I have a few suggestions... - make your "paddles" collapse when they're on top, which can be achieved simply by a tongue on each paddle and a separate path (groove), close to the tractor path on top, far on the bottom. - make a cover above your chain to prevent the water from being sent forward. - to limit the risk of "head over heels", add canards at the front. The circuit with an Arduino Nano and an MPU6050 is very simple and it can be fully autonomous once programmed. - print the threads (or the ends thereof, the parts un contact with the water/road) in flexible TPU to avoid breakage. Also, alter the print direction to avoid delamination on the Z-axis, the footage shows that's where your threads exploded: PLA is always weak in the Z, while very solid on both other axes (there's a clear demonstration on TH-cam with 3D-printed screws).
I wonder how a water deflector behind the track would affect it, deflecting som of that water being thrown up in the back. The attack angle of the track could also be a fun parameter to play with. Also a smaller wheel in the back would probably make it harder for the water to follow the track upwards, or what do i know, im only speculating.
I think you're right on attack angle. I want the whole thing to be an angle so the water isn't being throw up and forward. The wheel on the back is actually large because it helps this attack angle and I never want the top of the track close to the water. Next build will certainly improve the attack angle!
How would it perform if the track / paddles were in the front, and steerable thin wheel like rutters were in the rear. The wheels would allow travel on land and act as rutters on water. My pedal pontoon boat has the paddles in front and rutter in the rear.
You could add some pizza cutter thin wheels to the inside of your front skids, so the wheel only pokes through on the bottom. It can just ride on a basic axle attached to the inside of the skid and hopefully give you some better turning on land ..pretty cool project!
🤔 You could raise the front axle a little with a servo (or install an angle straight away) so that the front "paddles" don't directly pull the water away from under the boat and the air bubbles don't reduce the buoyancy.
consider changing the tread the following: more of a backward facing bucket for increased thrust (yeah, I know, bear with me).. change the front and back of the model around the track so that the buckets are never pushing down on the water in the front.. this can be done with a bit of a cover, maybe wedge shaped, to divert the water left and right just at the front. the down facing bucket never pushed down on the water because of the cover. the backwards facing bucket grabs water and pushed it backwards aggressively. at the back there needs to be a cover at the top to counter water being thrown 'up' that pushes the craft down.. a lid on this area counters the momentum and should even out. also consider angling the tread so either the front or back is lower in the water. a little experimentation here might show some big differences. last thing, the tread as you have it, what I will call wrong way facing buckets, is designed to lift the whole boat as the tread moves. good luck on version 2. and if you're going to have clown shoes on it, go all in. model some clown shoes and print them in vibrant red. :-)
I would consider building something similar to a snowmobile track tunnel. Unless I’m mistaken, that is essential to the snowmobile’s ability to cross water.
This is something we plan to test. I'm back and forth on how much this will help keep the nose down because I think the track submersion and relative angle of attack of the paddles plays a much bigger role. This is both front and back. I want to make the track depth adjustable so almost none of the upward or downward travel portions are very exposed to water.
Better is yet to be defined. We'll see how the metrics play out. There are also 3 thumbnails running a-b testing so I'm really curious to get that data tonight as well.
@@EngineeringAfterHours I think a lot of people would have thought the previous title was a bit over ambitions. The new title is more intriguing and suits the video better. Glad to hear it's doing well
maybe some swept wing floats at the back like a jet fighter (which would look cool) giving it more surface area might stop it pulling down into the water and possible some water in the front floats to add some weight.
Consider moving the tracks to the center of the vehicle rather than the back end. The rotation of the treads would be offset by the flotation of the hull behind the tracks.
Make the rear pontoons longer where they stick out the back about 6 to 8 inches. build a small fender to cover the track on top and it won't sling water like that.
What if the treads were printed in semiflex TPU? That stuff is rigid enough for fasteners etc, yet doesn't break. I personally like Sainsmart Semiflex 95A as it prints well, very good quality, and has a reasonable cost.
I think this would be better at lower speeds, but at high speeds the rubber likes to tear itself apart. I think I want to do metal spring like treads on round 2.
It's actually a software called multielement airfoils by Hanley Innovations. It's certainly not the ideal solver for that as it's 2D and designed for airfoils. But I can run water analyses and create my own geometry so it's also not entirely useless. It helps with pitch and taper angles. If you have access to a full 3D CFD solution that would be more accurate.
if it can't scale to a swamp boat size, then this is just a toy concept. doing it with something real sized would reveal the weaknesses that would need addressing for a useable craft of some sort. swamp boat because of the shallow draft, light weight, ability to put some wheels on the front, etcetera. there's a huge mass difference to account for when scaling up. good luck.
