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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 12 ก.ย. 2024
- Aimee and I go deep on the 8 cognitive functions and discuss John Beebe's definitions of the functions and how they look and are experienced in real life. Hope you enjoy! Watch for part two!
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Saw my face on the subscription feed was like, “Huuuuhhh???” Thank you for having me on your channel! 😊
Yesss I know it took me Forever to get this up! But this video is actually edited unlike all my others so hopefully it was worth the wait. Loved talking with you as always!
While I find the words subjectivity and objectivity are somewhat confusing, one could say
Fi = Embracing subjectivity
Ti= Distancing from subjectivty
So maybe Fi dislikes analysis, because it tries to make their subjective experience more objective? Not sure..
It's always a pleasure to see people elaborate on interesting topics and share their perspective. Thank you. 👍
Really appreciate both of your insights on Fi vs Ti; you following up on your great write up of the blind function's connection to the auxiliary functions especially the cool yet tragic sounding observations of EXFJs use of Ne and having a blind spot for Ni; the continual myth busting on Se and Si's relationship with reflecting and learning from the past and ISFJ's being "boring", your interest in open-ended series as opposed to the finality of movies; the SJs comfort in Disney films, the difference in playfulness between ENTPs and ESTPs...and giving up the SP secret that I only heard from SP Spazz and now you confirmed it!
Wasn't sure what to expect with this being your big come back on April Fool's day using your picture from the "How the 16 Personalities Manipulate you" video, but this interview was no joke! It rocks!
This was excellent, Kate. You and Aimee Y are great interviewers/interviewees. Aimee's "Ti vs Fi"- ESFP vs ESTP Interview with McKenzie video on her channel was one of my favorites, and I heard you being a great interviewee in an interview with one of the great commenters/interviewers/interviewees in this comment section Ghost of Jung, and....you also did an awesome interview with the ENTP Melissa Talks who also did great interviews with him.
Beautiful avatar of such beautiful typists with a beautiful peaceful blue background- greatest color because of its versatility for apparel, nature significance (nature is the most beautiful art), blue having the most shades appealing to both men and women, Bible significance, weighing the pros and cons of blue's impact on mood compared to other colors, so I'm just saying you picked a sweet color for your banner.
But red is my favorite color for a similar reason to how you described your interest in the ongoing second act journey of entertainment series as opposed to the finality of movies with red representing the journey toward peace as opposed to blue representing the peacefulness because I get kind of blue thinking about blue because I like that ongoing second act journey with the hope for peace similar to how I am with entertainment but with certain creative directions leading to not so peaceful discussions since I'm motivated to check out entertainment to be a part of the conversation as well as series jumping the shark such as, despite what Jerry Seinfeld says, Seinfeld dropped down in quality when Larry David left, I prefer finality of movies for the reason of peaceful bonding over entertainment. The Seinfeld characters turned to caricatures...still funny stuff like that Twix episode but...he's wrong...the shark jumped, Jerry. The shark jumped!
Frasier dropped off when Niles broke his marriage and hooked up with Daphne. Cheers declined when Diane left. Simpsons took a dive in Season 9 when Principal Skinner was revealed to not be the real principal or something...I forget...but I finished all those shows and didn't stop watching the Simpsons until Season 20 something until there was an episode that said Homer Simpson cheated on his wife Marge and then I was all crossed armed saying Simpsons should have ended at season 8...but
You were great, Kate! Thank you for having Aimee Y on. She's very good at explaining type and appreciate you both carrying the torch for sensors. Great come back. Thanks again. Looking forward to part 2!
Oh, and speaking of funny Si, the funniest show of all time for me is Impractical Jokers and that has an ESFJ, INFP, ESTP, and ENTJ as the cast and they were all funny! I like a lot of sitcoms but that's the only show that made me laugh!
This interview really shows that the more you know about Type, the harder it is to grasp. Or rather, the less sure you are that you can definitively know about a specific aspect of Type. Appreciate Amy speaking like a true Jungian always using "subject" and "object."
I feel like Kate was struggling to reconcile the way in which Amy was defining certain things with the way her own Ti "knows" them to be
Hahaha yes the Fi doesn't have a structure to it absolutely threw me bc I was always observing it through my own Ti lense. I really appreciate her patience as I tried to see how it was possible to not have an underlying structure 😅
So true. There is a lot of depth and detail to the MBTI.
45:15 - Really appreciate description about Si-Ne, reflection comes with entertaining of possibilities. Since Si-Ne are perceiving functions, healthy Si-dom will make use of Fe data to understand their own perception of relationships and people in order to arrive at conclusions.
57:00 - Totally agree. The word Maintaining sounds like a fantastic word for Si. My own understanding of Si (in a vacuum) is the sensory perception experienced in a personal way. I never understood why change was physically less comfortable for some people, e.g. temperature of how someone likes their soup, things they do before they start their day. etc.
