ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 มิ.ย. 2024
- Putting Kerbal Space Station into sun-synchronous terminator orbit with SSTOs. Realizing some interesting features of perfectly spherical Kerbin in the process... Who ever thought that Earths imperfections can make up for some awesome possibilities!
0:00 - 1:27 - Ride the Terminator
1:27 - 10:37 - Starting the construction
10:37 - 16:02 - Realizing things about basic orbital mech...
16:02 - 24:20 - Finishing the station - เกม
![CAMPปลิ้น | EP.77[1/2] ก็ไม่ได้ชอบเอาชนะ แต่เรื่องอะไรต้องแพ้!!](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/JraaBYOd7I0/mqdefault.jpg)
Who ever thought that Earths imperfections can make up for some awesome possibilities! Well, making fool of myself is part of the job description I guess. here is the link to a video to provide major bulk of mods in this video:
th-cam.com/video/UKbWx-bTOw0/w-d-xo.html
Extras:
KSC Extended
Near Future Solar
Stockalike Station parts
Extra Docking Ports
Pood's Calm Skybox
why are you not playing KSP 2?
@@teamruddy611 KSP 1 is much better since KSP 2 is still very buggy without proper mod support yet.
Edit: autocorrect sucks
@@teamruddy611 ksp 2 is a shit show
@@wow-roblox8370 Mods already exist for KSP2! And there are definitely NO Game Breaking bugs.
yo kinda crazy ur model of the ISS is like missing,, the entire russian half but haha it happens 👍
I know it's hard but your English is getting better by each vid bro👍
I appreciate that! In the end of the day it comes to amount of language used daily and overall. And since I no longer use English on a job, yeah it a bit hard xD
@@Yakez42 where are you from?
@@vonknorring09 he's Russian, you can hear it tho
His english is really easy to understand for non-native speakers)
@@JustPeo yh ik, but the pronounciation is bad tho
True Sun-synchronous Orbits are not possible in stock KSP (or KSP2). Yeah you can use fuel to keep adjusting the polar orbit around Kerbin to keep it in sync, but it is not a simple (or in my opinion, true) Sun-synchronous orbit then. This is a real pain if you have a lot of other missions that you have going at the same time. I've found that if you want a station in the Sun-light the vast majority of the time without constant station-keeping, you need to put it in a very, very high polar orbit around Kerbin. Your station will likely still quickly pass through Kerbin's shadow a few times a year, but that is it (if high enough, like close to the edge of the SOI, the shadows of Kerbin's moons are not usually an issue). The rest of the time it will be in full sunlight. The only downside is that it takes more fuel and time to setup your station and get your kerbonauts to and from the station. But it is still easier then if your station was in direct orbit of Kerbin's Sun, which is the only other way I know of to keep your station in constant Sun-light.
Yup. Turned out it is 24m/s daily correction for 600km orbit. Twice if station at 120km. Keeping this station operable at terminator requires a featured SSTO swap/boost every 2 months.
havent played ksp in a while, but is there a orbit around kerbin with exactly 1 year orbital period? if so you could put a station there.
Although the height of the orbit probably wouldnt make it worth it to put a station there, as flying to it would be very inefficient,
@@Retsom3D You can't have this kind of orbit. Well, Lagrange points behave like that (but that's really not orbiting the body, that's orbiting together in sync), but you don't have them in stock KSP.
@@Retsom3D Kerbin's Sphere of Influence is 84,159,286 metres, i.e in simplified 2-body problem gravity that KSP does, that is the maximum orbital radius you can have. An orbit at that heigh takes 717 hours, or ~120 kerbin days. However a kerbin year is 426 days, so no, its SOI is not large enough to have a year-period orbit.
@@ivolol then do a polar orbit with a period of 106.5 days. This way you can time it to never be in kerbins shadow.
This is an awesome video, your realistic take on Station Design is something I've longed to see in a KSP video, and you certainly delivered!
