Just a small correction, I thought Witch released before chomper, this isn't actually a thing. What happened was that I got confused of the release date between ghost and witch, but even ghost came at the same time BWB did, so I just made a stupid mistake for no reason. My bad. chomper still got outclassed pretty quickly after because of toad but, i really have no excuse to be so wrong either way
I See a Problem in your opinion. Because you Just Look at adventure with Level 1 Zombies but Adventure is Not the Main Game Mode of PvZ2, because you are done with it pretty quick and Arena and Penny's Pursuit are the Game modes that get Updates etc.. And the plants are buffed for Arena and Penny's Pursuit Standards and Not for Adventure Standards.
I just wanna say one thing about the ending, this isn’t hate or criticism, just a my theory of why they make plants more complicated and not just better stat wise: So people notice it. A lot of people probably don’t look at the patch notes and stats, so why would they use those bad premium’s they have if nothing’s changed (other than stats). these new flashier changes give a player a reason to go back, because they can easily tell how a plant has changed other than reading through the almanac to see if it got more damage or something. These changes are made so people can notice them more easily, and sure, veterans may be able to see the stat changes, PvZ2 also has quite the large casual player base. To put it bluntly, making changes noticeable makes sure a lot more people notice them, even if it’s the worse at way to buff a plant balance wise.
I unironically thought that electric currant's garlic ability was only activated when it was fully eaten, I never knew it was meant to happen when it was only bit. Imagine making an ability so bugged, the bugged version is thought to be the norm.
I had no idea that it even did that since I pretty much restricted its usage to the frostbite levels where there are the tiles that move zombies away from the ends, with laser bean and/or pepperpult heating and/or protecting them given how high-maintenance garlic is. I only recently found out that electric current even did damage to zombies that are trying to eat it from a practiaclly cheating hard mode wild west level that forces you to have electric current, hypnoshroom, wallnut, and spikeweed (with the zomboss still using rockets and ram attacks along with chicken zombies, bulls, and eventually even gargantuars...)
I personally like the idea of torchwood acting like a wall. He is made of wood after all, and that can’t possibly be easy to chew on. Also, he’s a little bit expensive, and having the bonus of igniting peas that pass through him make it so players have to put him in front anyways. (Unlike Pea Nut which can’t make up its mind)
I feel like the proper way to make Jack O Lantern more approachable would have been to have tapping toggle firing, that way he stays manual while being more easily used.
I feel like he would have been better if he was still tap to activate ( same way as before) but would atack by itself when zombies are 1 tile away from him , that or make him fully reload his fire once he refuels , his fuel mechanic doesnt really work with his auto mode
I actually like how they buffed Torchwood. The buffs expands its utility beyond peashooter comps since it now has more utility beyond buffing peashooters. I really agree tho that it should buff more projectiles instead of turning it into a jalapeno-explodeonut-endurian hybrid, but the HP increase is genuinely nice for a frontliner plant that really hurts the team when it is eaten, and the jalapeno-on-death is pretty cool as a policy in case the Torchwood does die
I'm really glad Chomper got at least some form of a face-lift, especially how near he is to mascot status (and also because I have a certain soft spot for monster plants). It doesn't stop him from being outclassed by a whole group of other plants, and I kind of prefer it that way, but I can't put why exactly into words.
I'm going to attempt to define it for you: Chomper becoming OP would push it away from your nostalgia lense. As long as he stays weak, you can see the PVZ1 Chomper legacy within PVZ2, a familiar sight.
I always use chomper he is better then most plants I use at times he is situationally good. Also if I am in a pinch and save my power up he clears a whole roll and still can chomp the next plant he is pretty strong used right.
The part where the Electric Currant is unable to even work as a functioning garlic is somehow the most hilarious moment to me. It just screams lack of play testing to me.
what screams lack of play testing to me is the recent hard mode levels. wild west zomboss gave you hypnoshroom, spikeweed, electric current, and wallnut while zomboss uses missiles, ramming, chicken zombies, bulls, and gargantuars... normal far future hard mode spawns holo head zombies where you could only have maybe 3 plants to defend other than a forced backline sapfling repeatedly... now in hard mode primal, the very first level you have primal peashooter, chilibean, and stallia when they are throwing bullies at you (the zombie literally designed to counter primal peashooter's knockback, though maybe it is less of an issue if you have higher leveled plants than what I have rn).
I really liked E Currant, then after the buff he was pretty good, but THEN they nerfed him to the ground so the redirection barely works and he can't reliably kill chickens, so Wild West Day 35 is even worse now
yeah, i dont understand why they dont just make the attack interval individual to each zombie, instead of making it some sort of vertical cactus shot, it makes hitting fast zombies completely luck based.
I see, I didn’t particularly notice the buffs with plants but it does aggravate me that most already overpowered plants are getting the buffs, while lesser plants such as garlic, get a let down nerf so much that it becomes barely useful.
You'll still want an actual wall for most waves. Some of them you can get away with not, but it's an extremely risky policy to live by. I think of Torchwood more as a fallback wall.
@@PhailRaptormy personal way of using it is a "fuck you" plant. Pretty much, if I don't like a zombie, or something stupid happened, or I just have a lot of sun to waste, I'll shove it down and watch the world burn. Highly recommended.
The aloe rework was really HUGE in the Chinese version, now the plant heals all plants around itself and the plant ITSELF, but instead of being a healing burst is a constant healing for a couple of seconds, and if that wasn't enough aloe also buffs the attack speed of all the affected plants which makes him a incredibly Support
I like the Torchwood buff that it has a lot more HP. It makes sense, given that it's a plant that goes in the front of your defenses, and that it's an entire plant made of wood, so it should be a little bit more resilient. The death animation is stupid though lol
I remember when Sweet Potato used to cost 300 sun and when Sap Fling cost 150 sun then they both got a buff with a sun decrease. I really wish that they would've released Icy Currant; it and Tactical Cuke's seed packet textures have just been sitting in the code forever. My favorite Plant being Jack O' Lantern I now use him in combo with Pyre Vine. Jack O' Lantern for damage and Pyre Vine to support him while he's recharging Great Video 🙂👍
Chomper’s biggest issue is obviously Toadstool. Toadstool does everything better than Chomper, he has better range, produces sun after gobbling a zombie. And, in my opinion, Toadstool is adorable. He’s a frog which is also a chonky mushroom, I love it so much and I don’t know why.
