LFP doesn’t have memory, but it needs to be calibrated often to 100% because the voltage at 100% vs at 0% is basically the same. With other cells the voltage varies and that’s how you measure capacity remaining. When voltage doesn’t change, you don’t know the max or min capacity that accurately so charging to 100% often, at least once a week according to tesla keeps the BMS calibrated so the car doesn’t shut down unexpectedly.
If the charged voltage and the discharged voltage was the same then it would never go flat ! I'm being a smart ass, I get your point. Also the on the charging of the LIP battery, Tesla state that the battery likes to be plugged in all the time. Always charge to 100%. I agree that this does not sound write but who would argue against Tesla.. Its quite possible that 100% is not actually at cell maximum anyway. A bit like saying the 18650 is 100% charged at 4.10v and not the specified 4.20v
@@marcusbiller867 not really. LFP cells can last 2-4x longer than nickel cells even if LFP is charged to 100%. If you look at the charge cycle data for LFP, there’s basically no difference between charging to 0-80 or 0-90 or 0-100 for longevity. For nickel cathode cells this matters a lot and it’s better to keep charge limit at 80% or lower.
sorry chaps but you are generally wrong. lfp should be fully charged once a week. because the individual cells can only be ballancrd at the higher voltages. no memory effect. The BMS will turn off the battery if individual cells get to low. So because they can only be balanced at high voltages they need to be fully charged once a week else the cells will get out of balance. Of course this is possible because they have lower cell voltages and do not degrade at full charge.
Hey Andy, I watch dozens of Tesla videos each week, and this is the first video where I’ve seen somebody try to comprehensively describe all of the different battery technologies that go into different Tesla vehicles. Even some of the best Tesla TH-camrs gloss over these types of distinctions, especially regarding the LFP batteries. Well done. This is one of the many reasons that we subscribe to your channel.
My Australian LFP SR+ doesn’t exhibit less than normal retardation @100% SOC. And I can sleep well at night. We did 457 km on a return trip in mild weather this week and had 5% left over. LFP for me !
Thanks for your video. We just got our Model 3 and received a text from Tesla asking me to charge to 100% at least once a week. I must say I was intrigued by the text as I was under the impression that charging like that would degrade battery life. Your presentation explains a lot!
I have the 2022 RWD LFP 60KW and it’s very impressive I’m getting 275 miles plus. Even on short trips here in the still chilly UK I’m often getting under 200wh. Since my last charge it’s averaged 223. Astonishing really. It’s a 300 mile car I suspect in warmer climate and careful acceleration and limiting to 65mph.
Hi Andy. You missed to mention NCMA LG Chem batteries which Tesla is using on their 2021 3/Y Long Range models (at least the ones delivered in Europe). There are pluses and minuses but the NCMA has way less cobalt content compared with the Panasonic NCA and lower degradation (at least they claim so). Having said that, NCMA seem to be a good balance between NCA and LFP. Charging speed on NCMA was also somewhat lower (I have one of the first released models, made in US and received in December 2020) comparing with NCA but as of December 2021 they boost the speed on the LG pack so the gap is smaller now. Everybody expects indeed the 4680 cells soon and will be interesting to see how will Tesla introduce them to the market.
never imagined the lead acid storage battery when pushed aside would start a race in technology that is so fascinating and will change our lives so thoroughly. thanks for your report
It's important to make a distinction between battery chemistry (NCA, LFP, etc.) and form factor (18650, 2170, 4680, blade, prism, etc.). They are completely separate issues and should be addressed separately.
Yes! 4680 isn't a different chemistry. He kept calling it the 3 different chemistrys. It's not. 4680 is either LFP or NCA. And for now it seems 4680s are only NCA as Tesla uses prismatic LFP batteries which are just that and not 18650 or 2170.
My guess about the new Model Y on the EPA list is as follows. The new Y is a SR+ from Fremont with less 2170 cells. This will allow Tesla to continue using Fremont for Model Y but give a price diff to the 4860 from Austin. With luck the Austin Model Y with 4680s will be a little lighter then the current long range and have a bit more range as well. Excited to see what happens at any rate.
just wanted to add another 3 things about the LFP battery, 1) cold weather DC charging can be slow 2) when you are DC charging you don't want to go much above 80% because the charge speed slows down. 80% on a NCA battery is more range than 80% on a LFP battery. 3) LFP batteries are said to last 2-3x times longer than NCA, so if you are the type to buy and own a car for like 10years it might be worth to consider this
How do we get to decide which battery we get? When you place an order you get what you get. I’m still waiting on my model 3. Who knows what battery I’ll get.
Just reserved a Model 3. I don’t think it’s right for them to put different batteries in cars and not allow you to choose especially if it may affect future resale value. Everyone is paying the same price and not receiving same batteries.
I'm thinking 279 mile Model Y is LFP chemistry in a structural pack (perhaps with BYD blade battery). My guess is they are also doing the 4680 out of Austin as well which will be the other one submitted to EPA but not yet released. My guess as well would be both of these are other variants of Model Y so delaying your order will not help... but perhaps you can have your order changed to the new variant. Very soon we will see the website updated if I am correct.
Thanks for this. I test drove a M3 LR yesterday and asked the rep about the rear wheel drive and if it would have the LFP battery. He had to call someone to find out. The answer was yes and to his credit he found out for me.
These gas prices sent me over the edge. I’m buying a Model 3 sometime this year. $50 for a tank of gas in a Prius Prime is crap. That is old SUV price from 2005.
They increased the price on the Model 3 by $7k since I bought mine in April 2021. The gas prices should be the least of your concern. I bought it for the tech, the zero emissions, being quick yet quiet, and the red model 3 also looks really nice aesthetically. The gas savings were honestly an afterthought for me given all the other benefits it offers
LFP does degrade more quickly due to 100% charging. I can't believe how many times people get this wrong. Only reason you're told to go to 100% is so Tesla can get an accurate trip reading.
It's also to allow the battery management system to balance the cells in series, otherwise the charge carried by each cell may vary, reducing the battery capacity and range.
I drive a 2020 model 3 long range for business purposes. Put a little over 250k miles on it before the battery failed. I beat the hell out this battery, drove between 300 and 600 miles a day on a regular basis while mostly using superchargers to make my errands. I would regularly charge to 100% before leaving home and drive it down to 5-10% before supercharging. I'm getting a brand new battery and not a remanded one. I'm curious what/if there's any improvements in this new battery I'm waiting on. This time around, I'm going to only set it to 90% and never let it go under 15% and I'll see how much more range I'll get compared to my last one.
@@happyhippo1710 A little shy of $16k. I anticipated I would get at least 300,000 miles before I would need a new battery so I was 50,000 off. I'm sort of glad it happened when it did because current prices are locked in contract with tesla's suppliers but when those contracts expire, prices due to inflation are going to be up 20-30%. Had my battery lasted longer than it did, I would be paying much, much more for the battery replacement.
Hi Andy, great video. Thank you. If my delivery date is end of May (changed from Aug-Sept yesterday), how do I know whether my Y LR has 4680 battery or not? I agree with you if I can delay my delivery so that I can get the first 4680 batter, i would like to do that as well. How do I delay my delivery?? Any suggestions? Thank you Andy.
What is funny is that NiCad batteries which were the first commonly used battery had an issue with memory which caused the search for new technologies like Nickle Metal Hydride which had a bad habit of imploding for no apparent reason and releasing toxic fumes. We then went to a few other types that only lasted extremely short periods of time until we found Lithium Ion which of course didn't suffer from memory issues and were supposed to be the ultimate form of rechargeable tech until we found that it would develop dendrites which of course caused them to degrade. Next question is, if or what we will find wrong with LFP in the future once it is in widespread use.
