Read the "New Rules For Negotiating In 2024+" article in my newsletter: www.toptechnewsletter.com/p/the-new-rules-of-negotiating-your Interested in negotiation coaching? Find time for an intro call: feelvalued.co
Some would say the intro is bragging, but I do try to just give the best advice I have at the moment and hope it helps without putting anyone in a tough spot. There's a newer article we wrote about how to negotiate in this tough market on my newsletter.
For someone who has had very little exposure with negotiating salaries, this was an eye-opening video for me. This is one of those things they do not teach you in any CS program.
This guy knows how it works. Ive worked at Google, Microsoft and other corps. I've learned this too late but such knowledge helped me to get decent increases between jobs.
@@ColinLate I think adding a context that in eu those comps are lower than in US. People need to be aware of that. I'm based in EU and got to the ceiling.
I'm unintentionally fantastic at interviewing and not so bad at salary negotiations. This video is full of fabulous advice for anyone trying improve their skills.
It's a tough market out there, so I feel you. I hope this comes in handy, though! There's a newer article we wrote about how to negotiate in this tough market on my newsletter.
@@ColinLate immensely! The algorithm has betrayed you on the value to views front, don't let this tempt you into watering down your content, the overlords will catch on soon enough.. you are a wellspring of amazing content, don't stop!
It is one of the best resources for tech salary negotiations out there. Your grounded and thought-through insights have helped me see things more clearly. Thanks a lot, Colin!
Some things to consider: 1) Tech job market state is not so great 2) There are performance reviews and mid-reviews, and people with higher level would get worse grades for same work. 3) Some companies will mark a checkbox in your profile like 'inflated_salary_expectations'
Love this comment! 1) True, but we still see successful negotiations all the time with our coaching services. Just not as high. 2) This is a smart thing to consider. You do want to make sure you will succeed no matter the level. I find it’s more admit the culture or role fit than the level fit performance reviews, but you do get more leeway in more junior roles. 3) You only negotiate at the end and you have to gauge all the relationships and signals I discuss.
2) In my expirience "succeding" in big tech is mostly not controlled by you. For example: a) You need to find the great project (tasks), and these are always scarce b) Then implement them with compliance to everchanging company metrics with "business impact" and "technical exellence" c) Then you will be reviewed against your teammates behind the closed doors (and there is usually grade quoutas) 3) Yes. But companies keep and update profiles about employees even after hiring
I’m glad you found it valuable! I’ve got a new article on the topic if you want more: www.toptechnewsletter.com/p/the-new-rules-of-negotiating-your?r=f1aru&
Thanks for making this Colin. I’ve been a military pilot for 15 years and going into the last round interview for my first civilian job. Whilst there are differences between our industries, you’ve given me some tactics and food for thought. Thanks. (Too bad aviation compensation is nowhere near tech…)
Really good talk, surprised the algorithm hasn’t blessed it even more. Some of the content is more geared towards later in a career, but definitely walked away with some nuggets of info applicable at all stages Nice presentation style, too
A junior company wanted me. I kept saying no for over half a year. I’m much older, but you could say, an outlier. My job is in part to provide broad technical experience, mentoring. My role is I’m the “dreamer”. To grow the company with new lines of products, mergers and acquisitions. You could say they gave me the keys to the kingdom, I chose the direction. My salary is low, covers my expenses and my chosen title is very modest, mid level tech lead (this is a client facing title, so intentionally not intimidating). They want to keep me, motivate me. So the bonus is 4% of gross margin from sales. Not my sales, but all sales from all divisions and subsidiaries. Gross margin is 60%. Products are half a million to several million each. I’m growing the company by multiples (not percentage) each year. This is also “golden handcuffs”, they want me long term. BTW, that “bonus” is every year. Do the math…
This is so important. Well presented. I've walked away from a number of offers because I did my own equity analysis, and found that the valuations were extremely stretched, to the point they'd be lucky to grow into it (from being valued during a bubble). Everyone should understand how to value a company, and understand that private equity exits should also add to your risk premium (it's highly illiquid, generally trades below fair value, and comes with high transaction fees)
Welp... watching this was the most productive 45 min of my life! Your advice that our stretch goal "may not even be high enough" was spot on. I actually exceeded my stretch early by keeping my mouth shut, and being respectful (but slightly apprehensive) whenever they put out a number. That made my counter easy too because I could ask for a smaller (5-10%) increase and show sincere gratitude to get it. Felt very win-win. I do feel like this advice is more geared toward senior/staff and higher roles, and is sorta predicated on nailing the interview.
Man, this video brings up so many strange emotions within me as a 28 yr old who just quit my job, looking to change industries completely starting at the bottom of the IT world, never made more than $60k a year, but also made more than my parents ever have. Just seeing these numbers thrown around feels so weird. It's aspirational/exciting/daunting/demoralizing/interesting all together. It's a great video all around. I hope one day it will be helpful for me
Don’t worry about the huge numbers. Honestly I’d be fine making a small fraction of this after making 40k early in my career. Just make sure you’re in the best boat you can get into to when you start to row. That matters as much as how hard you row
Wish i saw this video earlier. Uk financial manager and set my salary against the other execs, however i bring so much more value to the table. Employers have a procedural scarcity mindset and focus on percent increase being too high rather than value trade off. Got 55k.
Yeah. It is like that. Different companies and industries…and even managers view things differently. You can do a lot with these strategies, but the company’s compensation philosophy can limit you unless you’re absolutely top talent.
@@ColinLate oh I really do apologize, i meant. Better than the common regurgitated youtube crap you see from other channels. Thx again. Subbed on YT and to jr newsletter
It's pretty annoying when outside folks trivialize the technical interview and say things like "simply crush the technical interview and then you can negotiate". Dude, Meta is currently asking 3 medium Leetcode questions in 45 minutes. That's 1 medium every 15 minutes and you have to be perfect 3 times in arow. Congrats, my guy.. you can help the top 0.01% engineers negotiate a better salary.
Fair. It’s tough. We help folks negotiate all the time. You can still negotiate if you pass the interviews without being a top performer. It just limits your upside depending how you do on the other factors like unique skillset for the role and external leverage. At TikTok, they tier their negotiation strategy based on interview performance but we just got someone an $85k increase despite not being a top interview performer. It just helps a heck of a lot.
Do you have some hints for someone outside USA to get an interview in for example facebook? I have over 8 years of experience in java, but I think that people inside USA get easier a chance.
I knew the common advice to give the first number to appear confident is bs! That's some real value here, even though im more interested in working for medium sized companies. Going to shoot for a 50% salary increase by end of year with these techniques.
Great information. But I will say this. It seems the majority of what is described here is predominantly meant for specific Sr. level roles, or Fortune type orgs where a person would actually have such a huge window of salary/ options to negotiate to begin with. Assuming that's not where one is then there is either: NO negotiation via the company, OR a very small window to work in.
