It always made sense that Sisko was benched during the Borg invasion. 1. If Earth fell they needed officers who could hold the Federation together and keep the Dominion at bay 2. Sisko was the one and only Emissary that gave StarFleet an advantage in keeping Bajor on side in the most important area of space near the wormhole 3. Sisko lost his wife to the Borg. While not a critical consideration, coupled with 1 and 2, StarFleet had a means to justify its decision as being compassionate without telling Sisko he was to important to lose.
If I was the federation I would crank out a boatload of these, and have them in storage, in case of war. The DS9 tech manual describes the pulse phaser cannons, and why they where so good. The onion shaped of the pulse where difficult for shields to handle.
I think for the Romulan officer onboard the Defiant would have eventually been a love interest for the Julian Bashir character - but as things progressed they had too many characters - but a romance between the two would have been interested.
From an engineer’s perspective, I’m always a fan of small ships because they require sacrifices and compromises. If the primary characteristic of a ship is “powerful warship”, then designers could make it as big as they needed. However, when the primary constraint is SIZE, engineers really have to work out the fiddly bits.
9:34 Where was Sisko (and the other DS9 regulars during First Contact)? On DS9 of course. That question was kind of addressed months in advance. When Worf found out that Keiko was pregnent with a second child he (seeming panicked, possibly recalling acting as midwife for Molly O'Brian's birth) declaired that he would be on Earth visiting his adoptive parents at about the time the child was due, so Worf took Defiant back to Earth and was on Earth visiting his parents at the start of the battle of Sector 001, cronologically Kirayoshi O'Brian was born within a few weeks of the Battle of sector 001. Of course the crews of all Federation Starships in the area would have been recalled, Worf was on Earth, presumably a number of other DS9/Defiant crewmen wanted to return to Earth and maybe Starfleet wanted one of the main shipyards to check over the Defiant ahead of fast tracking it into mass production, That would explain why none of the other main DS9 charactors were present for the battle but Worf and Defiant were.
It's a good theory, but I don't buy leaving Deep Space Nine undefended from the Dominion just so Worf can go on holiday, and the rest of that is just conjecture. Because they came up with the Sao Paulo pretty quickly... and it kind of proves that it was more needed against the Dominion because they were actually able to destroy it and the Borg just kept hammering it but it was still salvageable. Story-wise I probably would have been better to let them just destroy it at the battle with the Borg if they wanted to have it in the movie and then address that later on DS9 why they got a different ship that didn't even have a cloaking device.
@@Jack_Stafford According to some interviews I read (unfortunately this was around the time DS9 finished so I cannot provide the exact quotes) early versions of the script for First Contact did destroy the Defiant but DS9s showrunner did not like the idea of loosing his ship outside a DS9 episode, so managed to get it disabled rather than destroyed. As for leaving DS9 defenseless, by that point DS9 was far from defenseless, it was able to hold its own against a fleet of about 40 Klingon ships, Defiant, as powerfull as it is would add maybe 15-20% extra defensive capability, and by that point DS9 usualy had several Federation Starships docked, including a Nebula class, an Ambassidor and that weird Intrepid/Constitution refit hybrid thing. with regards to the fast delivery of the Sao Paulo (later rechristened USS Defiant NX-74205), by that point it is likely the Defiant class was in mass production (considering we saw them in the Voyager episodes "Ship on a bottle" and "Endgame" as parts of rapid response fleets), and there is a good chance Starfleet was having trouble finding experianced persionell, so with one of their best combat crews having lost their ship with few casualties it makes sense they would provide a replacement ship as soon as possible.
Good point. I thought this would have been an easy one for Trek Yards. Considering that Captain Sisko and the rest of his crew had the most experience with Jem' Hadar tactics in Starfleet, it would make sense that Sisko's original team would stay behind and watch the wormhole in case the Jem' Hadar tried to take advantage of the Borg attack. (Worf would go, because he participated in repelling the previous Borg attack when he served on the Enterprise-D, if you remember) The Federation had enemies on many fronts. Since at this point in time the Jem' Hadar had not yet arrived in the Alpha Quadrant, it would only make strategic sense for the original DS9 crew to stay behind and look out for the Bajor Sector. Their expertise may have been at least helpful since the Defiant was temporarily assigned to protect earth. As far as the arrangement with the Romulans for the cloaking device, I think Sisko and crew broke the treaty during the short Klingon War for for safety concerns and just tried to cover it up. It's consistent with the show that breaks the rules. As far as when the actual Dominion War was formally declared, the cloaking was never seen used in the last 2 seasons because it was 'open warfare' in the 'Alpha Quadrant' and all the powers were watching them, officially. It's too bad sometimes, you can catch Trek Yards not giving the right information.
@@terryforsdyke306 Defendable or not, I can't see Starfeelt being OK with Worf taking the Defiant out to use as his personal taxi/airline. At most I can see him taking a Runabout, but even that would be a bit much, the more reasonable idea would be to take a shuttle to the nearest starship going to or within shuttle range of Earth. That or simply boarding a chartered vessel docking at DS9 and going to Earth, they must still have the space equivalent airlines in Trek.
Sisko's suitability for that mission may have been deemed by Starfleet command as impaired by feelings of vengeance from losing his wife at the Battle of Wolf 359. Just my humble opinion.
Perhaps. But I don't quite understand why it is felt that the Defiant didn't "perform well" against the cube. Isn't the concept of "well" a relative question? The cube was, clearly, in far worse shape than the one that attacked in BoBW. There is no on screen evidence to indicate which ship caused all of this damage. I'm not suggesting it was all inflicted by the Defiant, but clearly something had improved, with Star Fleet having closed the technology gap, somewhat. This, alone, is quite impressive given that the Borg will have been acquiring new technology in the intervening years. Personally, I've always felt that the Defiant, and other Federation ships, performed markedly better than previously; therefore they, arguably, performed "well". However, if you define "performing well" as meaning being decisively better than the cube, and capable of causing devastating damage against it, then it failed to do that. However, the technological leap from BoBW to FC would have been enormous, and a little difficult to swallow.
Great review guys. I’ve always loved the Defiant class ship as its smaller and different than the larger Federation class ships. It’s a tough little ship and I’d take it over the Galaxy or Sovereign class ship any day.
I've been rewatching DS9, so this was very Timely! Also appreciate the full episode with Canon on-screen information. But for the life of me I've never heard an acceptable explanation for that snout. It happens to Nestle in well with the assign but other Federation ships were able to dock elsewhere. And when they designed the defiant they didn't know they were going to even be taking possession of DS9. No other Federation ship has a design that even close to this protruding front proboscis. I wonder why this was signed off on, it would have looked cool with just a rounded front end and maybe a roll bar for detail like the reliance?
If they're on screen, then they're Canon. I had a Texas Instruments Star Trek game when I was a little kid, and it had mines also, but I don't expect everything from every Star Trek game ever made to be considered even remotely Canon. That space mines? Absolutely. We've seen him in several episodes on different series I believe.
@ Dale Stafford "If they're on screen, then they're Canon. " ... STRONGLY DISAGREE. Star Trek V: The Final Frontier clearly shows on screen that the Enterprise A has in excess of 78 decks which would make it over 3 times the vertical height of the Enterprise refit and almost twice larger vertically than the Galaxy class. So what we see on screen can sometimes be a lazy, absurd, diarrhea-like sh*t on canon and an insult to the intelligence of the fans.
It's my second favorite ship after the absolutely gorgeous Enterpriser refit of the TMP era. Glad you guys gave it another episode including touching on some of the arguments from the comments section of the earlier episodes.
Great video, gentlemen! I love the Defiant... I used to like it more for what it could do than how it looked, but now I just love the whole thing. One of Ronald D. Moore's best creations.
