Why is the Porsche 718 generation Cayman / Boxster a sales flop?
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 18 มี.ค. 2019
- The Porsche 718 Cayman & Boxster models are not selling well, I look at the possible reasons why. Also an update on my personal 911 issues.
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Every time I get a loaner car from the dealer, they tell me no smoking and NO pets, so what's Tui doing in all your rentals
I live by my own rules, and I let Tui smoke in all our loaners cars.
Kenny Marlin Tui can do whatever the fuck he wants in the car after what Porsche have put this guy through
Kenny Marlin you buy a $130k car and it’s a lemon, you treat the rental how you want
Not to mention cocaine.
I think Tui should be able to bring any pet he wants, even Nick...
The sound of the 4 cylinder. Still sounds nothing like the older 6. In a convertible, sound is important.
So Electric cars, Super Cars. What will you say then? don't like the fake sound system?
I have a 981 S with sport exhaust. They gave me a 718 as a loaner one time, I had zero interest in it. Yes it was faster, but the sound o the 981 really makes for an amazing driving experience.
Devon Regan I agree. I had 2015 Cayman which I had to trade for Macan Turbo (baby girl was born). I got 718 S as a loaner, and I could not take the 4 cylinder sound. I would look for preowned Cayman/Boxter with a flat six.
@@dafrasier1 That's very different, EVs serve a very different purpose compared to a 2 seater coupe/convertible. When it comes to electric supercars, those are made to BE electric supercars, so people interested in it are looking for an EV supercar. People looking for a Boxster or Cayman aren't looking for an EV sportscar, and they aren't looking for something that doesn't sound pleasant either. Honestly, if they made the 718 a hybrid, with a flat 6 engine, I'd bet it would sell a lot better. Good fuel economy, and great sound from the engine.
@@dafrasier1 Good question. I don't know what I'd say. For now I just wouldn't buy one. Not for this purpose anyway. As a family car, yes electric would be fine. And ironically as a track weapon electric could be great. But for top down driving, it's tough to beat the howl of a naturally aspirated flat 6. Someday there might not be a choice but to buy electric. And who knows, maybe sound systems will be so good I won't mind. Could be fun. "Let's see, what will it be today...flat 6...Columbo V12...Ford 427...Merlin?". All at the press of a button. I'm pretty sure though there won't be a button saying "718 flat 4". Until then I'll stick with what I have and hope for tunnels, canyons and long overpasses to drive through.
If Porsche are watching this. They need to do the right thing and sort you out a proper deal Nick. You're a fantastic ambassador form the brand. Your videos always show the cars in a good light. So come on Porsche. Sort the job out.
Yeah he's sold a lot of Porsches to people, enough to merit a free 911 alone, but after two lemon 911s, he needs to be upgraded to something like a GT3RS or Turbo S free of charge.
I’d love to see that and agree he deserves it. Porsche is likely thinking that they should too but if they do everyone else who has a problem with their car will expect to get the same deal. Still, they need to build him a new one.
well said. That's exactly what I was thinking.
Porsche is owned by VW. What made you think VW cares what people think? After probably the biggest scandal in the auto history people are still buying cars made by VW, a lot of cars. Too many people never learn...
Hahhahaha you don't know Porsche. Do you know how long his issue had been?
At 48, I never knew Cayman was a young demo. I got one just cause I loved the enthusiast feeling
I bought the 2017 boxter 718 my first Porsche. I drove 6 or 7 911's new and used and decided I could not live without the turbo. All the you tube and other reviews ppl didn't like the car because of "the sound" If you live in a urban or suburban area it is very difficult to punch the 911 with no turbo. Ppl give this car thumbs up almost everyday. I'm a happy camper.
When people ask me why I got a 2016 981 instead of a 718 I just say it's for the engine note. Really, I didn't have money for a 718. But shhh.
You did the right thing. The 981 Cayman, especially the GTS, is just perfection.
911 owners will always knock on Boxster S/Cayman S owners.
Boxster S owners to always knock on Boxster base owners.
Cayenne owners will always knock on Macan owners.
Ford owners will always knock on Chevy owners.
You cannot win.
I could have bought a 718, but I'm so glad I got 981 instead
I think you did the right thing as well. I purchased mine because the 981 to me was perfect in every respect. Plus I never buy the first of any model, I always like them to have a few years to sort things out. But its very highly possible that our 981's will end up more valuable in the long run being the last of the NA flat 6's
@Kyle Cronin Couldn't agree more. I love my 981 Cayman. Base model, dark blue (like Nick's loaner), 6 speed manual, Sport Chrono. I drive it as my daily, and I can't believe my good fortune every time I drive off in it. 2nd to 3rd upshift at full chat with no lift is automotive heaven. Sounds like an baritone version of an F1 car of 7 years ago.
Am I the only one who half expected Nick to just floor it and drive straight into the sea with the music still playing as a protest over how long his 911 is taking to get fixed?
Bugatti style
Nick & Tui? as Thelma & Louise?? - nah...
same...
I was thinking the same thing! For sure.. I thought he was going to drive down the boat ramp!
