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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 ก.ค. 2024
- 🌟Is Peony the best refresher in the game? How long do refreshers last? Is your favorite still good?
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⌛Timestamps
0:00 - C Tier -
1:05 Azura
1:16 Spring Nils
2:23 - B Tier -
2:56 Reason
3:35 Duo Sigurd
5:46 - A Tier -
6:03 Brave Chrom
7:11 Hatari Azura
9:13 Plegian Dorothea
10:17 Duo Peony
11:10 Legendary Azura
12:10 Mirabilis
13:27 Rearmed Plumeria
15:06 Spring Mirabilis
16:29 Rearmed Lucina
17:45 Attuned Azura
18:58 Legendary Chrom
20:32 Duo Chrom
22:49 - S Tier -
23:14 Legendary Ninian
25:07 Duo Sharena
26:47 Plumeria
28:28 Attuend Peony
30:22 - S+ Tier -
30:41 Attuned Triandra
32:53 Duo Robin
34:31 Peony
35:59 - Final Tier List -
36:21 How Long Are Refreshers Good?
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I’m going to do something special with this tier list. In a couple days, I’ll be posting all the raw scoring to the Discord. It should spark some fun conversations.
Edit: Raw Scores are up!
discord.gg/fehology
You should have invited a specialist for this tearlist, Pruitii
That's sounds fun 😁
Spring Mira's placement is way too low. She's so good at swing stats and ensuring stuff remains debuffed especially when units end turn to cleanse or Freyr start of turn's cleanse. She is the best dancer especially in SD when raid bossing is becoming the go-to strat for that mode again.
And she's a demote, she's easier to +10 even though she's seasonal-locked
Brave Marianne: Am I a joke to you?
For real, she belongs into S tier.
3H unit, big "EH"
She is lol
The term refresher always bugs me, how are the Robins and Chroms/Lucinas considered refreshers, but Edelgards are not? Because they attack and don’t use an assist? But B!Marianne is considered a refresher and she attacks to refresh too? But she isn’t in this video, so she isn’t a refresher? And why are Sain and Sylvain no refresher? They do the exact same as the Chroms/Robins/Lucinas…it’s so inconsistent
I would LOVE to have a +9 A!Peony instead of sitting around waiting to fodder them. Wish charges just stacked.
Ditto. My copies are just taking up space on my reserves, and it's bad enough that I'm a bit of a hoarder.
fr! they should allow stacking for merges, i have +9 attuned peony as well and i have my last copy just sitting cause i dont want to waste the copy potential just to have a +10
For a good while the Peony's were interchangeable for me, until i realized you could put Aerial Maneuvers on Attuned Peony, combined with one of the rank 4 Guidance skills and echo WoM and she can go anywhere she wants. I even run her with galeforce, heavy blade, and Marth engage, sometimes she can swoop in and proc her galeforce off of a weak enemy with no guard and go dance someone. It is glorious
Spring Mira was overlooked in my radar and now she is the one I use the most... she is really strong. I am super interested in +10ing her even as a dancer. if I get caught off guard or WoM jumped she usually takes hits like a champ. imo she is the best Dancer atm in my book.
when i was pulling for sylvain merges on the spring banner i got a good amount of miras and at first i was hesitant but honestly she’s great and very versatile. the fact that she has true damage reduction is the cherry on top and allows her to tank things she wasn’t supposed to. really happy with her
I pulled enough to get Spring Mira to +10 and she is now a core member of nearly every team I have. Best investment I’ve made in +10’ing a seasonal unit in my 7 years of playing FEH. Totally agree; she should be ranked higher! That stat swing is so valuable and gives my other units a chance to KO tougher meta units.
Also i feel like no infantry dragon dancer should be in C. Nils can run CC and HDW, as well as having high HP to run sudden panic or pulse ties
idk how much it counts but Rearmed Lucina lowkey has the best combat for a refresher. Axe of devotion + flared + assassin strike + 24 true damage treachery = 1 shot +10 arena assault EIkes, dont even need a precharged special.
AA may not be a consideration but its pretty damn neat that a +0 green unit can just 1 tap the best red tank in the game
C'mon Joel u really should put spring Mirabilis higher she's a really amazing dancer she helps so much with the debuffs she inflicts and the bonus doubler status really comes in clutch I'd say she's a fantastic dancer especially when u invest more into her she really shines!
