Computer science education: why does it suck so much and what if it didn’t? | Ashley Gavin | TEDxNYU
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 17 พ.ค. 2024
- Ashley’s talk shines a light on the major problem that is American Computer Science education. In 2020, 1.4 million new jobs will be available for those with competing backgrounds, but we’ll only have engineers to fill two-thirds of them. Ashley shows us how we can right this wrong.
Ashley Gavin is a computer science education consultant with a passion for making computer science curricula empowering, accessible, and above all, fun. Her work in curriculum and program development serves as the foundation for some of the finest educational organizations in the country including her brainchild “Girls Who Code”.
During high school, Ashley was actively interested in tech. However, she was denied access to computer science courses at her school due her failing grades in math and science. In her senior year, the newly appointed CS teacher noticed her affinity for tech and took a risk by letting her drop math and take computer science instead. Ashley has since been working to do so for as many students as possible, especially those in underrepresented groups.
This talk was given at a TEDx event using the TED conference format but independently organized by a local community. Learn more at ted.com/tedx
The less people going into computer science, the more the people calling me a genius.
ocast evo ok so I'm assuming you are a computer scientist. So i have some questions... 1. What do you do in your job.
2. Is it a normal 9 to 5 job
3.how much $$
4. Is the college course stressing?
5. Do you need bloody math?
the more people calling you a nerd
...exxaaaactly , less cs students more jobs
LosEagle okay but i’ll be richer than them lol
That's real. The more value your major is as well.
Wow 5 years have passed. Ashley Gavin is a great comedian and an amazing podcast host! Crazy to see where people come from
hey thank you!
@@ashgavs welp, and now she's saying horrible stuff to people.
@@Zack29810there was more to that story
Her first stand up gig! She nailed it!
This TED Talk encouraged me to go into computer science. Now I'm in my second year in college and I love it
How is it going? 🦋🌺🍃
@@bashaerhaddad4619 Going great, thanks for asking. I graduated last June and am now working full time as a Software Engineer
@@m.houdeib thanks for the great updates ! 🤍🤍 Soo happy for you :)
I am thinking about transferring to computer science
@@m.houdeib hey man would you mind if I ask in which state you are working and approximately how much do u earn. I wanna start studying CS but I am not so familiar with the salary.
@@alex-025x I am based in Lebanon.
But I guarantee that wherever you are in the world, after a Bachelor in CS you will be paid very well relatively to those who graduated at the same time as you from different majors. Software developers are the most in demand workers in all countries and states, and are hence paid appropriately.
When she said only 8% of people in computer science are of color, I was like wait, my AP CSA class is literally 60% indian
wrong color
@@wildmoonchild8210 that's facts
And my comp sci classes are 90% white. Your experience isn’t representative of everyone’s.
Yen Tre p mine is 93% white, which is not a bad thing but it’s something to point out.
There’s no white kids in my CS classes in pennstate lol
Thank you so much for this speech. I'm a 32 year old looking to study CS in the Spring semester of 2016. I was feeling *super* overwhelmed by the "math" aspect and this was ... just what I needed to hear. Thank you so much.
+Jessie Zimmer any accredited university is going to give you math courses, so unless you plan on going to a non accredited, don't get your hopes up. Get ready to take Discrete Math, Finite Automata, Statistics, Calc 1 and 2. :)
I'm not saying I *don't* wanna do math classes - I realize they're vital to the major - I simply appreciate her speech for helping me see that with patience, hard-work and support that I can accomplish it.
+Jessie Zimmer Very true. Absolutely hated math and rarely studied it in high school. Once I got into computer science, I studied up and tore through the calc series and have gotten a good deal into learning Java/C++. I'm not amazingly smart in any sense, just put in a good deal of time.
That's awesome! Congratulations on your achievements Razuu, time and the willingness to just keep on truckin' can get you a long way. So glad you shared your story!
Jessie Zimmer Thank you! Wish all the same for you.
"Computer scientists are second in terms of job satisfaction"
_(shows images of three multi-billionaire CEOs)_
MM!! Lol true
This is a stat from a large pool of responses and has nothing to do with the top 3 ceos.
Yeah I know. It still weakens her point rhetorically.
great irony
MM!! and its actually the opposite
I feel bad for her cuz nobody laughed at her jokes.
+AsianBatman her friends were the only ones laughing at her jokes.
+AsianBatman I thought I was the only one who noticed that :)
Strange, the algorithm she wrote to had this line: System.out.println("Haha, you're funny");
No idea what went wrong with it. :/
She's also a comic (check her site)
TED crows is way too serious
People of her and like-minded nature have different sense of humor.
show me a java dev that doesnt know what "static" means and I'll show you a java dev that shouldn't have a job...
***** Java still has a lot of useful applications. It's worlds faster than the newer interpreted languages like python and ruby, it's easy to write and maintain, and it's cross platform compatible. Also another huge advantage is the decades of open source projects written for it. Java is starting to show its age a little bit but it is far from irrelevant.
Also to nitpick; no mainstream languages are "better" than another, they just have different strengths and weaknesses.
