This is a great video. I had to retire as a mechanic after 25 years due to health problems. But you know they say once a mechanic always a mechanic. I watch this video because it was one of the engines I never got to really work on out of 25 years. And I have never seen such a thorough video! I was just bored and wanted to watch a nice video. This video was better than nice. You really know what you're doing. If customers saw a video like this they would understand the reason why labor cost or very high. Anyways with that being said. This is a great video and I hope the best for you. Keep up the good work!
Nice video, I even didn't mind the background music. If I knew other technicians did such a clean job like this I would feel much better taking my car in for service and repair.
Great video, lots of good information! Have an '03 pilot that we bought new that, fortunately, did not have the VCM yet, so none of those problems. On it's third teenage boy and still going strong, great vehicles! Oldest boy did get an '09 Accord with the v6 and VCM. A little over a year ago, had cylinder 3 misfiring. Not knowing what it was, we replaced the plug and the boot and ran fine...for about a week...then misfired again. Kept happening on and off for about a month. Ended up not being able to troubleshoot ourselves so took it into the dealer. They pretty much diagnosed the issue without looking at it, just hearing what was happening. Basically saving my son the fee to diagnose...told it was almost certainly the rings...$4k job, give or take. Spoke with a couple of the techs about it as it was a slow day for them, and one of them mentioned trying bg moa. Reasoning was it could potentially at least buy some time and wouldn't hurt anything. Went home and researched a bit and found out about bg epr. Tried that for 2 consecutive rounds of oil changes and the misfiring went away. About 5 months back, he found out about another product that basically keeps the car out of eco mode most of the time, so he installed that. Been over a year since the misfiring started and has been running fine so far. According to him, his oil consumption went way down as well. Don't think it would stop the rings from lining up, but definitely think it loosened them up to where they could work more like they are supposed to. Personally, big believer in bg epr after that.
Thank you for sharing this experience. Hopefully people having these issues can see this and perhaps buy themselves some time if they can't afford to do the repair right away.
@@SkillCollectors hi there! I’m at the connecting rods. I see 3 of mine could use new bearings. How do I identify what bearing color to buy? Brown, etc.
@@SkillCollectors oh my gosh. They are actually there!!! I went to the manual to coordinate the piston number to letter on the crank to try and do it backwards. Do you have a patreon or some way to support the channel?
TO ANYONE WHO OWNS/OPERATES A HONDA VCM ENGINE: Get a VCM-Tuner or Tuner2 to disable the VCM system. This is your best chance of avoiding this problem. Even if it's the simpler manual setting version. It can save your engine. Put one on around 50k miles when VCM caused the rear CAT to fail. Ben running great ever since. Currently at 160k and still Showing 2% leakdown in each cylinder (each warm and at TDC). Cant recommend enough. Great video BTW: Hope my tip doesn't cut into your business too much lol.
We actually tell people to do this as well, however we don’t have any recommendations on which one to get and we don’t install them, more of a DIYer option, thanks for sharing this though.
I have a ‘16 Acura RDX that needs this same repair. Cyl 3 has no compression. Bought it as a CPO car in 2019 and the CPO warranty expired 13 months ago. Car only has a total of 86k miles on it and I only added 36k since 2019. Been a loyal Honda owner for 30+ years. Not anymore. Honda America declined my case for them to assist in the cost of the repair. I am convinced this VCM stuff is what caused this, since all the info I can find online is it seems to always be in cyl 1-3 when this happens. I will be adding a VCM tuner for sure after I get this repaired. Great video.
Currently own a 2011 Honda Accord coupe V6. 100k miles. Never had a VCM problem. Should I put a muzzler of some kind? Trying to avoid that piston ring job at all costs.
Wouldn't hurt but it wasn't the reason for the misfire and takes extra time which wasn't sold. In my experience it's rare that it goes out of spec, typically it exhibits different symptoms. Does happen from time to time though. Also no sandblaster at the shop.
Hello again, I'm finally getting around to pulling the rear head on my 2016 Honda Odyssey. I ordered all the parts for the job before getting started. One thing I couldn't like on Honda's website was the oil pan gasket. Is there one or do they use a sealant on the pan. If there is a gasket, could you help me with a part number for it. thanks again.
Great video,,,, Anytime you have carbon buildup in the ring pack check the PCV System or just replace the PCV Valve and hook your HVAC Manometer to the Dipstick Tube and test drive. You want to see 1 to 3 inHg in the Crankcase at all times. Honda has theirs detuned and is why they have this problem. You can run syn oil to go around the problem but more vacuum is needed to pull the bubble of Blowby away from the Ring Pack and correct this problem. Acura/Honda only run -.3 to -.8inH2O and this is too low for good PCV function. Toyota and Nissan also run this low vac to avoid running a Catch Can and draining it every other month. Look at the varnish buildup that darken the closer you get to the Ring Pack/Pistons. The engine should be cleaner on the inside than the outside.
Incredible video!! Just the right details but enough details where you needed them.. Superb. I am going to embark on changing piston rings on my car after watching. If I had one recommendation, it would be to caption torque settings/ other vital numbers as and when you spell them out.
