@@isthisnametaken978 I'd say even beyond that..I use a zee derailleur in a 36 tooth cassette, which, although 10 speed like the derailleur, it shouldn't work because of the gap between cogs, but it's worked smooth for the last three years, plus, I use an altus 9 speed crank, and even with the bigger chainring pretty much destroyed for me using it as a bash guard it still works fine with and I never have chain dropping. Summing up, if you wanna follow the manual rules then the answer is not always (like zee components with bigger cassettes for instance) now if you don't mind experimenting a little, then you can even extrapolate that rule a little.
@@isthisnametaken978 At least one counter-example comes to mind: The latest Shimano Tiagra 4700 road groupset is 10 speed but has a different pull ratio than other/older 10 speed groupsets.
@@PedroHenrique-dn1dj I've been using zee m640 shifter paired with deore xt m786 derailleur, both 10 speed. Shifts without a problem, except some delay in shifting down from 8th to 7th gear. Probably because I had to tighten the b screw to accommodate the 42t cassette, larger than m786 was intended for. Or could be because it's a cheapo offbrand cassette from China. Or a combination of both. But I doubt it's because the zee/deore xt combo.
It's incredible how genuine and honest he is. Not pushing higher priced items. I seriously only want to buy from these guys after seeing these videos. Great work!
Chris Mitchell you have no idea. They are the most humble dudes EVER. During this pandemic they have been nothing short of AMAZING. I have purchased stuff from them in the past 2 months and will do even more in the future. Jeff is amazing and the dudes who work for them as well.
After watching this video I ended up going SLX rather than XT and have some $ left over for several rounds of post ride beers (once we are safely able to do so). Thanks for being a man of the people!
I feel like the difference is night and day when you are shifting in real life applications with loads of torque. This is when for example the XT or XTR truly shine as you can shift while at full power and it doesn’t cause any problems which for me is a game changer
For competitions or as a sponsor bike ok i would agree otherwise for daily use the XTR doesn't make any sense with that price.. i get the upper quality materials are expensive but still one full XTR set costing 4x Deore sets is insane : like i could have 4 different fully Deore equipped bikes or one bike fully equipped with Deore set and still 3 full sets as spares to replace.. just say'n regarding XTR price, so in my case for double switching thru gears i would really get XT shifters +rear deraylor and everything else Deore since they are compatible and still benefit of the 2x faster nicer shift feel. brakes in my case i got full set front +rear Magura MT7 - with 4 pistons they work awesome.. so yeah..
I don`t race and I have a family to support so the Deore stuff looks just right for someone who only rides for fun and does not give a crap about MTB snobs.
Ain’t that the truth! I am lucky enough that I can ride almost every day of the week. I am rocking a budget build, got about $700 in it right now. SLX brakes, used XT homemade 1x10 drivetrain, no name rims with Shimano hubs, midrange suntour fork, etc.... It never fails to put a slightly sadistic smile on my face when I pass people on their high end full sus carbon frame bikes. But then I realize that they’re just out there riding also, having probably just as much fun as I am and I’m just being a judgemental asshole. Who am I to judge their 8k bike. I would ride it if I could afford it, lol.
I am a noob in biking but 60 yrs old with little time and a bit of $ ... I bought the xtr and never look back. Snob ? Dun think so, I ride alone and no wish to wonder why not xtr in the 1st place. Safe biking ! 🙏
*get cheap suspensions components (a base model to serve as a chassis) and made them custom tuned by someone (eg. avalanche). it will be faaar better than anything fancy, over marketing bullshited, heroin priced shit.
You don't need a high end fork you dunderheed .. you just need better riding skills ....dave yer money If you really want suspension that actually works .. Buy a Motorbike
So you use the cheapest component that makes the biggest difference in performance? They all shift the same but feel is only 10% difference at most. But the cassette is the biggest tangible difference because it's so much heavier
As a bike tech, yes you can see the quality differences when you tune the bike. However, SLX and Deore run so well, and if you could ride blindfolded, the only difference between these is how they sound shifting and the double trigger downshift. Absolutely love the quality of Deore, definitely worth it over Sram SX and even NX
We basically did that and more in this video in article - www.worldwidecyclery.com/blogs/worldwide-cyclery-blog/sram-vs-shimano-brake-buyers-guide-the-ultimate-comparison-video
@@mrvwbug4423 That's what i take from it. If I'm not mistaken the calipers are the same throughout the range, the difference being the external finish.
On older models, XT and XTR allows instant shifter release, meaning the chain drops right after the shifter lever is pressed before returning, but Deore shifter lever has to return before chain drops. Something to note and I got the XT for this reason.
You guys rock! Thanks for all the great content. Cant wait to see you evaluate and breakdown SRAM’s Eagle lineup of XX1, XO1, GX, NX, SX, XX1 AXS, and XO1 AXS !
After 3 months on a new Giant Trance X Pro 0, just stumbled across this video which has helped me learn 1: That my XT shifters have double downshifting (to a harder gear) using your thumb, but only single using your index finger (didn't realise there was double shifting but noticed that it only does that with your thumb). 2: XT shifters have a triple upshifting with your thumb. 3: There is a clutch on the XTR derailleur to make it easier to take the back wheel off. Thanks for the video. Super useful.
XT has always been my go-to drive-train and preferably the complete bike fitted like this. However in my newest bike I am actually mixing and matching components and it’s been interesting. Front meg is Deore. Rear meg is XTR. Breaks levers and calibers are Deore but shifters XT because of their added functionality and crisp feel. My honest opinion is that Shimano is over complicating things. Deore is fine for most, but bikesnobs like me ride XT (because it’s cooler and because we finally can afford it and a set of carbon wheels) XT is a hell of a nice group set. XTR are for pros where seconds matter. SLX to me is the odd one out, just like the 105. Almost but not really...
I think the SLX does an important job. It allows a beginner to choose to go low-cost on the first hand (Deore) or to spend a little more (SLX), just to show some extra commitment, reflecting the own positive expectations about the new hobby. On the other hand, same goes for most routined riders, not those few likely to go for XTR: Choice between XT (best with still reasonable price point) or budget-friendly, but more than decent (and not beginner model) SLX. Having such options to choose makes customers happy, and happy customers buy stuff.
@@andreaslange8256 Shimano clearly must succeed greatly with their strategy, since they would not be doing it if it didn't pay off. How ever I am not sure consumers are benefitting. Huge production and developing costs lays hidden in having to produce so many different components and I think Deore and XT could both become more affordable IF the development of SLX was cut out. I do how ever find Shimano a democratic and fair company in the sense that they have allowed compatibility within the whole Deore Eco-system. That in itself is quite amazing that you can mix from all tiers of their product range and not have to commit exclusively to one group-set. Smart choice undoubtedly as it gives customers the option to upgrade and bike shops the possibly downgrade and flash a high-end rear meg to make the whole package seem greater value. That along with a set of entry level tires (which in my humble opinion should be banned as they are waste of money) and we're in business!
No I would definitely say deore is the odd man out. Best bang for your buck is slx groupset with an XT shifter. I wouldn't let deore touch anything SLX and above.