In terms of the USS Defiant "failing" at the Battle of Sector 001, nothing could be further from the truth. We know Starfleet set up multiple perimeters against the Borg Cube and the Enterprise arrives at the last perimeter and the Defiant is still dealing significant damage to the Cube despite being one of the first ships to be involved in the battle. Tough little ship indeed!
Yeh and I’d have thought that had the design issues been worked out earlier, the Defiant-class would have been sent in groups or even fleets against the Borg. As it was they only had one in tike for Sector 001.
The Defiant is prob my fav ship, in DS9 at least. Just for the sheer power it packs in a compact space but with refinement, and there's doses't seem to be waisted space. It would be a great Klingon ship, probably why Worf like's it so much. Great episode again guys.
I remember when I saw the defiant for the first time during the shows first run, that it was awkward looking with its nacelles canted out like that on the sides. But it grew on me and I later wished they would have showed more ships using that compacted design language.
Great discussion on that tough little ship. Thanks again for an enjoyable video. After 2 years of checking out the channel on and off I finally subscribed. Better late than never. Lol
The first time it was deployed with the cloaking device, like you said, it felt like an old WW2 U boat lol I can only imagine what it was like to get it ready for deployment,"Alright, lets check our provisions before we set off...Damn it, who put beans on the list!? I said NO beans while on board the Defiant! Tim! Wheres, Tim!? He did this, didnt he!?"
I always liked this design a lot. One of the few Star Trek designs where the exterior looked truly proportional to the amount of interior space the ship was supposed to have.
I don't remember pulsed phasers in TOS. I DO have a plausible explanation for the pulsing of the phasers in TWOK. In TMP, Decker explains that the new phasers draw power directly from the warp engines making them significantly more powerful. Perhaps due to so far inadequate emitters in the Enterprise refit and Reliant phaser banks, the phaser power has to be pulsed in order to not overheat or damage the emitters. With the advancements in emitters materials and collimated phaser strips of TNG, warp supplied phaser power is manageable. But, with the Defiant, it's all about ramping up phaser destructive capability so the pulse phaser emitters are directly adjacent the warp nacelles so directly in line with the power conduit for the warp system and thus has an even more effective increase in power. Also, a continuous stream of phaser beam is a constant stream of that power, but if you pulse it, then you can overcharge a shot, fire it, overcharge the next shot and fire it, and so on so you effectively boost each shot's power. Also think of the effect at the receiving end. A slightly lower power, continuous stream can strike the surface and melt or disintegrate the hull, but a higher intensity pulsed shot gives it more kinetic energy as well. Kinda like pushing a hammer on a car's windshield with constant pressure may not break it, or at least only make a spider-web like crack, but a tap and repeated taps will punch a hole right through it.
I am thinking it only connects to the docking port from the front. They disembark on the side of the front pod, like an air plane gate bridge. They do not exit through the defector at all, just looks like it.
That would make a certain amount of sense because I could never figure out how the Defiant was supposed to have docked with DS9 there's 0 indication of some sort of docking connection in the nose and even the tech manual isn't too clear on how it was supposed to have docked.
I just finished watching a video of some journalist railing against the new us zumwalt class destoryer. Makes imagine some talking head of the Federation News Service complaining about the Defiant Class. "It's a useless ship designed to fight the Borg....or so they say. Seem more like a pork project by the local Martian government to bring more jobs to the ship yards"
IDK, comparing the Zumwalt class to the Defiant? The USS Defiant was intended as a "beefy runabout", small but as powerful as possible. The Zumwalt class on the other hand is a multi-mission, multi-role, jack-of-all-trades (master of none?) battleship, packed with the latest high-tech gadgets and gizmos - the only actual novel tech of the USS Defiant is the cloak (and that was not included in the other ships of its class). So no, I politely disagree.
I’m trying to look at it with the same narrow mindset the federation has. They love jack of all trade master of none ships. They would look at such a limit ship as a waste. All it can do is move fast an lay down impressive amount of fire power. It’s not good for exploration, not good for scientific missions an I’m sure the idea of a dedicated combat ship would be controversial for the whinny “were not a military were explorers” crowed.
I wonder if starships where using the Delitheam crystal's from the TOS episode Thorugh the looking glass? That the crew of Enterprise was negotiating for..
what are those Squares on the Back? is that ever explained? The circular blue parts are part of the emergency warpcore ventilation system. But that square parts i can't find an explanation for.
Great video as always. Thank you both very much. The Enterprise A was originally the Yorktown if in not mistaken and the Enterprise E was the Sovereign.
No. If the Sovereign was re-named the Enterprise, then it would have been the lead ship of the Enterprise class. A new Sovereign class ship in the yards was designated the new Enterprise and Picard and his crew were transferred to it after the loss of the D.
I love the Defiant. My favorite of all time is the Constitution class from TOS movie era. The Excelsior class. The Defiant. Then Voyager. I also like the Enterprise C, I find its design interesting and the Stargazer.
Regarding the Borg invasion, I think Sisko was on a mission in the badlands at the time. However, much like Starfleet keeping Picard and the Ent-E out of the way to pick up the pieces of the Federation and Starfleet if the armada failed, Sisko would likely also have been kept out of the fighting, as at the time, the Dominion War was happening. Sisko being the Emissary had a special relationship with Bajor, and Bajor's co-operation was considered vital in keeping a Starfleet presence at the mouth of the wormhole aboard DS9. As such, risking such an important figure in the defence of Earth, when Worf was able to fill that role, was redundant and risked losing Sisko and a role only he could fill.
The Dominion War hadn’t started yet (Sisko references the Borg attack just before the Dominion fleet comes through the wormhole) even though the stardates are a bit muddled. I agree though that Starfleet would have told Sisko to stay away, if only because he could cause problems for the battle if he went off on his own to try to avenge his wife.
I think the stardates are a bit messed up, but it’s about the same time. And you know if Sisko had been at the battle and given his history with the Borg, he would taken out the entire cube with his bare fists! He was probably told to stay home like Picard was.
Was the Sao Paulo re-christened the *Defiant- A* ? I don't remember, and I honestly don't understand why they would rename the ship since it didn't have a long and storied past like the Enterprise did, they could have just assigned the Sao Paulo to DS9 and kept that name?
I am watching it again, I missed that detail. That's a break with tradition, but if there is any continuity in Trek at this point I guess that there rarely is continuity! ;)
Aye... because they wanted to be able to use the previous season's graphics. I really think they could have reused stock footage on the standard TVs of the time and no one would have noticed because they rarely lingered on registries, but I trust that is the fact!
I think keeping the name but changing the registry would have been right. The ship and crew earned the name with its service before and during the war.
I could go either way with the name, but it did need to have an A added, and then just use whatever special effects they needed to, because like I said they don't Linger on the small font name name and registry especially on TVs and effects of the era, so why not say yes we gave you another one this is now the Defiant-A, good luck? It seems like if they can go through the trouble to make the digital effects to blow the defiant up that they could have touched up some of the other footage if absolutely necessary.
Seems like a logical design. All components in one tight package....no pesky appendages to shoot off. Although...other classes with appendages look very nice!
I would love a video about why Voyager didn’t went to the Bajoran Wormhole in the Gamma Quadrant and the dangers that the crew might have encountered traveling in that Direction,Hope to see your version of the theory.two TH-camrs have already talk about this topic that has been on the internet for years .Certified Ingame and Lore Reloaded
The original plan was to destroy the Defiant in FC, until the folks on DS9 complained mightily. Another trivia bit, a large part of the design calls back to some of Matt Jefferies' preproduction concepts for the original Enterprise. As for the docking port issue, perhaps the deflector flips up inside the nose, with some sort of docking port tunnel setup behind.