Yes, what he is saying I think only applies to Senior roles at high growth start up / scale ups and large tech firms. Not just that but it only applies to technologists and perhaps sales and marketing. Finance, compliance, operations, risk management, audit and any other orgs not perceived as revenue generating or cost reducing have little to no leverage and would like lose the opportunity following this playbook. But seems like fantastic advice to those in which it applies.
As everyone else has said, this is liquid gold! This is mostly geared towards those with some work experience. Do you have any wisdom for those who are currently students looking for internships or graduate roles in the future? Do you think it is even possible to negotiate compensation for graduate positions in the current market?
It is but it’s tough. I don’t know your specific situation so it’s very hard to give general advice, but if you do it, don’t take too much risk, do it in person kindly, and make sure you are okay with the consequences of a bad actor on the other side. I have definitely seen even in this market and even in Europe new grads negotiating successfully with big tech. It’s just tougher and your career is long anyway.
Ha this is before I knew how to edit so I just did it old fashioned slides style. Glad you found it valuable! Check out my newsletter for more articles on the topic.
Glad this got recommended to me! I have been working in an engineering firm for about 9 months after graduate school and research, and I received a promotion 2 weeks ago. Typically, this next level takes about 3 years to get. However, the new title and merit increase doesn't take effect until November. We never discussed what the new salary would be. Should I be proactive in this case and bring this up now? I am worried that come November, they will use the excuse that there isn't time for negotiations anymore. I have saved this company multiple times my own salary so far this year so my worth is well known, but they know I don't want to leave as well
Promotion negotiations should start as much as a year or more before the promo. You need to create expectations and a plan that you track regularly with your boss. You can start later, but your best shot is to start with your manager yesterday
Amazing video. I feel that im still away to have a offer from a mang but who knows... i will keep working on this! Thank you for the video. Very informative!
Just make sure to do the math about your RSUs of your current position… you might feel good about your total comp increasing, but you gotta start all over with your vesting cycles!
Thank you. I find this video very information dense and helpful. I recently walked away from an offer which, looking in hind sight with your video, was poorly negotiated on my part. I think my key mistake was being way too transparent and divulging too much information too early. Specifically I told the recruiter my bottom line i.e. what's the minimum offer (+X% of my current comp) I'd consider an acceptable offer. And guess what, the offer came back almost exactly that amount. So even after counter offers and negotiating upwards with several back and forths, I ended up in a place where I still felt I was being undervalued and I would lose on opportunity cost and work life balance for an amount that was not convincing, so I ended up walking away. Unfortunately I felt the recruiter and HM had the impression that I was never winnable from how I walked away and they were both unpleasantly surprised I rejected their adjusted offer downright. Looking back, I did not evaluate my actual expectations accurately. I could see a world where we arrive at the final offer via a different route and I would have taken it, but I could also see myself getting a much better offer and be happy with that.
It’s hard to tell of course, but at least there is a different approach you will try next time. Many folks think there is no path forward when there might be if you understand how the other side feels. I don’t know all the context of that situation, but I have seen seemingly completely pulled offers be brought back to life through the right human, empathetic approach.
I think its important to re-iterate you have to be in a population of people that can take the risk of negotiating. I thought the advice is great for people that dont depend heavily on paying rent off. Of course if youre dedicated to spending your life in CS/tech, you will eventually get a role with negotiations. But some people prefer an initially conservative approach until they can break through initially. For instance, I already worked my first job in tech, but my second job only came recently after a year of job gap. Arguably a salary raise would make sense for the time without a job, but at the same time i cant risk savings over a few grand of salary increase.
Your personal runway both financially and psychologically and the downside risk are important factors in how aggressively you negotiate for sure. Great point
@@ColinLate Thanks. Ive always thought it was quite an interesting topic that tech jobs get paid in such a way. It seems like a lot of companies dont know what to expect so execs just go willie nillie with the company's cash reserves. Not much in the way of expectations and a standardized approach to software, is there. The EU and India pays differently salaries, but I think even they have to compete with the global market, too. I suppose its always just mirrored the signs of a very young and risky industry. People do crazy stuff with not just their software, but money too, and its not always the best thing...
Hey Colin, great video I highly appreciate the clear and concise delivery, no gimmicks just facts, strategy and expertise. My question is, is it a good idea it to make a presentation that justifies why you deserve a raise. Something like a 15 minute slide deck? This could include projects you’ve excelled on, things you did that have high value, the likelihood function you were talking about and so on. Thanks hope to hear back!
Hey - This will really depend on a lot of factors. I don't know your function or workplace culture, but I rarely think a presentation is the right way to go. For both new offer negotiations and raises, I usually recommend a 30/60/90 day draft plan that you go over collaboratively with your Hiring Manager as well as collecting a brag book. Consider promotions and raises a multi-month process where you work together with your manager to set expectations, track progress, get feedback to grow, and then it shouldn't be a surprise whether you're getting a raise or promotion in the end. Presentations are too one-directional.
No fancy story behind this one. It’s typically just because you only have so many rounds to negotiate. This path tends to get the first back and forth in a bidding war to start from a higher place. It then starts the first of 2-3 rounds of negotiation with your top choice from a higher first number.
A video about how to interpret recruiters words/messages would also be very helpful to tag on to this video. When they say this…..it means or could mean this.
@@ColinLate Example: Talent emails me right after 4 final interviews and wants to schedule a meeting for follow up. They want to “see how I felt they went and chat.” Any insight on this vague message? Overall slides on if they say this…..it could mean 1, 2, or 3. Similar to your slides on prep for negotiation. You are making the best videos on this overall process/subject. Big thanks! 🙏
You can. It depends on a lot of factors though. What companies you worked at, how fast it grew, what impact you drive, how well you interview, will you network into FAANG well, are you located in the right region, etc.
Your only goal is to move forward. That means not being filtered for too low or too high. Very hard to say without knowing your content, but typically looking for the range in the job description and picking near the middle is fine. You will need to negotiate later when you have built up leverage. Just make sure to deflect questions and if they ask about your entry, tell them you were not thinking of comp this early in the process, as normal. Sometimes they’ll try to guilt you but they set up an ill conceived form system. Just be kind and do the rest of the steps as normal.
"Recruiter: Sorry we have a no-negotiation policy" Is this ever actually the case? Also, is it possible to boost base-salary, even if it means reducing the equity value? I'd think its probably hard with startups since they are more strapped for immediate cash, but wondering how much leeway there is
Sometimes it is. Small startups will not negotiate sometimes on base salary with lower level candidates. Some big companies will not negotiate much with new grads. In general, it’s usually a white lie. They just mean they can’t negotiate until they get an executive to make an exception for you.
There are many. Depends on context but they can all work: Just focusing on interviews now. Deflect and ask their range then say you’re sure you’ll come to something that works for everyone. Hard to say before meeting the team, learning more about the role, and have all the details. Just starting your search. Pick a bunch. Usually they’ll let you go.