Weight comparison normally comes with a total weight difference !! Maybe you can put it up in the description .Because thats important. Thanks a lot for talking through the parts individually,but the big picture would be the difference in total. deore 4216 slx 4262 + 46 xt 4127 - 89 vs deore (- 135 vs SLX) xtr 3582 - 634 vs deore Now drink a bit more than half a litre of water before starting and the weight is same like Deore starting thirsty ; )
I can say from experience the ‘feel’ between the groups is the biggest change between them outside of the weight. Crispy shifts are important for quick riding. The SLX and Deore can feel plastic-like and kind of hollow. Whereas the XT & XTR is actuated almost immediately with a firm click of the shifter. It can be related to manual transmissions between cars that are basic daily drivers, and sports cars or ones with a short throw shifter. In a sporty / aggressive situation, you’re gonna want those immediate, quick and crispy shifts!!
That immediate and smooth actuation of the derailleur can be achieved on those cheaper ones too, but it requires a lot more maintenance to keep it that smoothly because they're made to less tight tolerances... there's more drift, so you need to readjust things more often and perfect lubrication plays a way bigger role compared to the higher end ones.
Wow here was me thinking it was technical ability and fitness. Guess I’ll be the next Amaury or Nino when I get xtr. Unless you are like top 10 nationally or regionally and race seriously you are just doing it for bling factor. Even if you are you would get it handed to you by a world class rider. So let be honest you are just buying bling and maybe the real difference is a lack of ability, which is sweet but don’t pretend you need the performance. Your not that good you might save 1/100of a second .
100% agree with your shifter analogy. A lot of people seem to think theres no different between the different levels but I absolutely seem to notice the feel, sturdiness, responsiveness, and overall quality of the XT compared to something like Deore or SLX. Those are still great groupsets but for the small price increase to go to XT, its definitely worth it in my opinion.
Shimano is absolutely brilliant. I have full XTR and it is the best shifting ever! XTR is a masterpiece! And thank you shimano for never ever going carbon for your cranks! You obviously know what you are doing. If you have the money go with XTR. Absolutely beautiful shifting, durability and looks!
Shimano seems to refer to these as; Doere, SLX, "Deore XT", & XTR. Throwing the "Deore" in on the XT name feels like Shimano is actively trying to confuse us. Thank God for WWC for helping demystify this stuff!
Dude! Don't get me started on confusing BS Shimano does. Have you looked at the part numbers and shifter / brake lever mounting terms and variants?! 😂🤦♂️
I am a budget mountain biker so I do get lower end components . A chain guide eliminates chain drop for the most part . I run my clutch looser than the factory setting . I run the Deor sgs 10 speed and Its ok for climbing capacity but on those longer steep climbs is difficult . I did not want spend the money to upgrade to a 12 speed so I went from 30 tooth to 28 tooth chain ring . I changed my cassette from a 11/42 to 11/46 and was surprised that I did not need a derailleur extender and shifts good with a Chinese cassette . So the upgrade was about $ 70 that is efficient and adequate for my budget hardtail and is close to a 12 speed capacity in the biggest cog . To me it doesnt make sense to put high end components on a budget bike
I have an SLX drivetrain on a FS XC 29 Alloy Bike. It's perfect for my style and riding on dutch flat and smooth trails. Just ride for fun and keep myself healthy and fit. Great vids guys. Keeps me updated with al the cool stuff out there.
There is also the new Shimano Deore M5100 which was released at the same time as Deore M6000 and flew under most peoples radar. It's a 11spd 11-51t cassette groupset which fits on a standard shimano freehub. I think they are meant for OEM bike builders but you can get the full set for $200 on Ebay or you could save $50, drop the cranks and buy a narrow-wide chainring to put on your existing cranks. You miss out on the 10t top gear, one less gear and no hyperglide+ compared to M6000 but if you want to upgrade to a 1x wide range cassette transmission on a budget (particularly since you don't need a new microspine freehub as well), then this is a good choice. I have just fitted mine and it's working great.
Holy moly poo, seriously if you guys had a shop in England, i would spend my money with you even if i had to pay extra compared to others for the simple reason that, i like honest, well explained and fun. It's everything i haven't got anywhere near me. Ok, now i'm waiting for the next video😁
I run a 1x10 speed drivetrain with XTR cranks, XTR shifter, XTR derailleur and XT cassette and XT chain also paired with Hope chainring and jockey wheels and I've never had any chain slips. Brought the XTR bits second hand so it didn't cost me a fortune. If your on a budget but still wanna shred hard, I would recommend going full XT and possibly even SLX as its still superb quality and requires little maintenance however I would swap out the shifter for an XTR one because of the grip feel on the levers and it also requires around 30% less force to shift! Even if you went full Deore, I would still combine it with the XTR shifter, it makes shifting very crisp. Trust me its worth it!
I’ve had full XT on every ride including brakes. Now I’m digging the trickledown tech to save money in some places and everything works together. I think if I was in the market I would go for SLX with the XT shifter and cassette.
Great comparison video. You guys rock. But, you forgot to mention the index finger shifting(pull or push for harder gear) My XT has it, but I’m not sure if SLX and Deore do. It’s something I learned after 4 months of ownership and it’s great!
I'm a big Clydesdale 255-270 depending on the season. XT is all I can use I've crushed SLX cassettes in about 100 miles or so. I do ride all levels of trails.I an currently running a 1x11XT setup and am very surprised how long it has lasted I'm on my second season with it. Shifts very well even when muddy very happy with it.
My bike is around 15 years old. It has XTR. The low end Shimano looks better than my old high end. You should do a time progression of the XTR shifters.
Great information! One thing not mentioned in this video is the durability of each groupset. Are they also more durable as you move up to better groupsets? and if so can that help to justify the price increases if you don't need to replace parts as frequently?
@@paulwhat322 that was the GOLD Answer i was waiting for!! Thank you so much! You made me finally get the point for a decision. So I will stay on XT rather than changing to XTR for less weight because as you mentioned XT is the more durable one ! ❤️
@@Fitnesstrainingpersonaltv You are welcome!👍😁. I mean XTR is beautiful stuff and often the focus of my fantasy lol🤣, but with what I've seen and heard it's all about weight saving which a few grams make a difference in a professional race, but seems that in normal use xt is slightly more robust and durable. The important thing is to get out there and ride. Whatever you are on😉👍👍 Enjoy and good luck!
The longest life has an deore and SLX groupset. XT and XTR are lighter but are made of softer materials. So you have to replace the higher sets (cassette, chain, chainring) more often than on the deore and SLX groupsets. Have a look on here th-cam.com/video/Xz3RI4sgvQU/w-d-xo.html XTR cassette needs to get fixed by this guy to not remove the whole expensive cassette
I'd go Deore for the chain and derailleur, SLX for the cassette and crankset, and XT for the shifter. That looks like it would be the sweetspot in terms of weight & features for the price. Maybe I'd go for an XT cassette as well if I'm feeling spendy, that would save 120g. Great vid!
Nice to see that SLX cranks are still lighter than XT, (this trend goes back at least 2-3 generations.) And it still looks like a mix of SLX/XT is still a nice balance between cost and features. (I'm trying SRAM on my new build, but still running a XT/SLX/Saint/Zee mix on my 26" bike and 105/XT/SLX/Zee on my road bike.)
I would certainly mix and match parts as they are interchangable. I definitly would not pay extra on things like chains or cassettes where the cost to effect ratio is just so small. Also both are consumables, so I save in the long run. Regarding the derailleur, unscrewing three more screws to tune something that one tunes once in a blue moon is totally fine. no need to pay extra to get quick access. I would maybe pay up the extra to get that downshift feature of XT, but I would not go over SLX for the rest and not over DEORE for consumables...
