Big News! Roughly 24 hours after the release of this video, Shangri-La, The ERP based world I talked about in this video, went private! This means there will be no more people stumbling upon this den of E-sex. Is it because of this video? I have my doubts, there has been plenty of movements elsewhere to try to shut them down. But if it is because of this video, that's kinda funny... lol
@@Derafog True, I believe this game amplifies peoples best and worst traits so that's why I don't see the degeneracy in public going away anytime soon sadly.
For me, the bad and ugly thing about this game is that you lose friends as fast as you make them. The relationships made are quickly created due to being able to express yourself however way the real you may act, and you'll eventually find people who match those characteristics. you'll enjoy being with them, but most of the time, they either forget you within a week or the group falls apart within a few month's. It's inevitably unsustainable and makes me wonder what's even left for me after putting in all those hours of getting to know someone. My brother described it perfectly; "Though it may feel special at the end of the day, they aren't people that will stick around. They're just lonely people looking for the nearest thing to fill the void until they see the next appealing thing. "
"they aren't people that will stick around. They're just loney people looking for the nearest thing to fill the void until they see the next appealing thing." this is what my old buddy on vrc said to me
Yeah, because of time zones, I am never online the same time my friends are and I do not have a consistant time that I go on VRchat, sometimes I don't realise that I didn't play the game in months and sometimes I have a really hard time remembering who the people on my friends list are. I have never been good at keeping friends and I bury my past all the time whenever I do the smallest embarassing thing, it is really hard to make a friend and then keep them.
Exactly why a friend and I stopped (luckily only after about 4 to 6 months) because it all became too superficial. It definitely was the off putting part about the entire experience even after having regular conversations with some players over discord sometimes daily.
Yeah it’s why I stopped going to VRC, too many times I try to reconnect or chat with people and… there’s no reach back. I stopped reaching and got nothing back. I’m lonely and shit, but doesn’t mean I have to be an AH like that.
The worst traumatic moment in vrchat for me was a friend shooting themselves in a public lobby, you see them thinking ah he is drinking. You hear a loud shot they fall down lose tracking. Few seconds go by, thinking he might be acting, seconds turn into minutes I go ask if he's ok, no response, minutes turn into hours hasn't moved. I leave thinking he's probably afk. 2-3 days go by and go check on him same guy, same world, same position hasn't moved an inch. Starting to be scared at that point, ok maybe he forgot to turn it off and went to a vacation. After Idk how long had gone by, but it should've been about a week. He disappeared and never saw that guy online again. So now thinking after I think he shot himself live infront of me in VRChat. And he was such a nice guy aswell.
Ah hell man, I’m sorry to hear that traumatic experience you witnessed, and your loss. I hope you’re doing okay in life, my prayers go out to you. Your friend must’ve been a great pal to you, I’m truly sorry for whatever heavy thoughts he was facing each day. 😔 🙏 ♥️ 💪
Im deeply disturbed that all that managed to go on without anyone noticing irl for him, Speaks volumes on why he did it. He had nonody irl, so he picked a place he felt happy and died there instead, his last view being of the digital space that took him in when his real world neglected him
TW: s*icide First VRChat friend group I had one of the members of the group unalive himself and I had to attend the funeral online, it was broadcasted. One of the things that hit me the hardest about this is that in the slideshow his family provided to celebrate his life, it was filled with pictures of him but instead of any pictures of him with IRL friends/family, it was pictures of our friend group and other friends he had taken on VRChat. It hit me because this is when I realized that this game was all he really had socially. I haven't logged on since, its been a year.
Many people escape from reality into virtual reality for a big reason--it's much better in here. Just like people IRL friends around him would warn. It's all up to the ultimate choice.... I am very sorry for your loss.
Buddy of mine got divorced cause his wife played the game 24/7 pretty much neglecting their kids. Was wild when he finally said the reason was his wife just got sucked into it to escape the responsibility of life i guess. He has full custody of his kids.
@@BullFrogFace Maybe they were socially forced to have the kids. Some people just think if you get pregnant for any reason, you should be forced to give up your life and raise the child(ren). Guess what... Not everyone is ready to have kids, either mentally or financially, when they accidentally get pregnant or get raped. It's healthier to not have kids until you're ready. My wife and I are waiting until we're financially stable and mentally ready.
"because it's easier to rig a bikini than a hoodie" so real. the devs need to add an optimized cloth component like they did with physbones so we can have clothing that drapes properly
It's a damn shame cloth physics suck so hard. Lots of awesome ideas for outfits that just don't work in vr because they clip so badly. Might just be a limitation of the medium though :/
@@Alkumist avatars should be more like web pages, only loading things as they're needed. at the cost of some jank (eg textures being purple before they load) you could have omnibus everything and actually better performance ranking as it'd be continually updated based on what you actually have enabled.
@@g_glop Sadly that doesn't really work. Loading isn't the limitation here, performance is. Textures and Audio take up over 90% of a file, and when loaded onto someone's machine are a magnitude larger then that (A 2000x2000 texture loaded into memory uses 12mb of data. There's no workarounds because shaders require uncompressed files) Meanwhile, Animations, Phsyics, even the Model itself uses up a tiny fraction of the data a few MB at most. But your PC needs to crunch millions of numbers a *frame* to account for all the dozens of anime tiddies on screen.
about two months ago, i had an adult veteran become my friend on vrc, we spoke alot, and after a week, he became super attached to me. being jealous if i even hungout with my boyfriend.. after a month, hes shown me (17) his nsfw avatars and said very weird things to me. eventually, i put my foot down and blocked him. he tried to start rumors about me, and shit talk me.. and i had a girl come up to me, around 20, and she told me all the horrid things he said about me. she said she hated me, until she realized i was underage, and the guy wasnt a victim, he was a pedo. its scary, how a person you think is a good guy shows his true colours on a socal game.
I e-dated a 23 yo off vrc when I was 17. Worst part is this man was about to go to police academy to become a cop. He asked for photos on multiple occasions. He dated another girl shortly after me who was of legal age, but imagine knowing your boyfriend a couple months prior was dating a freshly turned 17yo? Ugh.
i have seen pretty much every documentary style video essay on vrc and every single one uncovers something new about the community to me. its absurd how much can happen in just this one game
There's a lot that can happen in just one game. Roblox has the same ups and downs sometimes, as well as other online games and or just regular social media. I personally look at the better side of things
The last bit hit way too hard. I met the most amazing person on here and lost him cause he took his own life. VRchat hasn’t been the same for me since. You just learn to deal with it but it never heals.
The same happened to me but in FFXIV. The guy I met recruited me into his own server and he was a ray of sunshine... I can never forget how amazing of a person he was, picking me up randomly when I was a bit down by sending me a chat message while wandering. He overdosed on alcohol and ended up hitting his head on his dresser after a fall. He never woke up after. It's something that still hurts me to this day.
Yeah, I agree with you. The survivor's guilt and pain never really go away. It's only getting worse and worse too. I've lost four friends and a cousin to suicide and it seems like people really don't understand how bad it's getting until it's too late
A couple years back I had a friend, we called Michael, he was a fun caring person big in Half-life rp. Over time I drifted away from him and his group for another group of VRC friends. A few months pass, I’m in a friends world with some of my friends, Micheal joins unexpectedly. We hang out for a bit before telling me he has cancer. Was shocked, I couldn’t say anything, and I wish I did. We hang out the rest of the night and call it that. A couple more months go by, I log on VRC and check my friends list to see who’s on. I see the status of one of Micheal’s rp friends saying “RIP Micheal” It hit me hard. I looked at other friends of his, many saying things along that line. One of them ever turned their bio into a short Wikipedia like article about him. Micheal was 14, it’s been 2 years since his passing and I still find myself thinking of our last interaction, wishing I said something. Quick thing lad, your background music has inspired me to play the S.T.A.L.K.E.R series again! Thanks! Guten tag!
Maybe don’t ditch your “friend” next time, he wasn’t your friend He was only your friend until you wanted to try other friends. That’s no friend , rip Michael he didn’t deserve that
@notreallyafamousartist695 people drift apart sometimes, it's completely natural and there Is nothing wrong with that. Maybe don't go judging people and relations that you know absolutely nothing about
@@notreallyafamousartist695people like you are sad. Judging others based on nothing and making huge assumptions. Constantly assuming the worst only leads to sadness.
Man this made me sad to read and when I saw he was 14 I teared up. That’s so hard for a kid to go through. Cancer is hard enough for anyone but a child 💔 I hope he had fun in his short life and felt how loved he was by those around him.
@@notreallyafamousartist695friends drifting happens to everyone. You and another friend have drifted apart, it happens to humans especially as people change, as they meet new people, as they get jobs or busy with school.
i had friends with serious substance abuse issues. a day after a night of drinking, one friend asked, "Why does my stomach hurt so much? It's seriously bad." to which another friend responded, "That's because you drink so much the acid lining your stomach starts to wear away. (Alcohol gastritis). Either you go sober for a month and face serious pain and withdrawl, or you make the pain go away by drinking more." She chose the ladder
Tbh, the second person sounds horrible, and definitely not someone to consider a friend. Telling an alcoholic that to keep drinking means the pain will go away is basically a death sentence. An alcoholic may be afraid of dying to their addiction, but being presented the promise of no more pain as opposed to withdrawal is most likely going to send a crippling addict down the wrong path. It's important to be careful how you present things to an addict, and portraying the deadly outcome as the better one has to be one of the worst ways to do it.
@@NoLeftTurns965Dunno if I'd say that portrays the deadly outcome as the better one, though. It just read like a "you can drink yourself to death, or suffer through therapy" type statement. Definitely woulda been better to keep the "won't hurt as much" to themself tho
I used to be addicted to VR. It was difficult to break away from it as it not only got me addicted to alcohol but also led me into a routine of nightly drinking with people I barely knew. This addiction caused me to lose social skills and put a financial burden on myself with expenses like DoorDash, alcohol, and other drugs. Before VRChat, I used to be more social, spending time with my family and friends and feeling more confident in myself. VRChat turned me into an alcoholic and someone who couldn't handle problems correctly. I even almost ended up in the hospital once due to overdrinking. Just few weeks ago, I felt almost died in my room after smoking and drinking excessively because of people encouraging me to keep going. A while back, I broke my trackers, which ruined the game for me. Since then, I have reduced my game time from every night to maybe once a week. I've also been drinking a lot less and feeling better mentally and physically. I'm back to talking to my family more and seeing old friends again, whom I barely spoke to in the last 2 years of my addiction to this game. Being away from the VRChat addiction has made me realize how it has brought me down and hurt me, and also how it's actively harming the people I know who still play the game. I'm glad to be away from it, but I still get urges to get back on and continue the same behavior.
I'm so sorry that people encouraged you to keep going like that, and I am glad to hear that you are doing better. I've honestly stayed out of public rooms on VRChat for this and a lot of other reasons. I'm mostly on Resonite now because I can focus on social creation and teaching the conlang I know, so I am a firm believer that VR can be a valuable tool if you find a healthy activity to engage in. I hope I'm not sounding preachy here, it just breaks my heart to hear that you were in a place like that and people encouraged you to drink even more, and I hope maybe talking about the stuff i get up to might help you make some friends.
i honestly relate, i used to drink a lot when playing vrchat and talking to people (even thought of buying drugs to make the "experience" more enjoyable) but thankfully my own will stopped from doing so and not become an addict, it honestly has to do with the people your sourruonded with and the places (or worlds) u go to, im sorry to hear that, but then again, if u find a good healthy friendship or friends group it'd be an enriching experience, getting to socialize with likeminded people is one of the best feelings ever, i hope u continue to get better!
@@Pepo.. this x1000! when i get into VR i am learning how to make items, avatars, even ended up figuring out audio reactivity on my own the other day using a talkvisualizer component and linking it with an audio stream, all because of the helpful people i have met since i first got into VR. this i why i like resonite; i dont see anywhere near as much drinking parties or worlds, most of the time i see people hanging out they are showing off neat things they created and/or showing people how something was made so others can make their own. It definitely helps to be around people who you can have an enriching experience with. big part of why i have gotten into conlang learning (conlang = constructed language, for me it's na'vi) People are so eager to teach, and I love it. That sense of community has helped pull me through some really dark times.
I've met like 6 different guys in "Would rather" who were constantly playing drinking games. Everyone would cheer for another bottle with "Drink! Drink!". I was most of the time the sole person who stepped in to stop their game for their own health by interrupting view and telling about wellbeing. Looks goofy from their perspective - a fluffy space raptor jumps in face and begs in broken english to stop and value a life.
Yeah that’s crazy I’m so glad she got away safely, and she had someone to help her. I really hope that man never did anything like that to anyone else but I’m worried he did.