The phase cloak on this vessel would have been amazing. To bad they couldnt have made the deflector weapon ,the ent D used against the borg, a main stay and usuable regenerative option.
The reason Defiant had to drop out of warp to not be detected had nothing to do with his power signature. It had to do with cloaked ships operating at warp speed emit a slight of sub-space variance. Did you not see the episode where the defiant was captured by the gemhadar?
Consider the size of the ship when talking about the battle with the Borg. It was never meant to be a flagship to lead a fleet, so the fact it took so much fire from the Borg and kept going, I'd say it answered the call of duty, then some. Now the Enterprise, that's a flagship, I'd expect it to not even blink against the Borg. Also, I never knew the Nova class was that tiny, it's about the size of the Defiant! No wonder such desperate measures had to taken when one ended up in the delta quadrant. They were essentially stuck in a tiny tin can alone on the other side of the galaxy. It's a miracle they ever got as far as they did in the Equinox.
Just had a thought...as you would want to deploy the defiant quickly given it's role you would think they would back it in...there is also plenty of room for the airlock in her rear! Perhaps a suggestion worth throwing out there if they ever remaster the show lol
I was thumbing through a dictionary the other day and I stumbled across the phrase "Bad Ass". A picture of the U.S.S. Defiant was used as an example. 😉
Star Fleet LIED and broke its treaty obligations by gratuitously using the Romulan cloaking device in the Alpha Quadrant?! Oh say not so! Star Fleet is as clean as the driven snow -- snow driven to Section 31! 🤣🤣🤣
The Defiant as a single vessel against a single Borg cube is only going to so much, it I assume was meant as a swarming sort of class to overwhelm the Borg with multiple heavily armored and armed ships with near fighter like manueverabilty. Meanwhile the other ships in the fleet could pound on the Borg ship from a safe distance without worry of getting hit while planing the next assault on it. In the end Starfleet made cheaper ships with similar capabilities like the Norway and Steamrunner classes as well as bigger and just as heavily armed and armored ships like the Akira and Soverign classes while upgrading older classes like the venerable Excessior with Defiant tech.
There's actually an episode of DS9 when someone talks to Worf about a future stardate (which is when the movie happens) and Worfs says he'll be at Earth at that time. It was planned for the Defiant to be there with just Worf in command.
@@SGUDistantHope Only ones I can think of are Homefront/Paradise Lost when Worf takes the Defiant to Earth and fights the Lakota and when O’Brien tells him Keiko is pregnant and he says he’ll be very far away on Earth when she gives birth. I think both are too early for First Contact though.
P.S. The Defiant wasn't designed to take on a Borg cube alone. There was supposed to be a fleet of them so it makes sense that it got beat up in the borg battle. If there say 10 or more zooming around the cube laying into it nonstop with pulse phaser cannons and quantum torpedos then I imagine the result would've been different.
Remaining cloaked didn't require stopping, it was an expreiment that they thought might help with sophisticated Dominion sensors. It wasn't used again because it failed spectacularly
The original USS Defiant didn't get destroyed quickly. She was underfire and unable to defend herself for some time. It took awhile for the crew to abandon ship. And they were away and watched her take much more punishment before she was destroyed!
In the DS9 technical book by rick sternbach, it is mentioned on a page, that the defiant class is based on the nova class. Or in other words: defiant class is sort of a nova class refit. Wonder why it is never mentioned on youtube clips about the defiant
Because thats not technoically true. A defiant concept ended up being re-used as a Nova...and included in the manuel as something interesting. The USS Defiant and Nova class designs are radically different and in no way is the Defiant a Nova refit, the Defiant was designed from the ground up for a purpose...the nova class was designed from the ground up for a diffrent purpose. Fun alternate sketches dosent make real canon...and that was never said on screen..where as it was said it was a custom build ship in canon so i take the canon :)
@@SGUDistantHope maybe you're right. But if you check both ships by their seize, proportions and look, it's clear both must be related. I'll have to check that book again. I've read it allmost 20y ago
@@dascz1 their look? they have totally different looks lol? There is however the Defiant which is just a Nova with forward torpedo launches...which Rick then turned into the equinox...this look like the equinox but i dont think anyone would say the canon equinox and canon defiant look anything alike except their paint schemes...and even that is different really..i have both of the original 3D models from Star Trek so know both ships very very well.
What Technical Manuals could I get that would showcase Star Trek Ships like these and others , and where could I buy them at ? Online or at some Stores like Half priced books ? Anybody ?!?
The defiant did awesome against the borg. It was one of the 1st waves to hit it and was still going. It was not designed to be a lone wolf cube killer (sto excluded) and was part of the newer designed ships with waves that compliment each other including the akira steamrunner and Norway. Which was part of the task force in the attack. And not forgetting the oberth 🤦♂️🤷♂️ with its 1 phaser
Are your shots of the Defiant and DS9 from a Remastering, Star Trek Online, or something else? I’ve never seen these two in such high quality video before. 🤔
To the best of my knowledge there are no solid numbers for Defiant's firepower compaired to other ships, however as far as I can recall the Galaxy was only ever shown firing 1 Phaser at a time, Defiant usualy fires its 4 Phaser cannons together (often backed up by Quantom Torpedoes to a Galaxy's photons), realisticly Defiant is able to concentrate its firepower far better than a Galaxy so I choose to believe that the Galaxy does in total have as much or more firepower but Defiant is much better at focusing its firepower on a single target than a Galaxy making Defiant's firepower 2-3 times as effective.
@@terryforsdyke306 Given both the Defiant and Voyager were able to fire both Quantum and Photon torpedoes from the same launchers, it seems hard to imaging the Galaxy class would not get that capability relatively soon after we saw them introduced. Even if it required a retrofit that does not even seem on the level of several repairs done offscreen between TNG episodes.
it is likely that a Galaxy could be refitted to carry Quantom Torpedoes, but it was not for the Dominion War, and you would figure that if it was a simple modification that would have been done, but I do not believe any Galaxy was ever shown firing Quantom Torpedoes. yes, the refitted Dominion War era Galaxy had (if I recall correctly) 15 phaser arrays but the Defiant was (as far as I can recall) the only class with Phaser cannons. the lack of Quantoms on ships like the Galaxy, Miranda, Interped, Akira, Sabre. the only Federation ships known to use Quantom Torpedoes are the USS Lakota (a refitted Enterprise B type Excelsior theorised to be a recommisioned NCC1701B) as well as the Defiant and Soverign classes, this sugests the people incharge of wartime upgrades for Starfleet ships are hopelessly incompetant.
@@terryforsdyke306 seems to me the criteria for designing q torpedoes would have been "must be able to fire from current launch systems", so they could have been rolled out immediately - no refit needed. it was unnecessary writing.
Yes, the Terran Rebellion Defiant that fought Alternate Worf’s Klingon ship had a standard phaser array and I don’t remember the Prime Defiant ever using one.
@@elainepeters3295 The prime Defiant used a normal phaser array (positioned somewhere near the bridge) during its battle with the Lakota in Homefront/Paradise Lost.
3:20 - The "Romanoffs"??? LOL! Commander Mumbles does it again. Great video guys, favorite ship in Trek. Question - Cdr Cockings, are you doing the 3d rendering we see in this vid of DS9 and the Defiant etc? Incredible, whoever, whatever, the best Trek rendering I've seen, better than the original DS9 first 3d work with the Defiant. Again, great video here...
@@Trekyardswebseries Sort of been an ongoing joke, I've called him that since I subbed when you had 2200 subscribers, as I've always found it hard to understand him at times, and have made numerous (humorous) points over the years about this. You even responded and agreed once. I can post links if you want. Not meant to be rude, just an accurate nickname.
