How To Actually Use DLSS 3 Frame Generation!
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 15 พ.ค. 2024
- In this video, we showcase the results of Nvidia's DLSS 3 frame generation technology in several popular games including Cyberpunk 2077 and Ratchet and Clank: Rift Apart. DLSS uses advanced AI algorithms to enhance image quality and performance, and the results are impressive. Watch the video to see how DLSS 3 improves each game's frame rates with minimal impact to visuals.
Worried about additional input latency, or input lag when DLSS 3 Frame Generation is enabled? We also show you system latency with and without DLSS 3 Frame Generation.
Find out how to correctly use DLSS 3 Frame Generation!
System Specs:
Nvidia GeForce RTX 4080 (MSI Gaming X Trio)
Intel 12700K CPU @ Stock
32GB DDR4 4000Mhz CL18 Memory
Asus TUF Gaming Z690 D4 Motherboard
Corsair RM850 Power Supply
Resizable BAR Enabled
My previous DLSS 3 Frame Generation video can be found here: • Why Do People Hate DLS...
All metrics captured using MSI Afterburner in conjunction with RTSS, as well as GeForce Experience for latency metrics.
Timestamps:
0:00 - Intro
0:25 - DLSS 2 vs DLSS 3
01:57 - Cyberpunk 2077 Input Latency Test
4:45 - Spider-Man Remastered Input Latency Test + CPU Bound Scenario
7:40 - Ratchet and Clank Input Latency Test
10:53 - When to Actually use Frame Generation
12:47 - Extreme Power Savings Diablo IV - เกม
People don't hate framegen, they hate the pricing and specs of Nvidia latest products and attempts to sell DLSS3 and framegen as actual performance.
Thing is, there is very little competition from AMD so far this gen, and that is unfortunately why Nvidia has these ridiculous prices. Nvidia have released 7 GPUs so far, and AMD only 3, if you dont count the SI-only 7900 GRE. I really hope AMD steps it up so we can have more options this gen, as well as compete with Nvidia to keep prices in check. The 4060 and 4060 Ti were a real slap in the face, and nothing will justify those 2 GPUs. I just already fewl bad for the 4050 and 4050 Ti 🤦
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews 4060 and 4060Ti *are* the 4050 and 4050Ti. Same way the 4070Ti was supposed to be 4080 12Gb, but Nvidia decided not to anger their high-end customers.
To be fair AMD does pretty much the same thing with prices. I hope people won't cave in and let all those useless low and mid-tier cards rot on the shelves until the price drops are very substantial. =/
Yeah, I talked about the 4060 and 4060 Ti in the video, and not only are they terrible value, they actually lose to their previous gen counterparts in some titles. People are right to be angry about that, and I agree, those should gather dust or act as paperweights or doorstops until they drop to a much more reasonable price. Maybe replace the stickers with the correct naming while they’re at it
You have a point with pricing and specs, especially at the low end with the 4060 and 4060 TI, but the DLSS3 tech is impressive and works well. Moore's law is slowing down quite a bit, so "trickery" like DLSS3 to increase performance despite semiconductors not advancing at the same rate as prior years is most welcome to me. I would much rather have DLSS3 than not have it, as the alternative would be....what, some small extra percentage performance increase if those transistors were used for traditional performance? Not very compelling when DLSS3 can nearly double your framerate at the cost of a small amount of input latency.
@@arnham At this generation they just cut the core specs of anything lower than RXT 4080 and tried to sell DLSS 3 instead of actual performance.
Anti-lag and it's counterpart works by adjusting frame timings to line up with the CPU (along with a sort of inverse vsync) and reduces the buffer size so you have less pre-rendered frames.
Thanks, appreciate the explanation!
And it also gives you vac ban in cs2 as a bonus
@@user-yv6bf4ef6g That was only anti-lag+, because it injected directly into games at the driver level for better optimization. Doesn't affect regular anti-lag.
The problem is not that they are using frame generation to sell new cards, they are using frame generation as an excuse to bump up the price.
I can fully appreciate the issues surrounding frame gen, like pricing, and no performance improvements over last gen on the lower end cards except for AV1 and Frame Gen etc. But I find the tech itself pretty good.
Maybe because it takes time and money to develop frame generation technology? Lmao. You think God is just delivering them technical advancements every 2 years? They invest hundreds of millions in developing this tech. If you want a cheaper GPU, you can still shop the 20, 30 series GPUs and all the of AMD products. To cry about the 40 series not being cheap enough is weird when there's already so many great GPUs on the market, more than there ever has been any other time in history of gaming.
@@thecooljohn100 Yeah, I find it baffling as well. A lot of time went into R&D for this tech, and that's a lot of money. Gotta recoup it somewhere. Sure, AMD is doing it for *free, but I reckon it's to try and win some marketshare. People are constantly complaining about Nvidia's business practices, but the truth is, no corporation is your friend. They are all in it to make money.
My problem is that now games think that having Frame gen is an excuse to have low-performing games in the first place. It is not being used as a tool to make an average-performing game perform at high frame rates, it's now being used to make badly performing games perform at 60fps. I've tried a 4090 at my friend's house, and for a lot of games without frame generation on, it can't do much above 60 at ultra settings.
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews That is one hundred percent true, but that does not mean that we can't criticize them. Knowing that they are only out to make money doesn't make their price gouging any less contemptible.
Very informative video, nice work.
Appreciate the watch and the comment! This video almost didnt happen, but glad I published it :)
I have a Lenovo Legion 5i Pro incoming. Thank you for the detailed, real world info and examples. This totally makes sense and looks like a game changer, especially for single player games.
A nice comment on a controversial topic? Unheard of! Really appreciate the comment, and glad you could find some use for the video. Enjoy your new laptop!
Hey man. Just got mine as well. Having a blast!
@@contemplatingrain2380 awesome! I won the July Lenovo giveaway (much to my surprise) and I’m just waiting impatiently for the shipping notification.
I just got my Lenovo T7 with the 4080 and I7 13600k and the things a beast. Love it.
Underrated channel I like how u honest & explains about dlss3 clearly
Appreciate the kind words, thanks!
Good follow up video!
I could feel it right away, something felt off with mouse movement. Thanks for this breakdown, it's great to know the base framerate affects the latency post generation gives me more to work with getting it down. Excellent video
Yeah, some people are definitely more sensitive to input latency than others. It sounds like you are one of those that are more sensitive, so the best is to be very selective with this tech and use it in games where input latency doesnt matter, like Diablo 4, or MSFS or something similar.
Agreed. It feels like walking around in cement shoes
Great latency explanation.
Thanks!
Thanks, really appreciate the comment
I was always on the fence with DLSS very much game dependant but the tew games i have used frame gen i hsve been very impressed aa you mentioned if I was already getting decent frames but just needed a little bump its the feature of the generation if you aak me
Playing Ratchet & Clank PC now besides being a drop dead gorgeous game at 4k with ray-tracing cranked up the frame gen seems a good implementation
R&C performs very well. There are a few issues at the moment, like crashing and Nvidia Reflex causing performance loss etc, but a decent frame generation implementation, agreed. And the game looks SO good!
Hey there, great video 🙂 I have a question - do you know how to fix screen tearing while using frame gen? I tend to enable Vsync in NVCP, but that adds input lag which we don't want. It's just surprising I see tearing when I'm on a GSYNC compatible panel. 🤔
Thanks, appreciate the comment!