If you have mental health issues PLEASE reach out, theres so many skills to help you get through those really dark thoughts you have. Its not just a hehe haha cope with it by drinking; please get help. You are loved, you are cared for, we want the best for you, theres so many ways to ask for help. Just PLEASE reach out. My heart started racing when i read the warning, especially unaliving ones self. I went through something I wish no one ever went through, took me years of therapy to learn to handle the PTSD from that one night. Its almost 5 years since that night, almost to the date. I think about his mom a lot, his family and those who miss him all the time. I hope he's watching over his mom and acting as her guardian angel. Rest Easy Parcivul.
PSA: if you are mentally unstable, then stay off of public forms/places on the internet. Instead, talk to a doctor. VR Chat, Discord, Twitter, streamers, etc. Are NOT your personal therapists or babysitters. And they are not suitable replacements for such. Get help. A therapist for real issues, an AI if you want to do a toxic rant. Hopefully you have someone's contact information irl. You can contact them and ask to have lunch with. They don't even have to be a friend yet. Will it be awkward and uncomfortable to ask, probably. But if it gets you to touch grass, it's worth it to see the real world. As a last resort, call a wellness check on yourself using your area's non-emergency number.
This is sadly a really positive message to a very deep problem. You mean well, but reality does not always uphold your statement. Lets say there is help out there for you and you can pay for it. It's still a process which is very hard and tiring. Some people go through multiple therapists before they even find someone they feel comfortable around. Now if you combine that with some of the waiting lists of 2-5 months and you might have to invest a year into even finding help hopping from therapist to therapist. Not to mention the money you spend. Even in more "social" countries, often only the most heavy mental issues get compensated. Also saying "we want the best for you" is just a lie. It sucks but by far the most people do not want to be someone's "reason to live" not even be someone's therapist. Actually listening and being there for someone is hard work and is not fun. I'm not on VRC to listen to someone vent, I might to a friend from time to time, but I'm there to have fun. And don't get me wrong, I too have been people's "therapist" plenty of times but it gets boring and a relationship will quickly turn to an obligation. I do agree people should try and reach out, but it's difficult and please do so with professionals. People online will drop you when they feel you become a burden.
Quitting VRChat was the best thing I have ever done. I now have healthy friendships and a healthier understanding of relationships. I have improved my mental health greatly, and I only touch my headset for other vr games like beat saber. I consider myself very lucky to have gotten out of that addiction, but I am glad more videos like these are starting to come out detailing the dark side of VRChat. I played from 2018 to 2022 religiously and some of the stuff I experienced was on a range of vile to purely heartbreaking. Its sad to see so many people suffering, I wish the devs and community didnt turn such a blind eye to all these problems. So many of these people need serious help I hope they are able to get out like I did.
I quit vrchat, it was the first thing that really exposed me to pornographic type stuff first, when i was 13-14 this really affects those who are young, and it’s downright disgusting the things I had seen looking back, i though left and immediately my life became better, i will never look back
I had to break up with a guy, because he became addicted to VRChat. He was spending all his money on avatars and worlds. He would lock himself in his office from the moment he woke up to the minute he had to go to work every day of the week. He became distant and absent from conversations. He would get drunk on the weekends and that was the only time I ever saw him. I believe he was grooming underage girls, because I would hear his conversations from the other room. I caught him cheating on me when a text message popped on up his phone when we were in the car one day and it was from someone he frequently talked about playing with on VRChat. All of this was within 2 months of him getting his headset. I confronted him and he would become defensive and hostile. It was disgusting to see how much his perception of reality changed and how much he prioritized his VR life/reputation.
Ugh I’m so sorry for you. My ex thought I bought a vr headset to cheat on him with and I thought he was crazy for thinking that, I got it to hang out with friends who already played it, I got to spend time with my best friend since all she had was vr while she was struggling with housing crashing at different places. No computer, just her quest. But seeing people actually do that is crazy. I can’t imagine jeopardizing real life relationships for online crap. But I know it happens, a diff ex cheated on me, on PlayStation.
about two or three years ago, we lost complete contact with a friend in vrc, he had attempted s*, luckily we were able to contact his family and they found him before he was able to do anything, however those few days of not knowing whether my really dear friend from continents away was dead or alive have had quite the impact on me. From what i've seen, such stories aren't that rare in vrc. However it is also a universe i adore in which i have met incredible people and a world that has inspired me to work on art and on improving myself, outside of the vr headset. thanks for the great video ❤
@@calluxdoaron1903the money. this is my next quest, some clear sky dude told me to go check out a game called "VRChat", and now I'm here. I just want my money, man..
This video is genuinely a fascinating auto-ethnography about vrchat and its inhabitants. Such a refreshingly earnest and empathetic insight for something you clearly care for. The cinematography puts a bow on everything. Thank you.
I always feel out of place when i realize how different everyone elses opinions on sexualization and hypersexuality online is. To me its not really self-expression when they make it their entire personality. Like making sexual jokes all the time and flirting with people constantly, maybe its just me but its off putting.
yeah, I personally find it incredibly tiring when people can't finish a sentence without saying something sexual, and it's gotten so common online especially. you're not alone fr
You are not alone. If being overly sexual is how some people choose to express their personality, maybe their personality should be called into question.
Yeah fr! My best friend and I went to the black cat lobby and we’re just hanging out and this guy was joking about her ass and being sexual and I was like nah just stop, and he started saying I bet you’re the fat friend, and being so rude for what? Like..
I was groomed on this game multiple times and was chased off of it due to the threat of a 24 year old that groomed me was going to dox me. Got back on a year later and have been playing ever since and lemme tell you, the fear that i have of running into him again on a seperate account is still there enough where I stay out of a lot of the typical public egirl/eboy spaces and stick to games I know (like Genshin and Honkai) Although, I've had my run ins with weirdos and sub human people (p3dophiles, mainly). I was 15 when that happened, I'm now 20. I genuinely believe kids should be monitored by their parents now that headsets are more accessible Edit: I dont know how this got so contreversial, but for those few people in my replies trying to say that it "wasnt grooming" and that "its a game", I am genuinely asking why you don't see anything wrong with a 24-25 YEAR OLD MAN isolating, shit talking, asking sexual favours, verbally abusing, and threatening to dox a 15 year old on the internet. If that predator and I werent on VRChat, it was through Discord. If we weren't on Discord, it was through VRChat. You didnt see when I had said no to him and didnt want to, you didnt see the way he would get upset at me for not doing those sexual favours, you didnt see the way he would tell me to be grateful he still spoke to me because of "how much i was misbehaving". If you think all that is excusable behaviour towards a *15 YEAR OLD*, head to your nearest police station and put yourself on a registry. Also I was a generally trusting teenager of the adults around me to. Yknow. Not hurt me. And that "surely I'm safe around my adult friend,,," followed me up until I had turned 16-17.
I’ve been playing vrchat for less than two weeks and I’ve already seen insane amounts of racism, homophobia, transphobia, ERP, sexual harassment, and terrible alcoholism. I was one of those who nearly drank themselves to death. Never touching alcohol again.
Do you still play the game and do you recommend it? Sometimes when I feel lonely I really have the urge to buy a VR headset and just make friends in VRChat.
not even five minutes in and this video has almost brought me to tears remembering how vast and inviting this game used to be, how it truly felt like there was an unlimited amount of worlds and people to meet
Wow, what an incredibly heartbreaking watch... thank you for sharing, it means a lot. The constantly shifting subtitles for Maple and Yunggies gave me a chuckle though!
i had a friend in vrchat in 2021. i was 13 and he was 15. he had full body tracking so we were joking around and having fun in worlds and everything seemed fine. he invited me to several worlds where i saw him hanging out with this older group and having fun with them so i felt a little FOMO but there wasnt anything bad at the time. one day my friend on discord whos also friends with my friend told me to join this among us lobby, and there i found him erping with some dude. i thought it was funny at first because it was like "ooo virtual sex lmfaoo" but someone told me about how bad it is for someone his age to erp. i clicked on the other guy's bio (the one her was erping with) and it said he was 23. both of them had everyone muted so we couldnt say anything to him but eventually someone invited a crasher and they crashed the lobby. i tried dming him about it and told him how bad it is that hes doing this with someone whos 23 and he immediately blocked me afterwards. its truly depressing seeing someone getting groomed right before your eyes and knowing theres nothing you can do to stop it. i hope hes okay right now wherever he is
I feel like people miss this a lot but even if it was a minor x minor erp it’s still not ok If anyone is reading this do not erp if you are a minor and do not erp with a minor. No minors should be involved with erp it doesn’t matter if both parties are both minors, it still fucks people up The only people who should be allowed to erp are fully consenting adults
@@Seeks__ Adults can if they want to it’s their choice. But yes it can also be unhealthy for adults. it’s not always though that’s kind of ridiculous. I’ve seen enough adults use it for dating/flirting phase as well as for when they cannot be together physically, without being mentally ruined or developing bad habits. If you’re around enough people with unhealthy habits it can definitely seem like it’s one and the same with bad but it’s not. you have to be very careful and responsible with how you go about erp, how often, boundaries, and a lot of other stuff just like any other sexual activity/topic. But erp doesn’t automatically mean a sex addiction lol yes they can easily be connected, but it’s not absolutes. The most people in danger are people who are lonely/desperate/isolated/bored, minors, people who started when they were minors/young, people who do not have appropriate boundaries or can set appropriate boundaries/separation, and people already predisposed to unhealthy relationships, boundaries, and behavior (one example: abuse victims).
The video was already making me somewhat emotional towards the end and then I saw my very good friend at 00:40:10 and my heart sank. It's been years and it still hurts especially knowing what type of person he was and how he died. For anyone that lost him too... My condolences and for anyone who lost any friend to self-harm and depression. I'm so sorry for your loss!
The most recent one I lost was less than a month ago... VRC has therapists, but we are not a therapy office. We can't save you... but we can hold you during the bad times if you let us. I miss her, no matter how frustrated I would get with her... I miss her like crazy. Hug your friends, hold them accountable, and tell them you love them... You might miss the chance if you don't. VRC will only be safe if we stop being cowards about losing connections, by hurting someone's feelings or ego's, and make it safe.
The story about the VRC family actually brought a tear to my eye.. i wish more people saw this because although it was the good, the bad, the ugly, you made it into a beautiful and well presented story.. ive been on vrchat since damn near day one i only use it for my twitch streaming now adays but it definitely is a very good escape but you can definitely be sucked in, in all the worst ways
Wasn't on VRChat specifically, though I did lose a close friend of mine to a car accident while they were on a road trip north. It's been years since they passed, but everyday I think about them, what they would do, how they would react, something pertaining to them as we were hanging out all the time and always played the same games as each other. She never got into VRChat in time to see the wonders the game has to offer sadly, but I think she would of loved it just as much as I do... I even made a vrchat account using her name, as well as a discord application (bot) in remembrance, both named Meikaku. Not a history I talk about often to anyone, even some close friends don't know this... as it stiill hurts to recall the day I got the message from her father.
i understand how you feel i had a cat called lovelin i loved that cat more then anyone i know but she passed away you dont have to forget your loss but you cant stay in that moment forever sooner or later you have to move on and i hope you have or can find peace or content
I ran a drinking server for a year and drank heavily for a year in all sorts of places [and I mean heavily, 24 hours straight with the headset on drinking absinthe/rectified spirits] and the amount of things I've seen and people I've met VRC really is a dark and terrible place if you go too deep into it. I've known about second life and other "bad" places with deep rabbit holes online but I seriously believe VRC stands out as one of the worst places the internet has ever seen depending on how much you are exposed to the drinking and other sides of it. I've quit drinking entirely and have thankfully had some positives out of it all such as making some good friends that I've met irl [meeting them again in 10 days] and also meeting my partner who I met irl last month and plan on staying with them for a few months also in around two weeks or so. I'd say that is probably the only good side of any of it and the commonality between people like that is that they have also mostly quit VRC just like I have. I believe the people that stay and keep vrc as a constant factor in their life are the ones that just descend more and more into disconnection, addiction and madness.
the end made my cry and also remember some bad stuff.. a couple years back a friend of mine she always were online when i was around i always was wearing loli avatars and she was always welcoming and cheerfull... sometimes when you were hanging out with her you were able to hear or notice bad stuff happening to her by her family she always tried to hide it and was acting light hearted and happy stuff in my reallife increased so i spent less time online at somepoint i wasnt able to get online for multiple weeks... after i came online she wasnt around i wasnt thinking too much of it the last thing i noticed is she wanted to meet up with someone in the group and he also wasnt around ... about a month later i came since i wasnt online again... but the guy she wanted to meet up was around so i asked him how the meetup was and where she is havent seen her a while and everyone in the lobby got real quiet for a moment and he said... she took her own life the day before they wanted to meet eachother and she was victim of an alcoholic mother and father that were both severely abusive to her... i never had the chance to even properly say goodbye to her or anything... no one of us was... he also only knew since he hasnt heard anything from her for a couple days and drove to her 5 hours and her parents were blaming him for what happened... since then i had a hard time being part of the group... i every once in a while wrote with them but there are too many memorys and too many things hurting me and they all understand it are very understanding while still sad.... this video made everything come up again... and i feel guilty for net helping her more... i havnt really realized how bad it is
please remember that its not your fault, you were in her life and probably helped her more then you realize by just being her friend during the time she spent on earth, so please dont blame urself over something you couldn't control, sending you lots of hugs 🫂
Most awful thing I've experienced in VR chat was ACCIDENTALLY caused one of my best friends at the time to have a seizure when I was learning the features of my avatar with him in a world. I accidentally threw a flash bang grenade, didn't know how I did it, kept doing it by accident, and didn't know how to stop it from throwing them. I knew he was epileptic and in the process of switching avatars I must have flashed him like 20 times. We don't talk anymore. If by some chance you're reading this, Sean I'm so fucking sorry.