To be quite honest, I quite like the sound of the 4-cylinder in the Cayman. It can't beat the 6-cylinder of the older generations, but I still do like it.
It's 100% because of that 4 cylinder engine..
and the horrrible sound it makes
Bowan Anderton the new 992 doesn’t have a good sound making engine, so I don’t know what you are talking about.
@@neitherlink6612it still sounds better than the 4 cylinder which is my point.
Bowan Anderton they both still sound terrible, and that’s not something I would expect from a car that not only has fifty five years of history, but also costs thirty thousand dollars more.
Yet again, you guys make a mountain out of a molehill. The most important part of a sports car is how it drives and performs, things like how it sounds are a concern only to car enthusiasts who make not even 5% of the total Porsche owners.
Gabriel Andres the 6 cylinder makes a wonderful noise to it’s 8200rpm redline. Oh and that wonderful intake noise.
A 4 banger in a hot hatch costing 25-40K? Yes please!
A 4 banger in a premium brand such as Porsche costing 60-75K? Gotta be nuts to take one of these instead of an M4/F-Type with the supercharged V6.
car A faster than car B. Then you should get car A.
Millenials: car B sounds better than car A. Then you should get car B.
your M4/F-type are slower than 718. But yeah, for you sound and number of cylinders define sports car. Even when it's slower.
Paul B Since when is speed the sole factor when purchasing a sports car? How about sound? Looks? Value? Practicality? Everyday usability?
@@tomsaar2010 yeah, but looking at the comments here it's literally like this:
Sound > performance + looks + value + practicality + everyday usability.
Oh, muh, the sound. Hilarious when you think about it, especially after driving one and appreciating how much faster it is then the older model.
Either hot hatch, or a Miata at the same price point-less power, but handles almost like the Porsche and is also a Roadster, like the Boxster. In any case, if I'm paying double that, I want at least 6 cylinders, and an exhaust note to match.
Jag is more pose mobile then sports car in the way 718 is.
1st 60 k F-type is also 4 cylinder turbocharged. Straight 4 instead boxer and it sounds even worst.
2nd you cant have it with manual transmission
3rd it weight over 250 kg (have no idea how many pounds is that probably about 500+ ) which is a hell lot of weight to carry trough corners.
4th it is not build that well and won't keep the value in the way 718 will
5th Jag is not world known as reliable I put that in account too
Don't think there is any place for comparison as the performance is quite the same... It is quit the same with M4 as it weights nearly half a ton more!
The truth is the Boxster and Cayman never were a real sales success despite all the accolades given to them by the motoring press. I worked for Porsche for about a decade and saw it first hand. Base Boxster and Caymans would linger forever and S models didn’t sell much better. Things only got worse when the 4-cylinder models replaced the flat 6 as the image took a turn for the worse, because no matter what someone’s opinion on a 4-cylinders sound or performance, it’s almost never associated with cars in this price bracket. I always thought it’s biggest competition was used 911’s and even though the mid engined cars are superior in many ways most people have to have a 911 because of the perceived image Porsche has managed to engrain in everyone’s head. People of all ages have always aspired to own the legendary “911” and to many buying anything less wont do. Perhaps if there was a bigger spread in terms of pricing between the two that would make a huge difference....and as proof of that theory the preowned market on Boxster/Caymans has always been ridiculously strong despite being a slow seller as a new car, which tells me that there are a bunch of buyers that desire to own one but perhaps cannot at the roughly $70-90k ish range that most new one list for.
There's just too big an inventory of well-kept used 911s and Caymans/Boxsters for sale at virtually all price points.
Actually the first Boxster, in 1999 / 2000, saved Porsche from bankruptcy
Mr.BigBoss7
That’s a ridiculous price
Reckon they are hoping a silly sports personality comes along and buys it..
Porsche are very good at holding there price which in turn does work for the buyers in time..
Unfortunately Porsche have just made a press release that they are most likely going to put the prices of there range up by a additional 10% due to the Brexit issue we have here in the 🇬🇧..
As a Porsche fan/owner I’m very annoyed..
@Mr.BigBoss7 Exactly the problem... Nobody is going to pay 911 money for a 718. And considering a fully loaded M2 is $60K with straight 6 and 400hp... no wonder the 718 is not selling.
Lower the base price by 10k and all the options by 30%. Communicate the much better torque at low speeds. Sales increase by 40%.
In Europe, some 718’s are cheaper second hand, than 981’s. Thats how much people dislike them
Peter 911. I’d buy a a 981 over a 718! And I’m an American.
It's the same way in the US. 981's are selling for about what a brand new 982 would cost, it's crazy.
987 are the best to myself. Perfect size.
Wow, how the world has changed in only two years time
sound is the biggest reason, in a sport car sound is very important
I'm 57 and have had my Cayman S 987.1 for 2 yrs now and absolutely love it, its way fast enough to be fun, the handling is incredible, build quility is incredible and I can sell it for what I paid!
I love my 6 cylinder 3.4, manual gearbox and hydraulic steering when all later models went electric.
I cannot afford a newer Porsche and I really don't care!
I love my 2007 Cayman S ❤️
that's awesome!!!
