Eminem truly has ruined an entire generation of white rappers... himself included. also, for any Eminem diehards: El-P's always been better, especially now.
Born in 1997, the cutoff year for being a millennial. However, if you're my age, 25/26, you got called a millennial into your adulthood, until around 2020. I was suddenly reclassified, despite the culture I was subjected too during my formative years being very different from what true zoomed are experiencing. I don't remember 9/11, but I did play roller coasted tycoon on a floppy disk, and was cogniscent during the 00's paparazzi chaos, I remember rock music being the it thing in commercial music. I don't mind being nestled where I am in culture and time. My graduating class was the actual last group of kids to remember life without social media. We could feel the ground shifting as we aged. This is attributed to the millennial experience but its imo, the classic zillenial experience. Millenials pushing 40 didn't just grow up without social media, they went to college without it too. Kids around my age were in the actual throws of massive change during their adolescence when it comes to mass communication, media, etc. True millennials adjusted to all this shit as actual adults.
When I was 9 there was no social media at all. By age 14 we had Facebook and Instagram, soon to follow snapchat. Tik Tok wasn't popular until I was already out of college and largely divested from social media. Anybody see my point in here? For real cause, idk how well I am making it, lol. There's misconceptions about who was affected by what cultural shifts when. Millenials got to cook their brains slightly more before being thrown online. Pre zoomers were introduced to social media in their tweens and teens, and zoomers never lived without its omnipresence.
I'm in my thirties and like my favorite songs of the 60s just as much as my favorites from the 70s, 80s, 90s, 2000s, etc etc. Good songs are timeless and there will always be artists out there who learn to write well. But I do believe it's easier to get lost in the noise if you don't put effort in finding what you specifically like. It seems as a lot of people get older, they get lazier or care less about putting in effort to finding good stuff, and then they throw their hands up and say "welp I spent 5 min and couldn't find anything new I like, therefore all new music must suck!" 🤷♀️
@@OurgasmComrade I meant more that there was loads of disposable garbage music in any time period, but it just gets forgotten. The good stuff survives, giving the impression to the casual observer that music used to be better than it is today.
I grew up thinking the 70s had the best music. As I grew older, I started seeing a lot of Gen Z talking about the music that came out when I was a kid, in the same way that I used to talk about music from the 70s. "It's so much better than music today", and "I was born in the wrong decade", that sort of thing. Then I started to realize that there's a TON of music from the 70s that just sucks.
@@matthewclements3476 what you are choosing not to validate though is that the music industry has become increasingly manipulated by politics and money grubbing and Lou Perlman like influences and nepotism as well as a widening gap between the classes in the general public, and less and less access to music and art lessons in public schools as well as a more fettered path towards college education as the 2000’s progressed. Also seems worth mentioning the switch from instrument based music to music you could make on a computer at home in your bedroom rather than collaboratively (otherwise known as “jamming”) or in a professional music studio. If you weren’t there than you can’t exactly say your generation has just as much bad music in it as any other generation. I mean maybe? It just wasn’t probably quite as plethoric and at the tips of everyone’s fingers through a machine. Hope this helps. 🤓
@@Rainlichen music as a whole became democratize, there are tons of great rappers/artists/bands today that are able to be experimental becuse they don't have to rely on a record label, there are a ton of trash but it was never easier to ignore it and find true gems, everyone is a hipster now, and its great, even if the radio only plays trash
My grandpa left me his vinyl collection like 5 years before he passed and I remember listening to his favorite songs, the ones he would go out of his way to find for his collection, and something about hearing what he used to jam to brought me some perspective into this man. I felt like I knew him better and I still play his records whenever I want to feel close to him again. Quite honestly the best gift I ever received.
I'm mileanial and I easily older then you 1976-1990 is the millennials, 1991-2005 is the zoomers, 2006-2020 are the Alphas, the newest generation is 2021-2035 is the newest unnamed generation.
@@stevk0_- Generation is a sociology and history thing my take is based on 1946-1960 for baby boomers and generation x is 1961-1975. It's commonly available information off Wikipedia. My background is paying attention in history classes.
Dead End Hip Hop is the channel I’m sure FD was thinking of. Dope channel that’s been putting in work for a decade. They’re in ATL also would love to see some crossover at some point.
was surprised Anthony didn't catch that. he's done videos with DEHH before (like the Alfredo cross-review with them). I don't watch them much (nothing against them-I try to limit what YT channels I watch and am subbed to cuz opportunity costs and I try to follow every genre), but DEHH are super kickass from what I've seen.
Baby Got Back was a masterpiece that transformed American culture and hip-hop and I will brook no disrespect towards the Magnum Opus of Sir Mix-A-Lot. Just as all great visionaries stand upon the shoulders of giants, he stood upon a giant butt like Moses on Mount Sinai and proclaimed the law unto the world, "my anaconda don't want none unless you got buns, hon."
There's always been more crap than anything else. Almost 50 myself, and I get sick of people my age saying the new hiphop sucks compared to the rest. No, there is just as much good and bad now as there ever was. People remember the past as being pure and perfect and only see the bad now.
We come from the era where lots of rappers were militant and had directly run ins with the government (NWA, Ice T, 2Pac, etc). And we always had to defend our music against the previous generation too, now we're making these kids do it. Never thought I'd see the day when we got 'old', I guess we're the one-time rebels who lived long enough to become the establishment.
This, I didn't spend years being forced to listen to the worst music of my own generation just to shit in the next generation for also having bad music out there. People have always been making bad art, it just gets filtered out and forgotten as time moves on. Soon the bad zoomer music will be forgotten too, and all we'll remember is the innovative and interesting stuff, and the cycle will repeat once more.