So, I looked online to see if Honda sold the piston groove cleaner tool and ring compressors. Could not find that way. So did you buy them at the parts counter, and they ordered them for you. Would rather buy a good set than a cheap set and have problems with the tools. I'm replacing the rings on cylinder's 1,2, and 3 on my 2016 Honda Odyssey because of the VCM problem. Has only 118,000 miles on it. If you have some suggestions on where I can find these Honda tools that would great. thanks
So I watched a couple of your other videos today. Always nice to see other mechanic's work. I've been an aircraft mechanic for the last forty years but have done all the worked on my own cars as well. Talked with my snap-on rep. today. He was not much help with any tooling. He told me he doesn't have any mechanics that rebuild car engines anymore. Pretty sad to hear had. I guess there's not that many people who enjoy doing that anymore.
I remember my boss ordered these tools through Honda. It was a special order thing. I wish I had some part numbers for you but this was so long ago now.
Hi, We have a 2005 Acura RL that has excessive oil consumption and 30 percent loss on a leak down test for number 6 cylinder ( air escaping out the oil filler cap when number six is at TDC). Compression was good on the rear bank but variable on the front bank. Leak down was steady 10 percent across the board except number 6. That motor looks almost exactly like the RL we have ( I have only just removed the intake manifold and the valve covers). I think I want to try to replace the rings on the front head but is there any way you can confirm that the VTEC motor in our 2005 RL is the same as the one in the video? Also, it has been recommended that I send the head to a machine shop to do the valve guides and seals if I attempt the ring job. Is this a good idea?
Great job we have the same problem on my wife is odyssey. I got three questions call for the piston bring the compressor tool. What’s the part number or where you get it from and what about the head cylinder bolts and the connect rod bolts do you have to replace them thank you
Thank you, wiseco actually sells these. You can get them on summit racing: www.summitracing.com/parts/wis-rcs08900?seid=srese1&ppckw=pmax-tools&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI1dKA1K3m_wIVIRitBh13jwyzEAQYASABEgLyt_D_BwE As far as replacing the rod or head bolts. It’s only necessary if they are stretched, there is measurement procedures in the service info to check this but in my experience they rarely ever need replacing. (I’ve personally never had to replace any).
5 and 6 are not part of the cylinder deactivation system and are not usually affected. There's a point in the video where I show the hardware in the cylinder heads and it's not present in cylinders 5 and 6.
Nice work very very thorough. Can you tell me where your shop is located? thanks for the video really helps me to understand what goes into making an engine and how to maintain it.
Yes, a special piston ring tool is required to remove and install them and then a special piston ring compressor is required to install the piston in the cylinder.
Would this fix the check engine light being on? I got it checked out it says it’s the catalytic converter thing but it burns oil so I didn’t change it thinking it would not fix the issue.
If the cause of the oil consumption is the piston rings then yes, it would fix the primary problem, then you'll also have to change the catalytic converter as well. The burnt oil pre-maturely wears out the cat.
Great informative video. Why not replace the pistons instead of cleaning them? I've got an 07 Ridgeline with 192k on it runs like a top. It does have a knock in the motor thats driving me nuts and I can't identify it. Sounds like a valve tap but I've checked the clearances 2 times and they are spot on. Motor runs great and burns no oil just has a loud tap at idle that goes away as soon as you put a load on the engine.
Assuming you have one of these J Series engines... If that sound you have is indeed coming from the head, I have seen prematurely worn camshaft lobes cause mysterious tapping in the head, they usually check out in a clearance inspection because the clearance is done when the cam is not touching the rocker arms. I'd get a stethoscope and listen closely on different areas on the engine. If it's definitely under the valve covers, next time you have those apart, look real closely at the cams, sometimes you even have to remove the cam holders to see the damage. As far as replacing the piston, if it doesn't pass inspection then we'll replace them but I've never actually come across one that's bad. It's just added parts and labor for the customer if we replace everything, the bill starts to add up fast when you do it that way.
Check your timing belt tensioner, they leak out and causes it to lose tension on the belt. It'll sound like it's rattling or knocking on cold starts and eventually sounds like that all the time until there's a load.
@@SkillCollectorsThank you…I am doing this work on my pilot now…really helpful. Most other videos or text I’ve seen say to support the engine at the oil pan when removing the engine mount…where do you support the engine when you removed it?
@@mcbdoc2000that passenger side engine mount only prevents the engine from vibrating. The front and rear engine mount actually holds the entire weight of the engine. No support on the oil pan is actually needed when removing thar passenger side engine mount.
Great video. I learned a lot from it. My Accord (with same engine) is currently having the exact same issue, keeps misfiring in cylinder 2. I just keep throwing in a new spark plug because I'm not in a financial position to have this job done. Are you able to give a ballpark of how much this job costed the customer so that I could get an idea for myself? If I had all the specialty tools and a car lift at home I'd probably try to do this job myself but since I don't, I'll eventually have to take it into a shop. Once again, great video, I'm glad I was able to learn from it.
Not sure on the cost but it's a pretty big job, I want to say 1500-2000 maybe. There is a commenter in this video that said they used BG EPR and had some good results with that. Maybe you can give that a shot and see how it works until you can afford to fix it.
If the cylinder is glazed and lost the cross hatching from the factory then yes, it should be honed. The cylinder should also be measured from top to bottom to check that it's still cylindrical. Most of the time though it's still good to go and only the top but of oil build up needs to be cleaned off.
@Master of None gotcha. I have to check my rings out on my 06 Odyssey eventually. My compression is good but i just want to get in there and clean it up. I installed a vcm bypass and it hasn't been losing much oil, but it definitely burns a small amount.
Being a tech I’m actually disconnected from the quoting and billing process so I am not really sure. I want to say it’s probably 1500-2k-ish for parts and labor.
