Yes, this is a Roman Catholic Mass, according to the Sarum rite, celebrated in the Anglican chapel of Merton College, Oxford. This was done in 1997 with the cooperation of Roman Catholic authorities (to allow the historic rite) and College authorities (to allow a Roman Catholic mass in an Anglican chapel). Such cooperation is lacking in many of the previous comments.
@@wyllowgrayson8531 : I don't know the name of the celebrant. The event was sponsored by the Oxford Newman Society. A blog by an insider shows the entire mass with annotations beginning at valleadurni.blogspot.com/2008/02/sarum-candlemas-01.html
This is the Choir of the Church of Our Lady at Lisson Grove in London under the direction of Claude Crozet. They are a mixed voice choir. I should know, I was one of the singers that day - 2nd Bass. The Mass was genuinely Roman Catholic and was organised by the Newman Society of Oxford University in Merton College Chapel. It was a truly fabulous occasion and is for me a spiritual and musical high water mark. A reminder of what might have been in England had the Reformation taken another turn.
Anglo-Catholics, as I was, see the Anglican church as a schism (falling apart of communion) rather than a rebellion, as was the Protestant reformation. The Sarum Rite is the traditional, pre-English Reformation, rite ("Sarum" is the old Latin old name for the city of Salisbury). Many regions had their own rites that were suppressed at Trent but now we primarily know the Tridentine (Extraordinary) and Paul VI (Ordinary) forms of the Roman Rite and the Byzantine Rite in the East.
The two candles on the altar show it to be Sarum if nothing else. The ceremonial of the Sarum Rite is more elaborate than most. It is a shame it was not reinstated when the Hierarchy was reinstated in England
This particular local Sarum Use inside the Latin Rite Church should become the liturgy of the returning High Church ex-Anglicans (Traditional Anglican Communion etc.), as far as they do not use the classical Roman Rite. This is a Catholic Holy Sacrifice of the Mass, valid if confected by validly ordained Priests (and not by ministers), and an age-old treasury of Catholic England since the Middle Ages. Saint Osmund, pray for us and the conversion of Britain!
I'm still ignorant of how rites are organized in the church. If Anglicans wish to return to full communion with Rome does that mean they'll be back under the Roman/Latin rite or will they be given their own particular sui juris church as a means to maintain their own liturgies?
Great! Embarrassing as a Catholic to say we got rid of this and now our showpiece liturgy is "Yaweh, I know you are near!" Fortunately these types of liturgies, with Benedict's encouragement, are returning. High Churched Anglicans -please come to our Church and bring this with you!!!
Actually, Henry VIII got rid of the Sarum Rite although it did influence the Anglican liturgy (Book of Common Prayer) that replaced it in the Anglican Church.
The music being sung is not the Western Wynde Mass, though it is correct that that setting was written for the Sarum Use of Mass.This music is 'Gaude, Gaude, Mater' by Sheppard, as an offertory motet. The Mass setting that was sung at this Mass was, if I remember correctly, Tallis' Missa Puer Natus est Nobis'.
These are Roman Catholic priests celebrating the Rite of Sarum, the predominant liturgical rite in Britain prior to the Reformation. They are not Anglican.
Joshua Smith Really? What’s the proof? This is an Anglican Chapel. And why Roman Catholic did use Sarum rite? Was it legal to be used by RC priests at that time? I doubt.
Wow, you people are so sure of your (rash) judgments. Yes, this is a Catholic Mass. No, it is not Tridentine --- it is, as advertised, Sarum Rite. I personally know one of the acolytes involved in this Mass. At the time, he was head of the Oxford Newman Society. This was a special initiative with approval of the Diocesan Ordinary. The choir was, at least in part, from Lisson Grove.
The Sarum use was in almost universal English, Scottish, Welsh and Irish use (with some local variations in Hereford, York, Bangor, Aberdeen and a few other smaller places) from the middle ages through to 1558, and sporadically after that. It was only an 'Anglican' rite from about 1532-1547.
This is a Roman Catholic Mass in the Sarum Missal of the Roman Rite on the Feast of Candlemas. It is not a Protestant mockery. What you are seeing is a true, valid Catholic Mass of Holy Mother Church.
@D Z Had augustus pugin been alive, he wouldve really liked this! Wish the old sarum liturgy was more accessible like the tridentine or traditional latin mass too. They did a sarum mass in philadelphia last year. The ordinariates could probably do that sorta thing the old sarum mass.
I am Western Rite Orthodox. We are in full communion with the Eastern Orthodox Church. We are not in communion with the Roman Catholic church. We use the St. Dunstan plainsong prayer book for Matins and Vespers.
I made this account back when I was very much into the Samurai warriors. I was taking Kendo and Iaido Martial Arts and developed a great love for those heroic warriors, many of whom adopted Catholicism upon the arrival of St. Francis Xavier. I am not into the Samurai as much as I used to, but I have yet to change my username.
This church and its ornaments are in agreement with the Sarum rite and with the "ornaments rubric" which prescribes pre-reformation altars and vestments. Iconography shows that English churches before the reformation used two altar candles at service time, no altar rails (these were introduced by 17c Bishop Laud) and no tabernacles. As an Anglican, I am grateful to the Roman Catholic authorities for authorising and producing this beautiful liturgy at Merton in 1997.
Have you read the history "The Stripping of the Altars" by Eamon Duffy?? It explores the Medieval English Catholic practice and gives a new interpretation on the old view of the inevitability of the Reformation's replacement of medieval English religious rites.
The Sarum Rite is an elaborate one requiring the presence of a priest, deacon, subdeacon and instituted acolyte (in modern terminology). The average parish will struggle to find the personnel to do this every Sunday. The Tridentine Rite requires just one priest in its Low Mass form.
Right: polyphony was very much in use before the Reformation-in England, the Yorkist Plantagenet royal house encouraged its use, and nearly all the greater institutions had professional musicians who provided polyphonic music, which they called 'prick song' as opposed to 'plain song' (the chant). Sarum chant is not always less ornamental than gregorian. In fact, the Sarum liturgy generally is more sumptuous and complicated than the Roman.
