Funny, to listen to the two of you speak about eyesight. My central sight of 20/800 twice legally blind,also color blind to the colors green and red. Leaves me laughing. My eyesight without a doubt,a gift and blessing, as I get a different view from most. I have first hand knowledge of our amazing ability to adapt. My peripheral eyesight is intact, it picks up color, something it is not designed to do, and it has forced me to accept or develop trust in it, that what I see with my peripheral eyesight is indeed there, as I might turn my head to use my central sight, there is more than a very good chance I will not see it. My eyesight gift, is termed Progressive Cone Dystrophy. I thank God for technology in the form of my magnifier, so I may read books. Listening to this podcast is indeed a pleasure, and I thank you so much. Keep up the great work !!! And I thank God for this beautiful life !!! Bless you all.
Lol, no. I think these kinds of talks are interesting for sure, but interesting more in an intelligence increasing than wisdom increasing manner. His most wisdom increasing discussions on religion are his best works. It's great to hear this other guy go on and on about zoocentrism and realizing footsteps may be in the inspiration for cadence in music etc, but what does that do to get you out of bed in the morning? How does knowing that alphabets are largely derived from angles found in nature help you to move forward in life when you're faced with a loss or extreme adversity? Again, I found this conversation interesting, I'm sure I'll purchase this guest's book(s) and share the information I find inside them as interesting idle chat with people. But I certainly wouldn't label these kinds of discussions as 'Peterson at his best'.
JBP, you've been kicking butt at these interviews recently. Thanks for giving guests ample space to speak and share their full thoughts - we really appreciate it. I'm digging into Those Who Wrestle this week!
Dearest Dr. Peterson, I just saw your latest conversation with Piers Morgan. I cried with you. If I had been there with you I would have put my arms around you and comforted you. I’m good at comforting people. That’s my gift. The loss of your precious mum and dad won’t always hurt like it does now. Their memories will forever be for a blessing to you. I think it’s very healthy that you were able to open up a bit to Piers, and that could ease your heart a bit. I am so keenly looking forward to the Gospels series. Here is a gentle hug And Ruth Anne’s love
Humanity is the designer of the intelligence we pass down from generation to generation. Thanks to the insights of those who came before us, you become what you are, for you are the designer of your own cognitive intelligence.
One of the things that blows my mind about language is that, it evolved not that long ago, but we're so damn GOOD at it. To use a specific example from my own life, one time I tried a magic-mushroom-infused chocolate bar. The physical and visual hallucinations were _intense._ And yet I'm at my keyboard, able to type the whole time and describe how insanely haywire all my body's systems are going. That seemed impossible to me. Yeah, it was as difficult as walking across a boat deck on choppy water, but _I could do it._ It was easier than _walking._ How is language that deep in us!?
consider that it may be because you practiced it every day from when u were born it might also be true that language is deeply embedded in human brains. i mean that is evidently true. but it doesn’t need to be as deeply embedded as we often say all the infant needs is to be receptive to learning (maybe a proclivity to grammar) but i wonder if our affinity for language is less in the “nature” and more in the “nurture.” is there any other single skill you practice every single day of your entire life? elementary school really only teaches language if humans were handed a little piano at age 2 and practiced it every single day of their lives incessantly, and everyone around them was practicing constantly, it would reason that you’d take some mushrooms and magically be able to play fluent piano and wonder (in piano terms) “how is this so deeply ingrained?” the better question may be “after practicing something for tens of thousands of hours, how could it *not* be so deeply ingrained?
Sir, I grew up in Calgary during the Cuban Mistle Crisis. There were air raid sirens, timed drills for students to get home and shelters in schools. People were terrified and I recall my mother crying at one stage. What has changed? The situation seems much more dire than it was at that time, yet folks in North America seem to not even give this a thought or concern. Has mankind become so numb that this inevitability seems certain?
Trump has won. Putin doesn't want nuclear war (watch the Tucker Carlson interview) and he'll probably negotiate with Trump to keep Crimea, the Donbas and parts of eastern Ukraine in return for peace, is my interpretation. Already, the war in Israel has stopped. Don't despair, for we shall have peace once again!
@@djsaltarelli I don't think limiting the expressive musculature in ones face using neurotoxins is a good idea. Some of those muscles mainly work to express negative emotions, but these have thier important time and place.
In music I think the beat also mimicks the heartbeat, not just gait or steps, a sound which a fetus will hear as soon as his inner ear and neuronal network are developed enough to do so. The baby will also hear the mother's digestive system, her blood rushing, and her voice. Those are also sounds of our environment that may be more deeply engrained than any others.
I agree...so odd, I haven't been getting alerts either, and I re clicked before I even saw your comment. You tube is doing something like censorship again I fear.
Fascinating topic and one of the most important ones in my opinion. Evolutionary psychology is so underrated and had no idea that evolutionary biologist saw no meaning in understanding purpose in a deconstructive way. It is fundamental to understand how we evolved since we then understand what environment human body and mind flourishes. And also may give us hints to why we are so discontent in the modern society. Modern society and humans are like putting a round cube in a triangle. Just won't work.
“You are a rainbow” a book from Dolly Parton’s imagination library book delivery is one of my favorites talking about how all emotions are important and when balanced even anger and sadness and fear have their places and are important to be able to love and respect even though they are the less desirable emotions it doesn’t make them less valuable. They are very important to our expansion and healing. And by getting to know all your emotions and how they affect you and what brings them forth you can have a deeper understanding on how you can better show up for yourself and set boundaries for yourself to have successful relationships.