@@SkillCollectorsno sir. An all day job like this is going to quote for $3000-$5000. I've had two mechanics say it might be better to just replace the engine. Less experienced mechanics might actually do it wrong and create more problems, that happens too. There was a class action lawsuit in 2013 due to the damage caused by the VCM, especially version 2 which included shutting down cyl 4. If it starts sucking up oil it can cause scratches on the cylinder wall, so they say just get an engine, sigh. But engines right now are going to run almost $10k. For anybody with these Hondas with VCM, buy the device that shuts it down, save your engine. Although it's been a while since 2013, if you bought it used, probably someone has already had to deal with it. Don't let it happen again!
1. If you can remember, how many miles were on this motor? 2. Were the bearings and rings oversize or standard? 3. Would honing the cylinders made a difference in longevity of the repair?
Hey, 1) Have you seen any pitted camshaft lobes or piston slap in J37 engines which had oil consumption? 2) If yes, was there a tapping/knocking noise associated with deformed camshaft lobes or a piston slap?
I have seen this before a handful of times, can't remember if it was a J37 but for sure on V6 honda engines. We replaced the camshaft and corresponding rocker arm and it fixed the problem.
@@SkillCollectors If I provide you with a video clip with tapping or knocking noise would you compare if this noise is similar to what you heard on these engines?
@@JoeMomma. I sold the car last month. That noise wasn't consistent and a different oil brand, addition of marvel mystery oil helped. I drove 3 years like that and haven't seen any degradation in performance or an increase in noise level.
You don’t have to remove the coolant pipe from both heads. Use superglue on the rear nuts and the studs will come out of the rear head. Leave the pipe attached to the front head.
HI Buddy, it is great video and very nice explanation. Our 2012 Odyssey is victim of this problem and would like to get it permanently fixed. Let me know if you can help. I don't think I can do this as it is complex job. Or anyone else who are available in Dallas area. Thanks.
Our 2008 odyssey needs re ring w/ 307,000 miles. Is it worth the money to re ring? Cost is $3800+ tuneup and parts of $1600. FYI we really like our Odyssey. It drives better than new.
There's usually no need to change the pistons, they don't wear out. The rings rotate which is the reason for changing them. So yes, you can do this repair with just the rings as demonstrated in this video.
Thank you for the reply and I'm happy for you! I have a question. A year ago I bought a Honda Odyssey 3.5 2005 which engine is the exact same like yours in the video. Btw, I'm from Kazakhstan and the minivan was travelled overseas 3 years ago via Armenia but the its a different story) So, the engine mileage is about 200000 and I use Liqui Moly 5w30 oil. About a week ago I noticed little white, blue smoke from the exhaust especially when the ac is turned on and driving reverse. Any ideas for help, thanx in advance!
Wow, awesome video! This is so much work, lol. I have a 2013 pilot with 193,000 miles. So many codes have come on (lean bank 1 and 2, as random misfires codes)- took it to honda and the service rep said its gonna be a piston ring job. Im in the Westchester NY area. Can you please tell me how much the average cost of this is?
Enjoyed your video all the way through. I have a V6 2010 Honda with VCR problem with number 1 cylinder. It has 70k miles on it. Started to backfire about 60k miles. Took it to Honda dealer in Marysville, WA. .....won't do a thing. Do you have a way to to contact you via another channel. If you are that close to WA. state, I'll bring the Accord in. You seem to really know what you're doing and have a great attention to detail. Thanks.
dont you have to put new cross hatches in the cylinder to have the new rings seat? i always thought that. I see youre from VA, same lol. Nice video man. Just learning about these engines since i want to buy an older odyssey. Thanks for the upload, fully enjoyed it and very informative
Thanks for the comment. You only need to hone the cylinder if there's no cross hatching and it's glazed. In my experience, I've never come across one that didn't still have cross hatching. If you wanted to take the extra step to hone it though, it definitely wouldn't hurt anything but there's a lot of clean up to be done after honing to ensure a clean mating surface.
Hope you guys like the soundtrack on this one, I think I added some good music! Let me know what you think and if it was worth adding it :) Thanks for watching!!
Nicely done, but no updated parts? Had a 2003 Odyssey that burned a quart in 400 most of its life. Actually wore out the hood catch and cable from adding oil I bought by the case. Never smoked or fouled plugs or the cats. Gave it away at 232,000 miles. It’s still going. Not expected Honda quality for sure.
Definitely not expected Honda quality. I agree with you there! From what I understand, you are just buying more time but from my experience, once the rings are changed, they turn less over time, the problem does seem to go away for the most part. There are devices on the internet you can buy to disable the ECO mode but I have no experience with them. ECO mode is just some kind of trick tech for cylinder de-activation to save fuel while cruising.
First issue you had was buying a early version odyssey. especially if it was used before and u bought it. Those vans are known for horrible transmission due to weight power ratio & are over stressed because if it.
@@Justvn4thGenTL five years into the model run doesn’t seem early. The transmission failed at 93k when third gear evaporated into the oil. Not covered under the secret warranty. Factory reman plus new pcm was going strong when we gave it away. Honda did step up and we paid labor only.
@@dodgefree1400 a 2003 oddesy is still a first generation oddesy if you didn’t know. yea it’s 5 years into making them but they still used the same horrible transmission that is most likely due to weight.
This Pilot had the VCM motor (variable cyclinder management) which shuts down cylinders from 1 to 4 cylinders while the car is driving to make the EPA / MPG numbers look better. VCM was awful for the long term reliability of the engine : Ruined the pistons rings, causing it to burn oil, fouled plugs, kill ignition coils, wiped out the Cats, wore out the motor mounts.