What is your monitor's refresh rate? I use NVCP Vsync on my 165hz panel and the added input latency is very minimal.
What I have seen others do is cap it via RTSS, but at half your monitor's refresh rate -2. So if you have a 144hz panel, cap it at 70 fps. It should then prevent it from going over 140 fps, meaning you shouldnt get any screen tearing anymore with a G-Sync panel. Well, in theory, but we all know PCs like to give us the run-around every now and again.
How much extra vram does Frame generation take up generally? I’m currently near the vram limit in some games so was wondering if there’ll be performance impact if it goes over
How much VRAM do you have?
It does use some VRAM, but it depends on the game. I saw anything from 500MB to 1.5GB, but that is usually offset by using DLSS Super Resolution. Running out of VRAM will definitely cause performance issues, but also, a lot of games can get by with say 8GB, but use 14GB if available. So the VRAM usage you see might not actually be what is actually required. Diablo 4 uses up to 21GB on a 4090, but still runs perfectly fine on a 12GB 4070 Ti for example.
Just tested this again last night and I saw an average extra usage of 1GB by only enabling frame generation. When I enabled DLSS super resolution on the Quality mode it reduced VRAM usage again by about 400MB, so in my experience you can look at around 500MB to 1GB additional VRAM usage, depending on the game and settings.
Thanks, quite informative
Thanks, appreciate it
I'm late to the party here, but this is a great explanation to the whole DLSS 3 Fiasco. Yoy have a calm explanation to counter some arguments, was un biased about it, and even presented some of your evidence.
I will however say, I shared with my brother a system with a 7900 XTX, but decided to build my own as well, with a 4080 super that finally arrived yesterday. My last NVIDIA GPU i used on on a family's and also another personally mine, all in one pc's. Family's woth GTX 1050 mobile and mine with a 930mx. Neither playable on anything, even more so on the 930mx.
Looking at both of the drover settings software, it reminds me of the differences I watched within these technologies. I would say and that many others more informed on this Anti-Lag would say it's more if a competitor to NVIDIA's Low Latency Mode within the control panel. They both work by Dynamicallh limiting the number of frames the CPU can produce to help knock out the render queue, thus creating less worload on the GPU.
NVIDIA Reflex, and Anti-Lag+ (When ever that will come back), took this a step further by timing this better with added game data and also timing thongs within the game's engine.
Appreciate you taking the time to share your experience. Yeah indeed, at the time I wasnt fully clued up on exactly how reflex and Low Latency modes exactly did, but you explained it very nicely in Layman's terms. I really hope Anti-Lag+ makes a comeback as it definitely helps with FSR 3 frame generation. At the time of making this video only Nvidia had frame generation technologies available, but now that FSR 3 is here I am just happy that now everybody can try these for themselves. FSR 3 so far has had its issues, but in Avatar at least it works very well now. I had quite a few frame pacing issues initially but after a few patches and driver updates I have to say, it's pretty good.
I personally like frame generation, if that wasnt obvious at this point 😀 But even I can admit when it shouldnt be used, like competitive shooters for example. But if you have a high refresh rate monitor then frame gen is really great to enhance motion fluidity at the expense of some additional input latency.
Hope you enjoy that 4080 Super! I still ove my normal 4080, and dont see myself upgrading any time soon!
Thanks man. nice video!
Appreciate it!
As someone who severely despises input latency, and at all times would prefer less than 20ms, if you can't feel a 10ms difference in input latency then it's definitely for you. If you can, like me however, it's snake oil. Adding input latency is absurd. I don't care how the game "looks" I care how it feels.
Yeah, that's totally fair. Also, snake oil is such a funny term hahaha.
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews well the term snake oil is heavily derived from salesman selling fake or misleading products. Nvidia selling frame generation as "real" frames (quantities that reduce input latency, the most notable benefit from high frame rates) can be directly attributed to snake oil in that sense. At least I personally consider high frame rates to only be for feel not looks, I can play 60fps elden ring all day with controller but the second you hand me a mouse I'll FEEL the 60.
@@704pat Yeah, agreed, their marketing around this can be very misleading. I understand the term snake oil, just find it a funny term haha!
Fine work right here brother! keep spreading the Truth!
Appreciate the encouraging words!
Nice Vid , Duke
In Cyberpunk it feels awful unless you already have high base framerate without framegen, but in Rift Apart it feels crazy good, no input lag whatsoever, super high freames even with RT On and everything maxxed out. I play with DLAA and FrameGen and the game looks beautiful.
Rift Apart is just such a good looking game, and it performs very well with FG. The game isnt that hard to run on higher end GPUs, and add FG then to the mix and you get a very good experience.
I found rift apart better without FG, was getting strange frames stuttering when getting it on, didn't felt smooth
Framegen requires 60fps to fully work correctly
Because 40fps 120hz is 🔥 lol
Do you use gamepad or mouse?
The people with a problem with frame gen probably either don’t understand how it works, they’re trying to run it on underpowered hardware, or they can’t afford a graphics card that is capable of running it and they’re hating on it because some other TH-camrs told them it was bad.
I know you left this comment a while ago but I wanted to see how well it aged when FSR 3 became more widely available. It's been eye-opening to see the same people on Twitter that complained about DLSS 3 now praise FSR 3. Literally the same people 🤣
I fully agree with your last reason - they got told it was bad and jumped on the hate train. It happens with so many things.
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews my only problem with FSR, besides the fact it’s not as good as DLSS, is that game devs use it on console games when I believe there are more effective options for achieving target resolution and frame rate. Maybe FSR is part of that equation, but you have to wonder if they’re turning it on because they don’t know any better? They don’t realize the image is muddy now and there’s ghosting. In that case, and I’m talking specifically about Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth, that some other settings would provide a superior experience.
How do you get your overlay from Geforce Experience to show. I use it as well, but it never shows up in my recordings.
I used to have the same issue, but I didnt do anything to fix it really, it just started working a few driver updates ago.
Maybe try DDU in safe mode and then reinstall the drivers from scratch, see if that helps?
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews I think in the past it did work for me.. it's not a big deal .. but I was just curious. Thanks
Thanks a lot it definitely is a great feature
The premium for it sucks, but the feature is very good.
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews yeah but it is what it is. I actually thought the latency would be extremely bad due to how people talk this topic but I’m relieved after watching your video.
@@tunahan6719 Yeah, I use it on a daily basis. The latency is only bad if your base frame rate is low. Other than that it really is awesome.
why hate a new feature? it IS more frames - fake or not. and the fact is, you really notice the extra FPS but hardly notice at all the latency. Obviously just not something you'd use on esports titles for multiple reasons, including the fact that FPS is high in those games anyway
Exactly what I tried to convey. But this is the internet, no place for logic 😂
I don't play competitive eSports titles and was never good in 1st person shooters so I don't think I would feel the latency at all. Tech like this is perfect for me as I play mostly single player games.
@@deyandimitrov7287 yeah a lot of people just play single player and a lot just play online. I play a mix personally
@@deyandimitrov7287 I used to play Counter-Strike (Source and 1.6) competitive locally and I find that I can barely notice the additional input latency if my base FPS is above 60. It is there, but even in games like Cyberpunk it doesnt hamper my experience.