I would love to scale it to a swamp boat. It would be hard to hit the high speeds that the scale version can get, but I think a 20mph version is very reasonable given the budget.
why don't you cover the back part so.. maybe the water shooting up turns into like.. Thrust almost as it slides to the back of the vehicle efficiency-wise? I may have lost brain cells before I typed this. At least so the water does not splash everywhere.
This is not new, we've been using this method in our UGVs for years now. You're not changing anything, it's simply not very common, it's called water caterpiller, and has been available and known about and used for decades.
@@EngineeringAfterHours Not possible to put a link in comments you tard. But here are the search terms that will lead you directly to the noted articles and technologies: 1. Popular Science Dec 1918 p68 - History of boat propulsion, Water caterpillar 2. French military amphibious craft uses caterpillar tracks to move in an out of water 3. How Have I Not Known That There’s A French Company Making Amphibious Boats With Caterpillar Treads and finally 4. "Fast Track Amphibian Demonstration Video" you can find this on youtube. Thumbs down, do your own search next time.
I have a few suggestions...
- make your "paddles" collapse when they're on top, which can be achieved simply by a tongue on each paddle and a separate path (groove), close to the tractor path on top, far on the bottom.
- make a cover above your chain to prevent the water from being sent forward.
- to limit the risk of "head over heels", add canards at the front. The circuit with an Arduino Nano and an MPU6050 is very simple and it can be fully autonomous once programmed.
- print the threads (or the ends thereof, the parts un contact with the water/road) in flexible TPU to avoid breakage. Also, alter the print direction to avoid delamination on the Z-axis, the footage shows that's where your threads exploded: PLA is always weak in the Z, while very solid on both other axes (there's a clear demonstration on TH-cam with 3D-printed screws).
I wonder how a water deflector behind the track would affect it, deflecting som of that water being thrown up in the back. The attack angle of the track could also be a fun parameter to play with. Also a smaller wheel in the back would probably make it harder for the water to follow the track upwards, or what do i know, im only speculating.
Two tracks would make steering a breeze, just like a tank.
I think you're right on attack angle. I want the whole thing to be an angle so the water isn't being throw up and forward.
The wheel on the back is actually large because it helps this attack angle and I never want the top of the track close to the water.
Next build will certainly improve the attack angle!
How would it perform if the track / paddles were in the front, and steerable thin wheel like rutters were in the rear. The wheels would allow travel on land and act as rutters on water. My pedal pontoon boat has the paddles in front and rutter in the rear.
You could add some pizza cutter thin wheels to the inside of your front skids, so the wheel only pokes through on the bottom. It can just ride on a basic axle attached to the inside of the skid and hopefully give you some better turning on land ..pretty cool project!
Nickname "Mudskipper" very cool!
I sugest you add sprocket in the back that lifts the track out of water before it starts going around diging in water
Pease allow me to tell you how to do it better, using my armchair YT engineering degree.
Lol...im all ears!
@@EngineeringAfterHours oh I got nothing, I just think it's funny how every other comment thinks they can do it better :)
🤔
You could raise the front axle a little with a servo (or install an angle straight away) so that the front "paddles" don't directly pull the water away from under the boat and the air bubbles don't reduce the buoyancy.
consider changing the tread the following: more of a backward facing bucket for increased thrust (yeah, I know, bear with me).. change the front and back of the model around the track so that the buckets are never pushing down on the water in the front.. this can be done with a bit of a cover, maybe wedge shaped, to divert the water left and right just at the front. the down facing bucket never pushed down on the water because of the cover. the backwards facing bucket grabs water and pushed it backwards aggressively. at the back there needs to be a cover at the top to counter water being thrown 'up' that pushes the craft down.. a lid on this area counters the momentum and should even out.
also consider angling the tread so either the front or back is lower in the water. a little experimentation here might show some big differences.
last thing, the tread as you have it, what I will call wrong way facing buckets, is designed to lift the whole boat as the tread moves.
good luck on version 2. and if you're going to have clown shoes on it, go all in. model some clown shoes and print them in vibrant red. :-)
I would consider building something similar to a snowmobile track tunnel. Unless I’m mistaken, that is essential to the snowmobile’s ability to cross water.
I definitely need to look more into this.