OLÁ Skill 10/08/24 Ao meu ver, o ideal seria a limpeza do pistão ser efetuada com produto adequado com ácido CRESILICO, ela dissolve a sujeira sem atacar o alumínio. A ferramenta que usaste é ótima desde que não tenha canto vivo (90°). O canto vivo é responsável pela quebra da massa entre a 1ª e 2ª canaleta de compressão de todos os pistões. Abraços... Roberto Udo Krapf
Do you mean the cylinder wall. You could use oil through spark plug holes and put it in a bottle and squirt it up the cylinder walls from the bottom. I know the k series is a sleeved block idk about the j series. And I’m pretty sure I have seen it done from the bottom end maybe it works for some engines and not all. I may be wrong as well
The cast supports that hold the crankshaft in the block will impede the piston, you don't have a perfect cylindrical, piston sized opening coming out the bottom. Maybe it can be done on some blocks but I've never seen this on any Honda engine. On some engines, cylinders can be removed separate to the head and the block, for example, on many 2 strokes, the piston is installed through the bottom of the cylinder.
Great video. Have you had any success with a chemical soak instead of the full ring job? Obviously cheaper for the customer but better for the customer if they can avoid a $4000 ring job
@@je7420 I believe I have had success yes. But it’s on a Civic R18A. Still seeing a bit of oil consumption but there are some spool valve leaks and an oil pressure sender leak and possibly a main seal leak.
Flawed VCM technology in my car brought me here. Great video. But for all, the root cause of the problem is your VCM system. Turn off VCM via a VCM muzzler to avoid this headache. In many cases this "damage" can actually be undone by disabling VCM and replacing your spark plugs. Over time the normal cycling of your engine can clean the piston rings so long as VCM is off and not allowed to continue trashing your engine. That can be the lesser of two evils versus disassembly of a factory built engine.
Installing a used engine costs way more and also a used engine is subject to this same problem. This is a common issue with these older J series honda engines.
Wow that's unbelievable I've never met anyone dumb enough not to just replace all the rings on all the pistons to do it selectively is begging to do it again in a couple of months that is just plain ignorant.
the rings on the other pistons don’t fail like these do, those rings aren’t apart of the vcm system (cylinder deactivation) the other pings fail because of the cylinder deactivation
This is a great video. I had to retire as a mechanic after 25 years due to health problems. But you know they say once a mechanic always a mechanic. I watch this video because it was one of the engines I never got to really work on out of 25 years. And I have never seen such a thorough video! I was just bored and wanted to watch a nice video. This video was better than nice. You really know what you're doing. If customers saw a video like this they would understand the reason why labor cost or very high. Anyways with that being said. This is a great video and I hope the best for you. Keep up the good work!
Thank you for that really encouraging comment, I'm glad you liked the video.
Nice video, I even didn't mind the background music. If I knew other technicians did such a clean job like this I would feel much better taking my car in for service and repair.
Thanks, I appreciate that
Great video, lots of good information! Have an '03 pilot that we bought new that, fortunately, did not have the VCM yet, so none of those problems. On it's third teenage boy and still going strong, great vehicles! Oldest boy did get an '09 Accord with the v6 and VCM. A little over a year ago, had cylinder 3 misfiring. Not knowing what it was, we replaced the plug and the boot and ran fine...for about a week...then misfired again. Kept happening on and off for about a month. Ended up not being able to troubleshoot ourselves so took it into the dealer. They pretty much diagnosed the issue without looking at it, just hearing what was happening. Basically saving my son the fee to diagnose...told it was almost certainly the rings...$4k job, give or take. Spoke with a couple of the techs about it as it was a slow day for them, and one of them mentioned trying bg moa. Reasoning was it could potentially at least buy some time and wouldn't hurt anything. Went home and researched a bit and found out about bg epr. Tried that for 2 consecutive rounds of oil changes and the misfiring went away. About 5 months back, he found out about another product that basically keeps the car out of eco mode most of the time, so he installed that. Been over a year since the misfiring started and has been running fine so far. According to him, his oil consumption went way down as well. Don't think it would stop the rings from lining up, but definitely think it loosened them up to where they could work more like they are supposed to. Personally, big believer in bg epr after that.
Thank you for sharing this experience. Hopefully people having these issues can see this and perhaps buy themselves some time if they can't afford to do the repair right away.
This is so incredible. Literally going to enable me to fix my car. Thank you so much.
Happy to be of service.
@@SkillCollectors hi there! I’m at the connecting rods. I see 3 of mine could use new bearings. How do I identify what bearing color to buy? Brown, etc.
@@securityconnections9497 There is a small dab of color on the the edge/side of each bearing signifying what bearing you need.
@@securityconnections9497 jetskisint.com/media/wysiwyg/crankshaft-balancer-bearing_colors.JPG like this
@@SkillCollectors oh my gosh. They are actually there!!! I went to the manual to coordinate the piston number to letter on the crank to try and do it backwards. Do you have a patreon or some way to support the channel?
TO ANYONE WHO OWNS/OPERATES A HONDA VCM ENGINE: Get a VCM-Tuner or Tuner2 to disable the VCM system. This is your best chance of avoiding this problem. Even if it's the simpler manual setting version. It can save your engine. Put one on around 50k miles when VCM caused the rear CAT to fail. Ben running great ever since. Currently at 160k and still Showing 2% leakdown in each cylinder (each warm and at TDC). Cant recommend enough. Great video BTW: Hope my tip doesn't cut into your business too much lol.
