Cruiser not a race car, agree! But why the cookie cutter route. New line up -> M550i plug in hybrid with electric range & M5 with turbo electric (Porsche) set up.
But the M5 and 911 a two very different cars. One is a mid-size luxury sedan and the other one is a sports coupe so it has to be as light as possible. That's why only the 911 got this treatment or else the Panamera Turbo E-hybrid would have T hybrid too, but it doesn't because its main focus is on luxury, everything else is a bonus. BMW could use this kind of hybrid system on cars like the next generation M3 or M2.
@@bongamagagula8397 I can see where your coming from on this but in reality that philosophy doesn’t apply. We live in a world where we have 800hp SUV’s. They were never designed to be “sporty” but non-the-less we have them, and some of them are very good. To say that the m5 is luxury over sport is somewhat true, but then why do we have the m5cs if the engineers behind that car didn’t think it was just a luxury car. The platform is a very capable chassis that also incorporates amazing refinement. But just because it’s a luxury sports sedan does not mean bmw should stop innovating and limiting their lineup. Why shouldn’t we have a V8 sports sedan that’s very much as capable as the 3series.
@@abdulnashef3473 the G90 M5 has just been revealed. Who said BMW make powerful versions in the future?... I know they won't be as light as the F90 M5 CS but they will be lighter and probably more powerful than the standard M5. The V8 produces 585hp plus the 197hp from the electric motor, they can still take it up to 625hp for the CS version if they do make one.
@@bongamagagula8397 More power isn’t the issue. If we take a look at the XM we could only assume that the label red version will come to the M5 soon enough in one form or another. Still think what I said prev holds.
As a G90 hater I have to say this is actually a valid video. I think the fact that the M5 was never advertised as a light car is the best argument made for the new M5. But this doesn't help the fact that the F90 looks way better. Im just glad that they didnt go for the hideous M3/M4/XM designs.
@KeltonKozlowski your videos are very well put together now. But you need to add at least 2 types of car type memorabilia. That will make your background more interesting when your talking on screen from the views perspective. That's the only thing missing for now. I wanna see your channel get up there in the subs.
Cool, the M5's weight is excusable. But the design, the performance compared to the F90, and complete miss of being a continuation of the F90 generation are still there.
But that’s not everyone’s opinion. I love the design, couldn’t be better in my eyes. I have to admit I loved the G80 M3 as well when I first saw it 😂🤷🏽♂️ The performance doesn’t bother anyone as we speak about 0.2sec and when it comes to 80-100km/h it’s 0.1sec faster than the M5CS 🤷🏽♂️ Wait for the first tests and we will see that it doesn’t need more than 3.2sec or even less
@@Cars-k8e I also like the G80/82s design, but at the same time, there was nothing like it. For this G90, half the BMW line-up has the same headlights and design language, so the M5 just looks like a shorter, fatter version. Just not good to a large majority of people.
@@Cars-k8e really?? That's kind of surprising, but if that's the case then I guess what BMW did is excusable. Must be more tailored for the European market because I think in general they've been shifting their design team and it's been mainly negative in the spheres I'm in.
In Europe they are far ahead of Audi and Mercedes. They are breaking every record in regards of numbers right now. I wasn’t a big fan of BMW and was thinking about an RS6 again but at the end I ordered now the M5. I also have to say it’s also of course because the M5 is just 60k cheaper
I disagree with this take for a number of reasons: 1) power to weight ratio is worse, if they were increasing weight, they could have increased power proportionately or more. 2) it’s close to a Tesla model x plaid in weight which has a huge battery and 3 electric motors. BMW needed to find a a way to make that hybrid system more weight-conscious 3) the v8 outputs less hp than before!? 4) Chevy with the zr1 has shown that a stock v8 from a non-hyper car can generate over 1,000hp, yet bmw with a v8 + electric motor can’t do even 75% of that. Solution: massive increase to m5’s V8 power was needed, more powerful electric motor, more weight conscious hybrid system.
Appreciate the response. My take: 1. Power to weight is important, but not everything. That metric only considers peak power. Power over the whole curve matters too 2. Agreed 3. Might be looking at the last gen comp or CS. Base for base G90’s V8 is not less powerful than F90 4. ZR1 will not be sold in Europe. 0% the ZR1’s engine would meet EU standards
@@KeltonKozlowski fair enough, power curve does matter, but more peak and better curve should have been the standard. In canada, the base f90 did 600hp whereas the m5 cs did 627hp, the g90’s 585hp is not only less than the cs, but also less than the base which is regressive in that regard. The weight issue remains, shouldn’t be close to a model X weight as just a hybrid. And fair point with the zr1, I didn’t consider that.