The Ur- Cayman 987.1 is the last classic design Porsche has made in a long time its like the Porsche 911 G models till 1989 the base one with 245 HP and the 2.7 engine has a enough power and the build quality is better then the 981 and 718 it is the last analog Porsche manual gear box the new 911 have great performance but the design is horrible and mid engine is overall the best design in a sports car if you know Porsche you will buy a Cayman 987.1.2 till 2009 the and the base cayman has a better engine sound then the 3.4 Cayman 😉
And these 987.1 2.7 engines can run easily about 300.000 km without any issues no IMS no bore scoring none 👍
@@paulb7207 thanks 👍
@@savariaxa your right, it will become a classic and once you have driven one you will not believe how good it feels.
My car has done 114k miles now and is still as strong as new, awesome cars 👍❤️
I was going to buy a 718C, test drive was good I liked it, I found a 2008 2.7 987 in perfect condition for the same price as the deposit for the 718...
I will never sell my 987, it’s the most fun car to drive I have ever driven.
Before even watching yet I will put my two cents in, 4 cylinder.
This motor would be great in a 1960's Beetle restomod, if that's what you need.
Porsche killed a perfect engine but magically watch the new 718 GT4 sell very well flat six naturally aspirated .
I thought the gt4 was going to get the 3.0tt Carrera S motor. The factory race car gets the NA motor. Have you heard otherwise?
@@thomascarpenter8445Rumor has it a 3.8 N/A with 420 hp but it is all just speculation at this point but being a GT car most think it will be N/A.
The four cylinder engine is a huge improvement so don’t let the engine sound chatter put you off. The 718 is a big step up in every way.
4 months is effing ridiculous. I would be livid, as I'm sure you are.
This could be a 5 second video. *starts "It has a 4 cylinder engine" finish*
Malcom McQueen, I agree 100%
thanks. Saved me 12 minutes.
That's why America fails.
The current generation of Boxster has more low down torque and a car that's more driveable but because folks "think" that a 4 cylinder turbo can't be as good as a 6 pot engine, the sales tank.
I remember back in the early to mid 80's when BMW took a stock road going 4 cylinder engine and stuck a turbo on it the size of a Ferris wheel and it developed 1,600 hp in F1 qualifying trim and it did just fine. Four bangers weren't the scum of the earth. Sadly, Porsche's biggest market has, when it comes to knowledge of what really makes a car go fast, an IQ that's about the same as their cars tire pressure.
@@Swampster70 The reason I think people are upset though is because the boxer-4 doesn't have a sound that could ever match the godly cries of an NA boxer-6. I agree though, the boxer-4 is a far better engine overall for the Boxster/Cayman duo, I just wish they could make the car SOUND better and not like a muffled Subaru.
Swampster70 im British and it’s purely about the sound for me.
I’d sooner take a slower car that sounds great. Probably go for an F-type.
Mazda make a great 4cyl convertible for people who want a fantastic driving experience. If spending all that money on a Porsche sports car most people want the sound and feel of Porsche’s famous 6cyl, not an engine that sounds like it should be in an econobox.
lol
@@huss03 Yes, in the EU they have to get to really low CO2 emissions which are the median of the whole fleet. With diesel engines out (their own fault) they have to scale down most of their offerings so they can afford to keep the GT2s and GT3s and the Panamera or Cayene Turbos in their fleet.
Expect a lot of EVs and hybrids in Porsches lineup next year.
On my 3rd Miata-no regrets...
@@Seamus322 I would love to own a Porsche again. But...the maintenance was a deal breaker. I simply could not afford the maintenance costs nor deal with the reliability issues. On my second Miata. Same here; no regrets.
@@VolkerHett How much would the penalties work out to, per car?
It’s too close in price to a 911. Anyone that can afford a 80k car can, in reality, afford a 100k car. If the car was 50k well optioned, they would sell a ton of them.
Actually, it’s current pricing is the same delta to 911 since the 1990s. In other words, it’s not closer to 911 pricing. A Boxster is $70-80K off the lot all day (yes you can spend less or more). A 911 is $110K off the lot all day. A healthy delta. And, no, being able to afford one is not the same as being able to afford the other.
alliejr I hear what your saying, but I know when I was looking at the boxster for my wife, the increased delta to the base convert 911 was close enough for me to get the 911. Salesman even said it happened all the time.
Scott G God bless and enjoy!
The same for me, after putting in only a few options, I was in 911 territory
@@donh1572 A used or CPO 911? Maybe. Of course it's always the case you can get any used car for the price of a lesser new car. But it's unfair to compare a nicely equipped Boxster or Cayman with a base 911 or a used 911. Also, while they share engines, the cars are completely different. Rear engine versus mid-engine. Back seat (sorta) versus pure 2 seater. No luggage space versus reasonable amount of luggage space. And in the case of a Boxster, by far the cheapest way to have a Porsche convertible. Just because one _may_ be able to find an overlapping price Boxster/Cayman and 911, it's not obvious that one would buy the 911. I didn't. Finally, every car manufacturer has product lines where the prices overlap so one is always in the situation of "should I buy a base more expensive model or a well-equipped less expensive model?" BMW 3-series into 5... 5 into 7... every Mercedes line C to E to S... etc... etc... That's why I find this claim a bit spurious. It's not a "problem" with the Boxster/Cayman per se anymore than any other car lines from every manufacturer.