He accepted the risks. Not your problem. I personally go to cringe furry and ERP servers and annoy the shit outta them with jumpscares, lobby crashing etc.
And he stoppes talking to you? Fuck that guy he should know accidentes happen, forgiving is a virtue, and if he immediatly stopped talking with you, hes full of himself, or the same thing, shit
@@Fox_Onii-sanit’s a hangout space where you meet strangers who know nothing about you and have no accountability for their actions. That ain’t it brodie.
Kind of unlocked an old VRChat memory for me because this happened way back in early 2019 and easily was one of the most terrifying moments for me. I was doing a friends+ hop and stumbled into an instance with a group sitting and chatting in an upstairs room but one was very much in a depressive state. As the conversation went and despite the efforts of others there they, continued to spiral talking about being on the edge of suicide. Where it went from bad to worse was when they stepped away and when they came back, we all heard the rack of the slide. I cant recall how long stayed there talking on thin ice but it was a long stressful time with carefully choosing words to deescalate the whole situation. I wonder how they are doing now but it has been five years and their name has slipped my memory.
I fricking love vrchat, makes me able to meet amazing people while being myself, while being who I want to be and well, I'm still working on it but it helps me face my social anxiety with people that truly care about me but gosh, if only there wasn't all of this horrible stuff, yeah I know bad stuff is in every communities and games and social platforms but god dammit, this place can be such a comforting home most of the time, why can't it just stay like that..
This video was beautifully edited. Sometimes the little expo's under the people's names made me chuckle in the lighter moments. But it isn't too comical to lose the deeper subjects. Wonderfully done.
I had a friend I knew since playing Halo 2 with him online in 2005. He had a drinking problem that I think started after his mom died. It cost him his marriage and custody of his kids. For a while I even stopped gaming with him because I didn't like how angry games and conversations made him when drunk. He went to AA meetings and went sober for many months, and we reconnected after that. Fast forward almost 10 years later he started playing VRChat, and even convinced me to join. He was the only person I knew in VR for awhile because it was hard for me to make friends. I eventually did meet a group of people I started spending more time with, and eventually I'd only hear from my friend once every couple of weeks for his DJ sessions or when he put on an event. He was the anchor of his social circle that everyone gravitated to. It was 2020, so a lot of us were depressed from being locked down in self-quarantine. My friend started drinking during all of the online events through most of that year. One day in October of 2020, I had a falling out with a key member of the group I had been spending most of my time with. A lot of shouting in my face and the like. I was being a little annoying, but not to the point to warrant that treatment. I didn't have anyone to turn to in VR Chat in that moment except my long time friend that I hadn't heard from in about a month. I thought I may find some solace and refuge in his friend group. I then noticed he hadn't been online in a month. I thought this was strange, so I went to his Steam account to post an IM or comment. His comment section already had recent messages. The comments were from his friends, saying goodbye. I checked his Facebook and I cried for hours. One night a month prior, he drank so much that his liver failed. He and his doctors knew he was going to die. He sent out what final messages he could, transferred his groups and discord server... and died in the arms of his loving partner. VRChat encourages drinking, sex, and even drug abuse if you know what worlds cater to it. Those with predispositions to addiction will be tempted to do these things in excess. We need to be there to reign in our friends with addictive personalities, and remind them of the dangers they pose to themselves when they are making grave mistakes. If you truly love them, you'll tell them the hard things that they need to hear. Sometimes, even when someone is surrounded by caring people, there's no stopping them. His friends made a memorial for him in VRChat, and once every year we all gather there on the anniversary of his passing to remember him.
this video kind of made me want to share my story about the bad/ugly part of vrchat, and this was 2016/2017 the old days of vrchat. i was 14, a desktop player and i met this guy in a public lobby, i thought he was really cool and funny. he told me he was 24, and i was scared if i told him my real age he wouldn't want to be friends anymore so at the time i told him i was 17. he then started to get flirty with me and thats when i told him i was 14, since i didn't want to get in trouble and i didn't want him to get in trouble. but unfortunately this didnt stop him, and i naively thought he didn't stop flirting with me because he genuinely liked me. i later tell him where i lived and turned out he was staying only an hour away from me. i was SA'd to say the least. and reflecting on that experience as i got older kept me away from the game as a whole for a long time, but i eventually found my people and my crowd within the game. there are a lot of bad things in vrchat and it's not hard to find them, but i think i've had a lot more good experiences than bad as a whole.
There's something funny about seeing the little autism panda avatar that my friend dirty toast made for me, I used to be kinda angry about others using it, but nowadays It's just a fun surprise to see it in random videos c:
I just started playing vr chat a couple months ago, luckily this video warned me before I met any weirdos so I can stop playing but bro tysm my man I’m getting sad reading these chats and I am glad I won’t be able to experience because y’all gave me a warning again ty.
I don’t think that this video should try to persuade you not to play the game though. Like all games, playing VRChat in moderation will mostly be harmless and fun to play, and some of these issues do stem across all games anyway. Does that make the issues listed ignorable? No, but it doesn’t mean you shouldn’t try it out to find your own benefits in playing the game. Just don’t get too attached and have a good time
I don't play vrchat, no one close to me has died yet. but this video made burst into tears, because of the awful idea that a friend may die and you could no longer see them
when i was 16 on this game there was a 19 / 20 yo who groomed and manipulated me. i didnt realise what she was doing till recently (now 19). rlly fucked me up n affects my current life. shit on vrchat is so crazy to the outside wordl n so much stuff that happens behind closed doors. game needs to be 18+ and is way too over sexualised and sm ppl get away with doing shit.
ive been staring at this thumdnail for 5 days every day now. And now i finally had the motivation to watch this. The 3rd journal really got me crying and im kinda depressed now (guess i will be happiest person ever in 2 hours again, always the case for me) but i really found this video shocking. But i have to say, great job in production, just the buildup with all the calls that are getting rejected just to finally say, number canceled because the person died and couldnt pay the number, really great storytelling. Ima touch some grass now
I’d love to hear some women talk on the over-sexualization bit.. I couldn’t help but notice the guys who said they “didn’t care” about it weren’t even using avatars with bodies that are inspired by their own irl, and that’s rlly all we got on that… great video tho :) Hope that makes sense
I haven't successfully played vrchat in about 2 years for this very reason. Finding modest avatars with good features and quality is harder than it should be. The constant lewd portrayal of the avatars make me sick.
Dude this video is so good, and I thank you for touching on the substance abuse in VR. I’m trying to enjoy VR again without having to be under the influence, but it is hard with the pressure with everyone who does it around you, thank you so much though ❤ this video is wonderful
Peer pressure happens at high school, college, work, not a game where the majority of people are 40 year old men, using voice changers, dressed as an egirl….someone tells you to drink or do drugs, just say no and log off?
@@Arbysroastbeefjuice it’s more so the excuse to have an online community and to be alone to use. It’s more about my self control, which I’ve gotten much better with! Also homie- seeing all your recent, all your comments are on these dude videos. You’re just giving him the views and comments, get a life lmao
great video as always, been following you for a while now and i love how you portray things so accurate, yet in kind of a neutral state, you don't demonize things but put the necessary emphasis on the risks and dangers. As someone with a lot of hours on this game I can only agree with basically everything you said. There are sad moments but there are also a lot of happy moments, and if you watch out, you can avoid most of the bad stuff and make your experience pretty good :) Much love and I hope you'll get a million subscribers one day! Your content is awesome! ❤
i think the best thing vrchat taught me is to have fun in the moment, maybe have conversations that im never gonna have again, share knowledge... i learned to not stay around negative people and even to push out these people. if you dont wanna be in a situation, you can just walk out. IRL i dont have pressure to keep an image as much anymore, I just vibe, talk, learn, have fun and walk away if im not vibing. just be yourself and dont worry about others, what are they gonna do? try to talk to me or spread rumors? cant because its only pure vibes
When the “Bad” section was first introduced I immediately thought of TechGangster 💀 I met him a few times when I first started playing VR 3-4 years ago.. he’s been banned countless times but unbanned - a lot of mutuals of mine who have met him as well assume that some VRC creators support his behavior. Your video truly portrays VRC though, the good and the bad. Good Job!
The way you dove into so much about everything that does and is happening on the game is a amazing. To hope it bring awareness to what does happen on vrchat. I thank you for that :D Also 16:02 fucking awesome of you to use stalker music :DDDD
i was personally friends with prophet at 40:10 He made all of us laugh and was one of my first friends in the game back in 2017. I miss him lots💔 i never knew his grave was in vrc, what was the name of that world? i’d like to visit it
it's "Memorial world of Prophet699" it was one of the first ones that popped up. It's really cool that people make memorial worlds, I get sad af when I go to them though...
Thanks so much! I really appreciate you sharing. It hit hard for all of us who knew him, but it's still lovely that someone made this for him, and for the others who passed🙏
I’ve met a lot of people on vrchat, some who were suffering from some extremely debilitating conditions, and I’ve been friends with a lot of them. Most of them tend to drift away, but some stay. And the ones that stay are the most real people I’ve ever met. Vrchat can be a really terrifying place with really evil people on it, but it can also be a life saver for people who can’t leave their house and live.
I’m more of a solo vrchat player since I barely get on so I don’t really have time to really grow a relationship with anyone and I’m fine with that. There used to be a time where I thought that all the people who would dwell in mirrors or do be on vrchat 24/7 I’d think to myself “damn. They must be failures in life” and now it’s like I pity them because what if that’s the only thing they have? What if that’s the only thing keeping them from doing something bad.
Jesus, this was shot so well, this should honestly be entered into film festivals, like it's literally a documentary about how people live currently, it's heart breaking, and so fucking interesting, I've never used VR and have always wanted to, but this makes me even more curios about, like even tho I have lived a very eventful physical life, this brings curiosity to the people I could potentially meet
The best thing about vrc is the creativity and just how much you can do. The worst thing is that it's wasted because the community is so unfathomably toxic and awful that creativity is killed because any difference from the norm is shunned and the people who bring change are bullied until they become jaded and leave the community.
VRchat is way too loose on what it allows people to do in those lobbies. The bad and the ugly far outweigh the good and if you're looking for a place that embraces community and worl exploration, VRchat is one of the LAST places you should go. I genuinely think if the devs don't get their crap together and start moderating this game, they either need to be forced to make the game 18+ or the game needs to be shut down, pulled from storefronts, and investigated by law enforcement. I don't care if you made a friend on there, that pales in comparison to the amount of grooming, manipulation, addiction, suicides, and other tragedies that people have been forced to watch and experience.
@@NoLeftTurns965Social media giants like Meta and Twitter (or X if you wanna call it that) can barely moderate their own services, even despite the fact they have automated moderation systems in place. That's the inherent downside of social media, it attracts EVERYONE (I do consider VRC a type of social media). Should the game be M/Ao rated? Perhaps, but that won't magically solve the issue either, it'll only filter out some people. We could see VRC investing in automated moderation down the line, but even that wouldn't stop the problem altogether. Moderation is a never-ending arms race to keep the bad actors out. I can at least credit the VRC team for trying even despite their small size. It's better than no moderation whatsoever. As for the government/law enforcement angle: You're asking for government overreach with that proposal. I'm not sure you'd want to encourage that.
