PVC Snare drum UPDATE! Hint-It's not good!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 23 ส.ค. 2024
- Here's an update to the build video I posted about 10 months ago!
Click here to watch my build video:
• PVC SNARE DRUM BUILD! ...
And click here to watch the video that inspired me to make my own PVC snare drum: • 14 x 6.5 PVC Snare Dru...
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You should have used all the mounting holes. I watched your build video and you only used 1 screw in each lug. I would say this contributed to the lugs walking.
You may be right! I'm going to try mounting the lugs with both screws, and make a 3rd video. Coming soon!
Jason Conway I agree! I would use rubber gaskets where possible. I will also say, some snares ONLY sound good one way. It’s had to get a wood snare to sound like a metal snare. Why would this material be any different. I do think he is definitely onto something as far as the build but your DEFINITELY gonna have to break some eggs to make the omelet. Maybe the use of the hardware that are referred to lug locks that I maybe mistaken comes standard on certain drums and drum manufacturer.
Exactly! When I saw the first video I thought that using one screw would lead to this problem. I think adding the second screw will solve this problem.
When you pop the lugs off, you'll see right away if the holes you drilled are now an oval instead of a round drill hole. If the holes are elongated, then the lugs are too much for the pvc. If the holes are still round, I feel the beating on the drum is vibrating the part of the lug that's not secured. Re tape it and use both screws. I'm excited to see. Post a vid of you taking it apart :)
You could use a router with a guide bearing and cut a rabbet around the edge to accommodate the head better. As far as the lugs go, just drill the holes bigger and use some kind of metal bushing and epoxy it into the hole. That should keep things from moving around. And also what some of the other guys have said to. Use both the mounting holes. Interesting video for sure.
That's interesting! All of the PVC snares I have made have been of no issue when it came to the strength of the shells. Mine have all held up just fine. I do use double-sided lugs on all of my drums and am doing the same on my first full PVC set. I made one 14 x 3.5 inch snare with single-sided lugs that are right next to each other, just like your snare. It seems to be holding up just fine as well.
Hate to see your experience with PVC drums could had been better!
This shell type would be a good candidate for the Pearl floating shell snares
Well, they used schedule 40 it appears. Maybe schedule 80 would be okay but you read my mind, a floating head design would be great.
After reading excellent analysis I trust that percussion engineers will solve the current issues with new technology and ideas. I am confident that they will resolve the problem of shifting lugs with new design, maybe free floating.
Lug holes are too close together weakening that spot as well. Double sided lug would've been much better.
Or a reinforcement of the shell penetration somehow, an embedded sleeve to spread the load out some
I'm late to the party but thanks for sharing your thinking on this, really helpful. Cheers from the UK
Thanks for you honesty brother! That says a lot of the great human being you are!
Thanks man!
I’ve heard of similar issues happening with low quality acrylic shells, where the material simply isn’t rigid enough to withstand snare head tensions.
While the double-sided lugs can fix the problem of lug-drift, they aren’t actually fixing the problem, which is that the shell is warping under the tension. It’s literally compressing between the lugs and the heads, which won’t stop. Whatever bearing edge you had will disappear, whatever snare bed you cut will disappear...it just won’t hold its shape.
Also, Aquarian makes larger heads to fit slightly larger vintage shells like Gretsch and MiJ drums.
sanding the shell down to the 13 and 7/8 that you need to get the head to tune right will take forever. it needs to be lathed down to proper thickness. then pick the sets of lug holes that aren't stretched, and put full length tube lugs across the shell, drilling new holes on the opposite side, i'm guessing you'd be using the snare side holes and putting new holes in the top. then for a cool effect and to dry out the sound a bit, turn what's left of the offset lug holes into vents by drilling them out to about 3/8 and screwing in putting in proper vent covers. all problems solved, drum saved, tuning range fixed, and look of drum changed too.
Thank you for the update!! I also have been seeing older videos in my feed from others I subscribe to. Goes to show you something is going on with TH-cam
Great video(s) by the way!
@@jimmydunn2231 Thanks!
I know PVC expands and contracts a LOT in hot/ cold situations, I guess too much for anything bolted to it. Tube lugs would fare better, but situations like taking it from a cold vehicle into a heated venue in the winter would eventually elongate the lug mounting holes too because they can't expand & contract with it. Where I live gear can go from a trailer in minus 30-40 degree temps into a 70+ degree venue. I would guess one 100+ degree temperature change like that would destroy it here. In high temps (a car/ trailer in the sun) it not only expands, but it'll get soft too. This is why you don't nail vinyl siding down tight to the side of a house, it'll buckle and tear as it expands & contracts with temperature changes if the nails aren't left loose. Cool build though, always wondered how PVC would hold up, so it had a lot of educational value too.
