Will Fanatics Cancel Topps Heritage?
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 ม.ค. 2025
- Topps canceled the black, so what’s next?
Following the cancelation of the Flagship Topps Black parallel, Spitballin' Cards discusses what else Topps could cancel.
Are there signs that point to Topps Heritage being next?
Is anything safe?
If they kill heritage, it's strictly because breakers don't break heritage plain and simple. IMO, it shows how much of an impact breaking is having on sports cards.
Totally agree with you
Hard to argue this. 😐
I don’t think breakers like opening series 1 either. with a suitcase full of base cards to ship
likely due to the paper, and printing. sourcing that paper is difficult.
But they're duplicating it with the throwback inserts in flagship. I'd rather have the inserts.
Black Parallel 5 stages of Grief:
1. denial - They can't get rid of it!
2. anger - If they get rid of it, I'm leaving the hobby!
3. bargaining - Maybe it will be in Series 2!
4. depression - I'm not mad, I'm just disappointed!
5. acceptance - Most of the hobby won't miss it!
lol
Might need to pin this once “too soon” phase is over
It looks like 5 is part of 1
Yeah from these comments, most people jumped right to #5 🤣😢
@@alessandrorossi1294 ❤️ this!
Always appreciate Ty speaking his mind. RIP to the black parallel which will be missed.
I appreciate your appreciation and that you watch! Cheers
🍻🍻
Yes! Great insight since he’s the only one that works at a card shop. IG is a very small percentage of the overall hobby who preaches what they like. The hobby will continue on without the black parallel.
@t-pott4504 yeah, definitely agree! It's great to have someone with a different opinion in the conversation, it keeps it from being one sided and just positive reinforcement all the time 👌
@ Except TPott was the only one bringing 'positive reinforcement' this time! 🤣
This was a fantastic episode. Great takes from T-Pott. Never heard anyone I break with or for even care for the black parallels 🤷🏽♂️
Chris here - this is shocking to me. Seriously. You’ve bought into topps series 1/2/Update breaks and NEVER heard someone even mention a topps black??
Are we talking retail boxes only?
I mean, the black parallel would be the main chase of any flagship hobby box. If your breaker didn’t even mention it once, then I’d be worried about your breaker. Both ethically and psychologically.
Imagine breaking topps chrome and never knowing there was a gold refractor /50?!
My favorite part of the pod, probably during any pod yall have done, was when Ty was talking about the hypothetical of Fanatics "bringing on a guy from Microsoft" who argues with the lifer from Topps whos "tweaking out" about losing the black parallel! I lost it, i could easily imagine the hypothetical scenario 😂
Right? I wish it wasn’t so easy to picture it.
Ty is spot on, the segment of the collector community that spends time and effort to watch TH-cam videos on the hobby are NOT the majority of the community. I would agree, the vast, vast majority will not know or care - ultimately.
Chris here - is it possible that people are willing to spend $100 or more on a box of Topps cards and have no idea what the potential best cards could be?
@@SpitballinCardsI would say so. I haven't bought Topps recently, but used to rip a bunch of Topps baseball in the 10's. I knew it was a cool parallel, but it was so rare and out of my price range I really didn't give 2 cents. Now I can get a sweet Greinke for $30... it's a cool card, but I'm only buying it because I collect him, not because of the parallel. Because I didn't collect it college, or as a kid, it doesn't mean much to me, even though there's history. Hope that makes sense, take care out there!
I don't care about parallel and insert sets...I've never heard of the black parallel. Since 2002 I've bought the Topps factory set and done a customized album. From '73 to '02 I bought packs, and, I have complete sets for every year from-73 to now. You're really just a degenerate gambler if you're buying packs for the "magic dust" cards
I started collecting in the mid 2000s none of my friends collected the black parallels, most didn’t even know it existed, everyone was just going after the bowman chrome first auto at that time, I got back into the hobby in 2020 that’s were I found out about the black parallel. And it’s because I saw them on ig.
@@9Hammers Chris here - well that makes sense! You can’t get them in factory sets.
Don’t worry, you’re collecting niche is still good to go!
Btw - I agree that complete sets were made fr binders.
Maybe the government got wind of Chris' legendary "bottle of bourbon and two cases of Heritage" quote and figured this product is dangerous and stepped in and shut it down!
Hahahahaha
I like the idea Chris said of putting all the black parallels in Series 2. That could be sweet.
I'd buy a hobby jumbo for sure!