As Bruno says, it was used in most of England till 1549, and all of England 1553-59. Polyphony? Dunstable, Eton Choir Book, Taverner, Tallis, Shepherd, &c. The "Caput" masses were based on Sarum, as were the instrumental "In nomine" pieces all the way to Purcell.
For those of you who don't know your church history, the Sarum rite is the old English rite for celebration of the Eucharist, and it is preserved only at Salisbury Cathedral.
The Mass is the most beautiful act of Worship this side of Heaven Mr.Toricaballe, it's the modernist libby's and evangelicals who do not understand truth and beauty in worship, my parish upholds true Catholic reverent worship, i think it's people like the Masons and Benny Hinn who condradict truth
To Sohaila, are you thinking of something like the Liturgy of the Presanctified gifts in the Eastern Rites? As far as I know, in Latin Rite liturgical forms, one only prostrates when one is taking Holy Orders.
There seems to be confusion. I belong to a Catholic Church ( the Scottish Episcopal Church). It is a reformed Catholic Church, neither RC nor Protestant, yet part of the Anglican Communion, which comprises Catholic and Protestant Provinces. We adhere to the ancient Catholic traditions of The Church. The C of E, our neighbouring Anglican Province in the UK is Protestant, yet it includes Catholic churches, so all is not what it seems.
I listen to this and my mind my heart my body my Soul are one with god. How could anyone want to ban, do away with, reject, call it old fashion, change it. I don’t understand the society we live in today!!!!! Pope Francis would rather ban this and met with pagans and allow them to perform their their sick rituals right in the heart of the church.
@@quinkasbiome7989 It doesn’t really matter the church has been long dead Vatican II made sure of that. now it’s a freak show with a man in charge who gives pedophiles cushy jobs in the Vatican & treats the true believers as the enemy. He will find out soon enough the errors of his way.
@MenechemShaul So the Jews grumbled about him, because he said, “I am the bread that came down from heaven.” The Jews then disputed among themselves, saying, “How can this man give us his flesh to eat?” So Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. St. John (6.41, 52-53)
the Sarum Rite developed when England was in full communion with the Apostolic See in Rome and in 1549, the Mass was suppressed by Edward VI and Cranmer- so you can't claim an unbroken succession in use of the Sarum Rite by the C of E. It was only revived by the Ritualists in the 19th century
yes, Cramner moved from an early Lutheran view to the more radical Zwinglian view by the end of the 1530's-the language of BCP is beautiful but I for one would never have traded the Mass for it
I dont think that the Sarum Rite is being used by the Catholic Church at present, however there may be a small number of groups still using this Rite occasionally. I do know, however, that the faction of Anglicans calling themselves "Anglo-Catholics" or "Traditional Anglicans" are now trying to revive some of the vestments and rubrics of this Rite for use in their own protestant Rites, in order to appear in continuity with tradition which is not nescessarily "Roman"!
The Tallis Scholars / Peter Phillips have had a long association with Merton College; many of their recordings for Gimell were made in Merton College Chapel. If I were to hazard a guess, I'd say it was they. Also, that sounds like a mixed choir (adult female trebles) to my uneducated ear, which would square with the Tallis Scholars. Don't the Clerkes of Oxenford use mostly, if not exclusively, boy trebles?
This is a Roman Catholic Mass, celebrated according to the Use of Sarum. While the Sarum Rite is properly the Liturgy of the Church of England, they seldom (except in certain parishes?) celebrate it. This particular video is of a Roman Catholic celebration of this Liturgy.
This is a Catholic Mass of the Latin Rite according to the rubrics of the Sarum use as would have been celebrated before the protestant schism of the 16th century. The Sarum use was never the Liturgy of the English schismatic sect known as the “church” of England. The Liturgy of the “ Church” of England has always been the protestant Book of Common Prayer composed by the the heretical apostate schismatic Cranmer who completely and utterly rejected the Catholic Mass both in its theology and ceremonial expression.
The Sarum rite is not anglican. It is Roman Catholic drawing from reforms that the Normans initiated to old Celto-Saxon version of the Roman rite. This was initiated by St. Osmund, the bishop of Salisbury. So to say its origins are anglican would be innacurate as anglicanism was only introduced as part of the "protestant reformation."
Of course Salisbury had its own rite. There were several extant in England. The Tridentine Council actually abolished (restricted) most local liturgical rites, simply because it was a means of huddling the wagons to deal with the Reformation,. For some reason, a few rites of the west were retained, Lyon, Milan, and the rites of the individual religious orders.
Ese ornamento sagrado se llama TURIBULUM, y es usado especialmente en las misas solemnes. Compartimos el uso del Turibulum y del incienso tanto en la tradicion de la Iglesia catolica romana como en la Oriental (ortodoxa)
Though the Tridentine Mass was itself promulgated in 1570, and seldom modified in the following centuries, it was not a novelty; the rite was it had been celebrated for centuries past and was practically as Pope Saint Gregory the Great (d. 604) would have known it.
I think that this Church has a chancel screen, and we are watching this from the quire. Once one were to pass the chancel screen, the altar rail should be present. Additionally, in great European cathedrals, it is customary to keep the sacrament in a smaller chapel, rather than upon the main altar (viz. St. Peter's).
Do you mean Rite I? I also regret never having been to a 1928 Mass. My old parish, on the Sunday near our founding, would revive as many prayers from the 1928 BCP as allowed (since it is suppressed by TEC). There are parishes not in TEC which use the 1928 BCP or those within TEC that use the compromise Rite I (something like going to a Latin Novus Ordo Mass, like I did today). Anglican church music is good and the ICEL could learn something from the Anglicans about English language liturgy!
Is this a Roman Catholic or Anglo Catholic Mass? The Anglo Catholic Church still celebrates the Sarum Rite in places. Can somebody tell me what cathedral this mass was celebrated in?