Andy, I have a date of April 22 - May 27 for a LR Model Y in Blue. I live in NY. I delayed the order once. I will take the next VIN they give me hoping its an Austin build with 4680's.
Hi Andy, Many thanks for a really informative video. I too have a Model Y Long Range on order that is due in September. I haven't seen any confirmation on whether Tesla has shipped any of these from Austin and whether they are equipped with 4680 batteries. Hope to hear something from Tesla to confirm that they are currently producing Model Y LR from Austin with the 4680 batteries. Please give us an update if you get any reliable information fron Tesla on this subject, not guesses.
I am surprised you aren't listing the LG NMC battery pack that is going into the M3LR any time now. A pack that charges slower, has less discharge power and less capacity as well. This would have been essential to mention! Also when you mention that the top 10% can't be used on daily charge with NCA packs, then you should also mention that the lower 4,5% are hidden below 0%. This capacity also needs to be subtracted from the claimed range as it is part of it.
I attempted to do exactly what you are with my Model Y performance order. Tesla cancelled my order. I had a surgery coming up and it has a long convalescence period where I would not be able to pick up or even drive the car. Tesla did not consider that to be sufficient for a delayed delivery. They also told me that I was not allowed to specify 4680 batteries. I simply have to take whatever they decide to ship to me. I'll be interested in hearing if they cancel your order as they did mine.
Pretty sure they do the same to all customers no matter who they are. If everyone would want the new generations battery, they will not sell their previous edition and it would be a mess.
My Tesla rep told me they are no longer allowing delays. You take your car when it's ready or lose your order. I had both a LR3 and LRY on order and was waiting to see what happened with tax incentives. Lost the LR3 order bc it was ready now and they wouldn't delay.
@@invincibul I would have been willing to pay the price increase if they would have said it was required. I didn't get the option. They just closed my order and took my $250. That's just stupid. Over 20% margin on a 80,000 dollar purchase with FSD that has an even higher markup. They settled for a pissed off customer and $250. BRILLIANT!
@@bobdavis7192 They don't have the best training. If you were willing to pay the difference on the backend it would just be moving your order to the end of the line with upgraded specs. Pity they don't have the foresight to see that. Good luck on your car search
It will be interesting to see if the LFP in a Model Y has more range than the LFP RWD M3. Less energy dense so I have read that they are basically Full packs in the RWD M3 rather than a Scaled down NCA pack.
FYI - Tesla announced in the Q1 earnings call that Austin built Model Y use the new 4680 cells, and they don’t plan to make LFP versions of the 4680. Therefore the Austin cars don’t have LFP right now, and when Tesla adds an LFP option for the Model Y it will likely use CATL prismatic cells, like the RWD Model 3 does.
A very useful video, i will stick to my mazda cx5 until it is guaranteed the new battery is what we would get, I live in Europe so would have appreciated the analysis of the German Tesla factory as pertaining to the battery applications
Good luck on deferring your delivery. They kept changing my Model Y delivery and eventually wanted to deliver it in late December. I got them to defer to 2/1/22 but in mid January they said if I did not put myself back in line by January 27 they would refund my deposit. I ended up with a delivery of 2/10/22. Maybe due to your status with Tesla you will get preferential treatment but they were not accommodating to me. I wanted the car for April delivery when the weather is better and I did not have a pressing need for the car but Tesla didn’t care.
the LFP and 100% charge is really making me reconsider the M3 RWD. I've heard that second motor adds 400 lbs and really messes with the driving and handling. it loses the nimbleness of the single motor M3. Plus the RWD M3 is the only one remotely affordable for me right now. You have driven single and dual motors right? Whatcha think?
If you can't afford a dual motor model, don't even consider it. Extending yourself financially for any car is not worth it. The LFP M3 RWD is the most efficient Tesla battery and motor combo in most conditions currently, and daily charge up to 100 percent is akin to a performance or long range model at 80 percent charge with an NCA battery. If you're looking for long-term use, don't need the fastest charging speeds, and live in an area where all wheel drive isn't necessary, then the rear wheel drive LFP is a reasonable choice.
Are these batteries supposed to become standard for all Tesla vehicles soon?? I’d rather get a LR or performance than a rwd soon but the battery upgrade is huge
Great video! Lots of useful info. I think there will be dual motors using lfp 4680 as well. My guess is they limited lfp 2170s to single motors because of it's discharge limitations but the 4680 will not have the same limitations. Lfp 4680 will probably be in every model and trim in the future until the next innovation.
Bought LFP batteries for my friends EV scooter (need to purchase a better charger with battery management system). Lighter weight will help me load the scooter into the trunk of my car. Hooray for LFP batteries. So can I purchase the 12v LFP battery for my 2019 M3?? And is it a good idea?
They are canceling orders if you delay or reject a vehicle. This wasn't enforced much in the past, but I've seen orders canceled after putting it on hold when they assign you a vehicle.
Hi, I bought a Tesla model y dual motor for my dad in November 2022. I've also have had a KIA EV6 since May 2022. Let me just come out and say it. The battery range of the model y is HORRIFIC. In fact, I'm due to go into Tesla this weekend as it really isn't adding up. Regardless of whether we precondition the battery or not, the Tesla loses battery life even when parked. I charged it 80% on a Sunday night, and after 4 days of driving (dad on average does 25 miles per day), we had to charge it on Thursday night as we knew that it wouldn't get him to work and home on Friday. He barely turns the heating on or heated seats, and yet the return on the so called range is horrific. Absolutely nothing compared to the KIA which actually gives you back miles thru the regen breaking. We will see what Tesla will say, but I'm so disappointed. One day I went on a long trip. Charged it full to 329 miles. By the time I had preconditioned the car, this had someone dropped to 315 just through the preconditioning.
I have a friend that recently picked up a model Y in the Bay Area that may have an LFP battery pack.He has the same charging window as a model 3 standard and an E as the seventh symbol on his vin number. Any thoughts?
I commute my model 3 rwd with lfp 60mi daily im not able to complete two days without depleting my battery down to 10% daily. So my question is that is it okay or safe to charge my model 3 to 90% everyday?
Makes more sense that a new version of an existing vehicle like the SR+ will get a different batter (LFP or likely 4680). Otherwise you create a problem with order cancellations or postponements, fighting for a 4680 over 2170, and a logistical cutover nightmare. Guarantee Tesla won’t do something like that for it’s shareholders. I have a hard time seeing MYLR or MYPs come out with 4680s until all manufacturing facilities can accommodate and then sunset the 2170 models. They’re not going to make the same model with both batteries at the same time for a very long time, so you’ll probably see LR and P (probably P sooner with the less demand) with the 4680s when production and supply of the 4680 can accommodate the entire line at Fremont and Texas. Also, the Texas Y’s spotted in the lot on the trucks ETC are confirmed not performance. Likely SR+
I think we’re in the same order batch or very close? I ordered my LR-7, blue, tow pkg on 10/27…. My delivery range changed about a week ago to 5/7-6/11 EDD. Delivery to Vegas. I was ecstatic when it got pushed back a month! 🤞🤞🤞
I have a 2022 M3 LR with the LG E5LD battery. If I understand correct this is still a NCA battery and it should not be charged at 100% for the daily trips?
How are you going to delay your Y to then hope they upgrade you to a new one? You said you’re a couple weeks away, so you should have your VIN already, and I’m sure your car is already being built, so how would they upgrade you to the new one?
Thanks for your simple explanation!! I was going to order a Tesla y performance but I’ll wait until January to make sure I get a 4680. I’m not a scientist so your explanation was really god
How are you able to delay delivery? I didn't get my delivery date until right after my VIN, so wouldn't I be unable to get a newer vehicle by changing the date because they'd just keep my same vehicle stored until that date?
