Ineos Grenadier: Exclusive NA First Overland Drive (Prototype)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 15 ก.ย. 2024
- While this was a limited test, it only made us more enthusiastic for the Grenadier and its suitability for overland travel. It checks all the boxes, but it also works well as a system. When you combine its off-road capability with the class-leading payload, you are rewarded with a vehicle that is ready to take you to the remote corners of the globe, and back again.
ineosgrenadier...
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First video I've seen that really shows its offroad capabilities for the type of trails found in the U.S. Really impressed. Capable of 'wheeling', but fully ready for overlanding.
We agree
Pretty much the same here, I'm in the far southeast of Australia, lots of steep eroded tracks, rock, fallen trees ect. Pretty happy with how the suspension is looking tbh.
Good review. I can agree with all your observations having driven a diesel in Australia a week or so ago. The stability is better than I expected (your head toss comments are spot on) - it almost feels like it was cast from a single big billet of steel, it just feels so solid. All controls feel just right and so easy to modulate as required. The diesel will be the popular pick here and the torque just off idle is so good it feels like you don't need to carry momentum into anything.
Thank you for the detailed reply and additional insights.
I’d be interested in the diesel engine as well
@@efibendor1 only ECE cars have the diesel option. B57 is not emissions certified in the us so it is not an option for us market cars.
Cool to see Tony along for the ride. The OEX property at Uwharrie is awesome! A great proving ground for a vehicle like this. This Grenadier looks promising.
I'm impressed by all the skid plates and underbelly clearance. I'd like to get behind the wheel of a Grenadier someday. Great review, Scott. Thanks!
This was the video review I was waiting for. Not just splashing through some mud, but rather, and experienced overlander type twisting the thing through some overtly technical terrain. Yep, I’m happy I put some dough down on one. I love the look of the Grenadier and from the sort of intensity put into development along with asking questions of the actual user community, I’m quite confident the first iteration will be a terrific start point. 👍🏻😎👍🏻
Exactly right! Grenadier marketing department running around on gravel tracks was underwhelming.
This is an average driveway for people, nothing technical here. This vehicle is a joke. I put money down too, gonna be an easy flip at auction.
@@Silentway247, now that’s some serious trolling, lol. Average driveway?? Yeah, I always see my neighbors with a wheel hovering off the ground of their Honda Civic when pulling in, lol. As for the Grenadier being a joke, I guess you have an interesting sense of humor. I don’t find a vehicle made from this sort of material strategy and assembled on the same line with the same folks as the Mercedes G Wagon presented for production with over 2 million prototype miles invested in sorting out the vehicle in some highly targeted terrain specific testing much of a joke. Either you’re massing around or just the highly pessimistic type no matter what sort of quality level is presented as a market into model. 😎😎😎
I will add that this vehicle’s development by Magna Steyr, producer of the G wagon, gives me great hope for the Ineos. Stylistically it’s a perfect blend of Land Rover and MBZ G Wagon!
I owned a G-wagen for 12 years. It is so similar in all the right ways.
@@ExpeditionPortal yes even down to the door handles. Many want to compare to the Land Rover naturally. But the closer connection is to the G Wagon
Will you buy the Grenadier?
I haven't been this excited for a new vehicle in well over a decade. Been following the development of the Grenadier for a while now. I would love to replace my Disco 2 with this, but I fear that the starting price here in the US will be $70k.
Yeah my guess is base price in the high 60s and reaching into the high 80s for the higher trims with options.... I was hoping for the 45k to 55k range.
I have a ls swapped disco2 and slightly modified LR4. I will be replacing my LR4 with a grenadier
@@shauns06rubi Considering what they're using for engine, seats, overall build quality, waterproof switches, and so on, and that these will be lower production vehicles, I suspect a base price in the high 60s may be optimistic. I won't be at all surprised if these start higher than 80K and easily go over 100K with options added.
I'm also interested in one of these as a possible eventual replacement for my 2020 Land Cruiser, but definitely want to wait and see how the dealer network is set up, how easy they are to get serviced, how the reliability is, and so on.
Love that it’s meant for travel and not luxury! I’m definitely interested.
