I lost a sibling to Triangulation. So painful and so sad! Blocking the narcissistic sister and her Flying Monkeys was the only solution to my peace of mind and serenity!
My deceased narc mother created an environment of competition between siblings. She encouraged lying ,deceit and talking behind esp scapegoats back .She left behind a nasty mess of a very unloving family and constant fighting ,she would be loving it from her grave ,the disputes .
@@janasmith2463 Plus, you start making friends with the other volunteers who for the most part are supportive people who know how to give back and are not out for the manipulative take all the time.
Yes! My 85 year old narcissistic mother has been dividing my siblings our whole life and she’s still doing it as an elderly woman. Isn’t she scared of He//? She will leave a legacy of hate.
My mother is doing the same. She loves to ruin friendships, relationships and families. She’s pure evil! I’m wondering if anything will change once she’s gone.
I have been separating myself from my large dysfunctional family. The main narcissist has been using monkeys for decades. A funeral was approaching, and I openly declined to go because of the circus. I had said my peace and goodbyes to the loved one and felt no need and desire to put myself in such a sick position. This raised a lot. One monkey wanted to visit me after 30 plus years of neglect. I told her she could come to visit, but there are two rules: We will only speak of the people that are present, no other members, and no funeral talk. Well, she did not want to come. She seemed greatly relieved. Thank you for broaching this dynamic.
It breaks my heart that I had to go no contact with my siblings. I have always been the truth teller and empathetic one. Two narcissistic sisters and Who spend so much time convincing my other to younger siblings to go against me too. I’ve just had enough…I decided my peace was more important!❤️
Just like you, I went no contact and was no contacted upon a few years ago. That inner "peace" that you mention is PRICELESS! (I wouldn't be able to withstand that cognitive dissonance that I would feel if I continued on dealing with so-called people like that)
Me too. With both my brother and sister. Thank goodness our parents have both passed. It hurts, it's sad, but our peace and well being we have got to come first. 😊
@@fastnpray9729 Nope! More 20th century nonsense that you have some duty to forgive someone who hurt you or else you are ALLEGEDLY a "bad person." I'LL LET THEM TAKE THE SO-CALLED HIGHER ROAD. Once, shame on you. Twice, SHAME ON ME! I'm all done feeling ashamed about their bad actions. NEVER AGAIN! It's NOT MY JOB to forgive. That's God's and God's only IMHO
Plus one, original comment thread starter! (I needed your comment to reaffirm what I'm doing towards my siblings for the rest of my life at 49. Thank you!!)
@@Maybe-jg4efbesides what is forgiveness anyway? Its just words unless u take it to another level and open yourself up to being treated horribly again. Forgiveness to me means inviting someone back into your life after they’ve wronged you OR its just words you say to make everything think you’re being the bigger person. Forgiveness is overrated imho
3:30--It's funny how they do their "guilt tripping" or ""shaming" into your mid-40s when it's NONE OF THEIR FUCKING BUSINESS out of nowhere (if you're me.) It was at that point that looked up the word scapegoat for the first time in my life because I'm a stranger overheardwhat I was going through on a phone contract with a sibling trying to talk to them on the phone, and this older man sympatheticly said, "Ah... You're a scapegoat!" The only sentence I ever needed to hear! I thought I had a big vocabulary but I never had heard this word scapegoat before or thought of it until my mid-40s. Yet that opened up a world of healing for me. Life is so much better being NO CONTACT with my 3 siblings now. (Once you finally see it, you cannot unsee it anymore!!)
LOL. I was being guilt tripped and shamed into my seventies, so don't feel alone! Finally went no contact with them both, after I finally figured out what was happening! 😳
It's like being trapped in the grown up version of an American high school movie. You've got the table of popular girls, beautiful, rich, the right clothes, they are cheerleaders, etc.. They have everything going for them so what do they need to do at lunch? Pick on the one kid sitting by themselves just trying to survive. And, everyone else in the lunch room stands by or laughs. The audience watching the movie identifies with the lonely kid, yet in real life, was most likely the bystander laughing at the bullying going on.
I have one person in the family who I believe to be a covert narcissist (or something very close) who has, over a lifetime, managed to rope everyone in the family into her "web" via their own blind spots. This included me, to an extent, for a very long time until it eventually became clear to me what was happening. The others in the family are now unwittingly being used as "flying monkeys" to "neutralize me"...and I can't stress the "unwittingly" part enough. I believe they feel trapped, and can unconsciously sense that the easiest way to stay safe is to side with the narcissist. The entire picture is so sad. I can't even say that anger is my predominant emotion. It's as if fear is running the show amongst all members of the family...Not with more distant family members who are off living their own lives for the most part. I've finally come to realize that my only path to freedom is to break out of this toxic "inner family circle".
You just described my life in a nutshell! I am learning so much since I found this site (just this morning!) When I read the title of this discussion about flying monkeys I immediately thought of The Wizard of Oz and the witch and the "Creepy Monkeys"...😆 I had to just laugh, it was so right on!! I had not even thought of a "covert narcissist" until now!! Honestly it sounds like we are from the same family! I so appreciate you bringing all of this out... goodness I'm learning so much here. I have felt so alone over so many years in dealing with this kind of person as a sibling. Again, thank you so much for all you said I'm saving it!
Mine are exactly the same . But I believe a 2nd sibling is now also a narcissist I mean he joins in trying to make me submit to their will . He was never like this ever before, or perhaps I never noticed . Since all the siblings take part by their silence or making excuses for the Narc sis. They’re not innocent they aren’t stupid. Fully grown adults now, so for me they’re associates in crime . If they all stopped supporting her melodramatic outbursts over minor stuff then she would reduce her games . She would have less fuel. I’ve completely distanced myself emotionally . They call it grey rock ? I blocked all text facilities . Because they very much pushed me to join the chat facility for so called family meetings and socials . For many years I refused then made the mistake of joining and then the drama ensued . So that’s all stopped now and I won’t call except perhaps every couple of months . I haven’t done so yet . When I do I will be emotionally detached and very formal . One word answers and keep the conversation short . The irony is I’ve always been the doormat. I’ve always been the one that did all the domestics with my mother even for grown brothers who were fully grown men with wives living under my parents roof . I’d say I’m too giving . That’s just me and to be something else feels fake . So I suppose they saw me as a good punching bag. Well I’m an adult and have my own children , and refuse to accept this treatment anymore . I’m nothing but nice and forgiving in return yet I’m still treated like vermin every few weeks . I just done have the energy for the constant theatrics . Currently it’s concerning an inheritance . I figure I don’t need to speak to them about it they cant change the will without my agreement . It’s set in stone . I never in a million years thought my siblings would turn out greedy and selfish and abusive like this. Not since my mother was so loving and giving . Perhaps she was too generous and they were spoilt?
@@janasmith2463 second sibling could also just be an effective "flying monkey"...hard to know. I have another sister who I would NOT at ALL say was naturally narcissistic...but she has been behaving more and more like one as my narcissistic sister has been "working on her". However, if you believe what most people agree about narcissists...it's not likely that someone can be "turned into" a narcissist...or at least not one with actual "NPD". Sure there is narcissistic behavior...and there's a whole spectrum from healthy narcissism to malignant narcissism. In my case I think my more malignant sister is the only one of the two who would be willing and able to brainwash her sister for her own benefit. The sister who is not naturally narcissist, .I believe, is being manipulated via her own blind spots into believing in the distorted reality that the narcissistic sister has been painstakingly "selling" her.....and is simply "reacting" to what she increasingly has been led to believe. Does this let her off the hook? Not entirely...but....at least in my own understanding of this particular situation, I feel that my second sister is being "subsumed" by the narcissistic sister and have to ask myself just how much true "autonomy" my non- narcossistic sister actually has left. (Can one behave appropriately, when their reality has been distorted?)
One of the great disappointments in my current life, that I am working my way through, is that a couple flying monkey relatives have decided to take up the cause of my covert narcissist sister. They obviously adore her more now than ever and have no empathy for the shunning they are taking part in. I’ve started reading on Ambiguous Grief and I see myself on that healing journey.