Also u forgot base traindra her refine was really that bad she didn't want to be here poor girl! 😹
Also my favorite refreshers gotta be spring Mira, duo SharVero, Attuned triandra, and duo peony.
if we're including units like B!Sharena and the Chroms who only refresh themselves, then we should be including every single healer since they can all get Magic Shield+ that also self refreshes
also F!Tana since her Duo skill is a refresh, B!Marianne who has a refresh in her special, and B!Lapis who allows an ally who hit the same unit as her be refreshed should all be here
Yes also duo Snacki and duo ninjorrin!
And the Edels and the gullveigs, and lief.
And every character that can learn Galeforce since that refreshes the user.
favourite?
S!Dorothea, W!Dorothea and D! Dorothea! Now waiting for her base version, maybe actually a fighting and not a refreshing Dorothea (one can dream 😅)
My current favorite refresher is Attuned Azura.
I feel like I don't really need to argue why. She's just really good. 3 move, a ton of buffs and I love her art as well.
Only issue is that me foddering Kvasir to S!Nifl for Incite Atk/Spd was completely for nothing now lmao.
The cold steel music is so good in the background. Attuned Peony the GOAT
I know Peony has lasted long but she is definitely not the best dancer in the game
Yeah not sure why aether raids offense is being biased so heavily. By the same logic, she's the worst dancer in AR defense.
Yeah, Spring Mira is a lot better than her, and yet she's two tiers below, and Attuned Peony is easily better, but again, she's below Mythic
Chaos season too
baby chrobin baby chrobin baby chrobin
I Love tier lists and see others peoples opinion.
Overall I think this tier list is very agreeable … more less. But personally I have some points…
1. Some C tier dancers actually have PRFs. Just wanted to mention that, cause it seems „dancers with at least a PRF“ was a B-tier criteria.
2. like some others mentioned Brave Marianne went missing and I think we also had a newer unit, that basically did a very similar thing to Brave Marianne, which then was also missing here.
3. It’s crazy to me, that many dancers that actually are able to double refresh are so comparably low, especially Duo Peony, which as a Duo Unit is still on of the highest scoring dancers for Arena and also can dance any unit with her Duo skill unlike Harmonic Dorothea, Azura and Young Tiki that only can do that for units from two different games each and on top of that Duo Peony being a - to be fair ranged but whatever - flier, which got a lot of decent to great support skills that can be used by refreshers.
4. I probably didn’t understand the „player phase“ category at its fullest but I don’t know Mythic Peony on top with 20/19 kinda feels like a good amount of bias in it. :s
Also i kinda had to laugh about the „player phase“ explanation: „Including Galeforce but not only that…“ … the further we have come in the tier list (at least A-S-Tier): Galeforce, Galeforce, Galeforce, Galeforce, Galeforce, Galeforce, Galeforce, … xD
(Take that with a smiling grain of salt :P)
I didn't know Peony was S tier +
I have merged on her since she was released she became my favorite dancer and the first dancer i invested expensive builds, i love her design and all her variants but my favorite still the original one and hwr attuned version
Diferent dancers are good for diferent roles.
A Peony is great for speed tanking, A Triandra for galeforce/hyperofensive strats, Base and R Plumeria are generalist that are good in the ofensive side, and Spring Mirabilis is a generalist that is amazing in raidboss comps.
I think that the popularity of attuned Peony is mainly bc she already comes with her entire meta kit, in comparison, Triandra, the Plumerias and Mira want Rockslide/Firestorm dance or Wings of Mercy, and in the case of Base Plumeria and Spring Mira, they also want a Ploy skill.
Probably the most underrated dancer actually is NY Plumeria, sadly we still don't have speed/res ploy 4 for total debuffs, but with a t4 ploy and Carrot bow+ she can debuff 3 of the enemy stats and apply 3 debuffs just by existing, and she also still have a prf dance, slighty weak for today standars but better than nothing.
absolutely THRIVING in the fact that chrom is my fav character tied with sylvain and i've +10'd every single one lmao.. so much mileage
Great video!! I missed seeing spring Triandra on the list. She's quite high, I'd say. She's one of the only sources of foe penalty doubler and she also inflicts panic on the enemies, making her the hands down best dancer to pair with A!Miciah and many others. She also inflicts guard and comes equipped with firestorm dance right out of the box!