Im coming from console to a 4070ti. Id like to run max settings at 1440p while getting around 40fps, coming from console a lot if games in the quality preset are locked at 30 fps, and some even drop into the 20's sometimes. So, 40fps seems like it would give me room to drop some without going below 30. The majority of games i wanna play are older as well. I definitely wanna play cyberpunk with max settings, and dlss with input latency wouldnt really bother me i dont think. The 4080 was my first option, but 50 series cards are rumored to launch within the next year or so, so I'll get a 4080 or 4090 if the price drops a little on them
Make sure that you've turned off ALL forms of Mouse Acceleration. One checkbox exists in the Windows Control Panel: Mouse Settings and there may also be a mouse acceleration setting in your gaming mouse driver software, sometimes LG software has it's own for example. Most people aren't even aware that they've been using mouse accel until they actually turn it off and feel how their own mouse pointer accuracy seems off... until they become re-accustomed to not having it on.
Yeah, good tip. This makes game feel "floaty", which impacts the experience quite a bit.
Reflex Activating + boost doesn't have a better effect on decreasing latency?
The reflex toggle becomes completely unavailable when enabling FG, so not possible to enable +boost unfortunately. I am busy with a video showing the differences between on and on+boost, obviously without FG as you cant change it there 👍
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews Thanks for the answer.
I tested it here on Miles and Ratchet and it is possible to change between the two options even with the FG activated, but I did not notice a difference in latency, only in the frame rate, which loses a little when activating Boost
@@Leo_Hidalgo Interesting, I'll have a look again at Ratchet, but I know in Cyberpunk it locks it completely, and other games as well. I might be wrong with Ratchet and will check Spider-Man again as I dont have Miles Morales. Thanks for letting me know.
As for the lower framerate, that is typically what happens with +boost enabled.
Thanks again for the heads-up with regards to being able to set it to on+boost, will check it out. I just assumed from the other games I have tested you cant change it. You learn something new every day.
I keep try looking for information about whether Frame Generation quality has improved with time. I remember a video showing Microsoft Flight Simulator, where as crosshair would distort when panning. I think they fixed that.
Am wondering however if in general FG has improved over time. Thinking about because I would want to use FG in Cyberpunk 2077 if I bought it. Would be a shame to buy C2077, get path-tracing on, add Raytracing Reconstruction, only to have FG ruin it.
FG has definitely come a long way, but there are still some noticeable artifacts sometimes. For instance in Cyberpunk, the first time you draw a gun with "digital ironsights" it is slightly garbled for a second or so, but then it stabilizes. Stuff like that. It is much better than initially, especially in Spider-Man and MSFS. Spider-man's HUD was garbled in motion, but that doesnt happen anymore. Crosshair artifacts are not an issue anymore either, at least in the games I tested so far. A game migjt release with a subpar integration of FG where some of these things might be present, but it doesnt take long for it to get fixed in most cases.
For Cyberpunk, the implementation is probably 98% flawless. It looks great, runs great, and you'll have to pixel peep to really see a difference with FG on vs off. There are some artifacts here and there, as explained regarding the ironsights, but they are very few and far between.
Please note that this is only my perception / experience with it. Others might notice the artifacts more, but I dont, and use it in any game that has FG, except competitive shooters like The Finals and MW3.
Does anyone know why dlss super resolution setting doesn't improve fps at all? I have good cpu ryzen 9 5900X. Nvm, looks like CP has settings bug. Had to toggle frame generation on/off few times for super resolution to start working.
When CPU bound the framerate wont increase when using DLSS super resolution as DLSS lowers load on the GPU.
I can feel the input latency in D4 at native res 60fps... its super common for me to press a skill, like flame shield and die because it did not register my input in time.
I dont think it's input latency as this still happens at 300 fps without frame generation as well. This feels more like game or online latency as button presses arent instant no matter what. If you measure your input latency using the Nvidia overlay you'll see it's very low, even at 60 fps native.
sometimes i cant tell the difference between native and dlss performance.
sometimes dlss quality makes things look sharper than native
dlss ultra performance makes things blurrier
but performance, with the help of a sharpness filter, can really give you the most bang for your buck in terms of fps increase
but people choose quality cause they think it is sharpest
but the fps increase from native to quality is minimal
if you choose performance you could even increase overall resolution or enable ray tracing on midrange cards
If the implementation is good I can definitely use more aggressive upscaling settings. Cyberpunk 2077 does have issues with flickering lights to when using Performance at 4K, and Balanced at 1440p. But it does depend on the implementation. Going to be testing DLSS 3.5 (without ray construction) this week to see how it improves over previous versions.
u gonna make a video?@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews
@@SolarNeonFlare I definitely will
i want your eyes
@@Mostly_Positive_ReviewsBro I use DLSS Quality in Cyberpunk 2.1 and its trash, a lot blurry, can you explain why?
I have a Nvidia card that has frame generation. I tried it in a few game such as Cyber Punk 2077 and I like it a lot. It smooths the image on the screen, so it looks very good, as well as increasing fps about 50 percent higher. As everyone should know, it should not be used in competitive shooters, because you do not want anything affecting latency. But in 1st or 3rd person games, I feel is is great. Get a demo or a game and try it yourself. I thought frame generation was maybe a gimmick until I tried it myself, but I found that I like it.
Same, also thought it a gimmick until I used it. Use it in most games now.
Interestingly enough games like bf2042 have their own inferior version of future frames rendering but I don't experience any feel of input latency. Probably because I'm at ovet 100 fps
tried it in Forspoken with AMD frame gen and honestly it feels great, just gonna wait on FSR 3 in cyberpunk to try it out since i dont have a 4000 series
@@cooltwittertag Yeah, I have a few videos up with AMD's FSR 3 as well, and it's pretty good for their first attempt. Just hope they can bring it to more games soon!
I play on a 60hz 43inch tv with vsync of and frame limit to 60.
I wonder if frame genaration help on those situation the game can't reach/keep 60 fps? or this is only good if you already over 60fps on a +144hz monitor?
If the game is running like 30-40 fps and FG push it to 60, does feel better? or make things even worst?
If you go from 40 fps to 60 fps it feels pretty bad. If you go past 60 fps and cap it to 60 via v-sync or framerate cap it's not worth it in my opinion. I tried that on my 4k60 monitor and it felt terrible. It really is only to provide a high refresh rate output if you are already getting around 60 fps. AMD also advises to have at least 55 fps at 1080p before enabling FG, and 70 fps at 1440p or higher.
In my Cyberpunk 4070 Ti video I showed this, and enabling frame gen when running at around 30 fps the input latency was close to 200 ms.
For my first pc I'll be getting a 2080 ti because here they are selling for $250 :D. Can't wait to use dlss 3.5 and fsr 3's fg on cyberpunk. (I think cyberpunk supports fsr 3, right?)
The 2080 Ti at that price is a crazy good deal. Yeah, FSR 3 will be supported on Cyberpunk. FSR 3 launches Q1 2024 and I am very excited as well!
