When I look up reviews for these cars, YT only ever brings up videos from 5 years ago when they were new! Hardly anybody, filming long range tests on older EV's!
Fantastic that, about time there was a proper comparison test on second hand electric cars, showing real everyday driving tests, and what a good job you guys did. Looking forward to seeing your £20000 comparison test.
I took a Hyundai Ioniq on a 460km drive from Rangiora to Pohara in Golden Bay, a 6 hour drive. There is 3 charging stations along the route, Culverden, Murchison, and Motueka with a 2 hour 20 minute leg between Culverden and Murchison that passes through the Lewis Pass at just over 900m elevation. Despite it being summer it was cold as we went over the Lewis and we needed the demister on for periods. Having used ABRP app we knew that we would need to reduce our speed to reach Murchison, which we did, and despise the cold we arrived with 16km range remaining. The return journey saw us arrive in Culverden with 32km range remaining, mostly due to it being a more pleasant temperature. These trips can be done, but planning is required.
I took my Ioniq on a 1500km trip this week, 750km one way on Monday and back home on Wednesday. Learning the consumption of your car is important, but once you know what to expect, it becomes a breeze to plan long distance trips. And the Ioniq is an efficiency king in the end, so despite the small battery, it can go for a long way. On the return trip, I didn't even respect the ABRP plan but just winged it. Benefit of the German autobahn and knowing there's plenty of charger and they are well advertised on the signage.
@@Hans-gb4mv I can only dream of having that frequency of chargers, we are well catered for around the main centres but they become more scarce as to get on the open roads. There was a plan about four years ago to have a charger every 40km along all state highways but I think covid has gotten in the way, and the money has been spent elsewhere.
@@spikebmth as stated in the video, you need to drive them on the same route at the same time to see. I suspect the Niro and Kona would be 20% less efficient than the Ioniq - similar to the Renault and Nissan. Remember that actually means it costs you 20% more to go the same distance. The VW/Seat/Skoda is good in town, but this was a long trip. Would have been interesting to see how it compares. The next test should be measured against the Ioniq. See if anyone beats it. 🤔
I guess there is a challenge for Richard... a straight efficiently test.... However apart from the Tesla SR, the others are generally let down by their charging speed.
A point not always mentioned about the Zoe is that the charge rate above 80% doesn't drop until you get much closer to 100% as opposed to many cars that really slow down past 80%. Also quite a lot of ZE50 Zoe I have seen for sale have dc charging - most of them ?.
@@FFVoyager For around £20k you can get: MG ZS, MG5, VW e-Golf, Kia Soul and Mercedes B-Class among the usual Ioniq, Leaf, Zoe and other small city cars
Interestingly we did drive London to Edinburgh in our 2017 Leaf 30, 412miles in early 2020 (before COVID hit) took us 11hrs with 4 stops, we coped with it fine, though you do have to watch the battery temp. We’ve still have the car and I’d happily do it again. Surprised the one in this video got so hot after one rapid charge, in those circumstances I wouldn’t advise during it 400miles.
@@ouethojlkjn 30-40mins I’d say, charging to 95% and doing 85ish miles between stops. We started in Shepperton, stopped at Watford Gap, Rotherham (Instavolt), Scotch Corner and Alnwick, then on to our hotel near Holyrood, which as we planned had destination charging. Then did same in reverse on way back. We were careful but at no point were we close to running out of juice or cooking the air cooled battery.
I had a Nissan LEAF 2017 once, most comfy (soft seats)... After two years, range was not good enough (eg, around 100 miles) so I upgraded to Kia Niro EV with its longer range... less range anxiety, but the seats too firm on my back.. I miss LEAF seats....
@@jonjoyce3188 Wow so that's more like 48mph when driving! Even so if you know your itinerary and in no rush then why not have a nice relaxing lower speed drive with some pit stops....Make the trip part of the holiday rather than an ordeal to be gotten through.
Back in 2016 I took a 24kWh Nissan LEAF from Sussex to Edinburgh, which was 461 miles. Nine recharge stops! They were only about 20 minutes each as I stopped at 80% to help prevent the battery heat getting into the red and didn't go below 20%. There was a lot of drafting behind lorries, too! Left home at 05:30 and arrived in Edinburgh at 18:40. So just over 13 hours. Much the same on the way back a few days later. My current car could probably do it with a single midway charge, on a good day. More realistically it would be a couple of stops, which is at least as many as I'd need as a human being!
👏🏼 bravo in a 24. I recall Robert Llewelyn made the trip. When I did my edinburgh to London non-stop I think I was the first ever to do that and it’s phenomenal how easy it is now. As you say a quick one or two stops is what most cars can do and that’s what the body needs anyway!
@@RSEV Yes, I was very much inspired by the likes of yourselves and Robert. Of course the best bit was that the full 900+ miles cost me about £2 in 'fuel' as the Electric Highway was still totally free back then, just my initial home charge cost anything. Never had a problem charging either - it was solid, at least with CHAdeMO, back then.
Honestly, Richard, you and your team are to be commended for creating this 'affordable EV' series of back-to-back tests...! 👏 I, for one, found them absolutely fascinating - this long-range video in particular, as the Edinburgh trip data comparison was mind-blowing...! I (now wrongly, so it seems...! 😞) had discounted the 28kWh Ioniq way back when I eventually got my first EV - a 30kWh Leaf - as I presumed that a bigger battery equated to longer range... a fairly understandable assumption to a non-EV driver at the time, I guess...? Don't get me wrong - I love watching all your 'antics' in Teslas, Audis and Porsches but, for your average Joe (no offense, Joe... 🤣) who can't afford £50k on a car, this series has been absolutely what the UK car buying has needed to persuade them that a used EV is still a perfectly viable purchasing option, even for a single-car family. Brilliant work, chaps - I think you are trail-blazing in the EV community 😎 Oh, just had a thought re your suggestion on the next series... I've tried to research this online, but doing it in 'real-world' would no doubt be WAY more enlightening. My research was along the lines of trying to answer the question: "What usable battery capacity, combined with what charging speed makes for the 'perfect' every-day, every-use EV?" I came down to probably the 58kWh iD.3 - roughly 200 miles (3 hours' drive) any-weather, any-journey on a 75% battery capacity used, but able to then recharge to 80-85% in a 30 minute, stretch-your-legs / grab-a-coffee comfort break...? What do you reckon...? 🤔
Great video. Does show that people need to know how their own car charges, even newer cars all have different characteristics! The Zoe40, was a great car to own until needing to charge on a long trip, due to its AC only charging. Again, the leaf at a disadvantage due to its smaller battery. The extra charging time, over ICE isn't actually that much TBF. To the ICE drivers, see how long you spend in the services, from parking to leaving, if using the loo, having a snack & coffee (of course not driving while eating/drinking). #HyundaiForTheWin Nice to see the Taycan back!