However, the issue with a sun-synchronous is that over the course of Kerbin's year, the angle of the Sun changes, while the orbit stays static. In real life this is counteracted by a precession rate equal to Earth's year, which compensates for the issue, but 1-body point-gravity simulations like Kerbal Space Program 1/2, Juno: New Origins, etc, is that they cannot simulate orbital precession, among other things it would require simulating Kerbin's actual mass distribution and equatorial bulge as opposed to what they actually do which is having a singularity at the center of the planet.
Nice to see someone knowing the science behind these orbits! I was totally oblivious until I started video editing and noticed deviations on top of bug. Took me fair chunk of a day at least sort of understand what allow real life satellite to ride this orbit passively. In the end of the day this station at 600km orbit require only 24m/s daily boost to stay in this orbit (twice that at 120km). If you rotate showcased SSTOs every 2 month it is pretty achievable mission! So unknowingly I have created KSP station that need maintenance xD
Some issues with making this are one you noticed; IRL there is a yearly revolution which moves the terminator around the Earth gradually during the year. And also the magnetosphere around the poles is weaker so astronauts will be subject to more radiation than a typical station on the equator.
Your design is very cool and is a good idea for a solar station structure since it has a huge wall protecting the occupied station from the sun
Yea, also there are Van Allen belts, that you will pass through daily. Does not sound good.
If only Moho had its stationary orbit inside sphere of influence, then you can put this station facing the Kerbol and stationary relative to Moho! Need Principia mod for that.
If you really want to have a proper sun-synchronous station in kerbal, you should get RSS with Principia! Sun-synchronous orbit is also not perfectly on the terminator since it’s actually slightly retrograde. Still a fun idea though! I really like your idea of having something that can stay in the same orientation relative to the surface without needing to rotate the solar panels! Batteries would still practically be needed as different station operations need different amounts of electricity and the solar panels will degrade over time, but it would still likely be less than if it spent time in the earth’s shadow! Irl, the Russian Orbital Service Station is supposed to go into a sun-synchronous orbit.
Also, we should be getting huge space stations with small spaceplanes when dreamchaser flies soon!
Actually dabbling with Principia and Lagrange points for the next video! Russians have decided on this type of orbit for their next station... but then there are Van Allen belts. And they yet to determine viability for long term human habitation. Plan atm is to launch satellite that will survey radiation levels in this orbit. And then they want to use Angara A5 to put station in this orbit... Whole thing is on paper for now.
@@Yakez42 Only problems are money, radiation, and Ukraine stuff.
I thing Russian engineers can stripe soyuz rocket 1000 times and keep it stable, so there's will be no problem with transportation
this is really cool, I havent seen any of the major youtubers do something like this. your channel is really underrated. great job!
Thanks, Matt!
Did you know there is a high latitude launch site? Two of them. For one you need to fly north and make a slight right at the north pole, then fly south. For the other one you need to fly southwest following the terrain until you hit the end, then maintain that heading until you reach a pair of islands the look loke sideways New Zealand. It is on the south eastern side of the larger island and has a large flat area around it.
I remember that there were some, but like Boomerang they were missing proper runways. After your comment checked wiki, and oh boy, never even thought that there are like half a dozen of them!
@@Yakez42 aside from the DLC ones, which I don't have, I unlocked all of them in my career save.
I like all the launch sites, but I'm disappointed by the lack of runways. Mahi Mahi (the "New Zealand" one) is probably the best for a polar orbit if you don't mind a grass runway, but then why not just turn off the runway at the KSC? DLC adds one runway but mods definitely beat stock in this case.
You need to know that stock ksp gravity sim doesn't simulate percession of orbits but, mod "Principia,, (wich simulates newtonian gravity) does simulate these kinds of orbits as well many difrent and wierder orbits
Yup, one day, actually want to use this mod to put station into Mun L2 point. Does it simulate obolid shapes that actually make this orbit happen passively?