We actually tell people to do this as well, however we don’t have any recommendations on which one to get and we don’t install them, more of a DIYer option, thanks for sharing this though.
I have a ‘16 Acura RDX that needs this same repair. Cyl 3 has no compression. Bought it as a CPO car in 2019 and the CPO warranty expired 13 months ago. Car only has a total of 86k miles on it and I only added 36k since 2019. Been a loyal Honda owner for 30+ years. Not anymore. Honda America declined my case for them to assist in the cost of the repair. I am convinced this VCM stuff is what caused this, since all the info I can find online is it seems to always be in cyl 1-3 when this happens. I will be adding a VCM tuner for sure after I get this repaired. Great video.
I’ve read on the VCM thread that installing a Tuner before doing this job. Is there anyway that this would help?
Currently own a 2011 Honda Accord coupe V6. 100k miles. Never had a VCM problem. Should I put a muzzler of some kind? Trying to avoid that piston ring job at all costs.
Bro you saved me a bunch of time you the goat i thought i had to drop the engine in order to do the rings thank you
With the valve covers already removed, i wonder if checking/adjusting valve lash would have been prudent
Wouldn't hurt but it wasn't the reason for the misfire and takes extra time which wasn't sold. In my experience it's rare that it goes out of spec, typically it exhibits different symptoms. Does happen from time to time though. Also no sandblaster at the shop.
Hello again, I'm finally getting around to pulling the rear head on my 2016 Honda Odyssey. I ordered all the parts for the job before getting started. One thing I couldn't like on Honda's website was the oil pan gasket. Is there one or do they use a sealant on the pan. If there is a gasket, could you help me with a part number for it. thanks again.
Wow, how much this job cost?
Where did you get the piston ring compressor tool?
And how long did it take to complete the entire job?
Great video,,,, Anytime you have carbon buildup in the ring pack check the PCV System or just replace the PCV Valve and hook your HVAC Manometer to the Dipstick Tube and test drive. You want to see 1 to 3 inHg in the Crankcase at all times. Honda has theirs detuned and is why they have this problem.
You can run syn oil to go around the problem but more vacuum is needed to pull the bubble of Blowby away from the Ring Pack and correct this problem. Acura/Honda only run -.3 to -.8inH2O and this is too low for good PCV function. Toyota and Nissan also run this low vac to avoid running a Catch Can and draining it every other month.
Look at the varnish buildup that darken the closer you get to the Ring Pack/Pistons. The engine should be cleaner on the inside than the outside.
Incredible video!! Just the right details but enough details where you needed them.. Superb. I am going to embark on changing piston rings on my car after watching. If I had one recommendation, it would be to caption torque settings/ other vital numbers as and when you spell them out.
So, I looked online to see if Honda sold the piston groove cleaner tool and ring compressors. Could not find that way. So did you buy them at the parts counter, and they ordered them for you. Would rather buy a good set than a cheap set and have problems with the tools. I'm replacing the rings on cylinder's 1,2, and 3 on my 2016 Honda Odyssey because of the VCM problem. Has only 118,000 miles on it. If you have some suggestions on where I can find these Honda tools that would great. thanks
So I watched a couple of your other videos today. Always nice to see other mechanic's work. I've been an aircraft mechanic for the last forty years but have done all the worked on my own cars as well. Talked with my snap-on rep. today. He was not much help with any tooling. He told me he doesn't have any mechanics that rebuild car engines anymore. Pretty sad to hear had. I guess there's not that many people who enjoy doing that anymore.
I remember my boss ordered these tools through Honda. It was a special order thing. I wish I had some part numbers for you but this was so long ago now.
Hi, We have a 2005 Acura RL that has excessive oil consumption and 30 percent loss on a leak down test for number 6 cylinder ( air escaping out the oil filler cap when number six is at TDC). Compression was good on the rear bank but variable on the front bank. Leak down was steady 10 percent across the board except number 6. That motor looks almost exactly like the RL we have ( I have only just removed the intake manifold and the valve covers). I think I want to try to replace the rings on the front head but is there any way you can confirm that the VTEC motor in our 2005 RL is the same as the one in the video? Also, it has been recommended that I send the head to a machine shop to do the valve guides and seals if I attempt the ring job. Is this a good idea?
Im about to do my front head piston ring thanks for the video appreciate and value your time
Love your channel and keep up the great work!
Thanks so much.
Why not use chem dip to clean the pistons easily and fast ?
Never seen the need, only takes me about 5 minutes now to clean a piston but I'm sure it's probably a decent option.
Great job we have the same problem on my wife is odyssey. I got three questions call for the piston bring the compressor tool. What’s the part number or where you get it from and what about the head cylinder bolts and the connect rod bolts do you have to replace them thank you
Thank you, wiseco actually sells these. You can get them on summit racing: www.summitracing.com/parts/wis-rcs08900?seid=srese1&ppckw=pmax-tools&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI1dKA1K3m_wIVIRitBh13jwyzEAQYASABEgLyt_D_BwE
As far as replacing the rod or head bolts. It’s only necessary if they are stretched, there is measurement procedures in the service info to check this but in my experience they rarely ever need replacing. (I’ve personally never had to replace any).
love this video, can you tell me where you purchased the piston land groove cleaning tool.
Hi, I actually got that tool directly from the honda dealer, as well as the piston ring compressors.
you only did 4 of the 6, do 5&6 not ever have issues?