The Sarum rite was actually far more elaborate than the Roman rite ever was. Notably, prior to the Reformation and the Counter-Reformation, every diocese and religious house in Britain and on the Continent had the right to compile and publish their own rites - missal, diurnal, grail, pontifical and so on. Rome's was by no means the only influential use on the Continent prior to the Reformation. The Counter-Reformation arrived at the position of making it as uniform as possible about 60 years after Cranmer did, and for the same reason: to erase liturgical confusion and abuse. However, Venice, Milan, some of the Iberian dioceses as well as other places continue to use their own rites rather than the Roman.
Nevermind, I misunderstood and thought you said their were Roman Catholic priests regularly celebrating liturgies according to the Salisbury use regularly today. Opps. It could easily be done with resources now available from liturgy and chant scholars, facscmiies old missals etc. Russian Orthodox use an anglican translation of it, but its not very popular.
Very beautiful. Let us all pray that the conciliar liturgical deforms may be rejected and that the traditional Latin rites in all regions of Europe be restored, next to the MIssal of Saint Pope Pius V. Let us pray that England may convert to Catholic unity and that the English martyrs will intercede for the conversion of the prideful, but beautiful English Isles. Beautiful Liturgy. Laus tibi Christe.
How would you know for sure? Fot the church is 10 years later, 2008, only in use by the anglican protestants... The catholic students use an other church.
Or, one could say that Rome is out of communion with the Churches of the East. The excommunications which started the Great Schism were as simultaneous as they could have been in the 11th Century. The East and West have taken great strides towards reconciliation, if not reunification - John Paul II returning relics and icons sacked from the Eastern churches, for example - but until problems such as Papal infallabiity and supremacy are worked through or abandoned, there will never be true unity.
Henry's marital problems were the catalyst, but other issues were festering. The break would have come sooner or later regardless of the male heir issue.
As I remember from earlier research, the vestments of this use would have had collars and not hoods, which seems a more modern use which I do not approve of, as it is not original but is rather an adaption from monastic use. It is true, however, that much of the ancient English Catholic church was related to Benedictines, such as Durham and, I believe Canterbury, and some others. Perhaps, some viewer might elucidate better on that point.
well, you have something there: the fact is that the majority (by which I mean nearly all) of English cathedrals were also monastic foundations. In many cases, religious houses were wealthier (and, therefore, more powerful) than the cathedral of the diocese in which they were situated, which made for some interesting rivalry and history. All were not Benedictine, of course: Carmelites, Augustinians and several species of Franciscans had very large holdings, which is why their wealth was so, er, attractive to Henry VIII.
Danny Berry: ---Yes, I understand your reference to the Benedictine cathedrals, which is understandable, since the Anglo-Saxons were largely Christianized by the Benedictines. What I was saying, however, about the hoods, is that in the old use, the medieval English vestments had high collars rather than hoods in my study of liturgical uses.. They also had square patches at the bottom of the albs in front and back as I remember, and as can be seen here at the beginning.
ah. Pardon my obtuseness. Yes--what you're referring to that appear to be collars are actually amices, which, in Anglican churches, are worn so that they look like collars. They're actually placed on the head like a hood and tied at the waist before the alb is put on and girded, and then pushed back. You mentioned the "patches" at the base of the skirt of albs: these are known as "apparels," and are often seen on amices as well. They may be the liturgical color, or they may be a color that compliments the liturgical color; and may be worn by crucifer, acolytes and others in the altar altar party. I'm old enough to remember that when Roman catholics still used amices, as a gesture to their older use, they touched the amice to the crown of the head before wrapping it around the shoulders and tying it. English amices are larger than their Continental counterparts, and, like much liturgical vesture, were designed to help clerics and assistants to stay warm in choir and sanctuary in very cold English churches in Winter!
¿A qué viene todo esto? parece que te equivocaste de comentario. Ciertamente los abusos sexuales no tienen que ver con usar el latín o no. Pero me gustaría que comentaras sobre el uso de sarum, que es lo pertinente aquí.
They didn't hijack it, they continued it. The English Church split off but kept doing the same things they had been doing for over 1000 years. It was a political dispute, not a theological one. Protestant influences gained control, however, but the Oxford movement in the 19th c. re-established the fundamental catholicity and orthodoxy of Anglicanism. The Sarum Rite was the basis for the original BCP until the radical chances in 1979 (akin to the Roman Catholic liturgical changes in 1970).
the Original Sarum Mass contained a commemoration of the Pope and so it does properly belong to the Catholic Church in Communion with the See of St Peter more then it does to the church that developed from the Reformation
This is what the nasty reformation abolished. It is actually not the Sarum Rite but the Sarum Usage. It is the Roman Rite as it was celebrated (or Used) in England.
The Sarum Rite was a Catholic Mass in mediæval times, before the Tridentine reforms. What that holds for this video is that the lovely polyphony would be absent.
I agree with you, for the most part, and wish and pray for a reunion. I have a book here written about the Orthodox churches, by an orhtodox priest, and is rather polemical to the Catholic church. It goes beyond just the issue of Rome's supremacy in some Orthodox circles, from what I can see. He is almost as hostile as some fundamentalists are. Hopefully he is not the norm!!
Indeed, there is an Orthodox Monastery in Australia or New Zealand that uses the Sarum Rite. I am not sure of its Jurisdiction, however. Clearly, I am certain of all the details, haha Of course, whether we should be using Western Liturgies is an open question, but obviously not one to discuss here.
no I totally understand how Anglo Catholics would use the Sarum Rite but I do see the Book of COmmon Prayers doctrinally as a break with the whole meaning of the Mass as Cranmer would freely admit
It's Mr. I'm glad to see that you are also a traditionally-minded Christian. The Catholic Church is going through a great crisis indeed. The Post-Vatican II environment has inflicted great pains on Holy Mother Church, but I cannot imagine that going to a Protestant sect can solve anything. We are called to remain loyal and defend the bastions of the Barque of St. Peter. Also, keep in mind that there is an Anglican Rite within the Catholic Church for converts from the C of E.
J Cargill I love the Tridentine but, I did agree as a youngster in Ireland that the Confiteor could be changed as it was a Gentile addition not part of the Jewish Passover Prayers said in the Temple in Jerusalem that Jesus attended with His Apostles on the night He was betrayed. Jews celebrated Passover of the Messiah in advance so Jews are all saved in advance . Virgin Mary most pure saved before time.