+Adriel Kloppenburg Programming languages are like tools. Each tool serves a different purpose and can get one job done better or worse than another. You seemed to acknowledge something along those lines in your previous comment but just wanted to add to it. You can't really say a programming language is better or worse than another. Averaged out... maybe so. But certain languages can help accomplish a certain task more efficiently than another.
+jking13 LOL right? hahah
+jking13 static = I don't need an instance of an object to work (and thus no hidden pointer gets passed to me), I'm just a regular function that happens to "exist" within a class definition because you can't have a function outside of a class or object.
But how many java devs understand what's in ()s?
+FreeER “aka” atubeacct
I work with java professionally almost every day (I'm a java dev that fucks with ruby and ember.js occassionally). I understand what static means. My point was that any java dev worth paying would understand the keywords, syntax, and have at least a high level understanding of how the jvm works.
Last night, I was watching computerphile. I fell asleep on autoplay and woke up at 3am to this.
I just went back and there was an hour talk before this
the same shit happened to me. This chick probably did something to my unconscious mind.
Computerphile >>> Ted Talks.
I don't know. Ted Talks was always a mixed bag, but it's been a long time since I've seen anything half as interesting as any of the Computerphile videos. She's probably a good professor in the classroom, but this presentation is all over the map. And usually I don't like negative TH-cam comments, but I have to agree with most of the criticism here.
Maybe part of it is that Ted Talks presenters tend to assume the audience is kinda dumb instead of just new to the topic. I feel like Computerphile can get relatively technical and stay interesting, even though I don't have any background in Computer Science.
Yeah, nothing good happens after 11:00pm.
lol best comment
I think she's talking about software engineering education, not computer science education. Math is an integral part of computer science, because math is the language of science. If you took math from computer science, by definition, you took science out of computer science, which is quite bizarre.
+Yohanes Mario Chandra Definitely. She really only discusses it in regards to programming. Actual computer science encompasses far more. You can be a good programmer without any further CS knowledge but then your skill with algorithms isn't as finely tuned as it could be which is an essential part to the process. There's a whole lot more that could be said there.
Math is an "integral" part of computer science
pun intended?
Spoder Man LOL. I didn't realize that. No, no pun is intended.
+Yohanes Mario Chandra the ideas and theorems of computer science exist independently of math, math just happens to be a pretty neat and formal way of communicating those ideas.
for a lot of those millions of jobs, you don't need to be able to prove the halting problem as undecidable starting from nothing but the ZFC axioms.
I agree the difference between softeng/programming and compsci maybe should be noted but meh, in a context like this it kind of feels like nitpicking. that is not what the talk was actually about.
eNSWE computer science is made for people to be able to work as computer scientist. It just happen to acomodate many other jobs. As a computer scientist, or as a scientist in general, you need to be able to prove your theories using math most of the time.
I implied that this talk should focus on the applied side of CS, like the software engineering branch or IT branch, not the core CS.
And it's not nitpicking when you have to decide that you should abandon math in computer science. Imagine computer scientists with minimal math knowledge.
Studying computer science is my dream. Due to circumstances, I unfortunately couldn't study it. I am still trying my best to learn a little about it through online courses while working.
I’ll pray for you bro. You don’t really need the degree. My uncle doesn’t have a degree yet he’s top at AT&T. Just learn to program which is much easier than college.
5:35 the moment she realised her boss is listening..
“Despite this, no one takes it”
Well 4 years later it feels like everyone takes it.
I'm in the comp sci major. I love computer science when I learn and practice it on my own but when I'm in class, it's terribly boring.
This video: "Coding isn't all about math! Coding is easy!"
Comments section: "WELL ACKCHYUALLY..."
Computer Science tought me how to think and to aproach a problem. Im proud to be a CS major!
Yes, she's a computer science professor BUT above all; she's a tremendously good salesperson.
Salespeople everywhere, this was a masterclass in salesmanship.
She took every objections, exposed them and diffused them.
She was self-depricating and thus humanized herself.
She delivered a promise of a better tomorrow, by joining the ranks of computer scientists.
Kudos.
Comedy was always in your blood Ashley. The jokes in between were hilarious. However after listening to this talk I'm a little sad that you left the field coz I'm guessing you were great at it just like you're great now at comedy and podcasting. Would love to hear this story on the whgs podcast in one dedicated episode
Any computer scientist who doesn't know what the 'static' keyword is should be fired from life.
+chasenallimcam I'm sorry, would you elaborate? Why a single word from a specific domain of computer science should be more important than another, except that it is the kind of things you work on? I think people should understand classical curry howard to understand the nature of computing and reasoning, am i being obnoxious about that?
+Cao Li Similar, yes, but also different.
+chasenallimcam There are alot of computer scientists who do not deal with object oriented programming but with other aspects of computer science, for example computer architecture, operating systems etc. I don't think knowing what static is is that essential to all of them. Moreover it means different thing in different languages, take of example C..
Juan2003gtr fuck off kid u know shit
+hal Disclaimer not a computer scientist.
I know a static public variable in C# can be called from multiple scripts in unity within the same project. and the scripts are stored as files in a folder.
I don't know what static actually dose or means though or if its the different in other languages?
she has her degree in CS and never took pre calc?