It never made sense given the lack of space and likely lack of long term assignment that such a ship would have a captains ready room much like the Intrepid class having such an enormous ready room
i never understood cloaking. originally i thought it was and integrated system - which made sense to me, you couldn't steal a cloak from a ship because it was a part of the ship like life support. then they made it a portable device that could be attached to vehicles basically at will, and i think it all went downhill from there. the cloak didn't work properly on defiant because it wasn't designed to have one, wrong hull shape, wrong hull metallurgy, ad-hoc power setup, it wasn't a surprise that the dominion spotted them immediately and said "what's that? oh, it's an invisible ship, just let them go and see what they are up to, play along pretend their cloak is working... OH - WHERE DID THEY GO? THERE WAS SOMETHING HERE JUST A MOMENT AGO! OH WELL! I GUESS I WILL JUST GO BACK TO MY PATROL ROUTE NOW! DOO-DE-DOO-DE-DOO..."
... so basically you weren't familiar with the TOS episode, "The Enterprise Incident" where Kirk was able to steal a Romulan cloaking device... by hand. ... either that or it all went downhill 48 years ago in the 3rd season of TOS, which is not true... it started going downhill in the movies with Star Trek V: The Final Frontier or on TV with Star Trek Enterprise... fully rock bottom with JarJar Abrams Star Trek and Star Trek Discovery.
Before Voyager and First contact made a great leap in ship designs towards intrepid, Norway, Saber, Akira etc, TNG type ships were boring, (except for the vorcha); specifically starfleet ships were boring. 1993 or 1994, I can't remember, but the introduction of the Defiant to DS9 got me interested starfleet ships for of the 24th century.. TNG/DS9 story-lines were great but galaxy was ugly. New Orleans was kinda interesting, Excelsior cool only in the motion picture era, but old news in TNG, so I was extremely grateful for the outside thinking that went into the defiant! TMP is still my favorite design era of ships, but Defiant, and most things that came after the artists designed Voyager, saved TNG and post TNG for me.
At this point I'm going to question why they chose the name Defiant in the first place. When discussing Trek, and you say Defiant, the person could say: Oh you mean the one in the original series that Kirk was trapped on? No. Oh do you mean the episode of Enterprise where they found the ship in the Mirror Universe? No. Do you mean the episode of Discovery that it showed up on their scanners? No. You mean the ship that Khan took over ? No. That's Reliant not Defiant. Then you must mean the little ship from DS9 with a cloaking device? No. I mean the second version of that ship without the cloaking device... See what I'm saying? There's so many great and storied names out there for Starships that they could have gone with something completely new when they first introduced it, and then new again when it was destroyed. Some would argue that the Defiant when it showed up should have been Defiant- A in the first since there had already had been a famous ship with that name, and the replacement would have been the Defiant - B, but I guess since the numbers after the name were different they thought that was enough to differentiate it for the audience... I wonder who at Starfleet decided to name that ship after the ghost ship that lost its entire crew and mysteriously disappeared and trapped Kirk in the first place. Usually they retire names like that. A Rose by Any Other Name...
They say don't complain about a problem without presenting a solution. My personal favorite would have been Vanguard, one of the best battleships built for the Royal Navy, and of course Nelson and Duke of York also had incredible histories. But they ignore the British Navy far too often in favour of American names, which I understand for the original series since its audience was probably ninety-plus percent American. By the time of DS9 though, Trek was a known International phenomenon and I wish they would include Canadian Australian and British ships more often in their naming conventions. Especially now, since Trek is filmed in Canada anyway. Enterprise/ Enterprize gets a pass for belonging to all English-speaking navies at one time or another.
I remember they chose Valiant as the name first, but producers were already working on Voyager and didn’t want people to confuse them. And this is just my own thought, but I think the word “defiant” goes well with Sisko’s personality. In universe, maybe the Admiralty thought it had been long enough to bring back that name and that the name described the Federation’s attitude about the Borg after Wolf 359.
The original name was going to be Valiant. However the DS9 producers were told flat out that they could not use a name starting with V. (Because Voyager)
That's a good point about using the name Valiant and having another ship on at the same time as Voyager that more casual viewers might get them confused. I still think they should have done something other than defiant though.
I get the lack of A being due to budgetary reasons in the real world but didn't you say in one of your previous episodes that _only_ the Enterprise was allowed to have a letter after the registry? Anyway thanks for this episode, the Defiant is one of my favourite ships from my favourite Star Trek. It really was a welcome departure from the early TNG pacifistic Star Fleet.
I don’t think it’s been stated in canon that only the Enterprises get letters, but we’ve only ever seen the Enterprises get letters. All other reused name ships (including the Defiant itself, coming after the Constitution-class one) got new unique registries.
It always made sense that Sisko was benched during the Borg invasion.
1. If Earth fell they needed officers who could hold the Federation together and keep the Dominion at bay
2. Sisko was the one and only Emissary that gave StarFleet an advantage in keeping Bajor on side in the most important area of space near the wormhole
3. Sisko lost his wife to the Borg. While not a critical consideration, coupled with 1 and 2, StarFleet had a means to justify its decision as being compassionate without telling Sisko he was to important to lose.
If I was the federation I would crank out a boatload of these, and have them in storage, in case of war.
The DS9 tech manual describes the pulse phaser cannons, and why they where so good. The onion shaped of the pulse where difficult for shields to handle.
Waking up to this episode has made my day
i know it's pretty randomly asking but do anybody know a good site to stream new tv shows online?
@Iker Maximilian flixportal :P
@Lawrence Ezequiel thanks, signed up and it seems like a nice service =) I really appreciate it!!
@Iker Maximilian happy to help :D
While it isn't one of my favourite designs, it's still a pretty neat ship
I think for the Romulan officer onboard the Defiant would have eventually been a love interest for the Julian Bashir character - but as things progressed they had too many characters - but a romance between the two would have been interested.
From an engineer’s perspective, I’m always a fan of small ships because they require sacrifices and compromises. If the primary characteristic of a ship is “powerful warship”, then designers could make it as big as they needed.
However, when the primary constraint is SIZE, engineers really have to work out the fiddly bits.
This is a really good episode. Love the history of the Defiant.
9:34 Where was Sisko (and the other DS9 regulars during First Contact)? On DS9 of course.
That question was kind of addressed months in advance.
When Worf found out that Keiko was pregnent with a second child he (seeming panicked, possibly recalling acting as midwife for Molly O'Brian's birth) declaired that he would be on Earth visiting his adoptive parents at about the time the child was due, so Worf took Defiant back to Earth and was on Earth visiting his parents at the start of the battle of Sector 001, cronologically Kirayoshi O'Brian was born within a few weeks of the Battle of sector 001.
Of course the crews of all Federation Starships in the area would have been recalled, Worf was on Earth, presumably a number of other DS9/Defiant crewmen wanted to return to Earth and maybe Starfleet wanted one of the main shipyards to check over the Defiant ahead of fast tracking it into mass production, That would explain why none of the other main DS9 charactors were present for the battle but Worf and Defiant were.
It's a good theory, but I don't buy leaving Deep Space Nine undefended from the Dominion just so Worf can go on holiday, and the rest of that is just conjecture.
Because they came up with the Sao Paulo pretty quickly... and it kind of proves that it was more needed against the Dominion because they were actually able to destroy it and the Borg just kept hammering it but it was still salvageable.
Story-wise I probably would have been better to let them just destroy it at the battle with the Borg if they wanted to have it in the movie and then address that later on DS9 why they got a different ship that didn't even have a cloaking device.
@@Jack_Stafford
According to some interviews I read (unfortunately this was around the time DS9 finished so I cannot provide the exact quotes) early versions of the script for First Contact did destroy the Defiant but DS9s showrunner did not like the idea of loosing his ship outside a DS9 episode, so managed to get it disabled rather than destroyed.