The new Chinese RWD 60 LFP they are selling in the U.K. and Europe is pretty fantastic. Amazing efficiency and only about 30 miles difference to LR version. Also can be charged to 100%. Problem is they just put the price up by £3k! Still a lot cheaper than the LR though. Heat pump, double glazing, heated rear seats and steering wheel.
Hey, thought I should mention LFP batteries do not have a memory. I assume the reason they allow the charge to 100% is because their cycle life is 3000-5000 vs nmc which is ~1000.
No, the reason is the voltage. Because the BMS measures V difference to calculate SoC it needs to go to 100% to be able to calculate properly, because the V on LFPs is about 3.65% at the top and 3.45 at the bottom as opposed to 4.2V and 2.5V on NMC. Also, 1000 cycles (even if true, most likely more with BMS and cooling/heating) is about 300,000km for about 85% battery retaining. Do you expect to drive 300,000km?!
@@marcusbiller867 So, my experience with LFP is a DIY ~30kwh 16s2p (51.2V, 560ah). So I agree that the top voltage of LiFePO4 is ~3.65V, but I am not too sure where you got the 3.45V for the bottom? The nominal voltage of LiFePO4 is ~3.2v, and common bottom voltage is 2.8v (I believe u can go all the way to 2.5v though). Most modern off grid systems know not to use voltage to calculate SoC, as the discharge curve for lifepo4 is so flat. Most systems use a smart shunt, to measure the amount of ah that have gone in and out of the battery, and use this to calculate SoC. So my question is this: do we have any sources that show that Tesla uses strictly voltage to calculate the SoC? Personally, I don't think they do, because when under load the voltage sags, and you cannot get an accurate measurement until the battery is 100% at rest.
Im getting a new 85kw put in my 2013 model s. Because tesla doesnt make 85kw for the S anymore, my new battery is actually a 100kw that has been software reduced to 85
By postponing the delivery of your Model Y (if indeed you can still do that without Tesla cancelling your order), you might get a new type of battery. But, if the battery's size is such that the car's range is actually less, as suggested by the addition to the Fuel Economy website, then wouldn't it be better to have the older type of battery?
I have a MYP on order with a June 9 to July 21 delivery and as much as I'd like to see it ASAP would want to delay it if it doesn't come with the 4680 battery
Thanks for the info Andy. As an engineer, Tesla's amazing "outside the box" thinking has had my interest for the past couple years. Recently, I've been watching for updates regarding giga Austin and the possibility of 4680 springing to life in the Y. I ordered MYLR a couple weeks ago with a September delivery as of now. I'm hoping as you are, to score the new mega-cast front and rear with a 4680 structural pack between. Question, if my delivery day comes and they are still not shipping 4680 equipped Ys, how do you "delay"??
They are canceling orders if you try to delay or reject the car. I've seen it happen multiple times now. It's all over the forums. Read your contract, because it's within their right to cancel orders if you don't accept within a number of days.
@@vanto4362 I had a Plaid S and delayed my order and it was not cancelled. They picked me in June, delayed it until September and received my order. I would just ask for confirmation that it will not be cancelled.
@@bigswee693 There was a policy change a couple months ago, delay at your own peril. It’s unfair that you get both a lower price and the latest tech. Those should be for people paying $10k over what you paid for.
We have a M Y DM LR on order with delivery in December thru March 23. It's supposed to have the 2170 out of Freemont. However, with Austin expected to make M Y DM LR, I'm thinking it may be sooner. The announcement did say that Austin would be making 2170 and 4680. Whatever the case, I can hardly wait. Thanks for the info. Bob
Hi Andy, great battery tech info, thank you! I would like to purchase a 2023 Model S Plaid NOT a 2022, when should I place my order? The Tesla website states that if I place my order now I get a delivery date of July & Sept, 2022. I'm sure if I place it now I'll receive a 2022 model, so how much longer should I wait to place my order? Should I order in Sept then delay delivery? the only way I'll know if I'm getting a 2023 is when Tesla provides me with a VIN#. Your help would be greatly appreciated!
Just ordered my Model Y, Pushing to delay also due to wanting the new setup. but not sure when we will get them in Europe. i do hear that German MY will be new battery too.
I read everywhere that the first ones from Giga-Berlin will NOT be 4680 (initially 2170, I guess). After a few months (6-8?) they plan to switch to 4680. The first ones from Giga-Texas will be 4680, however, with their 4680 cells having already been built in California (ready in inventory). Hopefully before that supply runs out, Giga-Texas will begin producing their own 4680 cells, and also get various other forms of batteries from LG, CATL, etc.. Currently, there is no such thing as a LFP 4680 (as the LFP are prismatic ingots rather than cylindrical cells), which might likely rule out a structural battery pack also. Check further to see what form of battery you will get from Giga-Berlin, as it depends on what exactly you ordered. (Maybe you'll want to delay your delivery if you're strongly wanting 4680's?) Good luck.
My 2021 battery is Made of NMC Lithium ion Battery. It has a Lithium-Nickel-Manganese-Cobalt-Oxide Battery Chemistry. Remember Some Model 3's and Y's still use this Battery Chemistry for their vehicles as well. If your VIN number has an E on the 7th Digit (going from left to right) Then you have a Lithium-Nickel-Manganese-Cobalt-Oxide battery.
I would, unless you need it, keep the car at 70%-80%, and really, even with a car like a SR+ RWD model 3, that has a range of about 250 (I think) you get MORE range that most people would use on a daily basis. Even when DC fast charging, RARELY do I go above 85-90% (I may fill it to 100 at the beginning of the trip if I have time but that's not DC fast charging, I do that on a Level 2, and Even on road trips I keep it at around 90-95% because it charges SO SLOW after 85%! (and the most I ever went between chargers is around 160 miles) Maybe once in a while I'll do the first leg around 200mi, but rarely. (Did that with my CCS cars too). As for waiting... I would have prefer to get a 4860 Model Y, but I needed a car right away at the beginning of this year (2023) for work; since the price on Model Y was reduced (and the had a MOdel Y Performance that had less than 20 miles with a tow hitch available in my local area/inventory, I got it (may replace it in a year or two for the new battery pack, but for now, its astill a great car!). apparently Toyota engineers disassembled one to study it, and called it a work of art :)
I took delivery of a MYP 2 weeks ago. The vehicle info page says Low Voltage Battery: Lithium Ion (but not LFP?). My Tesla advisor confirmed that is the same thing since it doesn't say NCA. But when I go to the vehicle charge screen it does say Daily-Trip not 50-100% which indicates non-LFP. Im so confused. All I want to make sure is whether I should charge to 80 for non-LFP or 100 for LFP really depending on which one? Thoughts?
Thank you Andy for a great review! I ordered a SR+ M3 last year set to be delivered this month of March buy Tesla move the delivery date to June! Does this mean I will get a 2022 M3 with LFP battery?
Wow, fantastic video with knowledge I must have to assist in my decision. I'm looking at a Model 3 Performance but I feel I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place as the lease on my current vehicle runs out the first week of November. If I make the order and is ready for delivery before the end of my lease, I can't/don't want to be paying on 2 cars at the same time but as I also work at a hospital, I cannot afford to be without a car... I have to be ready at a moment's notice! I am stuck in quite the quandary. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!