1:13:44 I agree. IMO (about comments) people in general forget who these vitriolic comments come from. We don’t know. But they’re not from anyone that matters. Are we talking abt someone who is completely blotto or high on something or need to vent bc they can’t take it out on anyone? What’s their age, educational background or experience? There needs to be more talk about those facts . Trolling is real, but I think there’s too much emphasis put on them. Most comments are just thoughts people have that wouldn’t normally be voiced in person to your face. Maybe some would, but the majority, no. They love hiding out and getting displaced attention tho. It’s not normal, but people get away with it bc there’s no serious ramifications.
Why would you challenge the alfa mail wolf. If we are talking on the podcast how much the republicans had done and how good they are....the most shity disgusting comments will be coming from Democrats anonymously. That's how it works in Europe and all around the world
Your intriguing post got me to thinking of the men of a tribe catching their dinner for the night on some grassy African plain in the days when humans were still wild. First they travel at a slow run though the long grass in a column about 3 men wide, spears in hand to where they hear game. When they encounter the lions they swing round, keeping formation and together roar louder than any lion while charging towards them. (The lions see one huge animal and scatter.) With the lions at bay and at a fast run, they advance on the game forcing them to flee. The best runners select the dinner then, doing what humans uniquely can do, long distance running, they run the animal to the ground, an easy kill. On a good day, the lions stay near the herd. (If a lion did catch a skinny human, he'd quickly learn that he wouldn't get much to eat.) I'm hoping, In my comment, to provide a backdrop to where, I think, the complex human abilities, so well described, first became manifest. Of course humans warring against humans would add a layer to the one above.
According to a person who mainly studied gorillas, humans have easily the least amount of biomass in their anatomy devoted to eating and digestion of any vertebrate, an evolution enabled by cooking (which tremendously increases available nutrients.) Anatomy that is less constrained by limited nutrition is freed to evolve in other ways, such as those things needed for chewing and swallowing {and breathing) being elaborated into making more complex sounds signifying more things, and a brain freed to remember and generate the sound behaviors with their significance. Cooking, of course, is a behavior too, and one which no other creature has managed, which must be due to something our brains can do that others cannot, possibly because other creatures brains are constrained to more imperative needs exactly by lacking cooking behavior. Cooking leads to an increasingly differentiated brain development, eventually leading to language. Cooking drives brain development. Cooking has to come before language. In this conversation, they are taking language as what drove human brain evolution, which is traditional, although the guest is otherwise very untraditional. Surprising. In very old-timey books (1800), what distinguished man from the beasts was speaking, not especially tool-making, and definitely not cooking.
I love this, I wish I had had a chance to study this subject, I understand it all so clearly and have thought through some of Marks theories/conclusions. Thank you so much for sharing these wonderful conversations Dr Peterson
I'm not sold on Peterson's anti anonymity stance, however I vaguely understand his concerns. Given the HR anti truth world we live in, I can never support removing individuality protections. However, I'm fully behind banning children from the internet and am well academically qualified on the issue. I understand what mass media does to children, I also understand there are clear age cutoffs between the internet dealing permenant damage to your brain and just upsetting you.
Thank you for this interesting conversation. It crossed my mind before to think that language evolved from expressing emotions and as breath and muscles are involved the soumds uttered resonate in different sound pitches and length. Very interesting indeed. Lets befriend the this gentleman. Covid reactions, that's a topic of itself. All the best Mr Changizi.
This potential connection between color vision, emotional detection, facial cues, and detection of eye movement in others-it all makes me wonder if the manifestations of Autism Spectrum Disorder have something to do with visual/color processing. I am on the spectrum, and I’ve noticed that I often interpret neutral faces as hostile and that eye contact feels extremely uncomfortable. This could explain many common quirks of autistic individuals, including visual fascinations.
54:52 the poker analogy is very good. I'd like to hear about spades, because then not only are you signaling to your opponent who you might want to fool, but also to your partner who you definitely want to understand what you are doing. Makes it exponentially more complex I think.
really liked the point about music imitating human movement -- my personal hypothesis is that we enjoy music as the beats of song remind us of our mother's heartbeat in utero, which makes a one day testable prediction: that test tube babies might have a different relation to music, such as if they still like music they may prefer beat-less music
41:00 Forward facing seems like it is a factor in being able to predict, and become proactive instead of the rabbit reactive. It showed the ability to know what is to come without total focus on what is right in front. Is the ability to understand future.
22:56 Hi I have red green color deficiency and what a lot of people don't understand is we can actually see red and green albeit to a lesser degree at the least we can tell the difference between the normal shade of your face and a different shade of your face. From what I was told its a way to distinguish the shapes of predators that may use color camouflage to blend into foliage or grassy fields which would make sense Given our primate background.
"The moral of coronavirus19 will be that social contagion via social networks is more dangerous than biological contagion." -Mark Changizi, Mar. 17th, 2020 Mark was there from DAY ONE.
Yep -- While the brilliant C. JUNG was there over 75+ years ago! "We are on guard against contagious diseases of the body, but we are careless when it comes to the even more dangerous collective diseases of the mind." - Carl Jung
Very interesting discussion. I find myself going back to an on going thought experiment I like to do. I imagine creating an alien world, but make it as realistic as I can knowing how things evolved for us. For example, houses made of brick, basically just crushed stone, windows from glass that's just liquified sand commonly found, slopped roofs to stop the rain, etc etc. The world ends up looking a lot like ours. I found the part of this discussion about languages and the sounds they make can make another layer of this world. If we built our languages off of natural sounds, like Sssss, then it's logical to think aliens would do the same. So maybe they wouldn't sound too different from us as well.