The major difference is when you have to stop more frequently, like you do in the Leaf. After 3 stops one every hour and 10 min or so it gets annoying. First hand experience with my 30kWh Leaf
Actually, the LEAF and Ioniq have a similar size battery, the bigger issue for the LEAF is that CHAdeMO is slowly disappearing and that most of those old LEAFs have batteries that aren't that good anymore.
I've owned an Ioniq for three years and it's been a great car, the fast charging speed (for the time) and efficiency really make the most of the small battery. It's also been a practical family car although the boot is a little small.
Only just found this video a couple of months after buying my Ioniq and it definitely makes me feel great about my decision! I was basically looking at the cheapest EVs and worked my way through. Unsurprisingly starting with the cheapest is largely Leaf and Zoe with Ioniq and a few others like E-Up coming in a bit later. I ruled out the Leaf because of the battery size and I ruled out the Zoe because I'm very tall and we're a family of 5 so need to get us all in fairly comfortably. Pleased to say the Ioniq ticked basically every box so we bought a 2021 for £11k with 19,000 miles. Really, really pleased so far. Lovely to drive, very efficient, lots of kit that I haven't figured out yet. We don't do many long trips at all so I've only charged at home and don't see that changing for a long time. Go for it.
Another really good video, Rich. Good to see a channel demonstrating real everyday use cases rather than just a 70mph test and a walk around. For a lot of people getting into EVs on a budget, these are the kind of cars they’ll be looking for and not necessarily EV6s or a Tesla. I think you’ve done well considering I know how time consuming the testing is. Keep up the great work! P.S. would love to see a video on the maintenance of used EVs. Ie costs, anything to look out for?
One clear winner . Did you see the temperature of the leaf battery. Thanks for doing these videos and the grath at the end was great visual representation of how long the journey takes
IMO the zoe is the best overall,depending on your needs. newest,lowest mileage,longest range its just the ac 22kw. i love mine there is only me and my partner so no kids and stuff they need. i paid £11k battery lease 10 months ago for a 68 plate ze40 with 18k on the clock.they have shot up to stupid money now .if i sold i would prbably make £3-4k but my next car would go up the smane so meh.
If it has a leased battery, it would be a no-go for me. That would make it a big expense every month and wipe out the gain you made by charging your car. Imho, the Ioniq is the best overall. It's more efficient (and therefore cheaper to run), provides more space and is faster to charge.
A great series on used EVs. I hope your getting enough interest in these videos to justify a 20K series. Lots of interest in EVs now but many will be looking at used and need help.
I’ve done 2 trips down to the Alps using Channel Tunnel & Ouistreham ferry to Portsmouth. 550 miles with 3-4 charges, about 1h30 total charging time. That’s in an etron which doesn’t have massive range but does charge fast. It’s amazing how quick the Hyundai is over a long trip with multiple charging stops. It’s so efficient that the decent charging rate adds a lot of miles in a few minutes. Not far off my etron that costs 4 times as much!
Ioniq very impressive and appeared to be ahead of its time, how will the Ioniq 5 fare in 5 years time vs. the new competition? Will the new cars be 500 miles plus range and we’ll all be wondering how we coped with a 250 miles range; stick a reminder in the diary for another test 5 years time.
Absolutely brilliant. Yes the 28 ioniq actually charged faster than my Tesla ever did. The magic speed on the motorway for the leaf is 58/59 mph. Go over that and range just drops. Add wind n rain and it’s almost like a countdown timer lol. But I do love my leaf. Appx 130 miles range being careful. As mentioned before if you’re selling the ioniq I could well be very interested. Great vlogs. Loved this side by side comparison. Brilliant.
Subscribing because of this series. Everyone tests the new ones and forgets these. And most people who would like to get an EV can't afford a 40000€ car.
Love this format, you can really see what would be the real life experience for a future EV driver, picking one of these models! Thank you for sharing! 🔌⚡🚘
I have the Kona EV 64kWh and the efficiency is great, these are a few years old now and should start to hit the second hand market (from company car users) very soon. Pretty much the same bits and bobs from the Ioniq in a different styled package. Definitely worth a look if the 3 in the test don't flip your switch - I would love to see the same tests with the Ioniq 5, Audio Q4 E-Tron and VW ID-4.
I have the Nissan Leaf 30kw/hr. It's a brilliant daily runabout if you charge at home. A solid hundred miles but it's really not a long-distance vehicle. It works for us because we knew its pros & cons.
A fascinating comparison. I still have a sneaking admiration for the small battery Hyundai Ioniq. Genuinely does what it says on the the tin. I mean battery. I keep telling my wife that driving slower on the motorway but then avoiding an extra stop can still work out to be quicker. If you intend to stop anyway then fill yer boots. My father-in-law blasts along at a steady 73 just so we get to where we are going so fast we end up having to hang around for the place to open.
420 miles - a couple of months ago I did 430 mile round trip on a cold, windy and a bit wet February day in my Ioniq - I stopped more often but for less time each stop. My total charging time was under 90 minutes so I think your calculation of 2 stops of 30 minutes might just be possible in better weather - but you probably won't charge to 100% after the first stop - so you will only have 80% or so and might need a short plug and dash before the end.
Very good series. Three good options for city driving and occasional mid range trip. The options narrow down quickly for us in state side. Since we purchased a Model X, we are hyper aware of the usage. Mostly because of the brilliant app giving us all the data at our fingertips. Just doing school runs and sports, we average 1,200 miles per month. As soon as occasional unplanned longer trip we have to make, it will definitely bring range anxiety with these options. That’s why I believe Tesla has a such a big lead in US market where distances are generally further.
Under certain conditions, the Renault works really well. The Leaf is what it is - a local environs traveller. Did you mention you were impressed by the Hyundai Ioniq? I was. Best all-rounder.
