I haven't seen this movie yet, but I'm definitely going to check it out. I would like to see your take on some of Mike Flanagan's work like the miniseries "Midnight Mass". He likes to traffic in Christian-based horror, but unlikely a lot of it, he's pretty sympathetic to the believers, writing them as real, but still flawed people. He likes to put in scenes where believers vs non-believers get to have exchanges in ways that don't, in my opinion, denigrate either. As an atheist-leaning agnostic, I find his work to be some of the more compelling kind of Christian-related work I've seen in anything recent.
Midnight Mass is fantastic. That's definitely one of the only other pieces of media I've seen in recent years that has a critical but ultimately positive impression of faith. Also, Hamish Linklater deserved an Emmy nod for his performance.
The Bad Christians movies you spoke are all the product of a specific Sect of Christianity, American Evangelicalism. And as someone who's had thought on these movies since well before they became their own Genre of TH-cam content, Pure Flix movies are pretty damn professional compared to early 2000s Cloud Ten movies. But my point is a Catholic movie isn't really a counterexample of how to do what they're trying to do, the core understanding of The Gospel is different. I'm someone who still considers themselves an Evangelically where all the doctrines of the Faith are concerned, yet functionally an outsider no due to my Leftist Politics. What fascinates me is how often I feel Anime by sheer accident more resembles what a Christian movie should be then any of these movies.
Great video! One nitpick however: When you say "Christian movie" you seem to mean "*overtly* Christian movie" (which to be honest is pretty common usage by both Christians and non-Christians). It should be noted that there are also "*covertly* Christian movies", such as The Lord of the Rings and The Chronicles of Narnia, which are both written by devoted Christians, and have strong Christian themes and values, but just don't have crosses and God and Jesus everywhere (except that Aslan the lion is Jesus in a different guise). Heck, even Batman movies often have Christian imagery and values, but are generally not counted as "Christian movies", because they can be enjoyed by non-Christians as well (and because it's "Batman", not "Jesus-man"). When we limit "Christian movies" to only mean "overtly Christian movies", we're only left with movies: - that have preachy messages, - that have painfully unsubtle symbolism, - that have plots that only make sense to Christians, or... - that defame non-Christians (which this movie does somewhat by implying that people without faith are miserable (as you noted)). I think my list makes it pretty clear why overtly Christian movies aren't made as much in this current era, where there are more non-Christians than before, and studios don't want to alienate them. Of course, if we accept covertly Christian movies into the definition, there are still plenty of Christian movies, just no Christian hegemony.
Shellterdude makes a good point. It is not that Christian movies are inherently bad. There are so many that are terrible that they tend to overwhelm the good ones. But then "Oh God" came along and the world saw that God could be like George Burns and so began decades of peace and harmony. What makes films like Calvary and shows like Midnight Mass special is not that they are unexpectedly good, but that they dare to recognize that Christianity (and religion in general so say I) is a complex mishmash or the good, the bad and the totally fucked up. I would say that the great percentage of films about religion, whether good or bad, tend to land on the pro side or the con side. There are few films that sincerely cannot make up their mind which is worse -- a world with religion or a world without it. Calvary is a pretty damning portrait of what is lost when those we trust betray us, and the price that even good people pay when that trust is destroyed. You could replace the word 'Christianity' with almost any other noun and make a film that shows why that thing is really good or really bad. Dog, for example. 'Dogs are good' gets you Old Yeller. 'Dogs are bad' gets you Cujo. But where is the film where Old Yeller and Cujo both exist and must work together to save Timmy from a well just so they can bite him in the face? That's the sort of complex perspective that makes for a great film and it is what makes Calvary stand out.
What about Prince of Egypt? that's a good movie, or Evan Almighty? Or if you want some good movies from my strand of Christianity may I suggest 17 miracles and Ephraim's Rescue? They take place at the same time and be warned there is a high probability of crying, I kind of want to re-watch those movies now.