1:20 Having followed the public evidence of your trials and tribulations these last seven-plus years, it's fantastically gratifying to see you doing so well. I'm in "X jail," for carelessly suggesting an English police department drop into a state of being the opposite of a steady-state of well-being, after they posted a warning that British people would be found and arrested for "liking" or sharing an unflattering post about some politician over there. I was a very naughty boy. 😢
wow, Thanks Mark, and ty Mr J for the openess on the subject. Try searching for these types of trolls in young and adolscent maies, I feel a lot of them is just under that categody, most of adult ones are already busted as twisted, resentful and malicious ...
"If you have a dominant eye." As a shooting sports instructor: the number of people w/o a dominant eye is vanishingly small. I've probably taught over a thousand people to shoot, and MAYBE ran into two or three who do not have a dominant or have a switching dominant eye (one eye is dominant under certain conditions, the other during other condidtions).
Social media causes brain rot. IRL public discourse has nuanced timing, tone and clarity. The poster-board of online content are ideas and opinion without real consequence. The physical world has immediate impact. You must negotiate and collaborate on multiple levels, and be able to prove more than just concept, or warrant claims with studies. You have to validate your ideas in actionable ways.
A genuinely fascinating discussion, I wasn't familiar with Mark Changizi. Dr Peterson has a great range of guests on these interviews and you always learn something new. Mark Changizi explained his ideas in a very engaging way. I finished reading "We Who Wrestle With God" today, it was brilliant, full of great ideas and insight, drawing on all of Dr Peterson's vast reservoir of knowledge and with a wonderful final sentence; "Deus renatus est". I thoroughly recommend the book and I know it will be worth re-reading. Good to hear it's top of the Amazon bestseller list. Hope the book is flying off the shelves. Publishers Allen Lane could do with a better proof reader, as there were many "typos" that hadn't been spotted, there were virtually none in the two 12 Rules For Life books. Thanks Dr Peterson for writing such an important and profound book. and you were looking great in the striped suit, nice tie and stylish shoes. 👍🎯🦞❤
I felt like though this was an overall good conversation, Mark seemed to kind of wander off in different directions quite often. I didn't see many synchronization attempts from his part in regards to Dr. Peterson's propositions and questions. Generally, the more enjoyable conversations are those where both speakers are aiming at the higher unifying vision, rather than a state where the main theme is being pulled every which way by different motivations.
Here's my question - if language is just cultural and not at all genetic, then why is there a narrow window of opportunity to teach language at a relatively young age? In other words - it is my understanding that a person must be exposed to language before a certain age in order to learn language. Otherwise, they are limited in their ability to use language.
another reason to discount the fruit hypothesis for the color vision is that in that case it isn't only primates that evolved, the plants are also evolving. if the plants have a reproductive advantage from primates eating the ripe fruit and spreading the seeds, the fruiting plants may have evolved to fit primate vision which optimized itself for different reasons, not the other way around. if it's just about communication with other members of your own species then it makes more sense for the evolution to be specifically the primate, not any other living species.
Regarding the argument of color perception and skin coloration/tone, I'm curious how these experiments were conducted. Skin pigmentation might make it difficult to analyze experiments with black and brown skinned people. Is it more difficult to see a dark skinned person blush? Or detect pale skin due to ill health in dark skin?
Lack of consequences for being a product of the environment of heirarchy is a construct of fear? It precludes the events leading to the post. It assumes the level of the heirarchy? :) Appreciate the conversation. Low stake.
Have you considered retroviruses? Retroviruses can influence complexity with MRNA. Notwithstanding the above, Complexity is hierarchical. If one doesn't understand complexity then the idea of persistence containing multiple hierarchies feeding each other as the source of emergence obviates a fuller comprehension of "Evolution"
Perception is kind of funny; if we perceive something, we're right and we perceived it correctly. If we misperceive something, we're right and we still perceived it correctly.🎉
It's amazing how you both directly study the spirit, the thing that makes humans different from animals, and even name it: "human 2.0" without realizing what you're looking at. Peterson, you've studied the Bible in depth. How do you not see these things? Again, you name your own blindness: zoocentrism is simply a refusal to see what's plainly visible in front of your eyes.
@JordanBPeterson if you resonate with Gibson, you should explore Bergson. Bergson can, in some ways, provide an ontological foundation for Gibson's theories.
In an environment where the risk of sunburn and skin cancer is lower, it may be. There is however also Vitamin D photosynthesis that plays a role in that dynamic.
I had a feeling that this Mark Changizi was an American before I went to look him up to confirm it. There is just a way with Americans, be it with or without an obvious accent that expresses how these people talk.
If I wait forever, light as a feather If I beg intrude, a curse on you If I follow the way, all things are paid If permissed from One True God, the answer will find us just as I nod.
Will be watching later, but for now, my latest for Wrong Speak is out. Entitled “Tear Down This Wall: A Cultural Sea Change,” it is a reflection on spiritual warfare manifesting in political and cultural warfare and the turning point our nation is living through.
1:11 I agree that in the early Facebook days we had an idea of who we were talking to, but I never felt anyone was "meaner" than they are on social media with increased anonymity. Maybe his friends' friends are perks?