@@SpressoX3 Thanks for the input! I have thought about and mulled over that scenario much. With the way Tesla keeps increasing their prices, I didn't know if it would be a good idea to order now and lock in at a potentially lesser price. But then again, I have been bit by the new car bug and I'm jonesing for the Model 3 Performance pretty bad! Hahaha
You say that the 4680 cell is a “different chemistry” and I don’t think that’s true. You also distinguish between the “three battery types” by chemistry for the first two. Elon has already spoken about how the nickel based or iron based chemistries go into the 4680 cells. So the 4680 is simply a new form factor and manufacturing process right now. Yes it may facilitate better heat dissipation and current flow due to the physical design. But right now we only know that the existing chemistries will be inside these cells. 4680 is not a “new chemistry” as yet.
What's the cycle life rating of each chemistry? I have been wondering that for a long time and no one at Tesla seems to want to spill the beans. They say some canned/ rehearsed answer, but never tell me what I want to know. Anecdotally it seems the non-iron packs are good for a couple thousand cycles, and the LFP packs for double to triple that, but that is based loosely on what is publicly available for anecdotes and research papers. Real world range for a current Tesla Model Y could be about 300 miles/charge. 2000 cycles x 300 miles per cycle is 600k miles, or twice as long as the typical well-maintained ICEr gas vehicle. Factor in degredation and call it a bit less - 550K or even 500K miles and it's still going to last the average American motorist 33.3 years. Not too shabby. I have read that LFP cells last for between 5K and 15K cycles in the lab. Since the vehicles get less range overall - call it 250 miles/charge, that's 250 x 5K cycles or 1.25 million miles. On the high end it's 3.75 million miles per pack. Or 250 years for the average American motorist. That's not a typo - 250 year pack life. Even if that's off by a factor of 10, and it only lasts 25 years, that compares favorably to current ICErs that need to be completely overhauled/rebuilt after that amount of time.
Hi Andy, I wasn’t told anything about my Model LR when they dropped it off March 2022. I just realized today by watching your videos how to find the battery type. I have LFP but I’ve only been charging it to 80% since I’ve had it. Will this affect the battery life?
Thank you!! Very informative & interesting! I don't want the Cybertruck, I NEED the CYBERTRUCK. Lol. So I wonder if they will carry the new 4680s since it has the option of 1,2, & 3 motors? I subscribed!
I work at Tesla in Fremont and want to order a 4680 Performance Model Y from Texas!! Still not sure how this is going to work? Ordering in May for $ reasons.
@@Noogie-je4yy Nope. They are manufacturing those batteries in Texas. I doubt they will ship them to Fremont when they could just install them in the cars manufactured there, especially since they won't have that many batteries at first.
I too am hoping for the new 4680 in my LR Model Y, which was scheduled for delivery June 14th. It has now been rescheduled for August 14-October 14th. I live in SW Utah, which is definitely in the Fremont CA delivery zone. What do you think this delay means?
I live about 2 hrs from Fremont here in Cali and my Model 3 I just ordered last week has the same expected time frame. I thought being not that far from Fremont I might get it sooner but I guess not. The demand is so high right now, it’s hard to predict what factors are affecting delivery dates.
@@kerrie9479 Agreed! My original delivery date was June 14, 4 months from my order date. I ordered in late January. It seems they are pushing out the delivery dates of the non-performance models and those without FSD. I'm hoping with extra 3 months, my chances for the 4680 battery will improve, but its a great car either way and I'll be happy either way.
Don’t think the delivery distance really matters to them, they are just backlogged on making their cars due to such high demand and orders. Hope you get your cars soon!
Hi Andy et al, I have a model 3 2020. Does anyone know how far I can drive on a flat tire if 1 tire happens to go flat? I have michelin tires that came with the car. Thx!
Since Teslas do not come with runflat tires (nor a spare tire) from the factory, you should not drive on a flat tire. In the event of a flat, pull over to a safe area as soon as possible and call roadside assistance.
Great video, so if you order a Model Y now it says delivery date of Jan -Apr 2023 so does that mean these models will def have the new battery or will they still have the LFP or 2170's?
Watch next ➡ How to Set Up Your Tesla the RIGHT Way: th-cam.com/video/25NToLCPZf4/w-d-xo.html
🚘 BEST Tesla Accessories: geni.us/tm3accs
MUST-HAVE Tesla Accessories:
▶ 10% off Tesla Floor Mats: geni.us/uQBj (Use code: ANDYSLYE)
▶ Model 3/Y Screen Protector: geni.us/Akha
▶ Wireless Charging Pad/Hub: geni.us/Jeda
▶ Console Wrap: geni.us/x2AA788 (Use code: ANDYSLYE15)
▶ Magnetic Phone Mount: geni.us/xaowi
Tesla Cleaning Tools (Amazon)
▶ Waterless Wash/Wax: geni.us/yLqP7w
▶ Interior Cleaner: geni.us/uBxyl
▶ Dash Protectant Spray: geni.us/XPp9G
▶ Pressure Washer: geni.us/ZPDtW
Useful Tesla Accessories:
▶ Spare Tire (Amazon) geni.us/BJKK
▶ Replacement Tires: geni.us/33Txdp
▶ Frunk Luggage Set: geni.us/vwVM
▶ Stats App: geni.us/Stats
▶ Geeky Tesla shirts & prints: geni.us/SFSF
🎥 My TH-cam Camera Gear: geni.us/YTgear
Camera Gear I Use (Amazon)
▶ Main Camera: geni.us/GH5body
▶ Main Lens: geni.us/Lumix1235
▶ 4K Drone: geni.us/DJIM2
▶ Gimbal: geni.us/sJc7Bb
▶ Tripod: geni.us/BJSxkx
▶ Monopod: geni.us/mqNjTT
▶ Action Cam: geni.us/Hero9
▶ Camera Mount for Tesla: geni.us/60zs
▶ Microphone: geni.us/mics
💰 Get Free Bitcoin on CoinBase: geni.us/coinBase
⬇ Stay up to date!
TH-cam: geni.us/AndySlyeYT
Twitter: twitter.com/slye
Instagram: instagram.com/slye
Email: andy@mytechmethods.com
Does this mean one needs master or doctorate in commodity market to be able to own a tesla? 🤔😇 😊 some amusement
LFP doesn’t have memory, but it needs to be calibrated often to 100% because the voltage at 100% vs at 0% is basically the same. With other cells the voltage varies and that’s how you measure capacity remaining. When voltage doesn’t change, you don’t know the max or min capacity that accurately so charging to 100% often, at least once a week according to tesla keeps the BMS calibrated so the car doesn’t shut down unexpectedly.
Exactly. You "calibrate" the BMS, not the battery. 100% charging is not good for any battery regardless of chemistry. At least for now.
If the charged voltage and the discharged voltage was the same then it would never go flat ! I'm being a smart ass, I get your point. Also the on the charging of the LIP battery, Tesla state that the battery likes to be plugged in all the time. Always charge to 100%. I agree that this does not sound write but who would argue against Tesla..
Its quite possible that 100% is not actually at cell maximum anyway. A bit like saying the 18650 is 100% charged at 4.10v and not the specified 4.20v
@@marcusbiller867 not really. LFP cells can last 2-4x longer than nickel cells even if LFP is charged to 100%. If you look at the charge cycle data for LFP, there’s basically no difference between charging to 0-80 or 0-90 or 0-100 for longevity. For nickel cathode cells this matters a lot and it’s better to keep charge limit at 80% or lower.
sorry chaps but you are generally wrong. lfp should be fully charged once a week. because the individual cells can only be ballancrd at the higher voltages. no memory effect. The BMS will turn off the battery if individual cells get to low. So because they can only be balanced at high voltages they need to be fully charged once a week else the cells will get out of balance. Of course this is possible because they have lower cell voltages and do not degrade at full charge.