(I loved the video! This isn't directed at FD just some continued thoughts). A huge HUGE thing oldhead Hip Hoppers don't realize is that us Zoomer rap fans listen to a ton of 90s Hip Hop. Like trust me there is a crossover between 'mumble rap' fans and boom-bap fans because they're both accessible via Spotify, AM etc. Just because the new wave doesn't feature that many traditional lyricists doesn't mean Zoomers don't value them, that's a misconception. Ask any Zoomer Hip Hop head what their top 10 Hip Hop albums are and after Flower Boy, TPAB, MBDTF, Rodeo etc. you'll see them suddenly say an Enter the Wu-Tang or Aquemini or MM FOOD.
No zoomers will put rodeo or flower boy in their top 10. They are not even top 10 in the last decade. Another delusional Tyler and Travis fanboy. You probably a white teenager.
I substitute teach and I was playing music (because it was the second to last day of school) and the middle schoolers were giving me recs that were 50% Ice Cube. (I had to make them google to see if there were clean versions).
I've already accepted it. I spent a lot of 2021 going to used CD shops and building/rebuilding my music collection that reflects my tastes from the 90s and early 2000s. I've got my stereo set up in a room with my PS2 and no internet connected devices. I'm content to sit in my little vault of cultural irrelevance, reflecting on the words of Abe Simpson. "It'll happen to you."
i love your rapport! really feel the point about how stratified music has become and how intentional you have to be about learning about new music, i've taken a breather from spotify because of it.
@@redson4994 Like the middle Child. I kinda feel that too being 24 though to a lesser extent. I still firmly fit in Gen Z but definitely on the older side. Gen Z ain’t just a bunch of hyperactive teenagers anymore. A lot of us are in our mid 20s now which is wild
It’s easy to forget how much packaging was an essential component of an album. One that struck me recently was the first Long Winters record, the photos and writing in the booklet are fully-integrated parts of the story that’s told. Is it even worth redesigning a band’s website to match the theme of the newest album? Everything just looks the same on streaming. I suppose videos are much easier to self-produce these days and there are new affordances that social media provides artists.
I think using album art can still work in some cases if it's done well. I don't know if it's still true, but when K-pop was not yet mainstream but getting more popular in the West, my younger sister was a fan, and bought several albums of her favorite groups because the quality of the whole package (including well-made album covers, a nicely printed booklet with lyrics, a little photo-album of the group, etc) was so well designed. The same also goes for the more hipster-millennial music fans that are into vinyl for its nostalgic qualities. But yeah it's not going to appeal to the masses anymore I suppose.
@@KarlSnarks oh for sure! I was thinking about how that all needs to be more of a supplementary medium now, rather than something that’s a baked-in part of a release.
@@chris_troiano Ah ok, yeah I don't think we'll ever see physical albums become the main form of music consumption again, and album art will mostly be shown in thumbnails. It's a shame that this provides less reach concept-albums. On the other hand, there's enough possibilities to create transmedia-storytelling through album-videos (kinda like what Daft Punk did with their anime album way back, would have a lot of reach on social media), or virtual concerts, etc.
Being the first generation to grow up in the social media age, it'll be interesting to see how millennials interact with pop culture moving forward. I feel you in the sense that I've never been judgemental of those younger than me, so long as it's all in the spirit of having good fun. If someone puts me on a new artist or song, I'm pretty open and like to fuck with new and different things. One other thing I want to add - you were talking about how we're all "stratified" into different algorithms, and I think that has always been somewhat t true to an extent. There are so many different music scenes that reflect different genres and subgenres ... when I knew some DJs from different scenes showing me all the crazy stuff out there that I had no idea existed ... it blew my mind (granted it was largely EDM/Bass/DnB/Electronica/trance/etc/etc). And that's just from the local North American scene. There's so much different music out there ... fuck, there's this documentary/ behind the scenes where Madlib went down to Brazil and went crate-digging for obscure records to sample (of what would become Madvilliany). Part of the "spirit" of hip hop comes from sampling different genres/older music/etc - so to close off your mind to all the potential music out there, really does a disservice to that legacy. Yeah, the old stuff still holds a special place and time in my heart - the 90's era was unique - but newer generations synthesize and birth new music - which is pretty cool too.
I hope some new generation after gen z will grow up and see old people all over internet and say "fuck that, social media is for old timers, we're gonna go offline" lol
I feel that the last few years that older hip hop artists have been better at embracing younger artists vs how they were in the early 2010s . Like the consumers won’t have sophisticated views but the older seem more thoughtful and have learned about to engaged younger artists better
yeah, one of the weirdest conversation about music is when they act like bad music is a new invention, every generation had this template debate about music, like come on, is them memories that bad?
I think as far as shitting on younger gens, experience and perspective are key; nerd culture got appropriated by the mainstream during our gen, something that the previous 2 (maybe even 3 or 4) generations used to oppress those seen as weak for being passionate. Hand in hand with that is the realizations of the role that patriarchy plays in that and other oppression... That being said, there have always been a less vocal percentage of the population that promotes what newer gens do, even if not understanding completely - we just only hear the bitching and whining because it's funnier to the younger and reinforcing the superiority of the older. I'm a 34 year old millenial (35 in 2 days) with two teenagers, and they share in my culture - and the cultures before me - as i celebrate theirs: they know how to wind a phonograph and rewind a VHS, and I make dank AF memes with absurd shit that make them piss themselves laughing... And its mostly because I can appreciate that someone likes something even if I don't, and I passed that to them
I got to agree with Fiq. the 90's were the best era for hip hop. After 2005 it started to mostly sound the same. I don't think there are too many more fresh takes on money hoes cars and clothes anymore. There are a few that I fuck with now but its not many.
Man, I hate how if you have diverse but deep interests the algorithm punishes you. I’m at a crossroads with my photography account on Instagram with the content the algorithm wants me to push
Maybe it's better to have some different accounts for different interests (or clusters of related interests, like photography and film) so that you get the full benefit of every algorithm.
