If two bikes were the same spec (on paper) but one was way cooler, would you be willing to pay more money? What do you think about the price of mountain bikes at the moment?
Mine is around 1500 U.S. dollars..i run xt groupset, kenda plus tyres, rockshox reba fork and funn/spank cockpit on a local all mountain hardtail frame.
It would depend on the colour for me....I simply mist have a RED bike...and not many are doig red bikes these days, but Vitus are and it doesn't cost a small fortune like Santa Cruz!
@@sabo4055 1968 I was 21. First house 2 up, 2 down was £3990. My wages were about £25 a week as a fireman in London. Mortgage £14.00 a month! Times were so different.
Whether we like it or not Ebikes are here to stay, including them in the tech show is a must otherwise we end up with a us and them mentality, I'm not their greatest fan but can appreciate the way tech is moving forward and at the end of the day we are all MTBers...👍
I have a Vitus sommet vr.had it 2 years at its never missed a beat. Now what's incredible is the few week points it had have been addressed,they now come with full complement Enduro bearings ,better quality paint and have gone away from the OEM wtb rims that dented very easily. I'd have another in a heartbeat .
I totally agree I've got an Escarpe VRS and it's top class. Great kit and handles like a beast. Knocks my old Scott Genius into a peaked Urge MTB helmet
I feel that the average casual cyclist/non-cyclist would baulk at paying over £500 for a bike... I feel like people who haven't bought a proper adult bike for years think they cost £150-300 or so for a 'good one', because they see 'bikes' in superstores for less than that.
The quality and reliability difference between 600 and 300 Euros in a bike can be huge. Above that it does go mostly into non-essentials (i.e. performance) that are not that interesting to non-hobbyists tbh. I even think the current 600 Euro bike could be offered for 300 if manufacturer's didn't have to budget for oversized marketing departments and could produce in actual mass production final assembly lines instead of what is basically glorified ramp up numbers due to the splintered market.
I believe that mountain biking became more affordable thanks to "no name " manufacturers. I recently bought mountain bike from Decathlon with amazing specs. Rockrider AM500S I paid £1700, bought through cycle2work scheme so will end up paying around £1450... amazing bike for the price capable to go through proper trails - rockshox pike select, sram xo1 drivetrain, dropper post, mavic xc wheels etc. Think what you would pay for same specs bike with well know name printed on the frame..... So yes, there is much more good budget options on the market....
@@googleaccount6720 yap. Look for rockrider am 500s on google (there is a French decathlon site www.decathlon.fr/p/velo-vtt-all-mountain-am-500s-29/_/R-p-312746?mc=8574830 so you c an see full specs) . it is not available on decathlon uk website anymore as this is limited edition. As far as I know it will be available in spring 2021 again in uk. But decathlon have even more affordable bike with really good specs Rockrider am 100s, also xc CARBON bike for £2000 rockrider xc900s... It is amazing specs don't you think?
I've bought a ST 900 s in italy for 900€, but since there's a "Bonus Mobilità" I get a 500€ refund and so I'm paying 400€ for a full sus, 120mm travel back and rear (air, not coils), lockable suspension, tubeless ready wheels, and 1x11 microshift with SRAM X1000 crankset
Riding an YT Jeffsy and having looked ant Canyon, too, I would NEVER spend twice the price for a west-coast name brand. When comapring a Jeffsy Base and an IBIS Ripmo AF you ask yourself where the 1500 Euro of difference have gone.... in somebody else's pocket, but not into the product.
Canyon its good but not in UK nowadays. Price couple monts ago bump up rapidly. Ordered bike in October Neuron 8 and UK price £2999 then later found In EU €2799 what with currency conversion its £500. If not the virus happily pick up from Koblenz and have nice trip.
@@tomaskonkol8894 I think that is due to the somewhat insecure situation with the UK leaving the EU. The Brexit was not voted on this side, so we really do not care how you have to deal with it ... but I think that things are clearer now: transport has gone way up and there is an aditional 14% import tax on the UK side as far as I have heard.
Hi Doddy and team. I feel it would be better to keep e bike tech on the embn channel but I think a show is needed. It doesn’t bother me either way I could listen to Doddy talk about cups of tea and tea tech he’s that entertaining.
Here in Indonesia and Australia, Polygon bikes are amazing value, yet, most foreign brands are seriously overpriced. I guess buying local offers better vfm but decent carbon is pricey. Just bought a $400 bike for my daughter, rides as well as my old 700 quid bike. Modern aluminium bikes do offer bang for buck.
I was thinking of getting either the Polygon N9 or the Vitus Sommet. Both same price, but then i found out that for the Sommet the price listed does not include GST tax. With Tax and shipping the price sky rockets to $5000+. Shame....
It would be cool if you covered e-MTB bike tech here. I was never super interested but recently took a trip to Sedona, AZ where we had rented a small car and couldn’t shuttle ourselves to trail heads. We had to pedal from the shop to each trail. Renting an e-MTB, was the obvious choice for us and it was a blast to get to ride another 3 trail sets then we would have been able to otherwise in our day.
I bought from Commencal. It is an online retailer, which I got the meta ht. I definitely enjoy the fox suspension and full shimano deore drivetrain and brakes.
Hey Doddy, Love the channel! How about checking out some options for our future riders. My 6 year old is already doing a fair bit of off road on his 20 inch Cube and I reckon he will need a half decent fork soon but I wouldn't know where to start as there is hardly any info out there. These little guys and girls are the future of the sport how about representing them 😀
@Andrew Dodd it would be good to know what upgrades are around and if its worth it. For example my sons 20 inch cube acid is rigid so I might want to add a fork up front or disk breaks in the future.
@@knott4me561 you must not check bike prices cause what u pay for now is less than what you would get a couple of years back. Ther not much difference in components only lighter and much more expensive versions available
Adjusting for inflation, my Marin cost £2500 when new. (£1700 in 2006 money). Looking at modern bikes with similar specs you're talking £3000+. Granted I've had to pay out to keep the Marin current but that's a slow process and spreads the cost as parts become necessary.
I mean, vitus just released a carbon bike with modern geo and good specs for 2300 bucks. I mean a while ago you would get a barely functional full suspension for that much
@@sylvanmw but they are quite no name bikes. They can only fight for consumer by price. If you want something that is proofed the price is rising from year to year and the gear is lower and lower. Look at YT for example. I thing 3 years ago was the best time to buy them in term price/what you got.
@@Ciernik93 I guess but the standard of gear is getting higher. Like a new fox factory fork is better than one 3 years ago so in that sense the quality only seems to be going down when in reality the standard is just going up
@@sylvanmw in some point you have right, but are those changes so big that everybody can feel them? Those three years ago you could get SLX drivetrain and probably fox susp now for the same price they give you SRAM SX with RS suspension. I mean RS is very good and i prefer it over fox but look at that point if manufacturer buy everything from one producent he get better price for equipment. So he is probably buing cheaper RS+SRAM than FOX+shimano and still the price is getting higher. ;/
@@Ciernik93 well first off it could be fox rhythm suspension and now its rockshox select suspension, which is the same level of spec also an slx back then would be 1x11 when an sx now is 1x12
They are getting more expensive and with lower tier components. The mid tier (2k€) is getting the same price as last year but instead of bringing SRAM NX they bring SX, breaks always shimano MT-200... Suspension Fox Rhythm...
Yes and no. The 2021 Norco Fluid HT starts at $1300 CAD ($1000 USD). It's $100 more than the previous years model, but has more features. If I'm correct, the new one has a full deore 11 speed groupo, as well as a dropper. $1300 for a pretty good hardtail with a 11 speed drivetrain, 120mm fork, and a dropper? sounds loke a good price to me. Buddy of mine had an SX derailleur that would not shift right into the largest couple cogs, his shop upgraded him to an NX for free and it's perfectly fine now. I prefer shimano myself cause I don't like using my thumb for shifting up the cassette.
I saw this as well, the Scott scale which is the better hardtail from scott came equipped with a nx drivetrain(back when the sx wasn't launched yet) and mt200, at least spec out the brakes if the drivetrain is good enough
Facts. This is a principle I live by. LOL It is shockingly easy to get $12,000 into a bike... and I dont really care how nice my car is. The one cavoite to this: if your car is a van that you live in. In that case, I consider the bike part of the vans value, since the bike and I both live in it.