I agree to a point. The Roman Catholic Church is indeed the One True Church, but also too are the Eastern Orthodox Church[es]. The sacraments are acknowledged by Rome as being valid. The term 'schismatic' should be used in an historical sense, schism meaning 'divided'. The Orthodox are not heretical (teaching that which is not the truth), but are out of full communion with Rome. It is of great lament that the seamless garment has been rent asunder by human pride.
Roman Catholics may wish to explore the Eastern Catholic Rites (e.g. the Byzantine Rite), who are in communion with Rome, yet have maintained their own traditions despite the "reforms" of the Second Vatican Council.
Mindsprings57 The mass said in the Catholic Church Novus Ordo today is not the Mass of PaulVI that was slyly changed by dropping lines and in 1987 they had it right down to the Anglican communion . It was never promulgated by Rome.
As for Tridentine the only thing St. Pius V changed was everything after Ite Missa Est which currently there are only 3 things afterwards. God read and you will see that the Tridentine Mass originated at the time of ST. Gregory the Great. As for the Sarum Rite it is Catholic, has been and will be. Good look up Sarum rite and you'll see it was older than 200 years during Council of Trent and remained since that was the rule, older than 200 then it stays.
According to a customer review on Amazon (by "Hafizullah"), "Wulstan used girl sopranos who were trained to sound like boys (necessary because boys' voices break earlier nowadays)."
Please tell me that you are joking! "Priest wearing gothic chausable and maniple, deacon and sub-deacon in dalmatics", "High Altar against the east wall and Rood Screen", these you would have decried as "instruments of Papist idolatry" before the "Romanising" Oxford Movement introduced the decorum of Roman Catholic liturgy in Anglican worship! Look up "Tridentine Mass"; that was what the Catholic liturgy looked like from 1570 to 1969.
@fatimamovement Your putting the Holy Spirit into the Nominative or the Accusative case does not affect his temporal circumstances. John the Baptist is the Forerunner of Our Lord and the greatest of the prophets. Please don't talk nonsense.
I think that's all mike 4dogma does is post that same comment on every catholic video on TH-cam. I even got it in an email from him. Same exact comment! It seems as though he goes around complaining about the church so much he must not have any time to go practice the faith. no wonder they have such a big following. NOT!!!
You know Phil, I think I just figured out why you keep claiming I'm anti-American. I had a video in my favorites that had a picture of a Mexican flag flying over an American flag (a felony). However, despite the image, that video shows the heroic actions of an army vet who tears down that Mexican flag with his ka-bar knife. Search for "Jim Brossard" on TH-cam and you'll find that video. ... BTW, I live on the border region and I have worked with the Minutemen on several occasions.
Dear toricaballe, Open your Bible, wherein you will see that Our Lord Jesus Christ established His Church, "the pillar and ground of the truth" (I Timothy iii, 15), on Peter, and gave him the keys of the Kingdom of Heaven (Matthew xvi, 18--19) with a primacy in doctrinal teaching (John xxi); and that Jesus Christ is made truly present in the Eucharist (John vi) confected by a priest who has received Apostolic authority through imposition of hands (Acts vi, 6 & xiii, 3).
Sadly enough, an Anglican chapel may just be more suitable for a Catholic Mass than most Catholic churches. I had to smile when I saw an ultramodern Anglican cathedral, compleat with female clergy, but which had a quire and chancel screen! :)
@dsindc Just consider this: St. Peter was the first Bishop of Rome, ergo the first Pope, and since then the Bishop of Rome has had a position of authority within the universal Church. That, my friends, can't be undone.
Read the very first posts, Phil. You made a comment saying that this Mass was Protestant. I calmly said it was not using facts and civility. You responded viciously. I even had to delete your comment on my channel due to the level of insults! In regard to your holy orders, who were you ordained by? I'll investigate the matter for myself, but if it is not by a Bishop with valid faculties, then, I'm sorry, but I cannot give credence to a fallacy.
I cordially disagree with ramesses88. The bishops of the Holy Orthodox Christian Church have repeatedly said that no union between East and West is possible until Rome renounces all of its heresies--not the least of which is papal supremacy. MrLamontSanford: most Orthodox Christians are deeply grieved that Rome separated itself from Jesus's own Church.
Yes, this is a Roman Catholic Mass, according to the Sarum rite, celebrated in the Anglican chapel of Merton College, Oxford. This was done in 1997 with the cooperation of Roman Catholic authorities (to allow the historic rite) and College authorities (to allow a Roman Catholic mass in an Anglican chapel). Such cooperation is lacking in many of the previous comments.
Warren Steel do you know which priest celebrated this mass?
@@wyllowgrayson8531 : I don't know the name of the celebrant. The event was sponsored by the Oxford Newman Society. A blog by an insider shows the entire mass with annotations beginning at valleadurni.blogspot.com/2008/02/sarum-candlemas-01.html
@@wyllowgrayson8531The name of the priest is Father Tim Finnegan.
@@mudwsSorry for answering 4 years later, but it is Fr. Tim Finnegan.
This was celebrated on the Feast of Candlemas. I was the cameraman!
Do you have the full video??
This is the Choir of the Church of Our Lady at Lisson Grove in London under the direction of Claude Crozet. They are a mixed voice choir. I should know, I was one of the singers that day - 2nd Bass. The Mass was genuinely Roman Catholic and was organised by the Newman Society of Oxford University in Merton College Chapel. It was a truly fabulous occasion and is for me a spiritual and musical high water mark. A reminder of what might have been in England had the Reformation taken another turn.
Anglo-Catholics, as I was, see the Anglican church as a schism (falling apart of communion) rather than a rebellion, as was the Protestant reformation. The Sarum Rite is the traditional, pre-English Reformation, rite ("Sarum" is the old Latin old name for the city of Salisbury).
Many regions had their own rites that were suppressed at Trent but now we primarily know the Tridentine (Extraordinary) and Paul VI (Ordinary) forms of the Roman Rite and the Byzantine Rite in the East.