There are a few on here that I can so relate to and you are one of them. The very same thing you mention is going on right now in my life. My narcissist sister has not only her kids believing she is the bullied one but she also has my other- siblings- children thinking she is the greatest thing in the world. They have no idea what is really going on and what my whole life has been like trying to deal with her. Basically all you can really do for your own sanity is back away as soon as possible. Ugh! Too many Crazies!
I have found that ignoring them and then living my own life happily and successfully really annoys them. My sister and her flying monkeys hate it when I'm happy so when I concentrate on me I win both ways.
They hate seeing us happy They hate seeing things work out for us. Live ur best life, travel, eat well, take care of ur health, this is ur revenge against them
@@singstreetcar5881I think that you are correct! I’ve been traveling, eating well, working out, etc. I can tell that my narcissistic sister is somewhat envious…
I am struggling so much. I want to cut off the narcissist COMPLETELY, but if I do that, I will never see my niece again. The narcissist has already "punished" me by hurting my niece and keeping her away from me. My niece has been begging for help. She told me her dream would be to live with myself and my husband. When my niece turns 18, the narcissist will be dead to me. Until then, I have to play the game. It makes me mentally sick.
OMG, that's horrible. I've cut off a narcissist sibling, which means I never get to see my nephews again. But they're adults and they're doing fine. Can you call CPS on your sibling?
My daughter cut me off from seeing my Grandchildren!!! What a punishment when I’ve always supported her emotionally & unfortunately too much financially!!! Don’t ever give money to family because they will steal & expect it for eternity or until you’re BROKE & nothing left to give in their eyes!!!
@@audreyhero2235 Same here. I have a baby granddaughter which I am not allowed to see My brother and sister and sister in law have become flying monkeys due to an inheritance of my ex husband and the father of my two daughters. Luckily I have a good contact with my eldest daughter and my grandson.
I had to go no contact with my whole extended family after cutting out a narcissist sibling. Other members were immediately recruited to Hoover me back in. When that concerted effort failed the flying monkeys were then used to keep tabs on me for the narc to the point of it feeling like stalking. It took about 3 years when I realised that there was no way to heave a healthy relationships with the extended family. So I let them go and after a grieving process, I now feel a lot freer.
My mother was a narcissist still is but she is old alone and poor she lost everything. She would always tell me I was trying to be mysterious and I thought I was a pre Modena when I was a kid and didn’t know what that even meant. She made my life growing up a living hell. My brother didn’t survive her after I finally got away. She is truly evil
OMG this is completely what 2 of sisters have done, and continue to do!! They have their daughters and families doing the same to me and my family. Incredible
It’s common, although I’ve gotten so much shit for being sensitive, it’s made me aware of how not to treat family and have better communication and a healthier dynamic..so odd to me that a family just loves to dwell in this like net of toxicity
My mother pitted us all against each other. I was the scapegoat. My sister and I have not spoken to/seen each other in 17 years. I feel no connection to her anymore and even forget she exists. If she dies, I do not think it will affect me. We are complete strangers now. Thank you, Mummy.
Wow, all those statements are on point. Stop causing trouble, what's wrong with you, OH here we go again...that's not what happened, I didn't say that. It was all a misunderstanding.
"Stamp of approval" is so on point. Why do a sibling even take sides from lack of evidence? "Your attempt to paint me in a negative light is noted" is the perfect retort if need to use one!
I had to go no contact with my twin sister and other siblings because of the betrayal. She loves the narcissistic sister and hates and disrespected me so bye bye family, my narcissist won't rest till I am out of the family. However I am healing and now realise how I was lead to believe that I was a worthless horrible person, but thankfully, I have seen the truth and the light. I am now happier than I have been for over 50 years. I know I was a good daughter and a good sister, and the narcissist and the flying monkeys can enjoy each other but I will no longer endure the abuse.
My daughter has become a flying monkey against me by my narcissist brother. She doesn't like him, but he has married another narcissist and she has befriended my daughter and they are now using my daughter against me with their lies and manipulations. It is sad to feel helpless to rectify the situation, so I have gray rocked them all. It hurts. But I feel safer and happier. TY for your video.
I have a older sister who has always thrown jabs at me my entire life. As I have gotten older, I have been better able to set boundaries and stop her insults, however, the last two years have been pure evil and toxic. I had to cut ties. Now my other older sister, who always agreed my sister could turn on a dime, has taken sides with her and decided to cut me out as well. This has all been through email or texts...I have asked many times to meet in person or discuss on the phone and they won't do it. Trying to work through my feelings.
I am a 77 yr victim of two narsistic sisters, all our life they have been a thorn in the family. Their lies and deceit were a constant dance of survival. As a family It was not till we we were a lot older that we learnt about narcissism and flying monkeys and how havoc can be created. They were always delighted if they caused us to turn on each other. Our contact is now very limited, but at 82 and 73 yrs they can still use their tongue to inflict harm.
For years I was a 'battered sister' and it used to bother me that there was so much support for battered wives but not for those in my position. I'm sure I would have been calling child protection for help if I had understood that I was worthy of the same protections but it just isn't a 'thing' for some reason. I was beaten up regularly by my brother, whilst my mother enabled the entrie thing, making excuses and blaming me. Even having little talks with me to 'be nicer to him', it turned my stomach. She was the real narcissist using my brother to abuse me whilst she looked like the innocent one. I had too much cognitive dissonance to understand the dynamic and that she was to blame, because I could never understand why she didn't seem to understand that my brother was absuing me and it was his fault not mine! Her lies made no sense whatsoever, but I've come to realise that of course she understood it, she just didn't care and probably was encouraging it by doing nothing.
A family member is the flying monkey for his wife. After over 50 years of her torture toward various members of the family, I can finally make sense of the dysfunctional triangulation dynamic and understand that all I can control is my life and my choices. I choose no contact so that I may live in peace. It is liberating!
This is so affirming! To hear you both talk about the kind of shock and dismay I experienced in my own narcissistic sibling situation where she got her husband to scold me - even though I'd just offered what I considered to be an olive branch after her abusive and cruel messages to me where I was sure I was being discarded as a sister - I even expressed my appreciation that he'd always been such a kind brother-in-law, particularly as we lost our only brother years before. Blindsided indeed. There is quite a large age gap, with me the youngest, and I'd always held them in high regard. I think he possibly is in the 'unsuspecting' category of flying monkey, even so I was very hurt indeed. However one is never too old to learn and to know I have/am managing the situation in line with your advice is so reassuring. Thank you, it's great to listen to both of you.
I used to wonder what was wrong with me all the time but then realized, after much research, that I am ok. I am the second sister these monkeys have chased off, and it all makes sense now.
My mother would never pull her bee Ess on my brother. I did ask my brother, why is mum's pain so valid that it ought to shame me, while my pain is a mere ''grudge'' (I reminded him that it's NEVER been discussed, can something that's never been acknowledge be a grudge?). I asked him why am I branded '''sensitive'' for feeling my own hurt but cold-hearted when I'm not manipulated in to backing down and accepting her narrative that I'm mad/bad and she's the victim of me. My brother didn't seem to have an answer but he is still angry with me that I won't just just buckle under and accept the regime. He sees it, cognitively, or seems to but yet bafflingly he is still blaming me for the trouble caused and the damage done to the family. It is my fault because I didn't just ACCEPT all the projection. I understand now, my pain isn't real to them. But if my pain isn't real to them, I feel like I'm not real to them, so what is the point of playing the part they wrote for me, and they're not happy with that conclusion either. I'm not allowed to have given up either! There literally is only one thing they want from me, *submit* to mum's narrative. How can intelligent people not see how weak they are being?!?!
Love it that you asked your brother why your pain isn’t valid, while your mother’s is to him. Your mother has held more power in your relationship just because of her position as ‘mother’. Now that you’re an adult you can set a boundary. Let them know the consequences if they choose to ignore it. And live a happy life either way. I wonder if your brother is worried about the extra time and attention he’ll have to spend on dear old mom if you’re not in the picture. Flying monkeys can have their own agenda too. Best wishes!
Your mother was probably a spoiled brat in childhood. Mine was but I always believed she had it rough. My uncle revealed how spoiled she was after her funeral. (Eye opener). I always thought she was a long-suffering martyr. Your mom has no empathy for you.