All Vitus MTB's featured in this episode are OUT OF STOCK on both Wiggle and Chain Reaction Cycles for ALL SIZES. ! ! ! ! ! as of 28/10/2020 19:58hrs GMT
I haven’t seen many bikes in stock anywhere. My local bike shop is predicting they will sell out this winter for next spring. Great time to be a bike retailer, but a tricky time to find a bike. Wait a year, and there will be lots of used bikes around.
@@kiltymacbagpipe Yep, I'm just biding my time on this and keeping my 16 year old Halfords Steel frame 26"er MTB limping along....at least you can still buy some decent parts for such old bikes...! I just had to replace the rear cassette, BB, front chainring, cranks, pedals, and chain (both derailleurs were ok though), and have put decent tyres (Continental Explorer II) on it with slime-tubes inside, new rear pads for the v-brakes and just ordered new a 160mm rotor and cable actuated brake calliper (Shimano BR-M375) for the front as the original Artek one just has just had its day! All in, nearly 200 spent on bike worth 70 second hand. At least the Frame, the Wheels, rear coil Suspension and front coil forks are in good order!
Already there, years ago. For the spec AND ride quality/capability, Specialized and to a lesser degree trek and cannondale, have cost a premium for years.
Rupert and David are correct. Compare the price of high end Specialized Epic 2021 (11600eur) vs Canyon Lux (7000eur). That's 4600 euros difference! You can buy an incredible second bike with the difference 😅
When it comes to the big four, yes I think that is the case. But when you look at smaller brands like Evil, Kona, Guerilla Gravity and others you are still paying the same, but you are paying for engineering and getting a better component spec. Smaller brands can make changes and updates SO much faster. As a guy who works at a bike shop I hate to say it, but Canyon and more so YT are putting together huge value for the dollar.
I recently got back into mtb I was looking at the trek slash but I just couldn't justify the price so I ended up on a caliber sentry the geometry is very similar and you get a good spec especially when only paying £1600 Now on to your point about DH bikes I think there great if 1 you race them or you have DH trails local to you 2 you have more than one bike I loved my trek session but then I also had a hardcore hardtail and a jump bike so I had all my bases covered
I think what Doddy was saying about bike costs is why would I buy a non-ebike for 7K, when I could have an ebike. With ebike technology coming of age, it’s only a matter of time. These manufacturers seeing the bike escarpment are actually ahead of the game. Cheers! 👍🏼
Hey Doddy, Great show as always. In answer to your question about the price of bikes. Last year I started riding MTB again after an absence or around 10 years. I was shocked to see how the price of bikes had inflated in that time. However, I was equally pleased to see a new breed of cheaper brands who were building bikes that were nipping on the heels of the Big Boys! It’s great to see this kind of brand competition in MTB. It allows more people to access this great sport while keeping the big brands from dictating the ever inflating prices. Yes the brands will always be there for the Surrey Dentists but also now for the rest of us lesser mortals. 👍
The Ibis Ripmo AF is a good example. $3200 USD for the Deore model. Coil or air shock option. Due to supply issues, mine came with SLX 4 piston brakes (vs Deore) and Race Face Bar and stem(vs ibis brand) Plus you get local bike shop support.
I did buy a value bike - full carbon frame, XO1 Groupset, premium aluminum wheels, rock shod sid, carbon bar and seatpost, all name brand components - for less than half the money of a major brand bike. Don't regret it at all.
Got full sus and two specialized hardtails, HARDROCK COMP and STUMPJUMPER, both retro/vintage. XT on both, v-brakes xt, shifters xt on the Stumpy. Original saddle on Stumpy, short stem, wiggle bars. All my bikes are my babies, I love them all, just the Hardrock is the special one.
Those Vitus have always been great value, but LOOK at these new ones! I suspect their staff will have to visit hospital, after being FLATTENED by the stampede! (that red tho...)
I think it's absolutely vital for the sport to have more value and budget friendly, but still capable, full suspension bikes. The more widespread the easier it is to find place where to gather and the better they are going to be. Nothing wrong with the premium brands, but for a lot of people, myself included, it's really hard to invest the money, no matter how good this sport is and how much fun I have. Six grands for a bike... not going to happen. This is one of the reason why I simply exclude carbon bikes from my shopping list. I'd rather have a very good alloy frame and good components. I'm not a pro, will never be, I just have so much fun shredding down the hills and having long adventures in the forest, or up a tall mountain and am so glad there are brands making actually very high quality bike, for a price which is much easier to reach (for me), compared to the premium brands.
When I shop for a new bike I find a few that I like and then brake them down into bits to see which bike offers more bang for your buck. I have a ghost SL AMR 8.7 at the price point I paid gave me and incredible spec and a great bike.
I build all my bikes from the frame up just sold my old on one codein was a great bike, and got a new frame titus, drive train 12 spd deore, fork X fusion sweep 160mm, wheels 27.5 xt hubs wtb rims , was hoping it be done for 2k euro but will be full custom with all the parts I like and want so 🤔 budget be exploded by end possibly 😂
If you buy a 2nd hand fork with short steerer you can have the steerer tube only replaced in specialized shops. A guy here in Plymouth does it... big press kind of machine...
Bikes aren't getting cheaper e.g. This years Trek Remedy 7 (RRP) is £100 more than last years with no notable improvements. BUT - cheaper models like the Calibre Bossnut & Voodoo Bizango that are 100% trail worthy are becoming more common. A sub-£1000 full sus bike from 10 years ago would have been junk. Now is a great time to be getting into bikes.
Recently got a Megatower and its savage. When comparing those two comparable bikes on paper, that doesn't take into account the amazing lifetime frame warranty that Santa Cruz offers. That's just unbeatable.
Good mountain bikes, on the whole, are definitely not getting cheaper. You are however correct that spec-for-spec, and performance per pound, value bikes are getting better and better, especially sub $3K.
I mean personally I've got my schwinn ranger 24 inch (might have to move to 26 or 27.5 soon) with shimano transmission the moment I got it so you can get a good deal for cheap. Also the best time to buy a bike is around mid fall because when new bikes come out that's when previous models are discounted.
Great to see some of the brands fro the 90's coming back into the picture. Idea for a video......build a modern bike using brands that used to be top of their game back in the day So for example, the Sunn Ringle hubs and wheels you just mentioned, Manitou forks, hayes brakes etc etc. I think Pace are still about making frames too. Kind of like a modern-day not to the past!
Have looked at Bird, certainly good to be able to spec your own bike, but very seriously looking at a Privateer 141. So few brands spec Shimano at the moment, and I don’t have a high opinion of SRAM. Hopefully get to throw my leg over one the week after next 🙏🏼
I wouldn t Like if you would present dedicated ebike tech (Like Batteries and Motors) on the usual tech Show. I'd rather have an short ebike tech Show on embn, maybe Not every week, but when there are news / New parts. Apart from the dedicated ebike tech i would appreciate of you would also present e-bikes Cheers 😉
I've had 2 vitus bikes... now I own a santacruz and I also ride evil sometimes... there is a difference in feel and i prefer the latter. However I've still enjoyed all the rides when I owned vitus.
I'm rideing both types of MTBs: Fullsuspension and hardtail- both 29ers and in my opinion, ther'e no bike better or worse than the other, because I think each of those have their own pros and cons: A fully is stable in almost every condition but I feel like there is missing a little bit of contact to the floor and a hardtail gives you an absolute feedback from the surface and the energy gets a better transfer but it is much more nervous. My conclusion: Both types are great, but you have to handle them correctly depending on the riding circumstances.
I recently did make the decision to get a Santa Cruz and not a Canyon, YT, Bird or other direct to consumer brands. I ended up with a Hightower C S, because Santa Cruz warranty and customer service is unparalleled. I looked at Canyon and some of the stories I read about warranty claims for their limited warranty completely put me off. Really in this day and age, you pay a few grand for a frame, you should get a lifetime warranty as standard. Things like damaging rear triangles? Not really a problem with Santa Cruz whether you break it or not.
Speaking of downhill bikes i think in the future there will be no dh or enduro bikes, but rather gravity bikes with adjustable travel and bikes made for more pedaling like down country and trail bikes. Nicolai geometron is an example of a gravity bike and the new norco shore with a park and freeride version.