And still it’s 0.1sec faster from 80-100km/h as the M5CS Who can notice if it’s 3.3 or 3.5sec at the end? Also who will launch his car all the time. If you ask me I owned a G80 M3 which also needs 3.5sec 0-100 does that only with launch. Without a launch you need probably 4sec as there is nothing happening in the beginning
@@Cars-k8e based on what I’ve seen online, their 0-200km/h speedo is as follows: F90 comp = 10.3 sec F90 cs = 9.6 G90 = 10.0 Overall, I don’t anticipate this will feel any slower than the last gen m5, however, it doesn’t appear to be any faster either :/
I, myself very happy M5 is hybrid. I wanna get one, and don't want to pay the extra gas for 8 cylinder year round. This is really the best of both worlds. People should care more about the environment. Good for BMW
Mercedes can shut down the AMG brand. The V8 was the cornerstone of this brand. With that one gone AMG has no positioning anymore. BMW M knows that well that's why they still put the V8 into the M5
In an interview on bmwblog I think, the M ceo said that they didn’t even consider doing anything other than the V8 & just knew it needed to be a PHEV for emissions. People are going to complain regardless.
For me, the G80 was the first car I bought from BMW, as I loved the design from the beginning. The grill was awesome,since I saw it,I was in love. Same with this M5, for me it’s the best looking M5 ever, there is nothing I would want to change to be honest. Who the hell cares if it needs 3.3sec or 3.5sec as I wouldn’t feel 0.2sec anyway… also between 80km/h and 120km/h it’s 0.1sec faster than the M5CS 🤷🏽♂️ I am so glad they kept the V8 and mad it a plug in hybrid. That saved me 55.000€ in taxes (just because it’s a plug in hybrid) Keep in mind that in 10 years from now, you will not be allowed to register a new car with combustion engine anymore in the EU. Means they have to lower their emissions from present to 2030 by 55%, and there is no way to achieve that with mild hybrid syste. it’s just not enough to reach this target And if they won’t reach this target they have, it will cost them hundreds of millions. So I think it’s understandable why they did it
Removing the handling characteristics involving weight, bmw can overcome that with clever engineering. Just look at the new m3/4/2. I've got the new m2 and it deals with it well, you not even realise. But, weight is weight and there are issues that no engineering can overcome ie wear and tear. You'll go through tires quicker and fuel quicker, simple as that.
I agree with certain points but also disagree with a lot of points strongly. Emission regulations choking the manufacturers creative process is understandable, yet no buyer is gonna think: "Oh well, they did their best I might aswell buy it." No they're gonna go to the former generations or a whole other line of car. Meaning that just because BMW had their hand forced doesn't mean the car is accaptable in a buyers perpective, just like the new C63 AMG. I also disagree with what your perception of the M5's buyers demographic is. I'd say its more comparable to a Dodge Challanger with a high trim then a "Luxary preformance car". I know technically that term is correct but its phrased as a Bentley continental GT would be, which the BMW M5 just isn't. M8 or M6 would fit that bill way better. M5 is the supercar killer of a comfortable Sedan, It always has been. It is not a weekend cruiser its a true driving experience in a full car package. That's why when you add weight to the car it just becomes a tame car with high stats on the brochure. The BMW M5 may not be a track monster now a days but certainly has it never been a fancy daily GT car. They just missed the mark on what M5 buyers actually want from the car completely, and If that's because of their weird design language now a days or restrictions is irrelevant. Also I'll have to disagree with you on the looks of the car too, I thought the M3 and M2 looked wonky at first but they turned out to look really nice once they set in, Apart from a few features. The M5 just looks unimaginative, plain and weirdly proportioned especially in the front.