Replace a perfect 6 cylinder with a ropey sounding 4 cylinder.. not the cleverest thing Porsche has ever done.
....after having spent 20k to rebuild my M96 I can attest that at least a 4-cylinder would be cheaper to fix. It certainly couldn't be designed any worse, that's for sure...... besides Porsches origins are 4, not 6 anyway....
@@johnmoylan7202 The thing is, old 4 cylinders sound vastly different to modern turbo 4s, and this 718 doesn't even seem to be among the best modern 4 pots
@@RS-nq8xk I hear ya - I also have an Audi TT, which is a 4IL turbo, and it's a hoot. Every year for the last 3 years I go to Silverstone to the Porsche Driving Experience and despite the plethora of cars available, and owning a 996 - I go for the 718 in PDK. As a driving car, it's emperious. Sure, it sounds funny, but when you're out running a 911 ....doesn't really matter :) That said, I have PSE on my own car: go figure :)
EU emissions standards either current or in future I believe - no choice as turbocharging is more efficient, environmentally friendly, and less fuel hungry.
@@JL_sounds the new 4.0 718 are 249g/km.......bonkers. taxes above 190 kill it
I almost bought a 991.1. And I got a 718 Boxster S with loads of specs. It was such a pleasant car to drive and fit my age so perfect.
@@iTomSawyer I was 26… I found some bitcoin I forgot to sell back in 2013.
The 4 cylinder in my opinion
its simple, people used to buy them for the incredible bang for the buck with the NA boxer 6 cylinders, now they have a 4 banger and they didn't even get cheaper, so its not worth it at all anymore.
Why get it cheaper? What you get out as a sound you get in as power and driving performance. It is lighter, it is faster it is better in all aspects including the look...
Cheap to import in some country.
you put it in a nutshell. the fact that porsche even raised prices significantly after introducing the 4 cylinder is, frankly, beyond cheeky.
@@BenzinioB Because Porsche decided to put the Cayman on an oversaturated market full of rivals? The only thing that made the Cayman unique they removed, not only that, the fact that you have to pay MORE for LESS is absurd. And honestly, Jaguar and Mazda seem to be the better options on that market
TheRedHuskie For me this "More for Less" situation works OK. I pay more for Boxter which has less features (cylinders) but in some respects the lack of these things is more for me. It is purist and more enjoyable car then the Jaguar, way more focused on the driving excitement. And I cant agree that they removed the only unique thing - there is no other mid engine small affordable roadster on the market! That is still unique and in many ways define the character of Boxter/Cayman.
I do not consider Jaguar as an option in this league simply because there is no proper manual transmission and having sport car/roadster without manual in my personal view is pointless.
The Mazda, yes I'm agree, as MX5 follows quite the same philosophy as the Boxter does and the decision between those two I think is just what kind of financial possibility you have. Mazda is best sports car for the money, but If you can afford Boxter it is better then the Mazda...
I came here only to say "because 4 cyllinders < 6 cyllinders" DUH
Downsizing from 6 flat to 4 is the killer. PORSCHE is making a wrong move
Especially since there is soo many other options if you want a 4 cyl vertible, especially at that price range.
Well not really. They basically did this for 2 main reasons :
1 - Clearly separate the 718s from the 911s
2 - emissions\fuel consumption + carbon tax in Europe are VERY important now.
Maybe point 2 is not important in the US, but it is here. And don t forget that the carbon tax on 718s can go from 4,5K€ up to 10K€ (for a 718 GTS) which adds a considerable extra cost on already expensive cars.
I love my 2018 718 Boxster, and would think so at any age, and agree that the power is plenty for the car and the balance is fantastic to truly enjoy my Porsche.
Come on Porsche America sort Nicks 911 out it’s happened twice...it’s totally embarrassing even in the U.K. people are aware and supporting Nick...A brand should be judged by how it deals with complaints and issues and the fact that it making me think twice about upgrading my 991 next year should be a concern.......
Alan Wayte They are offering a 718T which ticks a bunch of boxes Nick mentioned. TBQH, it’s only 700quid less than a base S but it’s a pretty nice package.
David Verrwhatever porsche should offer Nick an 2018 911S Porsche America Demo car as a straight swap at the very least...he is incredibly loyal to the brand and even in U.K. people are talking about how disappointing it is that two 911 have been disappointing and totally unacceptable....
I have a 718 Boxster 2018 GTS and this car is really perfect. Before to buy, I have tried the 981 & 981 S ... Very disappointed ... yes Flat 6 but where is the Power/Driving pleasure ???? I went last week to Spa Francorchamps for the Porsche days ... 981 & S are not able to follow a simple 718 .... The noise of the engine is less exiting but the power of engine/turbo and the body make it very fun to drive ... a low fuel consumption ... even 996/997 has difficult to follow ... if you buy a car for the noise and not for drive pleasure, go to 981 and if not, go to 718 GTS ... the thing is that flat 6 are frustrated :-)
Hi Nick I love your videos. I've just ordered a 2021 Boxter S, I'm getting in next week and was worried when I saw people on youTube slagging it off and saying there was awful turbo lag at low speed. You've put my mind at rest. Thanks a million.
