Islam vs Secularism: How Democracy Failed in Tunisia - TLDR News
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ก.ย. 2024
- NEW PINS: tldrnews.co.uk...
TLDR Store: tldrnews.co.uk...
Follow TLDR on Facebook: / tldrnewsglobal
Follow TLDR on Twitter: / tldrnewsglobal
Follow TLDR on Instagram: / tldrnewsglobal
Discord: tldrnews.co.uk...
TLDR Store: tldrnews.co.uk...
TLDR TeeSpring Store: teespring.com/...
Support TLDR on Patreon: / tldrnews
Donate by PayPal: tldrnews.co.uk...
TLDR is all about getting you up to date with the news of today, without bias and without filter. We want to give you the information you need, so you can make your own decision.
TLDR is a super small company, run by a few people with the help of some amazing volunteers. We are primarily fan sourced with most of our funding coming from donations and ad revenue. No shady corporations, no one telling us what to say. We can't wait to grow further and help more people get informed. Help support us by subscribing, following and backing on Patreon. Thanks!
1:50 "In nearby Iran" The United Kingdom is nearer to Tunisia than Iran, do Brits see Tunisia as a nation "nearby"?
Nice point.
Yeah, that jumped out at me. There's five or six countries between Tunisia and Iran, including 3 bigger than Tunisia. The third closest country is Italy.
I think they mean that Tunisia is nearby to Iran, and that it's close enough that the Islamic Revolution was effecting them
@@neonbunnies9596 but tunis isn't near iran tunis is closer to Sweden than to iran, this is like in nearby syria when you're living in germany. also most of Tunisians are sunni Muslims and iran is shia which means that a revolution in iran doesn't mean shit to Tunisians.
@@neonbunnies9596 Tunisia is nothing like Iran. Tunisia is a civil, almost secular state.. also a flawed democracy with considerable amount of liberties and freedom.. trying to develop into a liberal democracy.
Iran is a theocratic rogue state leading proxy wars, developing nuclear weapons and threatening world peace.
As a greek, I wish the best for tunisia. I hope they recover, because they will become great allies of Greece and the EU.
As an Australian, I hope that Tunisia can root out its problems. Go Tunisia!
As a British person, I hope France is destroyed.
Thank you 🇹🇳❤️🇬🇷
@@togerboy5396 Wtf dude everyone hates the UK
@@danieloyewande4632 England*
Hello there, Tunisian here, I am seeing in this video a looot of misinformation and non proven facts like the assassinations and such. Many claim that Ennahda were behind all these terrorist ploys since they happened during their time in power. Heck the assassinations happened in Ghannouchi's neighborhood, two blocks near his highly protected mansion.
Also, most of the power struggle happening wasn't because of religion, but because of the rich families holding power in the country, where you find a lot of laws and regulations favoring monopoly in many important industries, with a lot of corruption coming from the parliament. Let's not forget the fact that tens of thousands of terrorists trials were put under the rug during the Nahdha power period, and they were let free, which led to the huge surge of brainwashed tunisians going to Jihad in Syria and Iraq with ISIS. The religious debate is what's happening with the general populace on the surface, while actual tensions is because of high corruption and not properly executing the law (law applies only to the marginalized and poor)
Finally, despite the current president's using the vague law to gain power, that law was said to be ambiguous by some memebers of the parliaments when it was instated in the constitution in 2014, however it was brushed off by nahdha and nidaa members as being fine as it is. The way I am seeing this is that every party wanted to use that law to their advantage, just to find themselves losing to an independent candidate that no one really knew and no one could buy off.
I also need to state that I do not necessarily support the current president blindly, though his current actions had brought the country to its feet quite fast. He's been actually fighting corruption with a lot of trials against members of parliament that had their immunity removed, and other members of the government old or current. He might become a dictator since he has the possibility to do so, but let's not forget that he isn't an army man like Sisi is or in any other military coups in the world.
Islam isn't really the issue but the fact to make tunisia an islamist country is. Though the nahdha's ways were pretty hypocritical by letting salafist roam as they pleased, to even brainwash my friends, while nahdha was watching even though they held enough power to stop it with ease, it was way too fishy. Additionally let's not forget that many nahdha and other islamist parliament members had pretty extremist opinions they wanted to instate, many of which are against human rights freedoms. Aaand finally, during the ben ali regime, and even bourguiba regime, it wasn't only nahdha members that were tortured and killed, any kind of opposition was, so let'ts not make them into the special martyrs that want themselves to be in the eyes of the public. They even admitted to terrorist attacks back in the 80's in trial and even after the 2011 revolution, which is why they were trialed for death penalty. Ben Ali took the opportunity to rise into power thanks to foreign help and the rest is history.