+Erik Ratcliffe So true. She mixed up "programming" and "computer science" a couple of times. (maybe on purpose?) They are 2 different things. Most programmers I've met don't know anything about computer science.
Schools don't teach computer science, they teach programming (if they do at all).
She said computer science is easy. I don't think it is. Programming is.
+Dennis E "Schools don't teach computer science, they teach programming (if they do at all)". By schools do you mean non-universities? Any accredited university be it state, city, or private teaches Computer Science.
Raymond Ferranti
Yes, that's what I meant with schools.
+Raymond Ferranti yeah that's weird, she probably got her degree a years ago with different standards. Nowadays, most cs majors have to talk calc, discrete , and linear algebra depending on what you want to do with cs.
+Victor P. Yea you're right, the math you are required to use completely depends on which industry you go into. But still, advanced mathematics courses really help train your brain to think algorithmically.
computer science != programming
cfish some parts of it do. Also different schools have different outlooks on its applications. But yeah there are definitely a lot of other things out there to do with a CS degree
majority of the jobs are programing....but there are jobs which dont need programming like network engineer etc...anyways if you dont like programing or less have logical thinking please dont take computer science as your major...you will suffer a lot in completing it
@@jithin9541 programming is a much smaller portion of computer science than you're making it seem. Mathematics is almost just as important for a true computer scientist. Tons of jobs don't require programming
I think you mean Assert.assertTrue(!"computer science".contentEquals("programming")); (thanks Java)
@@lms702 assert !"computer science".equals("programming");
I thought the core message was bang on. As a comp sci teacher myself my lessons are all about problem solving...oh and we can use tech to help us solve them...if you want. CS is not just coding, nowhere close.
During the process of solving a problem, if you find yourself needing to communicate to someone/thing in a different language that requires subtle and deep knowledge of that language, then go and find someone who has put the effort into learning another language to that detail and get back to solving problems.
CS is hard in this country because there is elitism and because we have our educational priorities ass-backwards. Every writing or composition based class I ever took, the teachers made the curriculum amenable to doing things over: you could revise essays, you could actually follow the feedback and improve. In CS courses, you are PUNISHED for being wrong. You are PUNISHED for making mistakes. I've had professors LAUGH in my face when requesting extra credit or attempt to improve my programs. These things are essential to learning yet most of these classes are not structured to give people time or room to learn. Most classes act as gatekeeping mechanisms: you have the skills or you don't. This is why these classes are so hard.
that's some good insight, thanks
Dude this hit home. Plus the syllabus is not always good (usually it's pretty bad), good ones are usually only available at top schools. But, over the years I've learned that the ability to write code on paper/whiteboard is pretty important and while mistakes should be forgiven in class, you should minimize it. But yeah, tl;dr syllabus and structure sucks.
I can totally relate. The only computer science classes I was able to take were Intro to Java and Software 1, and the most annoying part is that mostly everyone in the class says that the coursework is easy. All of the classes had projects that you couldn't redo, the "tutoring center" had highly inconsistent amounts of help that they would give people. I've now switched to Geographical and Information Science, so there's still some programming but hopefully they will be more lenient and the tests won't be as weird
Joneshing I agree. At my particular big reputable state university, it felt as though the instructors were more about "playing games" with students than actually genuinely teach. Learning how to program and the intricacies of math, science etc. takes careful time...should not be rushed like they do at uni. God forbid you make any mistakes....which is supposed to be the entire point of learning! Do you have any proof of your comment by the way?
If I'm writing a paper, even with an excellent rubric, I can't be sure if I did it correctly or satisfactorily until the individual responsible for evaluating my paper gives me feedback on it. I could write a paper arguing that the social and economic impact of undocumented immigration is universally statistically detrimental according to my cited and reputable sources. I could still fail if my professor personally disagrees with a premise based on something unknown to me. If you are writing code with a specific objective, you should be able to evaluate the outcome continuously until it meets the objective. Your only constraint is time, and that's when the the unfun bits of knowledge become important. If I hand you a boxed jigsaw puzzle that truly has all the pieces and a reference picture, you should be able to tell if you put it together correctly without me checking it.
Wow this was amazing watching and would like my instructor to be like her. She is to the point and understands that needing more programmers. I am just getting started and it is all about problem solving
this changed my whole entire perception. i wish i saw this when i was younger. i wish all programming classes were taught like how she has
This is so inspiring for a beginner programmer who feels out of my league compared to all the maths genuises at my uni
How is it going?
Aw poor Ashley no one is laughing but me after I saw you plug this in a different TH-cam video. I think you’re so funny
there is a long story to this, but the short version is, this was not the original audience and they were not mic-ed. the original talk had a technical issue and the tape was lost. so, i wasn't sad, because both audiences laughed, i just got screwed on the tech.
“I’ve been coding for 10 years, I still find this terrifying!” - that was good enough for a chuckle at least.
Tough crowd
This needs to be played for every CS freshmen in the world.
Out of so many reasons to study computer science, she had to mention the hot girls, well it's NOT about computer science at all, but money, yeah you just need to make a lot money and girls will "fall in love with you" (it really doesn't matter how you make it). If you want to do something, do it for yourself and not because of the money and what it might bring you!