I love your advice. Factual, straight to the point. Starting with ''avoiding playing the same drama card''..Following on with the advice of ''solidiifying relationships with people around you who KNOW you so that they won't become flying monkeys''...Well when the brother and sister that you brought up and fought for all their lives against the Narc Mother fall under the influence of that Narc Mother and her golden child it is a hard realisation that it IS the people closest to you that you trusted that decide to prop up that family dynamic and get pleasure from isolating that one person that you thought they'd stick up for. .A lack of certain character traits is what's evident here. You know the good ones like discernment, bravery etc. But they are too busy trying to fix the Narc. They think they are doing good and it is her targets fault for speaking out. She plays a good game. They both do. Years of fixating on her problems has people thinking she needs all the help instead of the fact she's creating drama.
This is such a painful Area in one’s Life.I’m experiencing this, With a partner whose mentally sick, And at 10 people around them are influencing his Life and his decisions! He’s Oblivious, to how these people are manipulating him, but about 30 other people around on the perimeters can see THIS scenario !
Just realized one of my daughters is a flying monkey. Her narc dad and I divorced 30 years ago. I thought all these issues were over. Now she’s saying I was the abuser and narcissist. I am very empathic and this blind-sided me. She is the youngest and is her dad’s golden child. Her sisters can’t understand her. She has asked me not to contact her. I am grey rocking her, but it hurts so much. I feel like I’ve lost a daughter. I love and miss her so much.
Such a painful story. I'm sorry you're going through all this. You are not alone! Many empaths are blindsided by Narcs. Learn as much as you can about this dynamic, so you can better understand the family patterns. One day, your daughter may begin to see these patterns on her own.
@@fernschumer186 My daughter will have to come to her own realization as to what’s going on. I deeply pray she does. Unfortunately, she has been “growing” a narcissistic attitude since childhood and may never realize I wasn’t the abuser. I got out of that marriage as soon as I could for my children’s sake, too.
I went No Contact with my malignant pathological lying sister. On Fridays I often went dancing at a small time bar. Several times, her flying monkeys would show up to try to catch me doing something they could report back. Unfortunately for them, I don't drink, and I'm an extreme introvert. I just came to hear the bands. Her monkeys were probably severally reprimanded for failing their missions. Or... they just made s*** up. Who cares?
I am and I was involved with narcissist situation but I never identify flying monkey narcissist it is not easy lots of manipulation lots of mental pressure that is hard to know what exactly going on
my feelings and thoughts were dismissed.... and, there was so much Understanding for other person's "issues" and Behaviors.. I am now NC, these 'friends' were enablers to keep me in the 'group', in which I was unhappy about how my Needs weren't met and how I was treated.. I Know I made the Right decision to go NC.
Oh and my experiences have been a lot of gaslighting. “I didn’t say that”, “that’s not how she remembers it”. “Dad doesn’t treat me that way”, “What did you say to him to cause him to treat you that way”. We had a Narc father. My siblings seem to have followed in his footsteps. I had no idea this would happen. I kept hoping and waiting for them to get into therapy for all the trauma we endured. Parents divorced when I was six. Mom was schizophrenic alcoholic. Dad didn’t come around and was later forced to take custody when I was twelve. Denied my getting counseling for taking on the mother role. Scapegoated me because he was angry that a twelve year old didn’t do a good enough job caring for her siblings. We went through three divorces and three marriages before the age of 18. Narc parent was divorced five times. All of his sick behavior is now being projected onto me. I have been in therapy for ages trying to understand why I’m so “negative, unforgiving and stuck in the past”. I finally know what a narcissistic family system does to the scapegoat of the family. It took a long while to finally see the truth. It’s not me. It’s sad. They don’t want to heal and recover. They want to continue the abuse.
Both of our parents are narcissists. I offhandedly mentioned to my sister that it's too bad we don't have better ones. (Careless on my part to not consider her feelings. ) She said "I think our parents are wonderful." And that was the end of that topic. She was not hostile or attempting to change my mind, which speaks to me this is more of strict trauma bond. It's possible the more distant I become from the parents she may be mobilized, but not at the moment. It breaks my heart. She was no golden child. She was invisible, and while we were young she suffered sibling abuse by me (I'm 2 years older) as well as neglect and abuse from our parents, and zero protection. Her survival skill became internalizing everything. She's used to remembering that I got more abuse due to my scapegoat status, I don't think her own suffering registers in her mind, nor understanding anything more than that I was "bad". We're not close, but not on bad terms. I found some of her drawings from our childhood and I sobbed. It didn't take an art therapist to see what was going on in them. Isolation, loneliness, needing love she wasn't getting. She refuses to go to therapy.
Can't trust them til they stop putting effort into being weird and manipulatively controlling, instead of just being normal and peaceful. She deserves better, we all do and they are too immature and un wise to do anything better
I had no clue about this information. Am in Recovery. Trust? My sister's put mean girls to shame.. I don't have to anything. My ancestors were indentured servants. Parents are dead. Not depending on Any sibling. Found empathy (of course) for them.. Rescinded. Realized Ive been repeating my patterns ...I've backed away from all my Activism and Advocacy. Read "Yoga Is Consciousness In Action",....not exactly getting threatened with arrest... The emotions at at Anti War Rally . is narc buffet . Unknowing (?!Flying monkeys ...this section of town thinks I have cancer... Current narc... wanting to tell especially people I know, I thought were friends. I don't know this either!! So much for being "a wave and the ocean" ive not ever felt more alone..Thank you for this info.
To the woman presenter in this, have you ever called out a narcissist on their behaviour? It is absolutely pointless. You will be abused and traumatised. I experienced it for 40 years, they are not capable of admitting they are wrong.
No Contact is definately a must! I went NO CONTACT with my mother, the Narcissist who continually triangulate myself a younger sister and herself. She also used my younger brother as a flying monkey. He was the Golden Child. I did this 2 yrs before she died. The youngest sister and I the Oldest finally figured out what was going on. Her two chosen Ones received the majority of her estate, which was fine with us. A letter given to us after she passed away as an Explaination of why we received so little. She said we did not live up to our DUTIES TO HER????? IT WAS SAD, BUT in the End, the sister squandered her money trying to keep her family out of jail and died almost 3 yrs ago. The brother is now in prison and had A drug an alcohol addiction. My younger sister and I are still here and better understand what happened to our disfunctional family.
Yes! My brother made some very bad decisions at seventeen and was in prison, our mother passed very suddenly and unexpectedly during this time as well. I supported him some financially, getting clothes he needed, making sure he had soap and toothpaste and extras so he could have burger king day or pizza when they got outside food support him emotionally & traveling to see him at every prison he was moved to across the state and the day he came home after a long 12 years he met a female who made him a very different person and not in a good way. He talks to our other two siblings and I am the one he hates. I was the only one not invited to his wedding. He was trying to hurt me and It didn’t because what I did for him was out of pure love not because I expected anything in return but it was definitely a slap in the face. He loves to talk bad about me and that’s ok. We haven’t spoken in 4 years. I let god handle it.
My sister was put in juvinile detention at 15 years old. I am 13 months older than her and visited her in jail, lockdown institutions, etc. all those years. When she was 17 and I was 18, I had just gotten out of foster care. I picked her up, took care of her and did what you said too! Each time I would pick her up, clothe her, feed her, go out, have fun, she even called me “mommy Holly”. Each time she would take so much of my money and time my life I worked hard for would fall apart. Then she would get with a boyfriend and show off her new clothes, after I couldn’t afford new clothes because of what I lost paying for her! Many years later, several rounds, and she continues to treat me as an enemy and now has turned our huge family into flying monkeys against me. She has physically and emotionally tried to kill me many times since I was 11 too. I don’t know why? It is all so odd. I am now not talking to my best closest sister friend I went through so much childhood trauma and more with to literally save my own life.
They think they can hoover you back by using the old tricks. After all, narcissists believe their victims are their property and losing a victim makes them doubt about themselves and their own worth.