Also I forgot to mention this, the 25 july "coup" was also instigated by a lot of riots against nahdha party for wanting to claim a huge amount of money as reparations for what happened to them during the Ben Ali regime, which isn't the time to ask for a huge sum of money that the country can't produce while being in Debt, having issues with the IMF, and in the worst covid spike in cases and deaths. Ghannouchi even threatened that if they don't get the money before July 25th, the nahdha youth will go out and protest (the youth doesn't exist ironically) so everyone went out to protest that night and Kais Saied did what he did that night. He also did that because of how the prime minister did poorly to deal with the crisis, with him going to a 5 star hotel with fellow transport minister two weekends in a row during the worst spike of deaths from covid.
I can talk more details about this all day, but this isn't something that can be recapitulated in a 10 minutes video unfortunately so it's hard for people outside Tunisia and the countries around to form a proper opinion about this.
This comment should be more upvoted
Keep in mind this channel and its videos aren't intended as in depth analysis. They are here to give a good enough general overview and point out the important, relevant information. Details of internal squabbles and finger pointing is irrelevant.
This channel rarely talks about things that haven't been sufficiently proven. Sure, you might have internal arguments about who is lying and who is the bad guy but the international community doesn't care for that.
IMF bailouts are something to behold
@@borutb11 The international community cares because many countries have stuff to gain from our country. The international community only cares about human rights violations and illegal oppressive activity when it suits their agenda and needs.
The situation in our country shouldn't even be something of note to the world as more important and serious stuff is happening that must warrant international focus.
And if I have to say who the bad guy is, all of the people in power are, from the oligarchs in our country to each country trying to spread its influence with disregard to the country's economic and social situation, heck they're using it to their advantage (like Turkey, Qatar, UAE, Egypt, Saudi Arabia, France, Italy, Spain, China and of course the US)
Though you're right, the international community shouldn't care about their country's external relations and affairs.
I wish I could like your comment a thousand times
Why do all old Tunisian men look like Sith lords?
Lol
Maybe it's because they are sith lords in fact.
totally agree
Because star wars was literally filmed there
You should see the Steve Job lookalikes 😂
I am a spaniard. I visited Tunisia in 2006 with my wife. We had a great, old and wise guide, who told us his view about the history, politics, education, and economy of the country. We both both felt in love with Tunisia. Is hard to behold and to believe the evolution since then. I wish the best for Tunisia what, for me, is a Liberal democracy able to let religion out of politics without violence on it's side. And able to protect citizens without discrimination for or against religious person's.
Difficult, but not impossible. Watch the United States evolution.
🇹🇳🌹👍
We don't need your approval or validation. We will carve out our own future and decide what it will look like.
@@elite7329 obviously
How do you let religion out of politics ?
@@sunset2.00 It's not easy, and it's not exactly "out of politics", but out of despotic rule. Each religion (and non religious thought) believes it has found THE way for people to be fair and good and happy. That leads to inevitable collisions.
We can solve it with an ethics based on individual freedom to choose, and to share the public space with people you strongly disagree with. Freedom of speech and debate is essential. And the freedom to leave your faith without being prosecuted, although you might have to pay a penalty if you are leaving a concrete community and causing actual harm.
Is very difficult. But I think the US jurisprudence has advanced quite a lot in concrete solutions to concrete conflicts, acceptable to all sides IF all of them accept the basic premises derived of individual freedom.
SO, say, you can defend on a religious bases the right to non educate women out of home till -say- 18, but someone who had access to your home could sue you for harassment If you are having that person in a cage, instead of homeschooling or even working-in-family. And, in any case, once that person stops being underage, if she wants to leave, you can't stop her lawfully, although you might sue her if she leaves later, to get a compensation, because your legal duties to raise a kid ends at 18.
Is strange, and somewhat "cold" and complex. But it's better that in-family or in-community violence, or forced and unitarian laicism, or religion.
E.g. see how the Mormon's communities in the USA live.
So basically the first president wanted a modern,western system in Tunisia but he himself denied the right to vote to citizens.
Ironic
That is a modern western system. Just not the one you were thinking about...
@@blede8649 depends of your definition. To me western style democratic system is more or less what EU is doing
@@jokuvaan5175 I know, I was joking. Jokes aside, though, don't forget fascism is a modern western system too. Historically, a very attractive system in the Middle East, even after WW2.
If the first president let everyone vote in 1956. Tunisia would have become an Islamist shithole like Afghanistan. People were too religious and fundamentalists back then.
It's always sad when democracy fails. Wishing the Tunisians the best!
our case is very very weird, there is no civil war, neither did the army take over, we are just stuck with our own ideological problems, im happy that this is the worst of it, but it just does not seem that there will be any solution.
