The 10 Different Types Of Dragon Ball Canon Explained
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 ก.ย. 2024
- #DragonBallZ #DragonBallSuper #DragonBallGT
Canon is one of the most common words used in the Dragon Ball fandom. Fans spend years debating what is canon and what is non-canon. In today's video we explain how canon in dragon ball evolves. The truth about Dragon Ball canon is more complex than meets the eye. Qaaman breaks down Dragon Ball, Dragon Ball Z, Dragon Ball Super, Dragon Ball GT and Dragon Ball Magic.
Artist: finn487
![[TH] RNT vs SPG - VCT Ascension Pacific - Day 1](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/RUTkf8Detj8/mqdefault.jpg)
It cracks me up how Dragon Ball nowadays has kinda become one of those CHOOSE YOUR ADVENTURE type books lmaoo
Original Story DB to DBZ
DB to DBZ + Bardock special
DB to DBZ + Bardock Special + Certain movies from the original 13 you can squeeze in & make them fit the story
DB to DBZ + Bardock special + Certian DBZ movies + Dragonball GT
DB to DBZ to Super
DB to DBZ to Super (But actively ignoring the bad parts)
Etc Etc etc.
hahahaha
Not even mentioning which dubs and soundtracks
@@doodguytheblank2403 Talk about opening a can of worms! That means there's a canon where Goku calls Yakon Miss Portugal of '97 XD
or Dragon Ball Minus, which leads up to Super and makes tarble canon in DBS broly movie, so Yo son goku happened etc
Technically the Grand Kai does exist in the manga canon, we just never see him. He gets mentioned by Piccolo when he asks Shin if he's the Grand Kai.
If what you are saying is true I made an error. I'll re-read that segmentn
I thought that was only in the anime but I have not read the manga in years.
Dragon Ball fans have a greater addiction to the word "canon" than JJK fans have to the word "fraud" 💀💀
😂😂
💀
I mean JJK is hella recent compared to DB so this is child's play.
@@aidanlyons25 Give it time, it'll grow like Broly 💀
Jjk fans are like 20 years younger and they are already as equally gullible and power scale addicted.
Fun fact: Grand Kai is mentioned by name in the original manga
The fact that there’s so many iterations of the story I know that people still debate on what’s supposed to be the true source/continuations just goes to show that using the word “canon” makes any show with multiple iterations/continuations just hell to deal with
People that care for canon: *skinny,bitchless,ugly,wears glasses,smelly,no life,weak
People that understand that its a multiverse and everything is canonical and just alternate timelines and there is no canon: *Literally Gigachad
strongest canon fan vs weakest multiverse enjoyer
I think the problem with Super is the fact that it adds stuff but in the process contradicts past canon
Potara is supposed to be PERMANENT not just 1 hour because the Vegito vs. Majin Buu fight lasted MORE than just an HOUR which contradicts the 1 hour time limit
In short, because Toriyama wasn't taking notes for his own story and also didn't seem to look at his work again once it is completed, we have now all these different sized cannon balls all seemingly belonging to the same cannon.
And as result everyone is rightfully confused about Dragon Ball in an equal manner...which means that as fellow idiots we apparently are allowed to wage war over this.
To be fair, the anime changes were not done by him, and both the Super anime and manga are not written by him directly, only the movies.
That's exactly my point
@@digiing1992 Your point is that a creator doesn't have complete control of his adaptation?
@@zenoblues7787 yes, after all you have to sign a contract with the studio to allow them to use your work but once your name is on the paper, the chance is there that it is out of your hands depending on what's written on said contract.
⬆️ that's the general stuff but from what I have seen Toriyama do with his works, he's rather nonchalant what others do with it, well, minus Dragon Ball Evolution, because that movie adaptation irked Toriyama enough to come back to Dragon Ball with making Battle of Gods.
Honestly I love this breakdown of the different dragon ball canons!!!
This is such a unique Dragon Ball "quirk." Like, im also a Naruto fan but Naruto fans don't split the movies, the filler, the boruto anime, The boruto manga, the boruto movie, the games, the anime and manga into separate canons or at the very least they aren't as canon obsessed as Dragon ball fans are. Most of them acknowledge the Naruto manga as canon and ignore the existence of Boruto and thats as far as they go
Star wars and transformers/Sonic also have similar canon debates but in terms of anime Dragon Ball is special in that regard.
@@justinarzola4584 Star Wars and Transformers is correct, but Sonic debates have quieted down now that everything is officially canon, except games SEGA doesn't own like Pocket Adventure and Chronicles.
Lol you're kidding yourself about Naruto mate.