I didnt expect to resonate with this video so well. It's like I knew how bad things were in the game, and how bad I've been doing in vrchat, but never from an outside perspective. I think I really needed this video to make me take a step back, reevaluate my life online and offline, and need to change before something happens. Thank you
Sometimes I want to play this game again. It made me really happy to always have people to talk to. I quit it because it just made an endless cycle of addiction and depression when I wasn't playing. I also got groomed so much without realizing it (I started playing when I was super young). The peak of COVID made me especially addicted. My only close friend in my life died before I got super into VRC. And I just couldn't make friends like I could with her. So I never felt connected with kids my age. So when my dad got VR it became my whole world. My life revolved around VRC day and night for 2 years straight. My parents constantly worrying and attempting to put limits on my time on it. But I, again, didn't have friends my age and I went without school for a year and a half. So I was isolated and the social interaction from VRC was my drive. Addiction stayed so strong and I would get on VRC regardless of time limitations or punishment. My mom eventually put her foot down after reading messages she saw I had back and fourth with a guy who was grooming me. She didn't take me off of it good, she said some bad things, that I am still affected by today. But she did get me off of it. And for that I am grateful. I was so addicted I almost k**led myself when she took me off of VRC for a month. I tried to go through the window. Nowadays I quit VRC forever and I haven't talked to anyone I used to know in the community for a few years now. I wonder if people remember me at all. In my time on VRC I had also witnessed many adults drinking. Adults who also let me into their private clubs (I was unfortunately very tightnit with many popular club creators and streamers so even though I was a minor I got a lot of leeway and stream noteriaty). It's insane how much drinking people did. Drinking games in lobbies went on for hours. I would sit and watch people drink and drink and take shots for hours on end. VRC just caused an endless bout of drinking and drug chains. People would just go all night long because of peer pressure and feeling it was safe. It's terrible and I just hope for one day people stuck in this game move on, and can be ok. Life gets better eventually without VRChat. It took me a long time to realize that for me. And I hope the addicts and s*icide people will get the actual help they need one day and not help from the people in the VRC community where it's encouraged to feel worse constantly.
My old username was CosmicBrownies or ThatFluffy1 if anyone is wondering what my user was. I am uninterested in re-kindling any old friendships though. I have very much moved on and I just like discussing my experiences.
Made so many cool friends first starting out. Stuck around with a cool group for a while and then slowly watched it dissipate and the fun nights where there would be close to a dozen of us laughing and playing just doing whatever having a good time turned into 2 or 3 people active regularly. I’ll forever miss what it used to be like but things change people move on with life. VRC is a blessing and a curse
Very insightful points with everything, not to mention well made story telling.. I like how the creepy dude voice mails kept looping back like chapters or something.
this video is a masterpiece. good to see you addressing everything going on within the game. i have personally experienced most of them and it is something people have to prepare for before playing this
VRChat was my escape when COVID ran through my family and took the lives of both my father and grandmother away. The only family I have left is my mother, who was days of driving away in Kansas. I was alone, I wasn't sleeping, and at the time my friends were all busy here in town or had started getting distant. Talking with some people in discord who I knew, they still jumped in VRChat and recommended I hang out if I needed some company. I've had my past with alcohol abuse (ex-military, are you shocked?) so it's never been an issue with me in VR, as much as I see others fighting battles with dependency and abuse with it. I've met so, so many wonderful people that I now hang out with in person on weekends, meet up with at furry conventions, and joined in other servers to play games with. In my years on VRChat, there's been good and bad, but overall good.
After watching this, I came through the comments looking for folks like myself who's VRChat experience has been largely great. Sure there a lot of people that come and go, but that's the same thing with real life!
Ima just say this right now and it's a huge reason why I never played vrchat but vrchat actually causes more pain then fixes them. Vrchat will never be a good replacement for actual interaction in the real world ever. Ik some people will have amazing stories about how they met their gf's or wives and vice versa on vrchat and how it saved them but realistically speaking it does more harm than good. The typical scenario I see playing out (because I do it even in video games but fairly certain its way worse on games like vrchat for many reasons) is them having a blast with friends in the virtual world but then having to get off for whatever reason and the second they slip off the headset or just get off if they don't have vr and just looking around. Realizing time and time again that it wasn't real. the characters, the people, everything wasn't real. Having friends hundreds of miles away sucks and if your life revolves around the game, it can be soul crushing realizing that 9 times outta 10 you will never see those people IRL breaks the people already hurting even more. Physical touch is very much needed in a person's life and someone who only has friends online can tell you when a friend or family member (depends for family if u like em or not) or just in general hugs you or even just gives you a handshake it breaks you. Your heart flutters and rejoices as if the dead came back to life and your heart just now began beating again. I know this because I have not had a IRL friend in 6+ years. I have not talked to a IRL friend face to face just as long. When I say these things its because I am going through them RIGHT NOW. If I ever got vrchat I can 100% guarantee that I would probably end up k****** myself because of not being able to go back to this reality. Wanting and longing for vrchat to be my reality instead of this hellish nightmare of a life I'm living in. When you use things like vrchat as an escape it will become your very own fucked up prison of torment in the end. vrchat for the healthy minded is fun and jokes but for the fucked up minded ones its like slowly carving up your brain thats already falling apart until you have completely lost touch with reality. This is just the more wholesome part of VRchat btw because the rabbit whole of the levels of fucked on that game goes insanely deep. You think this is dark the mind fuckery can get 10000000 times worse. So yeah I'm staying away from it at all costs.
The good for me, dancing improcing and being social at same time. The Bad, the ones u get to know and love are still to far away. Drama is drama no matter vr or irl.... ppl are ppl...The ugly well ppl with bad intensions... sadly there are some... . Loved the video awesome work , thanks!
I've been off and on off of VRC since 2019, I've had about maybe 3-4 friend groups ive gone through in those years. However I met my absolute soulmate in VR about a year and a half ago. They were a friend of a friend and long story short after a few months we got into a relationship and we happened to live coincidentally 2 hours by car away. Been to Japan with them and im looking forward to figuring life out with them. I owe VRC to my happinesses and finding her. ❤ Its one of the only good things to come out off that cesspool. I was real fucking lucky.
You're a fantastic journalist. Thank you for this. Sometimes, I regret not being logged in as often as I could be. Something or someone being absent when you come back is difficult. RIP 1k and the treehouse.
People treat VRchat like they’re in a dream state, doing anything they absolutely please and thinking it won’t affect the real world. Virtual reality is turning people crazy and it’s amusing how serious and delusional these pawns can get 🤖
My friend smew had shown me this video because the world (the drawing one) was featured and we watched it in the youtube search world and I think I wanna sub because this video was really well done and it summarizes vrchat really well, I look forward to seeing more videos!
This was a good video for me. I have been 2 years clean from vrc, and I got off bc I realized that I had become a the worst version of my self. And vrc wasn’t helping. Despite the fact this video was extremely hard for me to watch at times, it was a needed closure for me hearing someone describe the truth and facing it. For me, I often make jokes about my experiences on it and ignore the bad, and especially now, when I have been dealin with a relapse in ptsd and trauma from vrc, this video was extremely good for me. Thank you.
13:58 "its easier to rig a bikini than a hoodie" As an avatar modeler, it is NOT easier to rig a bikini over a a hoodie lol, its so much more complicated making skin tight clothing fit the body and move with it well, A hoodie being so loose is just so much more forgiving to work with lol.
Thankfully for me I never got into VRchat or making online friends. I do use discord frequently but I only stay on one server and that’s one that my friends and I created. I’ve known them since high school and almost 6 years since we graduated we still talk every day and try to hang out irl when we can. I’m very grateful for having something like that I can’t even imagine what I would do if I never made friends like that.
I met my now fiance (American) soon to be wife (Me Dutch) in VRChat, there are definitely bad sides to VRChat for sure but it can be incredible if you have some people skill and know who you want to be around or have around you.
What a beautiful, masterfully made video. It highlights many aspects of the game that I was unaware of, and makes everything feel a lot more real--the good and the bad--and I think that's really important. You also handled the more sensitive topics in a very respectful and informative manner, which I really respect. Excellent video, I look forward to what you do next.
I think the most concerning thing is that vr in general causes dissociation, let alone VrChat, and dissociation can make your brain susceptible to many kinds of input
@@klondikegardens6570 yeah i wouldn't risk it, keep yourself safe and healthy If youre really really interested, you could always do it with extreme moderation, thats what i do (i also dissociate p badly)
Big News! Roughly 24 hours after the release of this video, Shangri-La, The ERP based world I talked about in this video, went private!
This means there will be no more people stumbling upon this den of E-sex.
Is it because of this video? I have my doubts, there has been plenty of movements elsewhere to try to shut them down.
But if it is because of this video, that's kinda funny... lol
YES LETS GOOOOOOO, also amazing video, extremely underrated and your channel deserves more attention!❤
holy fuck, finally it's private, took long enough, it always been a thorn in my eye :( I was always worried that kids stumble upon it and get hurt...
It'll reopen or another similar world will pop up no doubt
maybe, It's all about popularity and notoriety though
@@Derafog True, I believe this game amplifies peoples best and worst traits so that's why I don't see the degeneracy in public going away anytime soon sadly.
For me, the bad and ugly thing about this game is that you lose friends as fast as you make them. The relationships made are quickly created due to being able to express yourself however way the real you may act, and you'll eventually find people who match those characteristics. you'll enjoy being with them, but most of the time, they either forget you within a week or the group falls apart within a few month's. It's inevitably unsustainable and makes me wonder what's even left for me after putting in all those hours of getting to know someone. My brother described it perfectly; "Though it may feel special at the end of the day, they aren't people that will stick around. They're just lonely people looking for the nearest thing to fill the void until they see the next appealing thing. "
"they aren't people that will stick around. They're just loney people looking for the nearest thing to fill the void until they see the next appealing thing." this is what my old buddy on vrc said to me
Agreed
Yeah, because of time zones, I am never online the same time my friends are and I do not have a consistant time that I go on VRchat, sometimes I don't realise that I didn't play the game in months and sometimes I have a really hard time remembering who the people on my friends list are.
I have never been good at keeping friends and I bury my past all the time whenever I do the smallest embarassing thing, it is really hard to make a friend and then keep them.
Exactly why a friend and I stopped (luckily only after about 4 to 6 months) because it all became too superficial. It definitely was the off putting part about the entire experience even after having regular conversations with some players over discord sometimes daily.
Yeah it’s why I stopped going to VRC, too many times I try to reconnect or chat with people and… there’s no reach back. I stopped reaching and got nothing back.
I’m lonely and shit, but doesn’t mean I have to be an AH like that.
The worst traumatic moment in vrchat for me was a friend shooting themselves in a public lobby, you see them thinking ah he is drinking. You hear a loud shot they fall down lose tracking. Few seconds go by, thinking he might be acting, seconds turn into minutes I go ask if he's ok, no response, minutes turn into hours hasn't moved. I leave thinking he's probably afk. 2-3 days go by and go check on him same guy, same world, same position hasn't moved an inch. Starting to be scared at that point, ok maybe he forgot to turn it off and went to a vacation. After Idk how long had gone by, but it should've been about a week. He disappeared and never saw that guy online again. So now thinking after I think he shot himself live infront of me in VRChat. And he was such a nice guy aswell.
Ah hell man, I’m sorry to hear that traumatic experience you witnessed, and your loss. I hope you’re doing okay in life, my prayers go out to you. Your friend must’ve been a great pal to you, I’m truly sorry for whatever heavy thoughts he was facing each day. 😔 🙏 ♥️ 💪
Holy shit, that sounds horrifying. I don't know if I'd be the same if one of my friends did that...
If this is real I am very sorry, how did he stay connected in the game that long ?
@@JovianL if he had his headset and stuff plugged up to his computer with no sleep timer it would've kept him connected :(
Im deeply disturbed that all that managed to go on without anyone noticing irl for him,
Speaks volumes on why he did it. He had nonody irl, so he picked a place he felt happy and died there instead, his last view being of the digital space that took him in when his real world neglected him
TW: s*icide
First VRChat friend group I had one of the members of the group unalive himself and I had to attend the funeral online, it was broadcasted. One of the things that hit me the hardest about this is that in the slideshow his family provided to celebrate his life, it was filled with pictures of him but instead of any pictures of him with IRL friends/family, it was pictures of our friend group and other friends he had taken on VRChat.
It hit me because this is when I realized that this game was all he really had socially.
I haven't logged on since, its been a year.
i'm crying because this feels like me.
This made me tear up, I'm so sorry.
Many people escape from reality into virtual reality for a big reason--it's much better in here. Just like people IRL friends around him would warn. It's all up to the ultimate choice.... I am very sorry for your loss.
my brain can't wrap my head around this
im speechless.