Snap pea is better he's free you get him through the arean.toad stool is only that likedable for the sun production and his plant food effect is pretty lame
Correction: His name is actually Icy Currant, he only ever had a seed packet Icon, so he didn't make it far in development (still more than Nightcap lmao) Also the Chomper and Snow Pea buffs where done as part of a Big Brainz event (which also buffed Snapdragon to give it heating)
@@blastfurnace8644 Kinda but not really, other than the fact that Snapdragon is already overly versatile; it doesn't really have an actual active fire source to justify it giving off heat, it's like if Hot Date heats up other plants, it doesn't feel right.
I’ve been playing since the original release of PVZ2 (since the old map, before most premium plants, old map order AE,PS,WW,FF) and when torch wood got buffed I was super confused lol. I was just watching zack Scott games and saw the torchwood explode, then I went onto the game and saw the new feature haha. Many of these buffs happened during my game hiatus so it was super cool to see all these plants redone (I mean aside from snow pea because I never used him 😂)
I think one of the reasons that they don't buff stats directly could be something to do with levelling up plants, as that can increase a given plant's power by a lot (peashooter, for example, gets its damage stat doubled from base after 2 level-ups, which are a total of 13 level packets). Whether or not this *should* be the case, or actually is, is still up for interpretation.
Peanut did, kind of, get a buff with reinforced mint. But, well, we don't really talk about those due to how much they break the game's balancing to the core. Reinforced especially, since it's pretty reasonable to have at least 2 lines of Peanuts at the final wave, who just destroy it entirely after being minted. Still wonder what they were thinking...
I used to use that too, it was very fun and boring at the same time. You essentially get unkillable peashooters after reinforcement, and annihilation for a short time
I like how they grave torchwood more HP. I always felt like it died too easily in PVZ 1 as it's a log, it should be more durable than other plants. I think the death explosion is a bit OP though, maybe if it's range was toned down to just anything touching it in a similar vain to Lava Guavas
Garlic should just redirect zombies in a 3x3 area around it. Completely ignore the biting to redirect which can save it from a lot of counters such as explorers and their torches.
I think I know what happened with electric currant about the redirection thing: they just copypasted the code from garlic without the brief stun , meaning there is the delay but the plant takes full damage the whole time
In my opinion, Jacko should be a enable esc plant. Like, tap Jacko to activate it, tap it again to make it stop. Also heres a Garlic Buff idea Its basically the most tanky plant. Because it cannot get insta killed. But not actually the tankiest plant. Garlic can survive 2-5 insta kills. The zombie dishing out said insta kill moves lanes. And can also move 10 zombies before going down
snow pea: increase sun cost to 200 and freeze zombies constantly torchwood: decrease sun cost to 150 and remove lane wide damage after death while having the ability to have plant food for all torchwood when one of them receives it electric current: everytime it deals damage it stuns and knocks back zombies to other lanes when they touch it
If you guys wanna know about the plants that were changed in the Chinese version, I'd suggest going to Flag Zombie’s YT channel. Or you could just go to the PvZ wiki, that’s fine too :)
if i were to buff chomper, it would be having his bite splash and will consume all zombies in 1 tile, this allows chomper to keep up with being overwhelmed but still has the one shot mechanic that can only chomp once before eating and i think it makes sense as chomper has a pretty big mouth to bite multiple zombies close to each other, and since chomper burps after eating anything it should have a weaker pushback effect like the one on his plantfood, either a fixed effect of push or pushback that is affected by how much zombies he consumed with the splash bites.
I think that most plants don't get stat buffs because they are catering towards people who will pay for plants and seed packets. Eventually the plants will just be good after upgrades
Man who buys seed packet plants? They are free, so it sounds like you were trying to find an argument to insult pvz2 for, you just have to wait till they appear, and it’s really not necessary to buy the real money plants because seed plants are better anyways
Along with bringing back splash for Torchwood (which until this vid I didn’t even know TW had). If I recall correctly, in PvZ2 both Torchwood and Snapdragon had the ability to emanate heat much like Pepper Pult, in Frostbite Caves. However I don’t think they can do this now.
Jack O' Lantern is my favorite plant both design and gameplay wise, so I was curious to see what was said about it. My opinion didn't really change though. (I'm also kinda a new player).
Technically theres been a few times they have, but I'm not sure if it was intentional, for instance, Reed got an increase in his chain damage from 5 to 10 at some point, which I'm somewhat sure was a mistake. And chomper but thats already covered.
I like torchwood. It’s definitely doing two things, but using it as a wall is super fun. It has so many unique properties that make it really fun. It’s incredibly spammable but very expensive, meaning you need a good income to support it. It’s death effect mitigates the weakness to crowds. And the damage it does to eating zombies is cool.
This has explained a lot for me. I recently redownloaded the game after a few years of playing and i remember using jack o lantern by clicking on it. I thought I was insane until you said they changed that.
torchwood, i don’t know how his buff is lame, the melee fire damage and extra hp makes sense as torchwood is made of wood hard enough to survive fire and the fire itself is one of the biggest flames plants ever had, the lanewide damage is probably as a last effort to get rid of zombies that killed torchwood to protect the pea shooters behind it, and being durable as a frontline plant already pointed out. having torchwood ignite more projectiles than peas will also work, however thats a pretty big step for torchwood and may need time to be tought of before being added, having the flaming peas deal splash damage is also a good option but may be pretty powerful for pvz 2 playstyle as how torchwood with peas can single handedly dominate arenas and penny pursuit even without the splash. so what are we going to do with torchwood and his 3 possible big buffs? one having torchwood increased stand alone abilities with the increased hp and extra fire damage, two with the extra synergies with torchwood, and three with better performance of his synergy with peas.