Would be cool in a 2 door also!
The two door is coming
Alu-Cab has mentioned they are working on a conversion top. It would make this vehicle almost perfect for long adventures.
That will be amazing
Good review - having driven one in Australia it just has a solid no nonsense feel and i have had two defenders so its just what i thought it would be
While I don't like the idea of a vehicle meant to be operated in remote locations on earth being powered by a BMW engine, I respect this company and hope they sell more than they can make.
The B57/B58 are some of the best engines ever made and reliable to high power levels as well
@André everything. So unreliable. With the exception of a few engines like the M57
Almost all German products are "get you home" reliable, although the repair costs are a bit high and maintenance can be difficult to perform.
@André im not sure if your idea of a direct injected, VANOS solenoid pooping, fluid leaking BMW engine is something you'll trust in the middle of nowhere. When someone mentions excellent reliability, BMW isn't exactly something you hear getting tossed around.
I would've rather Ineos buy V8s from GM instead of BMW engines.
@André there is a reason why BMW lose 60%of their resale values in 4 years. And that's true in any country.
I am really looking forward to the launch of the Grenadier, but am a bit worried I won't be able to afford one.
Me neither…
Best Ineos Grenadier video on youtube!
Thank you
Really looking forward to these. Just might have to put a deposit down. Noticeable improvement in camera work on this video! Well done Scott & co.
FINALLY an American off road review! Finally we see what the vehicle’s capabilities are. Too much Ineos marketing fluff. Is this B57 engine turbocharged? And how long term reliable is that ? I’ve heard from BMW 5 series owners that at 100k miles the turbo fails !?
Ticks all the boxes. Looks great. Maybe pricey but so is everything else and being purpose bit, the core modifications can be bypassed as it's already included. With this, no need for upgraded wheels and tires, suspension, body protection etc. It looks to have all you need. Just add living essentials as price and desire dictate. If you want the payload and off-road capability, it is pretty much in a class by itself.
Very informative video , really enjoyed it
I really wanted to like the Grenadier but they haven't been able to answer any of my technical questions regarding gear ratios, axle diameters, spline count, and materials, ujoint sizes, etc. Your video is great for showing us (finally) how the suspension performs. The minimal rear wheel travel and embarrassing front wheel travel are disappointing. I'm really surprised that Ineos chose not to use a disconnecting sway bar. Hopefully the aftermarket can address these issues, but only if Ineos prices the Grendadier to a level where "real people" can afford them. The last thing we need is another Geländewagen or Land Rover.
Fortunately, the front swaybar is an easy aftermarket (or owner) fix. Thanks for watching
They wanted to design a utility vehicle similar to the fore mentioned Merc and LR but without the tech - 50% less tech than LR, sounds like you want another Jeep?
It wasn’t designed to be a rock crawler. It is the new Land Rover that JLR should have built.
@@KansaSCaymanS true, but who wouldn't benefit from more wheel travel and a smoother ride off-road? Hopefully the Grenadier will come in at an affordable enough price for sufficient sales to support an aftermarket that can develop parts to address its shortcomings.
@@rubicon4wheeler it won't be cheap comparatively, $110k AU for the standard wagon. Not that I'm complaining I got in before the $13k price rise.
Finally a video that shows how capable this vehicle actually is. I'm surprised how good the articulation is, make me wonder why Ineos hasn't shown any footage of the vehicle going through and flexing on some technical terrain, strange they would basically hide how well it performs.
I watched Scott's 2012 review of the Jeep Wrangler Rubicon, and sure enough I had to have one. What have you done? Here we go again.........
HA! Thanks for watching, John
Squarebody with an I6.. I’ve seen this before. It’s got a good start anyways👍
Great video. Since the Grenadier is permanent 4wd, I'd like to know more about the max speed for engaging the center diff lock (CDL)? I'm thinking about those times when transitioning from pavement (all diffs open) to gravel, dirt, icy or snowy conditions. In my jeep wrangler jk (part time 4wd) I can go from 2wd to 4wd Hi, engaging the transfer case, at speeds up to 55mph. I use this all the time on mountain roads in winter.