I like the XT for my money and would consider an XTR rear cassette for the weight difference. I want to upgrade my Shimano 1x11 with XT 1x12 eventually. I'm glad they offer so many different levels and love that you can mix and match.
2:43 "The really high-end stuff vs the slightly less expensive stuff" Remember the "slightly less" expensive stuff is on $300 vs $1350 for XTR...I mere factor of 4.5. So there you have it, slightly less = 1/4.5. Ironically, I spend a ton of money on XTR components that I wore out from riding so hard when I was a young strong rider...but I didn't need it. Now I am old, slow, bitter with money I can't live up to that level of gear.
Deore for the beginner who has no idea if they will go hard core, but SLX for the average rider because you can up grade on shifter and derailer later on if wanted. If you race, defiantly XT and XTR. Great review.
I'll smoke any rider with XTR on my Deore. The difference in performance between the setups is so insignificant that there is no real value of having more expensive setup no matter if you are beginner or experienced rider.
WOW stopped by for a quick overview, and leaving with a Dr degree in drivetrains :) Thank you. Thinking about moving off my old setup to a new 12 gear setup. Maybe I need a new hub/rim for this....
Hell, I like the fact that he's got the Bourbon bottle behind him for decoration... lol. Looks like it's been tapped and some is missing too. Great, honest review!
XT shifter and XT jockey wheels with the XTR chain blended with the SLX drive train is for me the ideal setup ....I get that nice sharp double downshift and the jockey wheels bearings make the shifting just that little bit sharper when compared to the bushes on the Deore and SLX jockey wheels . And the XTR chain seems to last forever i got around 800/900 kilometers out of the Deore and SLX chains respectively and I have just over 1200kms on the XTR chain with barely any signs of stretch on it.
True, but I was surprised when I upgraded chains and felt a noticable difference. Biggest difference I ever felt in a single upgrade was going from 18t to 54t star ratchet on my 350 hubs.
@@topspot4834 new chains always feel like you have a brand new drivetrain in my experience. I’ve been spoiled my near instantaneous engagement. Hopping on a regular hub recently highlighted that to me.
@@biznatcho7 Can you elaborate on that please? What is a regular hub? And what did you switch from if you don't mind me asking? I'm an MTB newbie so I'm trying to understand all this better.
@@imranvp I didn't switch but I did ride a buddy's Ibis Logo hubs recently. Those are 36T hubs, so 10* of rotation between teeth (360* / 36T = 10*). That free rotation between teeth means that you will feel the pedals/cranks spin freely before the pawls engage and drive the rear wheel to get you going. There will also be a noticeable clunk. This will only be noticeable when starting from a standstill, pedaling again after slow speed coasting, ratcheting cranks through slow technical sections, etc. None of this is a big deal when you're first starting out (or ever for some people) but it can be noticeable if you're used to something with higher engagement (more teeth/less free rotation). In my case, I have i9 Hydras (0.5* or whatever) and Onyx Classics (0* due to sprag clutch instead of ratchet-pawl). Hope that helps.
Just ordered the 2021 ML Trek Fuel EX 8 XT in Rage Red to Dnister Black Fade colour. Can’t wait to receive & send it! Came here to learn about what’s on my new bike 😏
You get 2 shifts UP with xt vs SLX. And 3 clicks down rather than 2. Just switched the shifter over to an xt shifter from SLX a few weeks ago. Surprisingly big difference.
One small point, to add to a great video... Shimano parts generally come with a 2 year warranty but the top line XTR (& DuraAce) has a 3 year warranty. Not a big deal but it's a thing 👍
What a great video, I have a pretty hefty MTB, but I drive slow, and only on bikelanes (yes Im old now) I run a 42T front and a 10-25 tenspeed back, I drive slowly (backinjury so I need the slow Kadence). Please do a video on suspension sadel poles and handelbar rising options for a more upright seating position.
Do all of the cassettes require microspline? Will the 12 speed cassette fit an 11 speed freebody hub on any of these or do they all require a specific freebody?
Deore M4100(10s 11-46)/M5100(11s 11-51) are also available and for standard freehub. Or M6100 and Sunrace/SRAM 12s cassette If you don’t want to change freehub. Shimano released a Microspline freehub with the Deore 12 speed. FH-MT410/FH-MT410-B for about $/£30 and uses cartridge bearings. I had my wheel rebuilt using one of these until I buy a new wheel set
Awesome video! I have the deore set-up on my Kona... I've always thought it was the smoothest I've had, and wondered if it was even possible to have a better set-up!! The fact that you said they all shift like butter, makes me think about spending that money elsewhere on my bike now! Good stuff!!
Slx cassette, cranks and derailleur with an xt shifter, don’t want to spend lots on a derailleur as that can easily be broken and i don’t want to spend lots on a cassette as that will wear out and I’m not bothered about the wait or the cranks, they’re just cranks. But I do like the double shift on the xt. In my opinion this is the better value option if your doing a bike build, you can then spend more money on other stuff like suspension which will give you more of a benefit on the trail.
Interesting fact that would put weight into perspective for a lot of viewers...My iphone XR with case weighs approx 260grams.So roughly an iphone X difference between the xtr and deore cranks.(I now imagine a bunch of mtb geeks,like myself, holding there iphone in the palm of their hand weighing it up) That's quite a bit, if you're a weight weenie, which I can only hope to afford to be some day... I think about this as I'm geeking out on all this MTB shiz. Thanks Jeff. Love your reviews.
I use SLX groupset with XT shifter. Also I have drilled the cap thats covering the clutch, so I can access the bolt underneath, so I can adjust it quickly. Of course I covered the hole by tapping threads in the plastic and I 3d printed a screw which fits perfectly. I also added an O-ring to make sure no water is going inside the clutch. I really hate the cycling industry, since they can never justify their prices for what you get....
Total rookie here, just bought a 2020 Salsa Timberjack SLX. Specs state SLX,10-51t, 12 gears. I swear this thing allows me to down shifts 1, 2 or 3 gears, my choice. Based on this content what am i missing?!? My son loves his 510 shoes we got from you guys!!
Well this is kind of my fault. I say down shift and mean the chain going down the cassette into a harder gear. This is confusing because technically that is up, not down, in gear number and in automotive language I'm saying it backwards. But a lot people do this in cycling because down and down the cassette visually makes sense. Hope that helps 💩
HA! Still A rookie!! I say down as in down to an easer gear but i guess that’s wrong and i Promis I will work on what is true to MTB. But, what about the ability to single or triple (easier) shift!?!?! Totally willing to start with operator error, thanks!!
This is interesting. I am kind of old school, and I have older components in the Alivio and even Acera line which have three-gear downshift on one stroke. I’m sure there must be some reason why this is now considered a premium feature in higher end groups.
I have the XT on my bike...one thing I will say that I have noticed...the derailleur clutch system does get condensation either from the gasket or the flip cap quick access...mine was corroded in no time...so much that it locked up...so people that have that great feature on the XT and XTR...keep an eye on that
Yeah I don't get the limited shifts and then it's only 2? I could swear my old 90's XTR reversed 9 speed could do 3 as well. I just want that thing back.