We use the co-cars service in Exeter, they have the CCS version of the Zoe and have happily done 350 mile round trips in that with a single rapid charging stop of about 30 mins. Used their ID3 most recently for a 600 mile round trip with 3 rapid charges (hotel charger wasn’t working). All for about £45 a day. We use it instead of having a second car, saving us about £4k per year
Really enjoyed this real world series and would love another. I have a Corsa e on order and I'm very excited to be going EV but it wouldn't feel so impressive if I just saw your Tesla/Taycan vids so these will make it feel even better haha
*WIND RESISTANCE:* It's important to note that road speed and drag (so called wind resistance) doesn't scale proportionately - its exponential. So the difference in energy consumption driving at 80mph is significantly greater than driving at 60mph. A good example is the fact that the Bugatti Veyron needed double the McLaren F1's power just to go that 30mph faster. Drag starts to have a noticeable affect around 50-60mph in still air. Obviously any reference to drag here makes no reference to wind speed and direction and would also need to be taken into account on top of this.
You’re right. In simple terms, at 70 mph cruise speed, you are looking at roughly two thirds of the total power demand, with most of the rest being rolling resistance - but taking into account the headwind/tailwind air speed as well. Some cars are better than others, and usually the drag coefficient figures (Cd values) are available if one looks them up. The interesting thing about this trial was that they were all done on the same day, so as to minimise the weather differences that can easily obscure any comparisons otherwise.
I have leaf 30 with 111,000 miles on it , battery does about 70 miles on fast roads between charges. I mostly charge on 7kw as tend to be doing other things . Interesting to see how much more usable the ionic and Zoe are. Thanks for posting
Leaf: town car; Zoe - medium trips fine with the longer range but don’t buy if you do regular long trips due to the AC charge speed limiting you; Ioniq - jack of all trades really flexible
09:45 - Main benefit for faster car charging is to avoid Car Park time penalty Fines, and Home Charging time sensitive off-peak rates. I had 3 Phase Charging at home installed for fast charging within 4 hours at 5p rate
Really interesting comparison and as always find the data informative, it would be great to have seen what the effect of a car full of people in their efficiency!
Really enjoyed this series. I have a 4 year old 28kWh Ioniq and love it. A note on Lane Keep Assist - it disengages with no audible warning (icon changes colour) which, considering all the other bongs and beeps, is annoying. The adaptive cruise control is very good. I have the SE which also has: Blind spot assist 2 Memory driver's seat. Ventilated front seats Rear cross traffic alert Front parking sensors. I paid about £17000 a year ago. The efficiency is astonishing.
The Lane Keep Assist is just that, an assist. You are still supposed to be actively steering and controlling the car. Therefore it should not matter if it disengages without warning.
@@Hans-gb4mv I agree the driver must be in control of the car. I am simply saying that it would be better to more clearly know that any sort of assist is no longer operating.
Well I’ve never been sure about the usefulness of the earlier style Leafs due to claimed range and this proves it. I like the Hyundai but wasn’t sure about its millage but it seems better than I expected plus, like you say, decent charge speed. I’m quite impressed. As for the zoe, I’ve just never been a fan as I’ve never been a fan of French cars to be honest……(after years of doing my own and friends mechanics on ICE cars)
What is good about the Ioniq is it genuinely can do the quoted range. Unlike many other competitors. It charges quick because the battery is fairly small, but the car itself is extremely efficient. It is just very pricey all the same for what you get (new). A Hyundai Kona may be a better bet.
4:58 that's only half accurate. The Zoe does have a low regen power when you lift off the accelerator. However, the brake pedal is not (always) coupled with the brakes, and at the beginning of its course, that actually increases the regen which can then go up to 43 kW. And the classic brakes are only applied if you go further. I think this is very user friendly for people which are new to EVs
Always informative and entertaining, many thanks to you and your team…. I’m going through the process of learning about the charging and so this has been useful, Australia seems to have less infastructure
The price of rapid charges still shocks me compared to charging over night at home (forgot the high rate, but think it was still under 20p). 7.5p per KWH vs 65p to 79p per kWh. When I get my electric car on friday, definety sticking to home unless I have to.
The new Nissan Ariya will also do 22kW Level 2 charging. It's an option for the entry level trim but standard on all others. It's one of the best features I think, since it will give you a full battery within 4 hours even with a 87kWh pack, so perfect for city trips, visits, business trips etc.. Arrive, plug it in, do your thing and leave with 90-100%. Less rapid charging can only be a good thing for all parties and components invovled.
Thanks for another great video. You can get a rapid charging Zoe ze40 with 43 kW charging think it was a q90 I remember we nearly got one but the order was messed up and they ordered the slow version so we rejected it , it was a pitty the 38 kWh Ioniq was slow charging compared with the 28 as the extra 10 kWh battery would be quite useful looked at a 38 kWh but didn’t like the local dealership so Then got the ze50 2 years later was great car for the money but only problem was 50 kW charging limit would have been nice to have say 100 kW max but was nice flat charging curve so was good upto quite high Soc , don’t forget the leaf rapidgates so might be longer than u guessed as it looks like it was cooking after than one charging session! But this rapid charging would cut the Zoe’s charging time down .
Would be an interesting comparison is between the 28kWh and 38kWh Ioniq as to which is faster on a long run as to at what point the longer range gets negated by time lost at a longer charge stop.
Leaf (up to 2016) is a definite "no" for long journeys. Anything above 50mph will see the range shortened. I bought a Leaf 120miles away from home and it was a nightmare to drive back. Was driving 50mph but still had to charge twice, the first time had to do it for 40mins and then 15 mins. I have encountered a problem with a fast charging station which decided to throw errors rather than charging, this nearly got me stranded if it wasn't for luck to find another fast charger hidden on a hotel car park, this was the day I experienced first hand what range anxiety feels like. Until EV charging infrastructure gets better I'm not going to get an EV as my main vehicle.
Same with the Ioniq. True story - a mate of mine is an engineer, ex-Lotus been with Tesla since the Roadster. Took him out in the Ioniq recently and he was really impressed with it. He said the way they are managing regen is really impressive as it's very hard to get the regen/brake balance as good as they have.
I think car speed is calculated on wheel travel distance - so one you will get bigger or smaller wheels your speed be different, but still calculated on the default wheel size. I'm still surprised this isn't somehow calculated based on GPS, if possible and if not then go with the good old wheel size.