Plenty of people are begging for a Kai version of the anime DESPITE many others saying the anime just muddles things.
And literally most of the movies can be attributed to What-if scenarios especially the post timeskip ones.
But yeah the Naruto fanbase definitely has very similar hangups.
@@justinarzola4584only Marvel And DC hás more canons than dragon ball kkkk
I would love if we got a dedicated anime or even manga about the 7 years Goku spent in the underworld. I think they could actually come up with some good material and it would have that classic "adventure" feel to it as well.
Unfortunately we're getting Dragon Ball Magic instead...
So in other words there is no official Dragon Ball canon
Maybe if you stop at the original manga, but that's not much fun.
I've been telling people that there's no such thing as one singular canon in the world of DB, and now maybe they'll get the message with this awesome breakdown! Or maybe not because this fandom is more bullheaded than a donkey.
Depends on when you told them and under which context?
Kai isn't a separate canon from the original manga source. You can't erase that no matter how crappy the TV only broadcast get.
I'm glad Qaaman still makes dragon ball videos. Respect for still having passion for it. Still high quality videos.
Drinking game idea. Take a shot for every time Qaaman says the word Canon
For the vegeta's brother situation it could be he didnt know his brother survived at first. You can also make sense of it by saying he found in the afterlife when he found out about ssj3 goku. It could be as easy as asking the check in station.
Though it's werid tarble was never in contact with vegeta or showed up during Z so i guess he thought vegeta was dead too.
@@justinarzola4584 tarble not contacting vegeta after his whole race was destroyed by that universe emperor. Who knew the god of destruction. Not only that. Information probably took awhile. Also tarble is small and saiyan are warrior race. Vegeta not mentioning tarble. Makes since to me. Tarble not much of a fighter. So he probably doesn't try to go find vegeta.
@blackheart4360 that's a whole lot of cope.
I thought DBGT was canon to the original Z anime, as it was even mentioned in the last episode of Z. I think it was intentionally supposed to be a direct continuation of the Z anime.
it is
It was supposed to be a direct continuation but just like the movies it might aswell be just a different timeline.
The end of Dragon Ball proper has been rebooted twice now.
Ive been subscribed to you for years and youre still cranking out quality content. ✊🏽
Only thing I can add to this is that retcons don't automatically make something "non-canon" to something else. For example Raditz originally tells Goku that his planet exploded 3 years ago...then the date changed to 24 years (somewhere around there)...then it was revealed that it was done by Frieza. None of these changes caused a new canon to form...its within DBZ's nature to retcon itself or have inconsistant writing. Its just easier to take classifications of the narrative like "what's the series is called" or "manga/show/movie/ova/special/game ect." and ask ourselves "ok so where does this fit into the story so far?"...what's weird is that as a result we've collectively just made every seperation its own canon...and its a little suspicious to assume its all just a coinsedence.
The most useful way to establish canon (from my perspective anyways) is just to establish what's an adaptation and what's a continuation. For example DB and DBZ anime are adaptations of the og manga with GT being a direct continuation of said anime series. Super would be an alternate continuation of the anime series...some people seem to insist that Super is a continuation of the original manga but I see no evidence of this personally.
TL;DR Canon doesn't matter. Every DBZ related thing had an influence on future DBZ things. (For example the reason Vegito was used in the Buu saga was cause Gogeta was used in movie 12 and Toriyama didn't want to be redundant by using Gogeta again even tho he designed him first...thus showing that Toriyama doesn't just influence Toei's descisions but it works the other way around too.) What matters is the execution of each story and the artistic intention and all that. I personally view the whole canon thing as just a fun mental excersise to try and fit the whole story together in different parts...but yeah one should never take it too seriously...lol :P
Radtiz never said Planet Vegeta was destroyed 3 years ago,where did you get that?
@@veryangryboi4128 He says that when he first talks to Goku and starts talking about the history of the saiyans. Its literately the second episode of the show (DBZ uncut version/japaneese version). I know I'm not misremembering it cause its a very well known retcon of the show (and I've seen a youtuber poke fun of it in a dbz parody sketch).
Curious tho...have you not seen the begining of the saiyan saga in a while or what?
If canon doesn't matter it would've never been introduced.
And I mean that across the board for all other shounen too.
@Alienrun
Well to my knowledge that's not the type of retcon that would call the canon status into question because it still falls under The Word of God.
No matter how jarring the revelation of Goku's origin or the retcon of The Evil Demon Clan now being aliens, it's Toriyama making the changes.
Now if Lapis and Lazuli weren't the changes AT was behind and didn't implement I would say that's a retcon that changes canon because that revelation didn't occur in the original material.