As for leaving DS9 defenseless, by that point DS9 was far from defenseless, it was able to hold its own against a fleet of about 40 Klingon ships, Defiant, as powerfull as it is would add maybe 15-20% extra defensive capability, and by that point DS9 usualy had several Federation Starships docked, including a Nebula class, an Ambassidor and that weird Intrepid/Constitution refit hybrid thing.
with regards to the fast delivery of the Sao Paulo (later rechristened USS Defiant NX-74205), by that point it is likely the Defiant class was in mass production (considering we saw them in the Voyager episodes "Ship on a bottle" and "Endgame" as parts of rapid response fleets), and there is a good chance Starfleet was having trouble finding experianced persionell, so with one of their best combat crews having lost their ship with few casualties it makes sense they would provide a replacement ship as soon as possible.
Good point. I thought this would have been an easy one for Trek Yards. Considering that Captain Sisko and the rest of his crew had the most experience with Jem' Hadar tactics in Starfleet, it would make sense that Sisko's original team would stay behind and watch the wormhole in case the Jem' Hadar tried to take advantage of the Borg attack. (Worf would go, because he participated in repelling the previous Borg attack when he served on the Enterprise-D, if you remember) The Federation had enemies on many fronts. Since at this point in time the Jem' Hadar had not yet arrived in the Alpha Quadrant, it would only make strategic sense for the original DS9 crew to stay behind and look out for the Bajor Sector. Their expertise may have been at least helpful since the Defiant was temporarily assigned to protect earth. As far as the arrangement with the Romulans for the cloaking device, I think Sisko and crew broke the treaty during the short Klingon War for for safety concerns and just tried to cover it up. It's consistent with the show that breaks the rules. As far as when the actual Dominion War was formally declared, the cloaking was never seen used in the last 2 seasons because it was 'open warfare' in the 'Alpha Quadrant' and all the powers were watching them, officially. It's too bad sometimes, you can catch Trek Yards not giving the right information.
@@terryforsdyke306 Defendable or not, I can't see Starfeelt being OK with Worf taking the Defiant out to use as his personal taxi/airline. At most I can see him taking a Runabout, but even that would be a bit much, the more reasonable idea would be to take a shuttle to the nearest starship going to or within shuttle range of Earth. That or simply boarding a chartered vessel docking at DS9 and going to Earth, they must still have the space equivalent airlines in Trek.
Sisko's suitability for that mission may have been deemed by Starfleet command as impaired by feelings of vengeance from losing his wife at the Battle of Wolf 359. Just my humble opinion.
I love that it 'defies' the conventional Starfleet design of saucer section, secondary hull and naecells.
I think the reason the defiant didn't do well against the cube is that they were meant to hunt in packs
That's what I always felt.
Perhaps. But I don't quite understand why it is felt that the Defiant didn't "perform well" against the cube. Isn't the concept of "well" a relative question? The cube was, clearly, in far worse shape than the one that attacked in BoBW. There is no on screen evidence to indicate which ship caused all of this damage. I'm not suggesting it was all inflicted by the Defiant, but clearly something had improved, with Star Fleet having closed the technology gap, somewhat. This, alone, is quite impressive given that the Borg will have been acquiring new technology in the intervening years. Personally, I've always felt that the Defiant, and other Federation ships, performed markedly better than previously; therefore they, arguably, performed "well". However, if you define "performing well" as meaning being decisively better than the cube, and capable of causing devastating damage against it, then it failed to do that. However, the technological leap from BoBW to FC would have been enormous, and a little difficult to swallow.
My favorite ship in all of Star Trek. Great video, guys!
One of my favorite ships
Great review guys. I’ve always loved the Defiant class ship as its smaller and different than the larger Federation class ships. It’s a tough little ship and I’d take it over the Galaxy or Sovereign class ship any day.
Well they don't serve the same purpose. Defiant is a straight-up purpose-built warship.
Thank you for this completed episode, and thank you for keeping it Canon!
Great job and beautiful visuals to go along with it!
I've been rewatching DS9, so this was very Timely! Also appreciate the full episode with Canon on-screen information. But for the life of me I've never heard an acceptable explanation for that snout. It happens to Nestle in well with the assign but other Federation ships were able to dock elsewhere. And when they designed the defiant they didn't know they were going to even be taking possession of DS9. No other Federation ship has a design that even close to this protruding front proboscis. I wonder why this was signed off on, it would have looked cool with just a rounded front end and maybe a roll bar for detail like the reliance?
I agree, I wish it didn't have that nose part and rather had a cavity with a deflector recessed, the nose is angled and weird.
The antimatter mines from Star Trek: Armada are semi-canon -- the minefield from season 6 was deployed by the Defiant.
If they're on screen, then they're Canon. I had a Texas Instruments Star Trek game when I was a little kid, and it had mines also, but I don't expect everything from every Star Trek game ever made to be considered even remotely Canon. That space mines? Absolutely. We've seen him in several episodes on different series I believe.
@ Dale Stafford "If they're on screen, then they're Canon. "
... STRONGLY DISAGREE. Star Trek V: The Final Frontier clearly shows on screen that the Enterprise A has in excess of 78 decks which would make it over 3 times the vertical height of the Enterprise refit and almost twice larger vertically than the Galaxy class. So what we see on screen can sometimes be a lazy, absurd, diarrhea-like sh*t on canon and an insult to the intelligence of the fans.
It's my second favorite ship after the absolutely gorgeous Enterpriser refit of the TMP era. Glad you guys gave it another episode including touching on some of the arguments from the comments section of the earlier episodes.
Great video, gentlemen! I love the Defiant... I used to like it more for what it could do than how it looked, but now I just love the whole thing. One of Ronald D. Moore's best creations.
Love this episode thank you guys for doing it the defiant is one of my favorite ships. Great work as always!!
In terms of the USS Defiant "failing" at the Battle of Sector 001, nothing could be further from the truth. We know Starfleet set up multiple perimeters against the Borg Cube and the Enterprise arrives at the last perimeter and the Defiant is still dealing significant damage to the Cube despite being one of the first ships to be involved in the battle. Tough little ship indeed!
Yeh and I’d have thought that had the design issues been worked out earlier, the Defiant-class would have been sent in groups or even fleets against the Borg. As it was they only had one in tike for Sector 001.
The Defiant is prob my fav ship, in DS9 at least. Just for the sheer power it packs in a compact space but with refinement, and there's doses't seem to be waisted space. It would be a great Klingon ship, probably why Worf like's it so much. Great episode again guys.
I remember when I saw the defiant for the first time during the shows first run, that it was awkward looking with its nacelles canted out like that on the sides. But it grew on me and I later wished they would have showed more ships using that compacted design language.
Great discussion on that tough little ship. Thanks again for an enjoyable video. After 2 years of checking out the channel on and off I finally subscribed. Better late than never. Lol
The first time it was deployed with the cloaking device, like you said, it felt like an old WW2 U boat lol I can only imagine what it was like to get it ready for deployment,"Alright, lets check our provisions before we set off...Damn it, who put beans on the list!? I said NO beans while on board the Defiant! Tim! Wheres, Tim!? He did this, didnt he!?"
I always liked this design a lot. One of the few Star Trek designs where the exterior looked truly proportional to the amount of interior space the ship was supposed to have.
Squadrons of defiant class ships. Have three in each. That's three crews totaling 150. Each Defiant had the fire power of an Akira didn't it?
I still say we saw pulse phasers in TOS.
On more than one occasion.
I don't remember pulsed phasers in TOS.