+Wesley Satelis I think it was just a poor joke
Although she’s wrong about the math part. I definitely believe that professors like to make learning CS harder than it should be.
A lot of professors are gatekeepers, they want students to fail
Computer science is about algorithms, mathematics, numbers and logic. Stop saying that computer science should be this free for all degree. Guess what, if "Hello World" in Java is scary to you, you don't belong into computer science. She is talking about people being able to code a game in their first week but "Hello World" is too complicated? Sure, and lets just say physics is not about math, its about cool experiments and empowerment.
I agree, but I think she was trying to connect with her audience. I mean, her talk would be less memorable if she instead had a much more complicated example up there, and made it seem simple.
I couldnt agree more with you
Java is awful as an introductory language though, right up there with C++ and brainfuck. At least brainfuck has some use early on when you get to writing compilers and interpreters.
ultru Actually I think c++ is way more popular for writing compilers and interpreters. Why is Java so bad? I think it's excellent to learn on, the tools are very mature, there are thousands of classes baked in that handle pretty much everything you can think of, a huge community, tons of jobs for junior devs, it's easy to share programs, no hassle compiling for different os's or architectures. Beginners can literally jump right in, import a few swing components and have simple gui programs in no time. Also, I find Java is extremely strict and encourages good code early on. If someone just wants to code with little mental effort, then it's python all the way, but for someone serious about pursuing a career in coding, it's hard to imagine Java being awful.
Jadin Andrews That's not obviously what I meant, Brainfuck's great to write your first compiler for. You'd literally have to an insane genius to either write your first compiler in brainfuck, or write your first compiler for C++. All the reasons you listed are good reasons to use it for writing portable commercial GUI applications, but that's not what students will be doing in the first semester of programming. Letting them write bad code and cause segfaults is actually a good learning experience. A lot of people seem to have this impression that learning a new programming language is hard, so if you do learn one, it'd better be one you'll be using once you graduate years later, that learning anything else would be a "waste of time." They couldn't be more wrong. I learned Perl by looking at someone's Perl script and thinking I could do better, 2 hours later I'd written a better one. Once I started programming, I picked up 12 languages in 3 months, and ended up being better at Java than if I only focused on Java. Programming languages are just tools, if you're gonna learn metalworking, you should start with a simple soldering kit, not an industrial arc welder.
Whaaa??? Computer Sci without Pre-cal even?? I myself am contemplating Computer or Mechanical Engineering..so I had had to double check the course catalog for CS here. You DEFINITELY have to take at least 2 levels of Calculus for Comp Sci, 4 levels of it for Comp Engineering. I understand that they're trying to make CS look more palatable to the regular Joe/Jane, but..this is like flat out lying.
You have to remember she got her original bachelor's over a decade or more ago. I got a buddy who's a Network Security PM and I don't think actual full on calculus was taken either. Back then such rigorous requirements were often not needed by many universities. perhaps she's misguided by her alma matter's old curriculum? anyhow, I still liked her lecture. It served it's purpose. She's trying to get people interested at least in a sub-field. Especially because general CS skills will become as essential as speaking English or reading in the next 10 yrs...shes trying to wake up the humanities and social science majors...let her do her thing!
No I am not saying they are computer scientists. I'm saying various schools back in the day required something different.
I am in the midst of changing majors, but I am currently a business undergrad community college student. The only way I can get into many schools is if I take at LEAST up to Calc 2. Some require more depending on your concentration in business. Other schools required just business calc (whatever that means) and I had a friend transfer from a CC to one University with just statistics...
While business is totally different from Computer Science, what I am saying is it's highly possible some places had lower requirements. I know business undergrad programs are amping up what they now require. Perhaps CS was not as beefy at some state universities back in the day? I know many private unis have gotten away with all kinds of crap, especially Christian Unis offering STEM majors...
You really don't need to know much math to program.
Maths is very useful in particular fields of CS (Machine Learning for example), but to code up a script/function that does some form of functional task doesn't require any difficult maths most of the time.
Your theory for why she said what she said is quite plausible. I absolutely understand the underlying message and motive of her presentation which I do agree with (getting people to not be as intimidated and scared of tech fields due to a perceived inadequacy in math). However, here are my issues:
1) Setting up the wrong expectations. Getting someone excited and motivated to do something by setting unrealistic/wrong expectations and later having them disappointed once they find out the reality of the situation is the most discouraging of all. Let's say someone does get motivated to look into getting into Computer Sci or Computer Engineering due to this presentation. This presentation will set the expectation that not even Precal is needed to pursue this. Math requirements for these fields will not vary much between schools due to #2.
2) ABET accredited schools will all require higher level math to pursue these fields. So again, let's say someone with an inferiority complex in math becomes motivated to pursue CS or CE from this presentation and finds out that much more than Precal is required to do this. I did not really think there were schools that offered CS or CE without at least some higher level math, but let's say there are as you plausibly suggested. The only way they could pursue a CS or CE degree then is to go to an non-ABET accredited school. If that is what this presentation leads people to do to get around the higher math requirement, then this presentation will have caused a great disservice to those individuals. There are actually non-ABET accredited schools with good programs, but with all things being equal, given the choice between going to a school with ABET certification and going to one without one, you have to go with the one with ABET (again, with all things being equal).