Why did the First president have to replace Arabic with French
@@oscarosullivan4513 obviously because arabic is way more commonly spoken then french
@@oscarosullivan4513 He did not, in the 1rst article of the 1957 constitition, arabic is mentionned as the official language
@@haithemnafti63 Arabic is the official language of Tunisia yeah
8:39 both election turnouts say 2019
As a Tunisian adult, I believe that the approach of this video is myopic. It overlooks all the laxness and corruption of the lately dissolved parliament. Our inchoate democracy ,gained after the romanticized the jasmine revolt, failed to secure the people's life. Our parliament failed direly to orchestrate the country in a time of a stately crisis. Both Islamist and Secularists failed us. We wanted to change that since we are the ones who voted them in. The understanding of the notion of "Democracy" must be revolutionized and not reinstated to its previous perverted sense. We the people, wanted this change when we gathered the 25th of July in front of the parliament. IT'S NOT PLAUSIBLE now to go back to the pre-2011 dictatorship, and it's not possible to redress a corrupt parliament and government. The people that deposed Ben Ali 10 years ago is capable of safeguarding the long-cherished democracy which he procured with Blood and sacrifice, and though this democracy has only relatively secured an unprecedented freedom of expression, it failed to secure our right to live a dignified life with no "impoverishment" because Tunisia is rich. Up to this moment, all is good the president started sustaining previous cases of MPs corruption and theft. The vision is clearer, yet the situation is still precarious. Further sober views will be vindicated with time but there's no going back.
Make Carthage Great Again.
We will 👍🏺⚔️
🧂🧂🧂🧂🧂🧂
From what I’ve read from the comments I want to clarify a thing or two :
First that the real western concept that doesn’t fit well Islamic societies is secularism being undemocratically imposed on a Muslim majority population and so the problem is not necessarily democracy.
Secondly is that too much people tend to think that secularism=democracy and that’s completely false.
secularism=freedom of thought, and it is absolutely essential to any _functioning_ democracy.
@@cageybee7221 Secularism just means seperation of church and state. It has nothing to do with feedom of thought/expression or democracy.
A country could be secular and not allow for freedom of thought/expression (like Nazi Germany or Communist China for example). Also a democratic country could be governed by religious law as long as those laws are democratically voted in.
@@elite7329 it's hardly democratic when the church determines what thoughts you are allowed to have.
@@cageybee7221 lol and it's democratic when any opinion is banned regardless of popularity just because it is associated with a religion? Just say you're a hypocrite lol .
@@hmmm3210 secularism is not a ban on religion lol, it's a ban on religion _in government_
Islamists is a general term Salafism is an extremist branch of Islam, going back to early Islamic principles and often giving up modern items.
salafism is sunni islam throught the understanding of the first 3 muslim generation ( sahaba and muhammad , tabuin , tabuin al tabuin ) so salafis is not equal to extremism but certain salafis are extrimist
Salafism is a mode of though in sunni Islam. Any Muslim/non-Muslim seeing it as a sect or a branch is misinformed.
Muslims staying true to the religion and denying any form of modern filth and ideologies is called being a real Muslims.
@@themercifulguard3971 well you can equally say that Presbyterianism is a mode of thought in christianity, but that doesn't stop them being a branch of christianity, and really the difference between a sect and a denomination is in christianity now really only used prejudicially, but technically is the same thing. If we talk about sectarian issues it normally means two modes of thought (often within a group) in disagreement; and if they agreed they would be the same mode of thought. So the argument is fundamentally flawed.
@@oamaizingo3733 OK that is a reasonable point that Salafism is essentially trying to go back to basics, not unlike groups in other faiths. However that period was a time of great military expansion and also severe punishments that may not have been unusual at that time which is why they are seen as extremists today. That doesn't mean they are terrorists, and some military attacks I have been near have given rise to pity from me: people with swords attacking automatic assault rifles!
@@themercifulguard3971 or are you saying only Salafis are really Muslim?
Poverty + Islamists = Worst combination
= Islamic communism ⚠️☢️
Love Tunesia greetings from the Netherlands
As an Israeli, it's a shame to see the only other democracy in the middle east/north Africa go. I hope they hold out! It'd a shame islamists (and far right populists in the west) are like this.
This is just curiosity but do you believe palestine is a sovereign state?
@@mattf9156 first of all de facto absolutely, the Palestinian authority has control over large parts of the west Bank. As to de jure, it honestly comes down to your definition of terms like "sovereign" and "state". If your question is whether Palestine *should* be a free/sovereign state, then that is a much more complicated question, and so is my opinion on it.
@@smorcrux426 love opinions without people hating on Others opinions
It's ironic coming from an apartheid state
@Itsme Alex well yeah you're right, I guess we still have them. But 2 is dramatically worse than 3.
You can tell that people in the comments didn't watch the video...