(Haven't watched this episode yet). When I was a teenager in the 2000's, indie music had gotten worse, this Zillennial 90's throwback music and style thing started almost a couple decades ago, wasn't ironic/retro at the time, better material was already 10 yrs old. Should have been one indication, of the stagnating culture. I bring it up, because the medium that WAS often really good, 2000's through early 2010's, was indie film. I was mostly a musician, but got obsessed with watching/studying indie film. Because we read left to right, much of the action in a scene moves from left to right, across the screen. There's an unsettling psychological effect, moving in the opposite direction. Villains often move right to left, or a character in peril, or preceding some twist or turn in the story. Close up shots elicit identification with, or empathy for a character, or emphasize or elevate the character. Opposite with long shots. Shading and lighting, also play a major role for meaning. So does the color spectrum, although the meanings of colors might be somewhat imprecise. There's a near-universal, broad connotation with warm vs. cool colors. Red, and anger? Not exactly, almost the opposite, in my opinion if I were going to put a name on it. Red, "fear" would be maybe the most fundamental ascription. Broader connotation is better, warm evocative responsive unpredictable etc. "Anger," in a word? Cold. Blue. Frozen. In fact, the origin of the emotion, 'disempowered'. (Once again, the broader connotation is better, cool calm unchanging indifferent etc.) The collection of colors, and dark/light connotations, encompassing and shifting throughout the frame, overlapping with characters whose action/motivations/attitudes also become 'darker,' 'lighter,' or elucidated in one way or another, involve the language of the visual medium and are also reflective of the viewer's psychodynamic prospectus. All object relations theorists should study film symbolism, heh.
On your opinion of red and anger, I politely disagree. Anger is reflexive, impulsive. In psychology, they divide cognitive areas into two areas, Hot representing impulsive predominately energetic emotions and thought processes or the lack thereof, compared to cold, more thoughtful stabile cognitive processes. Anger is literally seeing red. Extremely impulsive and energy producing.
@@rainnbowunikorn This is semantic, I might agree, just distinguish anger vs. rage. Somewhat more formal anger denotation is probably, compulsive. (Not necessarily. It's a flexible descriptive term). Rage would be impulsive, a version of fear, it's probably a semantically clearer designation for your description.
Experimental problem: In theory we could compare the highest quality video recordings displayed at the highest resolution, from a distance where its hard to tell which is which, and see if certain vision abnormalities (color blindness, autism?, astigmatism, etc) correlate with certain performance in the study
Interesting… Suddenly everybody knows about a book nobody has ever heard about and they all feel compelled to share about it on this specific video lol.
![[LIVE] : ONE ลุมพินี 89 | คู่เอก "ยอดไอคิว vs คิริลล์"](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Z3vYkHJ_5Ig/mqdefault.jpg)
Funny, to listen to the two of you speak about eyesight. My central sight of 20/800 twice legally blind,also color blind to the colors green and red. Leaves me laughing. My eyesight without a doubt,a gift and blessing, as I get a different view from most. I have first hand knowledge of our amazing ability to adapt. My peripheral eyesight is intact, it picks up color, something it is not designed to do, and it has forced me to accept or develop trust in it, that what I see with my peripheral eyesight is indeed there, as I might turn my head to use my central sight, there is more than a very good chance I will not see it. My eyesight gift, is termed Progressive Cone Dystrophy. I thank God for technology in the form of my magnifier, so I may read books. Listening to this podcast is indeed a pleasure, and I thank you so much. Keep up the great work !!! And I thank God for this beautiful life !!! Bless you all.
It's a treat to simply sit back, relax and learn something new with every episode.
This looks great! Peterson is at his best talking neurobiology, perception, emotion and all the interwoven fields
Lol, no. I think these kinds of talks are interesting for sure, but interesting more in an intelligence increasing than wisdom increasing manner. His most wisdom increasing discussions on religion are his best works. It's great to hear this other guy go on and on about zoocentrism and realizing footsteps may be in the inspiration for cadence in music etc, but what does that do to get you out of bed in the morning? How does knowing that alphabets are largely derived from angles found in nature help you to move forward in life when you're faced with a loss or extreme adversity?
Again, I found this conversation interesting, I'm sure I'll purchase this guest's book(s) and share the information I find inside them as interesting idle chat with people. But I certainly wouldn't label these kinds of discussions as 'Peterson at his best'.
dawkins would have loved that 😅
JBP, you've been kicking butt at these interviews recently. Thanks for giving guests ample space to speak and share their full thoughts - we really appreciate it. I'm digging into Those Who Wrestle this week!
Dearest Dr. Peterson, I just saw your latest conversation with Piers Morgan. I cried with you. If I had been there with you I would have put my arms around you and comforted you. I’m good at comforting people. That’s my gift. The loss of your precious mum and dad won’t always hurt like it does now. Their memories will forever be for a blessing to you. I think it’s very healthy that you were able to open up a bit to Piers, and that could ease your heart a bit.
I am so keenly looking forward to the Gospels series.
Here is a gentle hug
And Ruth Anne’s love
You also good at expressing emotions, I'm sure you are a writer
@@Arun............I am! Dr. Peterson has read and shared some of my work.
So his dad has died. Sad for him. Time is cruel.
Mark is a brilliant scientist and a better person. This conversation is distilled wisdom.
No one has dropped the Mark Twain quote yet? I’m going to have to do it?
“Man is the only animal that blushes - or needs to.”
Man is not the only tricromate ape, but the others are a rare sight.
Interesting. What if orang-utan does but we just can’t see it?