3) If this hypothetical non-ABET accredited school that offers CS or CE does not require even PreCalculus, will this not make one question just how rigorous the rest of the program is? I know one thing, potential employers will. Again, this would be a great disservice to that individual that is led to get a CS or CE degree from such a school with lower requirements. Again, I know there are great schools without the ABET certification with great programs in these fields, however I guarantee that these schools, like their ABET certified counterparts will require higher level math.
Computational Programming or Computer Science is more on finding the formula. E=MC2 plus I/O. Its not easy. Information Technology on the other hand is the user of the Computer Science Products. Computer itself + OS + Computer Language + Database + Web. There are more opportunities in IT than in Computer Science. But Computer Science can easily adapt towards IT Discipline.
You know what really is preventing people from majoring in Computer Science?
The Math courses, especially calculus.
And Software engineer
Data Bases
Algorythms and data structures
Algebra and geometry
Math analysis.
nytrox93 To me many people like doing stuff on their own.
If they can't do simple Calculus, they are not prepared for harder classes like Data Structures and Algorithms which are the foundation for any computer scientist.
I literally was hoping and praying i'd find a video like this to get my son motivated to take CS in college. thank you!!!
Great talk! I'm more on the design side of things but you have encouraged me to dive into learning the computer science side of things as well. Thank you!
is computer science hard for u ?how did it go
Computer science is a medium for problem solving and self-expression - Ashely Gavin
I like her definition.
My brother told me about CS and I started looking up about it. This video is really really helpful, thanks
I did python tutorial after python tutorial and none of it ever stuck. It wasnt until it really mattered at my job that I was pushed to learn basic computer science principles, and not long after that -Python. And I love every single part of it.
The first TED talk I've seen in years that was good, even great. There were some inaccuracies about CS but note that the vocabulary varies by region, school, and nation. If definitions were your main takeaway then the video is not meant for you.
What a shit talk. If CS only appeals to you because of the money or anything else besides CS itself, you're not going to enjoy it and you'll have a harder time learning and finding jobs.
+vir ingens She ended it with "What do you want to make?" And her program for girls was really successful at getting them interested (10% interested became 88%+). Her main point was much more than "you'll make money".
Best explanation about CS I've ever seen, thank you Ashley.
One of the best inspirational and motivational video I have watched ! When she says" If your college teaches you how to do facebook privacy and ms word that's not computer science which is true because in computer science you don't learn how to use a software (Learning a software is included in Technical Skills) and I appreciate her about this fact that she cleared. Computer science reveals what happens in the backside or internal of computer when you do something. Programming to me is like "Giving life or ability to a machine and make it talk to you". Computer commands are like magic words which you do to make computer to unleash its powers to fulfil your desires. But she also says web development is also not computer science which I am in a little doubt.
Wow Ashley 💖 I'm 51 and I had awful experiences with computer classes in college in the '90s
i loved her, she has thought provoking ideas.
inspiring :)
Excellent talk, enjoyed it thoroughly!! And it is quite thought provoking for those who are in choosing the CS as a major.
for everyone else trouble by not hearing people laugh at their jokes, don't worry about it they are laughing a lot but the mic isn't picking it up. Rest easy starlords.
I stumbled upon learning about CS while searching about INTP personality to understand myself more. And voila! I'm now interested in CS now and will take it next year.. After years of soul searching, I'm now certain that this is what's meant for me.
the culture of "everyone is a winner" even if they suck...
+Luis Daniel Mesa Velasquez Everyone's a winner at walking. She's just saying computer programming doesn't have to be hard.
Paul Christian Kreitz fallacy: false analogy. Not everyone is a winner at walking. Computer programming doesn't have to be hard as it also doesn't have to be serious, but serious computer programming is hard. Ask yourself if you like when your operating system has bugs or when it needs endless updates just to keep you somewhat safe. Ask victims of cloud data leaks if they feel like computer programming should be taken less seriously. If you only plan on keeping cat pics in your computer or don't plan on entrusting your banking or life savings to a computer, then by all means let anyone think they can code without consequence.
As a current AP CS student, I can relate to everything she has said, and absolutely agree that math is not and should not be a prerequisite to Computer Science. I took AP Calc BC as a sophomore and got a 5, but struggled a lot with CS (not to say math doesn't help, of course).
I'm a senior in high school and have been thinking of majoring in computer science. This video has helped me feel more excited about majoring in computer science.
Thank you for all that! My PhD project about suicide and many other ideas of mine (such as L2 virtual immersive systems) highly depend on CS skills I don't have. I am 29 and my background is in language and music studies. Now I feel more motivated to get some Education in CS instead of taking so many notes like "ask my programmer friend to do this or that". Seems more achieavable and fun, even though I am not a Math & Logics nerd.
You are a girl and a comedian, besides a good CS teacher, so boring CS bitches will get mad at you. Don't mind them. Keep inspiring young or old dumbies like me, instead of doing what most male experts do: fearing newbies to eliminate further competition.
THANK YOU ASHLEY🤗AS A NEW TEACHER OF CS, I REALLY APPRECIATE YOUR ENCOURAGEMENT. I CAN DO BETTER THAN I DID BEFORE. LIFE LONG LEARNING!
how i wish this was recommended to me back in '15.. LOVE it!!!!!!