While I won't speak for whether the more authoritarian regime is a good or bad thing, what this ultimately tells us is that the implementation of modern democracy with a specifically western-oriented ideology that bulldozes over cultural specificity will eventually swing a country's politics hard in the opposite direction down the line. It's the same story with the history of Turkish modernization. If democracy is going to work, it can't be pushed as just a one-size-fits-all framework that gets transplanted wholesale into any culture in the blind chase for modernization and development. The idea that western values alone represent progress has long run its course and a new more self-aware post-colonial mindset needs to be pushed.
Yeah id agree, but a lot of things such as: womens equality, minority rights and "religious tolerance" should be ground 0 atleast man. Without these, we might as well just go back to tge mindset that let us be colonized in the first place.
Authoritarianism leads too easily to corruption. Everyone in power should be able to be held accountable by someone. In democracies the leaders are held accountable by the people. The first Tunisian president didn't even follow his own ideals of "western democracy" because he banned a whole political party that was only a threat to his own ideals. Then persecuted people based on their political views and religion. It wouldn't have mattered what his own religion or political allignment was, that kind of action will ultimately lead to uprisings and terrorism.
Although I agree that western democracy isn't one size fits all (heck even in the west it's not the same system everywhere), the problem in Muslim-majority countries is how do you account for the political identity of Islam in any kind of political system outside of authoritarianism? Most of the time it's not homogenous societies with one set of values and beliefs. And the policies of Islamic parties (usually some sort of "Shariaa Laws" are the best source of governance) never work without flat out tyranny. Yet still, because the ideology of a large sector of the population is fundamentally opposed to freedom of the individual and democracy in most of its forms, modern democratic systems also rarely work.
From my personal experience, it seems that the most successful system is some kind of oligarchic monarchy like Uman, UAE, Jordan or Morocco. It does highly depend on the feelings and competence of the ruler, but it creates a more or less stable political centre.
We sometimes joke in Syria that if Assad the father had called it a "kingdom" instead of a "republic" from the start, much of the *troubles* wouldn't have happened XD
Guess what? these also happened after the French revolution, and divorce was then banned in France for nearly a century.
These things need to happen eventually.
I perfectly agree. People tend to link Democracy with Western, which shouldn't be the case at all. Arab leaders need to think of making an Eastern Democracy based on their own Arab and Islamic values, and Democracy.
Like in Japan, South Korea, Taiwan, Malaysia, Indonesia, these countries formed a democracy while also maintaining their own Religions (Malaysia and Indonesia) and Cultures.
Arab Countries need to do the same.
Tunisias official language has always been Arabic since independence? Where did you get that from?
I wish the best for this country.
thank you, all of us are just too confused with what we want to do.
It's best known that Tunisians chose democracy, not by being imposed. I guess they have a chance to find the solution.
TUNISIA MUST GO BACK TO THE RIGHT PATH!!!! THAT IS SECULARISM AND DEMOCRACY!
Lmao french as official language of tunisia? Where do u get ur facts? 😹😹😹😹
tunisia has so much potential to become a nice country i hooe thing get better fast
Make more videos about African counties , there is so much going on , would love to see one about my county Angola we have presidential elections next year and might be the most challenging ones since 1992
This is a surprisingly well researched video. The problem in Tunisia is that corruption has suffocated the society so much that there is little structure in the society that allows for a transition into what we westerners understand as democracy. The economy is a web of monopolies owned or controlled by afew families and reinforced by governmental institutions. Islamists are rooted more in international islamist organisations than in the Tunisian society. There is next to no political participation. Thre is no vision, only anger and rejection for the old cleptocracy and the new chaos. The president is popular because he removed the current generation of thieves, but nobody really has an alternative to offer, the president included.
Stop telling me about new badges that aren't Taiwan
The secular dictatorship became to secular leading to a more democratic religious constitution leading to instability and becoming poorer . And me saying that the the first 30 years of 20tg Century Portugal was a complicated time
We are Islamic people and our country are democratic Republic, there is no one can change this, and there is no split between us, Allah Akbar and free tunisia 🇹🇳🇵🇸
Everything always changes. U sound like u are proud of being "Islamic", why?
Islam isn't a race, it's just a religion
@@jemalo36 The islam not like Christian.
@@zaoyon9309 They are both foreign re-interpretations of the previous Judean God. Both epics wich equally belong in a bookshelf - False images of creation wich shouldn't be worshiped within the 21th century.
@@jemalo36 This is due to your lack of knowledge of the Islamic religion, nothing more. You cannot hate them or defend something you do not know, my friend.
Nahda has nothing to do with Iran but it is closer to muslim brotherhood in egypt also I dont know why you call it islamist party and not islamic party? In the west you say christian party not christianist party
Good luck to Tunisians and there fight to maintain the flame of democracy.
Although not tackling all aspects of the situation (probably cuz it'd be too lengthy), I'd say Bravo for your unbiased work and stating facts as accurately as possible (unlike all the media spreading misinformation about us). Thank you! I'm happy to support such great journalists!