Humanity is the designer of the intelligence we pass down from generation to generation. Thanks to the insights of those who came before us, you become what you are, for you are the designer of your own cognitive intelligence.
Peterson Academy students here! Would love to connect with others! 👋
What's up!
Sure
Greetings
Hello fellow student..lol
Hi WEF fam... World Economic Forum? Most unfortunate choice of words haha
Oh wow. These themes are where Jordan Peterson is at his best. Psychology, emotions, perception. Simply amazing
One of the things that blows my mind about language is that, it evolved not that long ago, but we're so damn GOOD at it. To use a specific example from my own life, one time I tried a magic-mushroom-infused chocolate bar. The physical and visual hallucinations were _intense._ And yet I'm at my keyboard, able to type the whole time and describe how insanely haywire all my body's systems are going. That seemed impossible to me. Yeah, it was as difficult as walking across a boat deck on choppy water, but _I could do it._ It was easier than _walking._ How is language that deep in us!?
consider that it may be because you practiced it every day from when u were born
it might also be true that language is deeply embedded in human brains. i mean that is evidently true. but it doesn’t need to be as deeply embedded as we often say
all the infant needs is to be receptive to learning (maybe a proclivity to grammar)
but i wonder if our affinity for language is less in the “nature” and more in the “nurture.”
is there any other single skill you practice every single day of your entire life? elementary school really only teaches language
if humans were handed a little piano at age 2 and practiced it every single day of their lives incessantly, and everyone around them was practicing constantly,
it would reason that you’d take some mushrooms and magically be able to play fluent piano and wonder (in piano terms) “how is this so deeply ingrained?”
the better question may be “after practicing something for tens of thousands of hours, how could it *not* be so deeply ingrained?
Sir, I grew up in Calgary during the Cuban Mistle Crisis. There were air raid sirens, timed drills for students to get home and shelters in schools. People were terrified and I recall my mother crying at one stage. What has changed? The situation seems much more dire than it was at that time, yet folks in North America seem to not even give this a thought or concern. Has mankind become so numb that this inevitability seems certain?
Half of north America doesn't know how to divide in half, know 2 American states, or know where Russia is located
I think about this question all the time
We are under-educated and our teachers even more so. I’m a teacher educator and despair
Trump has won. Putin doesn't want nuclear war (watch the Tucker Carlson interview) and he'll probably negotiate with Trump to keep Crimea, the Donbas and parts of eastern Ukraine in return for peace, is my interpretation.
Already, the war in Israel has stopped.
Don't despair, for we shall have peace once again!
Love JP and the guests he has. Just wanted to say how physically healthy he’s looking again. Looking good JP!
Just needs a bit of botox to moderate the frown and frown lines... would help soften his image i think.
@@djsaltarelli I don't think limiting the expressive musculature in ones face using neurotoxins is a good idea.
Some of those muscles mainly work to express negative emotions, but these have thier important time and place.
In music I think the beat also mimicks the heartbeat, not just gait or steps, a sound which a fetus will hear as soon as his inner ear and neuronal network are developed enough to do so. The baby will also hear the mother's digestive system, her blood rushing, and her voice. Those are also sounds of our environment that may be more deeply engrained than any others.
Had me staring cross-eyed at my finger, smiling like an idiot at the start lol
Me too and I think something must be wrong in my brain, since I did not react normally.
idiots dony smile
Oh wow, that was unreal, could listen to you both all day. Thank you!!!🙃
Mind blowing interesting interview! Thanks for introducing Mark Changizi to me.
One reason I keep listening to your interviews is because I keep being reminded that you are first and foremost a scientist, JP. Much love
This is the most revelatory, intelligent and interesting conversation in the recent months in my opinion.
Without a doubt one of the best, most informative episodes.
Remember to click all notifications again, I was subscribed and not getting alerts.
Thanks Jordan your insights are invaluable 😊.
I agree...so odd, I haven't been getting alerts either, and I re clicked before I even saw your comment. You tube is doing something like censorship again I fear.
Fascinating topic and one of the most important ones in my opinion. Evolutionary psychology is so underrated and had no idea that evolutionary biologist saw no meaning in understanding purpose in a deconstructive way. It is fundamental to understand how we evolved since we then understand what environment human body and mind flourishes. And also may give us hints to why we are so discontent in the modern society. Modern society and humans are like putting a round cube in a triangle. Just won't work.
Looking forward to The Gospels!
Hey Doc,
Fascinating show. Especially at the end when he spoke about the origins of language and music. Blew my mind
“You are a rainbow” a book from Dolly Parton’s imagination library book delivery is one of my favorites talking about how all emotions are important and when balanced even anger and sadness and fear have their places and are important to be able to love and respect even though they are the less desirable emotions it doesn’t make them less valuable. They are very important to our expansion and healing. And by getting to know all your emotions and how they affect you and what brings them forth you can have a deeper understanding on how you can better show up for yourself and set boundaries for yourself to have successful relationships.
Love intelligent comments.
1:13:44 I agree. IMO (about comments) people in general forget who these vitriolic comments come from. We don’t know. But they’re not from anyone that matters. Are we talking abt someone who is completely blotto or high on something or need to vent bc they can’t take it out on anyone? What’s their age, educational background or experience? There needs to be more talk about those facts . Trolling is real, but I think there’s too much emphasis put on them. Most comments are just thoughts people have that wouldn’t normally be voiced in person to your face. Maybe some would, but the majority, no. They love hiding out and getting displaced attention tho. It’s not normal, but people get away with it bc there’s no serious ramifications.