Loved it Scot !!!
Thanks for the excellent review Scott!
Thank you for watching
Early observations from this interested party:
Styling is on point. Low hood and tall windshield are a huge plus. Approach and departure seem fair for the wheel base. 115” is a lot - which is great. Which leads to some critiques that would be nice to see adjusted before launch.
A 35” tire option. This is becoming the competitive edge for Ford and Jeep, adding those within an “advanced” package plus a disconnecting sway-bar would make this a huge win. Some of those obstacles weren’t too crazy, and are regular for post-monsoon season in the Southwest. A disconnecting sway bar is a must.
The 18° side incline is a little concerning as well. Being so top heavy, as it appears to be, if you’re uncomfortable at 18° what will happen on trails that tip the scale over 20°? I know some of the ruts on top of Adobe Mesa had my old JL at 23° to 25° with a pucker factor at 100%.
I love what Ineos is doing. It’s targeting us instead of casting a wide net that then requires double the vehicle price in modifications to make it viable for long-term travel.
I’m very impressed by their reception to feedback too. I really think this can be a market disrupter after a few years and as the early adopter bell curve catches on.
35" tires will work with a small lift. I am curious to try 255/80 R17 with no lift. Could be a great travel setup. 18 degrees was only the limit we achieved during the testing. I believe a 25-30 degree reasonable trail limit is ok
@ExpeditionPortal 225 80 17s is ideal for this vehicle in its present form. Some did mention that the trailing link arms are relatively short so a lift will be limited.
If they follow through with the pick up version, I'll order.
I’ve been following everything Grenadier since it first became public on social media. I really respect Ineos and the folks who designed, engineered and build this bespoke overlander. Well done! I would however point out that my main and only disappointment in this OffRoader is the power-plant. I’ve own several BMW’s, even though I’m very particular with the maintenance of any of my vehicles and farm equipment, placing even a B57/B58 engine on this Grenadier, in my humble opinion is a grave mistake. If you put this vehicle through it’s pace in a proper severe off road situation and severe conditions like NGO’s in Sub-Saharan African countries or, the jungles is South America and the countries along the the Andes mountains. countries of Central Asia like Northern India, Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan, the foot hills of the Himalayan’s etc. very remote areas of the globe, good luck finding spare parts for the engine. BMWs have never been synonymous with reliability. Before the advent of sophisticated electronics maybe. Unfortunately not now. If I had a wish, it should have the 2UZ-FE or 3UR-FE from Toyota. Then I’d definitely be comfortable taking this such great purpose built vehicle literally, anywhere! Still, I’m on the early list to purchase it yet, I’m definitely considering canceling and stick with Toyota equipment. Infinitely more support and parts wherever the country where it really matters.
The positive does seem to be that the powerplant has matured well, and received several durability and reliability improvements through the years. Hopeful
Something you need to consider with this power plant is the intentional way it was tuned. One needs to consider exactly why it was this engine in particular. The reliability of this power plants core internals is fantastic. The primary issues where BMW experienced most of the issues was in the parts and equipment used to support HP output and performance up-tunes. That core power plant being tuned down for HP output for an intentional rise in torque changes the dynamic dramatically. That power plant was chosen for that religiously consistent core design, build quality, and material quality that has made it one of the most reliable short blocks ever produced when you compare the numbers of how many have been made and how many have had internal issues when left in standard form and not pushed to its upper limits of performance. And conversely on the subject of parts availability, the other reason for the selection of that specific core power plant is the fact that so many of them have been sold for many years and are currently sold in pretty much every country on the globe. It’s even been use in Toyota products which also bolsters the availability of part universally. I’m actually quite happy with that selection, but I’m also not planning to blow the thing out and push it for maximum HP which will definitely be the mission for certain folks, no doubt. Definitely will be interesting to see what folks do to personalize this rig. 👍🏻😎👍🏻
Not just Africa, Asia or South America. Good luck finding a BMW mechanic in the Aussie outback. Meanwhile plenty of mines and farms Outback with Rangers/Everests, Landies and Prado.
Have an extreme desire for one of these right now, but will have to wait for more details about servicing in the US before I can get too serious.