I DO have a plausible explanation for the pulsing of the phasers in TWOK. In TMP, Decker explains that the new phasers draw power directly from the warp engines making them significantly more powerful. Perhaps due to so far inadequate emitters in the Enterprise refit and Reliant phaser banks, the phaser power has to be pulsed in order to not overheat or damage the emitters.
With the advancements in emitters materials and collimated phaser strips of TNG, warp supplied phaser power is manageable. But, with the Defiant, it's all about ramping up phaser destructive capability so the pulse phaser emitters are directly adjacent the warp nacelles so directly in line with the power conduit for the warp system and thus has an even more effective increase in power. Also, a continuous stream of phaser beam is a constant stream of that power, but if you pulse it, then you can overcharge a shot, fire it, overcharge the next shot and fire it, and so on so you effectively boost each shot's power. Also think of the effect at the receiving end. A slightly lower power, continuous stream can strike the surface and melt or disintegrate the hull, but a higher intensity pulsed shot gives it more kinetic energy as well. Kinda like pushing a hammer on a car's windshield with constant pressure may not break it, or at least only make a spider-web like crack, but a tap and repeated taps will punch a hole right through it.
I love this ship. I play Star Trek online and use it all the time
I am thinking it only connects to the docking port from the front. They disembark on the side of the front pod, like an air plane gate bridge. They do not exit through the defector at all, just looks like it.
That would make a certain amount of sense because I could never figure out how the Defiant was supposed to have docked with DS9 there's 0 indication of some sort of docking connection in the nose and even the tech manual isn't too clear on how it was supposed to have docked.
Starfleet has all the tactical prowess of a litter of kittens. 😂🤣🤣
I like how you will back to ships and do updated reviews as if to fine tune your craft and produce some great videos! Thank you.
We want to be the definitive place...and with the renders we can do, we can do these better than anyone else out there so we owe it to our fans!
@@SGUDistantHope Heard.
My favorite ship. Thanks guys.
Nothing like starting the episode with another dad joke; I love it! 😜
I always thought of it like it was Captain sisko's hot rod
I just finished watching a video of some journalist railing against the new us zumwalt class destoryer.
Makes imagine some talking head of the Federation News Service complaining about the Defiant Class.
"It's a useless ship designed to fight the Borg....or so they say. Seem more like a pork project by the local Martian government to bring more jobs to the ship yards"
IDK, comparing the Zumwalt class to the Defiant? The USS Defiant was intended as a "beefy runabout", small but as powerful as possible. The Zumwalt class on the other hand is a multi-mission, multi-role, jack-of-all-trades (master of none?) battleship, packed with the latest high-tech gadgets and gizmos - the only actual novel tech of the USS Defiant is the cloak (and that was not included in the other ships of its class).
So no, I politely disagree.
I’m trying to look at it with the same narrow mindset the federation has. They love jack of all trade master of none ships. They would look at such a limit ship as a waste. All it can do is move fast an lay down impressive amount of fire power.
It’s not good for exploration, not good for scientific missions an I’m sure the idea of a dedicated combat ship would be controversial for the whinny “were not a military were explorers” crowed.
How many ships from eaglemoss do we have to buy for the code to work? Says the code is expired.
WHAT? Your order has to be over $50 thats all, the code shouldn't be expired!!! I'll look into that!
@@Trekyardswebseries Yea, mine was about $140. Thank you. Prob a simple glitch. :) Excellent video as always!
StillsTheSeries E-mail Eaglemoss also. Maybe they will give you credit or a future additional discount.
@@Trekyardswebseries "This item is not eligible for use with promo codes or discounts."
Especially great animation/renderings on this one, Samuel!
Thank you sir!
didn't the Yorktown become the Enterprise a?
I wonder if starships where using the Delitheam crystal's from the TOS episode Thorugh the looking glass? That the crew of Enterprise was negotiating for..
Dilithium?
what are those Squares on the Back? is that ever explained? The circular blue parts are part of the emergency warpcore ventilation system. But that square parts i can't find an explanation for.
Great video as always. Thank you both very much. The Enterprise A was originally the Yorktown if in not mistaken and the Enterprise E was the Sovereign.
No. If the Sovereign was re-named the Enterprise, then it would have been the lead ship of the Enterprise class. A new Sovereign class ship in the yards was designated the new Enterprise and Picard and his crew were transferred to it after the loss of the D.
Best ship in ALL trek history.
I love the Defiant. My favorite of all time is the Constitution class from TOS movie era. The Excelsior class. The Defiant. Then Voyager. I also like the Enterprise C, I find its design interesting and the Stargazer.
Quote Commander Riker, it's a tough little ship!!
Little?
...and Lieutenant Riker.
Regarding the Borg invasion, I think Sisko was on a mission in the badlands at the time. However, much like Starfleet keeping Picard and the Ent-E out of the way to pick up the pieces of the Federation and Starfleet if the armada failed, Sisko would likely also have been kept out of the fighting, as at the time, the Dominion War was happening.
Sisko being the Emissary had a special relationship with Bajor, and Bajor's co-operation was considered vital in keeping a Starfleet presence at the mouth of the wormhole aboard DS9. As such, risking such an important figure in the defence of Earth, when Worf was able to fill that role, was redundant and risked losing Sisko and a role only he could fill.
The Dominion War hadn’t started yet (Sisko references the Borg attack just before the Dominion fleet comes through the wormhole) even though the stardates are a bit muddled. I agree though that Starfleet would have told Sisko to stay away, if only because he could cause problems for the battle if he went off on his own to try to avenge his wife.
Wasn't Sisko trying to thwart a Marquis plot with Eddington in the Badlands around the time of the battle of sector 001?
I think the stardates are a bit messed up, but it’s about the same time. And you know if Sisko had been at the battle and given his history with the Borg, he would taken out the entire cube with his bare fists! He was probably told to stay home like Picard was.
Was the Sao Paulo re-christened the *Defiant- A* ?
I don't remember, and I honestly don't understand why they would rename the ship since it didn't have a long and storied past like the Enterprise did, they could have just assigned the Sao Paulo to DS9 and kept that name?
No...USS Defiant. we mention that in the episode!
I am watching it again, I missed that detail. That's a break with tradition, but if there is any continuity in Trek at this point I guess that there rarely is continuity! ;)
Aye... because they wanted to be able to use the previous season's graphics. I really think they could have reused stock footage on the standard TVs of the time and no one would have noticed because they rarely lingered on registries, but I trust that is the fact!
I think keeping the name but changing the registry would have been right. The ship and crew earned the name with its service before and during the war.
I could go either way with the name, but it did need to have an A added, and then just use whatever special effects they needed to, because like I said they don't Linger on the small font name name and registry especially on TVs and effects of the era, so why not say yes we gave you another one this is now the Defiant-A, good luck? It seems like if they can go through the trouble to make the digital effects to blow the defiant up that they could have touched up some of the other footage if absolutely necessary.
I have both sizes and I had a friend make a custom job for me as a graduation present. USS James A. Baldwin. It is rather sick!!!!
Seems like a logical design. All components in one tight package....no pesky appendages to shoot off. Although...other classes with appendages look very nice!
I would love a video about why Voyager didn’t went to the Bajoran Wormhole in the Gamma Quadrant and the dangers that the crew might have encountered traveling in that Direction,Hope to see your version of the theory.two TH-camrs have already talk about this topic that has been on the internet for years .Certified Ingame and Lore Reloaded
The original plan was to destroy the Defiant in FC, until the folks on DS9 complained mightily.
Another trivia bit, a large part of the design calls back to some of Matt Jefferies' preproduction concepts for the original Enterprise.
As for the docking port issue, perhaps the deflector flips up inside the nose, with some sort of docking port tunnel setup behind.
This was a neat review. Thanks guys! 🖖😀
She was why I started watching DS9...that and the Jem Hadar destroying a Galaxy Class Starship.