Grey rocking I heard doesn’t work long term? I am trying it . It should be easy because I live far away. But if it doesn’t work long term what options do I have. Completely cutting off siblings means I would never see my nieces and nephews either . Not sure I can live with that . Since some of them I remember feeding and changing as babies :(
I grew up the youngest of 9 with parents who were loving and loved by many. Our house was always bustling with people. One brother named himself king when the parents died and his wife became 1st lieutenant. Bro and wife are in charge or very involved in every gathering, reunion, wedding, shower, graduation or funeral. Their house is like flying monkey headquarters. Whenever a person leaves, that person becomes the topic of discussion as bro remarks on all their bad points and makes all his guests laugh. What they call charm, I call disgusting behavior. One sister used to be their scapegoat until they pushed her to the point of no contact. She has been missing now for decades. Even her own children don’t know her whereabouts as they’ve been sucked into my bro’s narc world. Now I have become their target. I have very little contact and once our parent’s house sells, I’ll go no contact. I haven’t been to any sort of family function in 10 years. My healing has been slow but I am getting there. May anyone reading this feel loved and cared for and above all, accepted, just for being you. ❤
I'm completely alone.I have 8 adult children and a narcissistic ex. I need help. I was a self employed, self sufficient stay at home mom. I live miles from town. My family has always been literally my entire life. With a narcissistic husband and 8 children I never needed anyone else because I had a crowd around me at all times. When he left all that changed. Now instead of hussle and bustle, laughing and shouting it's crickets. The only face I see is the mailman driving by. I didn't know about narcissism or flying monkeys. But as I watched my family fall into the chaos which all seemed to center around me somehow and I became too bad guy to everyone I love, I got a crash course in narcissism but absolutely no information on a solution. I haven't seen any of their faces or my grandchildren for two years and it's literally killing me
Some of the worst things I've ever heard someone say were things said about their own personal flying monkeys. Of course defending the dignity of the other person only made me more of a scapegoat. The thing that shocks me most on this subject isnt even the levels of manipulation the toxic person will go to, but instead its the flying monkeys complete unawareness that he or she has that their lives and rights to choose have been robbed from them. They often don't even realize they arent truly living a life of freedom. Their lives are hijacked and theyre missing out on the people who would not only love them, but have their backs too.
I could write a book of the hell my sister put me through. When my mom died she and aloy of my family turned into salvage dogs and I mean I was shocked by the cruelty of their actions and words. They broke every rule set up in the trust my mom wrote so I split 50/50 and legally disinherited her sorry butt. I had them slander me online and recruiting daily for people to destroy me. They damaged my roof and my car and even got death threats. Had to get police involved. I have my whole family blocked from my life been very painful. I couldn't believe that I had to stand alone to do what my parents wanted but I will never back down cause I had the greatest parents and I feel so grateful for them. I go forward alone and I not looking back on forward.
My narc ex has estranged my oldest son from his sister. This is very hurtful to him as they were very close growing up. Their father has been determined to make me the devil even though he left the marriage after abusing me for thirty years.
What about tactics? invasion of privacy, unlawful entry, forgery of documents following, identity theft,,tying knots in eveything(reminiscent of stallag 13). Have experienced ALL of these things and more! Ongoing, and things are coming to a head. Say a prayer for me.
My mother has ruined my relationships for me with family. & she’s still at it, at 80 😢How can I repair them? If I can. I can’t confront this because one time she feigned suicide & terrified me. I promised myself I’d never confront her again☹️
The flying monkey sent to me infuriated me more than the narc...I was doing so well not engaging and she sent my best friend to pick up my Grandson WITHOUT ASKING ME FIRST NEITHER OF THEM HE WALKS IN AND RIGHT AWAY ASKS IF HE WANTS TO GO VISIT HIS AUNTE I THINK I HAVE NEVER BEEN MORE ANGRY IN MY LIFE SHE THOUGHT AFTER RUNNING ME DOWN MANIPULATING ME SHE THOUGHT SHE COULD GET AWAY WITH THAT...ALL SHE WANTED WAS MY REACTION SHE WILL NEVER GET IT AGAIN THAT WAS LAST STRAW FOR BOTH HER AND THE MONKEY ON MY BACK. LOL
The flying monkey keeps calling us to tell us to say thank you to the narc and to make sure and call the narc because the narc has convinced her that we don't do these things even though they are aware of the narc consistently making it up. She also is trying to force me to have another talk with the narc after we've had it many times bc the narc wants it.
I used to pretend like my siblings did their eventual hate into my 40s independently. But looking back at the videotape, it was all set up from day one
Watching my son turn into a flying monkey to his covert wife is extremely painful. My brother in law too. He wakes up to protect his wife!!! Can be nasty and arrogant too!
Its pretty bad they madecfertain they got.moms house no o nevdare question my dad in all his I fairness because hes a veteran now dead ...sisters words u can't contest it
The golden child and a flying monkey role included is a very twisted role as the narc mother and golden flying monkey gang up together on various ppl. Controlling every event, not sharing basic family info thats important to know, and deliberately excluding others then mocking them for not knowing the important info, such as deaths, out of town family visitors, etc. Lifetime of intentionally hurting others.
I tried to comment. It wouldn't let me. Well that went through. Flying monkeys...my family had plenty of those. Of course,im the crazy obe to blame for everything. Allbthe while they hide their dirt. It's unbelievable.
But what about when the flying monkeys are a parent working for a siblings- we want to maintain a relationship with the parents but they live with a narcissistic sibling
If you can't trust them, there's no relationship. All their fault. They need to act like it instead of proving their selfish sickness through their toxic pattern of behaviors
It's an act of betrayal. My Dad is in denial and is scared of any more drama. I feel like our relationship fell apart when he started to make excuses for her behaviour. He's going to say that her behaviour started when I did something wrong...Lehigh is not true and it put the narcissist in the position of not taking any responsibility for her behavior. He is never going to state the fact that her behaviour is abusive and irrational and she needs to seek professional help to make her aware of how she reacts and rages, without any care qnd conscience.
the flying monkey I know is not aware that i know that she is. SHe likesdrama and is not used to a person like. The high functioning, Emotionally Cold Empath.
It's ok I am a mistake maker and I didnt know what I didnt know and I am learning and practicing. Lols its somthing broken world we r capable of handling this
![ปฏิเสธไม่ไหว (Crush on you) - LIPTA feat. No One Else [TEASER MV]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/VC689EgdSIw/mqdefault.jpg)
I lost a sibling to Triangulation. So painful and so sad! Blocking the narcissistic sister and her Flying Monkeys was the only solution to my peace of mind and serenity!
Family's can be pure torture.
They are just overrated in my opinion.
I've kicked mine to the curb. I'm giving myself the best birthday present of my life! I'll be 71yrs old soon.
My deceased narc mother created an environment of competition between siblings. She encouraged lying ,deceit and talking behind esp scapegoats back .She left behind a nasty mess of a very unloving family and constant fighting ,she would be loving it from her grave ,the disputes .
Mine dod the same thing :(
You preaching to the decon.
@@janasmith2463 Plus, you start making friends with the other volunteers who for the most part are supportive people who know how to give back and are not out for the manipulative take all the time.
Yes! My 85 year old narcissistic mother has been dividing my siblings our whole life and she’s still doing it as an elderly woman. Isn’t she scared of He//? She will leave a legacy of hate.
My mother is doing the same. She loves to ruin friendships, relationships and families. She’s pure evil! I’m wondering if anything will change once she’s gone.
Better to be alone than have contact with a wicked monster. Life is too short and peace of mind too precious.
😂👍
I have been separating myself from my large dysfunctional family. The main narcissist has been using monkeys for decades. A funeral was approaching, and I openly declined to go because of the circus. I had said my peace and goodbyes to the loved one and felt no need and desire to put myself in such a sick position. This raised a lot. One monkey wanted to visit me after 30 plus years of neglect. I told her she could come to visit, but there are two rules: We will only speak of the people that are present, no other members, and no funeral talk. Well, she did not want to come. She seemed greatly relieved. Thank you for broaching this dynamic.
It breaks my heart that I had to go no contact with my siblings. I have always been the truth teller and empathetic one. Two narcissistic sisters and
Who spend so much time convincing my other to younger siblings to go against me too.
I’ve just had enough…I decided my peace was more important!❤️
Just like you, I went no contact and was no contacted upon a few years ago. That inner "peace" that you mention is PRICELESS! (I wouldn't be able to withstand that cognitive dissonance that I would feel if I continued on dealing with so-called people like that)
How do I proceed with doing this? I will feel like my narcissist sister won!!!