4 cylinder doesn’t sell in that price bracket.
Exactly. They need to either make these electric or put a damn flat 6 in there.
Ian Hobday - Inline 6 MAZDA
is coming... meanwhile:
Porsche is peddling
turbo 4’s for 60+ grand.
Ohhh Okayyy. 👌
If Mazda’s sequel
to the Rx7/8 comes -
w the inline 6?!
(MX-7, as in, the big brother
To the Miata/MX-5)
Boxster and the Cayman are
Niche - but will be:
even more so. 🤷🏻♂️
It’s the 4 banger.
It's the Macan.
Faster than 6-bangers from Jaguar (F-type), BMW (M2), actually base 911 is slower than 718 GTS on the track.
What does it tell you about all these 6-bangers?
Paul B u missed the point. Sure you can make 4 cyl fast. But at cost. 4 cyl turbo generally sound bad. In a open top sports car, this is really bad. And more power you try to get out of it, more lag at low rpm range. 718 motors have no power under 3k rpm. Go drive one.
@@yooseemotoringchannel3357 I did. Actually ordered one. Much faster than the previous model. Yes, you need to keep it over 3k (like any other turbo car), not a big deal. I want it to be fast. I don't care for sound as much as about the performance.
Paul B what it says is that people won’t pay for a sissy 4 banger. I’ll stick to my 991.1 911, thank you very mucb
Really nice looking car. I was shocked when I pulled up to one a few days ago. Did not know the Boxster was this nice looking now.
Your videos are so informative. Thank you! You have changed my opinion about “al-cantara”
For me: the sound...
My GT4 is like music compared to the lawn mower sound of the 718.
GT4 is about as close to perfection as you can get!!
@@gtperfection1596 I agree! She is a keeper :)
u dont have a gt4
@@Otaner142 you are absolutely right I don't but I do have a 991.2 GT3 with a manual please stop trolling thanks in advance LOL.
@@gtperfection1596 i wasnt taking to you mate....
1 year ago I bought my first Porsche, I wanted a Cayman. I went to the dealership and drove it and it was awesome and everything was perfect but 1 thing... the engine. I wanted one bc I drove a friends 2014 Boxter, it was not even close the feel of the engine and the sound. What did I do? My first Porsche ended up being a 2015 mint condition Cayman S. It took 5 weeks to find the perfect one (that was the downside) but I do not regret shit.
Brilliant sense of humour mate! Keep up the good work!
My 2019 718/350 HP turbocharged Boxster GTS is one one of the best and most fun sports cars I have ever driven. It has the 7/speed PDK TRANSMISSIONS which shifts so fast it is barely detectable. It is very fast, the exhaust is a little noisy but sounds great. You can tone the noise down if it is to loud. I highly recommend the seat ventilation package with the top down in the summer months. The vehicle is pricey but it draws attention because it commands attention. It is a beautiful vehicle.
I've had my Cayman for a little over a month now and I love it! The bright spot in my day.
The four cyclinder ...... Put six back in.
Sorry had to👍😀
At least make it an option.
@@GnomeChomsky9999 won't be an option: emissions day 'no'.
Nick you make some classy ass videos with wit dryer than the Sahara. Love it, Keep it up.
Awesome review! thanks Nick. from Tauranga, NZ
The engine. Sadly. I personally love the car, but when you compare it to the 981 a lot of people hate it.
Halaf Errikkson Good and lightly used 981 are common. Highly recommended.
the new engine has a significant increase in torque over the old 6. alot more fun to drive.
I chose a 2013 981 S over a 2017 718 last year. Tried the 718, thought, wow cool, then mashed the accelerator on the 981 S and was hooked. The sound... The behavior, the whole sensory experience is just better, even with no low end torque!
Robert Lacroix yeah man, my dad has a 987 2.7 and that’s an incredible feeling. The sound of that 6 cyl is addictive. I can see why people didn’t like the 718 4.
I’m looking an Audi TTS at the moment because of my budget, but definitely want a Cayman at some point.
Re: your 911... stay strong. I'm praying it'll be fixed once and for all for you...
Either Tui is running as fast as a 911 or that was powdered sugar at the end of the video. Haha!!! Nick has such an incredible sense of humor. Love the videos man!
Holy shit, I will have to admit the camera work and quality of this video is absolutely stunning.
The 4cyl is the problem. This coming from someone who owns a 981s and did a test drive of the 718
sorry to hear about your Porsche Nick, it's a bummer they didn't fix it yet...
Fantastic cars to drive, horrible if they are broken. The 6cyl really do sound fantastic...the 4cyl sound cool too.
PorscheAddict 4 cyl sounds like turd🤬🤬🤬💩💩💩
Good review of the 718 Nick! So sorry to hear of the continued problems with your 991.2, esp after that journey with your 991. Hope PNA do the right thing and it works out the best for you.