This is such a helpful video. I wish I had seen this before getting my job with Amazon or moving on to a different company. Question - Does this work when you get a promotion within the same company? Do you ever negotiate with your annual reviews or just take the compensation that you are offered.
You do a different process. Some of the same principles apply. Start keeping a brag book, work with your manager up to a year before the promotion cycle to keep aligning with them monthly and do 30-60-90 day plan reviews with them when it comes up to a cycle to let them know you’re ready for the promo. One day I’ll do a video on this but check out a life engineered on TH-cam in the meantime
@@ColinLate I did get a 5k counter offer. Not what I was looking for but the practice of negotiating is key. One more email sent and like you mentioned, pays off in the end.
Thank you so much for the awesome content! Is there any recommendations for internal hiring? When they all know about my current pay/position and the recruiter specifically said that there's very little room to negotiate.
It’s harder to negotiate internally. You can still do it, but they have more power in the relationship usually. Some companies just won’t negotiate much as a policy for internal transfers
I would work directly with the hiring manager though. Go through a 30:60:90 day plan after you get the offer with them. Work through the impact and scope and ask them if they’ll go to bat for you in a negotiation.
Well this is mostly relevant to tech, but principles may still apply. I wouldn’t worry so long as your income helps you live well and meet your goals. People are never satisfied, even high earners in tech.
Small criticism but I find the belief at the start that executives at fast growing startups or VPs at FAANG might know better than some other experts extremely naïve. You don't know what made them arrive there, or in spite of what they made it here
Yep, that’s why I get as many perspectives as I can. I actually coach executives on negotiations now because many haven’t even needed to negotiate to earn a lot. But many executives have experienced both sides of 100s of negotiations in their careers and they have very useful lessons.
The vid seems to have a lot of points in common with Haseeb's "how not to bomb your offer negociation" series of articles, I loved those blog posts. Have you read them?
Yes I have. Definitely recommend the read. I don’t agree with b 100% but it’s very worthwhile. Another great negotiator also posted another article on my newsletter: www.toptechnewsletter.com
Hi there, quick query: if you negotiate too hard and manage to gain a salary at the top of the range band, do you put yourself in a danger zone eventually when layoffs are round the corner? Or are layoffs regardless of salary levels?
There are rare instances where this happens, but most layoffs are based on when you were hired, performance, and the team you’re on. The marginal difference in probability of layoffs off is probably 5-10% vs all the other factors
Money isn't everything. I know folks who are very happy without all this. I used to make CAD$39k/year. It was stressful. I thought about work much less, but money a lot more.
There is always a balance between what you want and your output once you’re in the job. If expectations are not met you risk termination all future offers with other companies.
This is sometimes true, but I mostly find that the extra compensation doesn’t affect expectations as much as you would think. It’s situation dependent.
@@ColinLate Sure - Another point which is overlooked and we see this all the time is a candidate negotiates a high salary get the job then at some point has to go out to market only to alarmed that others are paying nowhere as much with little option but to take less. Be cautious and demonstrate merit and value in the job and earn your way up. That’s much more sustainable.
I try to avoid those awful forms! But seriously your main objective there is to move forward, not negotiate. Depends on the role/company/industry. For US PM roles I would put near the top end of the job posting range on the JD. That’s just the base salary anyway. You can tell the recruiter when they bring it up that you weren’t thinking of compensation at this stage and just entered a number, but are sure you will come to something that works for everyone later in the process. Some recruiters get upset that you surprised them so you can get around this by telling them after your 1st round interviews that you didn’t know what to enter there at the time and will discuss it later once you meet the team and know more about the role. You can also bring up if you’re in process with other companies but don’t mention details at this point.
is this a smart thing to do for a first professional job in finance? for example IB or accounting etc. or should I take whatever they give me for the first year or two so that at least I have some experience in my CV for my next position?
I know less about IB. New grad roles are usually less negotiable but it’s worth trying a low aggression version. I’ve seen new grads negotiating in tech with some success. Some companies and offices don’t but I can’t speak to your specific circumstances
What's your take on smaller job markets like Poland? It seems like there are much fewer opportunities to negotiate above market due to less venture money or FAANG competing for talent
I’m definitely less familiar, but in Western and Central Europe, I know negotiations are definitely possible. I can imagine you can negotiate, but the level bands are just less broad. There are many more roles there. I recommend following some of the tech creators in that area like Pawel Huryn. (My family is Polish in origin, actually)
Is there a case for settling in a compensation range early in the process *on your end* so that you don't waste your time, if both sides are putting up a poker face (i.e. employer not required to provide bands)? Not as if we're all getting multiple offers these days to warrant "time waste", but still.
I rarely worry about time waste, but it depends heavily on your situation for whether you want to pursue further or not. I’ve definitely seen some major changes. We helped a PM negotiate a senior pm role into a director offer.
I watched your other video on top jobs in tech and data scientists were at $166k if I understood your chart correctly. Im in data at low six figures right now. I’m looking online and the jobs appear to be in the 65k-130k range and the higher end is as a senior data scientist. What can I do to get to where you are or close to it? Do you have resources? Recruiters? I feel lost as to what skills/certificates/other forms of validation I should actually spend time on that convert reliably to income. Then, who is even offering these high salaries? Is it just FAANG? How much are people faking it till they make it? My perception is that people in these jobs could run circles around me based on job requirements for even 80k jobs. I feel completely out of the game and it makes me sad and frustrated. It’s like there’s something I totally missed and I don’t know how/where to get it and what reality is vs my self-doubt.
The other aspect is that they are Total Compensation including bonuses and equity. Job postings have basic base salary ranges that don’t include equity as well. Look at levels.fyi
I have received offers with total compensation including equity ranging from 350k to over 2m. This video is a year old and those were from 2 years ago at the peak of the market. I’d say today it would likely be 800k-1.2m depending on the role. Many caveats. In terms of negotiated increases, it’s millions in just the increases between myself and the people I’ve helped. Most recently we’ve helped three people in a row get $80k or more per year in increases.
@@ColinLate if I accept an offer with a competitor tech company can my current company find out? I was able to get a great offer with our competitors, my questions is that I have 5 days to sign the contract but i am working on a voluntary separation package over 100k with my current company and need to stay with them for 2 more weeks without taking any offers. The starting date with new company is 2 weeks after my last day with current company. If I accept I am worried they will find out. What should I do or tell the recruiter? His telling me they will not find out.
That helps but is not sufficient! You still have to negotiate. I helped someone who bailed their interviews increase their comp +$115k and get an up-level. They would have had neither if they didn’t negotiate properly.