I just think that GT is the same Canon as the Anime Canon because they did show a GT preview on the Final DBZ episode, and they kinda consider some Movies? I mean, Cooler, Garlic Jr., Gohan's Great Dragon, there is some connections (but yeah, those Movies contradicts the Anime, so idk). But besides that, this is the best-made canon explanation video I've ever seen. You summarized the points well in the way that makes the most sense. I'll absolutely share this with my friends to let them know how Canon REALLY works in Dragon Ball.
GT is it's own universe. Nothing to do with being canon; just like all of the movies that aren't also considered "Specials".
@@willdiesel8431 While i'm not sure about the Movies, i really think that GT is the same Canon as Original DBZ Anime. It didn't contradicts anything important and actually uses some of the Fillers to create connections. Of course, it's not Canon to the Manga (and that's why Toriyama said GT is a Side-Story), nor KAI nor Super, but is Canon to the Original DBZ Anime. In fact, Takao Koyama (DBZ Anime Screenwriter) did confirm GT is the Official Sequel to Dragon Ball Z Anime. But if you know something that did confirm GT isn't Canon to Z, let me know, i'm very curious.
@@diogodocallofduty410 my point was that if multiple uses or excuses for canon is being used then the word loses meaning. GT is the same as the movies and it doesn't really matter THAT much if it contradicts things from the OG DBZ anime because you would have to excuse the filler that contradicts the events of the anime sometimes even dating back to adventures of Kid Goku.
GT=Movies=DBZ anime.
@@willdiesel8431 What made you think that GT is the same as the Movies? I mean, the majority of the Movies didn't even have a gap to fit in the Anime Timeline. For example, on Fusion Reborn, you can see the date "Saturday, 16th" in Videl's watch, and the Tenkaichi Budokai in Majim Boo Saga begins at May 8th, and that Saga lasts like... 3 days i think? So it's impossible that Vegeta and Goku would stay dead at that Movie time period. That's the way the creators have to say that "This Movie doesn't fit in the Official Timeline, it's a altarnate story." In this case, probably Gotenks or Gohan defeated Majim Boo.
But when you look at GT, you see that is follows the Anime Timeline perfectly. As i said before, they show in the Final DBZ episode that the story will continue in GT, though there is no other thing like that for any Movie. It even respect the Fillers, like Goku's fear of needles, the conception of Hell, Freeza and Cell getting along, the Tuffles backstory, etc...
And if your point is just "it's not Toriyama's work" or "The Manga is the only Canon", than i assume you didn't pay attention to the video and you don't know a thing about Canon in Dragon Ball. Have a great night.
@@diogodocallofduty410
After many years on different messageboards and taking in the parallels of each series of stories, I came to that conclusion early on in fascination with the IP. Simply showing Android 19 as one of the enemies escaping from Hell is reminiscent of the Movies following their own lore (false SSJ transformation comes to mind immediately) that can be separate from even the anime. I'm sure I don't have to go into the specifics as to why a fully mechanical Android would not keep their body let alone be judged by Enma. By the time that episode aired on broadcast TV there were no shortage of enemies that could've taken 19's place but again GT follows the beat of a different drum from the anime.
Another thing would be; the absence of a notable powerscale. Even if the jumps in power were "generous" to say the least there was some sort of loose formula in the early parts of the Z portion of the story that kept some sort of give and take balance. I find that's never really the case in GT after rewatching the series in full about 8 months back. This mirrors what many of the earlier movies did and it wouldn't make sense in an ongoing epic. I very much have my favorites when it comes to the movies and certain parts of GT are well done and executed as though it is just a continuation of Z.
The Super Manga, Anime, and Movies are all separate canons if I believe because Toriyama only works on the movies and gives the manga and anime artists basic plotlines where they do whatever they want with it. Toriyama didnt plan for Ultra instinct, the changes to Potara fusion, and never planned for the Vegito vs Goku black or that universe being destroyed.
You know it’s strange something like Battles of Gods goes in different “canons” . Movie, anime and manga. Like how Champa and Vados appear in the manga version unlike anime and movie.
Different timelines,multiverse
Exactly what I mean about your editing style from the previous video, great job man.
Can we just accept that people should like what they like canon or not?
I don't think that should be an issue. I like the Bardock movie even when it's not canon.
That was never the issue for the most part.
What is happening though (several times in this thread) is people still instinctually using canon to make a distinction.
It shouldn't be a word that has meaning if EVERYTHING is gonna be accepted as valid.
Great video. Give quaman all the likes. He deserves it.