Jack o' is a really attentive plant, it's demanding to ask the player to manage at least 5 of them. My suggestion for a rework would be to increase sun cost, but let him attack adjacent lanes. You would only need to a couple to defend your lawn. The added sun cost would also discourage players from using too many. Might need to tweak the damage output and charge rate, but I feel like this would make Jack o' significantly more manageable.
This! The manual gimmick was interesting on paper but in practice it made it a bit hard to juggle with everything else you have to do and pay attention to..let alone trying to jungle an entire row of 'em
The only thing I liked about Jack O Lantern's changes was the new animations when it runs out of fire and when it lights up again, because it just used to stay there like normal before
Today I learned: - Torchwood can damage and explode - Jack o' Lantern is no longer manual (????) - Chomper is... different? - Electric Currant can divert zombies literally since when. I mean, most of my playing of this game was during its glory days (before leveling, penny's pursuit, arena, etc) but most of these things were a huge surprise to me. I remember thinking how cool Jack o' Lantern was when it came out since it was manual. Even now that I'm getting back into this game due to Reflourished, I still had no idea that these things were a thing.
Chomper isn’t, different, he just eats 2 zombies before charging (And also decreased his charge time by half) and well, jack o lantern I also thought it was really cool, the only problem was that when u had different pumpkins on lane, it was quite overwhelming and couldn’t tap them all at the same time, making it one of the least used plants, also I think they added those leveling things and penny’s pursuit, arena, etc, to make the game Atleast not just “Yay I beated the game now bye forever” but idk
While listening the part about Jack o' Lantern, I was thinking that wouldn't it be cool if Bowling Bulb is manual? Where you could wait for the bigger bulbs to regrow to fire them whenever you want
The Jack'O Lantern "buff" is disgusting, it was one of my favorite plants, and I used to wait until it had the most zombies possible in it's AoE before using it, now it just wastes all of it's fuel on the first random zombie that appears in it's range limit, without even giving a chance to more than one square of zombies get inside it's AoE, before you could more than double it's fuel efficiency just by waiting to use it It wasn't even a buff, it's a direct nerf The leveling on Jack'O is also screwed up, it doesn't give a better recharge nor fire rate, Jack'O just gets damage and more range, the extra range would've been amazing if it was still manual, but in this state it just makes it easier for the plant to waste even more fuel by attacking weak zombies, cause if you put it in the 4th column after leveling it, it'll just attack any zombie that steps in the lawn
I hate manual plants I hate manual plants I hate manual plants I hate manual plants I hate manual plants I hate manual plants I hate manual plants I hate manual plants I hate manual plants I hate manual plants
@@MaelCott1 that's what I mean.too much work. Had to wait till it gets charged before tapping on them to activate. When you have like 20 of them it does takes too much effort
In pvz 1 Chomper is MUCH better in my opinion, though that might be mostly since its a premium in the sequel, so I am only basing this off what you said.
"Oh hey, I've seen this one it's a classic. It's where Creeps talks about why he doesn't like PopCap's recent buffs to plants." "What do you mean, it's brand new?" "Oh, I-uh. Saw it on a reupload." "What's a reupload?" "You'll find out."
The problem with giving Torchwood slash is that with the leveling system. you could easily solo basically any level with it and a simple peashooter. Then when we get into the realm of combining it with Pea Vine, appease Mint, and threepeater/Mega Gatling strats... Then there would be no reason to run anything else in game modes like Battlez and Penny's Persuit. Splash damage would completely negate the threat of zombies like Excavator zombies and Jester Zombies in some situations. I say take that Splash damage idea and apply it to Fire Peashooter instead.
The issue with modern Jacko is the fact that the animation isn’t changed to reflect the mechanic change, so it doesn’t feel right because it still looks like a tap to use plant
I personally really like electric currant like it's a very unique plant, but it's so difficult to use well, and it has so many counters that there's little use in it
And that's why in my fangame PvZ Danmaku, many plants take some, but not all, of the buffs from PvZ2 (ex. Snow Pea has AoE chill, but not the 1% chance to freeze zombies for 10 seconds) There are also cases like Torchwood, which no longer has the effects of Endurian and Hot Date, but instead has more HP, but also a longer cooldown (equivalent to a Wall-nut in both regards), and can set any projectile on fire (not just peas).
Although Peanut is extrememly underwhelming on its own, it does have one benefit that other offensive plants don't, and that's that it benefits from Reinforce-mint's ability to trigger the plantfood of all plants in the same family. When a large horde is coming, slap down the min and watch the screen be filled with peas
The fact that Peanut is the only hybrid wall/attacker plant that they've added that actively gets weaker as it's damaged is crazy to me. Like, at least they learned their lesson, but damn, rip peanut fr.
Electric Currant is one of my favorite plants ever. In my opinion, it is actually basically flawless, maybe it deals a little bit too little damage. I really think that just buffing Garlic’s health and giving it the ability to “pop” when hit by a Gargantuar to be able to redirect a small area after being broken.
I had no idea Snow Pea got the 5% freeze chance. Thought that was just a leveled up thing. Busted! I like that reflourished kept its splash freeze since its now... unironically good for chill?? even better than winter if ur looking for just the chill effect. Chomper eating multiple zombies before chewing is kinda stupid imo and im glad mods removed that, replacing it with faster chewing which makes it so smooth and fun to play with. Torchwood ended up getting so many weird changes but I think they fit him. Glad reflourished gave fire splash too. Jacko will always be fun no matter if it auto attacks or not, so Im indifferent on it. Electric Currant was just weird, and a little funny. Overall just a lot of weird but fun buffs!