I would really love to see how the facelift Ioniq compares to the old one in real life conditions. I’ve holding out for the new Megane to come out but if it takes too long I’ll have to buy something used and I’ve been struggling to decide between the original Ioniq or the facelift.
+ for an idea that cars should be tested and compared at one day, so the weather and traffic do not affect the range cars can show. Came to the same conclusion. Later, when You test other cars - you can add one of those which tested before - so there is an "Zero point" in comparison.
Thanks for this series. Have really enjoyed it. Interested in that Ionic. How do you know if you're getting the early or late model? What do I look out for in listings?
Great video as always… I was going to ask if that was the old Ioniq, but you answered my question at the end of the video. Agree that despite smaller battery, better than newer one. Great car despite its age. Good equipment! What was the efficiency/consumption? I can’t remember you saying it for the Ioniq.., surely better than the others.., 4.5mi/kWh maybe? Do all “old” 28kwh Ioniqs come with CCS or is that an option? And how many miles had it done? Wondering about degradation… Also, where do you find Ioniqs for £15k? All in Autotrader at £19k+….
Great mini series, having just bought a 28kw Ioniq coming from a Leaf 40kwh the Ioniq is very impressive. Same range Has another legacy auto maker made a car as efficient or with as flat a rapid charging curve? I couldn't find one and I didn't have enough pennies for a Tesla model 3. I'd like to put out there that the Ioniq 28 is the Benchmark for Legacy auto and everything produced by them should be judged against it, Tesla are way too far ahead. Incidentally what was the Ioniq efficiency over the trip back?
As new Gridserve chargers have 100kw Chademo would that help the Leaf?! Also did you just happen to have a CCS car against Chademo against Type 2. Up to date Zoe has CCS now?!
Leaf can only take up to 50kw so yes can use more powerful but it won’t ever chargers higher than 50kw. Yes good to have the mix of different connectors. CCS is now the standard. Current Zoe 50 has CCS rapid as an OPTION! (Not standard)
@@RSEV I understood that Renault changed that late last year, and CCS is now standard on all new Z0Es? Looking at their order page it appears at the moment the only option available to purchase brand new is the GT Line R135 with CCS included as standard.
Great review. I feel a more fair review would be to do a comparison with the base m3 as they are closer in msrp. And maybe wait till the full fat i4m drops to compare with the full fat m3 comp X ? 70k v 100k … they def aren’t in the same category. This review was Like comparing a Porsche 911 turbo s with a base Taycan. The EV’s are at a disadvantage from the off!!
The speed convoy comparison is really interesting. The Ioniq is efficient, no doubt, but if it’s doing 65 at indicated 70, it will appear more efficient than it actually is. My experience with Zoe is it’s really inefficient at 70, found 63 indicated to be the sweet-spot of distance vs charging need, but at least Zoe is doing nearly 70 when it says it is!
Sorry - totally unimpressed as I don't spend my time doing nothing waiting for a car to fill. Did 870 miles in my BMW 5 series before a fill. But - and this is the kicker - more and more evidence that EV's are worse - yes worse for CO2 than an ICE and the car industry knows this as not telling the true cost to the planet. Please only buy one of these if 1) you get a load off your tax which you can spend on your jet holidays - but don't drive past the food banks - it must hurt you. 2) you have a weak bladder 3) you need the munchies and coffee on a regular basis.
Apreciando a una mujer tan hermosa. 2:3 sentadillas son unos Kimmy-jka.Monster muchas y un buen ejercicio. 5:25 Se deja ver que hay muy buenos resultados 😍👍 Saludos desde la Cd.. de world loss mortales abian apreciado tan hermosa mujer
When I look up reviews for these cars, YT only ever brings up videos from 5 years ago when they were new! Hardly anybody, filming long range tests on older EV's!
Fantastic that, about time there was a proper comparison test on second hand electric cars, showing real everyday driving tests, and what a good job you guys did.
Looking forward to seeing your £20000 comparison test.
I took a Hyundai Ioniq on a 460km drive from Rangiora to Pohara in Golden Bay, a 6 hour drive. There is 3 charging stations along the route, Culverden, Murchison, and Motueka with a 2 hour 20 minute leg between Culverden and Murchison that passes through the Lewis Pass at just over 900m elevation. Despite it being summer it was cold as we went over the Lewis and we needed the demister on for periods.
Having used ABRP app we knew that we would need to reduce our speed to reach Murchison, which we did, and despise the cold we arrived with 16km range remaining.
The return journey saw us arrive in Culverden with 32km range remaining, mostly due to it being a more pleasant temperature.
These trips can be done, but planning is required.
I took my Ioniq on a 1500km trip this week, 750km one way on Monday and back home on Wednesday. Learning the consumption of your car is important, but once you know what to expect, it becomes a breeze to plan long distance trips. And the Ioniq is an efficiency king in the end, so despite the small battery, it can go for a long way. On the return trip, I didn't even respect the ABRP plan but just winged it. Benefit of the German autobahn and knowing there's plenty of charger and they are well advertised on the signage.
@@Hans-gb4mv I can only dream of having that frequency of chargers, we are well catered for around the main centres but they become more scarce as to get on the open roads. There was a plan about four years ago to have a charger every 40km along all state highways but I think covid has gotten in the way, and the money has been spent elsewhere.
Efficiency on the day;
Hyundai 5.3 mi/kWh !!!
Zoe 4.0 mi/kWh
Leaf 4.1 mi/kWh (driven steady to make the distance)
Hyundai Ioniq magic efficiency!
Normal for an Ioniq. You can even do better than that in the summer.
Other EV's are really not efficient at all.
@@FFVoyager the Niro and Kona are pretty good too.
As are the up/citigo/mii... exceptional efficiency especially around town
@@spikebmth as stated in the video, you need to drive them on the same route at the same time to see. I suspect the Niro and Kona would be 20% less efficient than the Ioniq - similar to the Renault and Nissan. Remember that actually means it costs you 20% more to go the same distance.
The VW/Seat/Skoda is good in town, but this was a long trip. Would have been interesting to see how it compares.
The next test should be measured against the Ioniq. See if anyone beats it. 🤔
I guess there is a challenge for Richard... a straight efficiently test....
However apart from the Tesla SR, the others are generally let down by their charging speed.