A side story does still means it part the story. Like a side quest. I've always considered it 50/50 with gt being canon. It just up to fan interpretation. One of the writers that has work on dragonball since the orginal dragonball anime has stated it canon. I've looked up and rabbit holed both sides of this. Got in so many debates. Every dragonball fan just gonna have their own opinion of what's dragonball canon. I believe everything is canon in it's own way.
If everything is canon, there would be no need to make a distinction. It's just that simple.
Great video. I suppose it's just a consequence of a franchise like Dragon Ball going on as long as it has and being as big as it is. As a fan, I'm always grateful to get more material all these years later, but ultimately, it's all more or less supplemental to me. Or even just objectively speaking. The original manga and then, for the most part, the original run of the anime are my definitive "canon" and then the movies/ Z specials are their own branch off of that. But, it does suck seeing poor writing of the characters we love and even character regression in some cases as a result of having so many hands involved in different areas of the show. Also, it makes discourse a big headache sometimes
There should be a separate category for one shots and ovas, like for example the yamcha reincarnation which doesn't really fit into any of these 10 categories.
Glad to see Qaaman back making content
When did I leave?
It's even worse for DBS, both anime and manga, because their canon story isn't even all told via the same medium. Both anime and manga force you to watch movies inbetween.
I actually blame dbz for the five years absense from seeing Buma, the guy can teleport and its been five years? I always thought that was dumb same thing with goku leaving his family as if he can't see them in years
When you mentioned videogames my mind imediately when to those "what-ifs" they would sometimes do, like in the Budokai Tenkaichi games, they're the most non-canon thing in existence but I think they were fun lol
All the games based on the IP it's almost expected something different would be attempted.
Love how you break it down too qaaman great video
This is why I NEVER Get into Canon discussion with people that love to act like they know so much... Cause 7/10 times, they don't know what the hell they're talking about. I'm glad Qaaman cleared this up.
Both History of Trunks and Bardock Father of Goku came out before the manga specials. So the manga specials were built off of the TV Specials
What are you talking about? There is no manga special for bardock
@@QaamansLand The Minus chapter is what I consider to be equal to the Bardock Special, since both hit the same plot points. Its just a retelling of the special, but with significant changes. I honestly prefer Z Bardock to Minus Bardock but that's just me.
@@EclipseEuclid I thought you were saying there was a special for the original bardock tv special.
@@QaamansLand oh nah man you're good
So if there’s a retcon it counts as it own canon and not a continuation of the previous canon?
If there is a complete contradiction that means the show is going it's own path and following it's own canon
@@QaamansLand I suppose that makes sense.
Speaking of #10 on your list, when are you planning on finishing buu's fury quaaman, cause I'd still watch!
Def noticed the Twilight Princess music at the end of the vid 🔥
At least I know you stuck around that long
i think the DBS Manga could've had a much better canon if the anime's adaption was put on hold. But, despite everything that has happened, the manga has gotten better. Plus, some minor adaptions were made around each arc for the anime such as the Future Arc where Bluma and Gohan failed to get the dragon balls on time.
Now the only thing i may had some issues with the personal Hell and not there being one single hell world like how we saw with Goku falling into snake wave or when the villians saw the buu fight. Even if they were filler, it was still good to see what it might've looked like if it was in the manga. If the personal hell is a thing now, i would've like to have it only for major villians who deserve it the most. Anyone else would just have their souls in hell, and if they were somewhat decent beings, they could get their bodies back; but be restricted with their powers.
the tarble thing is written off as dbs broly kid vegeta says he doesnt know if his brother survived nor does he care and kid raditz saying the same thing about goku
For me in head canon [in chronological order]
1. Yo! Son Goku & Friends Returns!, Z Kai, Battle of Gods, Resurrection F to Super, [spite the contradictions, the ones you have mentioned], Broly movie, Superhero
2. Movie Special 1, DB, DBZ, Movie Special 2, Bojack Unbound, GT. [spite the issues Black Star, a second Android 17, Dende forgetting that he can heal, that Dende's Dragon Balls weren't over used, where as Kami's was...]
To me, they are both canon but different timelines. In my headcanon, GT is a timeline where beerus never wakes up.
No need to make the distinction of headcanon then. You defeated your own point in a singular post.
maybe, dragon ball super didn't retcon the end of z, but instead it was that goku literally abandoned bulma to train his son goten, to become stronger, for 5 whole years, so yeah goku most likely did it.
aight hear me out... what if gt was actually the movie timeline this entire time and we diddnt know.
12th Dragon Ball canon. Can't leave out Dragon Ball Evolution my guy! Lmfao!