Depends on the company and role. The bands can be within 50-60% lowest to highest. Check levels.fyi for your function and level at a few companies to see the spread
@@ColinLate he wrote the book Flip the Script which primarily outlined the concept of framing. I never thought to see if he originated the concept or anything, but it's pervasive throughout the book.
I dont know what world you live in that you have companies lining up for you and high expectations and all that. In Colombia I apply to 20 companies, get one interview, ask for like 20k a year, they simply say no and leave. Maybe you've been lucky indeed with all those mentors.
How do you recover if you gave a low salary expectation in the beginning because you were having some bad luck in the job search and throught the job market is worse than it is
New information, new leverage, new circumstances, new competing opportunities. All ways to re open negotiations. It happens sometimes. You’re fighting against that first anchor but after you get the offer, you will want to bring up your new information and argument for a higher offer in your counter. Ideally this is because the role is bigger scope than you originally thought, you learned your market value through other offers or interview processes, or you just learned from others at the company about what to expect. There is a lot that goes into an offer other than compensation, so you can bring up anything. More risk than you anticipated, giving up other opportunities, etc. Lots of ways around it but it’s just a bit tougher and you have to manage their emotions since they may be annoyed by your change.
This sounds fantastic for US passport holders and maybe even EU. But how does one outside of that deal with negotiating with US companies? Say for example a skilled dev from Ghana could qualify for a job but be low balled just for country of origin.
I don’t have that experience unfortunately, so it’s hard to say. Talking about value to the company and how investing in you will pay off could work, but the situation is foreign to me.
If you act disappointed in the call, you will almost certainly make a misstep and lose leverage or even worse, get sucked into questioning and negotiating by the recruiter on the call. That always leads to worse outcomes than planning your counter and coming back later prepared with your approach.
The problem for me is I have 3 years of exp doing network tech stuff. But now all the jobs out there are only offering $15-$20 an hour. Which is less then what I was making previously. And yet they don’t even do call backs after hundreds of applications sent. Im working two service industry jobs to survive now. My new hourly wage as bartender is 2.13 an hour.
I feel for you. That’s a tougher situation than many. Networking (the people kind) is your friend. It’s not going to be easy, but whatever you invest your time in, make sure you’re building optionality for your future. New skills. Try other related functions. I don’t know your situation or location, but find community with others out there in the hunt. There are many
Read the "New Rules For Negotiating In 2024+" article in my newsletter: www.toptechnewsletter.com/p/the-new-rules-of-negotiating-your
Interested in negotiation coaching? Find time for an intro call: feelvalued.co
Are you incognito on LinkedIn? Super interested
I like your approach. 0 bragging, 0 BS. Genuinely insightful and to the point.
Some would say the intro is bragging, but I do try to just give the best advice I have at the moment and hope it helps without putting anyone in a tough spot.
There's a newer article we wrote about how to negotiate in this tough market on my newsletter.
$2M per year? That's more than I've made in my entire life.
No one really deserves it, but if companies will pay it… the typical low-mid six figures is more common in US tech
For someone who has had very little exposure with negotiating salaries, this was an eye-opening video for me. This is one of those things they do not teach you in any CS program.
They don’t! I recommend watching more videos on the topic that discuss new grads. I also have a newsletter with some other negotiation posts.
This guy knows how it works. Ive worked at Google, Microsoft and other corps. I've learned this too late but such knowledge helped me to get decent increases between jobs.
Thank you and I’m glad you started advocating for yourself. I’m hoping folks don’t have to learn the hard way.
@@ColinLate I think adding a context that in eu those comps are lower than in US. People need to be aware of that. I'm based in EU and got to the ceiling.
@@basstradamus1 Whats the EU cieling in tech?
@@desertshadow721-1.2m eur total comp, beyond that amount you need to sit on boards or be VP in big tech which is impossible in Europe pretty much.
But, in today's job market, there are so many people applying that the companies have more leverage and can pay in the lower range of salaries
I'm unintentionally fantastic at interviewing and not so bad at salary negotiations. This video is full of fabulous advice for anyone trying improve their skills.
It's a tough market out there, so I feel you. I hope this comes in handy, though! There's a newer article we wrote about how to negotiate in this tough market on my newsletter.
This is gold dude, probably the best video on TH-cam on this topic, really next level!
Hope it’s valuable!
@@ColinLate immensely! The algorithm has betrayed you on the value to views front, don't let this tempt you into watering down your content, the overlords will catch on soon enough.. you are a wellspring of amazing content, don't stop!
Best ever value/time ratio on youtube I found so far. Great job!
I hope it works for you! Check out a more recent article on the topic too: www.toptechnewsletter.com/p/the-new-rules-of-negotiating-your
It is one of the best resources for tech salary negotiations out there. Your grounded and thought-through insights have helped me see things more clearly. Thanks a lot, Colin!
So glad to hear it was helpful! Were you searching for a job right now?
I've recently started my search and moved further along in the pipeline with some companies. So, it was great timing to find your content.@@ColinLate
Some things to consider:
1) Tech job market state is not so great
2) There are performance reviews and mid-reviews, and people with higher level would get worse grades for same work.
3) Some companies will mark a checkbox in your profile like 'inflated_salary_expectations'
Love this comment!
1) True, but we still see successful negotiations all the time with our coaching services. Just not as high.
2) This is a smart thing to consider. You do want to make sure you will succeed no matter the level. I find it’s more admit the culture or role fit than the level fit performance reviews, but you do get more leeway in more junior roles.
3) You only negotiate at the end and you have to gauge all the relationships and signals I discuss.
2) In my expirience "succeding" in big tech is mostly not controlled by you. For example:
a) You need to find the great project (tasks), and these are always scarce
b) Then implement them with compliance to everchanging company metrics with "business impact" and "technical exellence"
c) Then you will be reviewed against your teammates behind the closed doors (and there is usually grade quoutas)
3) Yes. But companies keep and update profiles about employees even after hiring
Best negotiation video Ive seen so far. Thank you so much for sharing your insights. I really appreciate your thoughtful and logical approach.
I’m glad you found it valuable! I’ve got a new article on the topic if you want more: www.toptechnewsletter.com/p/the-new-rules-of-negotiating-your?r=f1aru&
Thanks for making this Colin. I’ve been a military pilot for 15 years and going into the last round interview for my first civilian job. Whilst there are differences between our industries, you’ve given me some tactics and food for thought. Thanks.
(Too bad aviation compensation is nowhere near tech…)
Sounds like a heck of a fun job though
Really good talk, surprised the algorithm hasn’t blessed it even more.
Some of the content is more geared towards later in a career, but definitely walked away with some nuggets of info applicable at all stages
Nice presentation style, too
Well I hope it’s useful. Yes, I do work mostly with mid career candidates and senior leaders, but the principles helped me very early in my career.
A junior company wanted me. I kept saying no for over half a year. I’m much older, but you could say, an outlier. My job is in part to provide broad technical experience, mentoring.