When you put together your: budget, philosophy and values; with a bike that you’ll love to sleep with/ride then you get your answer as to which bike you should buy. A lot of people forget about legacy, that when you buy a high end bike with high end components then you’ve got to look after it and keep up that spec. Personally, lowest spec budget option for me.
But don't you think it's amazing you can get some great hardtails now with really good geometry, decent hydraulic brakes, a decent air-sprung fork for under $£€1000 now?
@@gmbntech Ah but the impression that I have gathered from watching TH-cam channels like GMBN Tech and GMBN is that bikes under 1000 pounds/freedom-dollars/euros are not very good. Mechanical disc brakes and a cheap SR Suntour fork for example. Not to use this as a "gotcha" argument but there is also the bike shortage so none of the companies I can think of have anything in stock currently.
If you were in the States at the moment you'd head to Walmart and buy the latest Schwinn Al Comp for $200 then just put decent brakes on it and replace as it wears.
@@gmbntech Definitely, I have a 2020 Voodoo Bizango Carbon, amazing value for £1000, and if that's still too much money the Bizango Alloy 29er is only about £600, not such good spec as the Carbon but fantastic geometry and feel, I bought one of those in 2018 and it's a fantastic mtb for that money.
I love vittoria tires, truly I do. But at $80 each the airliners are definitely not a fraction of the cost of cushcore. That being said, I genuinely did do some investigating and closed cell foam in a density enough to actually make a difference is quite expensive but it still hurts to spend that kind of cash on what seems little more than a pool noodle.
Sold. Vitus my next bike. Good geo and spec. Like the AL rear triangle. Steep seat angle. Good sizing. Flip chip. Good head angle. Sweet Fox suspension. Damn what else you need?? 🤯
Which platform do you have in mind? Escarpe is a great all round performer capable of fun on anything. Sommet loves being pushed and looks for the steep stuff. Super planted and confident
@@matthewcasey2393 def Sommet for me. I like more travel. My riding area has a lot of steeper terrain with compressions and some chunky stuff as well. I’m a bigger guy also so I don’t have trouble throwing around enduro style bikes
As a hobby, in the end it's quite decently priced sport. Something like icehockey might have yearly costs way over 1000 € even for kids. A good quality bike will lasts you for 5-10 years.
My friend had to send a vitus back under warranty because when he bottomed his suspension out, a chainring that they said was okay for the frame, gouged a 3mm chunk out of his chainstay
I still ride a fully rigid bike from 10 years ago for 100 bucks and customized the hell out of it almost no components are stock. Since the. I've bought a full suspension trail bike long travel and honestly still see myself reaching for my fully rigid bike because honestly when I rode my trail bike on my xc trails I honestly like the challenge with the single speed (yes it's also single speed) rigid bike, I honestly started taking to the trail center as well because I like being challenged(I feel like I progress more)and being underbiked(also turning heads) really puts a new twist on MTBing. Comment if you have any fully rigid stories because I'd like to hear them
I love those bikes in xc trails, I started on a nice chromoly fully rigid and you really learn to ride with those! everyone should start on this. Sadly there are no good suchbikes except the kona unit
@@WaveRiderMusic tell me about it, I think the Kona unit would be way more popular if it got the word out that it exists. I only heard about it yesterday. It's like nobody ever heard a story about a normal high end Allen key not stripping or a downhill bike going on downhill trails but she. You bring a rigid bike on those trail, well now you have a story!
Cost is never a limiting factor for me, even though I have an low/average income. If something is out of reach, I'll save up what I can. If I need to sacrifice part of my lifestyle to work and earn more, I will. I live for riding and tinkering and having the very nicest bikes possible is merely an expression of that ultimate dedication. That's just my chosen experience though, people enjoying second hand parts and bikes get my respect and recognition too for their MTB passion. What I do find bizarre is how that feeling is often not mutual. I get bombarded with jealous behaviors by those who think poorly of someone less skilled in riding than them, having an amazing bike to learn on. Why? What feelings does my nice bike hurt? I appreciate and admire every detail of customization on your bike, and couldn't have predicted that people exist who would feel any other way about other's bikes....
It's all about the "needs" for me atleast when picking a bike. It comes down to mostly where you live and how hilly the place you are living in is. Just like me, I'm living in a place where it's not to steap for my riding. The enduro/full sus bikes is not what i'm going towards cause it's not for my type of riding. Where i mostly love riding neutral wood section/singletrack. I just picked up my new Trek Procaliber 9.5 and it's pretty solid with that new Deore 12s drivechain. Going to get that weight down dough.
I agree that it is better said that bikes are not getting cheaper, (granted I’m not adjusting for inflation over here), but what you get spec and component-wise for the money, especially the if you’re budget concise, is OFF the charts. Can’t wait to see what it’s like in 2030.
Agreed I was torn between the spectral and the Vitus but the pressfit BB was the deciding factor that swayed me away from the canyon otherwise incredible bikes
@@meirsnyder3460 People think they r crap cos they're made in Asia, but even Santa Cruz bikes are partly made in Asia, as well as Trek, Specialized and more. And anyway, Canyon has multiple (very costly) MRI machines that they use to check every carbon component and frame they make. So yea just wanted to rant bout that for a sec
I ride a btwin rockrider 530s, £399.99 brand new, shimano MT-200, cheap suspension, double wall rims, 68.5° head angle, super comfy bike. Prefer to throw that around than a £4000 enduro
@@knott4me561 Motorcycles have far more components built into them than mountain bikes. The cycling industry has definitely reached economy of scale. Sure their components have tighter tolerances and higher quality control standards, lighter more advanced materials but I still don't find it justified to pay more than $4-5,000 on a bicycle when I can purchase a more utilitarian vehicle that can take me across the country. I own both.
I got a 2019 Vitus Escarpe VRX last year for $2600 shipped to my front door. Fox36 factory, DPX2 factory, DTSwiss M1700, DHR DHF, XT drivetrain, Sram Guide RE, 200mm front 180mm rear, MRP chain guide. Nukeproof Horizon bars, stem and seat, 150mm dropper. Beat that if you can!! Also it rides better than my Yeti sb5.5.
Definitely not getting cheaper!! I ordered a trek fuel ex 9.7...price €4100 in Ireland. Two days later the price when up to €4500!! Shop said trek up the prices up so I checked it out and yes trek have increased their prices but because I ordered before increase I only pay the lower price!!
I know, I'm a bit late to the party. Cush core - if there is such a risk of damaging a tyre when running at almost no or low pressures, why run at low pressures. Excluding professional racers, for the everyday rider why not run at 35psi +. With decent appropriate tyres for the conditions, surely there should be enough grip with little risk of pinched or ripped tyres whilst keeping rolling resistance fairly low. Can see the benefits of running tubeless but cush core? Why not experiment running cush core and low pressures against high ISH pressures.
Re: E-bikes on GMBN Tech... an e-bike is “not just another bike.” It’s a motorcycle. Whether or not “all the pros have them” just doesn’t matter. E-biking is a completely different activity than mountain biking. If it really was the same, y’all wouldn’t be constantly talking about how different an experience it is. For that matter, you’re already understaffed. What actual mountain biker wants to go down the rabbit hole of Bosch motor software upgrades and how to measure battery life?
No. A GXR250 Suzuki is cheaper than a lot of mid range MTBs. How is this possible - we are really being screwed over here. And now, with huge global demand for bikes and supply side issues, prices are not going down - and at the same time many people are just grabbing whatever they can get, and waiting weeks or months for delivery as well.
Ain't nobody can't say Doddy doesn't do his homework. Thanks, Doddy, you present a lot of information and I appreciate it. And as far as prices, way too many are way too high and I know I'd never pay crazy prices for a bicycle. I just don't have it and I just don't need it and I just don't see it. And when you get older, you realize all the more, O man, if I had stashed those thousands in a savings account instead of buying this or that, if only. But a new bike at or under five grand, sure, I can see it for a serious rider on road or off, someone who can really wring the value and enjoyment out of it week in and week out. Or buy a late-model used bike and upgrade with pricey components, absolutely. Or, like me, buy new or used at a reasonable price and simply embrace the affordability and fun and community of cycling. And cycling has benefitted me greatly in so many ways, most of all in terms of health now that I'm in my early Sixties and still living large.