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews no, fsr3 launches next month in first two games and normal hypr rx (without AFMF/Amd Fluid Motion Frames) launches near this too, hypr rx with AFMF (in driver) which is rdna 3 only will be at Q1 2024
@@krspy1337 You are indeed correct, thanks for the correction 👍
It is simply adding quite a significant latency from it's principle, as first it needs to render frame in low resolution, then resample it by DLSS then it needs to do same for one extra frame ahead and then to apply DLSS Frame Generation between these two frames, after that this is displayed. Also many LCD monitors are adding some latency, as they are not as fast as old analogue CRTs, in some bad combination of setting and low spec cards it can happened, that you have on display 60fps, but on-rail shooter experience 🙂
Yeah, very good explanation of what happens. I didnt test it in this specific video, but I think it was done in my 4070 Ti video on Cyberpunk, and there I showed that if your final output FPS is 60, the latency is terrible. But if your base frame rate is 50+ it can do good things for people on high refresh rate monitors.
Except that the DLSS (2) upscale DECREASES latency because it's faster than rendering a higher resolution frame. So you're partially wrong.
@@markjacobs1086 Seeing that the subject at hand was DLSS 3, I assumed he was talking about frame generation and answered based on that. But yes, DLSS 2 Super Resolution or upscaling does decrease latency
People play at 60-80ms in legue of legends of curse you can play a single player game at 50ms
@@dante4111south africans also play on europe servers with 240 ping, that is all dog shit
a 10ms increase in latency from just dlss to frame gen is miniscule. and with dlss completely off, you get MORE latency than dlss+frame gen? why are people complaining about the smallest things
Beats me. Unfortunately people like to complain nowadays just for the sake of complaining. Some people have provided good reasons why they dont like it, not that they should validate themselves. But jumping on a hate train just for the sake of it is beyond me.
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews yeah fr. every single technological progress update has huge haters for no reason. even rtx STILL has haters like 5 years later, which is rlly sad because it's haters like that, that prevent tech from progressing past what they're conformable with
@@theorphanobliterator And the best is, these are options. Very few games force ray tracing on, so you can choose to enable it or not. Same with upscaling and frame generation, they are all options that you can choose to use or not.
just a question: let's say that i'm hovering aroung 55-60 fps with some fluctuation, and i use framegen to lock it to 60. would that cause inpput lag problems?
Yeah, very much so, as half the frames would be generated, so you'd get worse latency than 30 fps without FG. I only know this because I tried something similar 🤣 I got around 110 fps but wanted to lock it to 120 using FG and a framerate limiter, and my latency more than doubled. Unfortunately when enabling frame gen, every second frame is generated, regardless if you only need 5 fps to lock it to 60.
What you can do is enable FG at 55 fps, and then use vsync fast in Nvidia control panel. That way it wont lock the framerate to 60 fps, and it will try to prevent tearing caused by going over your monitor's refresh rate. It doesnt always work, but I have gotten vsync fast to work on my 4K60 monitor, and then it's a good experience.
AWESOME video
Thank you, appreciate it!
Can you vsync with frame generation enabled to 60fps ?
You can but it will be a bad experience. Frame Gen is for high refresh rate monitors, so preferably 120hz+
I use frame generation .. I like it . When used with Gsync/vsync I feel barely any latency impact and it feels x2 smoother
Yeah, that's how I use it too, with G-sync and v-sync on, and the motion fluidity is really awesome then.
What it feels like to use frame gen when your framegen FPS is 60 and non framegen FPS is way less. Does it feel more input lag or artifacts ?
Yeah, if your end result is 60 the input latency is quite bad. I showed this on my 4070 Ti Cyberpunk video a little while ago. When using path tracing and I got 20 fps or so I enabled FG and the latency shot up to just below 200ms. It stabalized at around 100+ ms, but it wasnt a good experience 😂
Everything has it's drawbacks along with it's advantages. The more tools we have the better.
Couldnt agree more. As an option, these things arent forced on anyone, but those that want to use it, can.
I play solo games with an xbox controller🎮. You'll find the latency and fps matter not as much in comparison to a mouse. When using a mouse you'll notice it much more since movments are much more sharp
Yeah, exactly. I play Witcher 3 and Ratchet and Clank with a controller and the difference in input latency is imperceptible. With a mouse it is slightly more noticeable, correct. Well, that's my experience anyway.
Slight correction.... We actually don't know if DLSS is AI-based. This is what nvidia has said it is. However since it's closed source and since nvidias marketing work a lot with "half-truths" I wouldn't take it on face value. First of all, we don't do AI, nobody does AI... what we do is machine learning, and in that case, the algorithm needs to learn over time, which it doesn't. There was a huge paradigm shift from DLSS1 (which was AI generated), But the results were REALLY bad and the tech quickly became a laughing stock. Nvidia went back to the drawing board, kept the name "Deep Learning Super Sampling" but ultimately DLSS2 is a temporal upscaler. It does use tensor cores for acceleration. Which sure, nvidia market as "AI-cores", But in reality these cores are specifically designed for matrix calculations... that's not the same thing as "AI". This allow RTX APUs to accelerate parallelized workflows, which also accelerate machine learning, but in order to receive blistering fast performance, it calculate several layers of temporal data to reconstruct each pixel on screen. There is no image recognition, there's no learning, there's no AI. It's just an advanced, but accelerated temporal upscaler.
Interesting points. And yeah, I know AI is just a buzzword, but I used it for simplicity reasons, as a lot of my small audience are new to these types of tech. Would be interesting to know for sure regarding DLSS 2 though 🤔
Yeah, except you're wrong. There IS image recognition, there IS learning, there IS Ai compute at work. Ai is a spectrum of things, not just Skynet levels of intelligence. Nvidia is the world's leading company in Ai computing, so I'm going to take their stance on it before I do some armchair wizard's.
They TRAIN their DLSS algorithm in-house using their own machine learning supercomputer. They then package that into a static generalized model that can be integrated into any game, slap a version number on it and that lets us know how much the DLSS algorithm was trained. There is no machine learning done on the hardware itself, I think that's where you were thinking Nvidia was claiming that but they have never said that.
DLSS 2 was trained for longer and under more complexity than DLSS 1.0. DLSS 3.5 was announced to have been trained on five times more data than 2.0, and now also has Ai tensor core-fueled denoisers, therefore producing the best image quality yet. DLSS has temporal anti aliasing aspects but it is not as simple as "oh it's just TAA" because traditional TAA isn't trained by supercomputers and traditional TAA is usually used at NATIVE resolution. DLSS is inherently upscaling to a higher resolution, all while looking better than TAA at NATIVE res more often that not. DLAA is their newer native resolution AA tech and it is also better than normal TAA.
Don't try to reduce the company's accomplishments just because you don't like their business practices. At the end of the day they are producing state of the art real time graphics technology. How they choose to price it can be discussed while continuing to respect the work they do.
You're basing your whole rant on the tired question of 'what is AI'
They use convnets. That's it. That's all they mean when they say "AI based". Any and all "AI" these days is matrix multiplications deep down, and Nvidia engineers have repeatedly stated that modern DLSS is using convnets that have to be trained.
The big difference between DLSS 1 and DLSS 2 was that 2 has a temporal component
Nice video
Thanks, appreciate it!
Perfectly explained, now that we have fsr 3.0 am looking forward to trying frame generation on my rtx 2060super especially in games like forspoken
I did a video on Forspoken with FSR 3 as well, albeit a short one. You can download the demo for free on Steam to try it if you dont have the game yet.
3:30 Why did your fps increase from 80fps to 130 fps?
That was when I toggled Frame Generation in the settings, hence the big increase in framerate you saw.