I think That is why one will feel very cared for by Si dom, they will understand why and how you like your physical comfort zone.
Totally agree that ISFJ are interesting and fun to be with. Kids love them. They will come up with games and ideas of play on the spot!
"I prefer to destroy somebody else's argument than creating own" That describes my use of Ti perfectly.
The first thing I do as another Si user is also check my body stats:
- How many hours have I slept. How much more or less is it than my optimal configuration? Then how will this influence me the rest of the day?
- How Is my mood today? Usually a number out of 10 like 6.6/10
The goal is to sort of get to know how your body machine is functioning, like a device that has service checks
Then if results are not optimal (not much sleep and/or not optimal mood) I will try to adapt the day to that because with some tasks its more optimal to be in optimal state while for others it may matter less. Si is very aware of he experiential world and also of how the body influences the mind. Also it seems to me that types with Si will tend to focus on the long term aspects of the body, like like health and such. I find Si types more often seem to believe everything starts with a healthy body, which then affects the mind whereas the Ni/Se types more so believe that when the mind wants something, then the body will be able to follow. (Of course the truth is somewhere in the middle)
Aimee Y has read this from my commenting on her channel; maybe it's useful here too.
At this point, I see Fi as a *smell test* and Ti as a *stress test.* In most of life, you can get to the same place with either one.
But we notice the difference on the edges. Ti will take the time to figure out whether a thing will hold up, regardless of how it seems. That's great for a lot of things, but it's also time-consuming. Fi is able to look at something and be right most of the time on whether a thing will hold up, based on how it seems. So Fi will dismiss some things that it was not good to dismiss, but it also does the best job for anything in which you have a limited amount of time. And those with Fi blind spots (like me) can get into a spot where they wasted a lot of time/money/energy on something that the Fi user could have told them didn't add up.
Also, thank you for all your content. You were one of the first MBTI creators I watched regularly, and now I've made an album with multiple content creators as my singers. So you have been a key component in changing my life.
I agree with the se-si difference, si users definitely remember way more than se users , but the si in the shadow sometimes sticks to some things depending on their importance to you and their effect especially if it's bad because se is sooo sensitive to failure way more than si maybe that's why amy said we remember the point of the situation not to repeat it . I still don't think si users get into bad relationship cycles because of not understanding the point but si-ne has that problem when they get loyal faster and easier than se once they feel wanted with ne but ni wants to be the one wanting even more than wanted although we want both obviously .
I think Si types are less comfortable with their body gettng older, as they can remember like yseterday how it was before..For the Se users their body more seems like a disposable unit that you use to complee your task, but it's sustainability less so seems considered. As long as it still can get a job done, it's ok. For the Si user, they feel a strong connection between their body and being alive and look into the future knowing they will need this same body so its previous to them (that is functions well more so than the aesthetical aspect of it) . I also find Si types to be more scared of dying. To Ne/Si ideas just seem endless dispoable entities, but it always needs that body in the center of it. So in that sense I'd say the Si deep down also identified themselves more with the body, whereas the Ni/Se deep down identifies themselves more with the goal or vision.
Just some Ne ideas though!
Ni is knowing WITH reasoning, but it's not by 1 singular point. It's seeing a bunch of trees and realizing it's a forest, but singular point reasoning is asking "at exactly how many trees (by counting) did you realize?". Ni would just be like "no, I didn't count by the tree. I look at everything (at once or together) and then I understood."
Ti seems to me to be like you said dips into si a bit. I tend to see things and process it a little later. Makes me feel ADD. A bit.
I review my memories a bit with si. I can use NE the preceptive objects to use them to make creative tools. Ti can take preceptions and model them to see if they fit and work. The better the si memory and more accurate the better and more accurate ti can be in some cases. Unless when i create something never thought of. Then it tends to be more NE/ti mostly endevor.
Very good observation on ni and ti differences. Ones a perception of the now and ti can run it through a 3d model to see if the parts fit.
Thats why i can tell someone immediately if their idea will work. But if the model is not correct or incomplete then the idea will not work because of model. Then i have to mentally change the model to make it a new memory.
Thats how it seems to me. I use ti to make models.
45:00 minutes that sounds like me for sure. I cant tell you how many times ive questioned the possibillities of why a relationship ended or went bad. Reviewing memories.
About functions not working without others , it's not that you can just know that with common sense but also i remember dario nardi said a friend of his called dr. Meena something at John Hopkins university did research and found that thinking and feeling , and intuition and sending are indeed polarities which means they are on axes together proving Carl Jung's model
Most of things have a structure in them, whether you conciously realise it or not. You do no have to understand music theory in order to hear that a note was played that did not fit in there. You do not have to be actually aware of the gammar rules in language in order to hear something sounds wrong. If someone says "I'm thinking is car green", pretty much eveyone will register that as being wrong, while good degree of people might not be able to pinpoint why exactly. Ti more so looks for what this (seemingly hidden) underlaying structure is that things are build upon.