Damn it, Qaaaman, this video isn't canon to the DB series. Am greatly disappointed in your lack of canon continuation. 😖
I remember a Budokai game where time travel was utilized since the game pre-dates dragon ball super so the supreme Kai was completely ok with the time travel happening
On another note would that Cross Epoch manga that's a one piece and DBZ crossover also he it's own canon in the specials section
16:56 In DBZBT2 there was a scene where goku fought raditz on king kais planet aswell
I owned the game years ago. Remind me? It's been too long
@@QaamansLand it was in the story mode. After goku and raditz died. King kai had both of them come to train on his planet
I read the manga too but the canon is the anime.
It’s what the movies whether they fit in or not are based on, it’s what 99% of the games are based on.
The anime pulls from the manga and everything else pulls from the anime.
17:40 Tarble is mentioned in Battle of Gods as well
What's funny is that I wrote it down but my video was already 21 minutes. I'm sure you understand that this video could have been much longer.
And not in Super anime . Which is weird situation.
He is mentioned in the Broly movie too.
DBS explained that Shin and Kabito defused via Namekian dragon balls. And since they are gods---- probably easy to get the Namekians to help.
Dude your videos are soo good! I really do miss your outtros tho.
What outros?
@@QaamansLand it was like your 8 bit character and a red screen . That's what I remember, but I like this outtro this video.
And this is why I don’t give a shit when people say GT isn’t canon, Super has multiple canons lol.
It would be interesting to see how many of the dragon ball movie could be fitted in the the anime continuity with out breaking the continuity too much
Probably only the Bojack movie. Even when the Garlic movie is referred to in the anime, it still does not make sense since Krillin knows Gohan before Raditz arrives.
Cooler and Bojack, arguably the first Broly, are the only. Maybe Wrath of the Dragon. Bojack contradicts absolutely nothing. Most of the inconsistencies in Cooler's Revenge could easily be chalked up to being "for dramatic effect". Broly could possibly be squeezed in before the Cell Games and Wrath of the Dragon could totally fit in sometime after Goku kills Kid Buu. That's really about it. Broly is kinda pushing it but it can fit with a little head canon.
If you've been into everything DB long enough there's been many posts regarding what movies could be shoe-horned into the anime timeline.
ITS ALL CANON! Toriyama had never said the movies or GT were non-canon, just alternate stories. GT and the movies possibly in the same story as Cooler appears in GT. And now Bardock's story has been rewritten, but going to say that's part of Super's story, not DBZ.
Nice Canon( Birthday Video )
don’t forget the best one…
Headcanon.
10:27 If I'm correct, didn't DBZ Kakarot also expand upon this?
How? I never played the game but you guys and friends made me aware of some things
@QaamansLand I didn't play it as well but I do remember some of my friends telling me that they covered the Majin Buu arc in the Future Timeline. I also looked at some gameplay
Yeah. You can train with Supreme Kai as Future Trunks in Kakarot. You can also train with Beerus before the events of DBZ so... that game just be doin stuff Lol It's fun tho
They also used Future Trunks for the super saiyan god ritual. So, no fetal Pan this time.
There is also Nekomajin manga canon.
I forgot they did bobbles dirty that way.
Everything I like is canon and everything I don't like is non-canon.
Its all canon and part of a multiverse
@@newhybrid101nuh uh
at this point there is also the tfs cannon
People laughed at me for saying that Z, GT and Super should be considered their own timelines/canon but who's laughing now!?
But yeah it's a lot easier to just accept that each project/installation follows it's own rules/canon.
Another's filler is former villains watching the battle between Goku and Buu
Considering the thumbnail, I actually thought you were going to mention db heroes since that actually happened 😅
This thumbnail is so accurate! Lol!
That thumbnail is funny as hell.
Reason?
@@QaamansLand I just thought it was funny super sayin God smacking super sayin 4 with his pinkie, while sipping tea lol.
There’s a good question about tights and jaco. what happened to tights and jaco in the future timeline. you’d think that tights and jaco would help bulma in the future timeline but for some reason they never do (aside from the obvious explanation that they didn’t exist in toriyamas mind yet)
Tights and Jaco are completley pointless characters that do nothing and never were even alluded to in Dragon Ball or Z so it makes me wonder why Toriyama bothered creating those two.
Yo I forgot about the crew in the sub hideout 😂😂😂good stuff
Take a drink every time he sais canon. 😈🍺💀
I actually came up with this idea on google slides about a year ago.
For me it started with Dragonball and ended with Dragonball Z. The rest of it doesn't exist.
6:07 Kakarot game went one step closer
15:53 Puddlehan is crazy💀
Like I’ve always said, DB has no one Canon continuity. It’s all canon in its own right.