My role is I’m the “dreamer”. To grow the company with new lines of products, mergers and acquisitions. You could say they gave me the keys to the kingdom, I chose the direction.
My salary is low, covers my expenses and my chosen title is very modest, mid level tech lead (this is a client facing title, so intentionally not intimidating). They want to keep me, motivate me. So the bonus is 4% of gross margin from sales. Not my sales, but all sales from all divisions and subsidiaries. Gross margin is 60%. Products are half a million to several million each. I’m growing the company by multiples (not percentage) each year. This is also “golden handcuffs”, they want me long term. BTW, that “bonus” is every year. Do the math…
Better golden handcuffs than the alternative types!
This is so important. Well presented. I've walked away from a number of offers because I did my own equity analysis, and found that the valuations were extremely stretched, to the point they'd be lucky to grow into it (from being valued during a bubble). Everyone should understand how to value a company, and understand that private equity exits should also add to your risk premium (it's highly illiquid, generally trades below fair value, and comes with high transaction fees)
Yes! But not everyone took finance or tracks equity markets. I hope this helps a little. I have more content on the topic in my newsletter.
This is so awesome. Have to save this for when I negotiate. Totally wouldn’t know most of this!
Thanks! Glad you found it helpful.
Welp... watching this was the most productive 45 min of my life!
Your advice that our stretch goal "may not even be high enough" was spot on. I actually exceeded my stretch early by keeping my mouth shut, and being respectful (but slightly apprehensive) whenever they put out a number. That made my counter easy too because I could ask for a smaller (5-10%) increase and show sincere gratitude to get it. Felt very win-win.
I do feel like this advice is more geared toward senior/staff and higher roles, and is sorta predicated on nailing the interview.
Glad you found it helpful! And nailing your interviews really helps but isn’t the only way to get the role. Just amplifies
Man, this video brings up so many strange emotions within me as a 28 yr old who just quit my job, looking to change industries completely starting at the bottom of the IT world, never made more than $60k a year, but also made more than my parents ever have. Just seeing these numbers thrown around feels so weird. It's aspirational/exciting/daunting/demoralizing/interesting all together. It's a great video all around. I hope one day it will be helpful for me
Good luck, it's certainly possible. I started in IT Support and after many years am a Staff Software Engineer. I really love the work and try my best.
Don’t worry about the huge numbers. Honestly I’d be fine making a small fraction of this after making 40k early in my career. Just make sure you’re in the best boat you can get into to when you start to row. That matters as much as how hard you row
Wish i saw this video earlier. Uk financial manager and set my salary against the other execs, however i bring so much more value to the table.
Employers have a procedural scarcity mindset and focus on percent increase being too high rather than value trade off.
Got 55k.
Yeah. It is like that. Different companies and industries…and even managers view things differently. You can do a lot with these strategies, but the company’s compensation philosophy can limit you unless you’re absolutely top talent.
Cant believe this guy has less than 7K subs. This is absolutely solid! This is worth listening to!
Just need to make more videos, I guess!
Man this is top notch content . Not ur typical yt channels with bs regurgitated advice!
Appreciated. I hope I have a higher bar than regurgitated crap though!
@@ColinLate oh I really do apologize, i meant. Better than the common regurgitated youtube crap you see from other channels. Thx again. Subbed on YT and to jr newsletter
It's pretty annoying when outside folks trivialize the technical interview and say things like "simply crush the technical interview and then you can negotiate". Dude, Meta is currently asking 3 medium Leetcode questions in 45 minutes. That's 1 medium every 15 minutes and you have to be perfect 3 times in arow. Congrats, my guy.. you can help the top 0.01% engineers negotiate a better salary.
Fair. It’s tough. We help folks negotiate all the time. You can still negotiate if you pass the interviews without being a top performer. It just limits your upside depending how you do on the other factors like unique skillset for the role and external leverage. At TikTok, they tier their negotiation strategy based on interview performance but we just got someone an $85k increase despite not being a top interview performer. It just helps a heck of a lot.
Do you have some hints for someone outside USA to get an interview in for example facebook?
I have over 8 years of experience in java, but I think that people inside USA get easier a chance.
most medium leetcode questions arent that hard tho...
more like top 10 to 5%
@@bartekburmistrz8679yes they are lol.
Wow! It’s been only 10 minutes through and I’ve already couple of insights I’m grateful for enough to like, comment and subscribe. Thank you!
Thank you! I really hope it helps
I knew the common advice to give the first number to appear confident is bs! That's some real value here, even though im more interested in working for medium sized companies. Going to shoot for a 50% salary increase by end of year with these techniques.
I wish you well! Let us know how it goes. What role/function/location?
@@ColinLate Thanks! Enterprise Linux Consultant in South Germany, 3 years experience.
You're direct but detailed in your explanations as well. Great indicator of communication skills and experience. Appreciate the vid, and subscribed.
Thank you and I hope it’s valuable
Great information. But I will say this. It seems the majority of what is described here is predominantly meant for specific Sr. level roles, or Fortune type orgs where a person would actually have such a huge window of salary/ options to negotiate to begin with. Assuming that's not where one is then there is either: NO negotiation via the company, OR a very small window to work in.
This works for startups and public tech companies primarily, yes. It does work elsewhere, but that’s what I know first hand.
Yes, what he is saying I think only applies to Senior roles at high growth start up / scale ups and large tech firms. Not just that but it only applies to technologists and perhaps sales and marketing. Finance, compliance, operations, risk management, audit and any other orgs not perceived as revenue generating or cost reducing have little to no leverage and would like lose the opportunity following this playbook. But seems like fantastic advice to those in which it applies.
I came here to make a mental note of entirely too optimistic youtube audience.
Ha. Not too optimistic. Just not as pessimistic.
love the content, very well structured and informative. appreciate it.
Thank you! I hope it is useful
That maple neck Strat tho. 🎸
Hendrix Strat 🎸🔥
I liked for the algo... but mainly because this was a great watch. Thanks a lot for this little gem
Truly appreciate it and I hope it’s helpful!
As everyone else has said, this is liquid gold! This is mostly geared towards those with some work experience. Do you have any wisdom for those who are currently students looking for internships or graduate roles in the future? Do you think it is even possible to negotiate compensation for graduate positions in the current market?
It is but it’s tough. I don’t know your specific situation so it’s very hard to give general advice, but if you do it, don’t take too much risk, do it in person kindly, and make sure you are okay with the consequences of a bad actor on the other side. I have definitely seen even in this market and even in Europe new grads negotiating successfully with big tech. It’s just tougher and your career is long anyway.
This is so well presented!
Thanks for a lot of validation!
Ha this is before I knew how to edit so I just did it old fashioned slides style. Glad you found it valuable! Check out my newsletter for more articles on the topic.