P.S. Arabic has never been replaced by French. It was/still is the second language. (Tunisiaan Constitution 1959, Art.1)
"Nearby Iran" Bruh have you ever seen a map???????
Does literally no one rewatch the video before it is released? There are so many simple graphical/script mistakes within this video. Very unprofessional, you should be embarrassed.
6:29 you say 15k, but the numbers show 150k refugees
Another editoral miss… they commit so many of these recently. Do the animator and the voiceover even have the same script?
Not a Dutch.
@@ishaannag4545 Philippines. Got a Spanish last name.
The Tunisian revolution reminds me of the French Revolution. Tunisia will eventually become a democracy. Stay strong! Best wishes from Germany
We managed to avoid, the Terror period so far, hope we can avoid the napoleonic an the monarchy phase too
@@haithemnafti63 Germany also experienced the same instability after the November revolution before it fell for a demagogue, who had to fall for the nation to become a prosperous democracy
You mean the Weimar republic?
@@haithemnafti63 yes, during the November revolution we overthrew the emperor and the military administration and established the first republic
@@yeneraras7403 Being from a former french colony, we learn too little about german history, pesonally i find it more interesting especially the HRE and the rise of Prussia and the 1871 War with france. Germany has always been great power. According to the Higuelian dialectic we will become eventually a democraty, personally, i think that kais said is not the saviour, dispite what 87% of tunisians think of him today. We should forget about the saviour myth that arab people dream of. The Western powers can push tunisia toward democraty like they did with Spain and Portugal. The danger is that many countries especially France still believe that a Stable ( and docile) Dictatroship is better than an uncertain democraty. They shamelessly supported Ben Ali when his police was killing us in 2011. Also we can not become fully democratic untill we transform our inslamists into something like the CDU.
9:40 Kais Saied triggering Article 80 looks just like Chancellor Palpatine triggering Order 66.
The root causes here seems to be poverty (likely through colonisation). Without ridding of poverty it is unlikely that Tunisia will have a stable governance. People will protest if they can't meet their basic needs, whether it is a democracy or dictatorship. France should pay reparation for colonisation, that would greatly help with combating poverty.
Secularization only works if there is an Philosophic approach within the Civilisation.
Why is it always so hard to stay off the extremes. Religious freedom seems to be completely lost between official religion and banishment of religion positions
I'm Tunisian, although residing in North America, I go back often and follow the information. I think few Tunisians already gave solid feedback. I'm here to add 3 things:
- 99% are Muslims could not be further from reality, the % is much much lower, I would say probably around 75%, the new generation especially is mostly Atheists but there's still a fear of reporting that so they keep that info to themselves. So I see it even becoming less than 50% in 30 years from now.
- You downplay how bad Ben Ali dictatorship was, something had to be done or we could have turned into North Korea over time, he was slowly turning himself into a god to be worshiped, the scars from that regime are big among Millennials.
- Finally to answer your question, NO Tunisia will never go back to be in a Dictatorship, not within Millennials lifetime. In fact I would argue Tunisia after July 25th has never been in a better place, the Economy is slowly adapting to stand without Tourism, Corruption is being punished, the people seem more in control and have a say on so much, media is without restriction, it's honestly great! Yes there is poverty but it's going in the right direction, I see it, people living here may not but I see it.
69%? 42%? Nice
need such secular leaders in present islamic countries
the problem with Tunisia is the interference of foreign countries in its politics :UAE;France;Qatar and Turkey and the last crisis was just a power struggle between the two sides .
Noticed 3 typos, yall need someone to go over your work before you release it. Kinda unprofessional
I don't think that's how Bourguiba is pronounced.
Democracy didn't fail in Tunisia. It was reborn.
While technically any religion would indeed be an enemy of secularism, it'd make more sense to say islamism than islam in the title, as it is a bigger enemy of secularism than islam itself
He kinda overused it. Really banning people from praying. Ya they dont need crusades for that
Add a Taiwan pin!
So much for "democracy", not recognizing political parties you don't like 😂😂😂
Both Bourgiba and Ben Ali were dicators, nobody talked about a democraty before the revoltion of 2011 . Now we have more than 200 recognised paries from the ultra-nationalists to the communists. And it is impossible to ban a party.
Well if they did the democracy AND secularism would collapse.
Please do a video on the Canadian Election
After Moses crossed the red sea with the Israelites, they found themselves in the desert with no food and some of them wanted to go back, back to slavery under the tyrant where they didn’t have to worry about hunger and the unknown and others started to worship idols. Tunisia is in unknown territory passed from tyrant to tyrant. Freedom isn’t easy to handle along with the unclear responsibilities that come with it. The low referendum (27%) turnout is a sign of the people’s attitude and their lotus of control . They don’t believe that they have control of their fate and let things take their course at the hands of fate which is exactly what allowed to us to be conquered over and over. I’m worried that my people didn’t understand history well enough and are deemed to repeat it.