I somehow when I was young noticed the whole generational infighting and decided then I would never participate. I’m almost 40 and have held to that, and similarly I thought y’all (other millennials) were with me on that. I just don’t get it, every generation is different, they all like different things, this is so old hat at this point, we not only have our own experiences but documentation going back centuries of every new generation liking different things than the old, and growing into normal adults, too. After misogyny, trans and homophobia and racism, it is probably the next in line of human behaviors that upsets me the most.
As a newly 18 yr old zoomer I really do enjoy older hip hop/music in general because I feel like music, as time goes on, is turning into a purpose to only make money for companies/brands and not making art. But this could simply be because of the amount of music being made. But it's hard not to feel that way even with acknowledging that music taste is subjective and what I like can be totally different than someone else. And I know there's always been "bad" music but still. Or maybe it's just a waste of time to worry about what media others are consuming.
Funny how I just subscribed to the Needle Drop channel and TH-cam reveals that he's connected to the man, the legend, the one and only F D. Signifier! Love both of you and hope you keep up the great work!
“The youngest of us are in their early 30’s” Is the millennial cut-off ‘91/‘92? Ive got no problem with being considered Gen Z, but having been born in ‘96, I always thought I was right on the line
yeah, I agree that 1996 is the end of the millennial generation. But, on the edges, depending on the environment you grew up in, you might relate more to one gen or the other.
I think it depends, particularly due to class, culture, and geographical impacts. I’m in that Xennial/Oregon Trail generation bubble due to not experiencing a lot of the tech milestones until I moved to the US. Same goes for those raised in restrictive religious upbringing and the like. The generational borders are fluid IMO by 5 years or so at least.
Yeah 1996 could go both ways, depending on who you ask. Even if generational labels can sometimes be useful to analyse differences, their cut-off points are never clear and always contested.
Gen X'ers are sitting here living on the oldies station for a while. Glad you all could join us. the chairs are comfy, the music's great (obviously), and we're all old enough now to do the good drugs and not get in trouble, mostly... :D I mean, Ice-T has been one of my longest musical loves, and he's on a cereal box now.... OH shit, and re: Punk.... One of my city counsellors is Joe Keithley. Musical folx may know him as Joey Shithead from DOA.... He was born and raised here, and DOA still plays shows... He seems to not suck...
I actually don't hate the sound of a lotta the new music, for me it's the content and I'll never stop pushing back on it. The empty stuff or feel-good, novelty and turn-up joints I don't mind, wish there was more, but ideally it has it's place. We had that and it was fun or got left in the dust bin where it belongs. The 80's, 90's, and much of the 00's was where street music popped but it was more reporting back to the masses what happened in the hood and it didn't make it sound nice. At worst it inspired a G aesthetic, didn't really make people wanna go sling rock or do a life sentence for whackin dude from around the way. It was conscious in its own way and was distinct from the good time music and throw away tracks. Today so much is repetitive, ripped off, empty, mostly throw away, mostly saying nothing, mostly just pushing how cool it is to be depressed, suicidal, sippin lean, poppin pills, snorting powder, swillin booze, overdosing, running through women, and all that bs while making having and killin opps seem like a good thing and retaining the worst of our generation's music by being extremely sexist and homo/transphobic and mad materialistic. I don't think gangster rap made people join cliques and tool up, I do see how today's music is influencing kids and how it's devastating people everywhere. The stats ain't pretty and the music is reinforcing a lot of it at best and directly causing a chunk of it at worst. We're seeing way more newer artists dead from ODs or homicides or locked up over all kinds of mess than we ever did back then. Yeah, most talked about smoking grass and sipping some fancy booze, and some like Three 6 Mafia even talked about snorting coke, poppin pills, and sippin lean, but A. it was in the context of cutting loose at a party and B. was largely restricted to the underground. I think what a lotta people call out is petty, superficial, and not that serious. But I do think it's some very real criticisms to have about what's big today and why and I think no matter how ya compare our music with today's there's some real issues I just don't see being addressed.
It has already started happening. I've seen comments on IG talking about how their generation of SoundCloud rap is better than the new generation of SoundCloud rap. It's pretty cringe.
I was just listening, then pulled my phone out… FD, that hair is lookin killer man. I ain’t been to the barber in 25 years, if I live 25 more I probably still won’t go … I’m about to shave the sides and leave the mess on top like I did in 96… my shit never look half that good. Love these B sides dude, keep it up!
I need to get this off of my chest. I'm sick and tired of the notion that "oldheads" can't criticize new hip hop music. At the end of the day, we are all fans. And as a fan, you have every right to give constructive criticism on something that you love. I don't think it's right to insult the fans of a certain artist that you criticize (unless they're toxic fans) but everyone is entitled to their opinion and you should be able to give yours regardless of age.
It's so corny when people get stuck in the past. I grew up with 90s hip hop like Black Sheep, Gangstarr, De La Soul but I can still listen to Thouxanbanfauni or Ski Mask the Slump God and enjoy it just as much. Music evolves and so should you.
To fd's point about whack 90s hip Hop, I understand the point he was trying to make. But he could have used some better examples. Sir Mix-a-Lot (NOT Tone Loc) and Skee-Lo got got famous off of two catchy and well-constructed singles. And on top of that they were skilled lyricists in their own right. Now if you had said something like JT Money with Who Dat I might have agreed.