5 and 6 are not part of the cylinder deactivation system and are not usually affected. There's a point in the video where I show the hardware in the cylinder heads and it's not present in cylinders 5 and 6.
Hello friend, I would like to know what condition you are in. I need to change the rims on my 2015 Honda Odessey.
Nice work very very thorough. Can you tell me where your shop is located? thanks for the video really helps me to understand what goes into making an engine and how to maintain it.
Do u need a special tool for piston rings or is there other tools to use?
Yes, a special piston ring tool is required to remove and install them and then a special piston ring compressor is required to install the piston in the cylinder.
Where are you located? And what was the total cost for this job? I believe I need the same done.
Hi, Las Vegas and not too sure actually. I am just the tech, don't see prices in the back at all.
Amazing skills! Thanks for sanding. Im lucky my 07 pilot doesn’t have VCM.
How
Much is a job like that ?😢
I wish I had such a good mechanic taking care of my Honda Pilot
Just subscribed ! 🤙🏽 the v6 specialist 💪🏾
Thank you 🤙
Where you are located, you did a great job I need you to work on my 2010 honda pilot.
does the shop have a walnut shell sandblaster to remove carbon on piston?
Great job! Love your commentary. Very useful tips and advices.
I appreciate that, glad you liked it.
I would Like to bring my 2012 Acura TL to you do this on
You didn’t deglaze/honed the cylinder wall?
Negative, looked good on inspection so it wasn’t necessary.
Would this fix the check engine light being on? I got it checked out it says it’s the catalytic converter thing but it burns oil so I didn’t change it thinking it would not fix the issue.
If the cause of the oil consumption is the piston rings then yes, it would fix the primary problem, then you'll also have to change the catalytic converter as well. The burnt oil pre-maturely wears out the cat.
@@SkillCollectors THANK YOU!!!!!!
Thanks for the in depth showing.
Glad it helped.
Excellent video and your work is awesome 👏
Great informative video. Why not replace the pistons instead of cleaning them? I've got an 07 Ridgeline with 192k on it runs like a top. It does have a knock in the motor thats driving me nuts and I can't identify it. Sounds like a valve tap but I've checked the clearances 2 times and they are spot on. Motor runs great and burns no oil just has a loud tap at idle that goes away as soon as you put a load on the engine.
Assuming you have one of these J Series engines... If that sound you have is indeed coming from the head, I have seen prematurely worn camshaft lobes cause mysterious tapping in the head, they usually check out in a clearance inspection because the clearance is done when the cam is not touching the rocker arms. I'd get a stethoscope and listen closely on different areas on the engine. If it's definitely under the valve covers, next time you have those apart, look real closely at the cams, sometimes you even have to remove the cam holders to see the damage.
As far as replacing the piston, if it doesn't pass inspection then we'll replace them but I've never actually come across one that's bad. It's just added parts and labor for the customer if we replace everything, the bill starts to add up fast when you do it that way.
Check your timing belt tensioner, they leak out and causes it to lose tension on the belt. It'll sound like it's rattling or knocking on cold starts and eventually sounds like that all the time until there's a load.
At 5:15 you are holding a part…what is the part it is connected to? Small box shape.
That’s the purge solenoid and it’s connected to like a small plastic reservoir thing, not actually sure what it is to be honest. Some sorta chamber.
@@SkillCollectorsThank you…I am doing this work on my pilot now…really helpful.
Most other videos or text I’ve seen say to support the engine at the oil pan when removing the engine mount…where do you support the engine when you removed it?
@@mcbdoc2000that passenger side engine mount only prevents the engine from vibrating. The front and rear engine mount actually holds the entire weight of the engine. No support on the oil pan is actually needed when removing thar passenger side engine mount.
Great video. I learned a lot from it. My Accord (with same engine) is currently having the exact same issue, keeps misfiring in cylinder 2. I just keep throwing in a new spark plug because I'm not in a financial position to have this job done. Are you able to give a ballpark of how much this job costed the customer so that I could get an idea for myself? If I had all the specialty tools and a car lift at home I'd probably try to do this job myself but since I don't, I'll eventually have to take it into a shop. Once again, great video, I'm glad I was able to learn from it.
Not sure on the cost but it's a pretty big job, I want to say 1500-2000 maybe. There is a commenter in this video that said they used BG EPR and had some good results with that. Maybe you can give that a shot and see how it works until you can afford to fix it.
This is an excellent video. You are indeed talented. If someone asked a mechanic to conduct this repair what is the likely cost? Thanks much.
Not sure on the cost as I am disconnected from the quoting and billing process. I just get tasked with the work.
Should you have honed the cylinders? Is it necessary? If not, why
If the cylinder is glazed and lost the cross hatching from the factory then yes, it should be honed. The cylinder should also be measured from top to bottom to check that it's still cylindrical. Most of the time though it's still good to go and only the top but of oil build up needs to be cleaned off.
@Master of None gotcha. I have to check my rings out on my 06 Odyssey eventually. My compression is good but i just want to get in there and clean it up. I installed a vcm bypass and it hasn't been losing much oil, but it definitely burns a small amount.
Great walk through, thanks for sharing. too bad that ECO mode is causing all this work in V6 Hondas..
How much is this job? My Odyssey needs it done and I really don't want to do it in my driveway.
Being a tech I’m actually disconnected from the quoting and billing process so I am not really sure. I want to say it’s probably 1500-2k-ish for parts and labor.
@@SkillCollectorsno sir. An all day job like this is going to quote for $3000-$5000.