I haven't seen this movie yet, but I'm definitely going to check it out. I would like to see your take on some of Mike Flanagan's work like the miniseries "Midnight Mass". He likes to traffic in Christian-based horror, but unlikely a lot of it, he's pretty sympathetic to the believers, writing them as real, but still flawed people. He likes to put in scenes where believers vs non-believers get to have exchanges in ways that don't, in my opinion, denigrate either. As an atheist-leaning agnostic, I find his work to be some of the more compelling kind of Christian-related work I've seen in anything recent.
Midnight Mass is fantastic. That's definitely one of the only other pieces of media I've seen in recent years that has a critical but ultimately positive impression of faith. Also, Hamish Linklater deserved an Emmy nod for his performance.
@@MooVeeMan Agreed (on all counts).
The Bad Christians movies you spoke are all the product of a specific Sect of Christianity, American Evangelicalism. And as someone who's had thought on these movies since well before they became their own Genre of TH-cam content, Pure Flix movies are pretty damn professional compared to early 2000s Cloud Ten movies. But my point is a Catholic movie isn't really a counterexample of how to do what they're trying to do, the core understanding of The Gospel is different.
I'm someone who still considers themselves an Evangelically where all the doctrines of the Faith are concerned, yet functionally an outsider no due to my Leftist Politics. What fascinates me is how often I feel Anime by sheer accident more resembles what a Christian movie should be then any of these movies.
Great video!
One nitpick however: When you say "Christian movie" you seem to mean "*overtly* Christian movie" (which to be honest is pretty common usage by both Christians and non-Christians).
It should be noted that there are also "*covertly* Christian movies", such as The Lord of the Rings and The Chronicles of Narnia, which are both written by devoted Christians, and have strong Christian themes and values, but just don't have crosses and God and Jesus everywhere (except that Aslan the lion is Jesus in a different guise).
Heck, even Batman movies often have Christian imagery and values, but are generally not counted as "Christian movies", because they can be enjoyed by non-Christians as well (and because it's "Batman", not "Jesus-man").
When we limit "Christian movies" to only mean "overtly Christian movies", we're only left with movies:
- that have preachy messages,
- that have painfully unsubtle symbolism,
- that have plots that only make sense to Christians,
or...
- that defame non-Christians (which this movie does somewhat by implying that people without faith are miserable (as you noted)).
I think my list makes it pretty clear why overtly Christian movies aren't made as much in this current era, where there are more non-Christians than before, and studios don't want to alienate them.
Of course, if we accept covertly Christian movies into the definition, there are still plenty of Christian movies, just no Christian hegemony.
Shellterdude makes a good point. It is not that Christian movies are inherently bad. There are so many that are terrible that they tend to overwhelm the good ones. But then "Oh God" came along and the world saw that God could be like George Burns and so began decades of peace and harmony. What makes films like Calvary and shows like Midnight Mass special is not that they are unexpectedly good, but that they dare to recognize that Christianity (and religion in general so say I) is a complex mishmash or the good, the bad and the totally fucked up. I would say that the great percentage of films about religion, whether good or bad, tend to land on the pro side or the con side. There are few films that sincerely cannot make up their mind which is worse -- a world with religion or a world without it. Calvary is a pretty damning portrait of what is lost when those we trust betray us, and the price that even good people pay when that trust is destroyed. You could replace the word 'Christianity' with almost any other noun and make a film that shows why that thing is really good or really bad. Dog, for example. 'Dogs are good' gets you Old Yeller. 'Dogs are bad' gets you Cujo. But where is the film where Old Yeller and Cujo both exist and must work together to save Timmy from a well just so they can bite him in the face? That's the sort of complex perspective that makes for a great film and it is what makes Calvary stand out.
We need more redemption arc movies about dogs. "Evil" dogs that are actually just victims of circumstance that grow into really Good BoysTM.
What about Prince of Egypt? that's a good movie, or Evan Almighty? Or if you want some good movies from my strand of Christianity may I suggest 17 miracles and Ephraim's Rescue? They take place at the same time and be warned there is a high probability of crying, I kind of want to re-watch those movies now.
I have one response watch the chosen.
Silence.