That's the problem with democracy, it's too slow in this day and age, we need a more fit, faster version of it
more power needs to be devolved to local governments, so they can respond to the needs of their cities and regions without waiting for federal or provincial approval, aswell technocratic elements need to added. many cities have councils of professionals and experts to advise or even to govern themselves. the higher levels of government should also have these. and political parties should not exist, they cause so much deadlock and tribalism. a Cuban-style non-party system would be far better. we should not be in a position where cuba has a better democracy than us.
@@cageybee7221 agree with political parties and parliament are waste of time and money, also I think there should be a clause or a law that prevent anyone working in politics to accumulate wealth
@@a.a.6203 such a law is called Abolishing Capitalism. you will never get rid of corruption in a system built around getting as much money as you can no matter what.
This is why colonisers shouldn’t leave immediately, until they sort everything out thoroughly.
Or just give then enough money to make up for all the damage colonisation does
That's strange you think the French would've had enough time to sort "everything out" during the 75 YEARS they oppressed Tunisia...
The French were kicked out.
Tunisia “Carthage” was the first democratic republic in history
Nope!
@@mireillelebeau2513 i like how you just say no without any argument backing ur claim lol
@@agtv7368 Athens...
@@giorgos.efth43 lol that’s what western school is trying to indoctrinate you
The situation has nothing to do with Islamists vs Secularism.
It's more about Islamists vs Tunisia
More about problems completely independent from religion
When politicians are busy fighting among themselves or ineffective in bringing economic growth or stability, the people welcome
a strong authoritarian leader:
1 ceasar
2 napoleon
3 hitler
Those are the most famous examples but in no means the only ones
What Tunisia needs is a De Gaulle or Attaturk for sure. It can't do with this current bastard system where it's neither parliamentary nor presidential but people still only care about the president, it needs a fully presidential system carried by a strong charismatic leader that doesn't allow bullshit to happen, otherwise Tunisia will have a very hard time in the future and I hope that this is what's happening. As much as the most hardline of pro democracy advocate could wish for it, strong leaders are generally a must have for even democracies especially in a time of crisis since it unites the nation and political class instead of dividing it which is exactly what Tunisia needs right now
This all comes down to the Saudis and the Emiratis meddling in other countries
Kais Saied would not have done what he did without their backing
Lol not true. Saudis and Emiratis can't do shit. They couldnt even beat houthis, a group of bedouis with primitive weapons lmao
@@ellihowa2365 Lol, it's true
This has nothing to do with military power
It seems like you don't know much about regional geopolitics
@@mrvan3491you are assuming you have more geopolitical knowledge of my country? Lmao
You seem to be confusing Tunisia with Libya, Egypt and other countries where those rich petrodollar Arabs can have large political influence.
Tunisia is geopolitically very differerent from the region. We have been a democracy since a decade for a reason: a strong national unity, a sense of citizenship and rejection of foreign intervention from those autocratic monarchies.. the latter can't do shit with their money here.
We elect all our leaders democratically and we decide what to do next ;)
We still have good deplomatic relations with the Saudis and Emiratis just like other countries: Qatar, Egypt, Algeria, Morocco, France, USA...
Tunisia has been always neutral (our classic foreign policy doctrine) and did not choose a particular "clan" in conflicts like te Libyan civil war, Qatar-Gulf crisis, Egypt's military coup, Yemeni civil war, Western Sahara crisis...
The amount of ignorance and inaccurate information in this video is staggering, and I'm Tunisian
As far as I remembered, secularism was supposed to give the people freedom of religion, not mandatory atheism
it's supposed to give them the freedom to practice their religion in it's temples, not to rule the country and decide it's future, you are free to have or believe in any religion you want as long as you don't push it in other people's faces and try to overrule them by your beliefs
Secularism means Religion Is seperated from state.
I wish the best, but wouldn't it not be a democracy if the people didn't want it though? I don't know.
A democracy that sways to every whim of the people is an illiberal democracy. The way I see it is that government is the agent of the people and their power should come from the same.
So basically arab spring made the whole region unstable and seculars are becoming dictators and we are realizing the old dictators weren’t that bad after all considering life was better before the arab spring
No.
I'm curious what percentage threshold Tunisia uses for Party list PR. Also, I'm wondering how they select their president, it sounded like an instant runoff popular vote.
Why's everybody picking on Al Jazeera?! Like, they are very well respected at least in the west, and have strong fact checking compared to most news services. I get that they were formed by the crown prince of Qatar, but it's not like their coverage is "pro-islamist". Bonkers
Answers to election questions:
A full runoff election is how they choose the president rather than an instant runoff.