If they cut Heritage I blame Chris for his recent Freeman Gold pick up. The curse lives on. 😂
I'll accept that blame
Just thinking about it as I listen to this conversation, one could argue that 1975 was the last truly iconic vintage set so Fanatics may feel like the Heritage line has run its course. Additionally, Topps Chrome Platinum Anniversary is essentially the same concept, and I can see it "officially" replacing Heritage for the foreseeable future.
Similar concept, but a lot of Heritage collectors/fans loved the paper stock of the set, something that Platinum Anniversary doesn't have. Wonder if it will catch on with many/any of hardcore Heritage collectors?
It could. But we hope it doesn’t!
I bet they introduce new parallels with negative numbering, because of course we want that.
Frozenfractors! 🥶
🤬🤬🤬
Heritage is one of the iconic sets that Topps produces. I, just lucky, put together the Trout rookie and second year set, all variation and along with high number sets. For set builders it is the most anticipated sets of the year every year.The red auto's are also a big part of the auto chase for a lot of collectors.
Yes 😕
Agreed all around - and congrats on your trouts
To me the issue isn’t the “real one red autographs” no longer being on the market. The issue is they are now eliminating a product that a 6-10 year old can collect and actually rip.
This is very shortsighted to eliminate entry level products and the ability to get kids blaster boxes that they can pull a hyped RC out of for $25.00
Absolutely! We need entry level, low cost products in the hobby! Especially ones with vintage designs....
Heritage group posted High Number date announced. March 26th.
🎉🎉🎉 Amazing if true! Thanks for some good news!
@@Blabbin_Bout_Slabbinit was on the FB Heritage page. Also said 2025 Heritage in April. Hope both happen.
Hopefully topps spots some kind of confirmation!
Okokok, it's official, this is the best pod so far in Spitballin' history! We need some more "all in good fun" argumentative/ devil's advocate topics, but without the hobby being screwed by Fanatics!
Jeff here: Haha, thanks for that! Yes, we need to be able to debate about PLAYERS and BEST SETS and not about why a company with a monopoly is screwing things up!
Agreed this was fun!
Heritage is my favorite set. This is absolutely going to derail my collection 😢
Nothing is certain yet regarding heritage, so don't give up yet.
Great conversation, gentlemen
💪🏼
Second this
@@rage508cardsngrails Thanks!
Regarding Ty's point, they added a Black Foil parallel. In a world where they make more parallels, why wouldnt they keep a matte black parallel /75 along with the foil /10? Just does not make sense to me
Jeff here: exactly this! They could have streamlined special black parallels to 10 and NOT alienated collectors at the same time! Why not? 🤷🏻♂️
💯💯
Tpott is correct. I had no idea what the black parallel was and I been collecting and eating up all the TH-cam content.
But, how?
You’ve never seen one?
Ohtani, Witt, Acuna, Soto, Gunnar - all their best flagship cards are topps blacks!
Ty meant to say that there’s so many new collectors that they have no idea what half of the parallels are.
Just like old collectors have no idea about the new parallels.
They keep dicking around with the old heads….WE DONT BUY WAX ANYWAYS, except Philbert.
Yeah but when they alienate all the old heads, who will the breaking suckers sell their cards to??
@ we might need Elon for this one if Trade nights only doesn’t work…
I think like Chris and Jeff so I love that Ty has that different lense or perspective. This such a great group of thinkers.
Jeff here: Love Ty and his perspective on things! 💪
Thanks for watching and thinking like us smart guys!! JK
Ty, thanks for trying to understand what they are doing even as a devil's advocate...interesting show guys-I have stayed away from Heritage this year thus far but high number would be hard to resist...too bad if it's really dead
Yeah I was looking forward to some of the rarer Heritage Chourios
So many big name red ink autos are possible....
One of the years they eliminated the gold parallels also, there was outrage and they put all three sets of gold in update.
I think you’re right!
Can topps get rid of several more parallels please?
Yeah, all the crappy ones with no historical significance! 💪🏼
It wouldn’t shock me that if they get rid of Heritage, it’s because of breakers and clearly Topps/Fanatics is catering to breakers and giving us regular people who like to open a box here and there the finger. Just look how little product is available anymore. They want us all to join breaks.
No Heritage High 2024...? That is weird and too bad it would contain a bunch of great rookies. Sad.
Appears like there might be an announcement date of THH# for March 2025
I loved Heritage Minors and I'm still bitter that they got rid of it.