@@Yakez42 i'm not sure about those "obolid shapes,, (i don't know what are those) but it does simulate pasive stability of orbits in L5 and L4 lagrange points (only dose are pasively stable, L1 L2 and L3 aren't)
Edit: I now know what are you talking about, yes it does simulate obolid shapes and its effects on incined orbits
Edit2: btw sorry for bad english, it isn't my first language
hehe, yeah English not my first one either xD
That Stargate reference just earned you a Sub.
Awesome video man!
This is awesome!
SUPER COOL VIDEO!!!
yo that space station looks sick
"The game doesn't provide high latitude runways"
The polar icecaps are by far the most effective runways on Kerbin.
hehe... up next drilling ice for fuel!
sick station
thanks for teaching me this! after watching this video i put my own space station on the "terminator line" :D
noice!
Wait till he finds out KSP doesn’t model orbital procession and this orbit is seasonally in sunlight for the whole time while in others it’s only there for half the time.
Magnífico video! siempre quise hacer una estación espacial así, pero nunca tuve tiempo.
¡Gracias! Las estaciones espaciales son increíbles debido al diseño modular. Recuerdo los tiempos en que estaba construyendo la estación espacial lanzando 1 módulo diario.
Very cool! Especially for videos this orbit is helpfull, since it avoids situation where the game is too dark and YT will just make it look shitty. What do you think, should I try this Orbit for my upcoming KSP2 station? Would it cost a lot more time?
Exactly! I remember when I was new to KSP... I was docking longer than a day transition of LKO. This orbit is so chill when you dock! This is alone an incredible experience! This orbit is actually not at all more time consuming once you get your polar capable launch system. This orbit is worse that equatorial orbits since you need to boost it every so often (like every 30 days) to keep it in Terminator zone or otherwise it will drift in couple month into shadow/day. Well, it was the biggest discovery for me. IRL Earth orbits like this can be passive with some gravitational dark magic.
I use such an orbit to park a communications satellite, this way you always have line of sight and enough power to relay signals :D
Next you should try making a geostationary satellite that can send data back to Kirbin.
Now skip a half of year to make your always-in-sun station into always-in-shadow one :)
Wouldn't be more efficient to launch from Parallel 0 and go further distance than usual, and then do all the do all the maneuvers to match the orbital plane while coming back to Kerbin?
When he said ZPM i was watching 2nd season of stargate atlantis lol
Mfw I come home from orbital mechanics class to see it applied in Kerbal!
Really nice video. Which KSC mod were using for the SSTO launch?
KSC extended
This is all well and dandy but that line is gonna move because because kerbin orbits kerbol
Love the video. What's the docking mod?
Ты ведь из России или снг, да?) Забавно что человека с акцентом понимать намного легче чем говорящего на чистом английском. Классное видео)
есть такое дело
Right now I’m working on a constellation of satellites in ksp. I usually put them in a polar orbit at approx 2.820 km. Which is geostationary, however I’ve found out that I never go into the shadow of the planet. 🤣 Though it is a couple million km up.🤣
The zpm joke was really funny for me because i just last night watched Stargate Atlantis 😂
Was tempted to call it ZedPM like Rodney xD
@@Yakez42 😂
@@Yakez42 Im gonna subscribe xD
Could you please make a video explaining interstellar engines from far future cause i'm so confused and there's no tutorials anywhere
What planet and lighting mods do
You use?
So like what happens when kerben is on the other side of it's orbit isn't now facing 180°s away from the sun then?
It is all in the video. There is 0.8 degree drift daily. 24m/s daily correction at 600 km orbit.
yet another reason why i love KSP one, this looks better than KSP 2.......
KSP2 have its good moments, lighting in KSP2 generally better and engine plumes are really awesome and better than modded KSP1. But it still need several years to look even remotely as finished game.
@@Yakez42 yea it has tons of potential. but for now it`s very unfinished. got hope for the future.
lol really? There's like maybe ten different conflicting styles from different modders here...
won`t the suns position relavite to orbit change througout the season ?