I've had two mechanics say it might be better to just replace the engine.
Less experienced mechanics might actually do it wrong and create more problems, that happens too.
There was a class action lawsuit in 2013 due to the damage caused by the VCM, especially version 2 which included shutting down cyl 4.
If it starts sucking up oil it can cause scratches on the cylinder wall, so they say just get an engine, sigh.
But engines right now are going to run almost $10k.
For anybody with these Hondas with VCM, buy the device that shuts it down, save your engine.
Although it's been a while since 2013, if you bought it used, probably someone has already had to deal with it. Don't let it happen again!
1. If you can remember, how many miles were on this motor?
2. Were the bearings and rings oversize or standard?
3. Would honing the cylinders made a difference in longevity of the repair?
Hey, 1) Have you seen any pitted camshaft lobes or piston slap in J37 engines which had oil consumption? 2) If yes, was there a tapping/knocking noise associated with deformed camshaft lobes or a piston slap?
I have seen this before a handful of times, can't remember if it was a J37 but for sure on V6 honda engines. We replaced the camshaft and corresponding rocker arm and it fixed the problem.
@@SkillCollectors If I provide you with a video clip with tapping or knocking noise would you compare if this noise is similar to what you heard on these engines?
@@CharkatakDid you figure it out? I wouldn’t mind taking a look at the video clip to try and help.
@@JoeMomma. I sold the car last month. That noise wasn't consistent and a different oil brand, addition of marvel mystery oil helped. I drove 3 years like that and haven't seen any degradation in performance or an increase in noise level.
You don’t have to remove the coolant pipe from both heads. Use superglue on the rear nuts and the studs will come out of the rear head. Leave the pipe attached to the front head.
HI Buddy, it is great video and very nice explanation. Our 2012 Odyssey is victim of this problem and would like to get it permanently fixed. Let me know if you can help. I don't think I can do this as it is complex job. Or anyone else who are available in Dallas area. Thanks.
Bro! Where are you located at? I need to get this done to my pilot.
Our 2008 odyssey needs re ring w/ 307,000 miles.
Is it worth the money to re ring?
Cost is $3800+ tuneup and parts of $1600.
FYI we really like our Odyssey. It drives better than new.
Can you do this on the j37 instead of replacing the pistons just do the updated rings.
There's usually no need to change the pistons, they don't wear out. The rings rotate which is the reason for changing them. So yes, you can do this repair with just the rings as demonstrated in this video.
I have a 2014 acura TL with the same 3.5 engine @65k. Anyone have any tips for preventing this from happening?
I don't think there's any preventing it. Honda just made a bad batch of piston rings which turn on themselves over time due to the ECO mode.
@@SkillCollectors luckily the TL's dont have ECO mode. So far, so good
Get a vcm muzzler
Great job!
Did you change the valve stem seals?
Thank you, did not change them as they were not bad.
Thank you for the reply and I'm happy for you!
I have a question. A year ago I bought a Honda Odyssey 3.5 2005 which engine is the exact same like yours in the video. Btw, I'm from Kazakhstan and the minivan was travelled overseas 3 years ago via Armenia but the its a different story)
So, the engine mileage is about 200000 and I use Liqui Moly 5w30 oil. About a week ago I noticed little white, blue smoke from the exhaust especially when the ac is turned on and driving reverse. Any ideas for help, thanx in advance!
Does the 2011 pilot have a VCM engine?
Yes that Pilot has VCM.
Thank you, sir.
Wow, awesome video! This is so much work, lol. I have a 2013 pilot with 193,000 miles. So many codes have come on (lean bank 1 and 2, as random misfires codes)- took it to honda and the service rep said its gonna be a piston ring job. Im in the Westchester NY area. Can you please tell me how much the average cost of this is?
Enjoyed your video all the way through. I have a V6 2010 Honda with VCR problem with
number 1 cylinder. It has 70k miles on it. Started to backfire about 60k miles. Took it to Honda dealer in Marysville, WA. .....won't do a thing. Do you have a way to to contact you via another channel. If you are that close to WA. state, I'll bring the Accord in. You seem to really know what you're doing and have a great attention to detail. Thanks.
dont you have to put new cross hatches in the cylinder to have the new rings seat? i always thought that. I see youre from VA, same lol. Nice video man. Just learning about these engines since i want to buy an older odyssey. Thanks for the upload, fully enjoyed it and very informative
Thanks for the comment. You only need to hone the cylinder if there's no cross hatching and it's glazed. In my experience, I've never come across one that didn't still have cross hatching. If you wanted to take the extra step to hone it though, it definitely wouldn't hurt anything but there's a lot of clean up to be done after honing to ensure a clean mating surface.
Don't you need to check and adjust the ring gaps?
Not on the OEM replacement rings.
I'm guessing this is like a 4 or 5k job ?
The ticket on this one was right around $3k, which also included a new passenger motor mount.
Bro can you do mine please 🙏 I have a 2016 Honda Accord V6 3.5 J35 Y1
Great job broth...it looks like you love what you do ....I and you know what are you doing...
Hope you guys like the soundtrack on this one, I think I added some good music! Let me know what you think and if it was worth adding it :) Thanks for watching!!
LOVE The music by the way!
Thank you
Nicely done, but no updated parts? Had a 2003 Odyssey that burned a quart in 400 most of its life. Actually wore out the hood catch and cable from adding oil I bought by the case. Never smoked or fouled plugs or the cats. Gave it away at 232,000 miles. It’s still going. Not expected Honda quality for sure.