Buddy of mine got divorced cause his wife played the game 24/7 pretty much neglecting their kids. Was wild when he finally said the reason was his wife just got sucked into it to escape the responsibility of life i guess. He has full custody of his kids.
That's actually so sad
One reason people shouldn't have kids just for the sake of it
and yet i bet she's still playing it daily and has no remorse for it. She sounds like scum of the earth
@@BullFrogFace Maybe they were socially forced to have the kids. Some people just think if you get pregnant for any reason, you should be forced to give up your life and raise the child(ren).
Guess what... Not everyone is ready to have kids, either mentally or financially, when they accidentally get pregnant or get raped.
It's healthier to not have kids until you're ready. My wife and I are waiting until we're financially stable and mentally ready.
what was your buddy’s first name?
"because it's easier to rig a bikini than a hoodie" so real. the devs need to add an optimized cloth component like they did with physbones so we can have clothing that drapes properly
It's a damn shame cloth physics suck so hard. Lots of awesome ideas for outfits that just don't work in vr because they clip so badly.
Might just be a limitation of the medium though :/
@@Bladeofwar94 you do need more geometry for cloth because you can't fake shape with textures but nothing an AAA studio couldn't overcome
There are lots of tricks to do that, but most people want it all on one avatar. That’s where it brakes down
@@Alkumist avatars should be more like web pages, only loading things as they're needed.
at the cost of some jank (eg textures being purple before they load) you could have omnibus everything and actually better performance ranking as it'd be continually updated based on what you actually have enabled.
@@g_glop Sadly that doesn't really work. Loading isn't the limitation here, performance is.
Textures and Audio take up over 90% of a file, and when loaded onto someone's machine are a magnitude larger then that (A 2000x2000 texture loaded into memory uses 12mb of data. There's no workarounds because shaders require uncompressed files)
Meanwhile, Animations, Phsyics, even the Model itself uses up a tiny fraction of the data a few MB at most. But your PC needs to crunch millions of numbers a *frame* to account for all the dozens of anime tiddies on screen.
about two months ago, i had an adult veteran become my friend on vrc, we spoke alot, and after a week, he became super attached to me. being jealous if i even hungout with my boyfriend..
after a month, hes shown me (17) his nsfw avatars and said very weird things to me. eventually, i put my foot down and blocked him. he tried to start rumors about me, and shit talk me.. and i had a girl come up to me, around 20, and she told me all the horrid things he said about me. she said she hated me, until she realized i was underage, and the guy wasnt a victim, he was a pedo.
its scary, how a person you think is a good guy shows his true colours on a socal game.
that's honestly so awful. people can be so toxic and you wouldn't even know it
I e-dated a 23 yo off vrc when I was 17. Worst part is this man was about to go to police academy to become a cop. He asked for photos on multiple occasions. He dated another girl shortly after me who was of legal age, but imagine knowing your boyfriend a couple months prior was dating a freshly turned 17yo? Ugh.
Did you put your foot down on HIS FACE? maybe that's what he wanted all along.
lol the girl was prob right
You go girl
i have seen pretty much every documentary style video essay on vrc and every single one uncovers something new about the community to me. its absurd how much can happen in just this one game
The underground adult community is a cesspool
D.I.D is highly faked in vrchat look the disorder up find videos on it the disorder is a sad onr
There's a lot that can happen in just one game. Roblox has the same ups and downs sometimes, as well as other online games and or just regular social media. I personally look at the better side of things
@@NF-pk5mo Like underground adult community in real life, too???
It has the exact same issues as Discord and any other similar platforms btw.
It's surprising how much VRchat reminds me a lot of 1st year college student life.
I mean not if you just study and avoid all other aspects of it.
@@Cneqprobably what’s gonna happen to me 😭
@@Poiplimu probably a good thing
@@Poiplimui'm CO24 also and i will probably be spending most of my time on VRC tbh
@@primoryeprovince i’m highschool rn but I’m planning to do engineering and premed. Probably gonna get an MD from military I dunno if I’ll have time
The last bit hit way too hard. I met the most amazing person on here and lost him cause he took his own life. VRchat hasn’t been the same for me since. You just learn to deal with it but it never heals.
Im sorry to hear that
The same happened to me but in FFXIV. The guy I met recruited me into his own server and he was a ray of sunshine... I can never forget how amazing of a person he was, picking me up randomly when I was a bit down by sending me a chat message while wandering. He overdosed on alcohol and ended up hitting his head on his dresser after a fall. He never woke up after. It's something that still hurts me to this day.
@@tovahwulf thats so tragic im real sorry you had that happen i hope he's in a better place
Grief never goes away. You just grow bigger around it. May the grief you carry feel lighter, as you continue on.
Yeah, I agree with you. The survivor's guilt and pain never really go away. It's only getting worse and worse too. I've lost four friends and a cousin to suicide and it seems like people really don't understand how bad it's getting until it's too late
A couple years back I had a friend, we called Michael, he was a fun caring person big in Half-life rp. Over time I drifted away from him and his group for another group of VRC friends. A few months pass, I’m in a friends world with some of my friends, Micheal joins unexpectedly. We hang out for a bit before telling me he has cancer. Was shocked, I couldn’t say anything, and I wish I did. We hang out the rest of the night and call it that. A couple more months go by, I log on VRC and check my friends list to see who’s on. I see the status of one of Micheal’s rp friends saying “RIP Micheal” It hit me hard. I looked at other friends of his, many saying things along that line. One of them ever turned their bio into a short Wikipedia like article about him. Micheal was 14, it’s been 2 years since his passing and I still find myself thinking of our last interaction, wishing I said something.
Quick thing lad, your background music has inspired me to play the S.T.A.L.K.E.R series again! Thanks! Guten tag!
Maybe don’t ditch your “friend” next time, he wasn’t your friend
He was only your friend until you wanted to try other friends. That’s no friend , rip Michael he didn’t deserve that
@notreallyafamousartist695 people drift apart sometimes, it's completely natural and there Is nothing wrong with that. Maybe don't go judging people and relations that you know absolutely nothing about
@@notreallyafamousartist695people like you are sad. Judging others based on nothing and making huge assumptions. Constantly assuming the worst only leads to sadness.
Man this made me sad to read and when I saw he was 14 I teared up. That’s so hard for a kid to go through. Cancer is hard enough for anyone but a child 💔 I hope he had fun in his short life and felt how loved he was by those around him.
@@notreallyafamousartist695friends drifting happens to everyone. You and another friend have drifted apart, it happens to humans especially as people change, as they meet new people, as they get jobs or busy with school.
i had friends with serious substance abuse issues. a day after a night of drinking, one friend asked, "Why does my stomach hurt so much? It's seriously bad." to which another friend responded, "That's because you drink so much the acid lining your stomach starts to wear away. (Alcohol gastritis). Either you go sober for a month and face serious pain and withdrawl, or you make the pain go away by drinking more."
She chose the ladder
Tbh, the second person sounds horrible, and definitely not someone to consider a friend. Telling an alcoholic that to keep drinking means the pain will go away is basically a death sentence. An alcoholic may be afraid of dying to their addiction, but being presented the promise of no more pain as opposed to withdrawal is most likely going to send a crippling addict down the wrong path. It's important to be careful how you present things to an addict, and portraying the deadly outcome as the better one has to be one of the worst ways to do it.
@@NoLeftTurns965Dunno if I'd say that portrays the deadly outcome as the better one, though. It just read like a "you can drink yourself to death, or suffer through therapy" type statement.
Definitely woulda been better to keep the "won't hurt as much" to themself tho
Unhealthy people brings out unhealthyness in others. If they were good and healthy friends they wouldn't even have gotten to that stage of consumption
latter, not ladder
@@ExValeFor lmao someone's drunk
I used to be addicted to VR. It was difficult to break away from it as it not only got me addicted to alcohol but also led me into a routine of nightly drinking with people I barely knew. This addiction caused me to lose social skills and put a financial burden on myself with expenses like DoorDash, alcohol, and other drugs. Before VRChat, I used to be more social, spending time with my family and friends and feeling more confident in myself. VRChat turned me into an alcoholic and someone who couldn't handle problems correctly. I even almost ended up in the hospital once due to overdrinking. Just few weeks ago, I felt almost died in my room after smoking and drinking excessively because of people encouraging me to keep going. A while back, I broke my trackers, which ruined the game for me. Since then, I have reduced my game time from every night to maybe once a week. I've also been drinking a lot less and feeling better mentally and physically. I'm back to talking to my family more and seeing old friends again, whom I barely spoke to in the last 2 years of my addiction to this game. Being away from the VRChat addiction has made me realize how it has brought me down and hurt me, and also how it's actively harming the people I know who still play the game. I'm glad to be away from it, but I still get urges to get back on and continue the same behavior.
I'm so sorry that people encouraged you to keep going like that, and I am glad to hear that you are doing better. I've honestly stayed out of public rooms on VRChat for this and a lot of other reasons. I'm mostly on Resonite now because I can focus on social creation and teaching the conlang I know, so I am a firm believer that VR can be a valuable tool if you find a healthy activity to engage in. I hope I'm not sounding preachy here, it just breaks my heart to hear that you were in a place like that and people encouraged you to drink even more, and I hope maybe talking about the stuff i get up to might help you make some friends.
i honestly relate, i used to drink a lot when playing vrchat and talking to people (even thought of buying drugs to make the "experience" more enjoyable) but thankfully my own will stopped from doing so and not become an addict, it honestly has to do with the people your sourruonded with and the places (or worlds) u go to, im sorry to hear that, but then again, if u find a good healthy friendship or friends group it'd be an enriching experience, getting to socialize with likeminded people is one of the best feelings ever, i hope u continue to get better!
@@Pepo.. this x1000!
when i get into VR i am learning how to make items, avatars, even ended up figuring out audio reactivity on my own the other day using a talkvisualizer component and linking it with an audio stream, all because of the helpful people i have met since i first got into VR. this i why i like resonite; i dont see anywhere near as much drinking parties or worlds, most of the time i see people hanging out they are showing off neat things they created and/or showing people how something was made so others can make their own.
It definitely helps to be around people who you can have an enriching experience with. big part of why i have gotten into conlang learning (conlang = constructed language, for me it's na'vi) People are so eager to teach, and I love it. That sense of community has helped pull me through some really dark times.
Im in that boat with you man, gave away my headset and stopped when i realized the only reason i was on the game was to drink or do drugs
I've met like 6 different guys in "Would rather" who were constantly playing drinking games. Everyone would cheer for another bottle with "Drink! Drink!". I was most of the time the sole person who stepped in to stop their game for their own health by interrupting view and telling about wellbeing. Looks goofy from their perspective - a fluffy space raptor jumps in face and begs in broken english to stop and value a life.
"when life gives you lemon. you eat limes, and... do the time!" quote of the fucking year
That story about saving someone from an unstable armed person gave me shivers. And that's only "the bad", and not "the ugly". Fuck.
Yeah that’s crazy I’m so glad she got away safely, and she had someone to help her. I really hope that man never did anything like that to anyone else but I’m worried he did.
If you have mental health issues PLEASE reach out, theres so many skills to help you get through those really dark thoughts you have. Its not just a hehe haha cope with it by drinking; please get help. You are loved, you are cared for, we want the best for you, theres so many ways to ask for help. Just PLEASE reach out.
My heart started racing when i read the warning, especially unaliving ones self. I went through something I wish no one ever went through, took me years of therapy to learn to handle the PTSD from that one night. Its almost 5 years since that night, almost to the date. I think about his mom a lot, his family and those who miss him all the time. I hope he's watching over his mom and acting as her guardian angel. Rest Easy Parcivul.
PSA: if you are mentally unstable, then stay off of public forms/places on the internet.
Instead, talk to a doctor.
VR Chat, Discord, Twitter, streamers, etc. Are NOT your personal therapists or babysitters.
And they are not suitable replacements for such. Get help.
A therapist for real issues, an AI if you want to do a toxic rant.
Hopefully you have someone's contact information irl. You can contact them and ask to have lunch with. They don't even have to be a friend yet.
Will it be awkward and uncomfortable to ask, probably. But if it gets you to touch grass, it's worth it to see the real world.
As a last resort, call a wellness check on yourself using your area's non-emergency number.
there is no one to reach out to and therapist only help you bceause they get money
This is sadly a really positive message to a very deep problem. You mean well, but reality does not always uphold your statement. Lets say there is help out there for you and you can pay for it. It's still a process which is very hard and tiring. Some people go through multiple therapists before they even find someone they feel comfortable around. Now if you combine that with some of the waiting lists of 2-5 months and you might have to invest a year into even finding help hopping from therapist to therapist. Not to mention the money you spend. Even in more "social" countries, often only the most heavy mental issues get compensated.