Bike cost doesn’t really determine value. The bike I would grab if the house was burning, is the used Stache hardtail I rebuilt for less than $1,200. Sometimes less is more.
I bought my 26" trek fully with full fox suspension and SLX components for 1300 € in 2012. Today you cant get a decent fully for twice of that. Bikes are stupidly expensive today.
I have a 140mm travel aluminium cross country bike with 27.5 wheels and plus tires does everything I need it to do on the little downhill bits iv done so far I don't live near and mountains.
The hard part with "cheap" bikes is getting to demo them. What the paper says doesn't matter unless you you can ride it. I am taking a complete flyer on a Polygon (for example), hopefully the reach is right, the feel is good, etc. I can get on a Santa Cruz pretty much any time I want and guarantee it is the one. $3K is a lot to spend on something I have never sat on.
Doddy doing a Tech Show for EMBN? (at last!). This is a no brainer, I'm in. Love Steve J but you can't fix a motor by pointing a stick at it or ringing the CEO of Bosch. Bikes are bikes and one day we will all ride ebike whether we like it or not, either through age, injury or just the sheer fun of extending your riding by 20 years once the ol' body is worn out and broken. Shared knowledge is a good thing across platforms/disciplines and should help lessen the ridiculous and childish divide sometimes seen in the biking community.
Santa Cruz pioneered bugger all. Ibis did the pioneering and on a shoestring using DW for his suspension designs and throwing ideas through a CAD machine.
The 'short answer'? No. (Not getting cheaper... The Canyon I bought in June is now +20%... yeah, THIS past June... The Fuse I bought last November, and again in September of this year, is up 10%...) All that said, we ARE getting better tech for our money as the high-end stuff trickles down to more consumer-friendly models/prices. Also, consumer-direct ("Internet") brands have matured significantly and are solid options to LBS brands - at price points often far less than local stores. Global demand and supply-chain constriction/risk have increased MTB/component prices across all brands.
I ride DH and run mainly uplift days, or push up days. I dont mind the push up, its all a mater of perspective. And yes, Mountain Bikes are getting cheaper, no way could you get top spec bike for the price you can these days 10 years ago
Could you do a video or some information on sr suntour thinking about buying the auron but not really that much information about them would be much appreciated
I'm running the standard 'all round' tyres (Maxxis Rekon Race 29 x 2.25) but with the weather now changed I'm spending a lot of time time in mud - often several inches deep with water on top for several to many metres. I end up pushing the bike through a couple of times a ride. (Following a throwaway remark by one of you guys (Rich maybe) I'm now riding in wellies - I'm not a fashion person ... or proud.) I'm thinking about putting something knobbier on, but don't have much clearance. If I buy a 29 x 2.25 with big knobs will the overall size be the same as my current tyres - ie. smaller carcass - or will the carcass be the same size and the overall size may foul in either width or diameter?
They are not getting cheaper, but the value for money is so much better. The new Vitus and Nukeproof seem to be great at giving you the most bang for the buck
I dunno about not being able to get a good car for 22k. It might not be new, but you can get LOTS of actually really good and really cool cars for that kind of money. I picked up a ZR-1 for about $14,000; I think that's a pretty cool car. But, granted, I can't go MTBing with it. I get being into nice things. As far as bikes go, I personally won't spend beyond the point where the returns can't be noticed. I'm not fit or skilled enough to appreciate a $12,000 race bike out on the trails, but the performance deltas from a solid 6k bike to those race machines are miniscule even for people who are. Ergo, I wouldn't splurge on such a machine.
The price of bikes today is a joke and SNS (shiny-new-stuff syndrome) has hit an all-time high! I often see bikes 10x the price of my own, with what difference? 27.5" instead of 26", 10mm more travel and 200g lighter. Everyone is spending pro-prices, it's become absurd.
I bought a DH bike because nothing destroys a bike like bike park gnar and tech trails. I have a real nice Canyon Spectral which could certainly handle bike park duties, but let's be honest - you don't need a great transmission or top-end everything at a bike park. I picked up a used Giant Glory 0 for $1500 and use it for the park and keep my "nice" Spectral for trails and other things that require a better overall platform.
I love buying a cheapish second hand bike. My 2006 Marin is built up to exceed the spec of the £1700 (£2500 now!) bike which left the factory. SRAM 1×12 drive train, 800mm bars on a 35mm stem, Fox forks, Rockshox rear shock, big fat Continental tyres and Magura brakes all done under a grand.
Worth buying the top end vitus for the components alone! Stick on ur own frame. Reckon would work out way cheaper than buying components separately if ur doing ur own build
Interesting introduction about price of bikes. However the car comparison doesn't quite stack up. The difference between a Kia and a VW in terms of quality and drive is very profound not to mention residual values. In terms of bikes I owned a Whyte G150s which cost around £2700 at the time which came with a great spec and ride. At a demo day I rode a £6000 carbon specced up rig and it only rode about 5% better at the most. Point I am trying to make is that the quality of bikes like Whyte, Canyon, Vitus even Calibre etc there isn't much difference to justify the extra few £1000 of top brands like Santa Cruz
My opinion is that if youre in a position that you can afford an expensive bike then go for it. You will love the bike. I am a college student and i need to afford many things so that I can continue being an architect someday. That is why I bought the base YT Capra bike.
Dod, Review the CUBE STEREO 170 TM Alloy. Anything? Great bike, great price, great components! Do the review. Love mine! 2021 TM STEREO. Nice accouterments. Scott S. Ridiculous fast.
If two bikes were the same spec (on paper) but one was way cooler, would you be willing to pay more money? What do you think about the price of mountain bikes at the moment?
No way, I’d buy the cheaper bike 100% of the time. We’ve come so far with tech, that now there is a point of diminishing gains after $4000.
Everything in the bike industry is overpriced really.
Mine is around 1500 U.S. dollars..i run xt groupset, kenda plus tyres, rockshox reba fork and funn/spank cockpit on a local all mountain hardtail frame.
It would depend on the colour for me....I simply mist have a RED bike...and not many are doig red bikes these days, but Vitus are and it doesn't cost a small fortune like Santa Cruz!
MTB = Money To Burn 😁🙄😂😂
Whenever someone says “you could buy a car for that” you just say “yeah but you can’t go mountain biking on a car”
My first house was less than my mtb however, that was a long time ago.
@@paulroberts7775 did you live in a tent
very true!
@Mike Tran the cost in upgrades to get a car properly set up for off road would be as much as the bike lol...
@@sabo4055 1968 I was 21. First house 2 up, 2 down was £3990. My wages were about £25 a week as a fireman in London. Mortgage £14.00 a month! Times were so different.
Whether we like it or not Ebikes are here to stay, including them in the tech show is a must otherwise we end up with a us and them mentality, I'm not their greatest fan but can appreciate the way tech is moving forward and at the end of the day we are all MTBers...👍
Eventually all bikes will be ebikes in someway. Itll start with all the components being electric and communicating then the power too
I have a Vitus sommet vr.had it 2 years at its never missed a beat.
Now what's incredible is the few week points it had have been addressed,they now come with full complement Enduro bearings ,better quality paint and have gone away from the OEM wtb rims that dented very easily.
I'd have another in a heartbeat .
I totally agree I've got an Escarpe VRS and it's top class. Great kit and handles like a beast. Knocks my old Scott Genius into a peaked Urge MTB helmet
@@davyP12 lol a helmet only a mother could love
@@knott4me561 if you had a head like mine you'd probably need an urge lid lol keep safe
Agree, high end brands could learn a lot from vitus et all.
I feel that the average casual cyclist/non-cyclist would baulk at paying over £500 for a bike... I feel like people who haven't bought a proper adult bike for years think they cost £150-300 or so for a 'good one', because they see 'bikes' in superstores for less than that.
The quality and reliability difference between 600 and 300 Euros in a bike can be huge. Above that it does go mostly into non-essentials (i.e. performance) that are not that interesting to non-hobbyists tbh. I even think the current 600 Euro bike could be offered for 300 if manufacturer's didn't have to budget for oversized marketing departments and could produce in actual mass production final assembly lines instead of what is basically glorified ramp up numbers due to the splintered market.
I believe that mountain biking became more affordable thanks to "no name " manufacturers.