In my opinion this M5 is the best looking M5 they ever built. I had my M3 G80 for 7 months and used it as my daily, means I drove around 20.000 miles on it. The M3 looked great but was just a little too small for me, so I changed it and ordered now the new M5 which is sold out. There isn’t even a confirmation date yet but the car is likely to arrive around April 2025. I will use this M5 as my daily as well and I think people will love it at the end… but that’s my humble opinion
Weight isn't the issue here, the new Porsche Panamera Turbo S E-hybrid just broke the record for the fastest production sedan in the Nurburgring Nordschleife and it weighs 2.4t. No one has really driven the new M5 to the core determine whether it's improved or not. This will all come down to how the car puts its power down and knowing BMW, this will be one hell of a machine. The car was tested for more than a year and I doubt that it won't deliver.
I agree the design has really grown on me (especially the M5 in that green). However, I also grown to like the G80 M3 especially with the ADRO front bumper replacement. M2 and 7 series are trash I agree
At this point, they could have just upgraded their i5 M60 and it would have been lighter. Weight is absolutely the enemy of performance, wearables, feel and feedback, even luxury, no two ways around it. And what is wrong with them, this looks hideous. They went through all this trouble to keep the V8 but it just can't be heard. What can be heard is fake sound through speakers, which is despicable in any car let alone a performance or performance oriented car.
The new M5 is VERY HEAVY bla bla bla. Of course BMW can build an M5 under 2000kg and with 700-800hp but the last one had 257gr CO2/km with 700-800hp is close to 300gr CO2/km. It's impossible to sell it in Europe. And let's not forget that 300gr is during tests,in real world it's way more
Cruiser not a race car, agree! But why the cookie cutter route. New line up -> M550i plug in hybrid with electric range & M5 with turbo electric (Porsche) set up.
This would be interesting 🤔
But the M5 and 911 a two very different cars. One is a mid-size luxury sedan and the other one is a sports coupe so it has to be as light as possible. That's why only the 911 got this treatment or else the Panamera Turbo E-hybrid would have T hybrid too, but it doesn't because its main focus is on luxury, everything else is a bonus. BMW could use this kind of hybrid system on cars like the next generation M3 or M2.
@@bongamagagula8397 I can see where your coming from on this but in reality that philosophy doesn’t apply. We live in a world where we have 800hp SUV’s. They were never designed to be “sporty” but non-the-less we have them, and some of them are very good. To say that the m5 is luxury over sport is somewhat true, but then why do we have the m5cs if the engineers behind that car didn’t think it was just a luxury car. The platform is a very capable chassis that also incorporates amazing refinement. But just because it’s a luxury sports sedan does not mean bmw should stop innovating and limiting their lineup. Why shouldn’t we have a V8 sports sedan that’s very much as capable as the 3series.
@@abdulnashef3473 the G90 M5 has just been revealed. Who said BMW make powerful versions in the future?... I know they won't be as light as the F90 M5 CS but they will be lighter and probably more powerful than the standard M5. The V8 produces 585hp plus the 197hp from the electric motor, they can still take it up to 625hp for the CS version if they do make one.
@@bongamagagula8397 More power isn’t the issue. If we take a look at the XM we could only assume that the label red version will come to the M5 soon enough in one form or another. Still think what I said prev holds.
As a G90 hater I have to say this is actually a valid video. I think the fact that the M5 was never advertised as a light car is the best argument made for the new M5.
But this doesn't help the fact that the F90 looks way better. Im just glad that they didnt go for the hideous M3/M4/XM designs.
Appreciate that! And I agree the F90 is still the better looking car
the m4 and m3 actually look good just the m5 and xm look wierd
F90 is a great looking car, new one is disgusting
The M5 is a power cruiser, not a race car
Summarized the video in one comment🙌
@KeltonKozlowski your videos are very well put together now. But you need to add at least 2 types of car type memorabilia. That will make your background more interesting when your talking on screen from the views perspective. That's the only thing missing for now. I wanna see your channel get up there in the subs.
Tell the E60 that….
@@Dave_dave69 The E61 did exactly that
Cool, the M5's weight is excusable. But the design, the performance compared to the F90, and complete miss of being a continuation of the F90 generation are still there.
But that’s not everyone’s opinion. I love the design, couldn’t be better in my eyes. I have to admit I loved the G80 M3 as well when I first saw it 😂🤷🏽♂️
The performance doesn’t bother anyone as we speak about 0.2sec and when it comes to 80-100km/h it’s 0.1sec faster than the M5CS 🤷🏽♂️
Wait for the first tests and we will see that it doesn’t need more than 3.2sec or even less
@@Cars-k8e I also like the G80/82s design, but at the same time, there was nothing like it. For this G90, half the BMW line-up has the same headlights and design language, so the M5 just looks like a shorter, fatter version. Just not good to a large majority of people.