Also saying "we want the best for you" is just a lie. It sucks but by far the most people do not want to be someone's "reason to live" not even be someone's therapist. Actually listening and being there for someone is hard work and is not fun. I'm not on VRC to listen to someone vent, I might to a friend from time to time, but I'm there to have fun. And don't get me wrong, I too have been people's "therapist" plenty of times but it gets boring and a relationship will quickly turn to an obligation.
I do agree people should try and reach out, but it's difficult and please do so with professionals. People online will drop you when they feel you become a burden.
Quitting VRChat was the best thing I have ever done. I now have healthy friendships and a healthier understanding of relationships. I have improved my mental health greatly, and I only touch my headset for other vr games like beat saber. I consider myself very lucky to have gotten out of that addiction, but I am glad more videos like these are starting to come out detailing the dark side of VRChat. I played from 2018 to 2022 religiously and some of the stuff I experienced was on a range of vile to purely heartbreaking. Its sad to see so many people suffering, I wish the devs and community didnt turn such a blind eye to all these problems. So many of these people need serious help I hope they are able to get out like I did.
I quit vrchat, it was the first thing that really exposed me to pornographic type stuff first, when i was 13-14 this really affects those who are young, and it’s downright disgusting the things I had seen looking back, i though left and immediately my life became better, i will never look back
I had to break up with a guy, because he became addicted to VRChat. He was spending all his money on avatars and worlds. He would lock himself in his office from the moment he woke up to the minute he had to go to work every day of the week. He became distant and absent from conversations. He would get drunk on the weekends and that was the only time I ever saw him. I believe he was grooming underage girls, because I would hear his conversations from the other room. I caught him cheating on me when a text message popped on up his phone when we were in the car one day and it was from someone he frequently talked about playing with on VRChat. All of this was within 2 months of him getting his headset. I confronted him and he would become defensive and hostile. It was disgusting to see how much his perception of reality changed and how much he prioritized his VR life/reputation.
Jesus
I play VRchat a bunch but 24/7/365 is wild and grooming is wild and cheating is wild I’m so sorry for you
Ugh I’m so sorry for you. My ex thought I bought a vr headset to cheat on him with and I thought he was crazy for thinking that, I got it to hang out with friends who already played it, I got to spend time with my best friend since all she had was vr while she was struggling with housing crashing at different places. No computer, just her quest. But seeing people actually do that is crazy. I can’t imagine jeopardizing real life relationships for online crap. But I know it happens, a diff ex cheated on me, on PlayStation.
about two or three years ago, we lost complete contact with a friend in vrc, he had attempted s*, luckily we were able to contact his family and they found him before he was able to do anything, however those few days of not knowing whether my really dear friend from continents away was dead or alive have had quite the impact on me. From what i've seen, such stories aren't that rare in vrc. However it is also a universe i adore in which i have met incredible people and a world that has inspired me to work on art and on improving myself, outside of the vr headset. thanks for the great video ❤
i thought i recognized the music, then i heard "He was a good STALKER"
big ups
What else you have brought into those comments?
Tin cans? Kolbasa? Bolts?
@@calluxdoaron1903 you're not him brah. 😅
Also what is kolbasa? Kiełbasa...?
@@calluxdoaron1903the money. this is my next quest, some clear sky dude told me to go check out a game called "VRChat", and now I'm here. I just want my money, man..
@@towarzyszmarcin474 No, he's right. The in-game ID for it is 'kolbasa'. Which I guess is close enough to 'ковбаса' since the game is Ukrainian.
This video is genuinely a fascinating auto-ethnography about vrchat and its inhabitants. Such a refreshingly earnest and empathetic insight for something you clearly care for. The cinematography puts a bow on everything. Thank you.
I always feel out of place when i realize how different everyone elses opinions on sexualization and hypersexuality online is. To me its not really self-expression when they make it their entire personality. Like making sexual jokes all the time and flirting with people constantly, maybe its just me but its off putting.
yeah, I personally find it incredibly tiring when people can't finish a sentence without saying something sexual, and it's gotten so common online especially. you're not alone fr
Its only self expression if you're a degenerate with no real personality
You are not alone. If being overly sexual is how some people choose to express their personality, maybe their personality should be called into question.
Yeah fr! My best friend and I went to the black cat lobby and we’re just hanging out and this guy was joking about her ass and being sexual and I was like nah just stop, and he started saying I bet you’re the fat friend, and being so rude for what? Like..
@watermel0n210 thats actual sexual harassment what a creep, im so sorry that happened to you guys
I was groomed on this game multiple times and was chased off of it due to the threat of a 24 year old that groomed me was going to dox me. Got back on a year later and have been playing ever since and lemme tell you, the fear that i have of running into him again on a seperate account is still there enough where I stay out of a lot of the typical public egirl/eboy spaces and stick to games I know (like Genshin and Honkai) Although, I've had my run ins with weirdos and sub human people (p3dophiles, mainly). I was 15 when that happened, I'm now 20. I genuinely believe kids should be monitored by their parents now that headsets are more accessible
Edit: I dont know how this got so contreversial, but for those few people in my replies trying to say that it "wasnt grooming" and that "its a game", I am genuinely asking why you don't see anything wrong with a 24-25 YEAR OLD MAN isolating, shit talking, asking sexual favours, verbally abusing, and threatening to dox a 15 year old on the internet. If that predator and I werent on VRChat, it was through Discord. If we weren't on Discord, it was through VRChat. You didnt see when I had said no to him and didnt want to, you didnt see the way he would get upset at me for not doing those sexual favours, you didnt see the way he would tell me to be grateful he still spoke to me because of "how much i was misbehaving". If you think all that is excusable behaviour towards a *15 YEAR OLD*, head to your nearest police station and put yourself on a registry.
Also I was a generally trusting teenager of the adults around me to. Yknow. Not hurt me. And that "surely I'm safe around my adult friend,,," followed me up until I had turned 16-17.
juju i was not expecting to come across you in a comment section
@@WildfireAster YOU
what do you mean you got “groomed” you were in a game you’ll be fine lmao
@@WildfireAster omg is that the hit vrc user aster
How do you get groomed in vr
you are criminally underrated
criminally is an understatement
He is
True
Just stumbled opon him and I agree
Federally
I’ve been playing vrchat for less than two weeks and I’ve already seen insane amounts of racism, homophobia, transphobia, ERP, sexual harassment, and terrible alcoholism. I was one of those who nearly drank themselves to death. Never touching alcohol again.
Do you still play the game and do you recommend it? Sometimes when I feel lonely I really have the urge to buy a VR headset and just make friends in VRChat.
@@purex9415 Try it out on desktop mode first
Two weeks and you already tried to drink yourself to death? Jesus.
@@purex9415no go outside instead
I only saw those things in public worlds. I never go to public worlds now, less trauma.
The handheld cam feel and the raw documentary vibe is killing from how good it is. Great job man
not even five minutes in and this video has almost brought me to tears remembering how vast and inviting this game used to be, how it truly felt like there was an unlimited amount of worlds and people to meet
Plz stop💀
@@pandama-chanprod.8598how miserable are you, let the mf just reminisce
We ball
Till we fall.
Reaper‘s on call
While we runnin’ in the hall
i fuckin hit my head on the wall
I hope this isn't the end of it all
Wow, what an incredibly heartbreaking watch... thank you for sharing, it means a lot. The constantly shifting subtitles for Maple and Yunggies gave me a chuckle though!
i had a friend in vrchat in 2021. i was 13 and he was 15. he had full body tracking so we were joking around and having fun in worlds and everything seemed fine. he invited me to several worlds where i saw him hanging out with this older group and having fun with them so i felt a little FOMO but there wasnt anything bad at the time. one day my friend on discord whos also friends with my friend told me to join this among us lobby, and there i found him erping with some dude. i thought it was funny at first because it was like "ooo virtual sex lmfaoo" but someone told me about how bad it is for someone his age to erp. i clicked on the other guy's bio (the one her was erping with) and it said he was 23. both of them had everyone muted so we couldnt say anything to him but eventually someone invited a crasher and they crashed the lobby. i tried dming him about it and told him how bad it is that hes doing this with someone whos 23 and he immediately blocked me afterwards. its truly depressing seeing someone getting groomed right before your eyes and knowing theres nothing you can do to stop it. i hope hes okay right now wherever he is
I feel like people miss this a lot but even if it was a minor x minor erp it’s still not ok
If anyone is reading this do not erp if you are a minor and do not erp with a minor. No minors should be involved with erp it doesn’t matter if both parties are both minors, it still fucks people up
The only people who should be allowed to erp are fully consenting adults
@@LiSkyFox Erp is not healthy for adults, either. Sex addiction does terrible things to people, affecting their self-image and perception of love.
@@Seeks__ Adults can if they want to it’s their choice. But yes it can also be unhealthy for adults.
it’s not always though that’s kind of ridiculous. I’ve seen enough adults use it for dating/flirting phase as well as for when they cannot be together physically, without being mentally ruined or developing bad habits.
If you’re around enough people with unhealthy habits it can definitely seem like it’s one and the same with bad but it’s not.
you have to be very careful and responsible with how you go about erp, how often, boundaries, and a lot of other stuff just like any other sexual activity/topic.
But erp doesn’t automatically mean a sex addiction lol yes they can easily be connected, but it’s not absolutes.
The most people in danger are people who are lonely/desperate/isolated/bored, minors, people who started when they were minors/young, people who do not have appropriate boundaries or can set appropriate boundaries/separation, and people already predisposed to unhealthy relationships, boundaries, and behavior (one example: abuse victims).
@@Seeks__ ok catholic
The video was already making me somewhat emotional towards the end and then I saw my very good friend at 00:40:10 and my heart sank. It's been years and it still hurts especially knowing what type of person he was and how he died. For anyone that lost him too... My condolences and for anyone who lost any friend to self-harm and depression. I'm so sorry for your loss!
The most recent one I lost was less than a month ago...
VRC has therapists, but we are not a therapy office.
We can't save you...
but we can hold you during the bad times if you let us.
I miss her, no matter how frustrated I would get with her... I miss her like crazy.
Hug your friends, hold them accountable, and tell them you love them...
You might miss the chance if you don't.
VRC will only be safe if we stop being cowards about losing connections, by hurting someone's feelings or ego's, and make it safe.
The story about the VRC family actually brought a tear to my eye.. i wish more people saw this because although it was the good, the bad, the ugly, you made it into a beautiful and well presented story.. ive been on vrchat since damn near day one i only use it for my twitch streaming now adays but it definitely is a very good escape but you can definitely be sucked in, in all the worst ways
Wasn't on VRChat specifically, though I did lose a close friend of mine to a car accident while they were on a road trip north. It's been years since they passed, but everyday I think about them, what they would do, how they would react, something pertaining to them as we were hanging out all the time and always played the same games as each other. She never got into VRChat in time to see the wonders the game has to offer sadly, but I think she would of loved it just as much as I do...
I even made a vrchat account using her name, as well as a discord application (bot) in remembrance, both named Meikaku. Not a history I talk about often to anyone, even some close friends don't know this... as it stiill hurts to recall the day I got the message from her father.
i understand how you feel i had a cat called lovelin i loved that cat more then anyone i know but she passed away you dont have to forget your loss but you cant stay in that moment forever sooner or later you have to move on and i hope you have or can find peace or content
@@Foreversalt Thank you for your kind words.
I think it’s a pretty small beautiful way to remember her ❤
I ran a drinking server for a year and drank heavily for a year in all sorts of places [and I mean heavily, 24 hours straight with the headset on drinking absinthe/rectified spirits] and the amount of things I've seen and people I've met VRC really is a dark and terrible place if you go too deep into it. I've known about second life and other "bad" places with deep rabbit holes online but I seriously believe VRC stands out as one of the worst places the internet has ever seen depending on how much you are exposed to the drinking and other sides of it.
I've quit drinking entirely and have thankfully had some positives out of it all such as making some good friends that I've met irl [meeting them again in 10 days] and also meeting my partner who I met irl last month and plan on staying with them for a few months also in around two weeks or so.
I'd say that is probably the only good side of any of it and the commonality between people like that is that they have also mostly quit VRC just like I have. I believe the people that stay and keep vrc as a constant factor in their life are the ones that just descend more and more into disconnection, addiction and madness.
Your channel is still centered around it.
You're still exposing people to it...