I like to think that Tarble was in Witness Protection for witnessing a tax-fraud scam before the saiyan extinction, and Vegeta was miscounting on purpose because he loves his lil baby bro.
I thought of it like this I just don’t think about it I just see it all as creativity in the dragon ball franchise
I'm curious about DBZ Kai; because in the beginning of Kai they used footage from the Bardock special and I seen ppl trying to connect Kai with Supers continuity (presumably including DBS Broly)
Yeah, I'm pretty sure the Super anime follows DB Kai. Didn't Super reference the anime only scene that involved Bulma being turned into a frog? I think there are a few other references, as well.
@@CarlyDayDay I'm hip; I don't have a problem with that. The confusion comes in with Dragon Ball Minus lore trying to tie in with the intro to Kai (at least the Bardock aspects of things)
@@Keiyon95 Everything involving Bardock is messy as hell
@@CarlyDayDayI personally Ignore everything that happened with Bardock in the dbs manga.
@sydneyowusu3750 I ignore the entire dbs manga, as well as anything involving Bardock Lol Bardock does not exist in my head canon.
Have you seen Casual Anime Guy's explanation for why MUI and Vegito Blue aren't canon? What do you have to say to that?
@QaaMan,
Gt and the Movies, are apart of the same canon.
Not exactly some movies are "Canon" to GT but not all of them.
Still not canon
Kinda doesn’t matter nowadays. As long as it’s Dragon Ball, people will enjoy it. It depends on preferences and biases .
@@kapayasiame3632yeah it really depends on bias and preference
😂😂
Eh not really
You have 2 brain Cells and they are Still fighting for Space in there.
Now the million dollar question. Which is canon, what is not?
You didn't mention dragon ball super hero. I still don't know what that is
I didnt feel like it needed to be mentioned. Its a movie continuation
@@QaamansLand a continuation of super or of hero? Or a continuation of the broly movie? Funny how you think this didn't need to be mentioned. Imma just Google it, thanks.
@@jahjoekaOf Super Anime , considering the manga has it’s own version
@@Ealais76 i think it's a continuation of the broly movie because the end of super happened so long ago. All i know is shit is confusing and im always being spoiled because I don't know what to keep up with. Waiting for the anime to came back just to find out about beast Gohan, which is canon, is very annoying.
The only anime/manga where the non-canon and fan made series are better than the source material. Struggling from success
Great video!
Nice topic
Good that you didnt go into the Xenovrse/dragon ball online canon... cause that would be a lot to explain xD
I just want to point out, Battle of Gods and Resurrection of F are both Z movies.
For better or worse, dragon ball's many stories and timelines are starting to resemble super hero comics.
Also, Gregory was in dbz in the anime btw
Yeah but I thought that was obvious.
I will start off by saying that Akira Toriyama when GT first came out said that you could consider GT the official continuation of Dragon Ball or Side Story it was never one or the other but it did promoted and enjoyed it and even through his own version of Super Saiyan 4 so in my book that makes it Canon.
It's just slowly over the years fans who hated GT or just fans in general have forgotten the fact that Acura Toriyama said that you could consider GT the official continuation.
But as for GT I think it picks up where the Dragon Ball Z left off main kibito Kai with never supposed to diffuse they kept that.
Then Goku learned of the consequences of overuse in the Dragon Balls which later on resulted in the shadow dragons.
Because let's face it even Elder Kai told Goku in Dragon Ball Z they're over using the Dragon Balls was never a good thing even was dead set against it.
Then we get onto the baby Vegeta saga in which ties into Dragon Ball Z as well we know that the Saiyans were conquerors that was only natural that planet Vegeta was originally something else and then the baby Vegeta saga we found out that was
The planet of the
Tuffles.
Then they're Super Saiyan 4 which also ties into Dragon Ball Z we all know and Vegeta's flashback on Planet Namek the golden oozaru was scene in that flashback.
Is Super Saiyan 4 what's the next true dominant form from that that ties in.
The only Enigma that there is in GT is the Black Star Dragon Balls but really if you think about it the reason why if you want to try to make sense of it.
the nameless
Namekian ever since he split personalities into Piccolo and Kami have a lot of knowledge was lost.
Heck when they fuse back together during the cell Saga popo asked Piccolo what he should name him in the Piccolo said that he had long forgotten his original name but you just call and Piccolo.
So you see probably the Black Star Dragon Balls long-forgotten you want to make sense of it it's that simple no difficult mind process involved.
Now we move on to Dragon Ball super first off I will say I never believed in Reckoning just simply because there's too much red tape involved with it.
Because Dragon Ball Dragon Ball Z and GT have already been written in stone and cannot be changed.