They use the largest remainder method and a closed list system for their PR. I'm guessing this means there's no percentage threshold like some countries have, but rather it allows for some tiny parties to get t some seats.
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elections_in_Tunisia
aljazzera english is not the same as aljazerra arabic not the same aljzerra + each one have their own specific target that's why you think like that
As a turkish ,why tunusia remends me my nation western turkey pro europe ✝️ vs ☪️eastern turkey pro islam we are very diveded sociecty
Your fundamental mistake is in assuming West = ✝️. Western societies don't define themselves in terms of religion and have not done so since the 2nd half of the 20th century. Even those nations with official State Churches like Norway and Britain only preserve it due to inertia and culture. That's the reason why a ☪️ society like Turkey will never be accepted as European or a part of Europe, until you guys become thoroughly irreligious in your worldview.
As a European I hope Turkey becomes part of the EU one day. You guys belong in the west and I have hope that young turkish people will slowly reject Islamism and become secular.
@@joey199412 İ hope brother this is already start it in you see wikipedia official turkey religion say only %89 muslim but 10 years ago this %99.99 thanks to Erdoğan and AKP probably next 10 year after only %50 or 60 islam we turks learned what is political islam and ironicly every european say we are mongolian but İ check dna test and İ have %30 greece and south italy ,%30 central asian and %40 balkan dna 😂😂😂😂
@@therealfakeAlphabet İ know this my friend but please stop lying christiaty = european cultere and civilization , İ sweat god if we turks become catholic like spaniards belive me our countr no difference the italy or spain only barier islam because of this religion poising our cultere and brain ☹️☹️☹️
@@xxxxxx-rg6qr Turkey is already on its way to being a part of Europe as a free and democratic nation because the Turkish youth are starting to dislike Erdogan more and more.
Wait in which country there is democraty?
8:36 both pie graphs are labeled 2019
Could you make video about dying democracy in Kyrgyzstan?
Remove religion and win a better future...
Personally, I think that North African countries, especially in the southern Mediterranean to be more closely integrated with Europe, especially democratic Tunisia. The Union shouldn't be limited by geography or religion, and must begin further rappacroachment with countries in North Africa, like Egypt, Morocco, Senegal and Tunisia. In the very least, Tunisia must be integrated with Europe because of it's democratic system, with an eye on Algeria and Morocco (the northern Maghreb coastline in general).
Maybe Said could be like Charles De Gaulle and establish a new constitution with a more majoritarian, presidential system? Seems like the best outcome.
We only hope so
As someone with Tunisian descent I feel really bad right now.
Don't worry dude all is well and our coutry is going on the good traject 🇹🇳❤️
Beautiful name "Yazan" 🙂
You can't have democracy and religion it doesn't work State and religion must be separate
@@user-op8fg3ny3j Who elected them? The people or imams?
@@user-op8fg3ny3j Ok that’s true, but it’s still not necessarily democratic purely based off the fact that anyone that elects won’t necessarily have a different opinion. And it will just be the same people electing the same types of people Aka religious people. Do you get what I mean?
@@user-op8fg3ny3j this is not democracy it's called theocracy and it always become autocracy
@@user-op8fg3ny3j listen man do you really think a book written thousands of years ago have the secrets to build a great Nation be logical those things work in the past now we in the present
@@user-op8fg3ny3j if I remember correctly only the religious leaders are allowed to choose the next leader it's like the Catholic Church
religon vs politics
Democracy is over sold and tyranny is always right around the corner. The corner stones are 'rule of law'; pluralism ie, citizens having a say in their governing; protections and 'respect' for individual rights and free speech; and a free press. Unfortunately, humans while wanting and respecting their own individual rights don't extend that to others. We're selfish that way so it's a long road to Western style 'democracy' and even if achieved it's always on the edge to revert back to tyranny. The U.S. is a case in point.
There’s a mistake on dates in the visuals around minute 9
It was naive to think that you can bring Democracy to Islamic Conutry. Islam and Democracy dont go together. Same as oil and water.
And Indonisia isn't a real country.
Your election vote share pie charts at 8:39 both say 2019. Thank you for interesting video I knew nearly nothing about!
This Bourguiba seems like a great guy!
He was the most liked president/dictator in the tunisian history
@@stond
Nope
This has Abu Dhabi fingerprints all over it
I hope tunisia stays secular
Please do a video about the Lebanon crisis also. It would be really interesting.
Chunisia
BouGriBa
ah yes dismiricting against 99.9% of your people
This is why Tunisia should become a Monarchy, it would bring stability.
Who would be monarch tho?
@@scotandiamapping4549 Someone from the Husainid Dynasty
@@scotandiamapping4549 the heir of the bey of tunisia
@@Anis-zc9rw why not from the hafsid dynasty?
