I feel like Lucio is better with a coordinated team in top level. Juno is better in solo Q since everyone sees the ring and knows that they can get speed and go in. With Lucio, it’s hard to tell if you have speed or if your Lucio will keep giving you speed instead of swapping to heals as you go in.
Was just gunna comment this. I feel like the ring lets me shotcall without using voice comms. I was playing with a JQ earlier today that would just follow my rings, which I could never get with Lucio.
Cool thing about speed ring is how it kind of communicates with your team : GO CHASE THAT GUY! Lucio speed amp doesn't really do the same thing and can often be wasted on timid teammates.
Lucio main here. Juno's kit is more versatile, specifically with the ability to deploy speed boost in different ways versus speed amp'ing players that may not even want it (for aim purposes). I'm also preferring Juno's Glide Boost to Lucio's Wallride. Wallride can be slow to get the momentum going in a pinch, whereas Glide Boost is instant and gives you fast lateral movement to get out or into a situation. Lucio's heal amp is great, but his heal passive can make you feel useless in situations where you need to help your teammate that's low on health. Juno's healing from her Mediblaster makes you more of a playmaker in those situations and lets you choose whether to prioritize a 1hp teammate or a 1hp enemy for max team fight impact. Lucio has the upper hand in ultimates though. It's a direct counter for other key ultimates. I'm still not sure Juno's ultimate turns fights around. It's just another form of Lifeweaver's tree almost. I hope they rework that and give her something more unique. Overall, Juno gives more options and nuances to gameplay. I can pick where I want to add value versus just "existing" around my team for mediocre healing where I find I have to rely a lot on my ability to get kills to really add team value.
That’s been my biggest complaint so far too. She’s really fun to play don’t get me wrong, but Tracer and Sombra can melt her in half a second. I got trapped in spawn for half the match earlier cuz none of my team would turn around. I kinda think she should get a small amount of shields when she uses her glide dash thing. Nothing crazy strong, just to give her a tiny bit of sustain so she can be a little more self reliant.
Very true maybe giving her crits would be worth it but I'm also ok worth her not being able to dps that well. People already complain enough about the dps support. I rather her not have fight back potential
@@slandergames9494 The way I've been playing her is with teammates all the time. In Brawl I flank with comboing her glide boost and torpedo. The rest of the time I join 1v1s and help teammates get an advantage. I throw my hyper ring into a brawl to give my teammates the ability to both engage and escape. I feel like she's 100% designed to stay alive and to support teammates. It's a new design for Overwatch, so we'll see how she plays out. Pretty much all other supports can fight back in some capacity.
I feel like rush with Junkerqueen, Lucio and Juno could be crazy if coordinated. Juno’s heals are pretty good and making sure that Juno and Lucio are speeding at right times would be good.
it's diminishing returns, a lot of the time you will just be hitting the speed cap and if you are already on top of the enemy, you don't need the speed boost, it is just more beneficial to have a different utility rather than go all in on more of the same thing.
@@bigfudge2031 Yes, but if you properly coordinate, you can have so much speed uptime, by cycling the ring and amp it up. If you do both at the same time, then you’re losing speed. Yeah, maybe too much is diminishing, but it just seems cool.
I appreciate the plug for Lucio speed boost. In low ranks i think so many Lucios just heal and never amp speed because they dont understand speed's value. I think speed ring might help low ranked players begin to understand the importance of amped speed to get in or out. For reference, the speed bonus for hyper ring is 50% and for amp it up is 60%.
for the average player, it is very easy to see and understand the ring. With Lucio, a lot of people don't even notice that they are inside his aura and when you speed and go in, they don't always go with you.