I recently bought mountain bike from Decathlon with amazing specs. Rockrider AM500S I paid £1700, bought through cycle2work scheme so will end up paying around £1450... amazing bike for the price capable to go through proper trails - rockshox pike select, sram xo1 drivetrain, dropper post, mavic xc wheels etc. Think what you would pay for same specs bike with well know name printed on the frame.....
So yes, there is much more good budget options on the market....
x01 Eagle in a £1700 bike?!?!?!
@@googleaccount6720 yap. Look for rockrider am 500s on google (there is a French decathlon site www.decathlon.fr/p/velo-vtt-all-mountain-am-500s-29/_/R-p-312746?mc=8574830 so you c
an see full specs) . it is not available on decathlon uk website anymore as this is limited edition. As far as I know it will be available in spring 2021 again in uk. But decathlon have even more affordable bike with really good specs Rockrider am 100s, also xc CARBON bike for £2000 rockrider xc900s... It is amazing specs don't you think?
@@bigmanmountainbiker5322 yes and it has 160 mm travel fork
@@googleaccount6720 bargain for money. I'm really happy to have one at home.
I've bought a ST 900 s in italy for 900€, but since there's a "Bonus Mobilità" I get a 500€ refund and so I'm paying 400€ for a full sus, 120mm travel back and rear (air, not coils), lockable suspension, tubeless ready wheels, and 1x11 microshift with SRAM X1000 crankset
I think it would be sweet to cover the embn tech side of e-bikes. I think your reasoning makes sense! Not too much though, you have to ease us in
Riding an YT Jeffsy and having looked ant Canyon, too, I would NEVER spend twice the price for a west-coast name brand. When comapring a Jeffsy Base and an IBIS Ripmo AF you ask yourself where the 1500 Euro of difference have gone.... in somebody else's pocket, but not into the product.
Canyon its good but not in UK nowadays. Price couple monts ago bump up rapidly. Ordered bike in October Neuron 8 and UK price £2999 then later found In EU €2799 what with currency conversion its £500. If not the virus happily pick up from Koblenz and have nice trip.
@@tomaskonkol8894 I think that is due to the somewhat insecure situation with the UK leaving the EU. The Brexit was not voted on this side, so we really do not care how you have to deal with it ... but I think that things are clearer now: transport has gone way up and there is an aditional 14% import tax on the UK side as far as I have heard.
Hi Doddy and team.
I feel it would be better to keep e bike tech on the embn channel but I think a show is needed. It doesn’t bother me either way I could listen to Doddy talk about cups of tea and tea tech he’s that entertaining.
Here in Indonesia and Australia, Polygon bikes are amazing value, yet, most foreign brands are seriously overpriced. I guess buying local offers better vfm but decent carbon is pricey. Just bought a $400 bike for my daughter, rides as well as my old 700 quid bike. Modern aluminium bikes do offer bang for buck.
Very true polygon is a great brand
I was thinking of getting either the Polygon N9 or the Vitus Sommet. Both same price, but then i found out that for the Sommet the price listed does not include GST tax. With Tax and shipping the price sky rockets to $5000+. Shame....
@@orchlongavaa2494 The N9 will serve you well and can be lightened down the line with better wheels and higher-end cassette etc. Enjoy
@@celynjones4958 yeah has such great spec. Bought mine, but have to wait a month for it to get delivered.
Yeah I wish polygon was a thing in Canada. They are bloody good value.
It would be cool if you covered e-MTB bike tech here. I was never super interested but recently took a trip to Sedona, AZ where we had rented a small car and couldn’t shuttle ourselves to trail heads. We had to pedal from the shop to each trail. Renting an e-MTB, was the obvious choice for us and it was a blast to get to ride another 3 trail sets then we would have been able to otherwise in our day.
I bought from Commencal. It is an online retailer, which I got the meta ht. I definitely enjoy the fox suspension and full shimano deore drivetrain and brakes.
Hey Doddy, Love the channel! How about checking out some options for our future riders. My 6 year old is already doing a fair bit of off road on his 20 inch Cube and I reckon he will need a half decent fork soon but I wouldn't know where to start as there is hardly any info out there. These little guys and girls are the future of the sport how about representing them 😀
@Andrew Dodd it would be good to know what upgrades are around and if its worth it. For example my sons 20 inch cube acid is rigid so I might want to add a fork up front or disk breaks in the future.
The answer is no. They are not getting cheaper.
thx
You are getting more for your money that's for sure
@@knott4me561 you must not check bike prices cause what u pay for now is less than what you would get a couple of years back. Ther not much difference in components only lighter and much more expensive versions available
you good bro ?
Adjusting for inflation, my Marin cost £2500 when new. (£1700 in 2006 money). Looking at modern bikes with similar specs you're talking £3000+. Granted I've had to pay out to keep the Marin current but that's a slow process and spreads the cost as parts become necessary.
Yes for emtb tech content
Just bought my 1st mountain bike in 20 years, no, they are not getting cheaper
I mean, vitus just released a carbon bike with modern geo and good specs for 2300 bucks. I mean a while ago you would get a barely functional full suspension for that much
@@sylvanmw but they are quite no name bikes. They can only fight for consumer by price. If you want something that is proofed the price is rising from year to year and the gear is lower and lower. Look at YT for example. I thing 3 years ago was the best time to buy them in term price/what you got.
@@Ciernik93 I guess but the standard of gear is getting higher. Like a new fox factory fork is better than one 3 years ago so in that sense the quality only seems to be going down when in reality the standard is just going up
@@sylvanmw in some point you have right, but are those changes so big that everybody can feel them?
Those three years ago you could get SLX drivetrain and probably fox susp now for the same price they give you SRAM SX with RS suspension. I mean RS is very good and i prefer it over fox but look at that point if manufacturer buy everything from one producent he get better price for equipment. So he is probably buing cheaper RS+SRAM than FOX+shimano and still the price is getting higher. ;/
@@Ciernik93 well first off it could be fox rhythm suspension and now its rockshox select suspension, which is the same level of spec also an slx back then would be 1x11 when an sx now is 1x12
Agree on engagement, mine is 3 degrees, too fast for my suspensions anti-squat imo. 7 degrees or so (like hope pro 4) would be my sweet spot, I think.
They are getting more expensive and with lower tier components. The mid tier (2k€) is getting the same price as last year but instead of bringing SRAM NX they bring SX, breaks always shimano MT-200... Suspension Fox Rhythm...
Yes and no. The 2021 Norco Fluid HT starts at $1300 CAD ($1000 USD). It's $100 more than the previous years model, but has more features.
If I'm correct, the new one has a full deore 11 speed groupo, as well as a dropper. $1300 for a pretty good hardtail with a 11 speed drivetrain, 120mm fork, and a dropper? sounds loke a good price to me.
Buddy of mine had an SX derailleur that would not shift right into the largest couple cogs, his shop upgraded him to an NX for free and it's perfectly fine now. I prefer shimano myself cause I don't like using my thumb for shifting up the cassette.
I saw this as well, the Scott scale which is the better hardtail from scott came equipped with a nx drivetrain(back when the sx wasn't launched yet) and mt200, at least spec out the brakes if the drivetrain is good enough
@@vdel7418 you mean down the cassette?
I see the same trend. My 2017 came with SLX and Fox. Then they dropped the Fox for lower end RS and SRAM crap for the same price.
VDel and they stopped specing Fox fork on the Spark 940. $300 more!
MTB rules, your bike should cost more than.your car🤘😋
100% true. Well Actually I think I spent about 400% more on my bike!
@@deltanovember2296 👏👏👏👏👏🤘🤘🤘🤘
Uhhh
Nooooouuu.
@@BoomKillerE Boooo! Cars are boring.
Facts. This is a principle I live by. LOL It is shockingly easy to get $12,000 into a bike... and I dont really care how nice my car is. The one cavoite to this: if your car is a van that you live in. In that case, I consider the bike part of the vans value, since the bike and I both live in it.
All Vitus MTB's featured in this episode are OUT OF STOCK on both Wiggle and Chain Reaction Cycles for ALL SIZES. ! ! ! ! ! as of 28/10/2020 19:58hrs GMT
I haven’t seen many bikes in stock anywhere. My local bike shop is predicting they will sell out this winter for next spring. Great time to be a bike retailer, but a tricky time to find a bike. Wait a year, and there will be lots of used bikes around.