Yo that guy that picked up his friend from a dangerously scary situation is a serious chad! King energy right there❤ they deserve the happiest life fr
the end made my cry and also remember some bad stuff.. a couple years back a friend of mine she always were online when i was around i always was wearing loli avatars and she was always welcoming and cheerfull... sometimes when you were hanging out with her you were able to hear or notice bad stuff happening to her by her family she always tried to hide it and was acting light hearted and happy stuff in my reallife increased so i spent less time online at somepoint i wasnt able to get online for multiple weeks... after i came online she wasnt around i wasnt thinking too much of it the last thing i noticed is she wanted to meet up with someone in the group and he also wasnt around ... about a month later i came since i wasnt online again... but the guy she wanted to meet up was around so i asked him how the meetup was and where she is havent seen her a while and everyone in the lobby got real quiet for a moment and he said... she took her own life the day before they wanted to meet eachother and she was victim of an alcoholic mother and father that were both severely abusive to her... i never had the chance to even properly say goodbye to her or anything... no one of us was... he also only knew since he hasnt heard anything from her for a couple days and drove to her 5 hours and her parents were blaming him for what happened... since then i had a hard time being part of the group... i every once in a while wrote with them but there are too many memorys and too many things hurting me and they all understand it are very understanding while still sad.... this video made everything come up again... and i feel guilty for net helping her more... i havnt really realized how bad it is
please remember that its not your fault, you were in her life and probably helped her more then you realize by just being her friend during the time she spent on earth, so please dont blame urself over something you couldn't control, sending you lots of hugs 🫂
too bad i'm too socially akward to meet with people even in a virtual world
Most awful thing I've experienced in VR chat was ACCIDENTALLY caused one of my best friends at the time to have a seizure when I was learning the features of my avatar with him in a world. I accidentally threw a flash bang grenade, didn't know how I did it, kept doing it by accident, and didn't know how to stop it from throwing them. I knew he was epileptic and in the process of switching avatars I must have flashed him like 20 times.
We don't talk anymore. If by some chance you're reading this, Sean I'm so fucking sorry.
He accepted the risks. Not your problem.
I personally go to cringe furry and ERP servers and annoy the shit outta them with jumpscares, lobby crashing etc.
And he stoppes talking to you? Fuck that guy he should know accidentes happen, forgiving is a virtue, and if he immediatly stopped talking with you, hes full of himself, or the same thing, shit
@@ZipClipChannel ???? yeah no wtf is wrong with you.
vrchat is one of the most horrifying games I've ever played (in a emotional way)
It's not a game, it's a simple hangout place.
@@Fox_Onii-san Ain't nothin' *SIMPLE* about it.
@@nullprop The only "complex" thing about it is people, but people aren't place or game.
@@Fox_Onii-sanit’s a hangout space where you meet strangers who know nothing about you and have no accountability for their actions. That ain’t it brodie.
@@jonoleech7832 have you ever been in irl nightclub?
The stories... I'm not crying YOU ARE CRYING
Kind of unlocked an old VRChat memory for me because this happened way back in early 2019 and easily was one of the most terrifying moments for me.
I was doing a friends+ hop and stumbled into an instance with a group sitting and chatting in an upstairs room but one was very much in a depressive state. As the conversation went and despite the efforts of others there they, continued to spiral talking about being on the edge of suicide. Where it went from bad to worse was when they stepped away and when they came back, we all heard the rack of the slide. I cant recall how long stayed there talking on thin ice but it was a long stressful time with carefully choosing words to deescalate the whole situation.
I wonder how they are doing now but it has been five years and their name has slipped my memory.
I fricking love vrchat, makes me able to meet amazing people while being myself, while being who I want to be and well, I'm still working on it but it helps me face my social anxiety with people that truly care about me but gosh, if only there wasn't all of this horrible stuff, yeah I know bad stuff is in every communities and games and social platforms but god dammit, this place can be such a comforting home most of the time, why can't it just stay like that..
This video was beautifully edited.
Sometimes the little expo's under the people's names made me chuckle in the lighter moments.
But it isn't too comical to lose the deeper subjects. Wonderfully done.
I had a friend I knew since playing Halo 2 with him online in 2005. He had a drinking problem that I think started after his mom died. It cost him his marriage and custody of his kids. For a while I even stopped gaming with him because I didn't like how angry games and conversations made him when drunk. He went to AA meetings and went sober for many months, and we reconnected after that. Fast forward almost 10 years later he started playing VRChat, and even convinced me to join.
He was the only person I knew in VR for awhile because it was hard for me to make friends. I eventually did meet a group of people I started spending more time with, and eventually I'd only hear from my friend once every couple of weeks for his DJ sessions or when he put on an event. He was the anchor of his social circle that everyone gravitated to. It was 2020, so a lot of us were depressed from being locked down in self-quarantine. My friend started drinking during all of the online events through most of that year.
One day in October of 2020, I had a falling out with a key member of the group I had been spending most of my time with. A lot of shouting in my face and the like. I was being a little annoying, but not to the point to warrant that treatment. I didn't have anyone to turn to in VR Chat in that moment except my long time friend that I hadn't heard from in about a month. I thought I may find some solace and refuge in his friend group.
I then noticed he hadn't been online in a month. I thought this was strange, so I went to his Steam account to post an IM or comment. His comment section already had recent messages. The comments were from his friends, saying goodbye. I checked his Facebook and I cried for hours. One night a month prior, he drank so much that his liver failed. He and his doctors knew he was going to die. He sent out what final messages he could, transferred his groups and discord server... and died in the arms of his loving partner.
VRChat encourages drinking, sex, and even drug abuse if you know what worlds cater to it. Those with predispositions to addiction will be tempted to do these things in excess. We need to be there to reign in our friends with addictive personalities, and remind them of the dangers they pose to themselves when they are making grave mistakes. If you truly love them, you'll tell them the hard things that they need to hear. Sometimes, even when someone is surrounded by caring people, there's no stopping them.
His friends made a memorial for him in VRChat, and once every year we all gather there on the anniversary of his passing to remember him.
keep coming at us with god damn movies, wilddd
this hit really hard, got watery eyes more times than I'd like to admit..
this video kind of made me want to share my story about the bad/ugly part of vrchat, and this was 2016/2017 the old days of vrchat. i was 14, a desktop player and i met this guy in a public lobby, i thought he was really cool and funny. he told me he was 24, and i was scared if i told him my real age he wouldn't want to be friends anymore so at the time i told him i was 17. he then started to get flirty with me and thats when i told him i was 14, since i didn't want to get in trouble and i didn't want him to get in trouble. but unfortunately this didnt stop him, and i naively thought he didn't stop flirting with me because he genuinely liked me. i later tell him where i lived and turned out he was staying only an hour away from me. i was SA'd to say the least. and reflecting on that experience as i got older kept me away from the game as a whole for a long time, but i eventually found my people and my crowd within the game. there are a lot of bad things in vrchat and it's not hard to find them, but i think i've had a lot more good experiences than bad as a whole.
ur kind of dumb ngl
There's something funny about seeing the little autism panda avatar that my friend dirty toast made for me, I used to be kinda angry about others using it, but nowadays It's just a fun surprise to see it in random videos c:
25:35 THIS IS MY FAVORITE TRACK FROM S.T.A.L.K.E.R I CAN'T BELIEVE YOU USED IT IN YOUR VID! YOU A REAL ONE FOR SURE!!!
very good choice of soundtrack :) I don't hear Russian songs that often on Western videos, let alone on niche Vrchat videos. It is highly appreciated
Thank you ❤
It's always nice to see these topics covered from someone who has more experience in VRChat, and this is incredibly well produced.
I just started playing vr chat a couple months ago, luckily this video warned me before I met any weirdos so I can stop playing but bro tysm my man I’m getting sad reading these chats and I am glad I won’t be able to experience because y’all gave me a warning again ty.
You’ve chosen the good path
I don’t think that this video should try to persuade you not to play the game though. Like all games, playing VRChat in moderation will mostly be harmless and fun to play, and some of these issues do stem across all games anyway. Does that make the issues listed ignorable? No, but it doesn’t mean you shouldn’t try it out to find your own benefits in playing the game. Just don’t get too attached and have a good time
I don't play vrchat, no one close to me has died yet. but this video made burst into tears, because of the awful idea that a friend may die and you could no longer see them
when i was 16 on this game there was a 19 / 20 yo who groomed and manipulated me. i didnt realise what she was doing till recently (now 19). rlly fucked me up n affects my current life. shit on vrchat is so crazy to the outside wordl n so much stuff that happens behind closed doors. game needs to be 18+ and is way too over sexualised and sm ppl get away with doing shit.
You will be in my prayers tonight.
Jesus Loves You!
✝🙏
@@Seeks__ thanks friend :)
ive been staring at this thumdnail for 5 days every day now. And now i finally had the motivation to watch this. The 3rd journal really got me crying and im kinda depressed now (guess i will be happiest person ever in 2 hours again, always the case for me) but i really found this video shocking. But i have to say, great job in production, just the buildup with all the calls that are getting rejected just to finally say, number canceled because the person died and couldnt pay the number, really great storytelling. Ima touch some grass now
I’d love to hear some women talk on the over-sexualization bit.. I couldn’t help but notice the guys who said they “didn’t care” about it weren’t even using avatars with bodies that are inspired by their own irl, and that’s rlly all we got on that… great video tho :)
Hope that makes sense
From what I've read on twitter and reddit most of the female players wish there were more variety of modest clothing for female avatars.
I haven't successfully played vrchat in about 2 years for this very reason. Finding modest avatars with good features and quality is harder than it should be. The constant lewd portrayal of the avatars make me sick.
Dude this video is so good, and I thank you for touching on the substance abuse in VR. I’m trying to enjoy VR again without having to be under the influence, but it is hard with the pressure with everyone who does it around you, thank you so much though ❤ this video is wonderful
Peer pressure happens at high school, college, work, not a game where the majority of people are 40 year old men, using voice changers, dressed as an egirl….someone tells you to drink or do drugs, just say no and log off?
@@Arbysroastbeefjuice it’s more so the excuse to have an online community and to be alone to use. It’s more about my self control, which I’ve gotten much better with! Also homie- seeing all your recent, all your comments are on these dude videos. You’re just giving him the views and comments, get a life lmao
It definitely is possible. Just try to find groups that don’t encourage that sort of thing. There’s definitely communities out there that don’t
Commenting to help the TH-cam algorithms. Great video as always!
Same. Extra words since I’m pretty sure we need at least 4.
The story, the cinematography, the interviews. This is the magnum opis of documentaries on VRchat
great video as always, been following you for a while now and i love how you portray things so accurate, yet in kind of a neutral state, you don't demonize things but put the necessary emphasis on the risks and dangers. As someone with a lot of hours on this game I can only agree with basically everything you said. There are sad moments but there are also a lot of happy moments, and if you watch out, you can avoid most of the bad stuff and make your experience pretty good :) Much love and I hope you'll get a million subscribers one day! Your content is awesome! ❤
i think the best thing vrchat taught me is to have fun in the moment, maybe have conversations that im never gonna have again, share knowledge... i learned to not stay around negative people and even to push out these people. if you dont wanna be in a situation, you can just walk out. IRL i dont have pressure to keep an image as much anymore, I just vibe, talk, learn, have fun and walk away if im not vibing. just be yourself and dont worry about others, what are they gonna do? try to talk to me or spread rumors? cant because its only pure vibes
When the “Bad” section was first introduced I immediately thought of TechGangster 💀 I met him a few times when I first started playing VR 3-4 years ago.. he’s been banned countless times but unbanned - a lot of mutuals of mine who have met him as well assume that some VRC creators support his behavior. Your video truly portrays VRC though, the good and the bad. Good Job!
Thank you for explaining this game the way you did.
The way you dove into so much about everything that does and is happening on the game is a amazing. To hope it bring awareness to what does happen on vrchat. I thank you for that :D Also 16:02 fucking awesome of you to use stalker music :DDDD
i was personally friends with prophet at 40:10 He made all of us laugh and was one of my first friends in the game back in 2017. I miss him lots💔 i never knew his grave was in vrc, what was the name of that world? i’d like to visit it
it's "Memorial world of Prophet699" it was one of the first ones that popped up.
It's really cool that people make memorial worlds, I get sad af when I go to them though...
Thanks so much! I really appreciate you sharing. It hit hard for all of us who knew him, but it's still lovely that someone made this for him, and for the others who passed🙏
Vrchat players will sit next to a child getting groomed in a public space and will say “this is a very chill and relaxing environment”
I wrote this exaggerated comment before he got to the part in the video where he proved it to literally not be an exaggerated comment
@@ScatterBrainedYouBetterFollow that is 100% an exaggeration. I never saw that happen.
@@ExpertContrariandidn’t know you were the entirety of vrchat
@@ExpertContrarian Username checks out.