Harsimran Bansal. How is the LFP calibrated?
Hey Andy, I watch dozens of Tesla videos each week, and this is the first video where I’ve seen somebody try to comprehensively describe all of the different battery technologies that go into different Tesla vehicles. Even some of the best Tesla TH-camrs gloss over these types of distinctions, especially regarding the LFP batteries. Well done. This is one of the many reasons that we subscribe to your channel.
Most of the things, if not almost all of it, is wrong though, so you learned nothing. He is very bad with the technical part of these things.
Especially when he days LFPs have memory to simply plug in his sponsor. You as a viewer actually got dumber by that sentence alone...
My Australian LFP SR+ doesn’t exhibit less than normal retardation @100% SOC. And I can sleep well at night. We did 457 km on a return trip in mild weather this week and had 5% left over.
LFP for me !
Добрый
Yeah, without the cold weather concerns, EVs for Aus make even more sense (try telling boguns that though)
@@Octamed ahhh, well that’s the trumpian useful idiot era we now live in (via the internet and the Saint Petersburg FBI indicted IRA hacker mob.)
Thanks for your video. We just got our Model 3 and received a text from Tesla asking me to charge to 100% at least once a week. I must say I was intrigued by the text as I was under the impression that charging like that would degrade battery life. Your presentation explains a lot!
I have the 2022 RWD LFP 60KW and it’s very impressive I’m getting 275 miles plus. Even on short trips here in the still chilly UK I’m often getting under 200wh. Since my last charge it’s averaged 223. Astonishing really. It’s a 300 mile car I suspect in warmer climate and careful acceleration and limiting to 65mph.
Hi Andy. You missed to mention NCMA LG Chem batteries which Tesla is using on their 2021 3/Y Long Range models (at least the ones delivered in Europe). There are pluses and minuses but the NCMA has way less cobalt content compared with the Panasonic NCA and lower degradation (at least they claim so). Having said that, NCMA seem to be a good balance between NCA and LFP. Charging speed on NCMA was also somewhat lower (I have one of the first released models, made in US and received in December 2020) comparing with NCA but as of December 2021 they boost the speed on the LG pack so the gap is smaller now.
Everybody expects indeed the 4680 cells soon and will be interesting to see how will Tesla introduce them to the market.
My LFP 60kWh battery charged at 90kW at 80%, its amazing, you can charge 100% daily and have regen at 100% also. Im only seeing positives so far!
never imagined the lead acid storage battery when pushed aside would start a race in technology that is so fascinating and will change our lives so thoroughly. thanks for your report
It's important to make a distinction between battery chemistry (NCA, LFP, etc.) and form factor (18650, 2170, 4680, blade, prism, etc.). They are completely separate issues and should be addressed separately.
Exactly
Yes! 4680 isn't a different chemistry. He kept calling it the 3 different chemistrys. It's not. 4680 is either LFP or NCA. And for now it seems 4680s are only NCA as Tesla uses prismatic LFP batteries which are just that and not 18650 or 2170.
My guess about the new Model Y on the EPA list is as follows. The new Y is a SR+ from Fremont with less 2170 cells. This will allow Tesla to continue using Fremont for Model Y but give a price diff to the 4860 from Austin. With luck the Austin Model Y with 4680s will be a little lighter then the current long range and have a bit more range as well. Excited to see what happens at any rate.
Andy - no one has explained this so comprehensive and so clear than you have. Great job and thank you!
just wanted to add another 3 things about the LFP battery,
1) cold weather DC charging can be slow
2) when you are DC charging you don't want to go much above 80% because the charge speed slows down. 80% on a NCA battery is more range than 80% on a LFP battery.
3) LFP batteries are said to last 2-3x times longer than NCA, so if you are the type to buy and own a car for like 10years it might be worth to consider this
How do we get to decide which battery we get? When you place an order you get what you get. I’m still waiting on my model 3. Who knows what battery I’ll get.
Thank you for presenting facts and information on Tesla, not the usual hype and fanboy videos we see from other channels.
I am on the same boat as you. Had initial delivered August then moved to May and now back to Aug-Oct. FSD on order.
As someone who owns a P85+ for almost a year, this is some deep information. Thanks.
Just reserved a Model 3. I don’t think it’s right for them to put different batteries in cars and not allow you to choose especially if it may affect future resale value. Everyone is paying the same price and not receiving same batteries.
I'm thinking 279 mile Model Y is LFP chemistry in a structural pack (perhaps with BYD blade battery). My guess is they are also doing the 4680 out of Austin as well which will be the other one submitted to EPA but not yet released. My guess as well would be both of these are other variants of Model Y so delaying your order will not help... but perhaps you can have your order changed to the new variant. Very soon we will see the website updated if I am correct.
Thanks for this. I test drove a M3 LR yesterday and asked the rep about the rear wheel drive and if it would have the LFP battery. He had to call someone to find out. The answer was yes and to his credit he found out for me.
Its ability to charge at 100% makes it equivalent to a 300 mi battery car
@@BRBallin1 Yep that’s why I’m considering it.
These gas prices sent me over the edge. I’m buying a Model 3 sometime this year. $50 for a tank of gas in a Prius Prime is crap. That is old SUV price from 2005.
Prius 🤮
They increased the price on the Model 3 by $7k since I bought mine in April 2021. The gas prices should be the least of your concern. I bought it for the tech, the zero emissions, being quick yet quiet, and the red model 3 also looks really nice aesthetically. The gas savings were honestly an afterthought for me given all the other benefits it offers
LFP does degrade more quickly due to 100% charging. I can't believe how many times people get this wrong. Only reason you're told to go to 100% is so Tesla can get an accurate trip reading.
It's also to allow the battery management system to balance the cells in series, otherwise the charge carried by each cell may vary, reducing the battery capacity and range.
I drive a 2020 model 3 long range for business purposes. Put a little over 250k miles on it before the battery failed. I beat the hell out this battery, drove between 300 and 600 miles a day on a regular basis while mostly using superchargers to make my errands. I would regularly charge to 100% before leaving home and drive it down to 5-10% before supercharging. I'm getting a brand new battery and not a remanded one. I'm curious what/if there's any improvements in this new battery I'm waiting on. This time around, I'm going to only set it to 90% and never let it go under 15% and I'll see how much more range I'll get compared to my last one.
How much are you paying for the battery?
@@happyhippo1710 A little shy of $16k. I anticipated I would get at least 300,000 miles before I would need a new battery so I was 50,000 off. I'm sort of glad it happened when it did because current prices are locked in contract with tesla's suppliers but when those contracts expire, prices due to inflation are going to be up 20-30%. Had my battery lasted longer than it did, I would be paying much, much more for the battery replacement.
I own a 2021 model 3 sr+ and I love it. The current price is way too high for me. I got a deal compare to the ones that are for sale.
Hi Andy, great video. Thank you. If my delivery date is end of May (changed from Aug-Sept yesterday), how do I know whether my Y LR has 4680 battery or not? I agree with you if I can delay my delivery so that I can get the first 4680 batter, i would like to do that as well. How do I delay my delivery?? Any suggestions? Thank you Andy.
What is funny is that NiCad batteries which were the first commonly used battery had an issue with memory which caused the search for new technologies like Nickle Metal Hydride which had a bad habit of imploding for no apparent reason and releasing toxic fumes. We then went to a few other types that only lasted extremely short periods of time until we found Lithium Ion which of course didn't suffer from memory issues and were supposed to be the ultimate form of rechargeable tech until we found that it would develop dendrites which of course caused them to degrade. Next question is, if or what we will find wrong with LFP in the future once it is in widespread use.
@ANDY SLYE it does not seem as customers have the option of picking which battery we get when we place an order.