I wish you didn’t include the clip of the lady rapping to Forgot About Dre cuz I had finally managed to wash the cringe from my system and now it’s back
Also young millennial, and while I don't feel nostalgic towards owning/listening to CD's, I do feel nostalgic towards CD-stores. When I was young these were still pretty mainstream, and my boomer father was really into crate-digging for old CD's, so I have a lot of memories sifting through album art, listening those headphones on the wall that played certain CD's as sample, or just running around. Later on I remember looking through CD's to find new songs to download ;)
Interesting. "Music was better back in the day" is an AGE OLD conversation. All I will say is that "modern hip hop" is oddly both hyper homogenized and stratified at the same time. I truly believe this is because of the shared universe of the internet has created a specifically shared experience which is the life's blood of all creative medium music included. This is amplified by the fact that algorithms now curates a LOT of people's musical taste (especially younger ones). That's how you wind up with a TON of artists with no discernable rapping accent and basically the same tempo and cadence regardless of where they're from. It's baffling. Lol.
God that Eminem video is nightmarishly bad. As if millennials weren’t the first group to cancel Eminem. We already cancelled him in the 90s for rapping about murdering his girlfriend. Of course it didn’t stick because, say it with me y’all, cancelling does nothing. And it’s fine that it didn’t stick, I agree that was overblown. But to act like genz having problems with Eminem is somehow a new take, absurd.
I’m a Whitney and Prince guy. I can listen to anything honestly, but they are always my no. 1 played every year on Spotify. There’s some great new stuff, but a lot of slept on older stuff. Find a balance and don’t hate. I’m in a military family from New Orleans and MOCO MD and Norfolk VA so I like Campy and colorful stuff like Big Freedia and Nicki Minaj, but also like old Jennifer Holliday when she was recording in churches. Random ass picks I love are Kiki Sheard, Aya Nakamura, Maleek Berry, Tasha Paige Lockhart, Shensea, Raon Lee, Pellek, Bree Runway, Cookie Kawaii, and Doechii. Those are a bunch of different things that hopefully everyone can find something in. Obviously, it leans more gay.
Ain't even close to true. More rapping now than ever, if we talking sheer numbers. You just gotta search for it, white people don't care about it so you not gon catch it at the award shows or radio stations tho
@@fede2 and thats unfortunate my mans but I've never seen Indonesia I don't really understand how that would change the fact that it exists, and is probably beautiful
@@fede2 I'm teasing. But for real, look into the styles of rap that you like and the online and local communities those styles have. It feels like a lot of culture and artistry are being destroyed in late capitalism because they aren't all completely marketable, but I promise its out there, you just gotta do the work to find it.
that eminem freestyle gave me sensory overload. thank you editor
They needed to put a warning before that holy shit it was so awful
Eminem truly has ruined an entire generation of white rappers... himself included.
also, for any Eminem diehards: El-P's always been better, especially now.
@@MelMelodyWerner now? As a rapper? Definitely. But come on you're putting him up against someone with at least 1 classic album.
Uncle Melon calling it "the tiktok app" is adorable, and very appropriate for this conversation 😂
Born in 1997, the cutoff year for being a millennial. However, if you're my age, 25/26, you got called a millennial into your adulthood, until around 2020. I was suddenly reclassified, despite the culture I was subjected too during my formative years being very different from what true zoomed are experiencing. I don't remember 9/11, but I did play roller coasted tycoon on a floppy disk, and was cogniscent during the 00's paparazzi chaos, I remember rock music being the it thing in commercial music. I don't mind being nestled where I am in culture and time. My graduating class was the actual last group of kids to remember life without social media. We could feel the ground shifting as we aged. This is attributed to the millennial experience but its imo, the classic zillenial experience. Millenials pushing 40 didn't just grow up without social media, they went to college without it too. Kids around my age were in the actual throws of massive change during their adolescence when it comes to mass communication, media, etc. True millennials adjusted to all this shit as actual adults.
When I was 9 there was no social media at all. By age 14 we had Facebook and Instagram, soon to follow snapchat. Tik Tok wasn't popular until I was already out of college and largely divested from social media. Anybody see my point in here? For real cause, idk how well I am making it, lol.
There's misconceptions about who was affected by what cultural shifts when. Millenials got to cook their brains slightly more before being thrown online. Pre zoomers were introduced to social media in their tweens and teens, and zoomers never lived without its omnipresence.
Same. 97 as well
Same, 94. I feel everything u just said.
Kids born 93-98( I’m included) are labeled this lame ass term: Zillenials. Majority of what you stated is basically the definition for it lol
@@aaronlampkin284 they said that..
Never thought this combination would happen but you guys have a really good rapport. Would love to see more videos of you guys chatting it up.
For real, I'd happily take a Melon x Signifier podcast anyday.
I know right! Some of my favorite content creators on YT
agreed!
“Music used to be better in the past” is the best example of survivorship bias.
I'm in my thirties and like my favorite songs of the 60s just as much as my favorites from the 70s, 80s, 90s, 2000s, etc etc. Good songs are timeless and there will always be artists out there who learn to write well. But I do believe it's easier to get lost in the noise if you don't put effort in finding what you specifically like. It seems as a lot of people get older, they get lazier or care less about putting in effort to finding good stuff, and then they throw their hands up and say "welp I spent 5 min and couldn't find anything new I like, therefore all new music must suck!" 🤷♀️
@@OurgasmComrade I meant more that there was loads of disposable garbage music in any time period, but it just gets forgotten. The good stuff survives, giving the impression to the casual observer that music used to be better than it is today.
I grew up thinking the 70s had the best music. As I grew older, I started seeing a lot of Gen Z talking about the music that came out when I was a kid, in the same way that I used to talk about music from the 70s. "It's so much better than music today", and "I was born in the wrong decade", that sort of thing. Then I started to realize that there's a TON of music from the 70s that just sucks.