Chris here - I couldn't get into that, but I did like the price point I saw
I’m all for reducing sets to simplify the collecting calendar but I’d rather see more recent sets with less history on the chopping block than something like Heritage.
Exactly.
Agreed, makes sense to us as well.
I would argue that the Black and the Gold parallels are the two most sought after over the last decade. Yes the reds.. but i would say the Black would be right next to the Golds. getting rid of the black for the black foil was a HUGE miss.
Jeff here: totally agree 😐
I totally agree. THe flagship has existed longer than Chrome golds have been #/50!
They also did a mini heritage version this year. Some high heritage boxes might not be worth much but this year (2024) would have been huge with the rookie crop of the Jacksons, Skenes…I was looking at buying 3-4 boxes of high heritage
💯💯💯💯
I own a complete run of 2003 to 2024 Topps Black Colorado Rockies team sets. 677 total Colorado Rockies Topps Black cards. Losing this parallel literally makes me lose my collecting purpose. I was planning on continuing these team sets year after year until the day I died. Profound sadness.
Oh man, this is awful. Sorry 😢🖤
Bro that sucks.
That sucks. Has to be a different product with a black parallel you can substitute to keep it up?
Next year I bet they scrap the Gold /2026 😭
Sorry, buddy. We all lose, unfortunately
I love your opinions and you are very entertaining, what occurred to me during the discussion, is the 4 of you are very far away from their target market for new unopened product. The type of collectors the 4 of you are not money makers for Topps. Breakers and degenerate gamblers are their target audience.
That’s a good point. But if they alienate a big enough group of “end collectors” - who are all the wax openers/breaker participants going to sell to?
Chris here - but what are we gambling for in series 1 if the black parallels are gone?
It’s arguable the biggest chase parallel.
I don’t know what to compare it to exactly, but maybe removing the extra payout for a blackjack?
@@SpitballinCards I personally opened multiple cases of S1 the past few years and never really thought about the black. I was after camo and Independence Day as my parallels of choice. Heritage is another animal altogether, as a set builder and real one auto enthusiast that would be awful. It is leaving a bad enough taste I'm not buying S1 this year, just soured my appetite to buy in general now.
I thought the black parallel got renumbered to 10. Still way lower. Did it get eliminated?
The typical black border parallel has been axed and replaced with a black foil /10.
Like jeff said, now theres just a Black foil.
Topps / fanatics??
I can’t / have not continue/continued to buy these products with what they are doing
fair
I really do not care if they have Black or not... im trying to think what parallel i would really care about if they got rid of it, i can only think of refractors like gold, red and blue. That being said, i can understand the sadness and being upset if it really means something to you, hope you can find a balance, and keep having fun out there!
Yes, this is big. Being able to have empathy for what other collectors appreciate and enjoy is key. Because someday Topps might get rid of something you enjoy collecting.
The topps black has been around longer than the topps chrome gold has been #/50.
But like jeff said, it’s nice to hear empathy from fellow collectors!
🍻🍻
@@shorebreakcards follow up question for you: as a breaker, don’t you want that flagship black in there? If I bought a team in your break, I’m just hoping for a black or a golden mirror ssp.
Now with no black parallels, less incentive to buy into one.
I’m new here, got into the hobby 6 months ago and just pulled a Shohei chrome black /75. Didn’t even know it was a big deal until this video. I knew it was a good pull after checking comps so I actually sent it off to grading earlier today so pray for me. But I didn’t know why it was worth so much until this video so thank you
@@nickjohnson7312 congrats on the pull and good luck with PSA!
Dude i will be livid. I love Heritage
You won’t be alone
It’s getting where there is no entry level. When flagship hobby boxes are $400+ and Jumbos pushing $1,000, that’s a sign there’s a problem. If Topps releases a product at a price point, there should be a ceiling set at no more than a certain percentage above retail for a certain period of time to give folks a chance to buy product. This stuff is cardboard, not gold or silver, etc. Then if you do buy a box at these prices and pull garbage hits and parallels of checklists and team cards, we get pissed. I get it, we can’t all have banger boxes but when you spend that kind of money and get like 10% return, it gets frustrating.
It gets incredibly frustrating! I’ve felt it. It stinks!
2024 Topps series 1 89 design variation had a parallel called “The Real One” its numbered to /89. I would be willing to bet that they are going to have autographs on that card this year, calling it the real one autograph.
That is also in the checklist (the 1990 design), so THIS “The Real One” on the checklist is something else.
Ok, but how would those be different from the other ‘90 autographs?