That’s going down the gears, I think he said it the wrong way round, you can do lots of shifts down, from the little one to the bigger ones, but can do only on on up on SRAM stuff, 1-12
I just picked a new MTB, waiting for it to be delivered... It's got the full Deore 1x12 group set, and the more I read/see about it, the happier I am with the choice. I chose it over a Sram speced bike, because the gear ratios seem more usable to me (10x51 vs 11x50 on the similarly priced SX Eagle), and because it seems to be more compatible up in the range. It's all pretty amazing however, compared to only a couple of years ago when 1x12 was still elite stuff...
Flex in XTR, Dura-ace, Ultegra, XT/SLX, Campagnolo Record.. All the flex was gone when I moved to friction shifters. Being a road racer in the 80’s with friction shifters only, I have rediscovered the the ultra precision and foremost the ultra fast shifting with friction shifters. And the reliability - there are no parts that fan break or wear out in a friction shifter… and it is light. The experience is like going back from a modern Porsche with PDK to a analog Porsche without any driving nannies, or going from Spotift back to LP.
Brand new into MTB, just bought a 2021 Scott Genius 950. Came with all shimano deore gear, derailleur says "Deore XT" on it. I can double or triple shift with the thumb. No limitation on the shifter lever!
I just installed full XT M8100 Group and Brakes on my new bike with the SLX Chainring, liked the silver over the darker XT, minor difference for half the price. I then installed some of the 1x10 parts I took off onto my GFs new bike to get her off 2x Acera. So she is now running Deore M6000 Mech Sunrace 11-46 Cassette 10s Then I bought Deore M4100 shifter Deore M5100 Crank M6100 Brakes These replace M6000 Shifter (Ugly with display and M4100 integrates with I-Spec EV) Suntour Zeron Crank (heavy) Tekro HD-M276 (easier for me to maintain both sets of Shimano brakes without different bleed kits etc) I probably would’ve went New Deore 1x11 instead of XT if it wasn’t soooo slow to come into stock everywhere. Announced beginning of May and still everything not available in UK. Or trickles into stock in different European places or some hasn’t even come into stock yet.
@@wolver1n Yes. Every Sram drivetrain component is designed in Schweinfurt in germany. Sram bought a german drivetrain company a while back to gain the knowledge. Calling Sram american designed is bullshit. Nothing merican to be found there
One thing not mention in this video is that all four groups are cross-compatible. So you can spend on the shifter and derailleur to get XT or XTR, which have the additional features not present on SLX or Deore, and save on the cranks, chain and cassette. A great drivetrain from a cost/benefit perspective would go something like XTR shifter, XT derailleur, and Deore or SLX cranks, cassette and chain.
SLX has always been the one that is good enough in terms of durability and functionality to meet anyone's needs, where Deore has typically not been as durable, despite having great initial functionality. XTR was never aimed at anyone other than people who are likely to actually win races or who think others will be impressed by the size of their wallet. Even XT has some compromises that favour looks and weight over actual function. The only benefit with XT is that you get the latest functionality first. Once the other groups catch up it becomes pointless.
I just got the 10-11 speed deore derailleur for my hardtail because I didn't want to replace my rear hub to go 12 speed and I still had to order this older model from germany because it doesn't exist in my country. We literally have shimano distributors and they've never heard of their 1+ year old products. :) For the products I have nothing bad to say. I mean the stuff they replaced are 10+ year old Alivio parts and they went on my commuter bike because they still work flawlessly, I just wanted to upgrade to a clutch.
Protip: The XT shifter works on SLX and Deore, giving you double downshift capability (and nicer shift feel) on the cheaper groupsets.
Good tip. Getting an expensive cassette, chain (consumables) or rear derailleur (likely to break) just doesn’t make sense.
Aren't all the Shimano components cross compatible between groupsets as long as they're the same gear count?
@@isthisnametaken978 I'd say even beyond that..I use a zee derailleur in a 36 tooth cassette, which, although 10 speed like the derailleur, it shouldn't work because of the gap between cogs, but it's worked smooth for the last three years, plus, I use an altus 9 speed crank, and even with the bigger chainring pretty much destroyed for me using it as a bash guard it still works fine with and I never have chain dropping. Summing up, if you wanna follow the manual rules then the answer is not always (like zee components with bigger cassettes for instance) now if you don't mind experimenting a little, then you can even extrapolate that rule a little.
@@isthisnametaken978 At least one counter-example comes to mind: The latest Shimano Tiagra 4700 road groupset is 10 speed but has a different pull ratio than other/older 10 speed groupsets.
@@PedroHenrique-dn1dj I've been using zee m640 shifter paired with deore xt m786 derailleur, both 10 speed. Shifts without a problem, except some delay in shifting down from 8th to 7th gear. Probably because I had to tighten the b screw to accommodate the 42t cassette, larger than m786 was intended for. Or could be because it's a cheapo offbrand cassette from China. Or a combination of both. But I doubt it's because the zee/deore xt combo.
It's incredible how genuine and honest he is. Not pushing higher priced items. I seriously only want to buy from these guys after seeing these videos. Great work!
Thanks mate! I believe honesty is the best policy. I'm not here to BS people. 👊
They don't call him Honest Jeff for nothing
Chris Mitchell you have no idea. They are the most humble dudes EVER. During this pandemic they have been nothing short of AMAZING. I have purchased stuff from them in the past 2 months and will do even more in the future. Jeff is amazing and the dudes who work for them as well.
It's not always pushing the higher sale if they'll return it...
This video made me a customer of theirs.
After watching this video I ended up going SLX rather than XT and have some $ left over for several rounds of post ride beers (once we are safely able to do so). Thanks for being a man of the people!
I feel like the difference is night and day when you are shifting in real life applications with loads of torque. This is when for example the XT or XTR truly shine as you can shift while at full power and it doesn’t cause any problems which for me is a game changer
For competitions or as a sponsor bike ok i would agree otherwise for daily use the XTR doesn't make any sense with that price.. i get the upper quality materials are expensive but still one full XTR set costing 4x Deore sets is insane : like i could have 4 different fully Deore equipped bikes or one bike fully equipped with Deore set and still 3 full sets as spares to replace.. just say'n regarding XTR price, so in my case for double switching thru gears i would really get XT shifters +rear deraylor and everything else Deore since they are compatible and still benefit of the 2x faster nicer shift feel. brakes in my case i got full set front +rear Magura MT7 - with 4 pistons they work awesome.. so yeah..
Youre crap is probably not adjusted correctly. For the average rider an slx or max xt is acceptable
@@serafinlagunas yeah you’re totally right. XT is perfect
the R in XTR stands for Rich!
😂 Probably!
Either that or race
Xpensive To Replace
@@scottpatterson8289 SLX - slightly less xpensive
Actuality it means, eXTraRich! See what I done there?🙃🤣
I don`t race and I have a family to support so the Deore stuff looks just right for someone who only rides for fun and does not give a crap about MTB snobs.
Ain’t that the truth! I am lucky enough that I can ride almost every day of the week.
I am rocking a budget build, got about $700 in it right now. SLX brakes, used XT homemade 1x10 drivetrain, no name rims with Shimano hubs, midrange suntour fork, etc....
It never fails to put a slightly sadistic smile on my face when I pass people on their high end full sus carbon frame bikes.
But then I realize that they’re just out there riding also, having probably just as much fun as I am and I’m just being a judgemental asshole. Who am I to judge their 8k bike. I would ride it if I could afford it, lol.
@@nasonguycouldn't agree more
@Phillip Connolly Keep the rubber side down buddy!