The two candles on the altar show it to be Sarum if nothing else. The ceremonial of the Sarum Rite is more elaborate than most. It is a shame it was not reinstated when the Hierarchy was reinstated in England
This particular local Sarum Use inside the Latin Rite Church should become the liturgy of the returning High Church ex-Anglicans (Traditional Anglican Communion etc.), as far as they do not use the classical Roman Rite. This is a Catholic Holy Sacrifice of the Mass, valid if confected by validly ordained Priests (and not by ministers), and an age-old treasury of Catholic England since the Middle Ages. Saint Osmund, pray for us and the conversion of Britain!
I'm still ignorant of how rites are organized in the church. If Anglicans wish to return to full communion with Rome does that mean they'll be back under the Roman/Latin rite or will they be given their own particular sui juris church as a means to maintain their own liturgies?
Great! Embarrassing as a Catholic to say we got rid of this and now our showpiece liturgy is "Yaweh, I know you are near!" Fortunately these types of liturgies, with Benedict's encouragement, are returning. High Churched Anglicans -please come to our Church and bring this with you!!!
Actually, Henry VIII got rid of the Sarum Rite although it did influence the Anglican liturgy (Book of Common Prayer) that replaced it in the Anglican Church.
Im fairly sure the sarum right was in use untill Elizibeth 1st?
I'm a Protestant, but this video is painfully beautiful. (So beautiful it physically hurts!)
The Use of Sarum is authorized by the Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, and Anglican Communion churches.
The music being sung is not the Western Wynde Mass, though it is correct that that setting was written for the Sarum Use of Mass.This music is 'Gaude, Gaude, Mater' by Sheppard, as an offertory motet. The Mass setting that was sung at this Mass was, if I remember correctly, Tallis' Missa Puer Natus est Nobis'.
It is not the tridentine variant of the Roman rite, but a pre-tridentine variant (use) used in England before the reformation, The Sarum Use.
These are Roman Catholic priests celebrating the Rite of Sarum, the predominant liturgical rite in Britain prior to the Reformation. They are not Anglican.
Joshua Smith Really? What’s the proof? This is an Anglican Chapel. And why Roman Catholic did use Sarum rite? Was it legal to be used by RC priests at that time? I doubt.
Wow, you people are so sure of your (rash) judgments. Yes, this is a Catholic Mass. No, it is not Tridentine --- it is, as advertised, Sarum Rite. I personally know one of the acolytes involved in this Mass. At the time, he was head of the Oxford Newman Society. This was a special initiative with approval of the Diocesan Ordinary. The choir was, at least in part, from Lisson Grove.
A stop to celebrating the Sarum Mass by canonical Roman Catholic priests was made soon after this Mass.
Sean Connolly p
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The Sarum use was in almost universal English, Scottish, Welsh and Irish use (with some local variations in Hereford, York, Bangor, Aberdeen and a few other smaller places) from the middle ages through to 1558, and sporadically after that. It was only an 'Anglican' rite from about 1532-1547.
This is a Roman Catholic Mass in the Sarum Missal of the Roman Rite on the Feast of Candlemas. It is not a Protestant mockery.
What you are seeing is a true, valid Catholic Mass of Holy Mother Church.
Its a Catholic mass but sounds like a eastern orthodox. So amazing!
@D Z Had augustus pugin been alive, he wouldve really liked this! Wish the old sarum liturgy was more accessible like the tridentine or traditional latin mass too. They did a sarum mass in philadelphia last year. The ordinariates could probably do that sorta thing the old sarum mass.
I am Western Rite Orthodox. We are in full communion with the Eastern Orthodox Church. We are not in communion with the Roman Catholic church. We use the St. Dunstan plainsong prayer book for Matins and Vespers.
That’s because, correct me if I’m wrong, that this rite was used before the schism
I made this account back when I was very much into the Samurai warriors. I was taking Kendo and Iaido Martial Arts and developed a great love for those heroic warriors, many of whom adopted Catholicism upon the arrival of St. Francis Xavier.
I am not into the Samurai as much as I used to, but I have yet to change my username.
Does Sarum rite have something like "sarum chants"? Or do they hace to use chants from the roman rite (gregorian and sacred polyphony)?
From what I have read they are missing about 15 sacred ministers.
This church and its ornaments are in agreement with the Sarum rite and with the "ornaments rubric" which prescribes pre-reformation altars and vestments. Iconography shows that English churches before the reformation used two altar candles at service time, no altar rails (these were introduced by 17c Bishop Laud) and no tabernacles. As an Anglican, I am grateful to the Roman Catholic authorities for authorising and producing this beautiful liturgy at Merton in 1997.
Phenomenal liturgy!
Have you read the history "The Stripping of the Altars" by Eamon Duffy?? It explores the Medieval English Catholic practice and gives a new interpretation on the old view of the inevitability of the Reformation's replacement of medieval English religious rites.
The Sarum Rite is an elaborate one requiring the presence of a priest, deacon, subdeacon and instituted acolyte (in modern terminology). The average parish will struggle to find the personnel to do this every Sunday. The Tridentine Rite requires just one priest in its Low Mass form.
Right: polyphony was very much in use before the Reformation-in England, the Yorkist Plantagenet royal house encouraged its use, and nearly all the greater institutions had professional musicians who provided polyphonic music, which they called 'prick song' as opposed to 'plain song' (the chant).
Sarum chant is not always less ornamental than gregorian. In fact, the Sarum liturgy generally is more sumptuous and complicated than the Roman.
As Bruno says, it was used in most of England till 1549, and all of England 1553-59. Polyphony? Dunstable, Eton Choir Book, Taverner, Tallis, Shepherd, &c. The "Caput" masses were based on Sarum, as were the instrumental "In nomine" pieces all the way to Purcell.
Also... there would have been polyphony. The Western Wynde Masses, for instance, were written sepcifically for this rite
For those of you who don't know your church history, the Sarum rite is the old English rite for celebration of the Eucharist, and it is preserved only at Salisbury Cathedral.