However alternate timelines can exist and Alternate Realms can exist within Dragon Ball because they've existed ever since Future Trunks went back into time save Goku at the Warren him of the approaching Doom of Android 17 and 18.
And that's exactly what Dragon Ball super is it is its own thing and its own alternate timeline like a Back to the Future or the flash reference where the flash went back into time banana doing that it shattered the timeline enter multiple pieces.
Which later on another Speedster with tell Barry Allen and every time he used to speed force to go back into time try to prevent his mom's death another timeline would be created and the time lines would be shattered even more.
Which essentially means Once Upon them is Created from traveling back and forth Through Time it cannot be amended or repaired.
But the 800-pound gorilla in the room I'm about to also label another disconnect from Dragon Ball Z and Dragon Ball to Dragon Ball super that has to do with them linking the Supreme Kai's life with beerus'.
We all know way back before Dragon Ball Bibidi was using Kid Buu as a weapon of Chaos and destruction throughout the Universe.
Kid Buu was a complete and utter killer they had no feelings or conscience the most evil as character in Dragon Ball history.
Even going to the Planet of the Kai's fought the kais even killing all but one an absorbing to let's not forget that the God of destruction and the Supreme Kai or repair if one dies the other dies as well.
So beerus would have had them gotten involved Intuit eliminated Kid Buu and Bibidi
Seeing this as a threat to his life instability cuz that's his job.
The God of destruction is the only one that can directly get involved and eliminate threats and I know some fans a Dragon Ball tell me that beerus is a lazy God of destruction so I will get this out of the way beerus is a lazy God of destruction there's no doubt about it all he does is sleep and eat.
But when it comes to a threat to his own life true stability he would act heck he broke out into cold chills at the fact that the dumb version of Goku in super what's about to meet the Omni King.
Any fear that Goku might anger the Omni King so he did not want the Omni King to lash out at the Supreme Kai.
So you see Kid Buu would not exist neither would
Bibidi or his son so Goku and Vegeta never would have encountered him much less fought him.
Only hearing of him and legends just one of those evils that beerus destroyed.
So you see if there's no Kid Buu then there's no Majin Buu the Majin Buu and not being super to even begin with.
Then there's the development of the characters that makes super different Vegeta let go of his grudge against Goku when they defeated Kid Buu the only trained to better himself and that carried on into GT.
And Vegeta even became Goku's true replacement for the protector of Earth Goku at the end of GT gave Vegeta that honor and left the world behind fusing with the dragon which completed his journey.
And to me and my book gave Vegeta his respect I've always wanted it seems like Vegeta never won anything was always lived in Goku shadow.
Much like some other characters did much like Chichi did even though she was a well-rounded martial artist that's a discussion for another day.
But yeah at the end of the day super is its own thing it doesn't retcon anything because it is Askew off dimension that veered away after the Kid Buu fight.
Wow what an essay. It's not just due to the hate GT received. On top of it not being very good overall, you have the fact It's not a part of the canon just like the movies. If all it took to be considered canon is the fact that it is continuing the story many of the companion pieces that were also written would count too.
Again the canonical standing isn't determined by how the audience feels about the material but in the way it confirms and validates what preceeded it.
@@willdiesel8431 actually GT was pretty good overall especially when you look at Dragon Ball super which is horrible in character development an overall consistency.
Let's say that GT is superior to both Dragon Ball super and also this new Dragon Ball series.
But as far as Dragon Ball GT being Canon it is canon Akira toriyama's name is on it because he helped with the artwork of it and even helped promote it I don't know why this concept is so hard for some fans to understand.
And by Akira Toriyama saying that fans could consider it the official continuation only proved my point.
And it's even in the timeline as the official continuation as well that only concrete as being Canon.
Akira Toriyama had many things to do with GT even though it wasn't directly involved with it he still played a hand in it.
Just like he has with many things throughout Dragon Ball even had some hand in some of the dragon ball movies as well.
So I mean Dragon Ball ever since Future Trunks showed up on the scene Dragon Ball has been about multiple multiverses and universes indifferent timelines.
The movie verse it's just one of them in Akira Toriyama hasn't been solely and directly involved in Dragon Ball ever since the freezer Saga ended so if you want absolute Cannon you have to disclose that everything after the Frieza Saga isn't directly Canon either.
Because Akira Toriyama has had help there is multiple other creators that are involved in the making of Dragon Ball.
It is just a utter shame that's some fans just don't understand that so they jump up onto the hate GT bandwagon and call it non Canon when it is canon.
Now if this was Dragon Ball Deliverance are Dragon Ball Multiverse which is clearly fan made and had no Evolution with Akira Toriyama helping the creators of it then fans would have a leg to stand on in an argument.