Its like the AUDI of starships customized for specific task speed , power and classy loved it since the first episode it appeared
The name Defiant fits -was supposed to only use the cloak in gamma quadrant and with a Romulan onboard -they were defiant on all that LOL.
The phase cloak on this vessel would have been amazing. To bad they couldnt have made the deflector weapon ,the ent D used against the borg, a main stay and usuable regenerative option.
The reason Defiant had to drop out of warp to not be detected had nothing to do with his power signature. It had to do with cloaked ships operating at warp speed emit a slight of sub-space variance. Did you not see the episode where the defiant was captured by the gemhadar?
Consider the size of the ship when talking about the battle with the Borg. It was never meant to be a flagship to lead a fleet, so the fact it took so much fire from the Borg and kept going, I'd say it answered the call of duty, then some. Now the Enterprise, that's a flagship, I'd expect it to not even blink against the Borg.
Also, I never knew the Nova class was that tiny, it's about the size of the Defiant! No wonder such desperate measures had to taken when one ended up in the delta quadrant. They were essentially stuck in a tiny tin can alone on the other side of the galaxy. It's a miracle they ever got as far as they did in the Equinox.
Just had a thought...as you would want to deploy the defiant quickly given it's role you would think they would back it in...there is also plenty of room for the airlock in her rear! Perhaps a suggestion worth throwing out there if they ever remaster the show lol
I was thumbing through a dictionary the other day and I stumbled across the phrase "Bad Ass". A picture of the U.S.S. Defiant was used as an example. 😉
Never loved the Defiant, though some of the concepts were awesome. Always wished that the nacelles moved depending on need, ie combat or speed modes.
So like the BOP wings that move up or down in different configurations.
I love most Trek designs but this ship is in my top 3. First is Connie/Connie Refit, Defiant, and Akira.
Star Fleet LIED and broke its treaty obligations by gratuitously using the Romulan cloaking device in the Alpha Quadrant?! Oh say not so! Star Fleet is as clean as the driven snow -- snow driven to Section 31! 🤣🤣🤣
Hope you will do a video like this on the sovereign class.
We hope we will get 10-20,000 views and can do this sort of A* video soon.
The Defiant as a single vessel against a single Borg cube is only going to so much, it I assume was meant as a swarming sort of class to overwhelm the Borg with multiple heavily armored and armed ships with near fighter like manueverabilty. Meanwhile the other ships in the fleet could pound on the Borg ship from a safe distance without worry of getting hit while planing the next assault on it. In the end Starfleet made cheaper ships with similar capabilities like the Norway and Steamrunner classes as well as bigger and just as heavily armed and armored ships like the Akira and Soverign classes while upgrading older classes like the venerable Excessior with Defiant tech.
There's actually an episode of DS9 when someone talks to Worf about a future stardate (which is when the movie happens) and Worfs says he'll be at Earth at that time. It was planned for the Defiant to be there with just Worf in command.
oooo which episode?
@@SGUDistantHope Only ones I can think of are Homefront/Paradise Lost when Worf takes the Defiant to Earth and fights the Lakota and when O’Brien tells him Keiko is pregnant and he says he’ll be very far away on Earth when she gives birth. I think both are too early for First Contact though.
One possible reason for Sisko not being in First Contact would have been him recovering from the visions around the discovery of B'hala.
He was probably told to stay home just as Picard was. You wouldn’t want him trying to avenge his wife singlehandedly in the middle of the battle!
Im a Defiant fan. It's like a mustang Cobra with two 50 caliber guns on the front.
P.S. The Defiant wasn't designed to take on a Borg cube alone. There was supposed to be a fleet of them so it makes sense that it got beat up in the borg battle. If there say 10 or more zooming around the cube laying into it nonstop with pulse phaser cannons and quantum torpedos then I imagine the result would've been different.
Feds are stupid and would never make more than one.
Remaining cloaked didn't require stopping, it was an expreiment that they thought might help with sophisticated Dominion sensors. It wasn't used again because it failed spectacularly
The original USS Defiant didn't get destroyed quickly. She was underfire and unable to defend herself for some time. It took awhile for the crew to abandon ship. And they were away and watched her take much more punishment before she was destroyed!
U.S.S. Defiant - because U.S.S. Sisko's Muthafukkin Pimp Hand NX-74205-FU wouldn't fit on the hull.
I always thought that the Defiant looked like it was suppose to socket into a much larger ship.
In the DS9 technical book by rick sternbach, it is mentioned on a page, that the defiant class is based on the nova class. Or in other words: defiant class is sort of a nova class refit. Wonder why it is never mentioned on youtube clips about the defiant
Because thats not technoically true. A defiant concept ended up being re-used as a Nova...and included in the manuel as something interesting. The USS Defiant and Nova class designs are radically different and in no way is the Defiant a Nova refit, the Defiant was designed from the ground up for a purpose...the nova class was designed from the ground up for a diffrent purpose. Fun alternate sketches dosent make real canon...and that was never said on screen..where as it was said it was a custom build ship in canon so i take the canon :)
@@SGUDistantHope maybe you're right. But if you check both ships by their seize, proportions and look, it's clear both must be related. I'll have to check that book again. I've read it allmost 20y ago
@@dascz1 their look? they have totally different looks lol? There is however the Defiant which is just a Nova with forward torpedo launches...which Rick then turned into the equinox...this look like the equinox but i dont think anyone would say the canon equinox and canon defiant look anything alike except their paint schemes...and even that is different really..i have both of the original 3D models from Star Trek so know both ships very very well.
Like the ship. Not so crazy about the chain-link fencing in the rear of the nacelles.
What Technical Manuals could I get that would showcase Star Trek Ships like these and others , and where could I buy them at ? Online or at some Stores like Half priced books ? Anybody ?!?
Probably the only Eaglemoss I’d get in the standard size. All the others would be XL.... for scaling reasons
I believe that the docking ports are on the sides of that front deflectorpod.. Not in the actual front.. If i remember my DS9 games properly that is.
Can you do the sabre class please
We have already done the Sabre. Search Saber and Trekyards in TH-cam!
Genial comparacion de tamaños en 13.02!!!!
Captured during the first mission against the Dominion
The defiant did awesome against the borg. It was one of the 1st waves to hit it and was still going. It was not designed to be a lone wolf cube killer (sto excluded) and was part of the newer designed ships with waves that compliment each other including the akira steamrunner and Norway. Which was part of the task force in the attack. And not forgetting the oberth 🤦♂️🤷♂️ with its 1 phaser
That's 2 Phasers. (Allegedly) Does an Oberth ever fire on screen?
Are your shots of the Defiant and DS9 from a Remastering, Star Trek Online, or something else? I’ve never seen these two in such high quality video before. 🤔
i created them new for this vidro, along with all the beauty stills.
I read that the Defiant has 3 times the fire power of a Galaxy class starship.
To the best of my knowledge there are no solid numbers for Defiant's firepower compaired to other ships, however as far as I can recall the Galaxy was only ever shown firing 1 Phaser at a time, Defiant usualy fires its 4 Phaser cannons together (often backed up by Quantom Torpedoes to a Galaxy's photons), realisticly Defiant is able to concentrate its firepower far better than a Galaxy so I choose to believe that the Galaxy does in total have as much or more firepower but Defiant is much better at focusing its firepower on a single target than a Galaxy making Defiant's firepower 2-3 times as effective.
@@terryforsdyke306 Given both the Defiant and Voyager were able to fire both Quantum and Photon torpedoes from the same launchers, it seems hard to imaging the Galaxy class would not get that capability relatively soon after we saw them introduced. Even if it required a retrofit that does not even seem on the level of several repairs done offscreen between TNG episodes.