IMPORTANT PLEASE TAKE THE TIME TO READ = There is a easy fix to your problem with tuning that drum well maybe not easy but a solution you have to bring the shell to a machine shop and beval the part/edge where the head sits almost to a point and then just put a small rounded edge by sanding. Now with this beveled edge it will take the pressure off the head and allow a wider range of tuning not to mention it will kick ass! You can not use one lug has to be two you can still salvage change hardware. There is also different grades of pvc
Use a Sleishman snare drum with PVC shell. It's a floating shell system. Nothing attaches to the shell. It's held purely by compression of the skins.
There was a company in the 90's call Ugly Percussion which sold pvc snares...If I remember correctly they were mostly (if not all) 13" shells. They even had a somewhat favorable review in Modern Drummer magazine...the poof they were gone. Maybe I now know why. Thanks for the vid and work you put into this project.
Free floating locking mechanism for the lugs.
No holes in the shell and tension is even between the batter and bottom locking mechanism for the lugs.
I would like to hear the difference of pvc.
Also might consider thinner heads as acoustic properties of the shell may be too similar to the heads material when touching as sympathetic muting and resonance due to same manufacturing materials.
I think using pvc as a shell is a good notion but resonance is as important as the strength to keep shape all temperatures and conditions applicable.
Very interesting idea here.
I would try it with less tampering with the integrity of the pvc shell and tension between the locking mechanism for the lugs.
Thicker drumheads give more deep tones as well as flatten resonance.
Just saying
Free floating sounds like a good idea.
I was thrown by you not using both mounting holes. I'm thinking perhaps this would not have happened if you mounted the lugs as designed.
If you used a lug where its one piece for 2 tension rods in a straight line you probably wouldn't have run into that issue because it would pull on the lug in 2 directions at the same time vs 1 for each tension rod.
I know you've already dropped a good bit of money on this project but it does sound like the PVC lug tension is the culprit..if you feel like giving it a second chance you might look into the floating heads style.. just a thought..drum on my man..
Thanks for the update
You may need to route the outside of the shell to thin it out a little so that the head floats on the shell - because the way you are putting it on, it is choking the head's range a little. You'd only need to route about 3/4" toward the center of the drum from each end.
Thanks for the followup.
Dude,Dude,Dude I knew you were going to have A problem with your over sized Diameter, All you have to do is Rabbet the outer Diameter @ top of drum about half inch tall with A Rabbetting Router bit,I am a woodworker and I did it to my older B L x birch pearls your choking the head @ collar, go 1 /16 deep it will be 1\8 all around it will open up tuning trust me ill be lookin for improved drum you did An Xlnt job on . don't shelf it
I remembered you only drilled one hold, that could be a factor. You should drill the other hole, so that the lug sit more stable, you have.nothing to loose
I'm gonna give it a try and post a new video soon!
A metal insert inside, between the lugs that go through the shell, connecting the two, maybe tuning issue is the same as the softness issue
Hit the f’n thing 😂
I personally would have had the shell machined down to the proper size. Also I'm not a fan of offset lugs. 2 sided lugs definitely would have helped!
Maybe a free floating system would work
What about adding a backing plate to the inside of the shell connecting the two lugs together? Yes, I realize they are offset, but if you use a piece of sheet metal wide enough it can bind the two lugs together. Also, did you put a metal insert (sleeve) in the shell when you built it? That may have stopped the lug from digging into the PVC. Just my 2¢.
My stated concern was the tension from the lugs. Now this proves it.
It's also possible that the adhesive of the tape can't hold on under the vibrating lug - vibrating because you only used one mounting point. Maybe it's only the tape that's moving and not the lug or shell.
YT somehow suddenly started to promote you. 😉
Cant imagine anyone wanting a soft plastic snare drum shell... Each to their own i suppose... :)
Probaste recubrir internamente con lamina de corcho ?
Take a router go around the edge take the exess of so the drumhead sit properly good luck🇨🇦🇨🇦
Pete the phucken drummer!!!!!
Love this guy!!!
Thats a fantastic looking snare non the less!!
Backing plate sounds like a good ideal….test it….
😅that's _crazy._ thanks for the update.
Have perhaps thought about putting free floating lugs that way there's hardly any holes drilled into the shell for lug casings.
Look at pearl free floating snare.
Just suggesting.
Could have made a metal strap to connect the lug bolts on the inside of the shell. Still could.
your video showed up on my homepage
Still way cool though! Kinda disappointing that it didn’t really work out. Kinda makes me sad really.
Wow that's crazy. I was really hoping for the PVC snare drum to be successful.
How do you feel about your electric drums?
My strike pro is pretty cool... It takes a bit of getting used to, and the hihat doesnt always trigger properly, but I suppose you get what you pay for! Its good for practice though!