The first part of this video could have been taken at Christ Church New Haven. This truly the beauty of holiness!
The Mass is the most beautiful act of Worship this side of Heaven Mr.Toricaballe, it's the modernist libby's and evangelicals who do not understand truth and beauty in worship, my parish upholds true Catholic reverent worship, i think it's people like the Masons and Benny Hinn who condradict truth
To Sohaila, are you thinking of something like the Liturgy of the Presanctified gifts in the Eastern Rites? As far as I know, in Latin Rite liturgical forms, one only prostrates when one is taking Holy Orders.
Would work better in a church with a (rood) screen.
How very beautiful. Pax vobiscum.
There seems to be confusion. I belong to a Catholic Church ( the Scottish Episcopal Church). It is a reformed Catholic Church, neither RC nor Protestant, yet part of the Anglican Communion, which comprises Catholic and Protestant Provinces. We adhere to the ancient Catholic traditions of The Church. The C of E, our neighbouring Anglican Province in the UK is Protestant, yet it includes Catholic churches, so all is not what it seems.
I listen to this and my mind my heart my body my Soul are one with god. How could anyone want to ban, do away with, reject, call it old fashion, change it. I don’t understand the society we live in today!!!!! Pope Francis would rather ban this and met with pagans and allow them to perform their their sick rituals right in the heart of the church.
This aged like milk
@@quinkasbiome7989 It doesn’t really matter the church has been long dead Vatican II made sure of that. now it’s a freak show with a man in charge who gives pedophiles cushy jobs in the Vatican & treats the true believers as the enemy. He will find out soon enough the errors of his way.
@MenechemShaul So the Jews grumbled about him, because he said, “I am the bread that came down from heaven.”
The Jews then disputed among themselves, saying, “How can this man give us his flesh to eat?” So Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. St. John (6.41, 52-53)
the Sarum Rite developed when England was in full communion with the Apostolic See in Rome and in 1549, the Mass was suppressed by Edward VI and Cranmer- so you can't claim an unbroken succession in use of the Sarum Rite by the C of E. It was only revived by the Ritualists in the 19th century
Not sure if Gaude, Gaude Maria is the proper introit. Sometimes these sort of things are not too authentic, although the singing is splendid.
yes, Cramner moved from an early Lutheran view to the more radical Zwinglian view by the end of the 1530's-the language of BCP is beautiful but I for one would never have traded the Mass for it
The music Gaude Maria is very beatiful, but, where is the sound?
I dont think that the Sarum Rite is being used by the Catholic Church at present, however there may be a small number of groups still using this Rite occasionally.
I do know, however, that the faction of Anglicans calling themselves "Anglo-Catholics" or "Traditional Anglicans" are now trying to revive some of the vestments and rubrics of this Rite for use in their own protestant Rites, in order to appear in continuity with tradition which is not nescessarily "Roman"!
The Tallis Scholars / Peter Phillips have had a long association with Merton College; many of their recordings for Gimell were made in Merton College Chapel. If I were to hazard a guess, I'd say it was they.
Also, that sounds like a mixed choir (adult female trebles) to my uneducated ear, which would square with the Tallis Scholars. Don't the Clerkes of Oxenford use mostly, if not exclusively, boy trebles?
This is a Roman Catholic Mass, celebrated according to the Use of Sarum. While the Sarum Rite is properly the Liturgy of the Church of England, they seldom (except in certain parishes?) celebrate it. This particular video is of a Roman Catholic celebration of this Liturgy.
This is a Catholic Mass of the Latin Rite according to the rubrics of the Sarum use as would have been celebrated before the protestant schism of the 16th century. The Sarum use was never the Liturgy of the English schismatic sect known as the “church” of England. The Liturgy of the “ Church” of England has always been the protestant Book of Common Prayer composed by the the heretical apostate schismatic Cranmer who completely and utterly rejected the Catholic Mass both in its theology and ceremonial expression.
In this case, by "Church of England", I meant the historical Church IN England, as it existed prior to the English Reformation.@@giovanniserafino1731
The Sarum rite is not anglican. It is Roman Catholic drawing from reforms that the Normans initiated to old Celto-Saxon version of the Roman rite. This was initiated by St. Osmund, the bishop of Salisbury. So to say its origins are anglican would be innacurate as anglicanism was only introduced as part of the "protestant reformation."
Of course Salisbury had its own rite. There were several extant in England. The Tridentine Council actually abolished (restricted) most local liturgical rites, simply because it was a means of huddling the wagons to deal with the Reformation,. For some reason, a few rites of the west were retained, Lyon, Milan, and the rites of the individual religious orders.
Ese ornamento sagrado se llama TURIBULUM, y es usado especialmente en las misas solemnes. Compartimos el uso del Turibulum y del incienso tanto en la tradicion de la Iglesia catolica romana como en la Oriental (ortodoxa)
Though the Tridentine Mass was itself promulgated in 1570, and seldom modified in the following centuries, it was not a novelty; the rite was it had been celebrated for centuries past and was practically as Pope Saint Gregory the Great (d. 604) would have known it.
It is a Roman Catholic service in an Anglican chapel.
I think that this Church has a chancel screen, and we are watching this from the quire. Once one were to pass the chancel screen, the altar rail should be present. Additionally, in great European cathedrals, it is customary to keep the sacrament in a smaller chapel, rather than upon the main altar (viz. St. Peter's).
Do you mean Rite I?
I also regret never having been to a 1928 Mass. My old parish, on the Sunday near our founding, would revive as many prayers from the 1928 BCP as allowed (since it is suppressed by TEC). There are parishes not in TEC which use the 1928 BCP or those within TEC that use the compromise Rite I (something like going to a Latin Novus Ordo Mass, like I did today).
Anglican church music is good and the ICEL could learn something from the Anglicans about English language liturgy!
Is the entire Mass for view anywhere? The Sarum rite is definitely wotrh preserving
@dsindc May the good Lord have mercy on you and show you His light and find peace in mind and hearth.
khylle73,
they're kissing the book of the Gospels.
And please please, someone upload the whole mass! In separate parts here on TH-cam or Google Video.