Personally, I think the car is overpriced. It's just not worth the porsche premium for the "baby" p car. Also, suvs.
Agree. With the flat 6 they had something special about them but with just a 4-cyl they're competing with (here in Germany) RS3's, M2's or A45's and those are quite a bit cheaper.
Not really, it was just underpriced before.
coram it’s true $70k for a base boxster with options is ridiculous esp for a 4 banger
@@blankspace5614 not in all markets. Waiting for 718 boxster delivery in Poland and one of the reasons I got it over M2 Competition is that M2 Competition list price is 20% higher than base 718. I think there are some other countries (Netherlands maybe?) where < 2.0 displacements gets you lower sales tax(es).
@@paulb7207 Congrats! That's where the Boxster should be in my opinion.
The engine...In my 30's, can afford one, but have discounted it because of the noise. If porsche ever fit a 6 cylinder again (which I've recently heard fresh rumours of), then I will be visiting my OPC to place an order.
We have a 718 Cayman, manual a replacement for a 987 Cayman. Both cars are pure driving machines but with different characters. The 718 is such a flexible daily driver and although it sounds different to the 6 cylinder, it has a character of its own and it should sell much better...
I work at the Porsche dealer. They are not selling because they are: 1. too expensive for a 4 cylinder engine; 2. generally very little car for the money; 3. extremely high competition and yea, the 4 cylinder. The engine is extremely good, but not in a Porsche and not for that kind of money. But it's not Porsches fault. They have to do things like this because of emissions. Just look for sound comparisons between 911s with particle filters and without and you will know what I mean.
They could have made the cayman hybrid electric with a H6... for the price, that's certainly something they could do to cut down on emissions.
Nothing spins like a flat-6. I'll quit while I'm ahead.
964tractorboy Ian Hobday - Inline 6 MAZDA
is coming... meanwhile:
Porsche is peddling
turbo 4’s for 60+ grand.
Ohhh Okayyy. 👌
If Mazda’s sequel
to the Rx7/8 comes -
w the inline 6?!
(MX-7, as in, the big brother
To the Miata/MX-5?!
Yes Please!
Plus - 40-50 grand price point,
w Mazda Reliability and
Cost to own!
Instead of 60-80 grand and
Huge wait times and costs of
Porsche upkeep?
I’ll just leave THIS here.
Your experience with Porsche cars alone deter me from ever getting one. I'll keep my m4.... maybe get the new one in a few years.
300 Hp and Flat Boxer 4 Cylinder for
Really expensive base price. Porsche ruin this 718 lineup.
There are soo many other options for a 4 cyl convertible too, and a lot of then offer more for less, and to make it worst, people who want a flat boxer 4 cyl will never go after the cayman, they will go after the WRX.
TheRedHuskie Yea, I mean The WRX STi Has the Exact same power with AWD and Like Half the costs.
TheRedHuskie what options for a mid engine convertible 4 cyl? With this power and trully a so practical car?
williamsbboy Lotus, Toyota MR2,
Maybe the old Cayman too
Good information. thanks. you bought the 911 new? and still having all these problems?
*Soul, it boils down to soul*
I debated extensively back in 2016 between 2016 981 GTS and a 2017 718S at the time with every single performance option to make it more like what a GTS would be (718 GTS not out yet). I think It just boiled down to soul. The Cayman GTS sounds like a baby GT3, even much better than the 3.8 911 (in stock) due to the engine being so close and the unique GTS exhaust. The howl was so vibrant. But yet the 718 was so fast and cornered outstandingly especially with PTV and all. But 981 made me want to drive fast, the 718 was capable but I only drive fast because I felt like I need to do it to get my money worth, rather than I want to
What did you buy?
@@gsthree9534 the one with soul. The 981GTS.
Very over priced because I bought it in the very end of 2016 , but Porsche doesn't believe in discounts. First week I went, a few new 981 were left, by the time I visited again, only two were left and I just signed and thought heck. Turns out the other one was sold in the same moment. Seemed like quite a few people were buying out the last few 981 remaining new stocks
$7000 for a real doll is a bit too much. I got mine used for around $3000
How used was it?
It was like throwing a pencil into the Grand Canyon.
So good
@@DrMcMoist or a hot dog down a bowling alley.....
Sam Oh and you can rent it out to your friends for weekend party’s. A “friend” told me that.... :-)
I’m 19. I have a 718 cayman. I think it’s amazing, probably because I’m young. It’s got a straight pipe on it and I think it has its own unique sound, I love it. I had a 981 before, it sounded great too but I wouldn’t knock the new car cause it sounds different.
Have both of these cars you've had issues with gone back to the same dealer for repairs? If so, would it be worth taking it to a different dealer to get a second pair of eyes / opinion?
Because they sound terrible compared to the 981
th-cam.com/video/Qq2xGoZ-i-Q/w-d-xo.html check this out 😉
Just to make myself clear: it doesn’t sound terrible on its own, but when you compare it to the previous gen it does.
Missed your videos. I had a 981 Cayman with a 2.7 loved it, made you keep the revs up. Hated the sound of the 718. You have the patience of a saint. FYI just want to say how shocked I was what happened in N.Z. the friendliest people on the planet.