And also, reflourished kneecapped wintermelon by giving it less slow and it cost 650 with a compensation of higher dps. Snow pea still reigh supreme imo
Also Chomper in most PvZ1 Mods: Chewing time decreased or completely nonexistent, attacks zombies in a 3x3 radius while dealing heavy damage, burps and diverts zombies to adjacent lanes
oh god i remember when jack o was first released and everybody complained about the fact they didn't know jack o was a manual plant LMAO, i think that's why they changed it to an automatic plant i agree that they should change it back to manual though, citron already suffers from being an auto fire plant with a recharge time so jack o couldve just been a better, improved version of citron
A garlic rework would be cool I imagine he would become and insta use plant, well not really, you place him down and he has a stink aura around him, if any zombie goes near it it will redirect, he lasts for 30 seconds.
PvZ2 is a shining example of balance, just look at how they deftly balanced things like Tomb Tangler, Garlic and Primal Potato Mine! Simply the work of people who care a lot.
I would argue one thing to the contrary of you on the topic of electric current. Turning it into a garlic, even if they failed, is a good idea, for the simple reason that if a plant absolutely requires another plant to function, that’s not improving strategic depth. Thanks just forcing you to handcuff the 2 plants together and effectively need 2 slots to use one plant, meaning you won’t use that plant unless it’s really good. Synergies between plants are great, but only if those synergies offer options as opposed to a set in stone usage procedure that must be followed. So this buff really is about allowing electric current to do its job independently.
For Jack-o-lantern, it would’ve been interesting if it would fire if zombies were one tile away from it and would retain the ability to manually activate it for niché situations. It would make both sides of the spectrum happy
Maybe in few years we will get Snowood, which will have same stats as Torchwood, but it changes peas into Snow-Pea like, but dealing 2x more damage, also completly freezing every zombie on lane. I love changing fire plants into better snow plants which just outclass fire ones. /j
Torchwood being a heated plant that likes being by the front lines is novel for the Ice Age, and adds to it's role as a support plant, but is obviously way too situational. And now it's outright unnecessary seeing as Snapdragon can passively fill that role as well. For free.
17:06 honestly it sounds very simple. They probably coded the knockback to occur if electric current was on the field when a zombie got the lane switch condition from eating a plant, instead of if a zombie specifically ate an electric current. So when eating garlic the games code tested for an electric current on the field ignoring the fact that the zombie was eating garlic.
Well, how is an rng potato mine ever worth it, what move a plant, as if you would ever do that at the cost of an entire seed slot, just use the shovel if you need to do that.
![[UNCUT] The Loyal Pin ปิ่นภักดิ์ EP.4 (4/4)](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/d3l5rxl5CVo/mqdefault.jpg)
Just a small correction, I thought Witch released before chomper, this isn't actually a thing. What happened was that I got confused of the release date between ghost and witch, but even ghost came at the same time BWB did, so I just made a stupid mistake for no reason. My bad.
chomper still got outclassed pretty quickly after because of toad but, i really have no excuse to be so wrong either way
I See a Problem in your opinion. Because you Just Look at adventure with Level 1 Zombies but Adventure is Not the Main Game Mode of PvZ2, because you are done with it pretty quick and Arena and Penny's Pursuit are the Game modes that get Updates etc.. And the plants are buffed for Arena and Penny's Pursuit Standards and Not for Adventure Standards.
Man, how do you get so many coins in eclise? I want to play it again but i dont have the time to farm money again since i got a work.
I just wanna say one thing about the ending, this isn’t hate or criticism, just a my theory of why they make plants more complicated and not just better stat wise: So people notice it. A lot of people probably don’t look at the patch notes and stats, so why would they use those bad premium’s they have if nothing’s changed (other than stats). these new flashier changes give a player a reason to go back, because they can easily tell how a plant has changed other than reading through the almanac to see if it got more damage or something. These changes are made so people can notice them more easily, and sure, veterans may be able to see the stat changes, PvZ2 also has quite the large casual player base. To put it bluntly, making changes noticeable makes sure a lot more people notice them, even if it’s the worse at way to buff a plant balance wise.
Cry harder
@@henryhacker5076 actually adventure is the main game mode the others are your endgame.
I unironically thought that electric currant's garlic ability was only activated when it was fully eaten, I never knew it was meant to happen when it was only bit. Imagine making an ability so bugged, the bugged version is thought to be the norm.
Me too
I had no idea that it even did that since I pretty much restricted its usage to the frostbite levels where there are the tiles that move zombies away from the ends, with laser bean and/or pepperpult heating and/or protecting them given how high-maintenance garlic is. I only recently found out that electric current even did damage to zombies that are trying to eat it from a practiaclly cheating hard mode wild west level that forces you to have electric current, hypnoshroom, wallnut, and spikeweed (with the zomboss still using rockets and ram attacks along with chicken zombies, bulls, and eventually even gargantuars...)
May Torchwood and his cousin Torchwood live in our hearts
?
Heartburn
I personally like the idea of torchwood acting like a wall. He is made of wood after all, and that can’t possibly be easy to chew on. Also, he’s a little bit expensive, and having the bonus of igniting peas that pass through him make it so players have to put him in front anyways. (Unlike Pea Nut which can’t make up its mind)
I feel like this is a reference to one of the torchwoods almanac entries but I didn't read them so idk
Torchwood buff is okay but it's cost was unfair
Too cheap
I feel like the proper way to make Jack O Lantern more approachable would have been to have tapping toggle firing, that way he stays manual while being more easily used.
He used to function like that
Similar to his original function but not exactly how he worked, was tap to fire a burst and hold to keep firing.
What they did to Jack'O was the equivalent of making coconut canon automatic
Cry harder
I feel like he would have been better if he was still tap to activate ( same way as before) but would atack by itself when zombies are 1 tile away from him , that or make him fully reload his fire once he refuels , his fuel mechanic doesnt really work with his auto mode
I actually like how they buffed Torchwood. The buffs expands its utility beyond peashooter comps since it now has more utility beyond buffing peashooters. I really agree tho that it should buff more projectiles instead of turning it into a jalapeno-explodeonut-endurian hybrid, but the HP increase is genuinely nice for a frontliner plant that really hurts the team when it is eaten, and the jalapeno-on-death is pretty cool as a policy in case the Torchwood does die
The only thing is, it's way too cheap for a such versatile plant
@@ariztheackee505 Yeah.. i Love that overpowered plant..