Ironic that you rae the only snob here lol
I am a noob in biking but 60 yrs old with little time and a bit of $ ... I bought the xtr and never look back. Snob ? Dun think so, I ride alone and no wish to wonder why not xtr in the 1st place. Safe biking ! 🙏
I’ve got a xt shifter derailed slx cassett and cranks works amazingly
Get the Deore and spend the saved money on a high end fork instead.
Or treat your other half so you can ride anytime you want :D
@@mazditzo works best if she really wants a Garmin watch and the watch is already in the mail when you order a new bike!
Yup, Get Deore with XT shifter, spend the money you save on other upgrades.
*get cheap suspensions components (a base model to serve as a chassis) and made them custom tuned by someone (eg. avalanche). it will be faaar better than anything fancy, over marketing bullshited, heroin priced shit.
You don't need a high end fork you dunderheed .. you just need better riding skills ....dave yer money If you really want suspension that actually works .. Buy a Motorbike
I run for my shimano xt for almost 10 years and still kicking on a trail!
10 years 🤔 mmh...
I use the Deore cassette Bc the steel is more durable and xt derailleur and cranks and xtr shifter
That’s a rad combo!
So you use the cheapest component that makes the biggest difference in performance? They all shift the same but feel is only 10% difference at most. But the cassette is the biggest tangible difference because it's so much heavier
I'd use SRAM NX cassette instead. Not only it is more durable but also compatible with Shimano HG. Missed opportunity here by Shimano
Ivo Roilev I have a micro spline hub thought and the range is 1 tooth less
@@roilev shimanos 5100 cassette is 11-51teeth and compatible with the old hg freehub. 11 speed though
I really appreciate that you took the time to measure the parts yourself and avoid doing mistakes this way. Really nice video.
Definitely the best comparison of different groupset and their prices with the best most transparent feedback 👍👍👍
Thanks! Glad you liked it.
As a bike tech, yes you can see the quality differences when you tune the bike. However, SLX and Deore run so well, and if you could ride blindfolded, the only difference between these is how they sound shifting and the double trigger downshift. Absolutely love the quality of Deore, definitely worth it over Sram SX and even NX
The SLX and XT shifter also has 'instant release' - It drops the cog when you press, not when you release.
If is minor, but adds to a snappy feel.
Plus the weight difference
One of the best review I've ever watched. Very detailed and well organized when it comes to comparing.
Would like to see the brake sets compared
We basically did that and more in this video in article - www.worldwidecyclery.com/blogs/worldwide-cyclery-blog/sram-vs-shimano-brake-buyers-guide-the-ultimate-comparison-video
so from my own personal experience, SLX 4 pistons are amazingly good, only thing XT gets you is a small weight reduction.
@@mrvwbug4423 That's what i take from it. If I'm not mistaken the calipers are the same throughout the range, the difference being the external finish.
On older models, XT and XTR allows instant shifter release, meaning the chain drops right after the shifter lever is pressed before returning, but Deore shifter lever has to return before chain drops. Something to note and I got the XT for this reason.
You guys rock! Thanks for all the great content. Cant wait to see you evaluate and breakdown SRAM’s Eagle lineup of XX1, XO1, GX, NX, SX, XX1 AXS, and XO1 AXS !
It's coming!
Can’t wait!!!!!!! I had no doubt you guys were!
@@aamgdp you sure about that?
@@WorldwideCyclery that's what she said.
After 3 months on a new Giant Trance X Pro 0, just stumbled across this video which has helped me learn 1: That my XT shifters have double downshifting (to a harder gear) using your thumb, but only single using your index finger (didn't realise there was double shifting but noticed that it only does that with your thumb). 2: XT shifters have a triple upshifting with your thumb. 3: There is a clutch on the XTR derailleur to make it easier to take the back wheel off. Thanks for the video. Super useful.
XT has always been my go-to drive-train and preferably the complete bike fitted like this. However in my newest bike I am actually mixing and matching components and it’s been interesting. Front meg is Deore. Rear meg is XTR. Breaks levers and calibers are Deore but shifters XT because of their added functionality and crisp feel.
My honest opinion is that Shimano is over complicating things. Deore is fine for most, but bikesnobs like me ride XT (because it’s cooler and because we finally can afford it and a set of carbon wheels) XT is a hell of a nice group set. XTR are for pros where seconds matter. SLX to me is the odd one out, just like the 105. Almost but not really...
I think the SLX does an important job. It allows a beginner to choose to go low-cost on the first hand (Deore) or to spend a little more (SLX), just to show some extra commitment, reflecting the own positive expectations about the new hobby. On the other hand, same goes for most routined riders, not those few likely to go for XTR: Choice between XT (best with still reasonable price point) or budget-friendly, but more than decent (and not beginner model) SLX.
Having such options to choose makes customers happy, and happy customers buy stuff.
Yes I agree. The XT shifter in particular is worth it, it also has the rubber bits on the shifter grips
@@andreaslange8256 Shimano clearly must succeed greatly with their strategy, since they would not be doing it if it didn't pay off. How ever I am not sure consumers are benefitting. Huge production and developing costs lays hidden in having to produce so many different components and I think Deore and XT could both become more affordable IF the development of SLX was cut out. I do how ever find Shimano a democratic and fair company in the sense that they have allowed compatibility within the whole Deore Eco-system. That in itself is quite amazing that you can mix from all tiers of their product range and not have to commit exclusively to one group-set. Smart choice undoubtedly as it gives customers the option to upgrade and bike shops the possibly downgrade and flash a high-end rear meg to make the whole package seem greater value. That along with a set of entry level tires (which in my humble opinion should be banned as they are waste of money) and we're in business!
No I would definitely say deore is the odd man out. Best bang for your buck is slx groupset with an XT shifter. I wouldn't let deore touch anything SLX and above.
Weight comparison normally comes with a total weight difference !!
Maybe you can put it up in the description .Because thats important.
Thanks a lot for talking through the parts individually,but the big picture would be the difference in total.
deore 4216
slx 4262 + 46
xt 4127 - 89 vs deore (- 135 vs SLX)
xtr 3582 - 634 vs deore
Now drink a bit more than half a litre of water before starting and the weight is same like Deore starting thirsty ; )
I can say from experience the ‘feel’ between the groups is the biggest change between them outside of the weight. Crispy shifts are important for quick riding. The SLX and Deore can feel plastic-like and kind of hollow. Whereas the XT & XTR is actuated almost immediately with a firm click of the shifter. It can be related to manual transmissions between cars that are basic daily drivers, and sports cars or ones with a short throw shifter. In a sporty / aggressive situation, you’re gonna want those immediate, quick and crispy shifts!!
That immediate and smooth actuation of the derailleur can be achieved on those cheaper ones too, but it requires a lot more maintenance to keep it that smoothly because they're made to less tight tolerances... there's more drift, so you need to readjust things more often and perfect lubrication plays a way bigger role compared to the higher end ones.
Wow here was me thinking it was technical ability and fitness. Guess I’ll be the next Amaury or Nino when I get xtr. Unless you are like top 10 nationally or regionally and race seriously you are just doing it for bling factor. Even if you are you would get it handed to you by a world class rider. So let be honest you are just buying bling and maybe the real difference is a lack of ability, which is sweet but don’t pretend you need the performance. Your not that good you might save 1/100of a second .
100% agree with your shifter analogy. A lot of people seem to think theres no different between the different levels but I absolutely seem to notice the feel, sturdiness, responsiveness, and overall quality of the XT compared to something like Deore or SLX. Those are still great groupsets but for the small price increase to go to XT, its definitely worth it in my opinion.