By watching this video, the choice is clear:
Ionic is iconic. Zoe is no bother. But Leaf, well, I won't bother.
The ioniq is by far the better car here. The assist systemsvand general feel are so much better.
A point not always mentioned about the Zoe is that the charge rate above 80% doesn't drop until you get much closer to 100% as opposed to many cars that really slow down past 80%. Also quite a lot of ZE50 Zoe I have seen for sale have dc charging - most of them ?.
Excellent series, thank you. Glad I bought my Ioniq when I did. A very capable EV. 20k just means a newer leaf/zoe/ioniq from what I can see.
Exactly - I can't see what you would get that is much different.
A leggy MG ZS perhaps? 🤔
@@FFVoyager
For around £20k you can get: MG ZS, MG5, VW e-Golf, Kia Soul and Mercedes B-Class among the usual Ioniq, Leaf, Zoe and other small city cars
@@q3b26 don't think merc has rapid charging which would have made it much more expensive
Interestingly we did drive London to Edinburgh in our 2017 Leaf 30, 412miles in early 2020 (before COVID hit) took us 11hrs with 4 stops, we coped with it fine, though you do have to watch the battery temp. We’ve still have the car and I’d happily do it again. Surprised the one in this video got so hot after one rapid charge, in those circumstances I wouldn’t advise during it 400miles.
So with four stops you still achieved a very respectable 38 mph average! Do you recall roughly how long each pit stop was?
@@ouethojlkjn 30-40mins I’d say, charging to 95% and doing 85ish miles between stops. We started in Shepperton, stopped at Watford Gap, Rotherham (Instavolt), Scotch Corner and Alnwick, then on to our hotel near Holyrood, which as we planned had destination charging. Then did same in reverse on way back. We were careful but at no point were we close to running out of juice or cooking the air cooled battery.
I had a Nissan LEAF 2017 once, most comfy (soft seats)... After two years, range was not good enough (eg, around 100 miles) so I upgraded to Kia Niro EV with its longer range... less range anxiety, but the seats too firm on my back.. I miss LEAF seats....
@@jonjoyce3188 Wow so that's more like 48mph when driving! Even so if you know your itinerary and in no rush then why not have a nice relaxing lower speed drive with some pit stops....Make the trip part of the holiday rather than an ordeal to be gotten through.
Back in 2016 I took a 24kWh Nissan LEAF from Sussex to Edinburgh, which was 461 miles. Nine recharge stops! They were only about 20 minutes each as I stopped at 80% to help prevent the battery heat getting into the red and didn't go below 20%. There was a lot of drafting behind lorries, too! Left home at 05:30 and arrived in Edinburgh at 18:40. So just over 13 hours. Much the same on the way back a few days later.
My current car could probably do it with a single midway charge, on a good day. More realistically it would be a couple of stops, which is at least as many as I'd need as a human being!
👏🏼 bravo in a 24. I recall Robert Llewelyn made the trip.
When I did my edinburgh to London non-stop I think I was the first ever to do that and it’s phenomenal how easy it is now. As you say a quick one or two stops is what most cars can do and that’s what the body needs anyway!
@@RSEV Yes, I was very much inspired by the likes of yourselves and Robert. Of course the best bit was that the full 900+ miles cost me about £2 in 'fuel' as the Electric Highway was still totally free back then, just my initial home charge cost anything. Never had a problem charging either - it was solid, at least with CHAdeMO, back then.
Honestly, Richard, you and your team are to be commended for creating this 'affordable EV' series of back-to-back tests...! 👏
I, for one, found them absolutely fascinating - this long-range video in particular, as the Edinburgh trip data comparison was mind-blowing...!
I (now wrongly, so it seems...! 😞) had discounted the 28kWh Ioniq way back when I eventually got my first EV - a 30kWh Leaf - as I presumed that a bigger battery equated to longer range... a fairly understandable assumption to a non-EV driver at the time, I guess...?
Don't get me wrong - I love watching all your 'antics' in Teslas, Audis and Porsches but, for your average Joe (no offense, Joe... 🤣) who can't afford £50k on a car, this series has been absolutely what the UK car buying has needed to persuade them that a used EV is still a perfectly viable purchasing option, even for a single-car family.
Brilliant work, chaps - I think you are trail-blazing in the EV community 😎
Oh, just had a thought re your suggestion on the next series...
I've tried to research this online, but doing it in 'real-world' would no doubt be WAY more enlightening.
My research was along the lines of trying to answer the question: "What usable battery capacity, combined with what charging speed makes for the 'perfect' every-day, every-use EV?"
I came down to probably the 58kWh iD.3 - roughly 200 miles (3 hours' drive) any-weather, any-journey on a 75% battery capacity used, but able to then recharge to 80-85% in a 30 minute, stretch-your-legs / grab-a-coffee comfort break...?
What do you reckon...? 🤔
Great video. Does show that people need to know how their own car charges, even newer cars all have different characteristics!
The Zoe40, was a great car to own until needing to charge on a long trip, due to its AC only charging.
Again, the leaf at a disadvantage due to its smaller battery.
The extra charging time, over ICE isn't actually that much TBF. To the ICE drivers, see how long you spend in the services, from parking to leaving, if using the loo, having a snack & coffee (of course not driving while eating/drinking).
#HyundaiForTheWin
Nice to see the Taycan back!
The major difference is when you have to stop more frequently, like you do in the Leaf. After 3 stops one every hour and 10 min or so it gets annoying. First hand experience with my 30kWh Leaf
Actually, the LEAF and Ioniq have a similar size battery, the bigger issue for the LEAF is that CHAdeMO is slowly disappearing and that most of those old LEAFs have batteries that aren't that good anymore.
I've owned an Ioniq for three years and it's been a great car, the fast charging speed (for the time) and efficiency really make the most of the small battery. It's also been a practical family car although the boot is a little small.
Only just found this video a couple of months after buying my Ioniq and it definitely makes me feel great about my decision! I was basically looking at the cheapest EVs and worked my way through. Unsurprisingly starting with the cheapest is largely Leaf and Zoe with Ioniq and a few others like E-Up coming in a bit later. I ruled out the Leaf because of the battery size and I ruled out the Zoe because I'm very tall and we're a family of 5 so need to get us all in fairly comfortably. Pleased to say the Ioniq ticked basically every box so we bought a 2021 for £11k with 19,000 miles. Really, really pleased so far. Lovely to drive, very efficient, lots of kit that I haven't figured out yet. We don't do many long trips at all so I've only charged at home and don't see that changing for a long time. Go for it.