I think because the SJ's types so clearly tend to gravitate towards the parent like role in their lives in a sensing way, (responsibile, take care of job or household) when it comes to imagination (intuition) related subjects they tend to be interested in fiction that may be more towards the childlike side. They are the opposites of the NP's who are in a sensing way childlike, but conceptually/imaginative more interested in mature subjects. Part of this concept is what soccionics calls infaniles (NP) and something and the SJ's as caregivers.
For the SJs its indeed the disney and and such stuff and for the STJ's it's more the trains/planes, collecting toys
For the SP's and NJ's this socionics devision was about the NJ's being victems and the SP's the agressors. This problably because SP's seem more chasers. However, then it could be that the roles are turend around in some other field like for example the bedroom or such a thing.
Hi, enjoying your channel. Please can you make a video about ESTP-INTP relationships? And or Ti in general
About ni just knowing : this is not an important point , but here we are just talking , It's like the last comment , maybe if you combine ni with high ti you can actually know why you know because if there's a starting point you can go back to it , that's impractical though cause you'll have to go back to the big bang , but maybe you still can extract some logic in shorter chains too it just won't be the ultimate truth .
About ti physical verification : it's not necessarily a physical verification although at its core if you go very deep along the chain of if this then that you'll definitely end up with a physical thing that we extracted the intutive logical principle from because they are always attached , always 2 faces of the same coin , and with the time these rule became common and accepted so we don't need to go that far each time , it's like now logical rules are floating in the air the whole time around you , I still agree though that common sense is mostly common ignorance when you look at it at a macro level but there is still logic within and it depends on your filter , for ti it's easy to see logic . And about stps checking more physically than ntps cause they are reacting to a physical thing in the moment , I agree , but also we still extract the logical rule from it afterwards and use it in other things that could be physical too or theoretical. It's just cause stps are not high intuition users it may not come on the moment usually.
Gosh I completely agree on ti destroying your argument rather than build its own . Dang , literal.
That's a cool point from amy about te choosing the best argument commonly accepted after ti finished playing , that's the definition of te i know indeed .
Wait, do Se doms not feel "connected" or "disconnected" with themselves? Like the relation between they with themselves, with groups, society, or existence / universe? I thought that is just a universal human experience, that all humans go through.
@30:45 socionics have different structure.. i wonder if it is accepted in the MBTI community
Ni is it like i add more dots to the dots and other people cant see the added dots, the dots i added come from all dots i have mashed up and analyzed to make the new dots LOLOLOL, thats why others dont understand what i am talking about or think i am nuts. 44:28
Same exact thinking process with fi as you , it's so damn difficult.
By the way could you please do a video about the istp-intj romantic compatibility, your opinion and if you want there is an istp girl on TH-cam married to an intj if you want to interview her , her channel is called istp perspective.
That's a cool point about the trickster I didn't think of before , I also know that the trickster is always competing with the parent thinking it actually knows what it's doing but
It doesn't and it tricks you this way into making wrong decisions and that'swhy it'scalled the trickster , that comes from John Beebe 8 function model and how they behave in each slot If you want to verify , i haven't read his books honestly but that's I know , and I think just like the demon when it can go demonic or angelic the trickster tricks your parent when demonic bit gives it freedom as you say when angelic, maybe you can check that and come up with a cool theory to share with us and please correct me if you disagree.
I don't exactly agree on ni only being the gut feeling or that when people just know it's necessarily ni , I think it could equally be ne if not more since the majority of prople are sjs and they still use their child and Inferior and generally the ne-si axis with both it's options is more common that ni-se. I am saying ni is not the only one that predicts both do but ni is more about yourself and ne is more expanded with the things it predicts and sees more possibilities . I don't know if you actually think otherwise I am not a follower , I got this information from csj .
I would say I do stop to think of my fi as well , I am definitely feeling something the whole time I realise that now , it's just your demon function you don't care about it you know so I am not alwsys paying attention to identify the feeling especially if it's more complex than the basic feelings like hunger or anger , now I am trying to befriend my fi and sometimes just ask the ti to let fi breath . Mentally stop .
Csj just made a video clarifying the meaning of mind side focus , you don't turn into a different type but when you face a problem your ego can't solve with its cognitive stack and normal power order of your functions your mind tries to adjust anyhow so power order temporarily changes and this can make you go from the functions in your ego to those in shadow ( and of course the subconscious and superego have the same function ) as they are on cognitive orbits together depending on the power you put into gateway functions so you may look or act like other types on the outside for a little time, but the vast majority of time you're in your ego .