As a support player myself I say it depends on the goal of the comp, lucio if your all rushing together and playing as a death ball, Juno for comps that have one or two members who stay back For example I played in owcs (only got like 91st or something but for my first time in owcs we take it) and we payed a ram death ball comp with lucio like most other teams and it was great, but with juno you couldn’t play that same death ball. But since the new season I started playing Juno almost exclusively in a trio and her ring has been so good for my tank I play with to get in and or out for a quick Kill and resetting. That along with torpedos being really strong within team fights for finishing kills or saving a teammate it’s easy to see she’s viable I don’t think she’s broken tho, she’s actually fairly easy to catch out if she doesn’t have ring and hitscan really makes it difficult for you to use torpedos for more than just healing. I’ve even seen some lucio and Juno comps (mostly with queen) that have been doing well Both hero’s are viable they just have their comps
Until Juno's ult grants the hyper ring speed boost, I feel like Juno wont replace Lucio in terms of pure speed utility. Juno having a 14 second CD while lucio can have speed on whenever needed and also amp it every 12 seconds. The difference is though, that while Speed ring is up, Juno can provide both healing and damage through her weapon and torpedoes. And I think that's the main tradeoff. Is it worth trading some speed uptime for more healing/poke? Now, Some may say giving her ult speed boost would break her and make her op, but I argue it won't and compare it to Kiri's ult. Seeing as Kitsune Rush has 50% fire rate and reload as a relatively equal trade off to the 35%healing/dmg boost from Orbital ray, Rush also has a 2x cooldown reduction AND a 30% SPEED boost. So I don't see why Juno can't also have speed on her ult. Unless the counter argument is that Kiri's kit is bloated and Overpowered and thus we shouldn't compare her to Juno, then sure I agree. But still, I think Juno should also be able to speed the team with her ult.
I personally enjoy Juno Kit alot more. When your tank over extends, you can just shoot the speed ring behind them so they can quickly move back to a safer position and at the same time continue to heal them. As compared to lucio where you would need to just speed boost and hope your tank makes it out with you. The 3 main benefits of lucio as compared to Juno 1. Lucio beat counters alot of ults 2. Can deal damage and heal at the same time 3. Have passive speed boost 3 main benefits of Juno as compared to lucio 1. Can speed boost and heal at the same time. 2. Less team coordination needed (People can choose if they want to go through the speed boost ring or not and will not screw up with the sudden acceleration as it is expected. Compared to lucio who suddenly speed boosts without any indication besides you noticing that you suddenly move faster.) 3. Easier to hit shots (hitscan)
Rush is getting such a big buff from this. She is kinda like Moira + Lucio, you’re not gonna be doing crazy dps, but ur overall healing and damage numbers are gonna be crazy like Moira while providing lucio’s speed boost.
I think juno is more of a speed boost out ,but could be for offense if used at the right time, and lucio could do both more consistent, but the cool down is much more devastating if you dont use it right because he needs the boost to really heal more
Would be cool if they would do q+ left and right click so u can choose ur ult to go faster or slower if u wanna play point or dive in for example, but still viable
@@YaYama-c1fvery good suggestion. Most times my team either ignore it or it just goes a completely off the point in 2 seconds where u need to defend it
feels like lucio for highly coordinated teams and diving targets, while Juno has more freedom of usage. you can be more selfish with Juno because of how long it lasts and the fact that cd starts as soon as hyper ring is deployed, while amp it up cd starts when the ability is fully used
She just feels fairly underpowered across the board. I know they wanted to avoid a Lucio exodus so they made her kit undertuned outside the mobility, but her primary/ult are both kinda meh
Did you play her since play test? On play test she did feel a bit underwhelming to me, but now they tuned the ability feedback, and I can already feel a lot more impact with her kit
@@lumi-lumi-lumi For those 3 days yeah, but she just is still missing a "flow" I'm not sure how else to describe it. Lucio feels a lot more independent despite Juno's multiple movement abilities
@@prismescape1887 just bc you have to play around the team with Juno Doesn’t make her underwhelming. Lucio doesn’t have to play with the team and he can still get massive use, while Juno on the other hand she has no self sustaining ability so going into their backline and trying to get a pick like you would on Lucio just wouldn’t work, her abilities are for her to play around the team but that’s my opinion.