Block button is perfect
Why would you challenge the alfa mail wolf.
If we are talking on the podcast how much the republicans had done and how good they are....the most shity disgusting comments will be coming from Democrats anonymously.
That's how it works in Europe and all around the world
Really enjoyed following Changizi’s Twitter during the COVID crazy time! Looking forward to the talk!
beijing?
Should have been longer, amazing concepts that blew my mind!!
Your intriguing post got me to thinking of the men of a tribe catching their dinner for the night on some grassy African plain in the days when humans were still wild. First they travel at a slow run though the long grass in a column about 3 men wide, spears in hand to where they hear game. When they encounter the lions they swing round, keeping formation and together roar louder than any lion while charging towards them. (The lions see one huge animal and scatter.) With the lions at bay and at a fast run, they advance on the game forcing them to flee. The best runners select the dinner then, doing what humans uniquely can do, long distance running, they run the animal to the ground, an easy kill. On a good day, the lions stay near the herd. (If a lion did catch a skinny human, he'd quickly learn that he wouldn't get much to eat.)
I'm hoping, In my comment, to provide a backdrop to where, I think, the complex human abilities, so well described, first became manifest. Of course humans warring against humans would add a layer to the one above.
According to a person who mainly studied gorillas, humans have easily the least amount of biomass in their anatomy devoted to eating and digestion of any vertebrate, an evolution enabled by cooking (which tremendously increases available nutrients.) Anatomy that is less constrained by limited nutrition is freed to evolve in other ways, such as those things needed for chewing and swallowing {and breathing) being elaborated into making more complex sounds signifying more things, and a brain freed to remember and generate the sound behaviors with their significance. Cooking, of course, is a behavior too, and one which no other creature has managed, which must be due to something our brains can do that others cannot, possibly because other creatures brains are constrained to more imperative needs exactly by lacking cooking behavior. Cooking leads to an increasingly differentiated brain development, eventually leading to language. Cooking drives brain development. Cooking has to come before language. In this conversation, they are taking language as what drove human brain evolution, which is traditional, although the guest is otherwise very untraditional. Surprising.
In very old-timey books (1800), what distinguished man from the beasts was speaking, not especially tool-making, and definitely not cooking.
I love this, I wish I had had a chance to study this subject, I understand it all so clearly and have thought through some of Marks theories/conclusions. Thank you so much for sharing these wonderful conversations
Dr Peterson
Mark would be a great addition to Peterson Academy!
😅 who else is holding their finger up while watching this 😊
I'm starting to.
Well, not for the whole interview!
I'm not sold on Peterson's anti anonymity stance, however I vaguely understand his concerns. Given the HR anti truth world we live in, I can never support removing individuality protections.
However, I'm fully behind banning children from the internet and am well academically qualified on the issue. I understand what mass media does to children, I also understand there are clear age cutoffs between the internet dealing permenant damage to your brain and just upsetting you.
Great stuff.
More of this would be great.
I want Mark at my dinner party, love it ❤
Thank you for this interesting conversation. It crossed my mind before to think that language evolved from expressing emotions and as breath and muscles are involved the soumds uttered resonate in different sound pitches and length. Very interesting indeed. Lets befriend the this gentleman. Covid reactions, that's a topic of itself. All the best Mr Changizi.
This potential connection between color vision, emotional detection, facial cues, and detection of eye movement in others-it all makes me wonder if the manifestations of Autism Spectrum Disorder have something to do with visual/color processing. I am on the spectrum, and I’ve noticed that I often interpret neutral faces as hostile and that eye contact feels extremely uncomfortable. This could explain many common quirks of autistic individuals, including visual fascinations.
54:52 the poker analogy is very good. I'd like to hear about spades, because then not only are you signaling to your opponent who you might want to fool, but also to your partner who you definitely want to understand what you are doing. Makes it exponentially more complex I think.
Yessssss
Today years old I learned the true meaning of "The Market place of Ideas"
Dr. Peterson’s suits have really been hitting lately! 10/10 lookin’ sharp Professor! 🤗
really liked the point about music imitating human movement -- my personal hypothesis is that we enjoy music as the beats of song remind us of our mother's heartbeat in utero, which makes a one day testable prediction: that test tube babies might have a different relation to music, such as if they still like music they may prefer beat-less music
Love this whole look Doc. Long time fan. xo
Great Episode! Please more neuropsychology!
41:00
Forward facing seems like it is a factor in being able to predict, and become proactive instead of the rabbit reactive. It showed the ability to know what is to come without total focus on what is right in front. Is the ability to understand future.
this is new to me...mechanism and function to understand how development occurs?
22:56 Hi I have red green color deficiency and what a lot of people don't understand is we can actually see red and green albeit to a lesser degree at the least we can tell the difference between the normal shade of your face and a different shade of your face. From what I was told its a way to distinguish the shapes of predators that may use color camouflage to blend into foliage or grassy fields which would make sense Given our primate background.
Cool!
"The moral of coronavirus19 will be that social contagion via social networks is more dangerous than biological contagion."
-Mark Changizi, Mar. 17th, 2020
Mark was there from DAY ONE.
Yep -- While the brilliant C. JUNG was there over 75+ years ago! "We are on guard against contagious diseases of the body, but we are careless when it comes to the even more dangerous collective diseases of the mind." - Carl Jung
Thank you for this. I was thinking maybe some kind of recap at the end may be useful to help retain more information. Take notes folks.