Yes I understand you. I though think that we see it different in Europe as I haven’t heard anything negative about it looks yet at all
@@Cars-k8e really?? That's kind of surprising, but if that's the case then I guess what BMW did is excusable. Must be more tailored for the European market because I think in general they've been shifting their design team and it's been mainly negative in the spheres I'm in.
In Europe they are far ahead of Audi and Mercedes.
They are breaking every record in regards of numbers right now.
I wasn’t a big fan of BMW and was thinking about an RS6 again but at the end I ordered now the M5. I also have to say it’s also of course because the M5 is just 60k cheaper
I disagree with this take for a number of reasons:
1) power to weight ratio is worse, if they were increasing weight, they could have increased power proportionately or more.
2) it’s close to a Tesla model x plaid in weight which has a huge battery and 3 electric motors. BMW needed to find a a way to make that hybrid system more weight-conscious
3) the v8 outputs less hp than before!?
4) Chevy with the zr1 has shown that a stock v8 from a non-hyper car can generate over 1,000hp, yet bmw with a v8 + electric motor can’t do even 75% of that.
Solution: massive increase to m5’s V8 power was needed, more powerful electric motor, more weight conscious hybrid system.
Appreciate the response. My take:
1. Power to weight is important, but not everything. That metric only considers peak power. Power over the whole curve matters too
2. Agreed
3. Might be looking at the last gen comp or CS. Base for base G90’s V8 is not less powerful than F90
4. ZR1 will not be sold in Europe. 0% the ZR1’s engine would meet EU standards
@@KeltonKozlowski fair enough, power curve does matter, but more peak and better curve should have been the standard.
In canada, the base f90 did 600hp whereas the m5 cs did 627hp, the g90’s 585hp is not only less than the cs, but also less than the base which is regressive in that regard.
The weight issue remains, shouldn’t be close to a model X weight as just a hybrid.
And fair point with the zr1, I didn’t consider that.
And still it’s 0.1sec faster from 80-100km/h as the M5CS
Who can notice if it’s 3.3 or 3.5sec at the end? Also who will launch his car all the time. If you ask me I owned a G80 M3 which also needs 3.5sec 0-100 does that only with launch. Without a launch you need probably 4sec as there is nothing happening in the beginning
@@Cars-k8e based on what I’ve seen online, their 0-200km/h speedo is as follows:
F90 comp = 10.3 sec
F90 cs = 9.6
G90 = 10.0
Overall, I don’t anticipate this will feel any slower than the last gen m5, however, it doesn’t appear to be any faster either :/
I guess so too, it will feel more or less the same…
I, myself very happy M5 is hybrid. I wanna get one, and don't want to pay the extra gas for 8 cylinder year round. This is really the best of both worlds. People should care more about the environment. Good for BMW
Mercedes can shut down the AMG brand. The V8 was the cornerstone of this brand. With that one gone AMG has no positioning anymore. BMW M knows that well that's why they still put the V8 into the M5
In an interview on bmwblog I think, the M ceo said that they didn’t even consider doing anything other than the V8 & just knew it needed to be a PHEV for emissions. People are going to complain regardless.
Yes. Your 100% right.
Problem with this power train is they could have made it fully electric and it would have made it lighter and faster.
That would be absolutely horrible
They already made it, it's called the i5 M60 and it has 601hp,820nm and it weighs 2305kg.
Fully electric would be slower in the type of driving the M5 is made for. Which is cross continental touring.
I actually want to see M3 with hybrid as well, as that would be cheaper and I don't need the crazy acceleration
When did you drive it?
For me, the G80 was the first car I bought from BMW, as I loved the design from the beginning. The grill was awesome,since I saw it,I was in love. Same with this M5, for me it’s the best looking M5 ever, there is nothing I would want to change to be honest.
Who the hell cares if it needs 3.3sec or 3.5sec as I wouldn’t feel 0.2sec anyway… also between 80km/h and 120km/h it’s 0.1sec faster than the M5CS 🤷🏽♂️
I am so glad they kept the V8 and mad it a plug in hybrid. That saved me 55.000€ in taxes (just because it’s a plug in hybrid)
Keep in mind that in 10 years from now, you will not be allowed to register a new car with combustion engine anymore in the EU.