If you have already 200 fps whit native resolution and turn on frame generation + reflex + dlss you will get 300+ fps and the latency will be still good in a scenario where you are running a 240/360hz monitor and i test it in the finals (that I think it’s best game to turn it on ) you will gain smoothness and max out the refresh rate
i just wish entry level cards like the 4060's could leverage FG without resorting to, say, 720p internal resolution. the lowest end cards should have been benefitted the most.
So true. I just bought a 4060, video coming soon, but FG is not nearly as helpful on lower-end cards.
Yeah the starting fps has to be high. 60fps or more. Preferably 80-100. So that means you need at least 4070 with dlss upscaling to get around 80-120fps and then frame generation on top of that isn't too terrible
2.04 and at 4.23, the native res result the same latency than DLSS + FG.
tbh I needed high vram for work and got a 16 gig 4060ti and since gaming comes second to making money, it works for me, but I play 1080p 165hz. Pricing is insane but everyone has diff use cases for different cards :)
Yeah, that's true and fair. It's not a bad card at all, just that the pricing sucks. But that's true for pretty much the whole 40-series unfortunately.
to use DLSS 3 I'd need an Nvidia 4000 GPU and there ain't no way I'll be buying one of those anytime soon 🤣
Fair and valid point 😂😂
I would like u to do same video with first two FSR3 games! ur videos are great
Appreciate it, really. Will definitely do videos as soon as FSR3 drops, really excited to see it in action!
Im using frame gen in Starfield right now with an rtx2060 super, and holy input lag/floaty feeling. The "frames" are amazing looks like a buttery smooth 144fps but man the input sure as hell doesnt feel like 144fps. Its an old ass gpu though so it makes sense.
Starfield actually feels very floaty indeed with FSR3 Frame Gen. Tested it on the 3080 earlier this week and I went back to DLSS without FG. Try enabling reflex in the game, and then also Nvidia Low Latency in Nvidia's control panel and see if it helps?
Frame gen is awesome. You probably need a 4090 and a 120hz or higher display to really take full advantage of it. If you can’t make it work correctly, you’re probably lacking common sense or decent hardware. It’s a massive game changer in Jedi Survivor, Plague Tale Requiem, and Witcher 3. What I have found is that it’s best used in conjunction with DLSS and if you have the overhead, DSR. Dead Space Remake, doesn’t have frame gen, but the ultimate way to play that game is with a 4090 using DSR for 7K resolution with DLSS quality. Looks way better than native. With frame Gen, you could push it even harder or just make it smoother.
Yeah, it is great, and works better when CPU bound, but even if not CPU bound, use DLSS upscaling and then frame gen as it can make a huge difference. Recently finished DS remake, and game can benefit greatly from frame gen, even if to try and smooth over some of the stuttering. Wont help for shader compilation or traversal stutters, but stutters caused by your system generally sees a njce reduction when frame gen is used 👍
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews true, Jedi Survivor was virtually unplayable due to such bad stuttering. Frame gen, I think, took enough load off the GPU that it allowed for much smoother frame times and pretty much fixed the stutter.
It's really about what you are able to perceieve, I can absolutley feel the input latancy in Cyberpunk with FrameGen enabled, some may not. Also tuning graphic settings will help reduce ghosting and artifacting. Cyberpunk is a complete blurrfest with DLSS 3 when higher RT setting are enabled especially pathtracing but looks and feels great with DLSS 2 enabled same settings. Frame limiter and Reflex is a must with FrameGen. (Cyberpunk player and OLED+4090 user here)
Yeah, well put. Some people can feel the additional input latency, some cant, depending on the difference of course. Cyberpunk is a bit of a strange one to me, as with higher RT settings it does look blurry, but even without FG on my side. I thought it was my monitor at first so procured a 4k IPS panel to test, and while it does look a lot sharper at 4k, that blurriness is still present when high RT is used. I have since resorted to playing without RT, except for lighting, as it looks great then, and performance is also great.
I dont have an OLED to test with, maybe VA and IPS panels just have a higher amount of blur in Cyberpunk, really not sure at this point.
Either way, as you said, it depends on what you are able to perceive. If you notice the higher input latency then just dont use FG in that title. I use it in almost every title that supports it for a high refresh rate experience at 1440p. The only title I have disabled it is MSFS 2020 as I really dont mind 50-60fps there.
Bro does playing on an OLED screen appears way more better?
@@cashmoney2159 Yeah, an OLED screen does look good. It has near-perfect blacks so the contrast is exceptional. Couple that with HDR and ray tracing in something like Cyberpunk and you are in for a treat.
Just call it DLSS X.X Feature. It’s not “DLSS is: DLSS 2 Super Res, DLSS 3 Frame Generation, and Reflex”. That’s just wrong and as I’ve learned, a common misconception. It’s simply “DLSS X.X is: Super Resolution, Frame Generation, Reflex, and Ray Reconstruction”.
Until 3.5 released there was only 2 and 3, so wasnt wrong to call it as such. DLSS 3 is just a term though. DLSS 3 means a combination of DLSS2, Reflex and Frame Generation. That is not wrong. And DLSS 1 and 2 are Super Resolution, or upscaling. DLSS 3.5 does not always include frame generation either as ray reconstruction works on 20 series as well.
In the end, DLSS naming is confusing and I tried to explain it as best as I could in layman’s terms
Hi,how to get ''Average Pc Latency'' in overlay?
Thanks
Hey, you need to have GeForce Experience, or Nvidia App installed. Then once you open it once, you can press Alt+R in game and it would bring it up. That's my shortcut anyway, which is the default.
I need some help to figure out what is going on with my system...
I recently switched from an Intel system (14900kf) to a AMD one (7800x3d)
Same gpu on both(4080) and for some reason, before I switched i was able to use frame gen in MSFS2020 perfectly fine and smooth. Now since I changed my components (MoBo, CPU and Ram) when I turn Frame Gen on, all I get is horrible screen tearing and also I noticed the PC lag jumps to 200+ms and is impossible to have it on. Any ideas?
Interesting. What monitor do you have? Did you reload Windows?
Yes, I reinstalled all windows. I have a LG ultragear 2k g-sync monitor.
Did you set your refresh rate correctly again? And do you have HAGS enabled? HAGS usually gets disabled when reinstalling Windows, and your refresh rate defaults to 60hz again.
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews refresh rate is at 144hz, hags on.
@@PepuDrummer527 Hmm, that is strange yeah, sorry bud, I have no answer for you at the moment. Have you tried it with G-Syn enabled as well as v-sync in the Nvidia control panel? It will cap your framerate to around 138 fps on a 144hz monitor, but will probably get rid of the tearing you are seeing.
Framegen has been a great piece of tech allowing smooth gameplay in cyberpunk and witcher 3 with every ray tracing option cranked to the max including path tracing for cyberpunk. I'm using a 4090/13900ks so I'm able to reap the benefits of the tech but It's definitely interesting hearing other's experiences with it on varying hardware configs. It's not perfect, buts it damn good I think. Impressive how well it works when it does work
Yeah, agree 100%. I really like it a lot, and hearing others' experiences with it differ so wildly from my own is interesting to say the least. Beast of a system you have there though!
I use an RTX 4050 and play a lot of competitive games, never used frame gen until I downloaded ark survival. I was getting 30 fps with medium settings. I turned AI on and I got 80 frames and I can't even notice the latency, seems instant to me.