1:32:00 So would music help people who are in solitary confinement to not go crazy? Because it puts them in touch with a human element.
When does WE WHO WRESTLE WITH GOD, will be available in Spanish language?
Very interesting discussion. I find myself going back to an on going thought experiment I like to do. I imagine creating an alien world, but make it as realistic as I can knowing how things evolved for us. For example, houses made of brick, basically just crushed stone, windows from glass that's just liquified sand commonly found, slopped roofs to stop the rain, etc etc. The world ends up looking a lot like ours. I found the part of this discussion about languages and the sounds they make can make another layer of this world. If we built our languages off of natural sounds, like Sssss, then it's logical to think aliens would do the same. So maybe they wouldn't sound too different from us as well.
An arrow for example would work and look similar as well, due to the physics of ballistics working the same across the universe.
1:20 Having followed the public evidence of your trials and tribulations these last seven-plus years, it's fantastically gratifying to see you doing so well. I'm in "X jail," for carelessly suggesting an English police department drop into a state of being the opposite of a steady-state of well-being, after they posted a warning that British people would be found and arrested for "liking" or sharing an unflattering post about some politician over there. I was a very naughty boy. 😢
wow, Thanks Mark, and ty Mr J for the openess on the subject. Try searching for these types of trolls in young and adolscent maies, I feel a lot of them is just under that categody, most of adult ones are already busted as twisted, resentful and malicious ...
I am laughing, because as i say things to the staff here i find jordan saying things in videos high level thank you!
"If you have a dominant eye." As a shooting sports instructor: the number of people w/o a dominant eye is vanishingly small. I've probably taught over a thousand people to shoot, and MAYBE ran into two or three who do not have a dominant or have a switching dominant eye (one eye is dominant under certain conditions, the other during other condidtions).
Social media causes brain rot. IRL public discourse has nuanced timing, tone and clarity. The poster-board of online content are ideas and opinion without real consequence. The physical world has immediate impact. You must negotiate and collaborate on multiple levels, and be able to prove more than just concept, or warrant claims with studies. You have to validate your ideas in actionable ways.
A genuinely fascinating discussion, I wasn't familiar with Mark Changizi. Dr Peterson has a great range of guests on these interviews and you always learn something new. Mark Changizi explained his ideas in a very engaging way. I finished reading "We Who Wrestle With God" today, it was brilliant, full of great ideas and insight, drawing on all of Dr Peterson's vast reservoir of knowledge and with a wonderful final sentence; "Deus renatus est". I thoroughly recommend the book and I know it will be worth re-reading. Good to hear it's top of the Amazon bestseller list. Hope the book is flying off the shelves. Publishers Allen Lane could do with a better proof reader, as there were many "typos" that hadn't been spotted, there were virtually none in the two 12 Rules For Life books. Thanks Dr Peterson for writing such an important and profound book. and you were looking great in the striped suit, nice tie and stylish shoes. 👍🎯🦞❤
The funny thing is that the color blue makes us more aggressive. Red makes us more at ease. Kinda ass-backwards isn’t?
@@stvbrsn
Humans
Really interesting, thank you.
John 20:29 Blessed is he who has not seen yet believes
I felt like though this was an overall good conversation, Mark seemed to kind of wander off in different directions quite often. I didn't see many synchronization attempts from his part in regards to Dr. Peterson's propositions and questions. Generally, the more enjoyable conversations are those where both speakers are aiming at the higher unifying vision, rather than a state where the main theme is being pulled every which way by different motivations.
I enjoyed the conversation because it wasn't so much as an interview but two genuinely smart people really enjoying the conversation with each other.
Mostly over my head but learned great interview thanks.
I'd like to see Mark Changizi go on the Dark Horse podcast with Bret Weinstein.
Here's my question - if language is just cultural and not at all genetic, then why is there a narrow window of opportunity to teach language at a relatively young age? In other words - it is my understanding that a person must be exposed to language before a certain age in order to learn language. Otherwise, they are limited in their ability to use language.
5:19 Amit Goswami’s’ books on creative evolution would be a great addition to this discussion…
another reason to discount the fruit hypothesis for the color vision is that in that case it isn't only primates that evolved, the plants are also evolving. if the plants have a reproductive advantage from primates eating the ripe fruit and spreading the seeds, the fruiting plants may have evolved to fit primate vision which optimized itself for different reasons, not the other way around. if it's just about communication with other members of your own species then it makes more sense for the evolution to be specifically the primate, not any other living species.
boring
Regarding the argument of color perception and skin coloration/tone, I'm curious how these experiments were conducted. Skin pigmentation might make it difficult to analyze experiments with black and brown skinned people. Is it more difficult to see a dark skinned person blush? Or detect pale skin due to ill health in dark skin?
What an opening.
I love you, best teacher ❤😅 so kind
Lack of consequences for being a product of the environment of heirarchy is a construct of fear?
It precludes the events leading to the post. It assumes the level of the heirarchy?
:)
Appreciate the conversation.
Low stake.
Have you considered retroviruses?
Retroviruses can influence complexity with MRNA.
Notwithstanding the above, Complexity is hierarchical.
If one doesn't understand complexity then the idea of persistence containing multiple hierarchies feeding each other as the source of emergence obviates a fuller comprehension of "Evolution"
Perception is kind of funny; if we perceive something, we're right and we perceived it correctly. If we misperceive something, we're right and we still perceived it correctly.🎉
Red is the color of love
Words are the words of words.