I litterally get a Breeze beating the Game with that and Pea Vine.. they're both so OP..
@@thebernardoespinacovers6081 Ouch pea vine
@@ariztheackee505 torch wood isnt even that consistently strong, theres much more busted shit in the game
@@harryvpn1462 Yeah.. you're right.
He's strong, but he Still needs teammates to survive and Pea Vine can technically help him do just that.
I'm really glad Chomper got at least some form of a face-lift, especially how near he is to mascot status (and also because I have a certain soft spot for monster plants).
It doesn't stop him from being outclassed by a whole group of other plants, and I kind of prefer it that way, but I can't put why exactly into words.
I'm going to attempt to define it for you: Chomper becoming OP would push it away from your nostalgia lense. As long as he stays weak, you can see the PVZ1 Chomper legacy within PVZ2, a familiar sight.
I honestly like characters like chomper. Ones who don’t give shit abt anything
@@SwellowOffical Yeah sure definitely not because you have a certain fetish
I always use chomper he is better then most plants I use at times he is situationally good. Also if I am in a pinch and save my power up he clears a whole roll and still can chomp the next plant he is pretty strong used right.
@@alzhanvoid Is THAT why Chomper is so situational in the shooter series, they kept their mediocrity from PvZ 1? Wow
The part where the Electric Currant is unable to even work as a functioning garlic is somehow the most hilarious moment to me. It just screams lack of play testing to me.
what screams lack of play testing to me is the recent hard mode levels. wild west zomboss gave you hypnoshroom, spikeweed, electric current, and wallnut while zomboss uses missiles, ramming, chicken zombies, bulls, and gargantuars...
normal far future hard mode spawns holo head zombies where you could only have maybe 3 plants to defend other than a forced backline sapfling repeatedly...
now in hard mode primal, the very first level you have primal peashooter, chilibean, and stallia when they are throwing bullies at you (the zombie literally designed to counter primal peashooter's knockback, though maybe it is less of an issue if you have higher leveled plants than what I have rn).
You have no idea the joy it brings me to know that people are discussing pvz metas in 2022.
Me too bro,never even knew PvZ had a large online community until recently
Ikr
@@STG2022 so true like I just realized that by the amount of videos and views that pvz2 content gets here in youtube
I've never knew that even new pvz 2 videos get THAT many views. I thought it was a dead game
I really liked E Currant, then after the buff he was pretty good, but THEN they nerfed him to the ground so the redirection barely works and he can't reliably kill chickens, so Wild West Day 35 is even worse now
yeah, i dont understand why they dont just make the attack interval individual to each zombie, instead of making it some sort of vertical cactus shot, it makes hitting fast zombies completely luck based.
Hello there
I see, I didn’t particularly notice the buffs with plants but it does aggravate me that most already overpowered plants are getting the buffs, while lesser plants such as garlic, get a let down nerf so much that it becomes barely useful.
Cry harder
@@blackout4328 alright so you're just a spammer. That makes more sense.
@@CowKirbo cry harder
@@blackout4328 you got ratiod hard bud
@@blackout4328 thisis sctually really interesting, answer the same 2 lines to a bunch of comments, and watch the different reactions.
I like the torch wood buff. Now you don’t need a wall at all as the torch can be basically a makeshift wall needing less plants
You'll still want an actual wall for most waves. Some of them you can get away with not, but it's an extremely risky policy to live by. I think of Torchwood more as a fallback wall.
@@PhailRaptormy personal way of using it is a "fuck you" plant.
Pretty much, if I don't like a zombie, or something stupid happened, or I just have a lot of sun to waste, I'll shove it down and watch the world burn. Highly recommended.
I generally used it to kill zombies when I had troubles, because sun meta is broken.
The aloe rework was really HUGE in the Chinese version, now the plant heals all plants around itself and the plant ITSELF, but instead of being a healing burst is a constant healing for a couple of seconds, and if that wasn't enough aloe also buffs the attack speed of all the affected plants which makes him a incredibly Support
That was Chinese version
That was the Chinese version so uhh wrong game
Bro wrong game HAHAHAHHAHAH 😭😭😭
LMAO have you guys didn't pay attention to the video?
Damn, aloe in pvz2 Chinese sounds extremely good
I like the Torchwood buff that it has a lot more HP. It makes sense, given that it's a plant that goes in the front of your defenses, and that it's an entire plant made of wood, so it should be a little bit more resilient.
The death animation is stupid though lol
What's wrong with the death animation?
@@shadycactus7896 It's stupid? Exactly what he said in the video. It has nothing to do with what torchwood is supposed to do
@@Gibstack I thought you meant the actual animation looks weird
Can we just take a minute to witness and appreciate this 200 IQ play. 7:38
In PVZ2, plants are either really op, or trash.
Cry harder
@@blackout4328 nobody is wtf are you on
@@blackout4328 cool we dont care if you're using that term because its "cool" or a p2w in pvz2
@@Zackwashacked sounds like a you problem
@@blackout4328 dude did you get mid air burrowed 50 feet in the sky? Or did a chomper ruin your vanquish streak?
I remember when Sweet Potato used to cost 300 sun and when Sap Fling cost 150 sun then they both got a buff with a sun decrease.
I really wish that they would've released Icy Currant; it and Tactical Cuke's seed packet textures have just been sitting in the code forever.
My favorite Plant being Jack O' Lantern I now use him in combo with Pyre Vine. Jack O' Lantern for damage and Pyre Vine to support him while he's recharging
Great Video 🙂👍
Chomper’s biggest issue is obviously Toadstool. Toadstool does everything better than Chomper, he has better range, produces sun after gobbling a zombie. And, in my opinion, Toadstool is adorable. He’s a frog which is also a chonky mushroom, I love it so much and I don’t know why.