Me too. With both my brother and sister. Thank goodness our parents have both passed. It hurts, it's sad, but our peace and well being we have got to come first. 😊
Don't forgive them. Forgive yourself and don't look back.
@@janasmith2463 they derive pleasure from our pain; agreed.
We must forgive them that is what sets us free. And then go no contact
@@fastnpray9729 Nope! More 20th century nonsense that you have some duty to forgive someone who hurt you or else you are ALLEGEDLY a "bad person." I'LL LET THEM TAKE THE SO-CALLED HIGHER ROAD.
Once, shame on you. Twice, SHAME ON ME! I'm all done feeling ashamed about their bad actions. NEVER AGAIN!
It's NOT MY JOB to forgive. That's God's and God's only IMHO
Plus one, original comment thread starter! (I needed your comment to reaffirm what I'm doing towards my siblings for the rest of my life at 49. Thank you!!)
@@Maybe-jg4efbesides what is forgiveness anyway? Its just words unless u take it to another level and open yourself up to being treated horribly again. Forgiveness to me means inviting someone back into your life after they’ve wronged you OR its just words you say to make everything think you’re being the bigger person. Forgiveness is overrated imho
3:30--It's funny how they do their "guilt tripping" or ""shaming" into your mid-40s when it's NONE OF THEIR FUCKING BUSINESS out of nowhere (if you're me.) It was at that point that looked up the word scapegoat for the first time in my life because I'm a stranger overheardwhat I was going through on a phone contract with a sibling trying to talk to them on the phone, and this older man sympatheticly said, "Ah... You're a scapegoat!"
The only sentence I ever needed to hear! I thought I had a big vocabulary but I never had heard this word scapegoat before or thought of it until my mid-40s.
Yet that opened up a world of healing for me. Life is so much better being NO CONTACT with my 3 siblings now. (Once you finally see it, you cannot unsee it anymore!!)
LOL. I was being guilt tripped and shamed into my seventies, so don't feel alone! Finally went no contact with them both, after I finally figured out what was happening! 😳
My family is so dysfunctional that I actually can’t tell which of my two sisters is the Narc and which is the Flying Monkey!
They can be both.
It's like being trapped in the grown up version of an American high school movie. You've got the table of popular girls, beautiful, rich, the right clothes, they are cheerleaders, etc.. They have everything going for them so what do they need to do at lunch? Pick on the one kid sitting by themselves just trying to survive. And, everyone else in the lunch room stands by or laughs. The audience watching the movie identifies with the lonely kid, yet in real life, was most likely the bystander laughing at the bullying going on.
I have one person in the family who I believe to be a covert narcissist (or something very close) who has, over a lifetime, managed to rope everyone in the family into her "web" via their own blind spots. This included me, to an extent, for a very long time until it eventually became clear to me what was happening. The others in the family are now unwittingly being used as "flying monkeys" to "neutralize me"...and I can't stress the "unwittingly" part enough. I believe they feel trapped, and can unconsciously sense that the easiest way to stay safe is to side with the narcissist. The entire picture is so sad. I can't even say that anger is my predominant emotion. It's as if fear is running the show amongst all members of the family...Not with more distant family members who are off living their own lives for the most part. I've finally come to realize that my only path to freedom is to break out of this toxic "inner family circle".
Thank you for sharing this. I have been having very much the same experience with my family of origin.
You just described my life in a nutshell!
I am learning so much since I found this site (just this morning!)
When I read the title of this discussion about flying monkeys I immediately thought of The Wizard of Oz and the witch and the "Creepy Monkeys"...😆 I had to just laugh, it was so right on!!
I had not even thought of a "covert narcissist" until now!! Honestly it sounds like we are from the same family!
I so appreciate you bringing all of this out... goodness I'm learning so much here.
I have felt so alone over so many years in dealing with this kind of person as a sibling.
Again, thank you so much for all you said I'm saving it!
Run.
Mine are exactly the same . But I believe a 2nd sibling is now also a narcissist I mean he joins in trying to make me submit to their will . He was never like this ever before, or perhaps I never noticed . Since all the siblings take part by their silence or making excuses for the Narc sis. They’re not innocent they aren’t stupid. Fully grown adults now, so for me they’re associates in crime . If they all stopped supporting her melodramatic outbursts over minor stuff then she would reduce her games . She would have less fuel.
I’ve completely distanced myself emotionally . They call it grey rock ? I blocked all text facilities . Because they very much pushed me to join the chat facility for so called family meetings and socials . For many years I refused then made the mistake of joining and then the drama ensued .
So that’s all stopped now and I won’t call except perhaps every couple of months . I haven’t done so yet . When I do I will be emotionally detached and very formal . One word answers and keep the conversation short .
The irony is I’ve always been the doormat. I’ve always been the one that did all the domestics with my mother even for grown brothers who were fully grown men with wives living under my parents roof .
I’d say I’m too giving . That’s just me and to be something else feels fake . So I suppose they saw me as a good punching bag. Well I’m an adult and have my own children , and refuse to accept this treatment anymore . I’m nothing but nice and forgiving in return yet I’m still treated like vermin every few weeks . I just done have the energy for the constant theatrics . Currently it’s concerning an inheritance . I figure I don’t need to speak to them about it they cant change the will without my agreement . It’s set in stone .
I never in a million years thought my siblings would turn out greedy and selfish and abusive like this. Not since my mother was so loving and giving . Perhaps she was too generous and they were spoilt?
@@janasmith2463 second sibling could also just be an effective "flying monkey"...hard to know.
I have another sister who I would NOT at ALL say was naturally narcissistic...but she has been behaving more and more like one as my narcissistic sister has been "working on her". However, if you believe what most people agree about narcissists...it's not likely that someone can be "turned into" a narcissist...or at least not one with actual "NPD". Sure there is narcissistic behavior...and there's a whole spectrum from healthy narcissism to malignant narcissism. In my case I think my more malignant sister is the only one of the two who would be willing and able to brainwash her sister for her own benefit. The sister who is not naturally narcissist, .I believe, is being manipulated via her own blind spots into believing in the distorted reality that the narcissistic sister has been painstakingly "selling" her.....and is simply "reacting" to what she increasingly has been led to believe. Does this let her off the hook? Not entirely...but....at least in my own understanding of this particular situation, I feel that my second sister is being "subsumed" by the narcissistic sister and have to ask myself just how much true "autonomy" my non- narcossistic sister actually has left. (Can one behave appropriately, when their reality has been distorted?)
One of the great disappointments in my current life, that I am working my way through, is that a couple flying monkey relatives have decided to take up the cause of my covert narcissist sister. They obviously adore her more now than ever and have no empathy for the shunning they are taking part in. I’ve started reading on Ambiguous Grief and I see myself on that healing journey.
There are a few on here that I can so relate to and you are one of them.
The very same thing you mention is going on right now in my life.
My narcissist sister has not only her kids believing she is the bullied one but she also has my other- siblings-
children thinking she is the greatest thing in the world. They have no idea what is really going on and what my whole life has been like trying to deal with her.
Basically all you can really do for your own sanity is back away as soon as possible.
Ugh! Too many Crazies!
I got exiled cause I’ve been calling out my narcissist mother since she started mistreating me. It’s bullying at its core and I do not like bullies.
I have found that ignoring them and then living my own life happily and successfully really annoys them. My sister and her flying monkeys hate it when I'm happy so when I concentrate on me I win both ways.
They hate seeing us happy
They hate seeing things work out for us.
Live ur best life, travel, eat well, take care of ur health, this is ur revenge against them
@@singstreetcar5881I think that you are correct! I’ve been traveling, eating well, working out, etc. I can tell that my narcissistic sister is somewhat envious…
I’m realizing that my mother used my sister as a flying monkey, it makes sense since she was the golden child 🤪
I am struggling so much. I want to cut off the narcissist COMPLETELY, but if I do that, I will never see my niece again. The narcissist has already "punished" me by hurting my niece and keeping her away from me. My niece has been begging for help. She told me her dream would be to live with myself and my husband. When my niece turns 18, the narcissist will be dead to me. Until then, I have to play the game. It makes me mentally sick.