@@matthewclements3476 what you are choosing not to validate though is that the music industry has become increasingly manipulated by politics and money grubbing and Lou Perlman like influences and nepotism as well as a widening gap between the classes in the general public, and less and less access to music and art lessons in public schools as well as a more fettered path towards college education as the 2000’s progressed. Also seems worth mentioning the switch from instrument based music to music you could make on a computer at home in your bedroom rather than collaboratively (otherwise known as “jamming”) or in a professional music studio. If you weren’t there than you can’t exactly say your generation has just as much bad music in it as any other generation. I mean maybe? It just wasn’t probably quite as plethoric and at the tips of everyone’s fingers through a machine. Hope this helps. 🤓
@@Rainlichen music as a whole became democratize, there are tons of great rappers/artists/bands today that are able to be experimental becuse they don't have to rely on a record label, there are a ton of trash but it was never easier to ignore it and find true gems, everyone is a hipster now, and its great, even if the radio only plays trash
My grandpa left me his vinyl collection like 5 years before he passed and I remember listening to his favorite songs, the ones he would go out of his way to find for his collection, and something about hearing what he used to jam to brought me some perspective into this man.
I felt like I knew him better and I still play his records whenever I want to feel close to him again. Quite honestly the best gift I ever received.
You mean his “RECORD” collection. Vinyl is a material
Sounds should be here now...
We got sound 👍🏿
Yep 🙏
🙏🏾
I'm mileanial and I easily older then you 1976-1990 is the millennials, 1991-2005 is the zoomers, 2006-2020 are the Alphas, the newest generation is 2021-2035 is the newest unnamed generation.
@@stevk0_- Generation is a sociology and history thing my take is based on 1946-1960 for baby boomers and generation x is 1961-1975. It's commonly available information off Wikipedia. My background is paying attention in history classes.
Dead End Hip Hop is the channel I’m sure FD was thinking of. Dope channel that’s been putting in work for a decade. They’re in ATL also would love to see some crossover at some point.
Lol my 1st thought after he said "guys talking about hip-hop", obvs dehh
F.D. sorta gives me a slightly younger Ken vibe in terms of his hip-hop taste 😂
@@theromakepe4318 FD due to have an iPad in his videos soon.
was surprised Anthony didn't catch that. he's done videos with DEHH before (like the Alfredo cross-review with them).
I don't watch them much (nothing against them-I try to limit what YT channels I watch and am subbed to cuz opportunity costs and I try to follow every genre), but DEHH are super kickass from what I've seen.
@@theromakepe4318 he got sprinkles of Myke with the EL -P love he’s shown too
Baby Got Back was a masterpiece that transformed American culture and hip-hop and I will brook no disrespect towards the Magnum Opus of Sir Mix-A-Lot. Just as all great visionaries stand upon the shoulders of giants, he stood upon a giant butt like Moses on Mount Sinai and proclaimed the law unto the world, "my anaconda don't want none unless you got buns, hon."
That tik tok Eminem Stannette clip is some nuclear grade cringe and really needed a content warning of sorts.
This should be a monthly podcast… you guys have great chemistry….
Guest requests: Shad, Sam Sutherland, buck 65, nardwaur, Sook Yin Lee
100%
bro said nardwuar
There's always been more crap than anything else. Almost 50 myself, and I get sick of people my age saying the new hiphop sucks compared to the rest. No, there is just as much good and bad now as there ever was. People remember the past as being pure and perfect and only see the bad now.
We come from the era where lots of rappers were militant and had directly run ins with the government (NWA, Ice T, 2Pac, etc). And we always had to defend our music against the previous generation too, now we're making these kids do it. Never thought I'd see the day when we got 'old', I guess we're the one-time rebels who lived long enough to become the establishment.
This, I didn't spend years being forced to listen to the worst music of my own generation just to shit in the next generation for also having bad music out there.
People have always been making bad art, it just gets filtered out and forgotten as time moves on. Soon the bad zoomer music will be forgotten too, and all we'll remember is the innovative and interesting stuff, and the cycle will repeat once more.
@@d2dar459 yesterday's barbarians are today's tax collectors and priests - pat the bunny
@@harpsichord409
Right. Loool. 💯
Thank you people forget about all the garbage that has always been made lol. it's just the good stuff that we remember and keep consuming hahahaha
(I loved the video! This isn't directed at FD just some continued thoughts).
A huge HUGE thing oldhead Hip Hoppers don't realize is that us Zoomer rap fans listen to a ton of 90s Hip Hop. Like trust me there is a crossover between 'mumble rap' fans and boom-bap fans because they're both accessible via Spotify, AM etc. Just because the new wave doesn't feature that many traditional lyricists doesn't mean Zoomers don't value them, that's a misconception. Ask any Zoomer Hip Hop head what their top 10 Hip Hop albums are and after Flower Boy, TPAB, MBDTF, Rodeo etc. you'll see them suddenly say an Enter the Wu-Tang or Aquemini or MM FOOD.
I noticed this a while ago with people born from about 92 to 96. It tripped me out. Lol
Yeah the range is always funny my top 5 in no order are Ilovemakonnen, Doom, Young Nudy, Sahbabii and Method Man
No zoomers will put rodeo or flower boy in their top 10. They are not even top 10 in the last decade. Another delusional Tyler and Travis fanboy. You probably a white teenager.
I substitute teach and I was playing music (because it was the second to last day of school) and the middle schoolers were giving me recs that were 50% Ice Cube. (I had to make them google to see if there were clean versions).
Shoutout to KEXP. They play everything and they get performers from everywhere.
I would listen to so much more of the both of you talking on music it’s great
It's like watching the two cool uncles from different sides of the family talking
I've already accepted it. I spent a lot of 2021 going to used CD shops and building/rebuilding my music collection that reflects my tastes from the 90s and early 2000s. I've got my stereo set up in a room with my PS2 and no internet connected devices. I'm content to sit in my little vault of cultural irrelevance, reflecting on the words of Abe Simpson.
"It'll happen to you."