There is a global shortage of ALL bike brands. U have to just keep checking if u want one. As they get stock, they are listed. Fastest finger wins
@@kiltymacbagpipe Yep, I'm just biding my time on this and keeping my 16 year old Halfords Steel frame 26"er MTB limping along....at least you can still buy some decent parts for such old bikes...! I just had to replace the rear cassette, BB, front chainring, cranks, pedals, and chain (both derailleurs were ok though), and have put decent tyres (Continental Explorer II) on it with slime-tubes inside, new rear pads for the v-brakes and just ordered new a 160mm rotor and cable actuated brake calliper (Shimano BR-M375) for the front as the original Artek one just has just had its day!
All in, nearly 200 spent on bike worth 70 second hand. At least the Frame, the Wheels, rear coil Suspension and front coil forks are in good order!
Yeah I'm looking to buy my own vitus but as you said... sold out everywhere 😔
@@Archie84 Stock for 29ers arriving in 1-2 weeks, 27.5 dropping in 4-5 weeks :)
Just like the car analogy doddy, begs the question are we now entering the mtb equivalent of paying for the badge 🤔
Already there, years ago. For the spec AND ride quality/capability, Specialized and to a lesser degree trek and cannondale, have cost a premium for years.
@@rupedog Specialized lost the plot on value for money years ago. Great frame with below average kit.
Rupert and David are correct. Compare the price of high end Specialized Epic 2021 (11600eur) vs Canyon Lux (7000eur). That's 4600 euros difference! You can buy an incredible second bike with the difference 😅
When it comes to the big four, yes I think that is the case. But when you look at smaller brands like Evil, Kona, Guerilla Gravity and others you are still paying the same, but you are paying for engineering and getting a better component spec. Smaller brands can make changes and updates SO much faster.
As a guy who works at a bike shop I hate to say it, but Canyon and more so YT are putting together huge value for the dollar.
@@Jordan-W Large part of why I have 2 Canyon bikes.
I recently got back into mtb I was looking at the trek slash but I just couldn't justify the price so I ended up on a caliber sentry the geometry is very similar and you get a good spec especially when only paying £1600
Now on to your point about DH bikes I think there great if
1 you race them or you have DH trails local to you
2 you have more than one bike I loved my trek session but then I also had a hardcore hardtail and a jump bike so I had all my bases covered
I really think that you should include E bikes on GMBN Tech show
I think what Doddy was saying about bike costs is why would I buy a non-ebike for 7K, when I could have an ebike. With ebike technology coming of age, it’s only a matter of time. These manufacturers seeing the bike escarpment are actually ahead of the game. Cheers! 👍🏼
Hey Doddy,
Great show as always. In answer to your question about the price of bikes. Last year I started riding MTB again after an absence or around 10 years. I was shocked to see how the price of bikes had inflated in that time. However, I was equally pleased to see a new breed of cheaper brands who were building bikes that were nipping on the heels of the Big Boys! It’s great to see this kind of brand competition in MTB. It allows more people to access this great sport while keeping the big brands from dictating the ever inflating prices. Yes the brands will always be there for the Surrey Dentists but also now for the rest of us lesser mortals.
👍
The Ibis Ripmo AF is a good example. $3200 USD for the Deore model. Coil or air shock option. Due to supply issues, mine came with SLX 4 piston brakes (vs Deore) and Race Face Bar and stem(vs ibis brand) Plus you get local bike shop support.
I did buy a value bike - full carbon frame, XO1 Groupset, premium aluminum wheels, rock shod sid, carbon bar and seatpost, all name brand components - for less than half the money of a major brand bike. Don't regret it at all.
Got full sus and two specialized hardtails, HARDROCK COMP and STUMPJUMPER, both retro/vintage. XT on both, v-brakes xt, shifters xt on the Stumpy. Original saddle on Stumpy, short stem, wiggle bars. All my bikes are my babies, I love them all, just the Hardrock is the special one.
Those Vitus have always been great value, but LOOK at these new ones! I suspect their staff will have to visit hospital, after being FLATTENED by the stampede! (that red tho...)
I hope not I was planning to have a beer! And agreed the Red is EVEN better in flesh
I think it's absolutely vital for the sport to have more value and budget friendly, but still capable, full suspension bikes. The more widespread the easier it is to find place where to gather and the better they are going to be. Nothing wrong with the premium brands, but for a lot of people, myself included, it's really hard to invest the money, no matter how good this sport is and how much fun I have. Six grands for a bike... not going to happen. This is one of the reason why I simply exclude carbon bikes from my shopping list. I'd rather have a very good alloy frame and good components. I'm not a pro, will never be, I just have so much fun shredding down the hills and having long adventures in the forest, or up a tall mountain and am so glad there are brands making actually very high quality bike, for a price which is much easier to reach (for me), compared to the premium brands.
I've only ever owned used bikes, but took the plunge with the Vitus nucleus and I can't fault it, it's been so reliable and does I everything I need.
When I shop for a new bike I find a few that I like and then brake them down into bits to see which bike offers more bang for your buck. I have a ghost SL AMR 8.7 at the price point I paid gave me and incredible spec and a great bike.
I’m planning to get the cheapest escarpe model as my first full sus. I’m hoping it won’t go out of stock before I’m planning to buy it.
I build all my bikes from the frame up just sold my old on one codein was a great bike, and got a new frame titus, drive train 12 spd deore, fork X fusion sweep 160mm, wheels 27.5 xt hubs wtb rims , was hoping it be done for 2k euro but will be full custom with all the parts I like and want so 🤔 budget be exploded by end possibly 😂
If you buy a 2nd hand fork with short steerer you can have the steerer tube only replaced in specialized shops. A guy here in Plymouth does it... big press kind of machine...
Bikes aren't getting cheaper e.g. This years Trek Remedy 7 (RRP) is £100 more than last years with no notable improvements.
BUT - cheaper models like the Calibre Bossnut & Voodoo Bizango that are 100% trail worthy are becoming more common.
A sub-£1000 full sus bike from 10 years ago would have been junk.
Now is a great time to be getting into bikes.
Recently got a Megatower and its savage. When comparing those two comparable bikes on paper, that doesn't take into account the amazing lifetime frame warranty that Santa Cruz offers. That's just unbeatable.
Good mountain bikes, on the whole, are definitely not getting cheaper. You are however correct that spec-for-spec, and performance per pound, value bikes are getting better and better, especially sub $3K.
I mean personally I've got my schwinn ranger 24 inch (might have to move to 26 or 27.5 soon) with shimano transmission the moment I got it so you can get a good deal for cheap. Also the best time to buy a bike is around mid fall because when new bikes come out that's when previous models are discounted.
Great to see some of the brands fro the 90's coming back into the picture. Idea for a video......build a modern bike using brands that used to be top of their game back in the day So for example, the Sunn Ringle hubs and wheels you just mentioned, Manitou forks, hayes brakes etc etc. I think Pace are still about making frames too. Kind of like a modern-day not to the past!
Have looked at Bird, certainly good to be able to spec your own bike, but very seriously looking at a Privateer 141. So few brands spec Shimano at the moment, and I don’t have a high opinion of SRAM. Hopefully get to throw my leg over one the week after next 🙏🏼
You should also cover the ebike tech since it is still a MTB bike
I wouldn t Like if you would present dedicated ebike tech (Like Batteries and Motors) on the usual tech Show.
I'd rather have an short ebike tech Show on embn, maybe Not every week, but when there are news / New parts.
Apart from the dedicated ebike tech i would appreciate of you would also present e-bikes
Cheers 😉
I've had 2 vitus bikes... now I own a santacruz and I also ride evil sometimes... there is a difference in feel and i prefer the latter. However I've still enjoyed all the rides when I owned vitus.
I'm rideing both types of MTBs: Fullsuspension and hardtail- both 29ers and in my opinion, ther'e no bike better or worse than the other, because I think each of those have their own pros and cons: A fully is stable in almost every condition but I feel like there is missing a little bit of contact to the floor and a hardtail gives you an absolute feedback from the surface and the energy gets a better transfer but it is much more nervous.
My conclusion: Both types are great, but you have to handle them correctly depending on the riding circumstances.