Card stock maybe?
I’m just spitballin ideas….
Could be a different card stock or a stamp like on the 2001 topps home team advantage cards
@@PERKCARDS We'll definitely be looking for these on release day
I have to agree with Ty in regards to the black parallel. I Rip tons of wax and like the black parallels bc they sell well. But overall the true Black parallel collectors are very small. There great cards but at the end of the day it’s a small amount. It’s hard for you guys to see it bc how you feel about them. Overall it’s unfortunate if they stop them. Even missing them in one release messes things up but overall hobby. Moving forward. A very small amount of ppl will be effected by changing the black parallel.
Chris here - obviously i disagree very strongly. They’re taking the top chase out of the product. It feels like taking the gold refractor /50 out of topps chrome. But then add in the numbering significance to Topps’ history.
@@SpitballinCards I have to say I agree with Ty regarding the black parallel. For me, the black parallel is just another numbered parallel. Maybe it's because I'm back collecting since 2020?
#TheHobbyist
Great show guys. I've never been a fan of heritage and have collected cards for probably longer than you guys are alive. So, I definitely appreciate Ty's opinion. The real one autos are nice and the black parallel is nice. But nothing else about heritage has ever impressed me.
@@thehobbyist1 Hopefully if you've had the chance to sell any topps blacks, you did some research first - Or else you made someone else very happy at least!
@@johnhargis3027 Chris here - having recently gotten into Heritage Gold Refractors a bit, I can comfortably say that I wish i'd started in on them sooner!
I like Topps Heritage cards. It is awesome for autographs.
Yes! The paper stock is great for that
I will be more upset about Topps Heritage going away than I would the black parallels. Both seem totally indefensible. But I’ll still find something to collect so I guess they got me!
Our crippling addiction is real, but (chris here) - i've just focused more on older sets, 2010-2018 or so. Ultra modern is making my head hurt.
Agree with Ty 100% here. A small segment care compared to the hobby at large. I care, I think the blacks are great, but most people don’t know or care.
Just worried about it being a slippery slope and if they keep axing things that some collectors care about, they will lose a lot of end-buyers and the rippers and break folks won’t have anyone left to sell their big “hits” to.
Ty is correct, most collectors don't care about the black parallels. You can't go by the echo chamber of your insta followers.
That could be, but isn't it a slippery slope? If they get rid of black parallels and then Heritage, what happens when they ditch the golds numbered to the year? It just feels like if they alienate enough collectors and end-buyers, who are the people who rip going to sell to?
@Blabbin_Bout_Slabbin yes, I can agree with that. Leaning too far toward new collectors and breakers would be a mistake.
Chris here - I'm realizing that his apparently must be true, but I just cannot wrap my head around this. The flasghip black are routinely the most sought after parallel that demand the highest price on the secondary market. And some collectors just don't care? I can't make that make sense to me. Almost $200 for a hobby jumbo box and people rip them without caring about the best parallel they can pull??
@@SpitballinCardsblack parallels are extremely prominent and important on the secondary market. But the breaking/ripping base often has no idea of the hierarchy of value of parallels. Everyone eventually can come to the right secondary market number bc everyone has access to eBay sold listings now. So what ends up happening is the historic hierarchy of value sorts itself out every year. But people buying the product on the front end so often have no clue going in. I bet if you asked them they’d assume that value is directly tied to the numbering itself and has no idea that some are more desirable even numbered higher
@@SpitballinCards I would never pretend to try to explain or understand the average collectors thought process. But, from my limited scope, I personally got back into the hobby in 2022 and had no idea the cult following the black parallels have until I started watching you guys a few months ago.
Speaking of, you guys do a great job. I really enjoy your videos and live streams. Cheers
Man, i love how often you guys have been dropping lately. 🫡🫡🫡
Appreciate you watching!
Thanks for joining!
If Real One autos are stickers in Series 1, I will lose my GD mind.
😟 Oh man, I hope not.
🤣🤣🤣
I’m a blabbin and spitballing fan but 200 posts with a hashtag is a drop in the bucket to how many people are going to preorder series 1 in massive numbers to do their whatnot breaks. I don’t think Topps has any incentive to listen to the collectors. The breakers run the industry😊
Yeah it sucks to say but it’s true. And if you’ve watched breaks of flagship it’s: rifle through the base and frankly most of the parallels or color. Flagship is designed to be a personal rip product and that’s not how fanatics seems to want to operate
Jeff here: thanks for watching! I just worry for the slippery slope. If they keep axing things and sets that “real collectors” care about, who are the people who open wax or enter breaks going to sell to?? If there is no end-buyer for anything, how long can the hobby last?