OMG, that's horrible. I've cut off a narcissist sibling, which means I never get to see my nephews again. But they're adults and they're doing fine. Can you call CPS on your sibling?
My daughter cut me off from seeing my Grandchildren!!! What a punishment when I’ve always supported her emotionally & unfortunately too much financially!!!
Don’t ever give money to family because they will steal & expect it for eternity or until you’re BROKE & nothing left to give in their eyes!!!
I SO admire you for this. What a wonderful aunt and what a life raft you and your husband are for this girl. Respect.
Get the niece a recording device. Get evidence of abuse. Give to social services
@@audreyhero2235
Same here.
I have a baby granddaughter which I am not allowed to see
My brother and sister and sister in law have become flying monkeys due to an inheritance of my ex husband and the father of my two daughters.
Luckily I have a good contact with my eldest daughter and my grandson.
I had to go no contact with my whole extended family after cutting out a narcissist sibling. Other members were immediately recruited to Hoover me back in. When that concerted effort failed the flying monkeys were then used to keep tabs on me for the narc to the point of it feeling like stalking. It took about 3 years when I realised that there was no way to heave a healthy relationships with the extended family. So I let them go and after a grieving process, I now feel a lot freer.
Tried to guilt me by saying how can you abandon your family? What family?
Good for you! I'm in the process of doing the same. Better to be alone than be with a family who takes pleasure in making you feel alone.
Hello my whole story , as well .
God bless .
My mother was a narcissist still is but she is old alone and poor she lost everything. She would always tell me I was trying to be mysterious and I thought I was a pre Modena when I was a kid and didn’t know what that even meant. She made my life growing up a living hell. My brother didn’t survive her after I finally got away. She is truly evil
You keep flying, Free flyer! 🤗
You must be Italian, bc I was also referred to as a primadonna.
@@janasmith2463 I think it’s a mental health issue wrongly classified right now as just a personality disorder
OMG this is completely what 2 of sisters have done, and continue to do!! They have their daughters and families doing the same to me and my family. Incredible
It’s common, although I’ve gotten so much shit for being sensitive, it’s made me aware of how not to treat family and have better communication and a healthier dynamic..so odd to me that a family just loves to dwell in this like net of toxicity
It's more common than you think but still a taboo.
My mother pitted us all against each other. I was the scapegoat. My sister and I have not spoken to/seen each other in 17 years. I feel no connection to her anymore and even forget she exists. If she dies, I do not think it will affect me. We are complete strangers now. Thank you, Mummy.
Wow, all those statements are on point. Stop causing trouble, what's wrong with you, OH here we go again...that's not what happened, I didn't say that. It was all a misunderstanding.
It's valuable to become familiar with these enabling statements that serve to gaslight!
My sister and adult flying monkey have caused me so much pain. I have blocked them
Just create your own family outside of them
This is all so sad, so depressing! I have 5 sibling’s and they are all flying monkeys for my covert Nar mom. I feel so alone!
"Stamp of approval" is so on point. Why do a sibling even take sides from lack of evidence?
"Your attempt to paint me in a negative light is noted" is the perfect retort if need to use one!
What’s gone is gone.
Mind ya own family. Get that perfect first, you won’t have time or energy to destroy anybody else’s.
I had to go no contact with my twin sister and other siblings because of the betrayal. She loves the narcissistic sister and hates and disrespected me so bye bye family, my narcissist won't rest till I am out of the family. However I am healing and now realise how I was lead to believe that I was a worthless horrible person, but thankfully, I have seen the truth and the light. I am now happier than I have been for over 50 years. I know I was a good daughter and a good sister, and the narcissist and the flying monkeys can enjoy each other but I will no longer endure the abuse.
My daughter has become a flying monkey against me by my narcissist brother. She doesn't like him, but he has married another narcissist and she has befriended my daughter and they are now using my daughter against me with their lies and manipulations. It is sad to feel helpless to rectify the situation, so I have gray rocked them all. It hurts. But I feel safer and happier. TY for your video.
I have a older sister who has always thrown jabs at me my entire life. As I have gotten older, I have been better able to set boundaries and stop her insults, however, the last two years have been pure evil and toxic. I had to cut ties. Now my other older sister, who always agreed my sister could turn on a dime, has taken sides with her and decided to cut me out as well. This has all been through email or texts...I have asked many times to meet in person or discuss on the phone and they won't do it. Trying to work through my feelings.
She doesn't want to be the next victim is why she took the narcs side!
I am a 77 yr victim of two narsistic sisters, all our life they have been a thorn in the family. Their lies and deceit were a constant dance of survival. As a family It was not till we we were a lot older that we learnt about narcissism and flying monkeys and how havoc can be created. They were always delighted if they caused us to turn on each other. Our contact is now very limited, but at 82 and 73 yrs they can still use their tongue to inflict harm.
For years I was a 'battered sister' and it used to bother me that there was so much support for battered wives but not for those in my position. I'm sure I would have been calling child protection for help if I had understood that I was worthy of the same protections but it just isn't a 'thing' for some reason. I was beaten up regularly by my brother, whilst my mother enabled the entrie thing, making excuses and blaming me. Even having little talks with me to 'be nicer to him', it turned my stomach. She was the real narcissist using my brother to abuse me whilst she looked like the innocent one. I had too much cognitive dissonance to understand the dynamic and that she was to blame, because I could never understand why she didn't seem to understand that my brother was absuing me and it was his fault not mine! Her lies made no sense whatsoever, but I've come to realise that of course she understood it, she just didn't care and probably was encouraging it by doing nothing.
I had the same experience. They do it because they are sadistic.
I've been gone from my inlaws now 2yrs. My husband and I are so much better now since we have no contact. I stayed around all this mess for 32yrs
Really enjoyed this, very supportive
A family member is the flying monkey for his wife. After over 50 years of her torture toward various members of the family, I can finally make sense of the dysfunctional triangulation dynamic and understand that all I can control is my life and my choices. I choose no contact so that I may live in peace. It is liberating!
This is so affirming! To hear you both talk about the kind of shock and dismay I experienced in my own narcissistic sibling situation where she got her husband to scold me - even though I'd just offered what I considered to be an olive branch after her abusive and cruel messages to me where I was sure I was being discarded as a sister - I even expressed my appreciation that he'd always been such a kind brother-in-law, particularly as we lost our only brother years before. Blindsided indeed. There is quite a large age gap, with me the youngest, and I'd always held them in high regard. I think he possibly is in the 'unsuspecting' category of flying monkey, even so I was very hurt indeed. However one is never too old to learn and to know I have/am managing the situation in line with your advice is so reassuring. Thank you, it's great to listen to both of you.
I be will NEVER trust some of my ADULT CHILDREN in my so-called “family!” Out of sight! OUT of mind!
I had to kick 3 sons out at different times ! One kicked out twice! The judge kicked my X out after 36 years…. I’m done with the monsters
@@Ellie-rp8bh I used to never understand this but after what I’ve learned I don’t judge anyone anymore!!!
I used to wonder what was wrong with me all the time but then realized, after much research, that I am ok. I am the second sister these monkeys have chased off, and it all makes sense now.
My mother would never pull her bee Ess on my brother. I did ask my brother, why is mum's pain so valid that it ought to shame me, while my pain is a mere ''grudge'' (I reminded him that it's NEVER been discussed, can something that's never been acknowledge be a grudge?). I asked him why am I branded '''sensitive'' for feeling my own hurt but cold-hearted when I'm not manipulated in to backing down and accepting her narrative that I'm mad/bad and she's the victim of me. My brother didn't seem to have an answer but he is still angry with me that I won't just just buckle under and accept the regime. He sees it, cognitively, or seems to but yet bafflingly he is still blaming me for the trouble caused and the damage done to the family. It is my fault because I didn't just ACCEPT all the projection. I understand now, my pain isn't real to them. But if my pain isn't real to them, I feel like I'm not real to them, so what is the point of playing the part they wrote for me, and they're not happy with that conclusion either. I'm not allowed to have given up either! There literally is only one thing they want from me, *submit* to mum's narrative. How can intelligent people not see how weak they are being?!?!