Andy, I have a date of April 22 - May 27 for a LR Model Y in Blue. I live in NY. I delayed the order once. I will take the next VIN they give me hoping its an Austin build with 4680's.
Hi Andy,
Many thanks for a really informative video.
I too have a Model Y Long Range on order that is due in September. I haven't seen any confirmation on whether Tesla has shipped any of these from Austin and whether they are equipped with 4680 batteries. Hope to hear something from Tesla to confirm that they are currently producing Model Y LR from Austin with the 4680 batteries. Please give us an update if you get any reliable information fron Tesla on this subject, not guesses.
Glad I subbed to this channel because I'm seriously considering buying a Model 3 for myself and this was useful information!
I have a LFP 2022 Model 3 coming in July/August - Can't wait!!!
We ordered the same car in November, and ours arrives next month :-)
How do you know which battery the car you ordered have? Does it tell you in your account?
@@bingli4927 All Model 3 RWD’s now have LFP.
@@Kermit26297 we got an order in for a long range AWD, are they LFP as well?
@@bingli4927 No, ONLY the RWD models get the LFP batteries. That’s the only real downside of the LR Dual-Motor (besides the higher price).
I am surprised you aren't listing the LG NMC battery pack that is going into the M3LR any time now. A pack that charges slower, has less discharge power and less capacity as well. This would have been essential to mention!
Also when you mention that the top 10% can't be used on daily charge with NCA packs, then you should also mention that the lower 4,5% are hidden below 0%. This capacity also needs to be subtracted from the claimed range as it is part of it.
I attempted to do exactly what you are with my Model Y performance order. Tesla cancelled my order. I had a surgery coming up and it has a long convalescence period where I would not be able to pick up or even drive the car. Tesla did not consider that to be sufficient for a delayed delivery. They also told me that I was not allowed to specify 4680 batteries. I simply have to take whatever they decide to ship to me. I'll be interested in hearing if they cancel your order as they did mine.
Pretty sure they do the same to all customers no matter who they are. If everyone would want the new generations battery, they will not sell their previous edition and it would be a mess.
My Tesla rep told me they are no longer allowing delays. You take your car when it's ready or lose your order. I had both a LR3 and LRY on order and was waiting to see what happened with tax incentives. Lost the LR3 order bc it was ready now and they wouldn't delay.
I hope they cancel any delay requests. You can’t both pay a substantially lower price and also expect latest tech. Tesla is a business not a mark.
@@invincibul I would have been willing to pay the price increase if they would have said it was required. I didn't get the option. They just closed my order and took my $250. That's just stupid. Over 20% margin on a 80,000 dollar purchase with FSD that has an even higher markup. They settled for a pissed off customer and $250. BRILLIANT!
@@bobdavis7192 They don't have the best training. If you were willing to pay the difference on the backend it would just be moving your order to the end of the line with upgraded specs. Pity they don't have the foresight to see that. Good luck on your car search
Thanks for your good coverage of Tesla. Great to see someone in Kentucky working at this level.
It will be interesting to see if the LFP in a Model Y has more range than the LFP RWD M3. Less energy dense so I have read that they are basically Full packs in the RWD M3 rather than a Scaled down NCA pack.
FYI - Tesla announced in the Q1 earnings call that Austin built Model Y use the new 4680 cells, and they don’t plan to make LFP versions of the 4680. Therefore the Austin cars don’t have LFP right now, and when Tesla adds an LFP option for the Model Y it will likely use CATL prismatic cells, like the RWD Model 3 does.
A very useful video, i will stick to my mazda cx5 until it is guaranteed the new battery is what we would get, I live in Europe so would have appreciated the analysis of the German Tesla factory as pertaining to the battery applications
Good luck on deferring your delivery. They kept changing my Model Y delivery and eventually wanted to deliver it in late December. I got them to defer to 2/1/22 but in mid January they said if I did not put myself back in line by January 27 they would refund my deposit. I ended up with a delivery of 2/10/22. Maybe due to your status with Tesla you will get preferential treatment but they were not accommodating to me. I wanted the car for April delivery when the weather is better and I did not have a pressing need for the car but Tesla didn’t care.
the LFP and 100% charge is really making me reconsider the M3 RWD. I've heard that second motor adds 400 lbs and really messes with the driving and handling. it loses the nimbleness of the single motor M3. Plus the RWD M3 is the only one remotely affordable for me right now. You have driven single and dual motors right? Whatcha think?
If you can't afford a dual motor model, don't even consider it. Extending yourself financially for any car is not worth it.
The LFP M3 RWD is the most efficient Tesla battery and motor combo in most conditions currently, and daily charge up to 100 percent is akin to a performance or long range model at 80 percent charge with an NCA battery.
If you're looking for long-term use, don't need the fastest charging speeds, and live in an area where all wheel drive isn't necessary, then the rear wheel drive LFP is a reasonable choice.
@michael h LFP can go through more battery drain and full recharge cycles without significant degradation. Time will tell how they hold up, however.
Are these batteries supposed to become standard for all Tesla vehicles soon?? I’d rather get a LR or performance than a rwd soon but the battery upgrade is huge
Great video! Lots of useful info.
I think there will be dual motors using lfp 4680 as well. My guess is they limited lfp 2170s to single motors because of it's discharge limitations but the 4680 will not have the same limitations. Lfp 4680 will probably be in every model and trim in the future until the next innovation.
Bought LFP batteries for my friends EV scooter (need to purchase a better charger with battery management system). Lighter weight will help me load the scooter into the trunk of my car. Hooray for LFP batteries. So can I purchase the 12v LFP battery for my 2019 M3?? And is it a good idea?
They are canceling orders if you delay or reject a vehicle. This wasn't enforced much in the past, but I've seen orders canceled after putting it on hold when they assign you a vehicle.
YES. Thank you! get to the back of the line.
Hi,
I bought a Tesla model y dual motor for my dad in November 2022. I've also have had a KIA EV6 since May 2022. Let me just come out and say it. The battery range of the model y is HORRIFIC. In fact, I'm due to go into Tesla this weekend as it really isn't adding up. Regardless of whether we precondition the battery or not, the Tesla loses battery life even when parked. I charged it 80% on a Sunday night, and after 4 days of driving (dad on average does 25 miles per day), we had to charge it on Thursday night as we knew that it wouldn't get him to work and home on Friday. He barely turns the heating on or heated seats, and yet the return on the so called range is horrific. Absolutely nothing compared to the KIA which actually gives you back miles thru the regen breaking. We will see what Tesla will say, but I'm so disappointed. One day I went on a long trip. Charged it full to 329 miles. By the time I had preconditioned the car, this had someone dropped to 315 just through the preconditioning.
My LFP Model 3 has what feels like full regen at 100%. It’s no different depending on SoC as far as I can tell.
I wouldn't rely on that if you're braking behind another vehicle.
I have a friend that recently picked up a model Y in the Bay Area that may have an LFP battery pack.He has the same charging window as a model 3 standard and an E as the seventh symbol on his vin number. Any thoughts?
Andy, I picked up my Model Y in late December, How can I tell which battery I have ? it was made in Austin
I commute my model 3 rwd with lfp 60mi daily im not able to complete two days without depleting my battery down to 10% daily. So my question is that is it okay or safe to charge my model 3 to 90% everyday?