I love the idea of Computer Science, but choosing which career in Computer Science is hard for me.
***** Yeah I also want to explore the security realm, but also in some software.
***** I am
for real bro
what do you mean? how about the ones that just require computer science?
clerp computer science has fields, its too huge to be specialized in all of it
Thank you for this I have been very torn on what to do lately and have been feeling very lost. I’m going to change my course at uni from biomed to cs if it’s not too late!
I live in Kentucky and I have been taking programming classes in high school for two years. They are legit. They teach me programming
Sounds like a good high school
I really appreciate this talk. It's funny because there are a lot of haters in the comments that no one knows about. She is on a national /international stage educating and making a difference. Thank you for talk Ashley Gavin.
i can't believe i've been watching Ashley's podcast for so long and this is such a gem!!!! You are such an amazing person and I only wish for your future to be brighter ^.^ Thanks for illuminating our little brains
she is not an "amazing person" at all. look up her current controversy.
@@Zack29810 just found out about it. Nobody's perfect 🤷♂️
While I can appreciate her enthusiasm in trying to get more people in CS, saying you don't need math is a gross oversimplification...
Yes, it's true, programming is not necessarily about knowing math. You can code a lot of things with only a basic understanding of math. But there's many more things where you would need math to program it. Her example of creating a video game: if there's anything graphical in the game you will probably need to know something about geometry, trigonometry, linear algebra, etc. And these aren't the hard parts of math; you won't need to be a mathematical genius to work with these things, but it is math and it is likely you will need it. If even this simple math is not your strong suit you definitely will be limited in what you can do within CS.
Only in the very highest levels of abstraction in programming you won't see numbers, below that it becomes all about numbers.
On top of this, I don't see someone with a CS degree as a "one trick pony". Rather the opposite, a good computer scientist should be able to implement pretty much anything efficiently, given a clear instruction of what the program should accomplish. And this does require a solid understanding of math, even if that is just to understand someone with a better mathematical understanding of whatever problem you're trying to solve.
And what about AI, doesn't it take maths like statistics, lineal algebra?
I believe the point she was trying to get across is that she doesn't think you need standardized testing level of math, but you do need the problem solving portion of it - which she stated when she showed the hand drawn plan of the video game in her presentation.
The problem is not math...very often it is how it is taught in our system...bad...:((
And AI and machine learning almost all came from various branches of maths and statistics of course.
I think she just mixes programming with computer science. A programmer or a software engineer is not a computer scientist. I'm not sure without maths, what a computer scientist can do.
The worst part about learning code in college is the paper exam. They want us to learn all the code a throw it the day of the exam in a paper... I learned by myself computer science and also went to school and in all the cases it was way better to learn by myself.
So cool! Ada Loveless is actually my ancestor, so computer science is definitely in my blood. At my high school we were the first in our district to implement computer science courses, and we did it through a Microsoft program called teals. Their employees would come and teach at the schools and then train the current staff to teach more of these courses on their own. The really cool thing though was they implemented the techniques talked about in this video to get kids interested and excited to learn about it and it really worked to change people's perspectives, including my own.
This lady inspired me . I want to do cs next year
Everyones a computer programmer nowadays
Until you get in a room with them and find out they don't know anything.
In my computer science class in high school our teacher teaches us how to use mc word and how to download stuff from the internet
If that was CS, everyone would have that degree, even 9 y/o kids lmao
Planning on taking Computer Science.
I hope all computer science teacher should think like her.
Great talk! Would love to see more talks from her!
+joseph10097 how was this great? please tell me.
GreyFace Have you watched and understood what she was saying throughout the whole video? She hit the nail so many times. *She spoke nothing but the truth.*
joseph10097 pls tell me which part in CS is easy?
GreyFace She didn't mean it in terms of difficulty, CS is fu*king hard, esp. the mathematics involved. She was basically saying that it isn't rocket science and that it's a profession that can get you paid in huge amounts if you actually decide to work hard in that field. She also said that people get freaked out by code and their instant reaction is "WTF is this???" and decide to not pursue CS because it "looks hard". Therefore, she said it isn't that hard if you actually learn the language, it's easier than you might think.
I think this gave me the push I needed.
This approach to teaching should be applied to ever subject..U.S. education teaches about tools and not about want you can do with the tool..Tear something apart and put it back together & you will learn more about it than you would in school.
Holy crap, this just rocked my worldview, which as a former IT guy, is impressive!
Great talk! You sold me!
I am going to go study computer science in 2016! :D
Same!
+Vincent Desjardins Good decision
:)
DO IT IT'S THE BEST
+Vincent Desjardins I have just started my degree here in Mexico. Trust me, this career is really beautiful. Keep the hard work!
"Look at all these dorks in CS! Guys, we need to fix this."
+James King
"We need more woman and black people in CS" ~ TedxSpeaker
+SmashBrosBrawl and less Indians!
+Swarovski Memories We need less H-1B Vistas!
CZ OS and more trump! ... right?
Swarovski Memories In truth, Trump has me wondering if he might be sandbagging. But I despise The Nasty Bat (& cohorts) in ways I can't easily verbalize, so we'll see.