The Galaxy class doesn't have pulse phaser cannons.
it is likely that a Galaxy could be refitted to carry Quantom Torpedoes, but it was not for the Dominion War, and you would figure that if it was a simple modification that would have been done, but I do not believe any Galaxy was ever shown firing Quantom Torpedoes.
yes, the refitted Dominion War era Galaxy had (if I recall correctly) 15 phaser arrays but the Defiant was (as far as I can recall) the only class with Phaser cannons.
the lack of Quantoms on ships like the Galaxy, Miranda, Interped, Akira, Sabre.
the only Federation ships known to use Quantom Torpedoes are the USS Lakota (a refitted Enterprise B type Excelsior theorised to be a recommisioned NCC1701B) as well as the Defiant and Soverign classes, this sugests the people incharge of wartime upgrades for Starfleet ships are hopelessly incompetant.
@@terryforsdyke306 seems to me the criteria for designing q torpedoes would have been "must be able to fire from current launch systems", so they could have been rolled out immediately - no refit needed. it was unnecessary writing.
My fave tough little ship
Apparently in First Contact, the Defiant was originally going to be destroyed but the DS9 writers complained and it was changed. Thankfully...
How about the ISS Defiant from the DS9 Mirror episodes
Yes, the Terran Rebellion Defiant that fought Alternate Worf’s Klingon ship had a standard phaser array and I don’t remember the Prime Defiant ever using one.
@@elainepeters3295 The prime Defiant used a normal phaser array (positioned somewhere near the bridge) during its battle with the Lakota in Homefront/Paradise Lost.
The Defiant did not fail against the Borg cube. No Starfleet built ship can take out a cube by itself.
3:20 - The "Romanoffs"??? LOL! Commander Mumbles does it again. Great video guys, favorite ship in Trek. Question - Cdr Cockings, are you doing the 3d rendering we see in this vid of DS9 and the Defiant etc? Incredible, whoever, whatever, the best Trek rendering I've seen, better than the original DS9 first 3d work with the Defiant. Again, great video here...
yes all the animations were me :D thank you! the best??? :O :O
Commander Mumbles?? Well....that’s sorta rude.
@@Trekyardswebseries Sort of been an ongoing joke, I've called him that since I subbed when you had 2200 subscribers, as I've always found it hard to understand him at times, and have made numerous (humorous) points over the years about this. You even responded and agreed once. I can post links if you want. Not meant to be rude, just an accurate nickname.
is it me or does the defiant make the equinox look small?
The Equinox is small :)
@@SGUDistantHope But somehow has almost double the crew of the Defiant!
This is not the first Starfleet military ship. What about the Dreadnought?
would of been sweet if the defiant was lost in the first contact movie and ds9 got an akira class as a replacement.
It never made sense given the lack of space and likely lack of long term assignment that such a ship would have a captains ready room much like the Intrepid class having such an enormous ready room
i never understood cloaking. originally i thought it was and integrated system - which made sense to me, you couldn't steal a cloak from a ship because it was a part of the ship like life support. then they made it a portable device that could be attached to vehicles basically at will, and i think it all went downhill from there.
the cloak didn't work properly on defiant because it wasn't designed to have one, wrong hull shape, wrong hull metallurgy, ad-hoc power setup, it wasn't a surprise that the dominion spotted them immediately and said "what's that? oh, it's an invisible ship, just let them go and see what they are up to, play along pretend their cloak is working... OH - WHERE DID THEY GO? THERE WAS SOMETHING HERE JUST A MOMENT AGO! OH WELL! I GUESS I WILL JUST GO BACK TO MY PATROL ROUTE NOW! DOO-DE-DOO-DE-DOO..."
... so basically you weren't familiar with the TOS episode, "The Enterprise Incident" where Kirk was able to steal a Romulan cloaking device... by hand.
... either that or it all went downhill 48 years ago in the 3rd season of TOS, which is not true... it started going downhill in the movies with Star Trek V: The Final Frontier or on TV with Star Trek Enterprise... fully rock bottom with JarJar Abrams Star Trek and Star Trek Discovery.
My favorite ship
Before Voyager and First contact made a great leap in ship designs towards intrepid, Norway, Saber, Akira etc, TNG type ships were boring, (except for the vorcha); specifically starfleet ships were boring. 1993 or 1994, I can't remember, but the introduction of the Defiant to DS9 got me interested starfleet ships for of the 24th century.. TNG/DS9 story-lines were great but galaxy was ugly. New Orleans was kinda interesting, Excelsior cool only in the motion picture era, but old news in TNG, so I was extremely grateful for the outside thinking that went into the defiant! TMP is still my favorite design era of ships, but Defiant, and most things that came after the artists designed Voyager, saved TNG and post TNG for me.
Defiant was an LA class sub for the 24th century, one of the reasons I love her!
At this point I'm going to question why they chose the name Defiant in the first place. When discussing Trek, and you say Defiant, the person could say:
Oh you mean the one in the original series that Kirk was trapped on? No. Oh do you mean the episode of Enterprise where they found the ship in the Mirror Universe? No. Do you mean the episode of Discovery that it showed up on their scanners? No. You mean the ship that Khan took over ? No. That's Reliant not Defiant. Then you must mean the little ship from DS9 with a cloaking device? No. I mean the second version of that ship without the cloaking device...
See what I'm saying? There's so many great and storied names out there for Starships that they could have gone with something completely new when they first introduced it, and then new again when it was destroyed.
Some would argue that the Defiant when it showed up should have been Defiant- A in the first since there had already had been a famous ship with that name, and the replacement would have been the Defiant - B, but I guess since the numbers after the name were different they thought that was enough to differentiate it for the audience...
I wonder who at Starfleet decided to name that ship after the ghost ship that lost its entire crew and mysteriously disappeared and trapped Kirk in the first place. Usually they retire names like that.
A Rose by Any Other Name...
They say don't complain about a problem without presenting a solution. My personal favorite would have been Vanguard, one of the best battleships built for the Royal Navy, and of course Nelson and Duke of York also had incredible histories.
But they ignore the British Navy far too often in favour of American names, which I understand for the original series since its audience was probably ninety-plus percent American.
By the time of DS9 though, Trek was a known International phenomenon and I wish they would include Canadian Australian and British ships more often in their naming conventions. Especially now, since Trek is filmed in Canada anyway.
Enterprise/ Enterprize gets a pass for belonging to all English-speaking navies at one time or another.
I remember they chose Valiant as the name first, but producers were already working on Voyager and didn’t want people to confuse them. And this is just my own thought, but I think the word “defiant” goes well with Sisko’s personality. In universe, maybe the Admiralty thought it had been long enough to bring back that name and that the name described the Federation’s attitude about the Borg after Wolf 359.
I assume the name was based in the fact it was made to combat the Borg, it is to defy or in defiance of the Borg.
The original name was going to be Valiant. However the DS9 producers were told flat out that they could not use a name starting with V. (Because Voyager)
That's a good point about using the name Valiant and having another ship on at the same time as Voyager that more casual viewers might get them confused. I still think they should have done something other than defiant though.
At that time Warf was commander of the Defiant.
I agree with Probert: this design violates Roddenberry’s Rule of Two.
I get the lack of A being due to budgetary reasons in the real world but didn't you say in one of your previous episodes that _only_ the Enterprise was allowed to have a letter after the registry? Anyway thanks for this episode, the Defiant is one of my favourite ships from my favourite Star Trek. It really was a welcome departure from the early TNG pacifistic Star Fleet.
I don’t think it’s been stated in canon that only the Enterprises get letters, but we’ve only ever seen the Enterprises get letters. All other reused name ships (including the Defiant itself, coming after the Constitution-class one) got new unique registries.
Starfleet should have had a fleet of Defiant class ships.
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