Makes more sense that a new version of an existing vehicle like the SR+ will get a different batter (LFP or likely 4680). Otherwise you create a problem with order cancellations or postponements, fighting for a 4680 over 2170, and a logistical cutover nightmare. Guarantee Tesla won’t do something like that for it’s shareholders. I have a hard time seeing MYLR or MYPs come out with 4680s until all manufacturing facilities can accommodate and then sunset the 2170 models. They’re not going to make the same model with both batteries at the same time for a very long time, so you’ll probably see LR and P (probably P sooner with the less demand) with the 4680s when production and supply of the 4680 can accommodate the entire line at Fremont and Texas. Also, the Texas Y’s spotted in the lot on the trucks ETC are confirmed not performance. Likely SR+
Anyone has word about what the 2022 model 3 long range will have what battery?
Andy I have a 2023 model 3, how do I know which one I have? Neither of what you show looks like my screen :(
I think we’re in the same order batch or very close? I ordered my LR-7, blue, tow pkg on 10/27…. My delivery range changed about a week ago to 5/7-6/11 EDD. Delivery to Vegas. I was ecstatic when it got pushed back a month! 🤞🤞🤞
I have a 2022 M3 LR with the LG E5LD battery. If I understand correct this is still a NCA battery and it should not be charged at 100% for the daily trips?
You are the best of what you do. Lots of info I couldn't get elsewhere. Keep up the good work.
*Does anyone know when the 4680 Battery will come to the Model 3 cars?*
How are you going to delay your Y to then hope they upgrade you to a new one? You said you’re a couple weeks away, so you should have your VIN already, and I’m sure your car is already being built, so how would they upgrade you to the new one?
My delivery date is May 17-June 14 model Y performance. I hope I get 4680
Thanks for your simple explanation!! I was going to order a Tesla y performance but I’ll wait until January to make sure I get a 4680. I’m not a scientist so your explanation was really god
How are you able to delay delivery? I didn't get my delivery date until right after my VIN, so wouldn't I be unable to get a newer vehicle by changing the date because they'd just keep my same vehicle stored until that date?
The new Chinese RWD 60 LFP they are selling in the U.K. and Europe is pretty fantastic. Amazing efficiency and only about 30 miles difference to LR version. Also can be charged to 100%. Problem is they just put the price up by £3k! Still a lot cheaper than the LR though. Heat pump, double glazing, heated rear seats and steering wheel.
What about their network ability for catching fire, while not being able to put out the fire in reasonable time, like 2/3 days time?
Hey, thought I should mention LFP batteries do not have a memory.
I assume the reason they allow the charge to 100% is because their cycle life is 3000-5000 vs nmc which is ~1000.
No, the reason is the voltage. Because the BMS measures V difference to calculate SoC it needs to go to 100% to be able to calculate properly, because the V on LFPs is about 3.65% at the top and 3.45 at the bottom as opposed to 4.2V and 2.5V on NMC. Also, 1000 cycles (even if true, most likely more with BMS and cooling/heating) is about 300,000km for about 85% battery retaining. Do you expect to drive 300,000km?!
@@marcusbiller867 So, my experience with LFP is a DIY ~30kwh 16s2p (51.2V, 560ah). So I agree that the top voltage of LiFePO4 is ~3.65V, but I am not too sure where you got the 3.45V for the bottom? The nominal voltage of LiFePO4 is ~3.2v, and common bottom voltage is 2.8v (I believe u can go all the way to 2.5v though).
Most modern off grid systems know not to use voltage to calculate SoC, as the discharge curve for lifepo4 is so flat. Most systems use a smart shunt, to measure the amount of ah that have gone in and out of the battery, and use this to calculate SoC.
So my question is this: do we have any sources that show that Tesla uses strictly voltage to calculate the SoC? Personally, I don't think they do, because when under load the voltage sags, and you cannot get an accurate measurement until the battery is 100% at rest.
Im getting a new 85kw put in my 2013 model s. Because tesla doesnt make 85kw for the S anymore, my new battery is actually a 100kw that has been software reduced to 85
Best explanation I have seen. Good work.
It's possible create some sort of satellite internet access antenna for cable internet access ?
By postponing the delivery of your Model Y (if indeed you can still do that without Tesla cancelling your order), you might get a new type of battery. But, if the battery's size is such that the car's range is actually less, as suggested by the addition to the Fuel Economy website, then wouldn't it be better to have the older type of battery?
I have a MYP on order with a June 9 to July 21 delivery and as much as I'd like to see it ASAP would want to delay it if it doesn't come with the 4680 battery
How do I determine which battery is in 2022 Model Y Performance?
Thanks for the info Andy. As an engineer, Tesla's amazing "outside the box" thinking has had my interest for the past couple years. Recently, I've been watching for updates regarding giga Austin and the possibility of 4680 springing to life in the Y. I ordered MYLR a couple weeks ago with a September delivery as of now. I'm hoping as you are, to score the new mega-cast front and rear with a 4680 structural pack between. Question, if my delivery day comes and they are still not shipping 4680 equipped Ys, how do you "delay"??
Just text them and say you want to delay delivery.
@@bigswee693 Thanks for the feedback will. Guess I’ll have to wait and see what comes first.
They are canceling orders if you try to delay or reject the car. I've seen it happen multiple times now. It's all over the forums. Read your contract, because it's within their right to cancel orders if you don't accept within a number of days.
@@vanto4362 I had a Plaid S and delayed my order and it was not cancelled. They picked me in June, delayed it until September and received my order. I would just ask for confirmation that it will not be cancelled.
@@bigswee693 There was a policy change a couple months ago, delay at your own peril. It’s unfair that you get both a lower price and the latest tech. Those should be for people paying $10k over what you paid for.
So model x and model s has the best batteries? Thank you 🙏
We have a M Y DM LR on order with delivery in December thru March 23.
It's supposed to have the 2170 out of Freemont. However, with Austin expected to make M Y DM LR, I'm thinking it may be sooner. The announcement did say that Austin would be making 2170 and 4680.
Whatever the case, I can hardly wait.
Thanks for the info.
Bob
Since when can you pick the battery? I don’t see that on their site
Hi Andy, great battery tech info, thank you! I would like to purchase a 2023 Model S Plaid NOT a 2022, when should I place my order? The Tesla website states that if I place my order now I get a delivery date of July & Sept, 2022. I'm sure if I place it now I'll receive a 2022 model, so how much longer should I wait to place my order? Should I order in Sept then delay delivery? the only way I'll know if I'm getting a 2023 is when Tesla provides me with a VIN#.
Your help would be greatly appreciated!
Just ordered my Model Y, Pushing to delay also due to wanting the new setup. but not sure when we will get them in Europe. i do hear that German MY will be new battery too.
I read everywhere that the first ones from Giga-Berlin will NOT be 4680 (initially 2170, I guess). After a few months (6-8?) they plan to switch to 4680. The first ones from Giga-Texas will be 4680, however, with their 4680 cells having already been built in California (ready in inventory). Hopefully before that supply runs out, Giga-Texas will begin producing their own 4680 cells, and also get various other forms of batteries from LG, CATL, etc.. Currently, there is no such thing as a LFP 4680 (as the LFP are prismatic ingots rather than cylindrical cells), which might likely rule out a structural battery pack also. Check further to see what form of battery you will get from Giga-Berlin, as it depends on what exactly you ordered. (Maybe you'll want to delay your delivery if you're strongly wanting 4680's?) Good luck.
I ordered a Model X. Estimated delivery January 2023. I got a good chance to that new 4680 battery?
My 2021 battery is Made of NMC Lithium ion Battery. It has a Lithium-Nickel-Manganese-Cobalt-Oxide Battery Chemistry. Remember Some Model 3's and Y's still use this Battery Chemistry for their vehicles as well. If your VIN number has an E on the 7th Digit (going from left to right) Then you have a Lithium-Nickel-Manganese-Cobalt-Oxide battery.