Tethys is one of my favorites, but I don't use her except for fun! I definitely want more refresher merge projects because they do stay useful for so long, regardless of what you're doing. Excellent video, and I loved the little exploding effects, the rubric, and the charts!
OG Peony and Plum are #1 in my heart. AR is all about them
I always wish I'd merged them up 4 years ago, but was mostly using enemy phase strats. Since I've switched to player phase, it really hurts not having them
Legendary Camilla or Duo Seidr/Heidr? Who do you think will age better/is more unique?
I see a Fehology video, I watch it 👍🏾✨
I've been looking forward to this. My favorite refreshers are definitely duo baby female Robin and X peony and Duo sharena.
i hope you enjoyed it!!
@@FEH glad to help the discord and I enjoyed the video.👍
I never thought about Smite on Sharena. I'm going to do that now
LETS GO NEW FEHOLOGY VIDEO!!
i'm waiting anxiously for the new Satachi tier list 😎
OG Peony is one of the few units I never regretted to +10, she’s still incredible after all these years. Glad to see you agree! Awesome tier list 👍
Very interesting list, Joel! 🤩 No gripes from me, I have most of the higher A through S+ tier refreshers +10ed or at least invested into and I do find myself leaning towards the same units you put more emphasis on for sure 💪🏼 Duo Robin is an absolute UNIT holy cow lol Solo’s any E!Ikes on AR-D or in my hands in Arena. A!Triandra is on my short list for merge projects too, sitting at +5 (oppose of A!Peony, would be like +15 at this point 😂)!
I thought about making a 2nd X!Peony, but that would be a lot of fodder wasted 😅
@@FEH haha yeah honestly I’ve thought the same for some other rearmed/attuned units as well 😂 but I’ll call the fodder value from just refreshing their “charge” > or = the value of a random merge 💪🏼
23:15 The Description for Dragon’s Dance is the same as Faithful Breath instead of the Pref Dance’s Description.
Favorite Refresher is Peony, Attuned Peony, Mirabilis, Spring Mirabilis, and Duo Bride Sharena
I have an OG Peony at +10 and with max dragon flowers. With a res asset, her resistance at max invest is good enough to make ploy skills effective.
For the longest time, OG Olivia was my most used favorite dancer, mostly because she is one of my faves from Awakening ❤ and she is F2P in FEH. I haven’t used her much in the last few years though because there are dancers who can fulfill so many more roles on a team than Olivia can.
Nowadays, Spring Mirabilis is my favorite dancer and I pulled enough to +10 from her banner. Best investment in a +10 I’ve made in my 7 years of playing FEH!
I appreciate that you skewed towards support a little more than combat this time around, but I still think you should be branded as a war criminal for putting D! Sigurd and W! Dorothea as low as you did when they are 2 of only 3 units that can extend your trap's range in AR-D as much as they do. Is that a niche? Yes. Should you be branded as a war criminal? Also yes! Not even Margaret Thatcher dared as much.
🤣
I have a built out duo Sigurd for that exact purpose. He’s a great unit.
@@FEH I respect you far too much for the thought of you not valuing him to even cross my mind (not to mention you yourself pointed it out in the analysis). The joke was mostly because of my feelings about such a broad ranking system as a whole, and it's something I mentioned in the comments of your support tier list video: When a unit does something that, even when niche, is so crucial to a game mode (the examples I used then were Freyr/Medeus), and is so unique or limited in the amount of units that can do it, rankings based on anything other than that feel unfair to me. My takeaway of both videos is that the individual unit analysis are spot on, whether I like the ranking system or not is not important to the value of the content
Peony will always be S Tier in my heart 😌 excellent video like always Joel
Gave her breath of life 4. And she was kind enough to share it around
thank you! can't wait for your live tonight 🥰
Tethys stat line and being infantry and range (dagger) makes her great. I don’t have Groom Duo Sigurd so that dancer trap is not an option of me. HOWEVER, Tethys paired with Igrene and her super high RES stat becomes a potent monster that can run Ploy with her C-Skill and perform the same function - staple in my Anima defense for a few months since Igrene’s release
Including self refreshers in this list, I get it but they are so different from a regular refreshers
While pulling for L!Bylad on his remix banner, is got a single copy of him in 450 orbs... AND I got 13 A!Peony.