Place a cover over the top of the tread to keep from throwing the water momentum up in the air, that will keep your nose down considerably.
This is something we plan to test. I'm back and forth on how much this will help keep the nose down because I think the track submersion and relative angle of attack of the paddles plays a much bigger role. This is both front and back.
I want to make the track depth adjustable so almost none of the upward or downward travel portions are very exposed to water.
Like the tunnel of a sled. (the part under the seat covering the track)
Someone beat me to it 😂
6:41 that's definitely a hydro glide
@LayerbyLayerOfficial you're going to have to educate me on what that is. All I can think of is a harley.
😂 I was giving you a new name for a wheelie on water
New title is much better, good on ya
Better is yet to be defined. We'll see how the metrics play out.
There are also 3 thumbnails running a-b testing so I'm really curious to get that data tonight as well.
Following up to say the data shows you were correct. The new title is better for watch time. Lots of good data on this test run.
@@EngineeringAfterHours I think a lot of people would have thought the previous title was a bit over ambitions. The new title is more intriguing and suits the video better. Glad to hear it's doing well
maybe some swept wing floats at the back like a jet fighter (which would look cool) giving it more surface area might stop it pulling down into the water and possible some water in the front floats to add some weight.
Maybe enclose the tread and funnel it forward to the front and back down to maybe put some water pressure ? Idk. Sounded good in my head
Consider moving the tracks to the center of the vehicle rather than the back end. The rotation of the treads would be offset by the flotation of the hull behind the tracks.
Make the rear pontoons longer where they stick out the back about 6 to 8 inches. build a small fender to cover the track on top and it won't sling water like that.
What if the treads were printed in semiflex TPU? That stuff is rigid enough for fasteners etc, yet doesn't break. I personally like Sainsmart Semiflex 95A as it prints well, very good quality, and has a reasonable cost.
I think this would be better at lower speeds, but at high speeds the rubber likes to tear itself apart. I think I want to do metal spring like treads on round 2.
Fill the hollow sections with spray foam. If it gets a whole or cracks you wont have to dive to find it.
It is foam filled.
@@EngineeringAfterHours excellent
Awesome 😎😎😎
@EngineeringAfterHours what software did you use to analyze the tread performance underwater?
It's actually a software called multielement airfoils by Hanley Innovations. It's certainly not the ideal solver for that as it's 2D and designed for airfoils. But I can run water analyses and create my own geometry so it's also not entirely useless. It helps with pitch and taper angles.
If you have access to a full 3D CFD solution that would be more accurate.
Use trim tabs
need some trim adjustment. tabs or track angle or position. a throttle ramp or limiter would also help on water.
Will look into this for round 2
if it can't scale to a swamp boat size, then this is just a toy concept. doing it with something real sized would reveal the weaknesses that would need addressing for a useable craft of some sort.
swamp boat because of the shallow draft, light weight, ability to put some wheels on the front, etcetera. there's a huge mass difference to account for when scaling up. good luck.
I would love to scale it to a swamp boat. It would be hard to hit the high speeds that the scale version can get, but I think a 20mph version is very reasonable given the budget.
Lock the diffs on the Dragster
All fun and games then you get a call from Lockheed Martin😂
6:41 That’s a tracked glider
You can say Climbed 6:41
why don't you cover the back part so.. maybe the water shooting up turns into like.. Thrust almost as it slides to the back of the vehicle efficiency-wise? I may have lost brain cells before I typed this. At least so the water does not splash everywhere.
This is definitely something I will be testing in round 2.
Not very efficiency at all but sure we will learn a lot engineering doing project like this.
Snowmobile
Boatmobile
just make amphibious vehicle then... .?
Trackie not wheelie
Why not get speed on land and try and skip the water. Disappointing
I'll try to remember to do this on the second prototype. It would be cool to see
Great fun, thank you!
This is not new, we've been using this method in our UGVs for years now. You're not changing anything, it's simply not very common, it's called water caterpiller, and has been available and known about and used for decades.
Link or it didn't happen
@@EngineeringAfterHours Not possible to put a link in comments you tard. But here are the search terms that will lead you directly to the noted articles and technologies: 1. Popular Science Dec 1918 p68 - History of boat propulsion, Water caterpillar 2. French military amphibious craft uses caterpillar tracks to move in an out of water 3. How Have I Not Known That There’s A French Company Making Amphibious Boats With Caterpillar Treads and finally 4. "Fast Track Amphibian Demonstration Video" you can find this on youtube.
Thumbs down, do your own search next time.