Frame Gen in Ark Survival Ascended is absolutely necessary, game runs so poorly without it 😔
Lats say frame generation is like motion blur but way better one which bring a lot of positive things than just making your image on screen more smoother. People who don't like it, just do not use it.
Yeah, I think it’s great. Some people have valid concerns and opinions after using it, and I can respect that. What gets to me is the people who never tried it talking it down.
Amazing tech
how will DLSS and FG on the 4th gen RTX cards work with older CPU's?
DLSS Super Resolution doesnt help when CPU limited unfortunately, but frame gen helps a ton. Also, depends what you'd call an older CPU? But I reckon the 50-series GPUs will be very fast indeed so you'd need a decent CPU to keep up, as even today some games can be CPU limited with a 13900K and 4090 at 4K.
Thanks for the replay. i was thinking about the RTX 4070 with Xeon e-5 1650 v4 CPU with 32gp ddr4 ram for 1440p gaming. As far as I understand its best to maximize the graphics quality to lower the CPU usage right? @@Mostly_Positive_Reviews
Yeah, I think that would be fine at 1440p Ultra or High. You might run into some issues with games that use Ray Tracing that can be intensive on the CPU as well. Spider-Man Remastered is a prime example of this.
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews Thanks for the reply. Do you think downgrading the GPU to rtx 3070 and upgrading the CPU to Ryzen 9 3900x would be better?
@@asap1113 Frame generation will definitely help you a lot when CPU bound, so you'll get a higher framerate out of the 4070 in games that support frame generation. It also has 12GB of VRAM. You can always get the 4070 now and upgrade your platform later, that's what I would do personally.
It's only people who never used it hating on it, even if they're fake frames, they're produced in between 2 real frames allowing the transition between these 2 frames looking smoother = a better experience. I've also found 80 native fps is not as smooth as 80 fps with fg somehow, at least for me and I don't notice any latency at all (even if GeForce Exp saying I got 100ms)
Majority definitely havent used it. Some concerns are valid, I had some very decent explanations in the comments from people with good points, but they are by far the minority.
You not noticing 100ms latency also proves that some people are more sensitive to latency than others. I started testing the 4060 this week and it struggled with FG at respectable settings and the latency was very noticeable. But I also had others test the latency and they couldnt tell a difference.
It really is good if used properly.
It's not the tech we hate its Nvidia rebranded 30 series and selling dlss3 and fg as an upgrade
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews also in games with really bad optimisation, it would just simply double your fps and make the spiky frame time graph smoother
@@abdalazeemal-mashaqba6600 good to know there's still rational haters out there, mostly I'm seeing are those saying FG is BS and etc
@@aperson8693 Yeah, in today's time with games being as poorly optimized as they are, frame generation really helps a lot, agreed!
Hate it or love it.... dlss3 is the future like how dlss 1 was introduced with 20 series and people hated it at the beginning but now it has become mainstream .
Nice video and explanation 👍
Yeah, definitely not going away any time soon. Thanks for watching and leaving a comment, much appreciated!
Except that the reason people hated it was for different reasons. DLSS 3 is hated because its only available on RTX 40-series cards making the RTX 20 and 30 series buyers lose out which is shtty. DLSS 1 was hated because it was sht. The image quality was just bad with heinous ghosting issues.
@@ADunleavyit was like that because on 20 series if you would activate DLLs 3 your image would be blurry and even buggy on 30 series it would look better but slightly. that's why they didn't released DLLs 3 for other generations. DLLs was bad in 20 gen because 20 gen rtx cards had less efficient rtx cores and AI cores so raytracing performance was bad and quality of dlss was bad too and also they had to teach their ai how textures should look in most popular games so their new DLLs 2.0 would look better and perform good they did that ai learning thing on 30 series GPU to create frame gen soo it was time consuming for them to polish their features they wanted to work.
@@piotrolina2670no that's not quite right. DLSS looks the same on rtx20 as rtx 30 or 40. Frame generation relies on optical flow processing which is too weak on the rtx30.
@@Wobbothe3rd yo I didn't know thanks
If I know anything, is that normal people can't tell difference of 50ms latency from aying dota pings
And a smooth gameplay is always a + on my book
Sure, there might be artifacts now, but we were shown that fixing the artifacts was a possibility and is a promising future tech
I also believe it will get better over time. Look at what happened with DLSS 1. Hopefully FSR3 is good as well, will be testing as soon as it comes out.
Rtx 4060 or 4070 is my next GPU upgrade.. VSR for watching movies and it's 2x performance of my current GPU too..
If money allows I would highly recommend the 4070 over the 4060. I habe both and the 4070 is just a much better GPU.
Thanks for the recommendation..
Btw.. 110w vs 200w is a massive difference too..
Because i pay my own electricity bills.. i think I'll go for 4060 then.
Because right now.. my current GPU has 150w of TDP.
I really do care about my bills.. that 50w extra is equal to 12w x 4 lights Bulbs 😂.
Idk but i will reconsider.
@@juneaoalfred3704 Yeah, makes sense in that regard. The 4060 is extremely efficient. But the 4070 with a bit of an undervolt or even just running at a lower power target will be slightly more efficient actually, but I get it.
it's basically the same as v-sync and triple buffering. Only difference is that the framerate shows a higher fps. Which is meaningless if the latency is the same (or worse) as triple buffering. I think the best option is still G-sync/freesync for around 50-60fps and not frame gen. If you have over 80fps you don't need framegen. The increased framerate is doing practically nothing but adding latency. very difficult to see any difference from 80fps to 160fps in terms of smoothness.
me, happy, with a newly bought 4060 wanting to better optimize pc and about to watch this video :)
me 18 minutes later :(
I was a bit harsh on the 4060, I know :( The only reason is that it offers very little over the 3060, but since the video was made, the 4060 has come down in price and the 3060 and 6600 XT / 6700 XT GPUs have become a lot more scarce. So depending on pricing, the 4060 is really not a bad GPU, especially if you cant find alternatives or older gen cards for a good price. It's performance increase when it comes to RT is quite significant over the 3060, you get AV1 and frame generation. If it was $50 cheaper at launch and had 12GB VRAM it wouldve been an awesome card. The only thing that brought it down is at the time of release it cost the same as a 3060, and there wasnt much performance gains except for RT.
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews I actually got it for $250, but paid a US vendor, live in the UK and had a $50 customs charge. But overall I'm not super sad about it. It's giving my cyberpunk 100+ FPS with low RT on 1440p. I barely play FPS heavy games though so I'm not needing an upgrade yet.
The one I got for my channel I am using in my wife's PC now as she records gameplay and the NVENC encoder is very good. It's also pretty fast at 1080p and very decent at 1440p gaming.
In Spiderman you changed the DLSS scaling, but did not actually enable DLSS in the option above.
Go back and see.
It was set to off...
Yes, the first test was just with DLSS super resolution, and not frame generation to show that when you are CPU bound, DLSS Super Resolution does not increase your frame rate. I then enabled Frame Generation (the option above) to show how much it helps when CPU bound.
Shouldn't you combine Nvidia frame gen with Nvidia reflex?
Seems like the techs are built on top and complement each others.