Ah yes it's 2005 again. Ps2. Used cds. I wish I had a record store that isn't barnes and noble.
You're pulling a Fry from Futurama moment lol
Silk the Shocker had a platinum album in the 90s.
and a movie
i love your rapport! really feel the point about how stratified music has become and how intentional you have to be about learning about new music, i've taken a breather from spotify because of it.
i love listening to you two talk about music together
Could watch you two go back and forth over whatever music forever! Love this crossover
I’m 27 and I was always included with the millennials until F.D counted me out :(
I'm also 27 but I figure myself an old zoomer
I’m
29 and I’m def a millennial
It's more relative to your friends/siblings/environment etc than just arbitrary calendar years tbh.
Being 26 is stepping into the golden age of millennials internet and being there for the start of the zoomer net. I feel in between both gens
@@redson4994 Like the middle Child. I kinda feel that too being 24 though to a lesser extent. I still firmly fit in Gen Z but definitely on the older side. Gen Z ain’t just a bunch of hyperactive teenagers anymore. A lot of us are in our mid 20s now which is wild
It’s easy to forget how much packaging was an essential component of an album. One that struck me recently was the first Long Winters record, the photos and writing in the booklet are fully-integrated parts of the story that’s told. Is it even worth redesigning a band’s website to match the theme of the newest album? Everything just looks the same on streaming.
I suppose videos are much easier to self-produce these days and there are new affordances that social media provides artists.
I think using album art can still work in some cases if it's done well. I don't know if it's still true, but when K-pop was not yet mainstream but getting more popular in the West, my younger sister was a fan, and bought several albums of her favorite groups because the quality of the whole package (including well-made album covers, a nicely printed booklet with lyrics, a little photo-album of the group, etc) was so well designed. The same also goes for the more hipster-millennial music fans that are into vinyl for its nostalgic qualities. But yeah it's not going to appeal to the masses anymore I suppose.
@@KarlSnarks oh for sure! I was thinking about how that all needs to be more of a supplementary medium now, rather than something that’s a baked-in part of a release.
@@chris_troiano Ah ok, yeah I don't think we'll ever see physical albums become the main form of music consumption again, and album art will mostly be shown in thumbnails. It's a shame that this provides less reach concept-albums. On the other hand, there's enough possibilities to create transmedia-storytelling through album-videos (kinda like what Daft Punk did with their anime album way back, would have a lot of reach on social media), or virtual concerts, etc.
It's really nice to hear you guys talk about music, culture, etc...and thx to F.D Signifier to make me discover Khadidja Mbowe.
her lil freestyle had me reaching for 911
The youngest millennials are about 26
Right I’m 29 and a millennial
26-27 is kind of the cut-off point, so depending on who you ask 26 year olds are either millennial or GenZ.
The crossover we didn't know we wanted but the one we needed! Wow.
Is there somewhere I can watch the entire conversation between you two I’m pretty addicted at this point.. I need more!!!
Being the first generation to grow up in the social media age, it'll be interesting to see how millennials interact with pop culture moving forward. I feel you in the sense that I've never been judgemental of those younger than me, so long as it's all in the spirit of having good fun. If someone puts me on a new artist or song, I'm pretty open and like to fuck with new and different things.
One other thing I want to add - you were talking about how we're all "stratified" into different algorithms, and I think that has always been somewhat t true to an extent. There are so many different music scenes that reflect different genres and subgenres ... when I knew some DJs from different scenes showing me all the crazy stuff out there that I had no idea existed ... it blew my mind (granted it was largely EDM/Bass/DnB/Electronica/trance/etc/etc). And that's just from the local North American scene. There's so much different music out there ... fuck, there's this documentary/ behind the scenes where Madlib went down to Brazil and went crate-digging for obscure records to sample (of what would become Madvilliany). Part of the "spirit" of hip hop comes from sampling different genres/older music/etc - so to close off your mind to all the potential music out there, really does a disservice to that legacy. Yeah, the old stuff still holds a special place and time in my heart - the 90's era was unique - but newer generations synthesize and birth new music - which is pretty cool too.
I hope some new generation after gen z will grow up and see old people all over internet and say "fuck that, social media is for old timers, we're gonna go offline" lol
I feel that the last few years that older hip hop artists have been better at embracing younger artists vs how they were in the early 2010s . Like the consumers won’t have sophisticated views but the older seem more thoughtful and have learned about to engaged younger artists better
I like the pop music a lot more now than when I was a teenager but the hip hop now.... man it sucks never giving up on that.
I love this collaboration.
yeah, one of the weirdest conversation about music is when they act like bad music is a new invention, every generation had this template debate about music, like come on, is them memories that bad?
4:36 "Shut 'chow mowf" "Sitchow ess in tahm owt" "Spit'n baws"
Notice how her accent completely changed when she tried to rap.
Early 2010s hip hop was dope too
this would make a really fun periodical pod
That oldies music station is so true and cuts kinda deep
What a great conversation guys, seriously!
I love watching people have two conversations at the same time lmao
The 90s have the best metal and rock too
This is a great convo
props to y'all 💯
Ah...90's hip hop...so good...
Love your content and seeing you gain more attention
I think as far as shitting on younger gens, experience and perspective are key; nerd culture got appropriated by the mainstream during our gen, something that the previous 2 (maybe even 3 or 4) generations used to oppress those seen as weak for being passionate. Hand in hand with that is the realizations of the role that patriarchy plays in that and other oppression...
That being said, there have always been a less vocal percentage of the population that promotes what newer gens do, even if not understanding completely - we just only hear the bitching and whining because it's funnier to the younger and reinforcing the superiority of the older.