Shimano is absolutely brilliant. I have full XTR and it is the best shifting ever! XTR is a masterpiece! And thank you shimano for never ever going carbon for your cranks! You obviously know what you are doing. If you have the money go with XTR. Absolutely beautiful shifting, durability and looks!
I'm loving my Shimano XT 2×12 groupset on my bikepacking mountain bike 👍
2x group sets get bashed a lot but not all of us want a 1x, not everyone wanted less gears for less complexity. It’s a preference thing
Awesome video Jeff and all at WWC! I’ve been wondering about the differences between the tiers and this comparison knocked it out of the park
I run a SLX 11s set with the XT shifter ( 4 down/ 4 up) and loving it.
You get 4 gears with a lever push?
Shimano seems to refer to these as; Doere, SLX, "Deore XT", & XTR. Throwing the "Deore" in on the XT name feels like Shimano is actively trying to confuse us.
Thank God for WWC for helping demystify this stuff!
Dude! Don't get me started on confusing BS Shimano does. Have you looked at the part numbers and shifter / brake lever mounting terms and variants?! 😂🤦♂️
SLX used to be Deore LX. So it used to be worse.
In the 90 ties they were all „deore“ and there also was a DX
I love my 1x11 slx m7000 groupset. I pieced it together over a few weeks for about $260.
2x11 XT here. Shifts smooth as butter. Scored the entire groupset with brakes for $625.
I am a budget mountain biker so I do get lower end components . A chain guide eliminates chain drop for the most part . I run my clutch looser than the factory setting . I run the Deor sgs 10 speed and Its ok for climbing capacity but on those longer steep climbs is difficult . I did not want spend the money to upgrade to a 12 speed so I went from 30 tooth to 28 tooth chain ring . I changed my cassette from a 11/42 to 11/46 and was surprised that I did not need a derailleur extender and shifts good with a Chinese cassette . So the upgrade was about $ 70 that is efficient and adequate for my budget hardtail and is close to a 12 speed capacity in the biggest cog . To me it doesnt make sense to put high end components on a budget bike
Which Shimano drivetrain would you run on your bike?
Btw, we have a SRAM version of this same comparison: th-cam.com/video/9JmU5r5T_WU/w-d-xo.html
Worldwide Cyclery the one they put on Walmart bikes
Xt or slx
XT because of the number of clicks to change the gears and the clutch adjustment, also price for me 🤘🏻
Mix of Deore and SLX, May have to get that XT Shifter for double upshifts.
ride whatever comes on my bike then upgrade to xt when ive used stuff for a year or so
Yep, definitely best bike shop ever doesn’t just sell bikes but also give us all the updates/information we need to know about.
Now this is a detailed review. As always perfect explanation.
I have an SLX drivetrain on a FS XC 29 Alloy Bike. It's perfect for my style and riding on dutch flat and smooth trails. Just ride for fun and keep myself healthy and fit. Great vids guys. Keeps me updated with al the cool stuff out there.
SLX is the sweet spot for me. Great quality for a cheap price.
Deore cassette Ftw Bc it’s steel and stronger. Then again I have an emtb so I’m not counting grams by any means..
There is also the new Shimano Deore M5100 which was released at the same time as Deore M6000 and flew under most peoples radar. It's a 11spd 11-51t cassette groupset which fits on a standard shimano freehub. I think they are meant for OEM bike builders but you can get the full set for $200 on Ebay or you could save $50, drop the cranks and buy a narrow-wide chainring to put on your existing cranks. You miss out on the 10t top gear, one less gear and no hyperglide+ compared to M6000 but if you want to upgrade to a 1x wide range cassette transmission on a budget (particularly since you don't need a new microspine freehub as well), then this is a good choice. I have just fitted mine and it's working great.
i did exactly that to upgrade my 1x11 XT from 11-42 cassette to 11-52 range. 100 euros for derailler + cassette
Greetings from Germany! You guys make quality content.
Excellent video for a newbie like myself who's been researching his next "value"bike and getting lost in the component woods...
Holy moly poo, seriously if you guys had a shop in England, i would spend my money with you even if i had to pay extra compared to others for the simple reason that, i like honest, well explained and fun. It's everything i haven't got anywhere near me. Ok, now i'm waiting for the next video😁
I run a 1x10 speed drivetrain with XTR cranks, XTR shifter, XTR derailleur and XT cassette and XT chain also paired with Hope chainring and jockey wheels and I've never had any chain slips. Brought the XTR bits second hand so it didn't cost me a fortune. If your on a budget but still wanna shred hard, I would recommend going full XT and possibly even SLX as its still superb quality and requires little maintenance however I would swap out the shifter for an XTR one because of the grip feel on the levers and it also requires around 30% less force to shift! Even if you went full Deore, I would still combine it with the XTR shifter, it makes shifting very crisp. Trust me its worth it!
I’ve had full XT on every ride including brakes. Now I’m digging the trickledown tech to save money in some places and everything works together. I think if I was in the market I would go for SLX with the XT shifter and cassette.
I'm using M6100 crankset, RD & shifter, mixed with M7100 cassette & chain.
Works like a charm. So smooth.
I am currently working on getting a SB130 with XT build.
Nice
Just bought Xt groupset this weekend!
I would really like a video about what are the difference between sram and shimano groupsets !!
Oh it's coming!
Main difference is sram is overpriced and feels clunkier.
Shimano is better. That's the main difference LOL.
Yuuup the difference is Sram is overpriced and feels smoother**
It would be great to see a xt vx gx! thanks
Thanks for this. Basically, one should get an SLX drivetrain with XT shifter. Best price/funct/weight ratio, imo.
Great comparison video. You guys rock. But, you forgot to mention the index finger shifting(pull or push for harder gear) My XT has it, but I’m not sure if SLX and Deore do. It’s something I learned after 4 months of ownership and it’s great!
Dual release. It’s only for XT and XTR.
2-way release is a feature of SLX, too. 👍🏼
I'm a big Clydesdale 255-270 depending on the season. XT is all I can use I've crushed SLX cassettes in about 100 miles or so. I do ride all levels of trails.I an currently running a 1x11XT setup and am very surprised how long it has lasted I'm on my second season with it. Shifts very well even when muddy very happy with it.
I don't race and just do casual day rides, naturally XTR is the choice :)
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
My bike is around 15 years old. It has XTR. The low end Shimano looks better than my old high end. You should do a time progression of the XTR shifters.
Old school equivalent of Deore LX, Deore DX, Deore XT and XTR
Best explanation I ever had about drivetrains
Great information! One thing not mentioned in this video is the durability of each groupset. Are they also more durable as you move up to better groupsets? and if so can that help to justify the price increases if you don't need to replace parts as frequently?
Yes!! But the opposite is true. Xtr is for racing and less durable than xt.
@@paulwhat322 that was the GOLD Answer i was waiting for!! Thank you so much! You made me finally get the point for a decision. So I will stay on XT rather than changing to XTR for less weight because as you mentioned XT is the more durable one ! ❤️
@@Fitnesstrainingpersonaltv You are welcome!👍😁. I mean XTR is beautiful stuff and often the focus of my fantasy lol🤣, but with what I've seen and heard it's all about weight saving which a few grams make a difference in a professional race, but seems that in normal use xt is slightly more robust and durable. The important thing is to get out there and ride. Whatever you are on😉👍👍 Enjoy and good luck!