Definitely not expected Honda quality. I agree with you there! From what I understand, you are just buying more time but from my experience, once the rings are changed, they turn less over time, the problem does seem to go away for the most part. There are devices on the internet you can buy to disable the ECO mode but I have no experience with them. ECO mode is just some kind of trick tech for cylinder de-activation to save fuel while cruising.
First issue you had was buying a early version odyssey. especially if it was used before and u bought it. Those vans are known for horrible transmission due to weight power ratio & are over stressed because if it.
@@Justvn4thGenTL five years into the model run doesn’t seem early. The transmission failed at 93k when third gear evaporated into the oil. Not covered under the secret warranty. Factory reman plus new pcm was going strong when we gave it away. Honda did step up and we paid labor only.
@@dodgefree1400 a 2003 oddesy is still a first generation oddesy if you didn’t know. yea it’s 5 years into making them but they still used the same horrible transmission that is most likely due to weight.
This Pilot had the VCM motor (variable cyclinder management) which shuts down cylinders from 1 to 4 cylinders while the car is driving to make the EPA / MPG numbers look better. VCM was awful for the long term reliability of the engine : Ruined the pistons rings, causing it to burn oil, fouled plugs, kill ignition coils, wiped out the Cats, wore out the motor mounts.
OLÁ Skill 10/08/24 Ao meu ver, o ideal seria a limpeza do pistão ser efetuada com produto adequado com ácido CRESILICO, ela dissolve a sujeira sem atacar o alumínio. A ferramenta que usaste é ótima desde que não tenha canto vivo (90°). O canto vivo é responsável pela quebra da massa entre a 1ª e 2ª canaleta de compressão de todos os pistões. Abraços... Roberto Udo Krapf
How many hours?
This job takes me pretty much a full day 8-9ish hours.
Is that a VCM engine?
Yep, which is said to be what causes the piston rings to turn and cause the oil consumption.
Couldn’t you just drop the exhaust take the pan off and oil pump and take the crank and pistons out thru the bottoe
No, 1) the piston will hit the casting trying to get it out that way 2) even if you could, how will you install it without damaging the rings?
Do you mean the cylinder wall. You could use oil through spark plug holes and put it in a bottle and squirt it up the cylinder walls from the bottom. I know the k series is a sleeved block idk about the j series. And I’m pretty sure I have seen it done from the bottom end maybe it works for some engines and not all. I may be wrong as well
The cast supports that hold the crankshaft in the block will impede the piston, you don't have a perfect cylindrical, piston sized opening coming out the bottom. Maybe it can be done on some blocks but I've never seen this on any Honda engine. On some engines, cylinders can be removed separate to the head and the block, for example, on many 2 strokes, the piston is installed through the bottom of the cylinder.
What’s the cost of this?
Not sure, I just do the work.
Why not doing the rings on all 6 pistons you already right there i dont get it why not sold complete job
how in the hell can you remember how and where everything gets put back?
Experience, keeping the parts and bolts sectioned off and organized helps. But after doing a job many times, it almost becomes automatic.
If you take a nut, screw or bolt out to remove a part, once it is off, put the bolt / screw back in it's hole. Then you wont get em mixed up ;)
Nice Job, I need to do the same thing, thanks
Glad it was helpful.
Great video. Have you had any success with a chemical soak instead of the full ring job? Obviously cheaper for the customer but better for the customer if they can avoid a $4000 ring job
Have you?
@@je7420 I believe I have had success yes. But it’s on a Civic R18A. Still seeing a bit of oil consumption but there are some spool valve leaks and an oil pressure sender leak and possibly a main seal leak.
@@Watchman999 cool. Trying it on my pilot today
@@je7420 I used Berrymans Chemtool two separate times
Why not just chemically clean the rings?
Cool stuff!
....yo that is one of the cleanest engine and engine bay that I've ever seen for a daily driver
Amazing video
7 hours?? I'm on my fourth week not even half way 😂😂😂
Great info!
Thanks!
Cylinder 4 is the only one causing problems in mi e
Dude same
Get jacked by doing cylinder head jobs, great fitness advice.
Haha, I don't even have to lift anymore 😂
Thanks great video
Berrymans B12!
Yeah, I like the music
Thanks for the feedback!
Flawed VCM technology in my car brought me here. Great video. But for all, the root cause of the problem is your VCM system. Turn off VCM via a VCM muzzler to avoid this headache. In many cases this "damage" can actually be undone by disabling VCM and replacing your spark plugs. Over time the normal cycling of your engine can clean the piston rings so long as VCM is off and not allowed to continue trashing your engine. That can be the lesser of two evils versus disassembly of a factory built engine.
Why didn’t they just get a used engine instead?
Installing a used engine costs way more and also a used engine is subject to this same problem. This is a common issue with these older J series honda engines.
There’s no way that crank pulley bolt came out that easy…
If the music was taken out, that will be perfect.
THANK YOU JESUS !
i love video
If you wanna get jacked😂😂❤
Short guy tips!😂
Gotta look out for the short ones haha
What a waste of time just put new pistons and rings in
Wow that's unbelievable I've never met anyone dumb enough not to just replace all the rings on all the pistons to do it selectively is begging to do it again in a couple of months that is just plain ignorant.
Read the service bulletin and you’ll understand.
the rings on the other pistons don’t fail like these do, those rings aren’t apart of the vcm system (cylinder deactivation) the other pings fail because of the cylinder deactivation
Awesome video