But Akira Toriyama did have a hand in making GT does it stands now fans have no leg to stand on when it comes to arguing.
@@shanepoole527 the argument of today is not whether or not AT had a hand in GT and to what degree. The argument is whether or not GT can be held in the same canon regard to the original source which it isn't.
Again I'm not arguing the quality of GT but if you insist I will simply refer to the "Lost Episodes". It won't be in defense of Super but just to point out how bad GT can actually be.
At any rate you like to write alot however that doesn't mean GT isn't in the same boat as the movies, which ultimately serve as what-if stories/alternate timelines with few parallels.
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@@willdiesel8431 rather not if you want to admit it it doesn't make it so GT with foreshadowed at the end of Z in the late nineties and in the early 2000s if you're an OG fan and you should know this.
It fits perfectly in with the original timeline Goku went off with uub
At the end of Z in GT took place right after that where Goku was training him at kami's Lookout.
And I know some cats out there the right far more than I do because it's factual information.
Because GT does not belong to the movie verse not even in the least even Akira Toriyama said that you could consider GT the official continuation of Z or a Side Story.
It's just slowly over the years the official continuation statement that Toriyama stated slowly has been squashed by Og Dragon Ball fans who hated GT.
And I thought that GT was really good and its overall consistency even though Goku was reverted to a kid know that most fans hated.
They still kept his overall fighting experience from Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Z.
In each Saga within GT made perfect sense we all know of the treacheries not the Saiyans did years ago in Dragon Ball and I came to light with baby.
Now granite is Super 17 Saga wasn't all that great since I thought that they could have did more.
But the Shadow Dragon Saga was an excellent when he probably one of the best in Dragon Ball history.
We all know that Elder Kai back in the Majin Buu saga warrant Goku and Vegeta about the consequences of using the Dragon Balls.
In GT they used that concept coming up with the concept of the Shadow dragons it just meant that no matter for wish was good or for bad reason it would build up negativity within the Dragon Balls.
So all in all I would give GT a 4 out of 5 compared to what super did which was absolutely awful it had good Concepts but just horrible ideas on how to bring those Concepts to light.
Especially since Dragon Ball super is essentially what killed Dragon Ball it is such a messed up series and now with this new series coming out which is going to push it even further into the grave I just don't see it getting any better.
But as I said before GT is canon to the original timeline.
@@shanepoole527 ah the No True Scotsman trope.
Well it's clear you don't like reading and comprehending as much as you like typing. And that's OK, I'm just not going to continue explaining things to a brick with busy fingers.
Furthermore you can't point out anywhere in my posts where I am denying GT's validity in terms of continuity. Just because I'm not deepthroating the 3rd act of the anime epic doesn't mean I'm downplaying the fact it's a continuation.
You really need help.
In dragon Ball there is a only one canon your head canon even Goku use that against Demon King Piccolo 😁
Well Toryarama Designed Shallot From Dragon Ball Legends - So Is Shallot & Giblet Canon ? , Nah Jokes Bro , But Great Work - Great Stuff , SHALOM .
to me og bardock literally being in the manga will always mean that it is cannon to the original series while super has its own separate cannon spin off and as you mentioned, super contradicts bulmas line. it just dosent line up with the og series nearly enough
@ThatYellowSpiderGuy toryama said he wouldnt have writen that story but said he loved it and put a image from it into his manga legitimizing it as part of the manga cannon, when toryama included it he absolutely intended the implication that the special is cannon, and i forgot to mention the other reason minus dosent work is cause the bardock in the z manga is wearing the classic fit while the broly movie has him in the wrong outfit
Half of these "canons" are just due to bad writing and forgetfulness aka not giving a f*ck about the source material
Example?
What about DragonBall AF😅😅😅
AF is a Fanmade concept that isn't acknoledged by any of Dragon Ball's right owners so it's pretty much irrelevant.
Qaaman here *today!* 🤩
Dragon ball super just ruins the lore of the show. Bulma never had a sister, neither vegeta or frz knew about beerus, Goku never came to earth in a space armor, bardock rebelled against Frz the proof being that it was shown in the manga with his unique armor, in the broly movie Frz doesn't even see bardock
What do you mean Frieza didnt see him? I have to rewatch
@QaamansLand okay so I just rewatched it and Bardock is in space trying to stop the attack. Are we meant to assume that what happened up there in broly was the same that happened during Z? Either way, in the manga Frz talks directly about him opposing him and shows his iconic armor
are the Deuterocanonicals canon?
Something to note is dragon ball online and dragon ball z kakarot and their praises from toriyama and that heroes and xenoverse basically stem from dragon ball online