I would, unless you need it, keep the car at 70%-80%, and really, even with a car like a SR+ RWD model 3, that has a range of about 250 (I think) you get MORE range that most people would use on a daily basis. Even when DC fast charging, RARELY do I go above 85-90% (I may fill it to 100 at the beginning of the trip if I have time but that's not DC fast charging, I do that on a Level 2, and Even on road trips I keep it at around 90-95% because it charges SO SLOW after 85%! (and the most I ever went between chargers is around 160 miles) Maybe once in a while I'll do the first leg around 200mi, but rarely. (Did that with my CCS cars too).
As for waiting... I would have prefer to get a 4860 Model Y, but I needed a car right away at the beginning of this year (2023) for work; since the price on Model Y was reduced (and the had a MOdel Y Performance that had less than 20 miles with a tow hitch available in my local area/inventory, I got it (may replace it in a year or two for the new battery pack, but for now, its astill a great car!). apparently Toyota engineers disassembled one to study it, and called it a work of art :)
Hoping to get 46 80 in my Y expected to deliver late this year. I am in California but they are making them in Austin Texas.
I took delivery of a MYP 2 weeks ago. The vehicle info page says Low Voltage Battery: Lithium Ion (but not LFP?). My Tesla advisor confirmed that is the same thing since it doesn't say NCA. But when I go to the vehicle charge screen it does say Daily-Trip not 50-100% which indicates non-LFP. Im so confused. All I want to make sure is whether I should charge to 80 for non-LFP or 100 for LFP really depending on which one? Thoughts?
MYP does not come with LFP currently. You have NCA.
Thank you Andy for a great review! I ordered a SR+ M3 last year set to be delivered this month of March buy Tesla move the delivery date to June! Does this mean I will get a 2022 M3 with LFP battery?
@3m45s An easier way to check if your Model 3 (or Shanghai RWD Model Y) is LFP vs NCA - what’s the 7th character in the VIN? E is NCA, F is LFP.
Thoughts on leaving a Model Y plugged in for 3 weeks while on vacation? Leave it unplugged? Interested in knowing your take.
Cheers!
Always leave it plugged in when it’s sitting at home 👍
@@aslye You’re the man! Thanks.
Hey Andy
For 2021 standard , do you happen to know what kind the battery is?
Wow, fantastic video with knowledge I must have to assist in my decision. I'm looking at a Model 3 Performance but I feel I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place as the lease on my current vehicle runs out the first week of November. If I make the order and is ready for delivery before the end of my lease, I can't/don't want to be paying on 2 cars at the same time but as I also work at a hospital, I cannot afford to be without a car... I have to be ready at a moment's notice! I am stuck in quite the quandary. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!
Buy the car at the end of the lease. Then sell it at a profit when your new car is ready.
@@SpressoX3 Thanks for the input! I have thought about and mulled over that scenario much. With the way Tesla keeps increasing their prices, I didn't know if it would be a good idea to order now and lock in at a potentially lesser price. But then again, I have been bit by the new car bug and I'm jonesing for the Model 3 Performance pretty bad! Hahaha
You say that the 4680 cell is a “different chemistry” and I don’t think that’s true. You also distinguish between the “three battery types” by chemistry for the first two.
Elon has already spoken about how the nickel based or iron based chemistries go into the 4680 cells. So the 4680 is simply a new form factor and manufacturing process right now. Yes it may facilitate better heat dissipation and current flow due to the physical design. But right now we only know that the existing chemistries will be inside these cells.
4680 is not a “new chemistry” as yet.
This was super helpful. Thank you
Hopefully EVs will be further along in 5 years. Just bought a 2022 Blazer and I’m eyeing a Cybertruck or the the teased Chevy Blazer SS.
What's the cycle life rating of each chemistry? I have been wondering that for a long time and no one at Tesla seems to want to spill the beans. They say some canned/ rehearsed answer, but never tell me what I want to know. Anecdotally it seems the non-iron packs are good for a couple thousand cycles, and the LFP packs for double to triple that, but that is based loosely on what is publicly available for anecdotes and research papers.
Real world range for a current Tesla Model Y could be about 300 miles/charge. 2000 cycles x 300 miles per cycle is 600k miles, or twice as long as the typical well-maintained ICEr gas vehicle. Factor in degredation and call it a bit less - 550K or even 500K miles and it's still going to last the average American motorist 33.3 years. Not too shabby.
I have read that LFP cells last for between 5K and 15K cycles in the lab. Since the vehicles get less range overall - call it 250 miles/charge, that's 250 x 5K cycles or 1.25 million miles. On the high end it's 3.75 million miles per pack. Or 250 years for the average American motorist. That's not a typo - 250 year pack life. Even if that's off by a factor of 10, and it only lasts 25 years, that compares favorably to current ICErs that need to be completely overhauled/rebuilt after that amount of time.
So what's the formula for US cars?
Y Performance = ? battery type
Y long range = ? battery type
The 4680 battery is NMC chemistry, so it may become pricey as the cathode is about 81% nickel.
Hi Andy, I wasn’t told anything about my Model LR when they dropped it off March 2022. I just realized today by watching your videos how to find the battery type. I have LFP but I’ve only been charging it to 80% since I’ve had it. Will this affect the battery life?
It will. Start doing 100% most days
Hi! I just got my Tesla. Help pls. How do you do navigation like 4:33 and 4:38?
Thank you!! Very informative & interesting! I don't want the Cybertruck, I NEED the CYBERTRUCK. Lol. So I wonder if they will carry the new 4680s since it has the option of 1,2, & 3 motors? I subscribed!
I plan to delay mine also. Thank you for keeping us posted...
You said 4680 describes the size of the battery, but does it also define the chemistry? Why couldn't LFP batteries be produced in the 4680 size?
I work at Tesla in Fremont and want to order a 4680 Performance Model Y from Texas!! Still not sure how this is going to work? Ordering in May for $ reasons.
I live in Los Angeles and have a model Y long range coming in June. Any chance Fremont will be making them with 4680s by then?
@@Noogie-je4yy Nope. They are manufacturing those batteries in Texas. I doubt they will ship them to Fremont when they could just install them in the cars manufactured there, especially since they won't have that many batteries at first.
I too am hoping for the new 4680 in my LR Model Y, which was scheduled for delivery June 14th. It has now been rescheduled for August 14-October 14th. I live in SW Utah, which is definitely in the Fremont CA delivery zone. What do you think this delay means?
I live about 2 hrs from Fremont here in Cali and my Model 3 I just ordered last week has the same expected time frame. I thought being not that far from Fremont I might get it sooner but I guess not. The demand is so high right now, it’s hard to predict what factors are affecting delivery dates.
@@kerrie9479 Agreed! My original delivery date was June 14, 4 months from my order date. I ordered in late January. It seems they are pushing out the delivery dates of the non-performance models and those without FSD. I'm hoping with extra 3 months, my chances for the 4680 battery will improve, but its a great car either way and I'll be happy either way.
Don’t think the delivery distance really matters to them, they are just backlogged on making their cars due to such high demand and orders. Hope you get your cars soon!
Hello Andy, when is Tesla going to reach the territory of Lebanon and with what models? Thank you
Hi Andy et al, I have a model 3 2020. Does anyone know how far I can drive on a flat tire if 1 tire happens to go flat? I have michelin tires that came with the car. Thx!
Since Teslas do not come with runflat tires (nor a spare tire) from the factory, you should not drive on a flat tire. In the event of a flat, pull over to a safe area as soon as possible and call roadside assistance.
Great video, so if you order a Model Y now it says delivery date of Jan -Apr 2023 so does that mean these models will def have the new battery or will they still have the LFP or 2170's?