Love it that you asked your brother why your pain isn’t valid, while your mother’s is to him. Your mother has held more power in your relationship just because of her position as ‘mother’. Now that you’re an adult you can set a boundary. Let them know the consequences if they choose to ignore it. And live a happy life either way.
I wonder if your brother is worried about the extra time and attention he’ll have to spend on dear old mom if you’re not in the picture. Flying monkeys can have their own agenda too.
Best wishes!
Your mother was probably a spoiled brat in childhood. Mine was but I always believed she had it rough. My uncle revealed how spoiled she was after her funeral. (Eye opener). I always thought she was a long-suffering martyr. Your mom has no empathy for you.
Don't try to explain anything to a narcissist. They know what they have done but you keep playing the game and showing you care while they don't.
I have so many toxic family members, I am confused as to who the narcissist is.
Maybe a few or distint varieties; overt, covert...
I love your advice. Factual, straight to the point. Starting with ''avoiding playing the same drama card''..Following on with the advice of ''solidiifying relationships with people around you who KNOW you so that they won't become flying monkeys''...Well when the brother and sister that you brought up and fought for all their lives against the Narc Mother fall under the influence of that Narc Mother and her golden child it is a hard realisation that it IS the people closest to you that you trusted that decide to prop up that family dynamic and get pleasure from isolating that one person that you thought they'd stick up for. .A lack of certain character traits is what's evident here. You know the good ones like discernment, bravery etc. But they are too busy trying to fix the Narc. They think they are doing good and it is her targets fault for speaking out. She plays a good game. They both do. Years of fixating on her problems has people thinking she needs all the help instead of the fact she's creating drama.
This is such a painful Area in one’s Life.I’m experiencing this, With a partner whose mentally sick, And at 10 people around them are influencing his Life and his decisions!
He’s Oblivious, to how these people are manipulating him, but about 30 other people around on the perimeters can see THIS scenario !
Trauma bonded is like addiction.
Just realized one of my daughters is a flying monkey. Her narc dad and I divorced 30 years ago. I thought all these issues were over. Now she’s saying I was the abuser and narcissist. I am very empathic and this blind-sided me. She is the youngest and is her dad’s golden child. Her sisters can’t understand her. She has asked me not to contact her. I am grey rocking her, but it hurts so much. I feel like I’ve lost a daughter. I love and miss her so much.
Such a painful story. I'm sorry you're going through all this. You are not alone! Many empaths are blindsided by Narcs. Learn as much as you can about this dynamic, so you can better understand the family patterns. One day, your daughter may begin to see these patterns on her own.
@@fernschumer186 My daughter will have to come to her own realization as to what’s going on. I deeply pray she does. Unfortunately, she has been “growing” a narcissistic attitude since childhood and may never realize I wasn’t the abuser. I got out of that marriage as soon as I could for my children’s sake, too.
I went No Contact with my malignant pathological lying sister. On Fridays I often went dancing at a small time bar. Several times, her flying monkeys would show up to try to catch me doing something they could report back. Unfortunately for them, I don't drink, and I'm an extreme introvert. I just came to hear the bands. Her monkeys were probably severally reprimanded for failing their missions. Or... they just made s*** up. Who cares?
Very helpful content, and so much relatable. Has anyone else noticed that Ali-John totally sounds like Kermit the Frog? 😂
I am and I was involved with narcissist situation but I never identify flying monkey narcissist it is not easy lots of manipulation lots of mental pressure that is hard to know what exactly going on
The Centuries of games; unbelievable 🎉
my feelings and thoughts were dismissed.... and, there was so much Understanding for other person's "issues" and Behaviors..
I am now NC, these 'friends' were enablers to keep me in the 'group', in which I was unhappy about how my Needs weren't met and how I was treated.. I Know I made the Right decision to go NC.
This is exactly what is going on with me as i finally realised that my step Dad and Mam are narcs with my two brothers being the flying monkies.
Yikes! My family.
Thank you Ali-John and Fern this is so very helpful!
Oh and my experiences have been a lot of gaslighting. “I didn’t say that”, “that’s not how she remembers it”. “Dad doesn’t treat me that way”, “What did you say to him to cause him to treat you that way”. We had a Narc father. My siblings seem to have followed in his footsteps. I had no idea this would happen. I kept hoping and waiting for them to get into therapy for all the trauma we endured. Parents divorced when I was six. Mom was schizophrenic alcoholic. Dad didn’t come around and was later forced to take custody when I was twelve. Denied my getting counseling for taking on the mother role. Scapegoated me because he was angry that a twelve year old didn’t do a good enough job caring for her siblings. We went through three divorces and three marriages before the age of 18. Narc parent was divorced five times. All of his sick behavior is now being projected onto me. I have been in therapy for ages trying to understand why I’m so “negative, unforgiving and stuck in the past”. I finally know what a narcissistic family system does to the scapegoat of the family. It took a long while to finally see the truth. It’s not me. It’s sad. They don’t want to heal and recover. They want to continue the abuse.
Both of our parents are narcissists. I offhandedly mentioned to my sister that it's too bad we don't have better ones. (Careless on my part to not consider her feelings. ) She said "I think our parents are wonderful." And that was the end of that topic.
She was not hostile or attempting to change my mind, which speaks to me this is more of strict trauma bond. It's possible the more distant I become from the parents she may be mobilized, but not at the moment.
It breaks my heart. She was no golden child. She was invisible, and while we were young she suffered sibling abuse by me (I'm 2 years older) as well as neglect and abuse from our parents, and zero protection. Her survival skill became internalizing everything.
She's used to remembering that I got more abuse due to my scapegoat status, I don't think her own suffering registers in her mind, nor understanding anything more than that I was "bad".
We're not close, but not on bad terms. I found some of her drawings from our childhood and I sobbed. It didn't take an art therapist to see what was going on in them. Isolation, loneliness, needing love she wasn't getting.
She refuses to go to therapy.
Some people artículos not ready for the awakening. It's too painful.
Can't trust them til they stop putting effort into being weird and manipulatively controlling, instead of just being normal and peaceful. She deserves better, we all do and they are too immature and un wise to do anything better
I had no clue about this information. Am in Recovery. Trust? My sister's put mean girls to shame.. I don't have to anything. My ancestors were indentured servants. Parents are dead. Not depending on Any sibling. Found empathy (of course) for them.. Rescinded. Realized Ive been repeating my patterns ...I've backed away from all my Activism and Advocacy. Read "Yoga Is Consciousness In Action",....not exactly getting threatened with arrest... The emotions at at Anti War Rally . is narc buffet . Unknowing (?!Flying monkeys ...this section of town thinks I have cancer... Current narc... wanting to tell especially people I know, I thought were friends. I don't know this either!! So much for being "a wave and the ocean" ive not ever felt more alone..Thank you for this info.
To the woman presenter in this, have you ever called out a narcissist on their behaviour? It is absolutely pointless. You will be abused and traumatised. I experienced it for 40 years, they are not capable of admitting they are wrong.
I've decided that I really don't want flying monkeys or narcs in my life anymore period. I give the monkeys bad Intel .
Lol
No Contact is definately a must!
I went NO CONTACT with my mother, the Narcissist who continually triangulate myself a younger sister and herself. She also used my younger brother as a flying monkey. He was the Golden Child. I did this 2 yrs before she died. The youngest sister and I the Oldest finally figured out what was going on. Her two chosen Ones received the majority of her estate, which was fine with us. A letter given to us after she passed away as an Explaination of why we received so little. She said we did not live up to our DUTIES TO HER?????
IT WAS SAD, BUT in the End, the sister squandered her money trying to keep her family out of jail and died almost 3 yrs ago. The brother is now in prison and had A drug an alcohol addiction. My younger sister and I are still here and better understand what happened to our disfunctional family.
Yes! My brother made some very bad decisions at seventeen and was in prison, our mother passed very suddenly and unexpectedly during this time as well. I supported him some financially, getting clothes he needed, making sure he had soap and toothpaste and extras so he could have burger king day or pizza when they got outside food support him emotionally & traveling to see him at every prison he was moved to across the state and the day he came home after a long 12 years he met a female who made him a very different person and not in a good way. He talks to our other two siblings and I am the one he hates. I was the only one not invited to his wedding. He was trying to hurt me and It didn’t because what I did for him was out of pure love not because I expected anything in return but it was definitely a slap in the face. He loves to talk bad about me and that’s ok. We haven’t spoken in 4 years. I let god handle it.