I ask....why not both? 🤷♂️ Every single time I've played Lucio Juno backline I've won so far. If both supports are smart the team stays in an almost endless cycle of speed boost AND Juno still pumps out good heals. Win win.
lucio is tiny has passive speed self healing you dont have to have to use amp to get away from tricky situations that you probably got yourelf into with amp can now practically one shot all targets hanzo can and also gets style points bruh lucio is kinda insane except for the health nerf which makes cas 1v1 impossible
I feel like Lucio is better with a coordinated team in top level. Juno is better in solo Q since everyone sees the ring and knows that they can get speed and go in. With Lucio, it’s hard to tell if you have speed or if your Lucio will keep giving you speed instead of swapping to heals as you go in.
Was just gunna comment this. I feel like the ring lets me shotcall without using voice comms. I was playing with a JQ earlier today that would just follow my rings, which I could never get with Lucio.
I absolutely agree with your take, so much that i needed to emoji applause you 👏👏👏👏👏👏👏
It really does change the game a bit where you can dictate the pace solo. Super fun.
Short answer: Lucio
Knew it
I agree 100%
No one can replace lucio
For now. Lucio could get nerfed, Juno could get buffed, and people will get better at playing as and with Juno.
@@azure5644 don’t tell me that I’m a top 100 Lucio otp :/
Cool thing about speed ring is how it kind of communicates with your team : GO CHASE THAT GUY!
Lucio speed amp doesn't really do the same thing and can often be wasted on timid teammates.
Lucio main here.
Juno's kit is more versatile, specifically with the ability to deploy speed boost in different ways versus speed amp'ing players that may not even want it (for aim purposes).
I'm also preferring Juno's Glide Boost to Lucio's Wallride. Wallride can be slow to get the momentum going in a pinch, whereas Glide Boost is instant and gives you fast lateral movement to get out or into a situation.
Lucio's heal amp is great, but his heal passive can make you feel useless in situations where you need to help your teammate that's low on health. Juno's healing from her Mediblaster makes you more of a playmaker in those situations and lets you choose whether to prioritize a 1hp teammate or a 1hp enemy for max team fight impact.
Lucio has the upper hand in ultimates though. It's a direct counter for other key ultimates. I'm still not sure Juno's ultimate turns fights around. It's just another form of Lifeweaver's tree almost. I hope they rework that and give her something more unique.
Overall, Juno gives more options and nuances to gameplay. I can pick where I want to add value versus just "existing" around my team for mediocre healing where I find I have to rely a lot on my ability to get kills to really add team value.
Juno’s ult is absolutely insane when teams push up with it. It’s like a moving ow1 orisa ult with healing.
@@juritudi57yearsago59 Agreed. I don't think it's useless. But you can still get killed within it. Lucio's ultimate invalidates so many ultimates.
Really just want to know how to escape best when getting flanked because she can't take a fight to save her life.
That’s been my biggest complaint so far too. She’s really fun to play don’t get me wrong, but Tracer and Sombra can melt her in half a second. I got trapped in spawn for half the match earlier cuz none of my team would turn around. I kinda think she should get a small amount of shields when she uses her glide dash thing. Nothing crazy strong, just to give her a tiny bit of sustain so she can be a little more self reliant.
Very true maybe giving her crits would be worth it but I'm also ok worth her not being able to dps that well. People already complain enough about the dps support. I rather her not have fight back potential
@@slandergames9494 The way I've been playing her is with teammates all the time. In Brawl I flank with comboing her glide boost and torpedo. The rest of the time I join 1v1s and help teammates get an advantage. I throw my hyper ring into a brawl to give my teammates the ability to both engage and escape.
I feel like she's 100% designed to stay alive and to support teammates. It's a new design for Overwatch, so we'll see how she plays out. Pretty much all other supports can fight back in some capacity.