Snap pea is better he's free you get him through the arean.toad stool is only that likedable for the sun production and his plant food effect is pretty lame
Uh chomper isn't a chunky mushroom
It's the pirarana plants purple cousin
@@VISCA_BARCA10911he was talking about toadstool not chomper
Correction: His name is actually Icy Currant, he only ever had a seed packet Icon, so he didn't make it far in development (still more than Nightcap lmao)
Also the Chomper and Snow Pea buffs where done as part of a Big Brainz event (which also buffed Snapdragon to give it heating)
Last bit makes sense. Guy breathes fire. Of course he can heat things.
@@blastfurnace8644 true, but Snap is already busted enough they really didn't need to buff him more
It's just one place
@@blastfurnace8644 Kinda but not really, other than the fact that Snapdragon is already overly versatile; it doesn't really have an actual active fire source to justify it giving off heat, it's like if Hot Date heats up other plants, it doesn't feel right.
Wannna know something about nightcap?
The real ones remember when Fire Peashooter’s plant food only reached a few tiles in front of her and did the same amount of damage as an insta kill
I’ve been playing since the original release of PVZ2 (since the old map, before most premium plants, old map order AE,PS,WW,FF) and when torch wood got buffed I was super confused lol. I was just watching zack Scott games and saw the torchwood explode, then I went onto the game and saw the new feature haha. Many of these buffs happened during my game hiatus so it was super cool to see all these plants redone (I mean aside from snow pea because I never used him 😂)
I think one of the reasons that they don't buff stats directly could be something to do with levelling up plants, as that can increase a given plant's power by a lot (peashooter, for example, gets its damage stat doubled from base after 2 level-ups, which are a total of 13 level packets). Whether or not this *should* be the case, or actually is, is still up for interpretation.
Peanut did, kind of, get a buff with reinforced mint. But, well, we don't really talk about those due to how much they break the game's balancing to the core.
Reinforced especially, since it's pretty reasonable to have at least 2 lines of Peanuts at the final wave, who just destroy it entirely after being minted. Still wonder what they were thinking...
I used to use that too, it was very fun and boring at the same time. You essentially get unkillable peashooters after reinforcement, and annihilation for a short time
'chomper is the third mascot, after peashooter and sunflower'
Sad wall-nut noises
I like how they grave torchwood more HP. I always felt like it died too easily in PVZ 1 as it's a log, it should be more durable than other plants. I think the death explosion is a bit OP though, maybe if it's range was toned down to just anything touching it in a similar vain to Lava Guavas
Or just remove the ability entirely, would be way easier to balance
Garlic should just redirect zombies in a 3x3 area around it. Completely ignore the biting to redirect which can save it from a lot of counters such as explorers and their torches.
i think you mean inf front and behind since 3x3 means it can redirect things behind it
redirect things to be behind it*
I think I know what happened with electric currant about the redirection thing:
they just copypasted the code from garlic without the brief stun , meaning there is the delay but the plant takes full damage the whole time
When you copy something but forget the last line by accident:
Personaly ,the only buff Torchwood needed was the health and the contact damage.
The death effect seems random.
In my opinion, Jacko should be a enable esc plant. Like, tap Jacko to activate it, tap it again to make it stop. Also heres a Garlic Buff idea
Its basically the most tanky plant. Because it cannot get insta killed. But not actually the tankiest plant. Garlic can survive 2-5 insta kills. The zombie dishing out said insta kill moves lanes. And can also move 10 zombies before going down
My take on garlic, is that it could last a certain amount of time, however it affects the tile in front of it for everything.
@@_HoneyKnight actually sounds pretty good
5:41 what about wall nut? They always seem to aprear as a treo of "damage, money producer and tank".
SHHHHHHHH
I guess because he's not in the shooter games ('Johnny' is an ability for the Cactus, but the game classes that as a Tall-nut)
snow pea: increase sun cost to 200 and freeze zombies constantly
torchwood: decrease sun cost to 150 and remove lane wide damage after death while having the ability to have plant food for all torchwood when one of them receives it
electric current: everytime it deals damage it stuns and knocks back zombies to other lanes when they touch it
I absolutely adore these types of videos. Keep up the good work man!
If you guys wanna know about the plants that were changed in the Chinese version, I'd suggest going to Flag Zombie’s YT channel.
Or you could just go to the PvZ wiki, that’s fine too :)
The only good buff they did was making Snapdragon not being able to be frozen
if i were to buff chomper, it would be having his bite splash and will consume all zombies in 1 tile, this allows chomper to keep up with being overwhelmed but still has the one shot mechanic that can only chomp once before eating and i think it makes sense as chomper has a pretty big mouth to bite multiple zombies close to each other, and since chomper burps after eating anything it should have a weaker pushback effect like the one on his plantfood, either a fixed effect of push or pushback that is affected by how much zombies he consumed with the splash bites.
Idk, i feel like it only needed to prioritized the strongest zombie. One bite, but eat the strongest one. Thats good enough imo
I just went to watch this and saw it was private, so perfect timing.
t9u really changed my vision on pvz 2 and i really enjoy using plants ive never used like magnifying grass, so thank you
Chomper was the main strat in Eclise when the Secret Level that had Octo Spam where you had 2 chompers and 2 attacking plants
I think that most plants don't get stat buffs because they are catering towards people who will pay for plants and seed packets. Eventually the plants will just be good after upgrades
Man who buys seed packet plants? They are free, so it sounds like you were trying to find an argument to insult pvz2 for, you just have to wait till they appear, and it’s really not necessary to buy the real money plants because seed plants are better anyways
Along with bringing back splash for Torchwood (which until this vid I didn’t even know TW had). If I recall correctly, in PvZ2 both Torchwood and Snapdragon had the ability to emanate heat much like Pepper Pult, in Frostbite Caves. However I don’t think they can do this now.
3:13 I use Escape Root for 1 lone purpose: moving endangered plants to the back row
Another fact about Jack ‘O, he glitches out and automatically attacks lily pads, lily pads activate his attack making him useless in bwb
The first plant that kills a plant
Jack O' Lantern is my favorite plant both design and gameplay wise, so I was curious to see what was said about it. My opinion didn't really change though. (I'm also kinda a new player).