The longest life has an deore and SLX groupset. XT and XTR are lighter but are made of softer materials. So you have to replace the higher sets (cassette, chain, chainring) more often than on the deore and SLX groupsets.
Have a look on here th-cam.com/video/Xz3RI4sgvQU/w-d-xo.html
XTR cassette needs to get fixed by this guy to not remove the whole expensive cassette
I'd go Deore for the chain and derailleur, SLX for the cassette and crankset, and XT for the shifter. That looks like it would be the sweetspot in terms of weight & features for the price. Maybe I'd go for an XT cassette as well if I'm feeling spendy, that would save 120g. Great vid!
why not everything for XT?
@@likeris2 money
@@Sutta92 I sold 350 Bitcoins 3 years ago and have no clue what to do with all that $$
@@IIISentorIII send me some
Nice to see that SLX cranks are still lighter than XT, (this trend goes back at least 2-3 generations.) And it still looks like a mix of SLX/XT is still a nice balance between cost and features. (I'm trying SRAM on my new build, but still running a XT/SLX/Saint/Zee mix on my 26" bike and 105/XT/SLX/Zee on my road bike.)
I would certainly mix and match parts as they are interchangable. I definitly would not pay extra on things like chains or cassettes where the cost to effect ratio is just so small. Also both are consumables, so I save in the long run.
Regarding the derailleur, unscrewing three more screws to tune something that one tunes once in a blue moon is totally fine. no need to pay extra to get quick access. I would maybe pay up the extra to get that downshift feature of XT, but I would not go over SLX for the rest and not over DEORE for consumables...
WWC tells me that shipping may be slower due to covid. I placed an order on friday and got it on Saturday (the next day... with free shipping)
Oohhh yeah baby 👊👊💩
I like the XT for my money and would consider an XTR rear cassette for the weight difference. I want to upgrade my Shimano 1x11 with XT 1x12 eventually. I'm glad they offer so many different levels and love that you can mix and match.
2:43 "The really high-end stuff vs the slightly less expensive stuff" Remember the "slightly less" expensive stuff is on $300 vs $1350 for XTR...I mere factor of 4.5. So there you have it, slightly less = 1/4.5. Ironically, I spend a ton of money on XTR components that I wore out from riding so hard when I was a young strong rider...but I didn't need it. Now I am old, slow, bitter with money I can't live up to that level of gear.
Deore for the beginner who has no idea if they will go hard core, but SLX for the average rider because you can up grade on shifter and derailer later on if wanted. If you race, defiantly XT and XTR. Great review.
I'll smoke any rider with XTR on my Deore. The difference in performance between the setups is so insignificant that there is no real value of having more expensive setup no matter if you are beginner or experienced rider.
8:17 Lg Gram to talk about the weights eh?
So happy someone noticed this 😂
WOW stopped by for a quick overview, and leaving with a Dr degree in drivetrains :) Thank you. Thinking about moving off my old setup to a new 12 gear setup. Maybe I need a new hub/rim for this....
Hell, I like the fact that he's got the Bourbon bottle behind him for decoration... lol. Looks like it's been tapped and some is missing too. Great, honest review!
XT shifter and XT jockey wheels with the XTR chain blended with the SLX drive train is for me the ideal setup ....I get that nice sharp double downshift and the jockey wheels bearings make the shifting just that little bit sharper when compared to the bushes on the Deore and SLX jockey wheels . And the XTR chain seems to last forever i got around 800/900 kilometers out of the Deore and SLX chains respectively and I have just over 1200kms on the XTR chain with barely any signs of stretch on it.
I'd argue that almost all of the 'feel' comes from the shifter.
True, but I was surprised when I upgraded chains and felt a noticable difference. Biggest difference I ever felt in a single upgrade was going from 18t to 54t star ratchet on my 350 hubs.
@@topspot4834 new chains always feel like you have a brand new drivetrain in my experience. I’ve been spoiled my near instantaneous engagement. Hopping on a regular hub recently highlighted that to me.
@@biznatcho7 Can you elaborate on that please? What is a regular hub? And what did you switch from if you don't mind me asking? I'm an MTB newbie so I'm trying to understand all this better.
@@imranvp I didn't switch but I did ride a buddy's Ibis Logo hubs recently. Those are 36T hubs, so 10* of rotation between teeth (360* / 36T = 10*). That free rotation between teeth means that you will feel the pedals/cranks spin freely before the pawls engage and drive the rear wheel to get you going. There will also be a noticeable clunk. This will only be noticeable when starting from a standstill, pedaling again after slow speed coasting, ratcheting cranks through slow technical sections, etc. None of this is a big deal when you're first starting out (or ever for some people) but it can be noticeable if you're used to something with higher engagement (more teeth/less free rotation). In my case, I have i9 Hydras (0.5* or whatever) and Onyx Classics (0* due to sprag clutch instead of ratchet-pawl). Hope that helps.
Just ordered the 2021 ML Trek Fuel EX 8 XT in Rage Red to Dnister Black Fade colour. Can’t wait to receive & send it! Came here to learn about what’s on my new bike 😏
Very interesting video. I just wonder about the durability of the components.
You get 2 shifts UP with xt vs SLX. And 3 clicks down rather than 2. Just switched the shifter over to an xt shifter from SLX a few weeks ago. Surprisingly big difference.
Push it a bit more should be 4 clicks on downshift, I can’t really push that far riding normally though, a bit too much of a stretch
who else misses the way the old XTR derailleur looks, with that gold clutch lever
One small point, to add to a great video... Shimano parts generally come with a 2 year warranty but the top line XTR (& DuraAce) has a 3 year warranty. Not a big deal but it's a thing 👍
I like how when he's talking about weight he pulls out an LG gram
What a great video, I have a pretty hefty MTB, but I drive slow, and only on bikelanes (yes Im old now) I run a 42T front and a 10-25 tenspeed back, I drive slowly (backinjury so I need the slow Kadence). Please do a video on suspension sadel poles and handelbar rising options for a more upright seating position.
yes its an electric MTB, I cant ride a normal bike, well so dos my back tell me.
Hope don’t make carbon cranks either. hmm new hope ally cranks and xtr 12spd on my bike would look nice.
Thx for the realistic and honest overview! 👍🏻
Do all of the cassettes require microspline? Will the 12 speed cassette fit an 11 speed freebody hub on any of these or do they all require a specific freebody?
All require microspline
Deore M4100(10s 11-46)/M5100(11s 11-51) are also available and for standard freehub. Or M6100 and Sunrace/SRAM 12s cassette If you don’t want to change freehub. Shimano released a Microspline freehub with the Deore 12 speed. FH-MT410/FH-MT410-B for about $/£30 and uses cartridge bearings. I had my wheel rebuilt using one of these until I buy a new wheel set
You can use SRAM NX cassette, it works with retro shimano (unlike shimano).
You can get a 12 speed sunrace cassette that will work
Awesome video! I have the deore set-up on my Kona... I've always thought it was the smoothest I've had, and wondered if it was even possible to have a better set-up!! The fact that you said they all shift like butter, makes me think about spending that money elsewhere on my bike now! Good stuff!!
Slx cassette, cranks and derailleur with an xt shifter, don’t want to spend lots on a derailleur as that can easily be broken and i don’t want to spend lots on a cassette as that will wear out and I’m not bothered about the wait or the cranks, they’re just cranks. But I do like the double shift on the xt. In my opinion this is the better value option if your doing a bike build, you can then spend more money on other stuff like suspension which will give you more of a benefit on the trail.