My sister was put in juvinile detention at 15 years old. I am 13 months older than her and visited her in jail, lockdown institutions, etc. all those years. When she was 17 and I was 18, I had just gotten out of foster care. I picked her up, took care of her and did what you said too! Each time I would pick her up, clothe her, feed her, go out, have fun, she even called me “mommy Holly”. Each time she would take so much of my money and time my life I worked hard for would fall apart. Then she would get with a boyfriend and show off her new clothes, after I couldn’t afford new clothes because of what I lost paying for her! Many years later, several rounds, and she continues to treat me as an enemy and now has turned our huge family into flying monkeys against me. She has physically and emotionally tried to kill me many times since I was 11 too. I don’t know why? It is all so odd. I am now not talking to my best closest sister friend I went through so much childhood trauma and more with to literally save my own life.
Why do they come back around after you know they’re a flying monkey and you know their plans? Its stupidity.
They think they can hoover you back by using the old tricks. After all, narcissists believe their victims are their property and losing a victim makes them doubt about themselves and their own worth.
Grey rocking I heard doesn’t work long term? I am trying it . It should be easy because I live far away. But if it doesn’t work long term what options do I have. Completely cutting off siblings means I would never see my nieces and nephews either . Not sure I can live with that . Since some of them I remember feeding and changing as babies :(
I grew up the youngest of 9 with parents who were loving and loved by many. Our house was always bustling with people. One brother named himself king when the parents died and his wife became 1st lieutenant. Bro and wife are in charge or very involved in every gathering, reunion, wedding, shower, graduation or funeral. Their house is like flying monkey headquarters. Whenever a person leaves, that person becomes the topic of discussion as bro remarks on all their bad points and makes all his guests laugh. What they call charm, I call disgusting behavior. One sister used to be their scapegoat until they pushed her to the point of no contact. She has been missing now for decades. Even her own children don’t know her whereabouts as they’ve been sucked into my bro’s narc world. Now I have become their target. I have very little contact and once our parent’s house sells, I’ll go no contact. I haven’t been to any sort of family function in 10 years. My healing has been slow but I am getting there. May anyone reading this feel loved and cared for and above all, accepted, just for being you. ❤
I was a flying monkey/enabler many times.
I'm completely alone.I have 8 adult children and a narcissistic ex. I need help. I was a self employed, self sufficient stay at home mom. I live miles from town. My family has always been literally my entire life. With a narcissistic husband and 8 children I never needed anyone else because I had a crowd around me at all times. When he left all that changed. Now instead of hussle and bustle, laughing and shouting it's crickets. The only face I see is the mailman driving by. I didn't know about narcissism or flying monkeys. But as I watched my family fall into the chaos which all seemed to center around me somehow and I became too bad guy to everyone I love, I got a crash course in narcissism but absolutely no information on a solution. I haven't seen any of their faces or my grandchildren for two years and it's literally killing me
Perhaps for you to take accountability for part or a lot of your children’s pain can help.
Some of the worst things I've ever heard someone say were things said about their own personal flying monkeys. Of course defending the dignity of the other person only made me more of a scapegoat.
The thing that shocks me most on this subject isnt even the levels of manipulation the toxic person will go to, but instead its the flying monkeys complete unawareness that he or she has that their lives and rights to choose have been robbed from them. They often don't even realize they arent truly living a life of freedom. Their lives are hijacked and theyre missing out on the people who would not only love them, but have their backs too.
I could write a book of the hell my sister put me through. When my mom died she and aloy of my family turned into salvage dogs and I mean I was shocked by the cruelty of their actions and words. They broke every rule set up in the trust my mom wrote so I split 50/50 and legally disinherited her sorry butt. I had them slander me online and recruiting daily for people to destroy me. They damaged my roof and my car and even got death threats. Had to get police involved. I have my whole family blocked from my life been very painful. I couldn't believe that I had to stand alone to do what my parents wanted but I will never back down cause I had the greatest parents and I feel so grateful for them. I go forward alone and I not looking back on forward.
Also, the flying monkeys are willing to do the dirty work knowingly because of their own jealousy or envy towards the targeted person.
Great content
Thank you!
Well need I hope you come up with more on this dynamic
My narc ex has estranged my oldest son from his sister. This is very hurtful to him as they were very close growing up. Their father has been determined to make me the devil even though he left the marriage after abusing me for thirty years.
Very imp if to pity at them or to just let them be and gray rock them too
What about tactics? invasion of privacy, unlawful entry, forgery of documents following, identity theft,,tying knots in eveything(reminiscent of stallag 13). Have experienced ALL of these things and more! Ongoing, and things are coming to a head. Say a prayer for me.
My mother has ruined my relationships for me with family. & she’s still at it, at 80 😢How can I repair them? If I can. I can’t confront this because one time she feigned suicide & terrified me. I promised myself I’d never confront her again☹️
The flying monkey sent to me infuriated me more than the narc...I was doing so well not engaging and she sent my best friend to pick up my Grandson WITHOUT ASKING ME FIRST NEITHER OF THEM HE WALKS IN AND RIGHT AWAY ASKS IF HE WANTS TO GO VISIT HIS AUNTE I THINK I HAVE NEVER BEEN MORE ANGRY IN MY LIFE SHE THOUGHT AFTER RUNNING ME DOWN MANIPULATING ME SHE THOUGHT SHE COULD GET AWAY WITH THAT...ALL SHE WANTED WAS MY REACTION SHE WILL NEVER GET IT AGAIN THAT WAS LAST STRAW FOR BOTH HER AND THE MONKEY ON MY BACK. LOL
What are the Facebook group they mentioned URLs?
The flying monkey keeps calling us to tell us to say thank you to the narc and to make sure and call the narc because the narc has convinced her that we don't do these things even though they are aware of the narc consistently making it up. She also is trying to force me to have another talk with the narc after we've had it many times bc the narc wants it.
nice music for once. usually youtube videos have horrid music.
I used to pretend like my siblings did their eventual hate into my 40s independently. But looking back at the videotape, it was all set up from day one
Watching my son turn into a flying monkey to his covert wife is extremely painful. My brother in law too. He wakes up to protect his wife!!! Can be nasty and arrogant too!
Its pretty bad they madecfertain they got.moms house no o nevdare question my dad in all his I fairness because hes a veteran now dead ...sisters words u can't contest it
The golden child and a flying monkey role included is a very twisted role as the narc mother and golden flying monkey gang up together on various ppl. Controlling every event, not sharing basic family info thats important to know, and deliberately excluding others then mocking them for not knowing the important info, such as deaths, out of town family visitors, etc. Lifetime of intentionally hurting others.
I tried to comment. It wouldn't let me. Well that went through. Flying monkeys...my family had plenty of those. Of course,im the crazy obe to blame for everything. Allbthe while they hide their dirt. It's unbelievable.
But what about when the flying monkeys are a parent working for a siblings- we want to maintain a relationship with the parents but they live with a narcissistic sibling
10:35
If you can't trust them, there's no relationship. All their fault. They need to act like it instead of proving their selfish sickness through their toxic pattern of behaviors
It's an act of betrayal. My Dad is in denial and is scared of any more drama.
I feel like our relationship fell apart when he started to make excuses for her behaviour.
He's going to say that her behaviour started when I did something wrong...Lehigh is not true and it put the narcissist in the position of not taking any responsibility for her behavior.
He is never going to state the fact that her behaviour is abusive and irrational and she needs to seek professional help to make her aware of how she reacts and rages, without any care qnd conscience.
Such a simple truth that can get lost in all the drama of a narcissistic relationship.
the flying monkey I know is not aware that i know that she is. SHe likesdrama and is not used to a person like. The high functioning, Emotionally Cold Empath.
💙🕸🕷🕸💙
It's ok I am a mistake maker and I didnt know what I didnt know and I am learning and practicing. Lols its somthing broken world we r capable of handling this
Tfw personally systems /families what's the difference the roles and results r simiar