Wait they've never directly buffed stats? Huh... now that's shocking
Technically theres been a few times they have, but I'm not sure if it was intentional, for instance, Reed got an increase in his chain damage from 5 to 10 at some point, which I'm somewhat sure was a mistake. And chomper but thats already covered.
Another awesome video, I like this format a ton.
Icy currant is still in the spritesheet for seed packets along with tactical cuke
At first, I thought this would be about hidden mechanics being introduced as they gain levels, like grave-eater becoming a potato mine as well.
I like torchwood. It’s definitely doing two things, but using it as a wall is super fun. It has so many unique properties that make it really fun. It’s incredibly spammable but very expensive, meaning you need a good income to support it. It’s death effect mitigates the weakness to crowds. And the damage it does to eating zombies is cool.
I think Torchwoods should ignite catapults in front of it. That way it could be sandwiched between lobbers and straight shooters.
This has explained a lot for me. I recently redownloaded the game after a few years of playing and i remember using jack o lantern by clicking on it. I thought I was insane until you said they changed that.
Finally i was taking a dump when this dropped but my phone died💀
torchwood, i don’t know how his buff is lame, the melee fire damage and extra hp makes sense as torchwood is made of wood hard enough to survive fire and the fire itself is one of the biggest flames plants ever had, the lanewide damage is probably as a last effort to get rid of zombies that killed torchwood to protect the pea shooters behind it, and being durable as a frontline plant already pointed out. having torchwood ignite more projectiles than peas will also work, however thats a pretty big step for torchwood and may need time to be tought of before being added, having the flaming peas deal splash damage is also a good option but may be pretty powerful for pvz 2 playstyle as how torchwood with peas can single handedly dominate arenas and penny pursuit even without the splash.
so what are we going to do with torchwood and his 3 possible big buffs? one having torchwood increased stand alone abilities with the increased hp and extra fire damage, two with the extra synergies with torchwood, and three with better performance of his synergy with peas.
1:00 i didnt know that plant exists... No joke...
Can’t blame ya.
Finally jack o lantern is not torchwood anymore.
Jack o' is a really attentive plant, it's demanding to ask the player to manage at least 5 of them. My suggestion for a rework would be to increase sun cost, but let him attack adjacent lanes. You would only need to a couple to defend your lawn. The added sun cost would also discourage players from using too many. Might need to tweak the damage output and charge rate, but I feel like this would make Jack o' significantly more manageable.
This! The manual gimmick was interesting on paper but in practice it made it a bit hard to juggle with everything else you have to do and pay attention to..let alone trying to jungle an entire row of 'em
The only thing I liked about Jack O Lantern's changes was the new animations when it runs out of fire and when it lights up again, because it just used to stay there like normal before
5:45 "Being the 3rd Mascot after Peashooter and Sunflower"
Wallnut: Am I a joke to you?
I love how Garlic literally got Electro Currant's ability through transduction because Popcap refuses to make it do its job.
Today I learned:
- Torchwood can damage and explode
- Jack o' Lantern is no longer manual (????)
- Chomper is... different?
- Electric Currant can divert zombies
literally since when. I mean, most of my playing of this game was during its glory days (before leveling, penny's pursuit, arena, etc) but most of these things were a huge surprise to me. I remember thinking how cool Jack o' Lantern was when it came out since it was manual. Even now that I'm getting back into this game due to Reflourished, I still had no idea that these things were a thing.
Chomper isn’t, different, he just eats 2 zombies before charging (And also decreased his charge time by half) and well, jack o lantern I also thought it was really cool, the only problem was that when u had different pumpkins on lane, it was quite overwhelming and couldn’t tap them all at the same time, making it one of the least used plants, also I think they added those leveling things and penny’s pursuit, arena, etc, to make the game Atleast not just “Yay I beated the game now bye forever” but idk
This video is even better the second time
While listening the part about Jack o' Lantern, I was thinking that wouldn't it be cool if Bowling Bulb is manual? Where you could wait for the bigger bulbs to regrow to fire them whenever you want
The Jack'O Lantern "buff" is disgusting, it was one of my favorite plants, and I used to wait until it had the most zombies possible in it's AoE before using it, now it just wastes all of it's fuel on the first random zombie that appears in it's range limit, without even giving a chance to more than one square of zombies get inside it's AoE, before you could more than double it's fuel efficiency just by waiting to use it
It wasn't even a buff, it's a direct nerf
The leveling on Jack'O is also screwed up, it doesn't give a better recharge nor fire rate, Jack'O just gets damage and more range, the extra range would've been amazing if it was still manual, but in this state it just makes it easier for the plant to waste even more fuel by attacking weak zombies, cause if you put it in the 4th column after leveling it, it'll just attack any zombie that steps in the lawn
I hate manual plants
I hate manual plants
I hate manual plants
I hate manual plants
I hate manual plants
I hate manual plants
I hate manual plants
I hate manual plants
I hate manual plants
I hate manual plants
Ummm wrong it did get buff. The manual tapping plants take too much time to work.
@@lightninggear0131 what do you mean by "too much time to work"?
@@MaelCott1 that's what I mean.too much work. Had to wait till it gets charged before tapping on them to activate. When you have like 20 of them it does takes too much effort
In pvz 1 Chomper is MUCH better in my opinion, though that might be mostly since its a premium in the sequel, so I am only basing this off what you said.
I watch your videos because you somehow can make me sleep during the day
torchwood has a great buff, it makes him more useful instead of just flaming peas
Jack-o-lantern snow pea and electric currant supremacy
17:41 My guess is buffing stats conflicts with the plant leveling system.
I may only interact with PvZ via TH-cam videos, but I had never seen or known of Electric Currant until this video.
"Oh hey, I've seen this one it's a classic. It's where Creeps talks about why he doesn't like PopCap's recent buffs to plants."
"What do you mean, it's brand new?"
"Oh, I-uh. Saw it on a reupload."
"What's a reupload?"
"You'll find out."