Glad this got recommended to me! I have been working in an engineering firm for about 9 months after graduate school and research, and I received a promotion 2 weeks ago. Typically, this next level takes about 3 years to get. However, the new title and merit increase doesn't take effect until November. We never discussed what the new salary would be. Should I be proactive in this case and bring this up now? I am worried that come November, they will use the excuse that there isn't time for negotiations anymore. I have saved this company multiple times my own salary so far this year so my worth is well known, but they know I don't want to leave as well
Promotion negotiations should start as much as a year or more before the promo. You need to create expectations and a plan that you track regularly with your boss. You can start later, but your best shot is to start with your manager yesterday
Amazing video. I feel that im still away to have a offer from a mang but who knows... i will keep working on this! Thank you for the video. Very informative!
MANG isn’t everything! Hope it’s valuable
Just make sure to do the math about your RSUs of your current position… you might feel good about your total comp increasing, but you gotta start all over with your vesting cycles!
Yes! I wrote an article on my newsletter recently about Pre-IPO job searches that tackles this a bit
Thank you. I find this video very information dense and helpful.
I recently walked away from an offer which, looking in hind sight with your video, was poorly negotiated on my part.
I think my key mistake was being way too transparent and divulging too much information too early. Specifically I told the recruiter my bottom line i.e. what's the minimum offer (+X% of my current comp) I'd consider an acceptable offer. And guess what, the offer came back almost exactly that amount.
So even after counter offers and negotiating upwards with several back and forths, I ended up in a place where I still felt I was being undervalued and I would lose on opportunity cost and work life balance for an amount that was not convincing, so I ended up walking away. Unfortunately I felt the recruiter and HM had the impression that I was never winnable from how I walked away and they were both unpleasantly surprised I rejected their adjusted offer downright.
Looking back, I did not evaluate my actual expectations accurately. I could see a world where we arrive at the final offer via a different route and I would have taken it, but I could also see myself getting a much better offer and be happy with that.
It’s hard to tell of course, but at least there is a different approach you will try next time. Many folks think there is no path forward when there might be if you understand how the other side feels. I don’t know all the context of that situation, but I have seen seemingly completely pulled offers be brought back to life through the right human, empathetic approach.
I think its important to re-iterate you have to be in a population of people that can take the risk of negotiating. I thought the advice is great for people that dont depend heavily on paying rent off. Of course if youre dedicated to spending your life in CS/tech, you will eventually get a role with negotiations. But some people prefer an initially conservative approach until they can break through initially. For instance, I already worked my first job in tech, but my second job only came recently after a year of job gap. Arguably a salary raise would make sense for the time without a job, but at the same time i cant risk savings over a few grand of salary increase.
Your personal runway both financially and psychologically and the downside risk are important factors in how aggressively you negotiate for sure. Great point
@@ColinLate Thanks. Ive always thought it was quite an interesting topic that tech jobs get paid in such a way. It seems like a lot of companies dont know what to expect so execs just go willie nillie with the company's cash reserves. Not much in the way of expectations and a standardized approach to software, is there. The EU and India pays differently salaries, but I think even they have to compete with the global market, too.
I suppose its always just mirrored the signs of a very young and risky industry. People do crazy stuff with not just their software, but money too, and its not always the best thing...
Very valuable, thanks for making this!
Hope it helps! You can read a new article on this at my newsletter: www.toptechnewsletter.com
HR: What projects have you worked lately?
Colin: I've read books on salary negotiation
You’re not wrong 😑
Good points. Also the book never split the difference is a pretty good add on to this advise.
I’ve definitely read it. Silence, mirroring, labeling, etc all work very well for our clients
Fantastic advice, thank you
Hope it helps
Now flip things around, how do I as an employer negotiate with potential employees?
Good question. I’m writing an article on how to hire great product leaders. I might include something on negotiation
This video is amazing, and doesn't get enough views and likes! Thank you so much!
Glad you liked it! Any questions for a follow up I’m making?
in this market you're lucky you get an offer, other than that yeah the advice is good
It’s true, but even with one offer we help people negotiate all the time these days. It’s just hard to get one!
This seems very tailored for rockstars.
Trust me this works for almost anyone who lands a job in a tech company. But again, in a modern US/EU tech company.
Hey Colin, great video I highly appreciate the clear and concise delivery, no gimmicks just facts, strategy and expertise. My question is, is it a good idea it to make a presentation that justifies why you deserve a raise. Something like a 15 minute slide deck? This could include projects you’ve excelled on, things you did that have high value, the likelihood function you were talking about and so on. Thanks hope to hear back!
Hey - This will really depend on a lot of factors. I don't know your function or workplace culture, but I rarely think a presentation is the right way to go. For both new offer negotiations and raises, I usually recommend a 30/60/90 day draft plan that you go over collaboratively with your Hiring Manager as well as collecting a brag book. Consider promotions and raises a multi-month process where you work together with your manager to set expectations, track progress, get feedback to grow, and then it shouldn't be a surprise whether you're getting a raise or promotion in the end. Presentations are too one-directional.
Interesting point about using other offers as the last lever for the top offer. Is there some more background to that?
No fancy story behind this one. It’s typically just because you only have so many rounds to negotiate. This path tends to get the first back and forth in a bidding war to start from a higher place. It then starts the first of 2-3 rounds of negotiation with your top choice from a higher first number.
This is an incredible video.
Huge thank you!
A video about how to interpret recruiters words/messages would also be very helpful to tag on to this video.
When they say this…..it means or could mean this.
Glad it helped!
Interesting. Do you have some examples?
@@ColinLate Example: Talent emails me right after 4 final interviews and wants to schedule a meeting for follow up.
They want to “see how I felt they went and chat.” Any insight on this vague message?
Overall slides on if they say this…..it could mean 1, 2, or 3. Similar to your slides on prep for negotiation.
You are making the best videos on this overall process/subject. Big thanks! 🙏
Wish I found this video 2 months ago, before starting this recent position. But at least I'll have these tools for the future. Thanks for sharing!
I hope it helps! Similar principles for raises. I may post something on that eventually
Great video!
Thank you! I hope it helps
I am 40 with lots of experience. Currently I am a SE Manager with additional Lead Developer tasks. Can I still apply to FAANG?
You can. It depends on a lot of factors though. What companies you worked at, how fast it grew, what impact you drive, how well you interview, will you network into FAANG well, are you located in the right region, etc.
Thank you vey much, keep up posting , you saved my tine!
Glad it’s helpful!
What to do if the companies hiring process has a mandatory unskippable number-only field on their hiring web application called "expected salary"
Your only goal is to move forward. That means not being filtered for too low or too high. Very hard to say without knowing your content, but typically looking for the range in the job description and picking near the middle is fine. You will need to negotiate later when you have built up leverage. Just make sure to deflect questions and if they ask about your entry, tell them you were not thinking of comp this early in the process, as normal. Sometimes they’ll try to guilt you but they set up an ill conceived form system. Just be kind and do the rest of the steps as normal.