@@Blabbin_Bout_Slabbinthere is definitely a tipping point where it becomes damaging to their bottom line but I fear they’re gonna tinker with things constantly trying to maximize their profit and that a lot of these things will come and go to build hype or interest or correct past mistakes and in the meantime it’ll kill all continuity
You're right that 200 posts in indeed a drop in the bucket, but it can be a loud drop!! haha - I'm probably just overly hopeful/still in denial.
@@SpitballinCards a positive angle is that baseball collectors remain the most educated on this though. I found an early Tom Brady black parallel in a collection recently and it was practically impossible to explain the importance of it to anyone in the football market. Finally got it in the hands of an appreciator but if it was an equivalent baseball find it would’ve been immediately known and desirable to hundreds of people
2025 Heritage needs to happen. It would be VERY sad to lose it. I collect Archives. I collect Heritage. I collect flagship.
Agreed!
Topps puts out a new product every week, so the burnout is real. The realization is new people only care about a product for about week or two before they turn their attention to the next new product. For me being a player collector i only focus on a very limited number of products for my player, but even then im tired.... of them creating all this new product and burning down the traditional sets.
Chris here - I’m guessing one of those cards you focus on is the flagship black.
@SpitballinCards WAS
I'll be livid if they actually cut a set that could have Robin Yount's Rookie design for a Jackson Chourio rookie card. How cool would it be to have a graded yount Rookie, Chourio Rookie, a Yount Rookie real one auto and a Chourio real one auto in a 4-card frame? That's what I've been saving up for. That only happens with High Number. Maybe make less of it, jack up the price $45 and guarantee an auto and the breakers would break it. Killing it would show they don't know what they're doing at all.
Or how about a dual auto of chourio and Yount in that ‘75 design?
Yes! That double auto into my veins
Loved the show today guys! Ty I was watching a spitballin episode a while back and you talked about your display shelves.
I was wondering which ones you recommend to buy? Appreciate your help on this!
Thanks for the glass half full Ty 🙏
I do think combining Heritage and High number into 1 product makes total sense, but they should start that for 2025 products. We need 2024 Heritage High number for the key RC’s like you guys mentioned, but 2025 product and beyond release 1 Topps Heritage at the end of the year to get all rookies in. But, Topps should announce that ASAP if that is their plan.
Jeff here: totally agree. The fact that they haven’t said anything about that though makes me think we won’t see any heritage at all going forward 😐
Agreed! One heritage set is enough!
I have more connection to the Atomic parallel which Topps let go in 2023. That was something of a staple in Bowman’s Best and if it was because it was too close to sapphire (blue cracked ice), I was putting together all of Judge’s Bowman’s Best atomic run from 2015 to current but since it stopped, I kinda stopped.
That's unfortunate. Yeah, the atomics in bowman's best looked and LOOK great! Those '18 inserts especially!
There's a simple solution to all of this nonsense. Stop buying the product. I've been buying older singles of proven and HOF players for my PC. We all vote with our wallets. I refuse to pay higher cost for inferior product. They already got rid of the black parallels. Fanatics only caters to the breakers. I will continue to buy 22 Bowman occasionally and 22 Topps Update if I see a deal on it but that's about it for anything ultra modern in baseball. Also when is the last time you noticed a series 1 rookie class being deep or panning out? If you look at each year it's usually either Series 2 or Update that has the main chase rookies. And even then that's no guarantee of long term success. Remember how many were chasing Kyle Lewis and Arestides Acquino? The only rookie out of Series 1 that interests me is James Wood. But I already have a ton of his Bowman 1st singles so I'm all good. Thanks for sharing guys but again no one is forced to buy the new cards. We can JUST SAY NO to quote the 80s anti drug commercials 😂
😂Just Say No!
This is the way!
Once again Ty is spot on. Even with the 99% number.
Chris here - impossible!! 99% of collectors don’t care about the most valuable Flagship parallel. Can it be true? 🤷🏻♂️🤷🏻♂️
Are Ohtani topps black parallels just sitting in shoeboxes and landfills, dumped by uncaring rippers??
I’m OK getting rid of high number in 2025 just make it a later release and put all the rookies in it
RIght, maybe just one heritage release later in the year going forward. They just picked a crazy year to make the change!