Checking the map on Ineos's website it seems that Europe is fairly well covered, but the lack of details about any such locations across the pond is a bit concerning.
At least with it running a fairly ubiquitous BMW powertrain it might be hope that parts and servicing for that would be relatively easy to come by.
I wish that I knew more about the axle specs (ring size, axle diameter, full floating rear, etc). I am just genuinely curious about these things.
They are Italian axles Carraro they make tractor axles the lockers are eaton. I have had a drive in the uk and its good .
@UCPKAQ6Z26kF3WJxRFqArwAA Carraro Group was founded in Campodarsego, Italy in 1910 as Giovanni Carraro. The division Carraro Agritalia was founded in Rovigo, Italy in 1977.[1]
A vehicle with many virtues. Nonetheless I had to exit the wait list as the price escalated. Perhaps a used one in the future. Though i could see the used Grenadier market meeting a fate similar to that of the 94-98 North American Defender market that never saw any real depreciation? Hopefully not. Nice to see the Grenadier in more challenging terrain. Though the off camber testing seemed insufficient. I fear thoroughness of testing and freeness of speech could potentially be impaired at a managed event. It would be helpful to hear more critical commentary regarding some of the shortcomings any vehicle will inevitably have.
Bronco Badlands Sasq, or Ineos…? Compare & contrast please (I saw the thrill you had in the Bronco Badlands video)??
The first real off-road review of the Grenadier, thanks Scott! It will be an interesting 24 months as the Grenadier gets tested against the Everest and the upcoming new Prado. Defender is out, too unreliable. Whichever one has decent off-road capability matched with PHEV (as rumoured for the Everest and Prado) will get our order - something about getting free miles off our rooftop solar combined with all that extra torque that looks very attractive.
Are they ever gonna release this thing? I mean how many prototype videos can they make?
It is released for other markets. Just waiting out turn here in North America :)
Man this damn car puts me in a bind. I was going to keep my 3rd gen Tacoma and buy an RS3 for fun. Now I'm thinking of just getting rid of the Taco and pouring money into this grenadier.
Love from India......
really poor editing effort
- had to adjust the volume UP to hear the voice and DOWN to aviod loud music
I love this
Would have been nice to have heard the vehicle.
I'm waiting for someone to do a review where they are driving on something other than what a some Americans would call "driveway"
It needs larger tires or a lift, the break over angle is a hinderance, and departure angle is not great.
It would also be nice if someone did a review on the mounting points, and how they can be utilized. Cargo capacity is great, but having the ability to organize is super important off trail. Would a roof rack or roof top tent throw off the balance?
Why are they not releasing the price yet for the USA ?
Imagine trying to predict pricing with the current inflation. I am sure they are just being careful until closer to the order timeline.
@@ExpeditionPortal You think they might have to assemble if not manufacture the vehicles here in the US ? Maybe these are the tasks of the newly elected CEO.
@@Luckystudio13 us uses different vehicle regulations as the rest of the world. The FMVSS car is not approved yet so no point in releasing pricing for it.
are those the 17" or 18" wheels in the video?
17" wheels
Nice, but can you fit 35’s? 😀
The wheel wells will accommodate a 35 ;)
i'd take it for sure. love the minimal electric/electronic stuff. love the parking brake position. music sucks balls.
The music is free, ya get what you pay for.
The trick is toyota uses the bmw b58 in the supra
I'm I understanding correctly that the Grenadier does not have a sway bar disconnect? What's the rationale for that decision?
It does not come from the factory with a disconnecting sway bar. Fortunately, that is a 10 minute fix.
Any idea what they were calling the color of the grenadier you were driving? Was it the mushroom color?
That is the mushroom color
👍😁
Did you even have to engage diff locks?
We never "had to", but did for evaluation and chassis dynamics evaluation
Good video, but the extreme volume differences between speech and music is really really annoying. If I wasn't really interested in the vehicle I would have turned it off
Just watched this again on a very large screen. Again - great work Scott. Quick question - what is up with the dragging wheel at the 9:50 - 9:57 minute point? I've never seen that with my series Land Rovers or Land Cruisers. What is going on?