"Recruiter: Sorry we have a no-negotiation policy" Is this ever actually the case?
Also, is it possible to boost base-salary, even if it means reducing the equity value? I'd think its probably hard with startups since they are more strapped for immediate cash, but wondering how much leeway there is
Sometimes it is. Small startups will not negotiate sometimes on base salary with lower level candidates. Some big companies will not negotiate much with new grads. In general, it’s usually a white lie. They just mean they can’t negotiate until they get an executive to make an exception for you.
Salary negotiation? Brother I'm just trying to get a single interview lol
The struggle is real!
what are the best responses to dodge the first compensation question with the recruiter?
There are many. Depends on context but they can all work: Just focusing on interviews now. Deflect and ask their range then say you’re sure you’ll come to something that works for everyone. Hard to say before meeting the team, learning more about the role, and have all the details. Just starting your search. Pick a bunch. Usually they’ll let you go.
Great video. Lots of substance!
I hope it helps you!
@@ColinLate it was packed useful Tips and you structured it so clean and easy to follow.
Incredible content - thank you so much.
I hope it helps! Thanks
Grate vid! for 28:00 what is the right answer is there any way to use it as leverage?
Which specific question?
@@ColinLate Interviewing elsewhere?
Incredible video. I do all of this. And it works
Would love to hear your story
HR: What skill are you good at?
Colin: I am a pro in salary negotiation
HR: What skill are you bad at?
Colin: Everything else
If you can only be good at one thing…
This is such a helpful video. I wish I had seen this before getting my job with Amazon or moving on to a different company.
Question - Does this work when you get a promotion within the same company? Do you ever negotiate with your annual reviews or just take the compensation that you are offered.
You do a different process. Some of the same principles apply. Start keeping a brag book, work with your manager up to a year before the promotion cycle to keep aligning with them monthly and do 30-60-90 day plan reviews with them when it comes up to a cycle to let them know you’re ready for the promo. One day I’ll do a video on this but check out a life engineered on TH-cam in the meantime
Does this work in early career, or when you're not top talent? I often find myself negotiating lower just to increase my chances of landing the job.
I don’t know your situation, but I’ve seen m new grads and folks who barely got an offer negotiate successfully.
Excellently presented and thoroughly insightful, going through this now, much appreciated Colin!
Thanks! Check out my newsletter for some more on the topic
Taking your advice. I will let you know how it goes.
Please do! Also read the latest article on the topic at www.toptechnewsletter.com
@@ColinLate I did get a 5k counter offer. Not what I was looking for but the practice of negotiating is key. One more email sent and like you mentioned, pays off in the end.
Thank you so much for the awesome content!
Is there any recommendations for internal hiring? When they all know about my current pay/position and the recruiter specifically said that there's very little room to negotiate.
It’s harder to negotiate internally. You can still do it, but they have more power in the relationship usually. Some companies just won’t negotiate much as a policy for internal transfers
I would work directly with the hiring manager though. Go through a 30:60:90 day plan after you get the offer with them. Work through the impact and scope and ask them if they’ll go to bat for you in a negotiation.
Really interesting video, despite not even being remotely relevant to my (comparatively) miniscule income / career i'm currently in
Well this is mostly relevant to tech, but principles may still apply. I wouldn’t worry so long as your income helps you live well and meet your goals. People are never satisfied, even high earners in tech.
Small criticism but I find the belief at the start that executives at fast growing startups or VPs at FAANG might know better than some other experts extremely naïve. You don't know what made them arrive there, or in spite of what they made it here
Yep, that’s why I get as many perspectives as I can. I actually coach executives on negotiations now because many haven’t even needed to negotiate to earn a lot. But many executives have experienced both sides of 100s of negotiations in their careers and they have very useful lessons.
The vid seems to have a lot of points in common with Haseeb's "how not to bomb your offer negociation" series of articles, I loved those blog posts. Have you read them?
Yes I have. Definitely recommend the read. I don’t agree with b 100% but it’s very worthwhile. Another great negotiator also posted another article on my newsletter: www.toptechnewsletter.com
Hi there, quick query: if you negotiate too hard and manage to gain a salary at the top of the range band, do you put yourself in a danger zone eventually when layoffs are round the corner? Or are layoffs regardless of salary levels?
There are rare instances where this happens, but most layoffs are based on when you were hired, performance, and the team you’re on. The marginal difference in probability of layoffs off is probably 5-10% vs all the other factors
But it depends on the company culture around cost cutting
Alright understood. Means being an outlier in terms of salary among others would play a 5-10% role in defining whether you will be laid off.
Looking at these numbers... I'm working for peanuts. And made to feel I'm lucky to do so.
Money isn't everything. I know folks who are very happy without all this. I used to make CAD$39k/year. It was stressful. I thought about work much less, but money a lot more.
There is always a balance between what you want and your output once you’re in the job. If expectations are not met you risk termination all future offers with other companies.
This is sometimes true, but I mostly find that the extra compensation doesn’t affect expectations as much as you would think. It’s situation dependent.
@@ColinLate Sure - Another point which is overlooked and we see this all the time is a candidate negotiates a high salary get the job then at some point has to go out to market only to alarmed that others are paying nowhere as much with little option but to take less. Be cautious and demonstrate merit and value in the job and earn your way up. That’s much more sustainable.
Great video! Thanks
Much appreciated! Hope it helps
Fantastic content, I subbed!
Thanks! I really hope it helps in your next negotiation
Great info...thanks!
Thanks! Let me know if you have questions
I'ts been a while since I was able to watch a 40+ min youtube video. This is so much value
That means a lot! But makes me feel old for listening to podcasts that are 2+ hrs long on TH-cam while doing chores
@@ColinLate I also go for 5+ hour long ambient sound loops for working but I don't consider it active watching. Here I was paying attention
most workday application systems that you have to fill out before you apply ask your salary expectations, what do you put in there?
I try to avoid those awful forms! But seriously your main objective there is to move forward, not negotiate. Depends on the role/company/industry. For US PM roles I would put near the top end of the job posting range on the JD. That’s just the base salary anyway. You can tell the recruiter when they bring it up that you weren’t thinking of compensation at this stage and just entered a number, but are sure you will come to something that works for everyone later in the process. Some recruiters get upset that you surprised them so you can get around this by telling them after your 1st round interviews that you didn’t know what to enter there at the time and will discuss it later once you meet the team and know more about the role. You can also bring up if you’re in process with other companies but don’t mention details at this point.
is this a smart thing to do for a first professional job in finance? for example IB or accounting etc.
or should I take whatever they give me for the first year or two so that at least I have some experience in my CV for my next position?