Not what I wanted exactly, but now that I can hand out 13 copies of BoL 4, Guidance 4, No Quarter, Flared Sparrow...? That's kind of amazing.
Dancer in the mythic slot will never not be valuable. 2 meta units instead of 1 alongside the bonus unit is just so good.
Just wanted to say that you accidentally had the Duo Chrom nameplate above Brave Chrom! Excellent video though
Where is Heidr though?
Peony and Plumeria carry me in aether raids so much ❤
My +10 X!Peony is my most treasured unit
I'm kinda shocked Heidr isnt on the list if the Chroms are? Or did I just miss her? I thought she'd be high so it was up until the very end did I realize she just wasn't here
No, I missed her. Honestly, she should’ve been on the list. She’s a really good unit that a lot of folks sleep on.
@@FEH probably A or S? I think she's someone you build around mainly in the way of who uses the buffs and her providing the unique (I think) support of granting Brave weapon is pretty insane so I'd argue for S but I'd love to know where you'd put her
First of all really appreciate the effort and time in the tier list. I love your videos and the energy they bring! But I do disagree with some points, so my thoughts will mostly be counter-arguments which can come of as negative.
I get the point, Peony is the most valuable dancer within the context of Aether Raids, but the player phase rating is just completely absurd. The only reason she's given a 19 player phase rating here is because she needed to be on top. I think you can justify putting her there as "most valuable: , but you cannot justify that 19. She is not the best, she is the most valuable, don't give her the ratings as if she were the best. You can give her a lower rating yet still put her on top.
By that same logic, Mythic Mirabillis should probably be more valuable because it's just really awkward putting anything but Freyr besides her. There's Arval who still is okayish but is an two movement infantry nuke so has maybe too little threat range. There is mythic Gullveig who has threat range but no damage reduction piercing, besides she relies on piercable damage reduction herself and pre-combat damage which just got a hard counter, and Fomortiss is already an older armour unit that just does not tank enough as a mythic.
Then Sharena, the whole downside to her is that she needs to initiate first to get that extra action, and then another unit needs to initiate before she gets her next action. That sets her apart from any other unit on this list. That is just fundamentally a different type of refresher than the other units and I would argue just puts her down in the context of this list because the value of a lot of these refresher units is that they can refresh others or themselves unconditionally via their assist. And the biggest downside of that is that those other units have to be in range to kill, and also have to kill. It is not big. I would probably put her in A-tier, simply because it's a refresher list. Also, by that logic, where are the Edelgards? Where are the Ninja units? Especially Sanaki who also has a supportive ploy? Is this even the list for Sharena?
Lastly, putting Attuned Azura before the two bow Chroms? That just baffles me, she can refresh any unit within range (including mercy wing echo range), and not just herself via a reposition assist. And then she basically gets another action due to Canto Distance, she can move up to 4 extra spaces after her action providing extreme flexibiity in any strategy. Want to box a unit in on a Galeforce strat, that canto distance is massive. She is THE hit & run dancer, and besides Ninian probably only one of two, especially with the +1 movement to all units but ranged cavs enabling to be even better at hit & run (especially Tea Ayra). She can also do reliably do hit and run strageties herself as she hits rather hard. I have equipped her with No Quarter and Flow Desperation, so my build is really premium but anything that is not meta, and even some of the more meta threats in the tanking business are killable, including some of last years dodge tanks (yes, red swords) because she is really fast. Besdies that, if you want to kill a nuke that is gonna die anyway, it is better to be able to run away, than to stay such as the Chroms do. Then her start of turn effects are also just so simple but powerful. Everyone is always saying, NFU is outsourcable, but how many people then actually do that? Well, she does. I think you cannot justify putting a nuke such as legendary Chrom above her in a refresher tier list, because he can dance himself once up to someone with so much versatility. Same goes for Duo Chrom and I value special cooldown acceleration support extremely high myself, but Azura just does so much more as refresher. If this were a different tier list I would understand, but not in this one. And she can also actually run refresher assists in her B-slot, which are also very powerful, whereas the Chroms want to have some kind of nuking power in their B-slots usually.