Nvidia reflex gets enabled automatically when frame generation gets enabled, and you cant disable it, so it's always enabled by default 👍
very good video, i played cyberpunk with pathtracing on my 4070ti and the latency was just too much with framegen enabled, the 70 fps was playable no doubt but if you stop looking at things and just wanna have a snappy gameplay experience high latency is just a nogo, so yeah using framegen to increase from 60fps upwards to avoid latency is actually a really good takeaway from this video thanks man
Appreciate the comment!
Yeah, AMD also recommend at least 55 fps before enabling their frame gen technology, and I found anything below 50 to be just too low as the input latency penalty becomes a lot more noticeable. So what I do on the daily is configure the game so that I get about 80 fps and then enable frame gen, and it works great.
Have a good one and happy gaming!
Agree with much of this, but the rebuttal to the argument that DLSS3 is largely a bonus but performance gains are still being realized without it falls down a bit. A 4080 is not the next gen 'counterpart' to the 3080, it's in a completely different product class. $699 vs $1199 - you would only mention the 3080 and 4080 in the same breath because they have '80' in the name, you can't really compare a product that's almost *twice* as costly as the product it's meant to replace. You do recognize the folly of the 4060 series of course, but my point is that Nvidia's naming scheme really doesn't matter - we determine what product 'replaces' another by the new version at least being in roughly the same price category. The 4070 is meant to be the new 3080, and you can see there it's possible to actually get performance regressions without DLSS3. Nvidia's charts for these products focus on frame gen performance for a reason, because it is being relied upon to deliver next-gen gains against its comparable replacements.
What are you doing coming here with good feedback, a fair argument, conveyed in a civil manner? This is TH-cam, there is no place for any of that here!
I agree with some of your points too. This gen is just a mess when it comes to naming and pricing. Nothing is as it seems. But I get where you are coming from, and dont disagree. Appreciate the constructive criticism and feedback 👍
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews Hah, the rarity of this type of exchange is why I comment on youtube threads maybe twice a year. Thanks for the kind words.
@@massivechonk920 Yeah, it is definitely rare. I've had some nice exchanges on here, but almost never with someone who disagrees with certain points. Usually when there's a disagreement it is name calling and being called an idiot etc. Glad to see people can still have different opinions and not have it forced down your throat in a condescending way. Have a good day bud!
The 4080 is dramatically more performant than the 3080. It costs more because it has much higher value. You can dress it up in nice words amd reasonable sounding language, but you're still just whining amd coping. $1200 is a perfectly fair price for the 4080. Btw, most people paid much more than MSRP for the 3080 for most of its existence, from 2021-2022
@@Wobbothe3rd Interesting how the author and me just concluded a nice back and forth about how rare it is to see even-tempered, reasonable disagreement on youtube, then you come in with this to essentially say 'Yeah this is why"
As for people 'paying much more for the 3080', yes that was price gouging due to crypto. It is not a sustainable market for PC gaming, otherwise it would have been priced like that from the outset. Citing some of the most insanely priced years for PC gaming due to an artificial market as support for your argument wrt to 'value' today completely defeats your own point.
If anyone could help me I’m trying to determine which gpu would be best out of an rtx 3060 ti, rx 6700 xt or rtx 4060. I just want good VR and ray tracing performance
Hmm, the 3060 Ti or 4060 will probably be your better bet if you want the better RT performance out of these 3, but it's still not great RT performance unfortunately. Frame generation on the 4060 can help in games that support it, but if you want good RT performance you're probably better off with something more powerful. Overall the 3060 Ti is about 10% faster than the 4060, and about matches it in RT.
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews thank you
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews if you don’t mind me asking what would have the best VR performance
if i had a 165hz monitor ,what would happen if i enabled fg and fps went over 180 and i wanted to lock 5 fps below my monitors refresh rate for smooth experience?
I play on a 165hz monitor so I force v-sync on in Nvidia Control Panel. That locks it to 158 fps when G-sync is enabled and you get a great, smooth experience.
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews really?i thought it costs more than 7 frames to maintain smooth experience,what about input lag tho?is it same as a 10-12ms increase with vsync on while on high refresh rate territory?or is it more?in games like star wars jedi survivor,with rtx 4080 on 1440p RT off you will get around 200 fps with fg on,so that's why i asked that question,i was worried about 1.5x penalty for input lag.
At 158 fps the input lag to me is imperceptible, even when hitting the 200 fps frame cap of Jedi Survivor's engine. You'll get more than 200 with the 4080 when RT is turned off as FG will basically double the cap to 400. Tried it and I could get 400 fps at 720p haha. But 158 fps on a VRR monitor with frame gen on and v-sync feels really good to me.
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews so you have tried that game?
@@elinbarrage9638 I try it every time there is a new update to see if the stutter has gone away, but alas, at around Patch 5 the game started crashing so much for me that I just gave up on it completely.
Please 🙏 bro help i have rtx 3070 but the mod dosnt work on witcher 3 and miles morales what do i do
Hey, unfortunately frame generation doesnt work on RTX 30 series, only 40 series. But AMD's frame generation works on pretty much all GPUs, currently officially supported in Forspoken, Avatar and Immortals of Aveum. They are churning out mods for FSR frame generation for a lot of games now as well.
So frame generator is not good for games like call of duty yes?
Now it's available on Modern Warfare 3
Yeah, it's not good for online shooters, and it's really silly that MW3 now has it. I have a video up on that as well and it's horrible
is it just me or do other ppl get screen tearing when turning on Frame Generation?
Yeah it will if the framerate exceeds the monitor’s refresh rate or it goes beyond the VRR range if on a VRR monitor.
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews I'm on a laptop (legion 5i pro) and my refresh rate is 240Hz
Jeeze this guy's done an 8 ball.
I recommend 0.5 speed ... 😂
Not familiar with the term. Is it good or bad?
so much artifacting with dlss enabled @3:30
In theory it is for taking already decent performance, and pushing it so that you can max out a high refresh monitor.
Yeah, exactly this!
Another great benefit is if you are CPU bound you wont get any performance benefit from enabling upscaling. This provides a higher frame rate even when CPU bound.
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews If the game is running like 30-40fps and FG push it to 60, does feel better or worst?
saying about Doing It Wrong: Nvidia actually could do Frame Generation much better if they used motion vector buffer (already used by dlss 2 for other purpose) they actually could predict future intermediate frame, and I think this was the initial idea of deep learning frame generation, but they failed and now using pretty simple morphing, which are confirmed to be able to run on rtx 20 by FSR3 implementation
and btw,FG is redundant in diablo 4 as it doesnt increase fps by any means.i thought they already fixed it by dropping patches but no..
Yeah, when I initially tested it in Diablo it did nothing, and still not. But you get great energy savings if that is something you are interested it, as the fps stay the same, but half of it is generated, so the GPU works less hard.
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews i like fg in stutterymess games .
frame generation is going to revolutionise console gaming in the next gen
I actually wonder if they'll push it to current consoles via a software update as it really is only a software solution that'll work great on the custom RDNA2 GPUs.
the latency also depends on the game i get about 40-50 fps 35ms latency in a slightly demanding room in portal with rtx with my 4070ti with dlss quality and no frame gen and when i turn on frame gen it goes to about 80 fps 40-60ms latency which is honestly totally playable for a single player puzzle game like portal
Oh yeah, definitely. Some games when measured with an LDAT actually have slightly lower latency as well. I didnt show all games I tested in this video, but the average increase in latency over 7 (or 8) games tested was 10ms. Some were lower and some higher, and it changes from game to game.