What do you mean? I'm watching that section and I can't see any dragging.
@@MD-uu5nt left front wheel is motionless and is pushing a track in the dirt.
Looks like locked differentials with the inner wheel sliding.
@@stonepa I must be blind, I can't see it...
The dealer in Kuwait priced out a trail master spec with with full winch bar work. Pretty much US$100,000. In the video he talked about payload being the best in North America. I wonder how it compares to the 75 and 78 series landcruiser available in much of the rest of the world.
approx 200kg less than a 78 @ 906kgs
Thanks.
Similar payload to a VDJ76 (Comparable model)
@@ExpeditionPortal yes, but with much more room in the load area and so much better to drive.
👍
The traction control on it looks pretty garbage
A better looking G Wagon
Lo siento, pero no es un Land Cruiser serie 70 4.5 turbo diésel V8 de Toyota. Saludos desde Chile. Toyota es Toyota.
👍🏻🏴❤
Was this the petrol or diesel ?
Petrol
@@ExpeditionPortal nice! Thank you !
Love the lack of electronics , just basic and simple .
P09
I want to learn everything I can about the Grenadier, but I'd like do it without the god awful soundtrack.
What’s with that off putting music! 🙉 what were you saying again?
Ya that music was ANOYING
There is no music over the voice commentary. Did we miss something?
@@ExpeditionPortal true bit the music was still anoying
So sorry you didn’t like the music...what would you have suggested?
@@ryankeegan2974 the sound of the engine the sound of the car the outdoors sounds that make you feel like your there.
ㅇㅇ
I see testing one still requires a chaperone lol
صير
Built by a Brexiteer,who went back on promise to build in Wales!
Went to France,with German engineering and design!
No thanks!
Living life with only a political lens self-inflicted suffering.
These look awesome for the most part and check basically every overlanding box.
However, the engine choice leaves A LOT to be desired for overlanding. Not sure why an engine like a Ford EcoBoost/Ford DuraTorq/mild Chevrolet LS was not chosen instead...I personally would not trust a turbo direct injected BMW engine for anything that involves venturing into areas where the nearest BMW dealership is hundreds/thousands of kilometers/miles away.
I'll venture to say that this choice of engine offerings will put off a lot of their potential clientele in North America at least, where newer BMWs have a very sub-par reliability rating, not to mention just being a poor choice for an offroader in general.
This vehicle was designed for the international market not just the U.S. hence the BMW power plant. Both B57 and B58 engines are well tested and reliable, de tuned for longetivity.
@@mikefoster7085 I agree that it might be well-tested and reliable, but if you show up with an engine that mostly comes in luxury road-going vehicles to a shop in any remote part of the western hemisphere/Africa/Australia/Central Asia, you'll be shit out of luck trying to get any work done on it and much less trying to get replacement parts for it.
@a2xd94 they have circumvented this potential issue by having open source repair manuals, parts are like any vehicle anywhere, I should know (I live in regional Western Australia) Ive waited 8 weeks for a simple Toyota part. It's a non issue for me as we are used to not having convenience.
@@mikefoster7085 by open sourcing their repair manual, do you mean that the standard manual includes a service portion as well? I guess if you don’t mind carrying a stock of most-likely-to-break parts with you on long journeys and have a detailed service manual to show to techs if you can’t do a certain job, it should be fine.
A man can dream though, the ideal thing would for me would have been an option of a small displacement Chevrolet LS v8 here in the Americas. You could find parts for those in the most remote corners of the Americas, from Alaska to Argentina.
@a2xd94 yes, it's detailed to the point that anyone with basic mechanical knowledge can change a part, it's a how to change/service/repair. They so far have thought this out thoroughly.
I never understand why engineers design "offroad" vehicles for the road... 31" tire is a joke, that thing has what maybe 6" of suspension travel. Engine is already underpowered against it's competition. Boutique item that only influencers will buy and then dump.
The reality is, this thing doesnt offer anything that isnt already on the market for half the price (e.g. Every mid-size truck, T4R, Jeep, etc)
Looks way too much like a Land Rover Defender