time. I have to press the on button several times to turn it on. Can this quality problem be solved?
Have the same. Solution is to turn it on aroud 30 seconds after you’ve turned on your pre amp.
@ Exactly, its protection is highly sensitive (which is good as it protects the amp and speakers) and it gets easily triggered if the preamp powers up when D5Pro is already powered on
All power amps should be powered as the last device in chain, after preamp will stabilize. Read lower here my comment on sensitivity. I guess you are using preamp and you turn them both on at the same time?
Same issue here too, it is the protection mode. I have mine paired with the Cary clone and contacted the seller of the D5Pro. He stated it was the fault of the Cary as he Sid it is not "stable" and is causing the protection to be triggered. I just leave mine on, and I would recommend getting a fan, I use this one, found on Amazon, for $50, the AC Infinity AIRCOM S6 rear ventilation. It works.
Hi again, one of the channels has just shut down , the amp was turned on, without any music signal. Has anyone experienced the same? I would prefer to fix it, and not send it in return.
@@BowmanDk1 does it start again after power cycle? Maybe something had triggered protection. Have you checked the fuses on that channel if it doesn't power up?
@@k4syx Thanks for your good advice, I have turned it on again, and both channels works now. Only strange that it shut down without any signal. Do this amps need a dc power blocker? Thanks again, Best, HelgeH
@@BowmanDk1 there's a protection circuit that shuts the amp down (well the selected channel since there are two amps inside) in case of any problem. I've managed to trip that when I accidentally shorted outputs. It stays off until full power cycle.
This has happened to my amp a few times only on cold startup with no input. Cycle power and both leds come on.
I have the similar problem: the right channel is off. I tried to restart several times, but no signals come from the right side to the speaker. Fuse is changed. No idea what to do :((
I'm iching to order this amp today, not sure I should thank you for this expense😊😊 Which version have you got, D5 or D5 Pro? Thanks for the great content!
I felt that itching for two years, it was time to scratch that place ;)
I went for D5 Pro. Price difference is neglible and it really is better build.