Enjoyed this series. Its confirmed that the Ioniq 28 is the best car for me in my price range. Cheers chaps. 👍
Another really good video, Rich. Good to see a channel demonstrating real everyday use cases rather than just a 70mph test and a walk around. For a lot of people getting into EVs on a budget, these are the kind of cars they’ll be looking for and not necessarily EV6s or a Tesla. I think you’ve done well considering I know how time consuming the testing is. Keep up the great work!
P.S. would love to see a video on the maintenance of used EVs. Ie costs, anything to look out for?
we get about 80-90 miles from our 22kwh ZOE which will charge at 43kw. Bought the car with the battery for 9.5k, costs £1 to fill it at home
One clear winner .
Did you see the temperature of the leaf battery.
Thanks for doing these videos and the grath at the end was great visual representation of how long the journey takes
IMO the zoe is the best overall,depending on your needs. newest,lowest mileage,longest range its just the ac 22kw. i love mine there is only me and my partner so no kids and stuff they need. i paid £11k battery lease 10 months ago for a 68 plate ze40 with 18k on the clock.they have shot up to stupid money now .if i sold i would prbably make £3-4k but my next car would go up the smane so meh.
If it has a leased battery, it would be a no-go for me. That would make it a big expense every month and wipe out the gain you made by charging your car. Imho, the Ioniq is the best overall. It's more efficient (and therefore cheaper to run), provides more space and is faster to charge.
Of course, some of the Zoe's are 43kw ac capable (Q spec, I think)!
I brought my LEAF 2017 6 months ago while I waited for the Y, now I am keeping it. Its great for london use.
A great series on used EVs. I hope your getting enough interest in these videos to justify a 20K series. Lots of interest in EVs now but many will be looking at used and need help.
Mr. RSymons you are the best of the EVs
Congrats
I’ve done 2 trips down to the Alps using Channel Tunnel & Ouistreham ferry to Portsmouth. 550 miles with 3-4 charges, about 1h30 total charging time. That’s in an etron which doesn’t have massive range but does charge fast. It’s amazing how quick the Hyundai is over a long trip with multiple charging stops. It’s so efficient that the decent charging rate adds a lot of miles in a few minutes. Not far off my etron that costs 4 times as much!
great video yet again guys!! keep it up!!!!
Thank you 🤗
Ioniq very impressive and appeared to be ahead of its time, how will the Ioniq 5 fare in 5 years time vs. the new competition? Will the new cars be 500 miles plus range and we’ll all be wondering how we coped with a 250 miles range; stick a reminder in the diary for another test 5 years time.
7:35 For comparison, a small town in Qld Australia (Eromanga) is 861km (537 mi) from the nearest ocean (in a direct line or "as the crow flies").
Absolutely brilliant. Yes the 28 ioniq actually charged faster than my Tesla ever did. The magic speed on the motorway for the leaf is 58/59 mph. Go over that and range just drops. Add wind n rain and it’s almost like a countdown timer lol. But I do love my leaf. Appx 130 miles range being careful. As mentioned before if you’re selling the ioniq I could well be very interested. Great vlogs. Loved this side by side comparison. Brilliant.
Great series of videos on all these cars. So impressed with the efficiency of the Hyundai.
Subscribing because of this series. Everyone tests the new ones and forgets these. And most people who would like to get an EV can't afford a 40000€ car.
Love this format, you can really see what would be the real life experience for a future EV driver, picking one of these models! Thank you for sharing! 🔌⚡🚘
Great video!
Audi E-tron and old Mercedes B-Class electric can also be ordered with dual AC chargers - 22 kW
Came to say the same. E-tron has the option of 22kW charging.
I have the Kona EV 64kWh and the efficiency is great, these are a few years old now and should start to hit the second hand market (from company car users) very soon. Pretty much the same bits and bobs from the Ioniq in a different styled package. Definitely worth a look if the 3 in the test don't flip your switch - I would love to see the same tests with the Ioniq 5, Audio Q4 E-Tron and VW ID-4.
Yes. The one we were waiting for!
Oh yes........... 1st!
I have the Nissan Leaf 30kw/hr. It's a brilliant daily runabout if you charge at home.
A solid hundred miles but it's really not a long-distance vehicle. It works for us because we knew its pros & cons.
A fascinating comparison. I still have a sneaking admiration for the small battery Hyundai Ioniq. Genuinely does what it says on the the tin. I mean battery. I keep telling my wife that driving slower on the motorway but then avoiding an extra stop can still work out to be quicker. If you intend to stop anyway then fill yer boots. My father-in-law blasts along at a steady 73 just so we get to where we are going so fast we end up having to hang around for the place to open.
Kudos for the hard work and series! Thank you.
420 miles - a couple of months ago I did 430 mile round trip on a cold, windy and a bit wet February day in my Ioniq - I stopped more often but for less time each stop. My total charging time was under 90 minutes so I think your calculation of 2 stops of 30 minutes might just be possible in better weather - but you probably won't charge to 100% after the first stop - so you will only have 80% or so and might need a short plug and dash before the end.
Very good series. Three good options for city driving and occasional mid range trip. The options narrow down quickly for us in state side. Since we purchased a Model X, we are hyper aware of the usage. Mostly because of the brilliant app giving us all the data at our fingertips. Just doing school runs and sports, we average 1,200 miles per month. As soon as occasional unplanned longer trip we have to make, it will definitely bring range anxiety with these options. That’s why I believe Tesla has a such a big lead in US market where distances are generally further.
My Leaf 2014 is always going exactly 10% slower than indicated.
I’ve been looking forward to this one……….curious to how it worked out. Here goes!
Under certain conditions, the Renault works really well. The Leaf is what it is - a local environs traveller. Did you mention you were impressed by the Hyundai Ioniq? I was. Best all-rounder.
We use the co-cars service in Exeter, they have the CCS version of the Zoe and have happily done 350 mile round trips in that with a single rapid charging stop of about 30 mins. Used their ID3 most recently for a 600 mile round trip with 3 rapid charges (hotel charger wasn’t working). All for about £45 a day. We use it instead of having a second car, saving us about £4k per year
Turning the heater off makes the biggest impact on range in my experience.