10:48 i just wanna mention, that was incredibly sad to watch
The problem with giving Torchwood slash is that with the leveling system. you could easily solo basically any level with it and a simple peashooter. Then when we get into the realm of combining it with Pea Vine, appease Mint, and threepeater/Mega Gatling strats... Then there would be no reason to run anything else in game modes like Battlez and Penny's Persuit. Splash damage would completely negate the threat of zombies like Excavator zombies and Jester Zombies in some situations. I say take that Splash damage idea and apply it to Fire Peashooter instead.
The issue with modern Jacko is the fact that the animation isn’t changed to reflect the mechanic change, so it doesn’t feel right because it still looks like a tap to use plant
I personally really like electric currant like it's a very unique plant, but it's so difficult to use well, and it has so many counters that there's little use in it
17:10. Maybe they use the same direct and that’s why Electric currant takes so long. It doesn’t STUN and redirects it waits and redirects
And that's why in my fangame PvZ Danmaku, many plants take some, but not all, of the buffs from PvZ2 (ex. Snow Pea has AoE chill, but not the 1% chance to freeze zombies for 10 seconds)
There are also cases like Torchwood, which no longer has the effects of Endurian and Hot Date, but instead has more HP, but also a longer cooldown (equivalent to a Wall-nut in both regards), and can set any projectile on fire (not just peas).
Although Peanut is extrememly underwhelming on its own, it does have one benefit that other offensive plants don't, and that's that it benefits from Reinforce-mint's ability to trigger the plantfood of all plants in the same family. When a large horde is coming, slap down the min and watch the screen be filled with peas
This confirms that creep was arrested for stalking once
The fact that Peanut is the only hybrid wall/attacker plant that they've added that actively gets weaker as it's damaged is crazy to me. Like, at least they learned their lesson, but damn, rip peanut fr.
Creeps Thinking chomper is the third major mascot of pvz
Wallnut: Am I joke to you?
Electric Currant is one of my favorite plants ever. In my opinion, it is actually basically flawless, maybe it deals a little bit too little damage. I really think that just buffing Garlic’s health and giving it the ability to “pop” when hit by a Gargantuar to be able to redirect a small area after being broken.
The urge to murder when he just ignores the sun
peanut plus enforce mint do be kinda gamer though
I had no idea Snow Pea got the 5% freeze chance. Thought that was just a leveled up thing. Busted! I like that reflourished kept its splash freeze since its now... unironically good for chill?? even better than winter if ur looking for just the chill effect.
Chomper eating multiple zombies before chewing is kinda stupid imo and im glad mods removed that, replacing it with faster chewing which makes it so smooth and fun to play with.
Torchwood ended up getting so many weird changes but I think they fit him. Glad reflourished gave fire splash too.
Jacko will always be fun no matter if it auto attacks or not, so Im indifferent on it.
Electric Currant was just weird, and a little funny. Overall just a lot of weird but fun buffs!
And also, reflourished kneecapped wintermelon by giving it less slow and it cost 650 with a compensation of higher dps.
Snow pea still reigh supreme imo
“Chomper is also historically bad in the tower defense games”
Chomper in Pvzh:
Also Chomper in most PvZ1 Mods: Chewing time decreased or completely nonexistent, attacks zombies in a 3x3 radius while dealing heavy damage, burps and diverts zombies to adjacent lanes
oh god i remember when jack o was first released and everybody complained about the fact they didn't know jack o was a manual plant LMAO, i think that's why they changed it to an automatic plant
i agree that they should change it back to manual though, citron already suffers from being an auto fire plant with a recharge time so jack o couldve just been a better, improved version of citron
A garlic rework would be cool I imagine he would become and insta use plant, well not really, you place him down and he has a stink aura around him, if any zombie goes near it it will redirect, he lasts for 30 seconds.
PvZ2 is a shining example of balance, just look at how they deftly balanced things like Tomb Tangler, Garlic and Primal Potato Mine! Simply the work of people who care a lot.
Yep, once again he's not failed to ro give us the creeps.
3 LV5 Snow Peas in a row can just defend the lane perfectly fine against the majority of threats. Except for Excavator and Jester.
I would argue one thing to the contrary of you on the topic of electric current. Turning it into a garlic, even if they failed, is a good idea, for the simple reason that if a plant absolutely requires another plant to function, that’s not improving strategic depth. Thanks just forcing you to handcuff the 2 plants together and effectively need 2 slots to use one plant, meaning you won’t use that plant unless it’s really good. Synergies between plants are great, but only if those synergies offer options as opposed to a set in stone usage procedure that must be followed. So this buff really is about allowing electric current to do its job independently.
I’d be curious about your take on laser bean compared to its clones
I've started playing pvz 2 again recently and I didnt even know they changed some of these plants
For Jack-o-lantern, it would’ve been interesting if it would fire if zombies were one tile away from it and would retain the ability to manually activate it for niché situations. It would make both sides of the spectrum happy
Lol the main theme I noticed is they all were premium
Maybe in few years we will get Snowood, which will have same stats as Torchwood, but it changes peas into Snow-Pea like, but dealing 2x more damage, also completly freezing every zombie on lane. I love changing fire plants into better snow plants which just outclass fire ones. /j
Torchwood being a heated plant that likes being by the front lines is novel for the Ice Age, and adds to it's role as a support plant, but is obviously way too situational.
And now it's outright unnecessary seeing as Snapdragon can passively fill that role as well. For free.
17:06 honestly it sounds very simple. They probably coded the knockback to occur if electric current was on the field when a zombie got the lane switch condition from eating a plant, instead of if a zombie specifically ate an electric current. So when eating garlic the games code tested for an electric current on the field ignoring the fact that the zombie was eating garlic.
I swear i tought i imaginated Electric current up/ was a mandela effect
That moment when he said Escape Root wasn’t powerful made me extremely angry
Well, how is an rng potato mine ever worth it, what move a plant, as if you would ever do that at the cost of an entire seed slot, just use the shovel if you need to do that.
Fun fact the electric current was removed once and then came back
Personally I like Reflourished Torchwood: when multiple are planted on the same lane one after the other, the peas' damage is increased.