Wonderful resources. Do you have any footage of the Dominican rite or has it been supressed?
Is this a Roman Catholic or Anglo Catholic Mass? The Anglo Catholic Church still celebrates the Sarum Rite in places. Can somebody tell me what cathedral this mass was celebrated in?
ofcourse :)
The Sarum Rite is only the Roman Missal published and used at Sailsbury Cathedral.
Catholic Traditional: I understand it had some different uses, therefore is a Use rather than a separate Rite.
The Sarum rite was actually far more elaborate than the Roman rite ever was. Notably, prior to the Reformation and the Counter-Reformation, every diocese and religious house in Britain and on the Continent had the right to compile and publish their own rites - missal, diurnal, grail, pontifical and so on. Rome's was by no means the only influential use on the Continent prior to the Reformation. The Counter-Reformation arrived at the position of making it as uniform as possible about 60 years after Cranmer did, and for the same reason: to erase liturgical confusion and abuse. However, Venice, Milan, some of the Iberian dioceses as well as other places continue to use their own rites rather than the Roman.
Nevermind, I misunderstood and thought you said their were Roman Catholic priests regularly celebrating liturgies according to the Salisbury use regularly today. Opps. It could easily be done with resources now available from liturgy and chant scholars, facscmiies old missals etc. Russian Orthodox use an anglican translation of it, but its not very popular.
where's the sound?
Very beautiful. Let us all pray that the conciliar liturgical deforms may be rejected and that the traditional Latin rites in all regions of Europe be restored, next to the MIssal of Saint Pope Pius V. Let us pray that England may convert to Catholic unity and that the English martyrs will intercede for the conversion of the prideful, but beautiful English Isles. Beautiful Liturgy. Laus tibi Christe.
How would you know for sure? Fot the church is 10 years later, 2008, only in use by the anglican protestants... The catholic students use an other church.
Sound is broken. :(
Magnificent. Deo Gratias.
Or, one could say that Rome is out of communion with the Churches of the East. The excommunications which started the Great Schism were as simultaneous as they could have been in the 11th Century. The East and West have taken great strides towards reconciliation, if not reunification - John Paul II returning relics and icons sacked from the Eastern churches, for example - but until problems such as Papal infallabiity and supremacy are worked through or abandoned, there will never be true unity.
Henry's marital problems were the catalyst, but other issues were festering. The break would have come sooner or later regardless of the male heir issue.
How might I contact one of these priests?
Tem muito, acabou o ocidente
As I remember from earlier research, the vestments of this use would have had collars and not hoods, which seems a more modern use which I do not approve of, as it is not original but is rather an adaption from monastic use. It is true, however, that much of the ancient English Catholic church was related to Benedictines, such as Durham and, I believe Canterbury, and some others. Perhaps, some viewer might elucidate better on that point.
well, you have something there: the fact is that the majority (by which I mean nearly all) of English cathedrals were also monastic foundations. In many cases, religious houses were wealthier (and, therefore, more powerful) than the cathedral of the diocese in which they were situated, which made for some interesting rivalry and history. All were not Benedictine, of course: Carmelites, Augustinians and several species of Franciscans had very large holdings, which is why their wealth was so, er, attractive to Henry VIII.
Danny Berry: ---Yes, I understand your reference to the Benedictine cathedrals, which is understandable, since the Anglo-Saxons were largely Christianized by the Benedictines.
What I was saying, however, about the hoods, is that in the old use, the medieval English vestments had high collars rather than hoods in my study of liturgical uses.. They also had square patches at the bottom of the albs in front and back as I remember, and as can be seen here at the beginning.
ah. Pardon my obtuseness. Yes--what you're referring to that appear to be collars are actually amices, which, in Anglican churches, are worn so that they look like collars. They're actually placed on the head like a hood and tied at the waist before the alb is put on and girded, and then pushed back. You mentioned the "patches" at the base of the skirt of albs: these are known as "apparels," and are often seen on amices as well. They may be the liturgical color, or they may be a color that compliments the liturgical color; and may be worn by crucifer, acolytes and others in the altar altar party. I'm old enough to remember that when Roman catholics still used amices, as a gesture to their older use, they touched the amice to the crown of the head before wrapping it around the shoulders and tying it. English amices are larger than their Continental counterparts, and, like much liturgical vesture, were designed to help clerics and assistants to stay warm in choir and sanctuary in very cold English churches in Winter!
¿A qué viene todo esto?
parece que te equivocaste de comentario. Ciertamente los abusos sexuales no tienen que ver con usar el latín o no.
Pero me gustaría que comentaras sobre el uso de sarum, que es lo pertinente aquí.
They didn't hijack it, they continued it. The English Church split off but kept doing the same things they had been doing for over 1000 years. It was a political dispute, not a theological one. Protestant influences gained control, however, but the Oxford movement in the 19th c. re-established the fundamental catholicity and orthodoxy of Anglicanism.
The Sarum Rite was the basis for the original BCP until the radical chances in 1979 (akin to the Roman Catholic liturgical changes in 1970).
the Original Sarum Mass contained a commemoration of the Pope and so it does properly belong to the Catholic Church in Communion with the See of St Peter more then it does to the church that developed from the Reformation
This is what the nasty reformation abolished. It is actually not the Sarum Rite but the Sarum Usage. It is the Roman Rite as it was celebrated (or Used) in England.
The Sarum Rite was a Catholic Mass in mediæval times, before the Tridentine reforms. What that holds for this video is that the lovely polyphony would be absent.
I agree with you, for the most part, and wish and pray for a reunion. I have a book here written about the Orthodox churches, by an orhtodox priest, and is rather polemical to the Catholic church. It goes beyond just the issue of Rome's supremacy in some Orthodox circles, from what I can see. He is almost as hostile as some fundamentalists are. Hopefully he is not the norm!!
Is this High Church Anglicanism or Roman Catholic??
Indeed, there is an Orthodox Monastery in Australia or New Zealand that uses the Sarum Rite. I am not sure of its Jurisdiction, however. Clearly, I am certain of all the details, haha
Of course, whether we should be using Western Liturgies is an open question, but obviously not one to discuss here.