Means they have to lower their emissions from present to 2030 by 55%, and there is no way to achieve that with mild hybrid syste. it’s just not enough to reach this target
And if they won’t reach this target they have, it will cost them hundreds of millions.
So I think it’s understandable why they did it
Removing the handling characteristics involving weight, bmw can overcome that with clever engineering. Just look at the new m3/4/2. I've got the new m2 and it deals with it well, you not even realise. But, weight is weight and there are issues that no engineering can overcome ie wear and tear. You'll go through tires quicker and fuel quicker, simple as that.
But it still weighs more than H1...
Yes and no. The Hummer H1 is now is called Hummer EV and it weighs 4500kg
I agree with certain points but also disagree with a lot of points strongly. Emission regulations choking the manufacturers creative process is understandable, yet no buyer is gonna think: "Oh well, they did their best I might aswell buy it." No they're gonna go to the former generations or a whole other line of car. Meaning that just because BMW had their hand forced doesn't mean the car is accaptable in a buyers perpective, just like the new C63 AMG. I also disagree with what your perception of the M5's buyers demographic is. I'd say its more comparable to a Dodge Challanger with a high trim then a "Luxary preformance car". I know technically that term is correct but its phrased as a Bentley continental GT would be, which the BMW M5 just isn't. M8 or M6 would fit that bill way better. M5 is the supercar killer of a comfortable Sedan, It always has been. It is not a weekend cruiser its a true driving experience in a full car package. That's why when you add weight to the car it just becomes a tame car with high stats on the brochure. The BMW M5 may not be a track monster now a days but certainly has it never been a fancy daily GT car. They just missed the mark on what M5 buyers actually want from the car completely, and If that's because of their weird design language now a days or restrictions is irrelevant. Also I'll have to disagree with you on the looks of the car too, I thought the M3 and M2 looked wonky at first but they turned out to look really nice once they set in, Apart from a few features. The M5 just looks unimaginative, plain and weirdly proportioned especially in the front.
I respect it
In my opinion this M5 is the best looking M5 they ever built.
I had my M3 G80 for 7 months and used it as my daily, means I drove around 20.000 miles on it.
The M3 looked great but was just a little too small for me, so I changed it and ordered now the new M5 which is sold out. There isn’t even a confirmation date yet but the car is likely to arrive around April 2025.
I will use this M5 as my daily as well and I think people will love it at the end… but that’s my humble opinion
Weight isn't the issue here, the new Porsche Panamera Turbo S E-hybrid just broke the record for the fastest production sedan in the Nurburgring Nordschleife and it weighs 2.4t. No one has really driven the new M5 to the core determine whether it's improved or not. This will all come down to how the car puts its power down and knowing BMW, this will be one hell of a machine. The car was tested for more than a year and I doubt that it won't deliver.
I agree the design has really grown on me (especially the M5 in that green). However, I also grown to like the G80 M3 especially with the ADRO front bumper replacement. M2 and 7 series are trash I agree
F90 m5 cs is the greatest bmw ever by far
Well said
Yes, thanks you. 👏
Pls don't shoot in hdr 😢
Why not? I know nothing about videography
At this point, they could have just upgraded their i5 M60 and it would have been lighter. Weight is absolutely the enemy of performance, wearables, feel and feedback, even luxury, no two ways around it.
And what is wrong with them, this looks hideous.
They went through all this trouble to keep the V8 but it just can't be heard. What can be heard is fake sound through speakers, which is despicable in any car let alone a performance or performance oriented car.
First step: have the money to get an m5
Second step: you don’t
how did audi have a choice not to hydbridise their 2025 rs6, rs7, sq8, rsq8?
useless to argue something without doing a test drive at the wheel. that extra weight is a big NO. it cannot be as nimble. physics
The M5 has never been a nimble car. Get the M3 if that's what you're looking for.
@@volundrfrey896 Did you ever drive M5 CS? From that no inline 6? No, thank you. BMW shed a lot of fanboys now
why are we wrong , "sport" car that is heavyer than house, please... 😅😅
nah, its awful
The new M5 is VERY HEAVY bla bla bla. Of course BMW can build an M5 under 2000kg and with 700-800hp but the last one had 257gr CO2/km with 700-800hp is close to 300gr CO2/km. It's impossible to sell it in Europe. And let's not forget that 300gr is during tests,in real world it's way more