@@petegreendrummer Oh yeah, tell me about it. I have the strike pro set up right now as my daily driver and have had it for about 1 year now and already I've needed two modules, a hi hat, a ride, a snare and a kick drum replaced. I know all kits take a trashing but I thought the Strike Pro was supposed to be, well pro.
You could have had the lugs an equal distance from each other top and bottom.
That would'nt put so much pressure on one area. Instead of putting the lugs right
in one area. You could still do this. Just redrill it.
Also, because the shell is 14", your bearing edge is having the color of the head being pulled over it...instead of the flat part of the head. Maybe if you cut the heads to the inside edge, you'll get a better sound 🤷♂️
did you make a snare bed? you only used 1 screw per lug and its prob just sliding up and down between tunings; pulling the tape up... if thinner acrylic shells are strong enough I'm sure that thick pcv is.
Yes, edges and beds were cut by Precision Drum. I am going to try using both screws, and post a 3rd video with the results!
You should try out Remo’s vintage sizes- they’re a little wider and could probably fix the tuning issue, sucks about the lugs tho mate. What snare is your go to now for live?
I have 3 others. The one I use most is a 6.5 inch deep solid aluminum shell I bought from Drum Factory Direct. I also use a 6 inch deep 8-ply maple Keller shell, and a 4x13 8-ply keller.
Pete Green Productions nice set up there, have you every tried Remo’s vintage sizes?
@@TomSmith-hq1ok I haven't... I can't find any info on Remo's site that clarifies that their vintage heads are in fact wider. On Aquarian's site, however, they specifically state that their American Vintage head is made with a slightly wider hoop, but, I hate that their vintage heads are pale yellow color... So, I'm gonna try sanding it down some more, and I'm going to try a standard single-ply head. I'm gonna film a third video and get it posted hopefully before new year's eve!
Pete Green Productions oh my mistake you’re actually right, I got confused, I meant their ‘classic fit’ heads, worth checking out, could save you a lot of work. They maintain the 14” on the outside but have a narrower flesh hoop to allow for oversized drums. Their video explains them very well
Looking forward to the third vid!
Does anyone know how temperature is going to affects the flex of the shell?
Set up a PVC shell for a Pearl free floater.
This is a great idea.
@@pheachshorbet916 If you have a Pearl FF and use a wood or plastic shell, remove the felt from the mating surface where the shell sits on the snare carriage. It's only really needed for metal shells.
When I setup a wood shell for mine, I took 4 sheets of #40 grit sand paper and glued them in a big square to a piece of tempered glass taken from a screen door for a surface plate, using 3M repositionable spray adhesive so the glue isn't permanent.
The coarse grit is very important because an aggressive cut is required to remove the high spots accurately. Of course this was on wood, so plastic may be soft enough to use 60 or 80 grit.
Then I set the plate on a non-skid mat and orbited the bottom of the shell by hand on the abrasive until the surface was true and flat, that made it sit nice and square on the snare carriage for a nice true resonance from the entire drum as a unit.
I would just remove the stripes.. I thought it looked better without the stripes anyway. Also the spacing. I would have putt the bottom lucks equally between the top lugs vs right next to the top lugs.. May have distributed the stress more vs focused into just a small area.
Lock tight
What if you used metal ferrules or some kind of inserts,not to solve but to decrease the problem?
You remind me of Eric Stoltz looks and voice!
If you use a clear plastic head instead of a fyber skin or a 2 ply coated head will have a more warm tone
The plastic pvc shell with a clear plastic head will be too bright and thin
You have a 5.5 shell, maybe 6, and you like a high tuning. You are asking it to perform out of its range. distance = depth...Your shell should be halved if that it is what you wanted it to sound like. PVC is a rigid unforgiving product. It does not breathe and expand as wood or metal, are prone to do. I bet if you reduced the depth, your shell issues would disappear. You do not use a sledgehammer to set wood flooring nails...
eh!...you gave it a try...live and learn and back to the drawing board...try the double-sided lugs!
You wanna sell it?
Matt Tisdale hell I’d buy it lol
Thanks, but no. I'm gonna try a couple more things with this shell, and if it's still not good, I'm gonna reuse the hardware on another build. But thanks!
Pete Green Productions lol I’d gladly buy the shell, that’s what I was after anywho 😂👌🏻
@@MrHavok9 I'll keep you posted!
Being the person who sold him the shell, I could definitely help you out if you want one. :)
Black PVC
get another shell.
Well I hate to be Captain Obvious here but you'll have these problems when you build drums out of material that was never meant to be a drum in the first place what did you expect would happen
Just take the tape off
Snare drums are always too loud compared to the rest of the kit.....no matter what they are made of............end of story.
It’s fookin shite! Octabons maybe. Snare..no.