I'm sorry if I offend anyone because I'm not really a specialist on the Tunisian Monarchies and Dynasties
It constantly seems that whenever proportional representation is the election method of government, it frequently results in split minority governments or poorly managed coalitions.
Now, I get the point of proportional representation. The idea is that all views are catered for - but it just doesn’t seem to work.
It’s probably why here in Australia the lower house is based on instant run-off voting and the upper house on proportional, to give some balance.
so much for the optimism of the Arab Spring
The problem with Tunisia (and other countries) is that religion is still a big part of what constitutes a "citizen".
Maybe it is wrong to expect arab countries to evolve as western countries did in the last 200 years. What citizens of arab countries that arent religious can do is limited,depending on the country.
The "secular" arab countries there are no real democracies,everywhere there are governments assisted either by the saudis,iran,turkey,UK or USA.(and probably there are a few under Russian influence).
Foreign influence is i think the root of all problems.
And i dont mean only the era of european occupation.
We never allowed these countries to "grow up",to evolve as they want.
We divided areas according to our ideas,we financed projects that benefited only a few already rich local elites,we helped these elites steal public wealth and export it to europe/invested in european companies,we supported the dictators bcs it was good for us.imperialist europeans
But not all the blame is ours.
Tunisians understood that their only hope for escaping the dictatorship is to side with religious organisations that are already organised.
This is to me exactly what the populist right wing does in europe,sides with church in order to influence "believers".
I fear these countries are in a cycle that would end only if religion somehow gets out of the equation.
Same applies in my home country Greece.
The orthodox church is very similar to the islamic organisations that pose as just religious but in reality are politicly active and usually involved in all kinds of frauds,thefts of public land and wealth etc.-not to mention the paedophiles,the rapists and all kinds of perv clergy with political friends in high places who keep protecting them.
There is a quid pro quo btween them,the priests talk to their "sheep" with good words abt the right party and the right after getting the power returns the favour by allowing the church to keep million of hectares of fertile land that they got from the Turkish occupiers in the 18th century with who the church had good relations (as part of the ruling class was helping the Turkish occupiers to keep Greeks in line with the help of the church. In short ,they were traitors who got paid with land that belonged to Greek citizens)
Maybe TLDR should do a video on Greece 's right wing government ,orthodox xhurch and the greek mafia in the future.
Not Mila Kunis being the President of Tunisia
Please focus more on the split between Tunisians who are practising Muslims and those who are non-religious, or only 'cultural' Muslims. A country which identifies as Islamic, and stipulates that its President must be a Muslim, will always have trouble in transitioning to a representative democracy because Islam is not compatible with secularism. At least 40% of the younger generation are not religious so hopefully they will be a stronger force in the future.
As a tunisian and someone who has experienced all of this as a daily citizen in tunisia , i must say that this video is misleading and not accurate in so many ways and i would suggest viewers to double check most of what has been brought up in this video .
Why did Saied give up his job as the host of Tales from the Crypt?
Did the first president really change the official language from Arabic to French? (one would have thought that French was the official language during French rule and after independence, Arabic would have been the new official language).
A Tunisian in the comment section said that that never happened.
No it's wrong. The official language of Tunisia is Arabic since 14 centuries . However, our Tunisian Arabic is very influenced by French , Turkish and Spanish and Italian due to long eras of colonisation and due to proximity to Southern Europe.
Democracy is overrated...
There is no way for a strongly Muslim community to suddenly become democratic. The value sets are simply too opposed to each other. Unfortunately, Islam is also very fond of presenting itself as a victim under any and all circunstances, and the 1950s measures have furthered that narrative.
Separately, democracy has been in crisis in most countries, largely because economic problems take time and effort to resolve and promises of quick, "painless" solutions by populists and wannabe dictatores gain appeal.
So it seems to me that there is a perfect storm in Tunisia. Frankly, I expect things to go downhill something fierce; they seem to have somehow avoided the worst of its own vulnerabilities so far.
Bourguiba was a brutal secular tyrant, thank God Tunisians got rid of him and his opression. I just hope that the current president of Tunisia won't turn out to be yet another militant secularist.
It’s proportional representation that isn’t working.
Not Every Issue especially ones that started in 2019 are caused by Covid. The causes of Tunisia's failures are sadly the same issues that have doomed so many Arabic and Muslim nations of the region the need to remove religion from politics when it comes to political retribution with Religion itself being Baptists is not a bad thing inherently. Tunisia will need to decide do they go full Islamist state or do they go the route of say Poland and have a secular government with a supermajority religious country.
Nice account, thank you.
One unstable democracy after another. Sadly, Tunisia will serve as another example for Russia & China's promotion of autocracy & other authoritarian rule.
The first president was pretty based :)
Nope
@@yasmineelboubsi6038 Yes, coming from a Tunisian
@@ellihowa2365
No
So that's why their flag looks like turkeys flag