Yes, just like it stated in the video it change 0.8 degree daily. 25 m/s correction if you put station at 600km.
what mods do you use and what ksp version?
Everything is in the pinned comment!
Wow, I'm still struggling to build sstos
I remember time when I was docking longer that day transition of an orbit xD Just remembered that when was making this station (since it always have sunlight). SSTOs are delicate and first I have perfected my Space Shuttles, before dabbling into SSTO game several years later.
iceland moment
Hello!, I have a question, I recently bought the enhaced edition in muy ps5, but I shows like It is the PS4 edition, uhmm whats wrong? They said there is a ps5 edition but I dont have It.
Cannot really tell, my last console was PS3 like 10 years ago, since then I just use PC ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
If you’re struggling with English I suggest you try fully translating some subtitles to make it easier to understand what’s going on - I don’t mean this with any offence and I’m sorry if you’re upset by this
For the most part videos are scripted, nevertheless converting script from screenplay format into subtitles was a major pain. Maybe one day I will find a way to add proper non generated subtitles.
What mods does this use ? Thanks!
hey hey they are in the pinned comment
Can I have a list of all the mods you are playing with?
everything is in the pinned comment
@@Yakez42 thanks
Tufx config ?
i dont think you understand but when kerbin orbits the sun the terminator line will shift making your station orbit partly in sun and partly in night
making only 2 points possible for a terminator orbit
This is exactly what is discussed in this video. While in the real world orbital occultation allows for somewhat stable passive orbit, KSP orbit needs 24m/s daily correction at 600km altitude. Although there is no such thing as passive orbit in real life. You still need to make an altitude boost. For example ISS has night side glide mode for solar panels to reduce atmospheric drag!
@@Yakez42 im sorry i guess i didnt watch the full video my fault on that one
@@Yakez42 I was confused by this as well because I thought you said it was a bug.. but that's exactly what we would expect to see happen. I don't think KSP could ever replicate the real life behavior because it treats all objects as single points of mass, and gravity is a linear force towards those points. Passive sun synchronous orbits seem to take advantage of Earth's uneven shape. Can't imagine what the computational power requirement would be to simulate that :)
But you’ll get in the shadow because kerbols light is moving so it will get into light
Yep it is Kerbal year / 360 degrees a day. So 0.8 degree change daily relative to terminator line. Manageable with active propulsion system on a space station.
Won't the solar panels turn away from the sun after half a year? The rotational plane of a terminator orbit, does not change, but the direction of the sun does through the seasons??
Well station attitude control systems are designed for keeping station oriented in continuous fashion purely on solar power. Considering the orbit itself drifting over the course of the year (0.8 degree daily for Kerbin) it need active boost to keep up with Kerbol rotation. 24m/s daily at 600km orbit to be correct. Window for correction is quite big, so making monthly corrections is pretty acceptable.
IRL correction is achieved passively through combination of uneven gravitational field with obolid shape of Earth relative to polar plane of orbit. How exactly... well this above my paygrade xP
@@Yakez42 Wow, thank you, that was the explanation I was looking for.
But, doesn't the space station get misaligned as the earth rotates around the sun and the terminator line rotate with it ?
It have a drift of 0.8 degree daily like is mentioned in the video. IRL some orbital balck magic with uneven gravitational field allow for passive orbit like this, in perfectly spherical world like KSP you need active correction. 24m/s daily at 600km orbit.
@@Yakez42 alright sorry did not watch it entirely before commenting, did not here you say that !
I can understand like… half of what they’re saying
Doesn't the terminator shift as kerbin goes around the sun?
Yep just like stated in the video orbit drift 0.8 degree daily (correlation to Kerbin year) This require 24 m/s boost daily at 600 km orbit. And the correction window is quite big. So monthly boost can do the trick.
@@Yakez42 I only watched part of it, but that's a pain man.