I'm a 34 year old millenial (35 in 2 days) with two teenagers, and they share in my culture - and the cultures before me - as i celebrate theirs: they know how to wind a phonograph and rewind a VHS, and I make dank AF memes with absurd shit that make them piss themselves laughing... And its mostly because I can appreciate that someone likes something even if I don't, and I passed that to them
I got to agree with Fiq. the 90's were the best era for hip hop. After 2005 it started to mostly sound the same. I don't think there are too many more fresh takes on money hoes cars and clothes anymore. There are a few that I fuck with now but its not many.
Man, I hate how if you have diverse but deep interests the algorithm punishes you. I’m at a crossroads with my photography account on Instagram with the content the algorithm wants me to push
Maybe it's better to have some different accounts for different interests (or clusters of related interests, like photography and film) so that you get the full benefit of every algorithm.
Love to you colabing with some of my fav other channels
"baby got back" may be a novelty track, but at least Mix-A-Lot had some semblance of technical skill and respect for even the idea of rhyme.
I didn't know I needed this colab
I somehow when I was young noticed the whole generational infighting and decided then I would never participate. I’m almost 40 and have held to that, and similarly I thought y’all (other millennials) were with me on that. I just don’t get it, every generation is different, they all like different things, this is so old hat at this point, we not only have our own experiences but documentation going back centuries of every new generation liking different things than the old, and growing into normal adults, too. After misogyny, trans and homophobia and racism, it is probably the next in line of human behaviors that upsets me the most.
Same. I also thought we had decided no thanks after listening to our parents say shit like "your generation just doesn't..."
As a newly 18 yr old zoomer I really do enjoy older hip hop/music in general because I feel like music, as time goes on, is turning into a purpose to only make money for companies/brands and not making art. But this could simply be because of the amount of music being made. But it's hard not to feel that way even with acknowledging that music taste is subjective and what I like can be totally different than someone else. And I know there's always been "bad" music but still. Or maybe it's just a waste of time to worry about what media others are consuming.
And don't get me wrong I still listen to newly released music
I turned 40 last month. All of this is hitting home like a MF 😂😂😂😂
Wow you got Fantano. Big move. Good for you. Major props
Didn't expect this collab
Funny how I just subscribed to the Needle Drop channel and TH-cam reveals that he's connected to the man, the legend, the one and only F D. Signifier!
Love both of you and hope you keep up the great work!
“The youngest of us are in their early 30’s”
Is the millennial cut-off ‘91/‘92? Ive got no problem with being considered Gen Z, but having been born in ‘96, I always thought I was right on the line
yeah, I agree that 1996 is the end of the millennial generation. But, on the edges, depending on the environment you grew up in, you might relate more to one gen or the other.
I've always heard '97 as the cut-off
I think it depends, particularly due to class, culture, and geographical impacts. I’m in that Xennial/Oregon Trail generation bubble due to not experiencing a lot of the tech milestones until I moved to the US. Same goes for those raised in restrictive religious upbringing and the like.
The generational borders are fluid IMO by 5 years or so at least.
I tought that 91/92 was middle/main millennial. The cultural cutoff is doesn't remember the Soviet Union and remembers 9/11.
Yeah 1996 could go both ways, depending on who you ask. Even if generational labels can sometimes be useful to analyse differences, their cut-off points are never clear and always contested.
Gen X'ers are sitting here living on the oldies station for a while. Glad you all could join us. the chairs are comfy, the music's great (obviously), and we're all old enough now to do the good drugs and not get in trouble, mostly... :D
I mean, Ice-T has been one of my longest musical loves, and he's on a cereal box now....
OH shit, and re: Punk....
One of my city counsellors is Joe Keithley. Musical folx may know him as Joey Shithead from DOA.... He was born and raised here, and DOA still plays shows... He seems to not suck...
Happy early birthday unc!!
Happy birthday!
I actually don't hate the sound of a lotta the new music, for me it's the content and I'll never stop pushing back on it. The empty stuff or feel-good, novelty and turn-up joints I don't mind, wish there was more, but ideally it has it's place. We had that and it was fun or got left in the dust bin where it belongs.
The 80's, 90's, and much of the 00's was where street music popped but it was more reporting back to the masses what happened in the hood and it didn't make it sound nice. At worst it inspired a G aesthetic, didn't really make people wanna go sling rock or do a life sentence for whackin dude from around the way. It was conscious in its own way and was distinct from the good time music and throw away tracks.
Today so much is repetitive, ripped off, empty, mostly throw away, mostly saying nothing, mostly just pushing how cool it is to be depressed, suicidal, sippin lean, poppin pills, snorting powder, swillin booze, overdosing, running through women, and all that bs while making having and killin opps seem like a good thing and retaining the worst of our generation's music by being extremely sexist and homo/transphobic and mad materialistic.
I don't think gangster rap made people join cliques and tool up, I do see how today's music is influencing kids and how it's devastating people everywhere. The stats ain't pretty and the music is reinforcing a lot of it at best and directly causing a chunk of it at worst. We're seeing way more newer artists dead from ODs or homicides or locked up over all kinds of mess than we ever did back then. Yeah, most talked about smoking grass and sipping some fancy booze, and some like Three 6 Mafia even talked about snorting coke, poppin pills, and sippin lean, but A. it was in the context of cutting loose at a party and B. was largely restricted to the underground.
I think what a lotta people call out is petty, superficial, and not that serious. But I do think it's some very real criticisms to have about what's big today and why and I think no matter how ya compare our music with today's there's some real issues I just don't see being addressed.
It has already started happening. I've seen comments on IG talking about how their generation of SoundCloud rap is better than the new generation of SoundCloud rap. It's pretty cringe.
I was just listening, then pulled my phone out… FD, that hair is lookin killer man.
I ain’t been to the barber in 25 years, if I live 25 more I probably still won’t go … I’m about to shave the sides and leave the mess on top like I did in 96… my shit never look half that good.