I recently did make the decision to get a Santa Cruz and not a Canyon, YT, Bird or other direct to consumer brands. I ended up with a Hightower C S, because Santa Cruz warranty and customer service is unparalleled. I looked at Canyon and some of the stories I read about warranty claims for their limited warranty completely put me off. Really in this day and age, you pay a few grand for a frame, you should get a lifetime warranty as standard. Things like damaging rear triangles? Not really a problem with Santa Cruz whether you break it or not.
Speaking of downhill bikes i think in the future there will be no dh or enduro bikes, but rather gravity bikes with adjustable travel and bikes made for more pedaling like down country and trail bikes. Nicolai geometron is an example of a gravity bike and the new norco shore with a park and freeride version.
When you put together your: budget, philosophy and values; with a bike that you’ll love to sleep with/ride then you get your answer as to which bike you should buy.
A lot of people forget about legacy, that when you buy a high end bike with high end components then you’ve got to look after it and keep up that spec.
Personally, lowest spec budget option for me.
I couldn't afford a $1500+ bicycle twenty years ago and I can't afford a $1500+ bicycle now, I think "good" bikes should cost less than they do.
But don't you think it's amazing you can get some great hardtails now with really good geometry, decent hydraulic brakes, a decent air-sprung fork for under $£€1000 now?
@@gmbntech Ah but the impression that I have gathered from watching TH-cam channels like GMBN Tech and GMBN is that bikes under 1000 pounds/freedom-dollars/euros are not very good. Mechanical disc brakes and a cheap SR Suntour fork for example. Not to use this as a "gotcha" argument but there is also the bike shortage so none of the companies I can think of have anything in stock currently.
If you were in the States at the moment you'd head to Walmart and buy the latest Schwinn Al Comp for $200 then just put decent brakes on it and replace as it wears.
@@gmbntech Definitely, I have a 2020 Voodoo Bizango Carbon, amazing value for £1000, and if that's still too much money the Bizango Alloy 29er is only about £600, not such good spec as the Carbon but fantastic geometry and feel, I bought one of those in 2018 and it's a fantastic mtb for that money.
I love vittoria tires, truly I do. But at $80 each the airliners are definitely not a fraction of the cost of cushcore. That being said, I genuinely did do some investigating and closed cell foam in a density enough to actually make a difference is quite expensive but it still hurts to spend that kind of cash on what seems little more than a pool noodle.
XC = F1 fast aero light weight, Emduro = WRC stage racing on hard offroad, DH = HC (hill climb) specialized tool for one one purpose only.
Sold. Vitus my next bike. Good geo and spec. Like the AL rear triangle. Steep seat angle. Good sizing. Flip chip. Good head angle. Sweet Fox suspension. Damn what else you need?? 🤯
Which platform do you have in mind? Escarpe is a great all round performer capable of fun on anything. Sommet loves being pushed and looks for the steep stuff. Super planted and confident
@@matthewcasey2393 def Sommet for me. I like more travel. My riding area has a lot of steeper terrain with compressions and some chunky stuff as well. I’m a bigger guy also so I don’t have trouble throwing around enduro style bikes
As a hobby, in the end it's quite decently priced sport. Something like icehockey might have yearly costs way over 1000 € even for kids. A good quality bike will lasts you for 5-10 years.
My friend had to send a vitus back under warranty because when he bottomed his suspension out, a chainring that they said was okay for the frame, gouged a 3mm chunk out of his chainstay
I still ride a fully rigid bike from 10 years ago for 100 bucks and customized the hell out of it almost no components are stock. Since the. I've bought a full suspension trail bike long travel and honestly still see myself reaching for my fully rigid bike because honestly when I rode my trail bike on my xc trails I honestly like the challenge with the single speed (yes it's also single speed) rigid bike, I honestly started taking to the trail center as well because I like being challenged(I feel like I progress more)and being underbiked(also turning heads) really puts a new twist on MTBing. Comment if you have any fully rigid stories because I'd like to hear them
I love those bikes in xc trails, I started on a nice chromoly fully rigid and you really learn to ride with those! everyone should start on this. Sadly there are no good suchbikes except the kona unit
@@WaveRiderMusic tell me about it, I think the Kona unit would be way more popular if it got the word out that it exists. I only heard about it yesterday. It's like nobody ever heard a story about a normal high end Allen key not stripping or a downhill bike going on downhill trails but she. You bring a rigid bike on those trail, well now you have a story!
Cost is never a limiting factor for me, even though I have an low/average income. If something is out of reach, I'll save up what I can. If I need to sacrifice part of my lifestyle to work and earn more, I will. I live for riding and tinkering and having the very nicest bikes possible is merely an expression of that ultimate dedication. That's just my chosen experience though, people enjoying second hand parts and bikes get my respect and recognition too for their MTB passion. What I do find bizarre is how that feeling is often not mutual. I get bombarded with jealous behaviors by those who think poorly of someone less skilled in riding than them, having an amazing bike to learn on. Why? What feelings does my nice bike hurt? I appreciate and admire every detail of customization on your bike, and couldn't have predicted that people exist who would feel any other way about other's bikes....
It's all about the "needs" for me atleast when picking a bike. It comes down to mostly where you live and how hilly the place you are living in is. Just like me, I'm living in a place where it's not to steap for my riding. The enduro/full sus bikes is not what i'm going towards cause it's not for my type of riding. Where i mostly love riding neutral wood section/singletrack. I just picked up my new Trek Procaliber 9.5 and it's pretty solid with that new Deore 12s drivechain. Going to get that weight down dough.
I agree that it is better said that bikes are not getting cheaper, (granted I’m not adjusting for inflation over here), but what you get spec and component-wise for the money, especially the if you’re budget concise, is OFF the charts. Can’t wait to see what it’s like in 2030.
This is quite an overhaul from there design side👌
Canyons are great value
Agreed I was torn between the spectral and the Vitus but the pressfit BB was the deciding factor that swayed me away from the canyon otherwise incredible bikes
Love my Strive, amazing value!
Got that straight
@@Calispeedboi how are they made like crap
@@meirsnyder3460 People think they r crap cos they're made in Asia, but even Santa Cruz bikes are partly made in Asia, as well as Trek, Specialized and more. And anyway, Canyon has multiple (very costly) MRI machines that they use to check every carbon component and frame they make. So yea just wanted to rant bout that for a sec
On the sommet crx pretty sure its an X2 factory shock and not a dhx2 shock
Yeah definitely, especially as dhx2 is a coil shock. Doddy just too excited lol
I ride a btwin rockrider 530s, £399.99 brand new, shimano MT-200, cheap suspension, double wall rims, 68.5° head angle, super comfy bike. Prefer to throw that around than a £4000 enduro
Leave the E-mopeds on EMBN.
E-Kawasaki ninjas
I would really like to see embn do a separate tech show👍
You also have to ask if the cheaper bike comes with wheels and tires that can run tubeless, if not could cost alot to convert.
I’m all for some ebike tech on here. Great show
No way am I spending motorcycle prices on a bicycle.
2020 Scott Spark 900 SL vs 2020 BMW R nineT. Same price, go figure.
Funny you say this... I just bought a motorbike for less than the cost of my MTB!
Motorbikes are produced and sold at a ratio of 1000 to 1 so manufacturers costs are a drop in the ocean compared to MTB .
@@knott4me561 Motorcycles have far more components built into them than mountain bikes. The cycling industry has definitely reached economy of scale. Sure their components have tighter tolerances and higher quality control standards, lighter more advanced materials but I still don't find it justified to pay more than $4-5,000 on a bicycle when I can purchase a more utilitarian vehicle that can take me across the country. I own both.
I got a 2019 Vitus Escarpe VRX last year for $2600 shipped to my front door. Fox36 factory, DPX2 factory, DTSwiss M1700, DHR DHF, XT drivetrain, Sram Guide RE, 200mm front 180mm rear, MRP chain guide. Nukeproof Horizon bars, stem and seat, 150mm dropper. Beat that if you can!! Also it rides better than my Yeti sb5.5.
It's tough to be nice about e-bikes. Suffice to say, GMBN Tech is the best MTB channel on TH-cam. Please don't dilute it with that stuff.