Math is simple - 25% worse latancy for 80-100% more frames. Works phenomenally with 50+ base framerate.
And 25% is on the high end, some games see a very minimal increase in input latency. But I realized a lot of people use it on 60hz monitors, or start with a too low framerate and want to achieve a final output of 60 fps, and then it's going to be terrible.
most importantly dlss3 is now open source so you can have dlss3 in games regardless of whether the developer includes support or not. Starfield with dlss3 is going to be amazing.
Yeah, if ever a game is going to need it I suspect it will be Starfield. Will be awesome with DLSS 3, agreed!
thats good news, i was worried about the rumors AMD would stop this tech from being used.
@@jungleboy1 I don't think so, the pc market is important, and developers know that most gamers have an nvidia gpu of course these technologies will end up in amd sponsored games
Where did you hear about DLSS3 being 'open sourced'?
@@massivechonk920it's on nvidia's development kit, for free.
4090 4k dlaa FG pathtracing latency goes crazy...
Yes, because your base frame rate is like 15 fps at that point.
They hate frame gen because they make most of the new game lazily optimized by using this but unpolished on raw Rasterization. And telling gamers that dlss is required to play the game...
Sure, but if this is a reason they should be angry at the devs, not the developer of the tech. If the tech is used how it was designed it is actually very good.
So… You are telling me. You went from 50 fps to 130 at the SAME or even LESS input delay and people are complaining that you got 80 flipping fps for free???
I know, right. The horror 🤣🤣
First time on your channel and I am very impressed. You reviewed the tech in such detail that filled in the blanks for me! It is an impressive technology and I don't get the hate Frame Generation gets, it definitely isn't a gimmick. I do, however, get the hate towards the lower tier Nvidia GPUs pricing and naming because they are atrocious. Hopefully AMD's FSR3 Fluid Motion Frames will be as good(AMD GPU owner here).
Thanks for taking the time to leave a comment, really appreciate it. Yeah, the lower-end GPUs need frame gen to beat their previous-gen counterparts, which leaves a sour taste in the mouth.
I am also really looking forward to FSR3, will be testing it as soon as it launches. I am still trying to figure out exactly when that is haha! There are 3 dates I have dotted down, but I have a 6000 and 7000 series GPU ready for testing whichever launches whenever.
my GTX 650ti crying
If you still use a GTX 650 Ti then that’s really awesome! It’s probably crying tears of joy at being kept alive for so long. But if you plan on playing any recent AAA game then yeah, probably time for it to be put to rest. Still, really awesome to hear you are still using a 650 Ti! Never sell it.
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews Well I'm just a poor person, + I have a difficult situation in the country and in the economy, not everyone can buying computer. I'm from Ukraine
@@antarus6338 Yeah, I can only imagine. Didnt mean to sound elitest at all, sometimes it's all people can afford, and that is also fine. As long as people enjoy what they have and what they are playing all is good! Really hope the situation in Ukraine improves quickly :(
As a fellow south african, can you recommend any battery setups to run my desktop for at least 4 hours during load shedding? (I have a rtx 4070)
Yeah sure. I currently use a 3KW inverter with 2x110ah lithium batteries. The size of the inverter doesnt matter too much, depending on what you want to connect, obviously. But if I use the full 3KW it will last less than an hour. So the 2 batteries provide 2.4KWh, meaning it can power 2.4KW for an hour, or 600W for 4 hours, give or take.
I used to have the same capacity deep-cycle lead acid batteries but they die so quickly because they can only discharge 50% before they get damaged, and take much longer to charge, so they dont charge fully before the next loadshedding starts. The lithium batteries are good for 3000 cycles when discharged to 80%, and take only 3.5 hours to fully charge. Lithium batteries are expensive though :(
Drop me an email if you want me to send you more info, but to give you an idea, I paid R23K for mine, which is quite a lot.
People don't have fg.they hate the fact that it was the only selling factor.if 4060 was better than 3070 then we all would have loved it.
DLSS Frame Generation Greyed Out for me and i cant fix that help pls
Hey, you need to make sure that Hardware Accelerated GPU scheduling is enabled in Windows under advanced graphics options (HAGS).
It does a great job increasing the FPS counter for great marketing material. As for gameplay, frame gen feels meh when playing.
Fair enough! Though I enable it in every game I can, except MW3. Tech like this doesnt belong in a multiplayer competitve shooter.
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews The fact that it requires a pretty high frame rate to begin with without feeling excessively laggy makes its usefulness limited. It is decent for certain situations though.
@@Son37Lumiere It does limit its uses, agreed, and a lot of people arent aware of the fact that it's not meant to turn 30 fps into 60 fps, but rather 90 fps into 140 fps for example. I have a 1440p 165hz monitor and I adjust my visuals so that I get around 90-100 fps base frame rate, and then I enable frame gen to get to 140+. I mostly play single player games, and the added input latency at those frame rates dont bother me in the games I play, but I do get a more visually pleasing presentation in the form of increased motion fluidity.
I get why people dont like it though, it's not perfect. There is some artifacting, additional input latency and you require a high enough frame rate for it to work properly. Generally for me though it works quite well, as does FSR 3 frame generation, mostly. The increased motion fluidity is worth the negatives to me, but I understand that for others it might not be.
@@Mostly_Positive_Reviews I do use AFMF in Cyberpunk on my 7900 XT to achieve 120 fps with RT reflections enabled, which causes a 50% decrease in performance alone on AMD hardware. Being that nearly every surface in CP is reflective it does have a pretty large visual impact, more so than any of the other RT settings save path tracing. In most games though, I've found it to be unnecessary, except to overcome a hard 60 fps limit or to make a game I'm getting less than 100 fps in feel better with my 144 hz monitor. I will say, it generally performs better than I was expecting though.
The whole AI shenanigans in game rendering are amazing. Given how fast AI is evolving, those technologies will improve drastically in a short timespan. People talking about “fake frames” have absolutely no idea what they are talking about 😂
I agree with you. And now that AMD has joined the fray it's even better for everyone.
Frame gen is oerfect for tripple A games with slow gameplay like the last of us or residemt evil 4 for exemple you will never notice the differwnce but in fast past games you can notixe some ghosting if you look for but if you focus on the game u will not notice it
Agree fully, it's great tech!
Is it working with gsync?
yes
Yeah, it does 👍
I don't know what I am doing wrong but I seem to be getting screen tearing, although I have G sync turned on with my GPU and monitor, anyone else getting this issue?
What is your monitor's refresh rate?
@Mostly_Positive_Reviews it's a TV, 120hz with frame generation on I get between 60 and 100 fps and vrr can run between 20 and 120hz.
That doesnt sound right, unless the VRR is not working as it should. I have seen that on my LG 60hz monitor where VRR doesnt work, even though it is enabled, but it should be fine on the TV. Do you enable VRR via Windows? Or gsync compatible via Nvidia Control panel?
@Mostly_Positive_Reviews it's enabled in the Nvidia control panel. How do I enable it in windows?
@@StussyFlo If it's enabled in the Nvidia control panel then it should work fine. The Windows version is just for games that dont support it natively, but you can see if it makes a difference.
Go to Display Settings from desktop, click Advanced Display, click on Graphics, click on Change default graphics settings at the top, and then enable Variable refresh rate from there.
Let me know if it helps or not.