Doing major in Computer Science, it sucks sometimes for sure but I love every second of it.
I'm taking APCS at high school, and the teacher doesn't actually know Java. For the entire course, we are using an online platform, where our lessons come from TH-cam videos published by one lady. The actual teacher doesn't do anything, except for assign us extra, pointless work that won't help us to do better on the AP test in May. Almost everyone in the class of about 30 people is confused, so only about 6 out of the 30 people in the class are going to be taking the AP Test. So basically, I'm self-teaching myself Java right now. I plan to take the AP test, but I'm confused on a lot of the material being taught, and I have no one to go to for help. This is why no one takes APCS, because we don't have enough people who actually know how to teach it!
My friend, teaching yourself how to code will be the greatest gift of all. Embrace it, love it, live it. Lectures are for the weaklings.
excellent talk! thanks!
Love her!!!!!!! She is so blunt and goes straight to the point
Awesome presentation. Thank you.
"I've been coding for 10 years." For some reason I don't believe her. In case you forgot, this talk is a pretty good demonstration on the differences between Ted and Tedx.
MrJosh6889 why would she lie? Lol you'd believe her if she was a guy I'm sure
Funny how you decided to take this towards sexism when that had never crossed my mind.
I honestly have my doubts too, regardless of her gender. If you've been coding for 10 years and you find a simple "Hello World" program terrifying, something's horribly wrong.
I've been coding for less than half that time, and the only thing I feel whenever I see a "Hello World" program is nostalgia.
dominique007 Because it’s just not true. My mom is a software engineering and she laughed when she saw this video. It’s not sexism, it’s facts. What we need to do it get more young women involved in the sciences and math early on, instead of lying about what fields are.
She was obviously joking, come on.
TEDx talks: Why do they suck so much and what if they didn't? Did she seriously just say it's ok not to know what static means?
You don't need to know what static means.
Use a modern programming language that doesn't suck.
+BeegieB If you think Java sucks, try Fortran 99.
BeegieB such as? I doubt very much there is a modern language that is a drop in replacement for all other languages, in all contexts and scenarios. At least a Java developer will never be without a job, since it's one of the most popular languages to get hired for.
try COBOL or Assembler
Eman Jayme Going to be doing some assembly in my next module, I have no idea why I'm looking forward to it.
I think that the reason that people are unlikely to take CS is because they know that inevitable good CS programmers will not go to school for it. They will learn it themselves because they love to problem solve even without instruction of teachers.
Great Ted Talk I enjoyed it thanks for sharing!
a lot of what she said not 100% correct.
be specific or no dice.
She's trying to get people interested, and so a tiny bit of falsities don't really matter. And if you can identify what is wrong, you've already maintained the interest she wants to inspire
People Don't take CS because it's very difficult and takes a ton of effort. Simple. Don't need to over think it.
+Tristan Marroquin exactly. she mentioned everything but that. basically it's complicated as hell and requires the left side of your brain to brutally murder your right side.
I dunno, if you can manage to find the college she went to where there’s no pre-cal requirement maybe it’s way easier XD
seriously, sometimes you feel like giving up. Advanced Data Structures and Algorithms ain't laughing matter.
why every time there is a female teacher, everything has to be about empowering girl. Whyt does everything has to be about gender or ethnicity?
If you want equality stop talking about gender and ethnicity. Otherwise you have an agenda.
The problem is that this woman is completely ignoring BIOLOGICAL differences between men and women. More young boys tend to get into computers, after playing games on them, and they tend to play more games because boys are generally more competitive and less social. Women generally find relationships more important and more rewarding, so they tend to avoid isolating activities like computers. Boys when given the choice prefer video games, women tend to prefer to read a book.
+Iron Fist trying to empower women because they have been told they can't do it, is not a bad thing. This is why these minority groups exist.i completely understand what you are saying but there isn't equality socially. This is what needs to change and it can't change without encouragement and support. If we didn't need these groups they wouldn't exist. eventually we won't need these groups. until then we are trying to balance the power.
All your examples are typical CULTURAL differences, not biological. There is NO biological imperative to get into computers, at least not a gendered imperative. 41% of gamers are female. Much of the disparity could be due to video games being HEAVILY marketed to young white males. Again, cultural. The next generation is going to have just as many women as men in these jobs, it is already happening
gildebrant You're wrong. "Biological imperative: ... Include the following hierarchy of logical imperatives for a living organism: survival, territorialism, competition, reproduction, quality of life-seeking, and group forming."
Hmm territorialism, competition, survival, quality of life, group formation. Those ALL sum up gaming, especially online competitive gaming, which is NOT 59% male, its way more. As for those 41% of female gamers, the majority are CASUAL gamers, big difference. They typically play games to waste time, and care less about the actual details of a game (They completely avoid the competitive and group forming aspect) Guys on the hand, spend waaay more time on games, spend way more time on average thinking about games, and are waaay more likely to show an interest in MAKING games (as evidenced by the overwhelming ratio of male to female game developers). I should also add there have been studies where small children have been given the option of toys. Boys almost always chose things like cars, and things they could take apart, and girls almost always went for dolls. Sorry, but gaming has a huge biological imperative for men, and that is why computers will always be a favored by men over women.