@@khele2k agreed. The way she plays I feel is definitely intentional. People just aren't used to supports being actual SUPPORT for your team.
Going Juno to start and giving your team hyper ring then swapping out of spawn goes crazy now
😂 that's actually kind of genius.
I feel like rush with Junkerqueen, Lucio and Juno could be crazy if coordinated. Juno’s heals are pretty good and making sure that Juno and Lucio are speeding at right times would be good.
it's diminishing returns, a lot of the time you will just be hitting the speed cap and if you are already on top of the enemy, you don't need the speed boost, it is just more beneficial to have a different utility rather than go all in on more of the same thing.
@@bigfudge2031 Yes, but if you properly coordinate, you can have so much speed uptime, by cycling the ring and amp it up. If you do both at the same time, then you’re losing speed. Yeah, maybe too much is diminishing, but it just seems cool.
@@Wusyaname_ this would go crazy. 85% speed uptime with maybe 30 of that being at the speed cap
I appreciate the plug for Lucio speed boost. In low ranks i think so many Lucios just heal and never amp speed because they dont understand speed's value. I think speed ring might help low ranked players begin to understand the importance of amped speed to get in or out. For reference, the speed bonus for hyper ring is 50% and for amp it up is 60%.
for the average player, it is very easy to see and understand the ring. With Lucio, a lot of people don't even notice that they are inside his aura and when you speed and go in, they don't always go with you.
As a support player myself I say it depends on the goal of the comp, lucio if your all rushing together and playing as a death ball, Juno for comps that have one or two members who stay back
For example I played in owcs (only got like 91st or something but for my first time in owcs we take it) and we payed a ram death ball comp with lucio like most other teams and it was great, but with juno you couldn’t play that same death ball.
But since the new season I started playing Juno almost exclusively in a trio and her ring has been so good for my tank I play with to get in and or out for a quick Kill and resetting. That along with torpedos being really strong within team fights for finishing kills or saving a teammate it’s easy to see she’s viable
I don’t think she’s broken tho, she’s actually fairly easy to catch out if she doesn’t have ring and hitscan really makes it difficult for you to use torpedos for more than just healing.
I’ve even seen some lucio and Juno comps (mostly with queen) that have been doing well
Both hero’s are viable they just have their comps
One thing to note is that her healing has falloff which when healing people from critical u have to be somewhat close to them to actually heal them
Until Juno's ult grants the hyper ring speed boost, I feel like Juno wont replace Lucio in terms of pure speed utility. Juno having a 14 second CD while lucio can have speed on whenever needed and also amp it every 12 seconds. The difference is though, that while Speed ring is up, Juno can provide both healing and damage through her weapon and torpedoes. And I think that's the main tradeoff. Is it worth trading some speed uptime for more healing/poke? Now, Some may say giving her ult speed boost would break her and make her op, but I argue it won't and compare it to Kiri's ult. Seeing as Kitsune Rush has 50% fire rate and reload as a relatively equal trade off to the 35%healing/dmg boost from Orbital ray, Rush also has a 2x cooldown reduction AND a 30% SPEED boost. So I don't see why Juno can't also have speed on her ult. Unless the counter argument is that Kiri's kit is bloated and Overpowered and thus we shouldn't compare her to Juno, then sure I agree. But still, I think Juno should also be able to speed the team with her ult.
I personally enjoy Juno Kit alot more. When your tank over extends, you can just shoot the speed ring behind them so they can quickly move back to a safer position and at the same time continue to heal them.
As compared to lucio where you would need to just speed boost and hope your tank makes it out with you.
The 3 main benefits of lucio as compared to Juno
1. Lucio beat counters alot of ults
2. Can deal damage and heal at the same time
3. Have passive speed boost
3 main benefits of Juno as compared to lucio
1. Can speed boost and heal at the same time.
2. Less team coordination needed (People can choose if they want to go through the speed boost ring or not and will not screw up with the sudden acceleration as it is expected. Compared to lucio who suddenly speed boosts without any indication besides you noticing that you suddenly move faster.)