Latin - therefore probably Catholic. Remember that the 39 Articles specify vernacular in liturgy.
no I totally understand how Anglo Catholics would use the Sarum Rite but I do see the Book of COmmon Prayers doctrinally as a break with the whole meaning of the Mass as Cranmer would freely admit
Sarum....Salisbury (UK) Is it not the C.of E High Church rite?
It's Mr.
I'm glad to see that you are also a traditionally-minded Christian. The Catholic Church is going through a great crisis indeed. The Post-Vatican II environment has inflicted great pains on Holy Mother Church, but I cannot imagine that going to a Protestant sect can solve anything. We are called to remain loyal and defend the bastions of the Barque of St. Peter. Also, keep in mind that there is an Anglican Rite within the Catholic Church for converts from the C of E.
is this anglican or roman catholic?
Interesting, beautiful. Looks different from the Tridentine.
J Cargill I love the Tridentine but, I did agree as a youngster in Ireland that the Confiteor could be changed as it was a Gentile addition not part of the Jewish Passover Prayers said in the Temple in Jerusalem that Jesus attended with His Apostles on the night He was betrayed. Jews celebrated Passover of the Messiah in advance so Jews are all saved in advance .
Virgin Mary most pure saved before time.
@lichtbroeder Except this is a Catholic Mass...
I agree to a point. The Roman Catholic Church is indeed the One True Church, but also too are the Eastern Orthodox Church[es]. The sacraments are acknowledged by Rome as being valid. The term 'schismatic' should be used in an historical sense, schism meaning 'divided'. The Orthodox are not heretical (teaching that which is not the truth), but are out of full communion with Rome. It is of great lament that the seamless garment has been rent asunder by human pride.
Why not become Orthodox? There are some Orthodox who celebrate the Sarum Rite Mass. They are unde the Russian Orthodox Church I think.
Roman Catholics may wish to explore the Eastern Catholic Rites (e.g. the Byzantine Rite), who are in communion with Rome, yet have maintained their own traditions despite the "reforms" of the Second Vatican Council.
Mindsprings57 The mass said in the Catholic Church Novus Ordo today is not the Mass of PaulVI that was slyly changed by dropping lines and in 1987 they had it right down to the Anglican communion . It was never promulgated by Rome.
As for Tridentine the only thing St. Pius V changed was everything after Ite Missa Est which currently there are only 3 things afterwards. God read and you will see that the Tridentine Mass originated at the time of ST. Gregory the Great. As for the Sarum Rite it is Catholic, has been and will be. Good look up Sarum rite and you'll see it was older than 200 years during Council of Trent and remained since that was the rule, older than 200 then it stays.
Anglican Sarum Rites.
According to a customer review on Amazon (by "Hafizullah"), "Wulstan used girl sopranos who were trained to sound like boys (necessary because boys' voices break earlier nowadays)."
Please tell me that you are joking!
"Priest wearing gothic chausable and maniple, deacon and sub-deacon in dalmatics", "High Altar against the east wall and Rood Screen", these you would have decried as "instruments of Papist idolatry" before the "Romanising" Oxford Movement introduced the decorum of Roman Catholic liturgy in Anglican worship! Look up "Tridentine Mass"; that was what the Catholic liturgy looked like from 1570 to 1969.
@fatimamovement Your putting the Holy Spirit into the Nominative or the Accusative case does not affect his temporal circumstances. John the Baptist is the Forerunner of Our Lord and the greatest of the prophets. Please don't talk nonsense.
I think that's all mike 4dogma does is post that same comment on every catholic video on TH-cam. I even got it in an email from him. Same exact comment! It seems as though he goes around complaining about the church so much he must not have any time to go practice the faith. no wonder they have such a big following. NOT!!!
I know a man who is an acolyte in this video. It's Catholic.
@lichtbroeder View it in 240p.
I didnt know anglicans wear those type of vestments I thought they wear those albs with the scarf things.
Glory to Jesus Christ!
You know Phil, I think I just figured out why you keep claiming I'm anti-American. I had a video in my favorites that had a picture of a Mexican flag flying over an American flag (a felony). However, despite the image, that video shows the heroic actions of an army vet who tears down that Mexican flag with his ka-bar knife. Search for "Jim Brossard" on TH-cam and you'll find that video.
... BTW, I live on the border region and I have worked with the Minutemen on several occasions.
Correct.
Dear toricaballe,
Open your Bible, wherein you will see that Our Lord Jesus Christ established His Church, "the pillar and ground of the truth" (I Timothy iii, 15), on Peter, and gave him the keys of the Kingdom of Heaven (Matthew xvi, 18--19) with a primacy in doctrinal teaching (John xxi); and that Jesus Christ is made truly present in the Eucharist (John vi) confected by a priest who has received Apostolic authority through imposition of hands (Acts vi, 6 & xiii, 3).
Sadly enough, an Anglican chapel may just be more suitable for a Catholic Mass than most Catholic churches. I had to smile when I saw an ultramodern Anglican cathedral, compleat with female clergy, but which had a quire and chancel screen! :)
@dsindc Just consider this: St. Peter was the first Bishop of Rome, ergo the first Pope, and since then the Bishop of Rome has had a position of authority within the universal Church. That, my friends, can't be undone.
Read the very first posts, Phil. You made a comment saying that this Mass was Protestant. I calmly said it was not using facts and civility. You responded viciously. I even had to delete your comment on my channel due to the level of insults! In regard to your holy orders, who were you ordained by? I'll investigate the matter for myself, but if it is not by a Bishop with valid faculties, then, I'm sorry, but I cannot give credence to a fallacy.
I cordially disagree with ramesses88. The bishops of the Holy Orthodox Christian Church have repeatedly said that no union between East and West is possible until Rome renounces all of its heresies--not the least of which is papal supremacy. MrLamontSanford: most Orthodox Christians are deeply grieved that Rome separated itself from Jesus's own Church.
As if the anglicans never sing Latin?
It is obviously an English Church.
But I still don't know if it's catholic or anglican...