Great video as always Nick. Sorry to hear about your continuous Carrera problems. I remember your last one and all the issues you had with it. Didn’t blame you then going to the m4.
base 718 is a great car, either pdk and manual is a lot of fun. would take one over
M2/4
because rattly 4cyl not silken 6cyl
If the 718 would come with the option of adding the last naturally aspirated 911 6 cylinder engine then it would sell a lot better probably.
Guy Incognito Yes. Shoulda just offered 981.2 with updated center stack and called it a day.
alliejr If you could upgrade older cars with the newer infotainment systems a lot of people would not buy new cars. ^^
Porsche will NEVER put an equal engine/trans combination from the 911 into a Cayman/Boxster, because the latter would drive circles around their 'premier' line, the 911's. They know it, and we know it. It would kill the goose that lays the golden eggs. Can't have that, so they continue to preach that the 911 is their best road car. It's all for sales. If you wanted the ultimate Cayman, you had to build it yourself.
Your doggo is the star of this episode!
I enjoy my 2019 718 Boxster. It has plenty of power, and its Miami Blue color draws lots of attention.
Best Boxster/Cayman is the 987.2 version - 981 looks a little better but too many nannies and electric steering. 718 engine, bleh
Les Murray 🙌🏽🙌🏽🙌🏽
As a driver I hardly notice the difference between the electric steering of the 981 and the hydraulic 987. One thing for sure I noticed was the hydraulic leak I have had on the 987 that spoiled a good summer week end, while the electric steering on the 981S didn’t give me any problem yet.
why no selling? It is that bloody ENGINE !!! Sounds like a sewing machine. U-GLY !
Gusseisern, you are right, but I would call it a lawnmower instead of sewing machine.
Not selling because the factory had been shut
Good video. I agree on most of your feature choices. However, the seats should always be heated.
If I may ask Nick, you’ve mentioned that Porsche began tuning the sound that comes out of the 2020 caymans and boxters. does that mean to avoid buying a 2019 cayman and wait instead for the 2020?
The updated sound actually sounds pretty good!
I thought this too glad I am not the only one...
Actually, the 2017 with Sports Exhaust, sounds fine. It will never sound like the flat six. It does give a more robust driving experience but unlike the older car, it does not “add” to the fun from the sound. A roadster is all about making you feel good. The 718 makes you feel great about the improvements in performance, but if the sound causes your smile to fade too much...no sale. Me? I am shopping both. The big difference is the 718 must have sports exhaust while the 981 is a “would be cool” if it does....
I have a 718 Boxster GTS and I absolutely love it - but I also get why it's not a favorite among Porschefiles. Go ahead and hate it - I couldn't care less - this is a really amazing vehicle.
Well said
Me too. For what I paid for mine I could of had a new 911s but I think the boxster looks better and handles better and is much quicker than the 6 cylinder 981. I track mine 3-4 times a month and it’s just awesome. I also like the way it sounds especially with wide open throttle.
Just get it out your brain it’s 4 cylinder..
Then just get on with it
They are sooooo much fun,and go like hell with a Porsche chassis..
Had a 911.2 manual standard Carrera and whilst in for a few items I had a pdk boxster S
It was quite simply fantastic it handled brilliantly and was faster than you will ever need on a road..
Be careful base cayman 718 is not any quicker on track than base 981 depending on what options you have fitted from Porsche to the 981. That might be true though for the Cayman S@@egoncool1
The new owner of that boxter thanks you for all the scratches etc.. Your dog added free of charge.
And now there is the gts & gt4 and everybody falls in love with the 718
By going to a 4 cylinder they sucked the fun out of it...Porsche keeps adding performance at the cost of fun,maybe they should look at what Singer is doing.
Waycool jr How much time have you spent driving one?
@@Meatwad650 It sounds like shit and that's all I need to know.
It's not about the engine. It's not about the Boxster/Cayman. It's about sports car sales, in general. They are down across the board, regardless of the model.
Yep, that what we want, a different engine exhaust. Maybe the next re fresh will be a turbo 3 cylinder.
Do you have a porsche?
@@chikara758 Yes, a 1970 911 targa.
@@TheBonsaiZone This is a complete different topic. The 718 is an all day car. Hopefully, you don't drive 15-30.000 km per year. 🙏
More like no cylinders... BEV only. 718 deliveries have been pretty poor in North America for 2022 vs. 2021 so far... Either they are phasing them out, or there is no demand.
@@nafnaf0 Yeah Unless you're getting a six cylinder just buy the new GR86. Get good with that car and then put on a high end supercharger kit or turbo kit and you match a Cayman Base/S for $40,000
4CL engine that’s why. I work at the 2nd best Porsche Dealership in the UK. We sell more used 981 Boxter/Caymans than New and Used 718’s combined. The 981’s fly out and are at the dealer less than 2 weeks. We keep the 718’s for months at least...
The Boxster/Cayman have always been too expensive for what they are, but when they had 6-cilinder flat sixes (still a legendary engine configuration), a real petrolhead could justify it to himself on the basis that they were the only non-supercar with a mid-engine configuration and unreal handling (the latter obviously being a consequence of the former).