Hey nice thoughts. Still building my bike here. I will try your build
Currently riding this set up and its great!
Interesting fact that would put weight into perspective for a lot of viewers...My iphone XR with case weighs approx 260grams.So roughly an iphone X difference between the xtr and deore cranks.(I now imagine a bunch of mtb geeks,like myself, holding there iphone in the palm of their hand weighing it up) That's quite a bit, if you're a weight weenie, which I can only hope to afford to be some day... I think about this as I'm geeking out on all this MTB shiz. Thanks Jeff. Love your reviews.
So now we know what to do. Save yourself a lot of money by leaving your phone at home!
Thanks for the breakdown fellas!
XTR and XT have ball bearings on the derailleur pulley wheels. You can buy them separately and slap them on your Deore or SLX.
With xt you can actually drop 3 gears if you use both thumb and index shifter.2 thumb push and 1 index pull on its way back.😉👍
Could you record a video how to do that? Would be useful for many people
Thx WC,I have been always confused about the different Shimano drivetrains..
I use SLX groupset with XT shifter.
Also I have drilled the cap thats covering the clutch, so I can access the bolt underneath, so I can adjust it quickly. Of course I covered the hole by tapping threads in the plastic and I 3d printed a screw which fits perfectly. I also added an O-ring to make sure no water is going inside the clutch.
I really hate the cycling industry, since they can never justify their prices for what you get....
Total rookie here, just bought a 2020 Salsa Timberjack SLX. Specs state SLX,10-51t, 12 gears. I swear this thing allows me to down shifts 1, 2 or 3 gears, my choice. Based on this content what am i missing?!? My son loves his 510 shoes we got from you guys!!
Well this is kind of my fault. I say down shift and mean the chain going down the cassette into a harder gear. This is confusing because technically that is up, not down, in gear number and in automotive language I'm saying it backwards. But a lot people do this in cycling because down and down the cassette visually makes sense. Hope that helps 💩
HA! Still A rookie!! I say down as in down to an easer gear but i guess that’s wrong and i Promis I will work on what is true to MTB. But, what about the ability to single or triple (easier) shift!?!?! Totally willing to start with operator error, thanks!!
perfect just what I was after
could u do one on for or rockshox levels please
XT for life...thanks for putting this together!
Thank you so much for this video
This is interesting. I am kind of old school, and I have older components in the Alivio and even Acera line which have three-gear downshift on one stroke. I’m sure there must be some reason why this is now considered a premium feature in higher end groups.
You're absolutely right about the multiple shifting feature, it's nothing new at all ...
I know they make great fishing products, are they new to the bike industry???
No they have been making bike stuff for 50 years
I didn't even know they made fishing products until last month.
I have the XT on my bike...one thing I will say that I have noticed...the derailleur clutch system does get condensation either from the gasket or the flip cap quick access...mine was corroded in no time...so much that it locked up...so people that have that great feature on the XT and XTR...keep an eye on that
My 2006 Sram X0 downshifts 3 gears at a time
Yeah I don't get the limited shifts and then it's only 2? I could swear my old 90's XTR reversed 9 speed could do 3 as well. I just want that thing back.
That’s going down the gears, I think he said it the wrong way round, you can do lots of shifts down, from the little one to the bigger ones, but can do only on on up on SRAM stuff, 1-12
You can go down 3, and up 2.
Eagle can go down 5 and up 1.
Eagle Grip shift can go 11 up and 11 down
I just picked a new MTB, waiting for it to be delivered... It's got the full Deore 1x12 group set, and the more I read/see about it, the happier I am with the choice. I chose it over a Sram speced bike, because the gear ratios seem more usable to me (10x51 vs 11x50 on the similarly priced SX Eagle), and because it seems to be more compatible up in the range. It's all pretty amazing however, compared to only a couple of years ago when 1x12 was still elite stuff...
Excellent video but I support Sram!
Flex in XTR, Dura-ace, Ultegra, XT/SLX, Campagnolo Record.. All the flex was gone when I moved to friction shifters. Being a road racer in the 80’s with friction shifters only, I have rediscovered the the ultra precision and foremost the ultra fast shifting with friction shifters. And the reliability - there are no parts that fan break or wear out in a friction shifter… and it is light. The experience is like going back from a modern Porsche with PDK to a analog Porsche without any driving nannies, or going from Spotift back to LP.
Looking at the Stand box in the background and now I am hungry :/ GIMMIE ONE OF THOSE BURGERS
Brand new into MTB, just bought a 2021 Scott Genius 950. Came with all shimano deore gear, derailleur says "Deore XT" on it. I can double or triple shift with the thumb. No limitation on the shifter lever!
I’m confused, I thought Deore was the name of their drivetrains like “Deore xt m8100”
Faz5HD imagine the XT as a Deore Pro, no idea why they still keep Deore in the XT brand name
I just installed full XT M8100 Group and Brakes on my new bike with the SLX Chainring, liked the silver over the darker XT, minor difference for half the price.
I then installed some of the 1x10 parts I took off onto my GFs new bike to get her off 2x Acera.
So she is now running
Deore M6000 Mech
Sunrace 11-46 Cassette 10s
Then I bought
Deore M4100 shifter
Deore M5100 Crank
M6100 Brakes
These replace M6000 Shifter (Ugly with display and M4100 integrates with I-Spec EV)
Suntour Zeron Crank (heavy)
Tekro HD-M276 (easier for me to maintain both sets of Shimano brakes without different bleed kits etc)
I probably would’ve went New Deore 1x11 instead of XT if it wasn’t soooo slow to come into stock everywhere. Announced beginning of May and still everything not available in UK. Or trickles into stock in different European places or some hasn’t even come into stock yet.
Only 'MERICAN designed, Chinese built, drivetrains touch my Taiwanese carbon bike. 'Merica! SRAM for life!
😂
isn't sram designed in germany?
@@wolver1n Yes. Every Sram drivetrain component is designed in Schweinfurt in germany. Sram bought a german drivetrain company a while back to gain the knowledge. Calling Sram american designed is bullshit. Nothing merican to be found there
@@erikherrenbauer4398 They bought Sachs in 1997 and replaced their name around 2000.
One thing not mention in this video is that all four groups are cross-compatible. So you can spend on the shifter and derailleur to get XT or XTR, which have the additional features not present on SLX or Deore, and save on the cranks, chain and cassette. A great drivetrain from a cost/benefit perspective would go something like XTR shifter, XT derailleur, and Deore or SLX cranks, cassette and chain.
SLX has always been the one that is good enough in terms of durability and functionality to meet anyone's needs, where Deore has typically not been as durable, despite having great initial functionality. XTR was never aimed at anyone other than people who are likely to actually win races or who think others will be impressed by the size of their wallet. Even XT has some compromises that favour looks and weight over actual function. The only benefit with XT is that you get the latest functionality first. Once the other groups catch up it becomes pointless.
I just got the 10-11 speed deore derailleur for my hardtail because I didn't want to replace my rear hub to go 12 speed and I still had to order this older model from germany because it doesn't exist in my country. We literally have shimano distributors and they've never heard of their 1+ year old products. :)
For the products I have nothing bad to say. I mean the stuff they replaced are 10+ year old Alivio parts and they went on my commuter bike because they still work flawlessly, I just wanted to upgrade to a clutch.