So concluding, for Azura, you can run her in hit & run phase, as hit & run, in Galeforce, in enemy phase with supportive effects and a supportive dance skill, and if you swap out her prf with Gänglots Axe as Gaeforce, but I think that is her least viable strategy. And I'd say that would put her in between Attuned Peony and Attuned Triandra. She fits in more strategies than Triandra, but Triandra hits so hard and for Galeforce she could actually use Arcane Devourer.
I feel like putting the self refreshers in here is a false equivalence.
I’d argue that outside of re-armed duping, Re-armed chrom and Valentine Lucina are legitimately significantly worse than Gen 1 dancers because gen 1 dancers give a second action to units that are actually good, self refreshing really isn’t comparable to dancing, because while it’s definitely a really strong effect, it’s only strong on units that are themselves strong. And the chroms only get to reposition, they don’t get to take a kill with that free action, not that it isn’t useful, but it’s really just not that comparable to actual dances.
Dances aren’t good because you go + in action economy (most times you don’t), they’re good because they allow you to trade a worse unit’s action for a second use of any other unit.
also by counting chrom, why aren’t gullveig, or edels on the list, when they also refresh but can actually take kills with those actions?
Also, a bit of a side note I’d argue that legitimately, A;Peony and A;Azura are without a doubt the best users of arcane Thrima, and the best targets for it, giving it to them isn’t a hard choice, it’s kind of an obvious one. Galeforce is good.
Also considering Chaos season, mythics lost a bit of their inherent value.
In what sense is Duo Chrobin a refresher? 🤔
Maybe I don't understand the Player Phase score, but how is Peony at 19? Compared to Legendary Chrom at 17 for example.
@2:00 The criteria is how versatile rather than how strong they are in general combat
No clue tbh, unless somehow he’s counting being a mythic as part of that, because A;peony has a 16 despite potential for galeforce and access to more versatile skills, and better stats.
6:07
Why does it say Duo Chrom? Its Brave Chrom
Nah, its the way I have Baby Azura built as a nuke, lmao
If anything I think Plumeria might be a bit underrated, as a heavy W!Edel user who used her on both seasons I found her GFU support (especially combined with Firestorm 3) to be very noticeable compared to her performance in Light next to Peony running the same build.
Fav refresher is B Marianne because Like weird ones
My favorite is OG Ninian, who is not even on the tier list 😭
Aww, I didn't even notice! Well, as a Prf-less Dancer, she'd probably end up in C tier.
OG Ninian loses to Halloween Nils in terms of stats, for example. And Nils is free.
I'm just a fan of Ninian and Nils in general haha! I have almost every version of the two, except Bridal Ninian, though I haven't been as lucky with merges for base Nini 😭 I have, however, given the big kits to every alt I have by a fair bit, though. Arcane Fellstone, Finish, Scowl, Atk Oath Echo (when applicable), etc. Absolute worth for some of my favorite FE characters in general tho
actually i will say - not really.
if you gave Rearmed Lucina a lot of skills - that peony can then take. she can take 4 skills + the weapon. two flies. one swat.
Who is all my favourite refresher?
All of them.
I guess I'm the only one who generally hates galeforce strategies or at least that it's the be all end all strategie.
The new Azura is super broken, I’d put her on top, also I’ll take one of those robin shirts 😅
thx комментарий просто чтобы был продвинуть видео
I don't get why mythic peony is so much better than the other units. Her weapon isn't all that special to me and I feel like regular peony does the same but more. Which things am I missing?
With how tight team slots are, Mythic Dancer that's Good is so far above every other option. Really helps that Neutralize Penalties is an incredible status that continues to bear fruit and scales with improving debuffs.
theres not enough separation to justify an S+ tier IMO.
6:21 THATS NOT DUO CHROM! 0/10, I’ve been scammed 😁
I don't disagree so much with the placement, but duo Peony is still my most used dancer (i don't have the mythic dancers merged up, but I'm finally saving orbs to do it in the Summer). The ability to use her in all seasons and dance twice is just too good.