3. Easier to hit shots (hitscan)
For top players, Juno's ult should be buffed because the beat has so much value. But Juno's kit is easier for most of the players. Good hero design.
Rush is getting such a big buff from this. She is kinda like Moira + Lucio, you’re not gonna be doing crazy dps, but ur overall healing and damage numbers are gonna be crazy like Moira while providing lucio’s speed boost.
I think juno is more of a speed boost out ,but could be for offense if used at the right time, and lucio could do both more consistent, but the cool down is much more devastating if you dont use it right because he needs the boost to really heal more
I learned. A lot. Im not good enough at the game to use any of this learning tho lol
haven't played her yet but I think if you can pick a target with right click, she could be stronger.
as an ana lucio main, i think juno is easily my 3rd fav hero in this game now, BUT lucio is still KING of speed. love the video ML
I think a lot of people doesn't see juno as a viable character right now because they didn't see the full potential yet
Would be cool if they would do q+ left and right click so u can choose ur ult to go faster or slower if u wanna play point or dive in for example, but still viable
@@YaYama-c1fvery good suggestion. Most times my team either ignore it or it just goes a completely off the point in 2 seconds where u need to defend it
so fluid! cant wait to get good with her
feels like lucio for highly coordinated teams and diving targets, while Juno has more freedom of usage. you can be more selfish with Juno because of how long it lasts and the fact that cd starts as soon as hyper ring is deployed, while amp it up cd starts when the ability is fully used
Lucio seems better in close map brawl or dive and Juno seems better in open map/long rage map brawl or dive
She just feels fairly underpowered across the board. I know they wanted to avoid a Lucio exodus so they made her kit undertuned outside the mobility, but her primary/ult are both kinda meh
Did you play her since play test?
On play test she did feel a bit underwhelming to me, but now they tuned the ability feedback, and I can already feel a lot more impact with her kit
@@lumi-lumi-lumi For those 3 days yeah, but she just is still missing a "flow" I'm not sure how else to describe it. Lucio feels a lot more independent despite Juno's multiple movement abilities
@@prismescape1887 just bc you have to play around the team with Juno Doesn’t make her underwhelming. Lucio doesn’t have to play with the team and he can still get massive use, while Juno on the other hand she has no self sustaining ability so going into their backline and trying to get a pick like you would on Lucio just wouldn’t work, her abilities are for her to play around the team but that’s my opinion.
Her ultimate is great. Everything else is underwhelming
Editors didn't show the stats after the first game?!? What's going on here?????
juno
gotta familiar her for the hub
Juno nerfs killed her
The only thing they nerfed is fire rate😂😂😂 wdym
And mobility characters got 225 hp but that's deserved
why choose between lucio and juno when you can play with them
I ask....why not both? 🤷♂️ Every single time I've played Lucio Juno backline I've won so far. If both supports are smart the team stays in an almost endless cycle of speed boost AND Juno still pumps out good heals. Win win.
I think she has more use than Lucio I hope they gut him to make her better
As a bro'ze player im gonna maybe need this
Lucio? Juno? Both is good
Trick question roadhog is best support
Play them together 👀
YIPPEEEEEE
lucio is tiny has passive speed self healing you dont have to have to use amp to get away from tricky situations that you probably got yourelf into with amp can now practically one shot all targets hanzo can and also gets style points bruh lucio is kinda insane except for the health nerf which makes cas 1v1 impossible
The answer is clear. Does Lucio has cake? I don't think so 😅
Play whichever one you LIKE. Question answered. Not trying to optimize my fun. I never liked Lucio so I'm not gonna play him.
why not both 😂 (fr tho these two together make your team so slippery it’s playing on 2x. Bit sad it can’t stack tho
first!
🍪