I know less about IB. New grad roles are usually less negotiable but it’s worth trying a low aggression version. I’ve seen new grads negotiating in tech with some success. Some companies and offices don’t but I can’t speak to your specific circumstances
Just lower your aggression if you do decide to try it unless you have very good backup alternatives. I speak only from a US tech perspective
What's your take on smaller job markets like Poland? It seems like there are much fewer opportunities to negotiate above market due to less venture money or FAANG competing for talent
I’m definitely less familiar, but in Western and Central Europe, I know negotiations are definitely possible. I can imagine you can negotiate, but the level bands are just less broad. There are many more roles there. I recommend following some of the tech creators in that area like Pawel Huryn. (My family is Polish in origin, actually)
Those numbers are total compensation correct? That would put the base in a more restricted range such as low-mid six figures.
BTW, just finished listening. Great video. Thank You!
Yes. Base has much more narrow a band. It also makes up less as you move up
Is there a case for settling in a compensation range early in the process *on your end* so that you don't waste your time, if both sides are putting up a poker face (i.e. employer not required to provide bands)?
Not as if we're all getting multiple offers these days to warrant "time waste", but still.
I rarely worry about time waste, but it depends heavily on your situation for whether you want to pursue further or not. I’ve definitely seen some major changes. We helped a PM negotiate a senior pm role into a director offer.
How applicable is this to other industries? For example, engineering in manufacturing
Unfortunately I can’t say since I’ve only used this in software companies.
@@ColinLateThanks for the reply
This is an awesome content. Thank you so much 😀
Thanks! I’m glad it’s helpful. I plan to create more here
I watched your other video on top jobs in tech and data scientists were at $166k if I understood your chart correctly. Im in data at low six figures right now. I’m looking online and the jobs appear to be in the 65k-130k range and the higher end is as a senior data scientist. What can I do to get to where you are or close to it? Do you have resources? Recruiters? I feel lost as to what skills/certificates/other forms of validation I should actually spend time on that convert reliably to income. Then, who is even offering these high salaries? Is it just FAANG? How much are people faking it till they make it? My perception is that people in these jobs could run circles around me based on job requirements for even 80k jobs. I feel completely out of the game and it makes me sad and frustrated. It’s like there’s something I totally missed and I don’t know how/where to get it and what reality is vs my self-doubt.
Aha. To clarify: That other video had median compensation across individual contributor levels, not entry level.
The other aspect is that they are Total Compensation including bonuses and equity. Job postings have basic base salary ranges that don’t include equity as well. Look at levels.fyi
@@ColinLate Appreciate it man! Do you have a suggestion on where to look for recruiters? Does levels cover that?
Are you saying $2 million is the sum total of the offers you received in that year, or you received a single offer for $2 million?
I have received offers with total compensation including equity ranging from 350k to over 2m. This video is a year old and those were from 2 years ago at the peak of the market. I’d say today it would likely be 800k-1.2m depending on the role. Many caveats. In terms of negotiated increases, it’s millions in just the increases between myself and the people I’ve helped. Most recently we’ve helped three people in a row get $80k or more per year in increases.
This great Video, I have lot of question for you
What’s your top question?
@@ColinLate if I accept an offer with a competitor tech company can my current company find out? I was able to get a great offer with our competitors, my questions is that I have 5 days to sign the contract but i am working on a voluntary separation package over 100k with my current company and need to stay with them for 2 more weeks without taking any offers. The starting date with new company is 2 weeks after my last day with current company. If I accept I am worried they will find out. What should I do or tell the recruiter? His telling me they will not find out.
So true. I got cucked at my current company. Senior SWE and there are mid-levels making more. WTF?
Sorry to hear that! It’s very normal. You can negotiate internally though it’s much harder.
This is really helpful. Thanks dude.
Much appreciated!
TLDR; if you perfectly nail the interview process, you will get perfectly awesome results!
That helps but is not sufficient! You still have to negotiate. I helped someone who bailed their interviews increase their comp +$115k and get an up-level. They would have had neither if they didn’t negotiate properly.
heh, I wish I saw this video 5 years ago :)
Better late than never!
Selling yourself as if you were an appliance.
Except appliances work in my house longer than employees work in tech companies
Most comanies are not willing to pay 2x for a great candidate, even if they could be 5x in productivity. They'd rather have 2 mediocre employees.
Depends on the company and role. The bands can be within 50-60% lowest to highest. Check levels.fyi for your function and level at a few companies to see the spread
Jhonny Sins?
🥸
Hearin a lotta Oren Klaff in here
Never heard of him. Just Googled and will take a look
@@ColinLate he wrote the book Flip the Script which primarily outlined the concept of framing. I never thought to see if he originated the concept or anything, but it's pervasive throughout the book.
Now to find the job that's paying 10m a year
Achievable stretch goal
For what
I dont know what world you live in that you have companies lining up for you and high expectations and all that.
In Colombia I apply to 20 companies, get one interview, ask for like 20k a year, they simply say no and leave.
Maybe you've been lucky indeed with all those mentors.
My experience is very much biased to US modern tech companies.
How do you recover if you gave a low salary expectation in the beginning because you were having some bad luck in the job search and throught the job market is worse than it is
New information, new leverage, new circumstances, new competing opportunities. All ways to re open negotiations. It happens sometimes. You’re fighting against that first anchor but after you get the offer, you will want to bring up your new information and argument for a higher offer in your counter. Ideally this is because the role is bigger scope than you originally thought, you learned your market value through other offers or interview processes, or you just learned from others at the company about what to expect. There is a lot that goes into an offer other than compensation, so you can bring up anything. More risk than you anticipated, giving up other opportunities, etc.
Lots of ways around it but it’s just a bit tougher and you have to manage their emotions since they may be annoyed by your change.
This sounds fantastic for US passport holders and maybe even EU. But how does one outside of that deal with negotiating with US companies? Say for example a skilled dev from Ghana could qualify for a job but be low balled just for country of origin.
I don’t have that experience unfortunately, so it’s hard to say. Talking about value to the company and how investing in you will pay off could work, but the situation is foreign to me.
@@ColinLate Understandable. Ever came across anyone who defeated those odds?
why be neutural but not overly excited in the offer call? That helps you to be winnable, but does it make it so much harder to negotiate later?
If you act disappointed in the call, you will almost certainly make a misstep and lose leverage or even worse, get sucked into questioning and negotiating by the recruiter on the call. That always leads to worse outcomes than planning your counter and coming back later prepared with your approach.
The problem for me is I have 3 years of exp doing network tech stuff. But now all the jobs out there are only offering $15-$20 an hour. Which is less then what I was making previously. And yet they don’t even do call backs after hundreds of applications sent. Im working two service industry jobs to survive now. My new hourly wage as bartender is 2.13 an hour.
I feel for you. That’s a tougher situation than many. Networking (the people kind) is your friend. It’s not going to be easy, but whatever you invest your time in, make sure you’re building optionality for your future. New skills. Try other related functions. I don’t know your situation or location, but find community with others out there in the hunt. There are many