Really enjoyed this real world series and would love another. I have a Corsa e on order and I'm very excited to be going EV but it wouldn't feel so impressive if I just saw your Tesla/Taycan vids so these will make it feel even better haha
Love this! Perfect for people who is thinking of buying a cheaper EV!
*WIND RESISTANCE:* It's important to note that road speed and drag (so called wind resistance) doesn't scale proportionately - its exponential. So the difference in energy consumption driving at 80mph is significantly greater than driving at 60mph.
A good example is the fact that the Bugatti Veyron needed double the McLaren F1's power just to go that 30mph faster.
Drag starts to have a noticeable affect around 50-60mph in still air. Obviously any reference to drag here makes no reference to wind speed and direction and would also need to be taken into account on top of this.
You’re right. In simple terms, at 70 mph cruise speed, you are looking at roughly two thirds of the total power demand, with most of the rest being rolling resistance - but taking into account the headwind/tailwind air speed as well. Some cars are better than others, and usually the drag coefficient figures (Cd values) are available if one looks them up.
The interesting thing about this trial was that they were all done on the same day, so as to minimise the weather differences that can easily obscure any comparisons otherwise.
I have leaf 30 with 111,000 miles on it , battery does about 70 miles on fast roads between charges. I mostly charge on 7kw as tend to be doing other things . Interesting to see how much more usable the ionic and Zoe are. Thanks for posting
Leaf: town car; Zoe - medium trips fine with the longer range but don’t buy if you do regular long trips due to the AC charge speed limiting you; Ioniq - jack of all trades really flexible
Great to see those cars can still do a job
09:45 - Main benefit for faster car charging is to avoid Car Park time penalty Fines, and Home Charging time sensitive off-peak rates.
I had 3 Phase Charging at home installed for fast charging within 4 hours at 5p rate
Really interesting comparison and as always find the data informative, it would be great to have seen what the effect of a car full of people in their efficiency!
Really enjoyed this series.
I have a 4 year old 28kWh Ioniq and love it.
A note on Lane Keep Assist - it disengages with no audible warning (icon changes colour) which, considering all the other bongs and beeps, is annoying.
The adaptive cruise control is very good.
I have the SE which also has:
Blind spot assist
2 Memory driver's seat.
Ventilated front seats
Rear cross traffic alert
Front parking sensors.
I paid about £17000 a year ago. The efficiency is astonishing.
The Lane Keep Assist is just that, an assist. You are still supposed to be actively steering and controlling the car. Therefore it should not matter if it disengages without warning.
@@Hans-gb4mv I agree the driver must be in control of the car. I am simply saying that it would be better to more clearly know that any sort of assist is no longer operating.
Well I’ve never been sure about the usefulness of the earlier style Leafs due to claimed range and this proves it. I like the Hyundai but wasn’t sure about its millage but it seems better than I expected plus, like you say, decent charge speed. I’m quite impressed. As for the zoe, I’ve just never been a fan as I’ve never been a fan of French cars to be honest……(after years of doing my own and friends mechanics on ICE cars)
What is good about the Ioniq is it genuinely can do the quoted range. Unlike many other competitors. It charges quick because the battery is fairly small, but the car itself is extremely efficient. It is just very pricey all the same for what you get (new). A Hyundai Kona may be a better bet.
4:58 that's only half accurate. The Zoe does have a low regen power when you lift off the accelerator. However, the brake pedal is not (always) coupled with the brakes, and at the beginning of its course, that actually increases the regen which can then go up to 43 kW. And the classic brakes are only applied if you go further.
I think this is very user friendly for people which are new to EVs
Love the mini series! Please let us know how much you sold each car for?
Always informative and entertaining, many thanks to you and your team…. I’m going through the process of learning about the charging and so this has been useful, Australia seems to have less infastructure
The price of rapid charges still shocks me compared to charging over night at home (forgot the high rate, but think it was still under 20p).
7.5p per KWH vs 65p to 79p per kWh.
When I get my electric car on friday, definety sticking to home unless I have to.
The new Nissan Ariya will also do 22kW Level 2 charging. It's an option for the entry level trim but standard on all others. It's one of the best features I think, since it will give you a full battery within 4 hours even with a 87kWh pack, so perfect for city trips, visits, business trips etc.. Arrive, plug it in, do your thing and leave with 90-100%. Less rapid charging can only be a good thing for all parties and components invovled.
As will the new Renault Megane, as built on same platform.
More useful in Europe I'd guess,
@@spikebmth Aren't there any 22kW chargers in the states? The Tesla destination chargers should do i.e. (Adapter needed).
A fascinating series of videos. Especially the real-world timing analysis for long distances. But when do you guys find time to do any real work...?
Zoe has the 50kw DC as an option. With the 22kw AC I think it's a very versatile car.
The reason I never bought the 2nd generation Zoe , 3rd gen with ccs and larger battery is a game changer
Thanks for another great video. You can get a rapid charging Zoe ze40 with 43 kW charging think it was a q90 I remember we nearly got one but the order was messed up and they ordered the slow version so we rejected it , it was a pitty the 38 kWh Ioniq was slow charging compared with the 28 as the extra 10 kWh battery would be quite useful looked at a 38 kWh but didn’t like the local dealership so Then got the ze50 2 years later was great car for the money but only problem was 50 kW charging limit would have been nice to have say 100 kW max but was nice flat charging curve so was good upto quite high Soc , don’t forget the leaf rapidgates so might be longer than u guessed as it looks like it was cooking after than one charging session! But this rapid charging would cut the Zoe’s charging time down .
Would be an interesting comparison is between the 28kWh and 38kWh Ioniq as to which is faster on a long run as to at what point the longer range gets negated by time lost at a longer charge stop.
Leaf (up to 2016) is a definite "no" for long journeys. Anything above 50mph will see the range shortened. I bought a Leaf 120miles away from home and it was a nightmare to drive back. Was driving 50mph but still had to charge twice, the first time had to do it for 40mins and then 15 mins. I have encountered a problem with a fast charging station which decided to throw errors rather than charging, this nearly got me stranded if it wasn't for luck to find another fast charger hidden on a hotel car park, this was the day I experienced first hand what range anxiety feels like. Until EV charging infrastructure gets better I'm not going to get an EV as my main vehicle.