@@stvbrsn sounds just like Kamala Harris
It's amazing how you both directly study the spirit, the thing that makes humans different from animals, and even name it: "human 2.0" without realizing what you're looking at. Peterson, you've studied the Bible in depth. How do you not see these things? Again, you name your own blindness: zoocentrism is simply a refusal to see what's plainly visible in front of your eyes.
God‘s character versus God’s personality… how do they differ?… sorry for going off the subject… I love your new book.❤❤❤
Great podcast!
I got angry for 30mins,ended up going blind,because soft plague from my neck....i mean complete blindness and fully restored
That was fascinating
@JordanBPeterson if you resonate with Gibson, you should explore Bergson. Bergson can, in some ways, provide an ontological foundation for Gibson's theories.
Symmetrical symmetry in nature, is not so far fetched as the mirror,reflecting infinity and the so called light defeating the dark🍺🚑
Is this 19:38 "3rd cone sensitivity for blood oxygenation" a potential evolutionary reason for pale skin? To communicate these flushes more easily?
In an environment where the risk of sunburn and skin cancer is lower, it may be. There is however also Vitamin D photosynthesis that plays a role in that dynamic.
I had a feeling that this Mark Changizi was an American before I went to look him up to confirm it. There is just a way with Americans, be it with or without an obvious accent that expresses how these people talk.
If I wait forever, light as a feather
If I beg intrude, a curse on you
If I follow the way, all things are paid
If permissed from One True God, the answer will find us just as I nod.
It's almost as if the mainstream want everything to be random only. I often wonder why are they so afraid of the "design" word.
1:29:12 tickled jordan there with the unintentional yahweh 😂
Why are there no women involved in the Gospels round table of men? I am asking this genuinely?
❤
must everything be about gender ?
@CaptainSurfy First this isnt "everything" and second it is you who sees it thus.
28:24, I feel dizzy when the camera is moving.
Will be watching later, but for now, my latest for Wrong Speak is out. Entitled “Tear Down This Wall: A Cultural Sea Change,” it is a reflection on spiritual warfare manifesting in political and cultural warfare and the turning point our nation is living through.
1:11 I agree that in the early Facebook days we had an idea of who we were talking to, but I never felt anyone was "meaner" than they are on social media with increased anonymity. Maybe his friends' friends are perks?
Jerks*
@@DillonStanhope you can edit your comment
I think that “5-10% are the troll types” (online) is probably a naive estimate 🤣 🤣
I was enjoying the conversation until 1:02:33
I think Jordan Peterson, by accident, placed a different hypothesis why we have forward facing eyes: so other humans can see what we are focussing on?
(Haven't watched this episode yet).
When I was a teenager in the 2000's, indie music had gotten worse, this Zillennial 90's throwback music and style thing started almost a couple decades ago, wasn't ironic/retro at the time, better material was already 10 yrs old.
Should have been one indication, of the stagnating culture.
I bring it up, because the medium that WAS often really good, 2000's through early 2010's, was indie film.
I was mostly a musician, but got obsessed with watching/studying indie film.
Because we read left to right, much of the action in a scene moves from left to right, across the screen.
There's an unsettling psychological effect, moving in the opposite direction. Villains often move right to left, or a character in peril, or preceding some twist or turn in the story.
Close up shots elicit identification with, or empathy for a character, or emphasize or elevate the character.
Opposite with long shots.
Shading and lighting, also play a major role for meaning.
So does the color spectrum, although the meanings of colors might be somewhat imprecise.
There's a near-universal, broad connotation with warm vs. cool colors.
Red, and anger?
Not exactly, almost the opposite, in my opinion if I were going to put a name on it.
Red, "fear" would be maybe the most fundamental ascription.
Broader connotation is better, warm evocative responsive unpredictable etc.
"Anger," in a word?
Cold. Blue. Frozen.
In fact, the origin of the emotion, 'disempowered'.
(Once again, the broader connotation is better, cool calm unchanging indifferent etc.)
The collection of colors, and dark/light connotations, encompassing and shifting throughout the frame, overlapping with characters whose action/motivations/attitudes also become 'darker,' 'lighter,' or elucidated in one way or another, involve the language of the visual medium and are also reflective of the viewer's psychodynamic prospectus.
All object relations theorists should study film symbolism, heh.
On your opinion of red and anger, I politely disagree. Anger is reflexive, impulsive. In psychology, they divide cognitive areas into two areas, Hot representing impulsive predominately energetic emotions and thought processes or the lack thereof, compared to cold, more thoughtful stabile cognitive processes. Anger is literally seeing red. Extremely impulsive and energy producing.
@@rainnbowunikorn This is semantic, I might agree, just distinguish anger vs. rage.
Somewhat more formal anger denotation is probably, compulsive. (Not necessarily. It's a flexible descriptive term).
Rage would be impulsive, a version of fear, it's probably a semantically clearer designation for your description.
Got to love it when someone you look up to makes you feels like a complete psychopath 😢😂
Nice suit! Much better than some of your others. 😄
I wonder if truthfulness increases survival? It sounds like the blush response is not sexual.
Experimental problem:
In theory we could compare the highest quality video recordings displayed at the highest resolution, from a distance where its hard to tell which is which, and see if certain vision abnormalities (color blindness, autism?, astigmatism, etc) correlate with certain performance in the study
It would perhaps have to use a spectral camera.
Me here with my dominant eye 😕
Interesting… Suddenly everybody knows about a book nobody has ever heard about and they all feel compelled to share about it on this specific video lol.