Just found this video and really enjoyed it! Ashley you are so beautiful inside and out! ☺️😍🙂
Great speech! Thank you :)
I don't understand all the downrates. I think she's incredible, I'd take computer science if she was my professor.
+Panny Frost Then you would learn the hard way how poorly she would have prepared you if she was your professor. For once you try to get actual jobs in computer programming with the background she is capable and willing to give you, you would find out nobody wants to hire you -- except perhaps for undesirable companies.
"Computer Science is not about numbers" it definitely is. She says it is about solving problems, but what do you solve those problems with? Yep. Numbers. Higher level languages make it so the coder doesn't have to deal with numbers as much, but fundamentally there are numbers at work.
+Abhinav Bhandari (PixelZerg) Bad analogy. Computer Science has the word computer in it. The definition of computer science: "the study of the principles and use of computers." The study of the use of COMPUTERS. Because it IS about computers (the machine. What else could it be other than a machine...? I am not sure why you clarified this) and their uses. Astronomy on the other hand isn't about the telescope because it is about the study of celestial objects. I would like to know what computer science is about other than computers, code, and their applications--all of which, I might add, are based on numbers. And yes I am arguing something that doesn't need to be argued but I like to sharpen my persuasive skills when I am bored.
Juan2003gtr You sure got me Juan. How do I refute that? LOL
+Audiack Computer science is not necessarily about computers but about computability (theory of computation), which has been studied before the existence of modern computers. In this sense the analogy about telescopes is pretty good, since the subject of the study is not the computer itself, the computer is a tool to study the abstract algorithms.
That said most cs degrees surely are more practically oriented than just pure theory of computation and involve the things you said. Just pointing out that the analogy really was not that bad.
+theTribesHawk I see what you are saying. I now see the flaw in my argument (and that I found it hard to find a good analogy for computers based in another field like astronomy). I am glad to see I stoked a flame and got some useful information back, though. The abstract nature of computability is made possible to understand with computers, which isn't necessarily about the computer of itself. He could have explained that though. Going back to the topic of this thread, that computers aren't all about numbers: do you agree or disagree with this?
+Audiack On the most fundamental level, yeah I agree computers are all about numbers. Could argue that these days you don't really need to know the details too well to be able to do some stuff but you address that in your original comment, so I think you are being reasonable here.
best speech i ever heard related to computer science really helpful....Thanks
Good insights at the end. inspiring.
Why would you major in Computer Science if you don't enjoy it?
I don't know, maybe... money. Of course money what else X'D
sometimes you gotta follow the money. A guy told me his experience that he wanted to be a lawyer. He went to law school and graduated. However, he couldn't find a job to satisfy his living needs. He ended getting into software development and easily found and a job and is now earning good money for his family
Parents, supposedly money, etc
neettim Wow that is quite a switch! How long did it take him to learn software development and did he go back to school for it?
I have no passion. The only real passion for me, frankly, is being some kind of prostitute or p0rn actor or something. Do you think I will do those jobs just because I have a passion for it? No, because it's unethical and just not right. That's why I choose to pursue my sense of purpose instead of just immediate "passion". Even just hearing the word passion makes me cringe and it should be removed immediately from any motivator's dictionary.
I almost died when she said that some of her colleagues still don't know what "static" means. I totally feel that way too sometimes. Some days, I'm like "what the heck is a 'volatile' again?
Same. I still don't know what static means.
Thank you so much, im so happy i found this ted talk
Also i wish you were my teacher in highschool or university ... I learned so much watching this
I started out in CS but failed Calc 1 twice switched over to Network Administration and am currently doing my Masters in Network Security with nothing but a C in precalc and don't regret my decision at all. Some fields aren't for everyone especially with Tech being such a broad subject you can find something you love and excel at.
This is 4 years old. Things are changing in this field. Lot more people are graduating from this field and less jobs are now available.
False. You are probably bad at mathematics. 85% of people drop out of a CS program in the United States. Only roughly just about 400,000 people graduate each year world wide with CS degrees. There will be roughly 1.4 million jobs for computer science grads by 2020.....do better research. That's a huge shortage.
Also, the number one reason why people drop out and don't like computer science is because of the computational discrete mathematics involved. Lost of proofs and algorithims.
9:37 project based learning is exactly how I taught myself python without any guides at all. I did take an AP computer science principles class but that taught strictly computer science ideas, so programming fundamentals like conditionals and loops, different base numbers, encryption, networking/internet, etc. which helped with understanding the basics but I still had to do a lot of learning. I would think of a simple project and try to make it and whenever I wanted to learn how to do something, like get an input, I would search it up and learn the function. It slowly escalated and I ended learning way faster than my cousin's intro to computer science class in college which he started at the same time I started learning python with projects (he's also very smart so he went way ahead of the class). I tried so many things and even tried to read this big book but understood absolutely nothing until I used projects and became very good at it.
I want to be a computer science teacher but I've never been good in math back in school. I've applied at Unisa (University of South Africa) to study a pre-degree programme so lets see how that goes.
I am proud of being a computer guy and i fully agree with the statement that teachers are not qualified to teach computer science :D ;)