Bought the IONIQ in 2017 glad I did. Still going strong. With a $14,000.00 incentive I did well.
How much was the total cost? I own one as well :P (2018)
@@Owsryudie 28,000 CAD plus tax (Limited) Got a 2025 IONIQ 5 AWD booked just the other day. They say it could be here in the fall. Cheers
Thanks to you and The Team another useful test/review.
Joe im not sure Rock Stars wear nice comfy warm cardies like the one your sporting. 😄
To increase the regen on the Zoé, you have to press the brake pedal. The beginning of the course is regen, then friction brakes.
Same with the Ioniq.
True story - a mate of mine is an engineer, ex-Lotus been with Tesla since the Roadster. Took him out in the Ioniq recently and he was really impressed with it. He said the way they are managing regen is really impressive as it's very hard to get the regen/brake balance as good as they have.
hope to see more of this like you mentioned
I think car speed is calculated on wheel travel distance - so one you will get bigger or smaller wheels your speed be different, but still calculated on the default wheel size. I'm still surprised this isn't somehow calculated based on GPS, if possible and if not then go with the good old wheel size.
I would really love to see how the facelift Ioniq compares to the old one in real life conditions.
I’ve holding out for the new Megane to come out but if it takes too long I’ll have to buy something used and I’ve been struggling to decide between the original Ioniq or the facelift.
+ for an idea that cars should be tested and compared at one day, so the weather and traffic do not affect the range cars can show. Came to the same conclusion. Later, when You test other cars - you can add one of those which tested before - so there is an "Zero point" in comparison.
Great series of films. Good work.👍🏻
Thanks for this series. Have really enjoyed it. Interested in that Ionic. How do you know if you're getting the early or late model? What do I look out for in listings?
The later models have the bigger 38kwh battery. Mine is the 28kwh
Liking the top gear challenges!
Just spotted one of your Teslas in Newquay! About 100 yards from where I live...(all black)
Great video as always… I was going to ask if that was the old Ioniq, but you answered my question at the end of the video. Agree that despite smaller battery, better than newer one. Great car despite its age. Good equipment! What was the efficiency/consumption? I can’t remember you saying it for the Ioniq.., surely better than the others.., 4.5mi/kWh maybe? Do all “old” 28kwh Ioniqs come with CCS or is that an option? And how many miles had it done? Wondering about degradation…
Also, where do you find Ioniqs for £15k? All in Autotrader at £19k+….
I've had my leaf 30 for 4 years and thinking of an ioniq 28kwh as upgrade , what's the extra range on leaf do you think, leafs about 80 miles range,
Great mini series, having just bought a 28kw Ioniq coming from a Leaf 40kwh the Ioniq is very impressive. Same range Has another legacy auto maker made a car as efficient or with as flat a rapid charging curve? I couldn't find one and I didn't have enough pennies for a Tesla model 3. I'd like to put out there that the Ioniq 28 is the Benchmark for Legacy auto and everything produced by them should be judged against it, Tesla are way too far ahead. Incidentally what was the Ioniq efficiency over the trip back?
That time chart is great!
Great content like it how using the electric cars in different ways
Etron can do 22kwac but think it’s just an option, but not sure if ipace also can do it
As new Gridserve chargers have 100kw Chademo would that help the Leaf?! Also did you just happen to have a CCS car against Chademo against Type 2. Up to date Zoe has CCS now?!
Leaf can only take up to 50kw so yes can use more powerful but it won’t ever chargers higher than 50kw.
Yes good to have the mix of different connectors. CCS is now the standard.
Current Zoe 50 has CCS rapid as an OPTION! (Not standard)
@@RSEV I understood that Renault changed that late last year, and CCS is now standard on all new Z0Es? Looking at their order page it appears at the moment the only option available to purchase brand new is the GT Line R135 with CCS included as standard.
Great review. I feel a more fair review would be to do a comparison with the base m3 as they are closer in msrp. And maybe wait till the full fat i4m drops to compare with the full fat m3 comp X ?
70k v 100k … they def aren’t in the same category. This review was Like comparing a Porsche 911 turbo s with a base Taycan. The EV’s are at a disadvantage from the off!!
The speed convoy comparison is really interesting. The Ioniq is efficient, no doubt, but if it’s doing 65 at indicated 70, it will appear more efficient than it actually is. My experience with Zoe is it’s really inefficient at 70, found 63 indicated to be the sweet-spot of distance vs charging need, but at least Zoe is doing nearly 70 when it says it is!
Also, I’m not sure the LEAF could do that distance in the time, given how hot the battery pack would get with all those DC charge stops..
That Dude abides! Far out!
If you drive around at 80, your range will drop to 0 when you get pulled over for speeding
Wow those chargers in the services are very expensive.
Unreal is that a vw eup on a 22 charger?
These will probably be £20k cars soon the ways things are going
I love the LEAF but it will never achieve 109 miles on a motorway.
09:33 - Cable over BMW bonnet... was that a protest by an Ev owner?
At times left me feeling confused .
And Richard maybe speak bit slower/ clearly..
but generally good 👍🏽 content
The Ioniq is a impressive package for the buck..
2 shorter charges with the leaf would have saved him time
Enjoy the real world videos.
Forgot to say. Your impartial honest reviews assisted me in the leap in to electric vehicles. Since Dec I have been loving my Tesla model 3 LR.
Electric ioniq for 15k! Can you hook me up 😀
Not many about for 15k
Shame to see resorting to and old tired “top gear format” envelope and all…
Chris it's only a bit of fun, just enjoy the video.
If you drive down the motorway at 80mph you will (eventually) get nicked!
Sorry - totally unimpressed as I don't spend my time doing nothing waiting for a car to fill. Did 870 miles in my BMW 5 series before a fill. But - and this is the kicker - more and more evidence that EV's are worse - yes worse for CO2 than an ICE and the car industry knows this as not telling the true cost to the planet. Please only buy one of these if 1) you get a load off your tax which you can spend on your jet holidays - but don't drive past the food banks - it must hurt you. 2) you have a weak bladder 3) you need the munchies and coffee on a regular basis.
Apreciando a una mujer tan hermosa. 2:3 sentadillas son unos Kimmy-jka.Monster muchas y un buen ejercicio. 5:25 Se deja ver que hay muy buenos resultados 😍👍 Saludos desde la Cd.. de world loss mortales abian apreciado tan hermosa mujer