Well, there is always an option to play RO with Principia. From what I can gather one can simulate real passive orbits there. Ones that use osculating Earth orbit to stay in this orbit passively.
Kerbin orbiting around the Kerbol:
- я для тебя какая то шутка?
Или в реальном физическом мире предполагается, что орбита тела движется вместе с Землёй? Ведь периоды обращения явно различны и как с видимой стороной Луны вряд ли работает.
Now about the sensor going crazy. Have anyone ever noticed that the vanilla SAS is going crazy at the poles?
Research orbital occultation and sun synchronous orbits in IRL. Or watch video until the end all the answers there.
@@Yakez42 okay, thanks, братишка)
And how about lunar / Mun eclipse, that does make a shadow, no?
I think total solar eclipse at a sunset is not possible on Kerbin. It have no axial tilt and polar orbit is 300 km+ away for perfect Mun/Kerbol ratio. Like a lot of things working against it, while IRL we have orbital variety that can click together now and then.
@@Yakez42 Well, on a polar orbit the satellite will cross the equator twice per orbit, so my argument stands that it's quite possible that the satellite will be in the shadows once in a while :)
But doesn't this orbit shift over a year?
Just like stated in the video it shifts 0.8 degree daily. This require 24m/s delta V correction every day at altitude of 600km. IRL this orbit can be passive thanks to uneven gravitational field and obloid shape of Earth.
@@Yakez42 Sorry I wasn't really interested in the concept enough to watch the video. I just wanted to know how the click bate thumbnail could be true, but I couldn't sit through it all so I must have skipped over that part.
Хм, неплохая идея, жаль только ирл бесполезно
Like in KSP you need actually actively boost this orbit. IRL this is done with all sort of bizarre Earth characteristics, like obolid shape and uneven gravitational field. Ну и наши там станцию хотят сделать "в 2027 году". Правда облучать людей каждую орбиту через радиционные пояса...
@@Yakez42 Чтобы прикинуть какая станция будет построена рф в 2027, стоит сопоставить хронологию анонсов и список того что было реализовано.
@HR0N это еще та история. В целом наши космические станции кончились с проектировкой МИР-2 и половинчатым МИР-1. Чего стоит только наш орбитальный сегмент МКС. Жалкая пародия на изначальный договор. Меня всегда веселит народ с "чтобы бы было если не похерили Буран-Энергию"... да ничего бы не было, запускать то нечего.
@@Yakez42, к сожалению ты прав, роскосмос в глубокой жопе :(
@@Yakez42, ахахах половина на английском половина на русском, про проект такой не слышал, пойду посмотрю, звучит очень странно, да и непонятно зачем
why dont they do this irl
They do this all the time with weather satellites. It is even better irl since it can be passive thanks to uneven gravitational field and obloid shape of Earth. Russians want to put next station into this terminator orbit. However they yet to determine real radiation levels in this orbit. This orbit passing through Van Allen belts. Scout satellite is pending launch.
Graphics mods?
th-cam.com/video/UKbWx-bTOw0/w-d-xo.html
and extras in the pinned comment
@@Yakez42 thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you
@@Yakez42 i'm sorry, but can I ask you something, my English very dad. But when I download ckan and start it, it don't work, if you now how fix it, help please.
@@user-ri2uv7uw9b did you put ckan in your ksp folder?
@@aram226 yes
So you're riding thr terminator?🤨
Terminator 3 had a bad influence on me in my childhood...
@@Yakez42I never watched terminator 3 so idk efat that meand
ride the terminator? pause
Insert joke about terminator 3 and inflatable boobs scene.
жесть - такой русский акцент 8)
manuever
not maneur
манёвр, definitely манёвр
@@Yakez42 what
Вы Россиянин? Акцент очень похожий на русский
bro im tripping so hard rn
I want KSP but it's a lot of learning
It is definitely a journey. I remember picking up this game 10 years ago and completely failing at simple docking procedures xD