Definitely not getting cheaper!! I ordered a trek fuel ex 9.7...price €4100 in Ireland. Two days later the price when up to €4500!! Shop said trek up the prices up so I checked it out and yes trek have increased their prices but because I ordered before increase I only pay the lower price!!
I know, I'm a bit late to the party. Cush core - if there is such a risk of damaging a tyre when running at almost no or low pressures, why run at low pressures. Excluding professional racers, for the everyday rider why not run at 35psi +. With decent appropriate tyres for the conditions, surely there should be enough grip with little risk of pinched or ripped tyres whilst keeping rolling resistance fairly low.
Can see the benefits of running tubeless but cush core? Why not experiment running cush core and low pressures against high ISH pressures.
Re: E-bikes on GMBN Tech... an e-bike is “not just another bike.” It’s a motorcycle. Whether or not “all the pros have them” just doesn’t matter. E-biking is a completely different activity than mountain biking. If it really was the same, y’all wouldn’t be constantly talking about how different an experience it is. For that matter, you’re already understaffed. What actual mountain biker wants to go down the rabbit hole of Bosch motor software upgrades and how to measure battery life?
No. A GXR250 Suzuki is cheaper than a lot of mid range MTBs. How is this possible - we are really being screwed over here.
And now, with huge global demand for bikes and supply side issues, prices are not going down - and at the same time many people are just grabbing whatever they can get, and waiting weeks or months for delivery as well.
Ain't nobody can't say Doddy doesn't do his homework. Thanks, Doddy, you present a lot of information and I appreciate it. And as far as prices, way too many are way too high and I know I'd never pay crazy prices for a bicycle. I just don't have it and I just don't need it and I just don't see it. And when you get older, you realize all the more, O man, if I had stashed those thousands in a savings account instead of buying this or that, if only. But a new bike at or under five grand, sure, I can see it for a serious rider on road or off, someone who can really wring the value and enjoyment out of it week in and week out. Or buy a late-model used bike and upgrade with pricey components, absolutely. Or, like me, buy new or used at a reasonable price and simply embrace the affordability and fun and community of cycling. And cycling has benefitted me greatly in so many ways, most of all in terms of health now that I'm in my early Sixties and still living large.
Bike cost doesn’t really determine value. The bike I would grab if the house was burning, is the used Stache hardtail I rebuilt for less than $1,200. Sometimes less is more.
0:36 Yyeeessssssss baby🤣😂....Doddy nailed it. Always my personal answer as well😂🤣👍🏻🤙🏻😎🤟🏻
I bought my 26" trek fully with full fox suspension and SLX components for 1300 € in 2012. Today you cant get a decent fully for twice of that. Bikes are stupidly expensive today.
You can change the ratchet (changing the engagment whit the number of teeth) in all the Dt swiss hubs range btw.
I have a 140mm travel aluminium cross country bike with 27.5 wheels and plus tires does everything I need it to do on the little downhill bits iv done so far I don't live near and mountains.
The hard part with "cheap" bikes is getting to demo them. What the paper says doesn't matter unless you you can ride it. I am taking a complete flyer on a Polygon (for example), hopefully the reach is right, the feel is good, etc. I can get on a Santa Cruz pretty much any time I want and guarantee it is the one. $3K is a lot to spend on something I have never sat on.
Doddy doing a Tech Show for EMBN? (at last!). This is a no brainer, I'm in. Love Steve J but you can't fix a motor by pointing a stick at it or ringing the CEO of Bosch.
Bikes are bikes and one day we will all ride ebike whether we like it or not, either through age, injury or just the sheer fun of extending your riding by 20 years once the ol' body is worn out and broken. Shared knowledge is a good thing across platforms/disciplines and should help lessen the ridiculous and childish divide sometimes seen in the biking community.
Yes to more Ebike content!!!
I really want a set of wheels with I9 hydra hubs but with 0.52 degrees of engagement they could by a real pain that sounds great
Santa Cruz pioneered bugger all. Ibis did the pioneering and on a shoestring using DW for his suspension designs and throwing ideas through a CAD machine.
The 'short answer'? No. (Not getting cheaper... The Canyon I bought in June is now +20%... yeah, THIS past June... The Fuse I bought last November, and again in September of this year, is up 10%...) All that said, we ARE getting better tech for our money as the high-end stuff trickles down to more consumer-friendly models/prices. Also, consumer-direct ("Internet") brands have matured significantly and are solid options to LBS brands - at price points often far less than local stores. Global demand and supply-chain constriction/risk have increased MTB/component prices across all brands.
I ride DH and run mainly uplift days, or push up days. I dont mind the push up, its all a mater of perspective. And yes, Mountain Bikes are getting cheaper, no way could you get top spec bike for the price you can these days 10 years ago
Could you do a video or some information on sr suntour thinking about buying the auron but not really that much information about them would be much appreciated
I'm running the standard 'all round' tyres (Maxxis Rekon Race 29 x 2.25) but with the weather now changed I'm spending a lot of time time in mud - often several inches deep with water on top for several to many metres. I end up pushing the bike through a couple of times a ride. (Following a throwaway remark by one of you guys (Rich maybe) I'm now riding in wellies - I'm not a fashion person ... or proud.)
I'm thinking about putting something knobbier on, but don't have much clearance. If I buy a 29 x 2.25 with big knobs will the overall size be the same as my current tyres - ie. smaller carcass - or will the carcass be the same size and the overall size may foul in either width or diameter?
They are not getting cheaper, but the value for money is so much better. The new Vitus and Nukeproof seem to be great at giving you the most bang for the buck
Yes Dobby, please do some ebike tech with GMBN.
You like to be corrected? Ok, so The bike shop you mentioned that built Brendogs Scott eBike ⚡️ is in Haslemere pronounced Hazelmear
PS Doddy love this show, you’re the best 👍🏻
@@mradam4430 Thanks Adam! 🙌
I dunno about not being able to get a good car for 22k. It might not be new, but you can get LOTS of actually really good and really cool cars for that kind of money. I picked up a ZR-1 for about $14,000; I think that's a pretty cool car. But, granted, I can't go MTBing with it.
I get being into nice things. As far as bikes go, I personally won't spend beyond the point where the returns can't be noticed. I'm not fit or skilled enough to appreciate a $12,000 race bike out on the trails, but the performance deltas from a solid 6k bike to those race machines are miniscule even for people who are. Ergo, I wouldn't splurge on such a machine.
The price of bikes today is a joke and SNS (shiny-new-stuff syndrome) has hit an all-time high! I often see bikes 10x the price of my own, with what difference? 27.5" instead of 26", 10mm more travel and 200g lighter. Everyone is spending pro-prices, it's become absurd.
*facepalm*
I bought a DH bike because nothing destroys a bike like bike park gnar and tech trails. I have a real nice Canyon Spectral which could certainly handle bike park duties, but let's be honest - you don't need a great transmission or top-end everything at a bike park. I picked up a used Giant Glory 0 for $1500 and use it for the park and keep my "nice" Spectral for trails and other things that require a better overall platform.
I love buying a cheapish second hand bike. My 2006 Marin is built up to exceed the spec of the £1700 (£2500 now!) bike which left the factory. SRAM 1×12 drive train, 800mm bars on a 35mm stem, Fox forks, Rockshox rear shock, big fat Continental tyres and Magura brakes all done under a grand.
Worth buying the top end vitus for the components alone! Stick on ur own frame. Reckon would work out way cheaper than buying components separately if ur doing ur own build
Interesting introduction about price of bikes. However the car comparison doesn't quite stack up. The difference between a Kia and a VW in terms of quality and drive is very profound not to mention residual values. In terms of bikes I owned a Whyte G150s which cost around £2700 at the time which came with a great spec and ride. At a demo day I rode a £6000 carbon specced up rig and it only rode about 5% better at the most. Point I am trying to make is that the quality of bikes like Whyte, Canyon, Vitus even Calibre etc there isn't much difference to justify the extra few £1000 of top brands like Santa Cruz
My opinion is that if youre in a position that you can afford an expensive bike then go for it. You will love the bike. I am a college student and i need to afford many things so that I can continue being an architect someday. That is why I bought the base YT Capra bike.
Dod, Review the CUBE STEREO 170 TM Alloy. Anything? Great bike, great price, great components!
Do the review.
Love mine!
2021 TM STEREO. Nice accouterments.
Scott S.
Ridiculous fast.