Love these B sides dude, keep it up!
Getting older millennials entering middle age means seeing a lot more actually funny/sad middle-age MEMES online lol
yall could probably do a music podcast
These b sides are what I never knew I needed.
Cutting these chats up like this had made for some good spread out content. Really drew me to b sides. Nice job on playing that YT algorithm game.
I need to get this off of my chest. I'm sick and tired of the notion that "oldheads" can't criticize new hip hop music. At the end of the day, we are all fans. And as a fan, you have every right to give constructive criticism on something that you love. I don't think it's right to insult the fans of a certain artist that you criticize (unless they're toxic fans) but everyone is entitled to their opinion and you should be able to give yours regardless of age.
Hair looks great! Yours too, FD.
There were actually 3 "Whoop There It is" tracks
i wish is an amazing novelty song
been loving these clips but where can we watch the conversation in its entirety??
It's so corny when people get stuck in the past. I grew up with 90s hip hop like Black Sheep, Gangstarr, De La Soul but I can still listen to Thouxanbanfauni or Ski Mask the Slump God and enjoy it just as much. Music evolves and so should you.
Lucas with the lid off!
To fd's point about whack 90s hip Hop, I understand the point he was trying to make. But he could have used some better examples. Sir Mix-a-Lot (NOT Tone Loc) and Skee-Lo got got famous off of two catchy and well-constructed singles. And on top of that they were skilled lyricists in their own right.
Now if you had said something like JT Money with Who Dat I might have agreed.
I wish you didn’t include the clip of the lady rapping to Forgot About Dre cuz I had finally managed to wash the cringe from my system and now it’s back
Despite being the biggest generation, I think Millennials will be a bridge generation.
Her Eminem freestyle single handed lay saved hip hop! #thefutreisingoodhands #passingofthetorch
Horrible trick to have your mics on tin-can level while that lady comes in clear as a crystal rose.
F.D. you listen to that new Drake yet 👀 😂
“They have exhausted notions, because they have not been humbled by life…”
Not Signified forgetting Dead End Hip Hop :(
I missed a lot of the CD stuff. I'm a younger millennial and it's so different. I missed the gen x stuff.
Also young millennial, and while I don't feel nostalgic towards owning/listening to CD's, I do feel nostalgic towards CD-stores. When I was young these were still pretty mainstream, and my boomer father was really into crate-digging for old CD's, so I have a lot of memories sifting through album art, listening those headphones on the wall that played certain CD's as sample, or just running around. Later on I remember looking through CD's to find new songs to download ;)
Come ooon, don't end it on 'and I, like...'!
I hope we'll get more clips.
0:30
Chill! I’m only 29 this yearrrrrrrr 😭😭😭
Why do they look like biracial twins?!?😂
WE GOT SOUND NOW 🥳
👑
Anthony busted out Kendrick for the background of this lmao
Actually the youngest millennials are in their late 20s not early 30s.
Interesting. "Music was better back in the day" is an AGE OLD conversation. All I will say is that "modern hip hop" is oddly both hyper homogenized and stratified at the same time. I truly believe this is because of the shared universe of the internet has created a specifically shared experience which is the life's blood of all creative medium music included. This is amplified by the fact that algorithms now curates a LOT of people's musical taste (especially younger ones). That's how you wind up with a TON of artists with no discernable rapping accent and basically the same tempo and cadence regardless of where they're from. It's baffling. Lol.
Hi FD! Thanks for the content but on this one there is no sound :s
Millennials will always have MF DOOM and Deltron 3030. And maybe Kool Keith and Memphis and Houston stuff when the Zoomers aren’t paying attention…
Wish I was a Little Bit Taller is a shortking anthem
God that Eminem video is nightmarishly bad. As if millennials weren’t the first group to cancel Eminem. We already cancelled him in the 90s for rapping about murdering his girlfriend. Of course it didn’t stick because, say it with me y’all, cancelling does nothing. And it’s fine that it didn’t stick, I agree that was overblown. But to act like genz having problems with Eminem is somehow a new take, absurd.
I’m a Whitney and Prince guy. I can listen to anything honestly, but they are always my no. 1 played every year on Spotify. There’s some great new stuff, but a lot of slept on older stuff. Find a balance and don’t hate.
I’m in a military family from New Orleans and MOCO MD and Norfolk VA so I like Campy and colorful stuff like Big Freedia and Nicki Minaj, but also like old Jennifer Holliday when she was recording in churches. Random ass picks I love are Kiki Sheard, Aya Nakamura, Maleek Berry, Tasha Paige Lockhart, Shensea, Raon Lee, Pellek, Bree Runway, Cookie Kawaii, and Doechii. Those are a bunch of different things that hopefully everyone can find something in. Obviously, it leans more gay.
Millennials only 30s and 40s? What? It's a huge generation ranging of 1981-1996. Anyone who's 25-41 right now is a Millennial
@0:39, actually the youngest so-called millennials are 1995/1996 babies who are in their mid to late 20s.
12:57 so well said
Those old man impulses are there, though. Sometimes I can't stop myself from thinking "Why do they call it rap when nobody's rapping anymore???"
Ain't even close to true. More rapping now than ever, if we talking sheer numbers. You just gotta search for it, white people don't care about it so you not gon catch it at the award shows or radio stations tho
@@casadastraphobia Not seeing it. A lot of it is auto-tuned semi-singing which drives me crazy.
@@fede2 and thats unfortunate my mans but I've never seen Indonesia I don't really understand how that would change the fact that it exists, and is probably beautiful
@@casadastraphobia Eh...?
@@fede2 I'm teasing. But for real, look into the styles of rap that you like and the online and local communities those styles have. It feels like a lot of culture and artistry are being destroyed in late capitalism because they aren't all completely marketable, but I promise its out there, you just gotta do the work to find it.