Remove the flat six though, and they lose all interest (I certainly did). At which point you are left with a very, very expensive MR2. Turns out there's only so large a market for that. Having said that, I think the US sales numbers are still pretty incredible for what this car is/has become. It certainly reveals that a large portion of buyers were only ever in it for the badge anyway (who would have though... well actually, most of us would have).
If you are really into small, nimble, agile, rear-wheel drive sports cars, you're in a Miata ND today. Funny how that turned out - all those years of being questioned for not being a 'proper sports car', and suddenly it's the only real game left in town.
Sorta. The Miata is significantly smaller inside for taller drivers. At 6'2", I absolutely can not sit in the driver or passenger seat of my wife's 2019 Miata. Driving around the block as a passenger is torture. The Porsche is more car in every way and is enough bigger that I'm not uncomfortable at all. Is it worth 2.5X as much? I haven't decided. Gotta take a test drive in the BMW Z4 and see what it's like....
@@BillLee3 Height is a valid complaint for the Miata - you either fit or don't. But removing that, as a sports car, it's about all we have left. Read reviews on the new Z4 today, in standard trim with the 2.0 engine (apparently what BMW brought to the launch), and it has very little to do with being a sports car (at least in that config).
@@greyrock551 Yeah, I'd only be interested in the M40i. Seen some video reviews that make it seem like 90% of the way to a Boxter S for considerably less money than the base Boxster (when configured similarly). Note that I'd want an automatic anyway due to local traffic (Atlanta).
You nailed it.
I predict that Porsche will use the lack of interest in the 718 as proof that people don't want mid engined vehicles.
Porsche took buying public for fools, big mistake. Good vid.
The thing is that, like you said, the Boxster/Cayman, specially the Boxster, are aimed at younger people, or at least people think they are, which is the important part, but when you are hit with that absurd sixty thousand dollars price tag your hopes get completely crushed.
I think Porsche should strip a little luxury and comfort out of these cars, make it more about the performance and driving experience, and cut down the price.
I love the green Patagonia Jacket Nick!
Without watching the video, its because of the 4 cylinder engine. People buying a Porsche want that Porsche flat 6 noise they're familiar with. I would absolutely own a Boxster (or buy one for my wife) but not with a flat 4.
I will be taking delivery of my brand new 718 base Boxster PDK within a couple of weeks, and I am really looking forward to it.
My guess is that it is a mix of 4 cylinder prejudice/ignorance and perhaps a general lack of sports car sales.
Based on my testdrives of the 718 I must say I am very impressed with the platform and engine, as you say the low down torque of the turbo four makes it a much easier car to drive, but it can still rev high when you want to play.
I also really like the sound of the flat four, it is unique and it does not sound as straining on the ears as when you are pushing performance out of the NA flat six.
And for once it is nice to see a positive TH-cam review of the 718, which does not focus entirely on the lack of the flat six wail.
alf_17
You will loveeeeeee it..
They are fantastic
Unfortunately the rest moaning about the amount of cylinders well let them..
It’s how it is..
There will be huge swaths of people that will want to be you.
Enjoy
Congratulations and enjoy!!! You will love it. Ignore the naysayers. You chose well.
You will love it. It is a wonderful car. Don't let people spoil the fun - they are just envious. The road holding, the performance on twisty roads and the practicability of the two trunks - front and rear. Great car.
I'm getting mine in three months. Can't wait.
John Brothers Enjoy!!! Congratulations.
I would have one if I had the money. The car really does handle and the sound is OK.
That intro music is exactly what people hear in their heads when u drive by in a boxter.😂
I hate 4 cylinder engines.
After publication of this video with Nick driving it, the sale will skyrocket
i have a 718 and i love it and now you. thanks for a realistic review.
I was surprised on how much I liked the turbo 4 but to make it easier to swallow I think 45k base price is needed
Agreed Nick it’s the engine full-stop in my mind. I have a Macan S daily and just got a 2007 Boxster as a second car. I need the flat 6.
I Love my 718 cayman s in Miami Blue 🤗
I like the floor camera angle, nice touch :)
Im one of those 718 caymans s owners in their 20s. Personally I dont care it's a 4 cylinder. The cabin noise is really good and it's an incredibly fun car to drive. Not to mention it looks great. There will always be a group of Porsche vets that will find any reason to hate on the caymans/boxsters. Point in case, I don't regret buying the car despite any arguments I've heard from the haters. Some may say, oh why don't you just buy car x it has engine y. Well, one does not buy a car only for it's engine. If that was the case I would get an old Nissan Supra with 1000hp.
I am sure they are awesome cars, but they are a lot of money for 4-cylinder cars. The 718 is so expensive, it makes sense just to save up some more and buy a 911, or spend less money and buy a less expensive competitor.
987.2S is the best
BERSERK Yes. But base.
@@alliejr no base is too slow
Agreed
Another great informative video nick, thank you! I’m waiting to buy my first Porsche when they bring back the 6 cylinder to the cayman, which I read rumor that Porsche is going to make one in the future besides the gt4; have u heard anything about that?