@@ExpertContrarianshut up ☠️
I’ve met a lot of people on vrchat, some who were suffering from some extremely debilitating conditions, and I’ve been friends with a lot of them. Most of them tend to drift away, but some stay. And the ones that stay are the most real people I’ve ever met. Vrchat can be a really terrifying place with really evil people on it, but it can also be a life saver for people who can’t leave their house and live.
I’m more of a solo vrchat player since I barely get on so I don’t really have time to really grow a relationship with anyone and I’m fine with that. There used to be a time where I thought that all the people who would dwell in mirrors or do be on vrchat 24/7 I’d think to myself “damn. They must be failures in life” and now it’s like I pity them because what if that’s the only thing they have? What if that’s the only thing keeping them from doing something bad.
Jesus, this was shot so well, this should honestly be entered into film festivals, like it's literally a documentary about how people live currently, it's heart breaking, and so fucking interesting, I've never used VR and have always wanted to, but this makes me even more curios about, like even tho I have lived a very eventful physical life, this brings curiosity to the people I could potentially meet
the scenes you use with your avatar and different worlds are cool asf ngl
i'm glad i didn't have access to vr headset
I've watched so many vr chat videos like this and every time it makes me want to play VR chat more, no matter how bad people say it is.
honestly love the concept of your videos, they are so informative and generally absolutely enjoyable to watch :D
The best thing about vrc is the creativity and just how much you can do. The worst thing is that it's wasted because the community is so unfathomably toxic and awful that creativity is killed because any difference from the norm is shunned and the people who bring change are bullied until they become jaded and leave the community.
VRchat is way too loose on what it allows people to do in those lobbies. The bad and the ugly far outweigh the good and if you're looking for a place that embraces community and worl exploration, VRchat is one of the LAST places you should go.
I genuinely think if the devs don't get their crap together and start moderating this game, they either need to be forced to make the game 18+ or the game needs to be shut down, pulled from storefronts, and investigated by law enforcement. I don't care if you made a friend on there, that pales in comparison to the amount of grooming, manipulation, addiction, suicides, and other tragedies that people have been forced to watch and experience.
They’re not loose at all. It is just literally impossible to moderate everything. Nobody forced you to get on the game and watch all those things
@@ExpertContrarian That's a very lazy excuse for the kind of filth that takes place on that platform. Did you even watch the video?
@@NoLeftTurns965 you think objective reality is an excuse? Lmao that’s a very lazy way of thinking
@@ExpertContrarian weird way to say you support pedophilia but ok.
@@NoLeftTurns965Social media giants like Meta and Twitter (or X if you wanna call it that) can barely moderate their own services, even despite the fact they have automated moderation systems in place.
That's the inherent downside of social media, it attracts EVERYONE (I do consider VRC a type of social media). Should the game be M/Ao rated? Perhaps, but that won't magically solve the issue either, it'll only filter out some people.
We could see VRC investing in automated moderation down the line, but even that wouldn't stop the problem altogether.
Moderation is a never-ending arms race to keep the bad actors out. I can at least credit the VRC team for trying even despite their small size. It's better than no moderation whatsoever.
As for the government/law enforcement angle: You're asking for government overreach with that proposal. I'm not sure you'd want to encourage that.
I didnt expect to resonate with this video so well. It's like I knew how bad things were in the game, and how bad I've been doing in vrchat, but never from an outside perspective. I think I really needed this video to make me take a step back, reevaluate my life online and offline, and need to change before something happens. Thank you
I'm watching this while I work, thanks for the video 😊
Sometimes I want to play this game again. It made me really happy to always have people to talk to. I quit it because it just made an endless cycle of addiction and depression when I wasn't playing. I also got groomed so much without realizing it (I started playing when I was super young). The peak of COVID made me especially addicted. My only close friend in my life died before I got super into VRC. And I just couldn't make friends like I could with her. So I never felt connected with kids my age. So when my dad got VR it became my whole world. My life revolved around VRC day and night for 2 years straight. My parents constantly worrying and attempting to put limits on my time on it. But I, again, didn't have friends my age and I went without school for a year and a half. So I was isolated and the social interaction from VRC was my drive. Addiction stayed so strong and I would get on VRC regardless of time limitations or punishment. My mom eventually put her foot down after reading messages she saw I had back and fourth with a guy who was grooming me. She didn't take me off of it good, she said some bad things, that I am still affected by today. But she did get me off of it. And for that I am grateful. I was so addicted I almost k**led myself when she took me off of VRC for a month. I tried to go through the window. Nowadays I quit VRC forever and I haven't talked to anyone I used to know in the community for a few years now. I wonder if people remember me at all.
In my time on VRC I had also witnessed many adults drinking. Adults who also let me into their private clubs (I was unfortunately very tightnit with many popular club creators and streamers so even though I was a minor I got a lot of leeway and stream noteriaty). It's insane how much drinking people did. Drinking games in lobbies went on for hours. I would sit and watch people drink and drink and take shots for hours on end. VRC just caused an endless bout of drinking and drug chains. People would just go all night long because of peer pressure and feeling it was safe. It's terrible and I just hope for one day people stuck in this game move on, and can be ok. Life gets better eventually without VRChat. It took me a long time to realize that for me. And I hope the addicts and s*icide people will get the actual help they need one day and not help from the people in the VRC community where it's encouraged to feel worse constantly.
My old username was CosmicBrownies or ThatFluffy1 if anyone is wondering what my user was. I am uninterested in re-kindling any old friendships though. I have very much moved on and I just like discussing my experiences.
Vrchat kinda reminds me of night city and cyberpunk2077, it's just like.. it has a massive dark underbelly that feels very dystopian
Made so many cool friends first starting out. Stuck around with a cool group for a while and then slowly watched it dissipate and the fun nights where there would be close to a dozen of us laughing and playing just doing whatever having a good time turned into 2 or 3 people active regularly. I’ll forever miss what it used to be like but things change people move on with life. VRC is a blessing and a curse
This is the best fucking video out there on VRChat, I loved every bit of it and cried atlest once while watching it
Very insightful points with everything, not to mention well made story telling.. I like how the creepy dude voice mails kept looping back like chapters or something.
This videos are so good, man, keep it up!
this video is a masterpiece. good to see you addressing everything going on within the game. i have personally experienced most of them and it is something people have to prepare for before playing this
VRChat was my escape when COVID ran through my family and took the lives of both my father and grandmother away. The only family I have left is my mother, who was days of driving away in Kansas.
I was alone, I wasn't sleeping, and at the time my friends were all busy here in town or had started getting distant.
Talking with some people in discord who I knew, they still jumped in VRChat and recommended I hang out if I needed some company.
I've had my past with alcohol abuse (ex-military, are you shocked?) so it's never been an issue with me in VR, as much as I see others fighting battles with dependency and abuse with it.
I've met so, so many wonderful people that I now hang out with in person on weekends, meet up with at furry conventions, and joined in other servers to play games with.
In my years on VRChat, there's been good and bad, but overall good.
After watching this, I came through the comments looking for folks like myself who's VRChat experience has been largely great. Sure there a lot of people that come and go, but that's the same thing with real life!
Ima just say this right now and it's a huge reason why I never played vrchat but vrchat actually causes more pain then fixes them. Vrchat will never be a good replacement for actual interaction in the real world ever. Ik some people will have amazing stories about how they met their gf's or wives and vice versa on vrchat and how it saved them but realistically speaking it does more harm than good. The typical scenario I see playing out (because I do it even in video games but fairly certain its way worse on games like vrchat for many reasons) is them having a blast with friends in the virtual world but then having to get off for whatever reason and the second they slip off the headset or just get off if they don't have vr and just looking around. Realizing time and time again that it wasn't real. the characters, the people, everything wasn't real. Having friends hundreds of miles away sucks and if your life revolves around the game, it can be soul crushing realizing that 9 times outta 10 you will never see those people IRL breaks the people already hurting even more. Physical touch is very much needed in a person's life and someone who only has friends online can tell you when a friend or family member (depends for family if u like em or not) or just in general hugs you or even just gives you a handshake it breaks you. Your heart flutters and rejoices as if the dead came back to life and your heart just now began beating again. I know this because I have not had a IRL friend in 6+ years. I have not talked to a IRL friend face to face just as long. When I say these things its because I am going through them RIGHT NOW. If I ever got vrchat I can 100% guarantee that I would probably end up k****** myself because of not being able to go back to this reality. Wanting and longing for vrchat to be my reality instead of this hellish nightmare of a life I'm living in. When you use things like vrchat as an escape it will become your very own fucked up prison of torment in the end. vrchat for the healthy minded is fun and jokes but for the fucked up minded ones its like slowly carving up your brain thats already falling apart until you have completely lost touch with reality. This is just the more wholesome part of VRchat btw because the rabbit whole of the levels of fucked on that game goes insanely deep. You think this is dark the mind fuckery can get 10000000 times worse. So yeah I'm staying away from it at all costs.
I ran into a guy who’s wife died so he broke down, quit his job and drank on vr chat all day
damn, that’s sad to hear
The good for me, dancing improcing and being social at same time. The Bad, the ones u get to know and love are still to far away. Drama is drama no matter vr or irl.... ppl are ppl...The ugly well ppl with bad intensions... sadly there are some... . Loved the video awesome work , thanks!
I've been off and on off of VRC since 2019, I've had about maybe 3-4 friend groups ive gone through in those years. However I met my absolute soulmate in VR about a year and a half ago. They were a friend of a friend and long story short after a few months we got into a relationship and we happened to live coincidentally 2 hours by car away. Been to Japan with them and im looking forward to figuring life out with them. I owe VRC to my happinesses and finding her. ❤ Its one of the only good things to come out off that cesspool.
I was real fucking lucky.
keyword 'lucky'...might as well buy a lotto ticket with that logic
@@Seeks__ maybe I should, lol
You're a fantastic journalist. Thank you for this.
Sometimes, I regret not being logged in as often as I could be. Something or someone being absent when you come back is difficult.
RIP 1k and the treehouse.
People treat VRchat like they’re in a dream state, doing anything they absolutely please and thinking it won’t affect the real world. Virtual reality is turning people crazy and it’s amusing how serious and delusional these pawns can get 🤖
My friend smew had shown me this video because the world (the drawing one) was featured and we watched it in the youtube search world and I think I wanna sub because this video was really well done and it summarizes vrchat really well, I look forward to seeing more videos!
I never met people on VR chat that where dinking but probably because i was busy flying jets and driving cars
Real
i HAD to cop that lethal company avatar.
It's super customizable and is just generally great ngl. 10/10 would recommend
Where did you get the skin I love it!!!
ive recently turned 21, and i think I understand why a lot of people become vr alcoholics, unfortunately from experience
This was a good video for me. I have been 2 years clean from vrc, and I got off bc I realized that I had become a the worst version of my self. And vrc wasn’t helping. Despite the fact this video was extremely hard for me to watch at times, it was a needed closure for me hearing someone describe the truth and facing it. For me, I often make jokes about my experiences on it and ignore the bad, and especially now, when I have been dealin with a relapse in ptsd and trauma from vrc, this video was extremely good for me. Thank you.
13:58 "its easier to rig a bikini than a hoodie"
As an avatar modeler, it is NOT easier to rig a bikini over a a hoodie lol, its so much more complicated making skin tight clothing fit the body and move with it well, A hoodie being so loose is just so much more forgiving to work with lol.
Thankfully for me I never got into VRchat or making online friends. I do use discord frequently but I only stay on one server and that’s one that my friends and I created. I’ve known them since high school and almost 6 years since we graduated we still talk every day and try to hang out irl when we can. I’m very grateful for having something like that I can’t even imagine what I would do if I never made friends like that.
I met my now fiance (American) soon to be wife (Me Dutch) in VRChat, there are definitely bad sides to VRChat for sure but it can be incredible if you have some people skill and know who you want to be around or have around you.
y’all met in real life and got married or are going to get married?
What a beautiful, masterfully made video. It highlights many aspects of the game that I was unaware of, and makes everything feel a lot more real--the good and the bad--and I think that's really important. You also handled the more sensitive topics in a very respectful and informative manner, which I really respect. Excellent video, I look forward to what you do next.
I think the most concerning thing is that vr in general causes dissociation, let alone VrChat, and dissociation can make your brain susceptible to many kinds of input
Aghjdjghd thats whats really putting me off from trying vr in general, i already have problems with dissociation, i dont wanna come out worse lol
@@klondikegardens6570 yeah i wouldn't risk it, keep yourself safe and healthy
If youre really really interested, you could always do it with extreme moderation, thats what i do (i also dissociate p badly)