Come on Ty. If black parallels aren't significant/worth keeping around because only 60-70ish of people can get them then surely that can be said for every lower numbered card out there. Hard disagree here. Black parallels are an iconic parallel and should have remained as such. Not taken down to virtually impossible to collect. Or the one that pops up on eBay will be an extreme bid war between a few super collectors
Jeff here: Totally agree. I think it is a bad move.
Chris here - AGREED 💯
I don’t understand how people are still optimistic about Fanatics in the hobby. Fanatics fest was a losing proposition. The tacofractor was a disaster. They are killing fan favorite products. They are hemorrhaging Topps Chrome. They have printed Wemby cards so much the cards have lost much of its value. The Tom Brady card was cool until you found out they CGI his head on a random minor leaguer body. Fanatics is more concern about printing unlicensed basketball and football products than some already try and true products. Rant over… sorry.
The Tom Brady card - I still think about it. Just why oh why did they do that
I like the Heritage products. Hope they keep em.
Agreed!
They could have kept black paper and still did the black foil /10. They are 2 different cards, but what do collectors know.
absolutely!
💯
They just told my Topps rep yesterday that 24 High # comes out end of March, 2025 releases end of April
Finally some good news!!!!
Theres been a lot of Ginter and TSC broken this year ive noticed due to affordability and a chance at hits (Heritage has less hits so broke less)
Affordability, on card autos and great photography are what make stadium club so good!!
Chris. Just a heads up. Red and green refractors was done in 22. Not 2023 or 2024.
You’re definitely right about 2023 but I can find a few 2024 reds on eBay. Stanton is the first that comes up on my search.
Lots of 2022 available!
Is Jeff in the Star Wars Unlimited game?
Jeff here: not yet! Maybe when a Bad Batch version drops? That would be awesome for me 🙏🏼
2024 heritage was a big hit. Along with the Mini release. Getting rid of 24 HHN would be the biggest mistake on there part
So many big name rookies this year too!
It feels like it would be an easy sell with Skenes and the Jacksons. But we haven’t seen it and there’s no mention of it anywhere.
Regarding no Heritage High Number: I can only imagine what it would be like as a collector to be so excited about a 20 year old franchise defining player in Chourio already signed for the next decade or so only to have Topps take away the chance to go get his Red Ink Auto RC. Sorry Jeff. Brutal if HHN is indeed gone for 2024.
Jeff has been inconsolable on this and rightly so.
😢
No heritage high # is awful. Huge RC class now with no on card real ink autos.
Yeah, no red ink Chourio autos would be a big disappointment 😐
Such a shame!!
It’d suck changing heritage golds to /50 instead of 5 but they can do red /5 and orange /25.
Also. They should of kept the black parallel in flagship and just added a black foil to /10
Yes to all this!
💯💯 what they should have done in flagship
Topps Now !!!!!!!
Jk, but stop buying topps for 6 months and watch what happens. Thats not even that long….im afraid it’s time to hit them in the pockets !!! It’s the only way !!!!
I think you’re right
It feels like Topps has effectively relaunched a version of Heritage by another name in Topps Chrome Platinum. I actually have enjoyed collecting Heritage... the problem for me is the designs get less and less iconic (and attractive) into the later 70's.
Chris here - just what we needed was another topps chrome set…
1975 is an all time design and I personally really like 78 and even 76.
Yeah I think the coming designs over the next decade or so would be really high on the nostalgia meter for a lot of collectors. But still, not a breaking product 😢
@@SpitballinCards I agree on 75! I’m all for heritage forever… or at least to 1986! You guys should do a heritage show - there are some nicey nice action variations (2014 Trout is my fave)
If Topps cancels Heritage and we lose Heritage Red Ink Autos and Heritage Black Chrome Refractors after already losing Topps Flagship Black parallels. I’m going to start taking this crap personal. 😢
Oh no, Mike! It’s like they are attacking everything you PC specifically.
I’m holding out some hope here. For all of us. Although, another way to look at it is that you completed all those runs!
new collectors are not being informed of products.
Old Collectors are assuming everyone knows the differnt lines and sub lines.
Blaster, retail, hobby, hobby jumbo, breaks delight, series 1, series 2, update, chrome, chrome update, heritage, difinitive,
parallels, short printer, reverse images, on card auto, sticker auto.
the nomencleture and minutua to details takes years to figure out.
then you have lines that ended, or new ones that started.
Brands. Topps, upper deck, don russ, pannini, TCG, etc.
i think the mistake of all these channels is no one pauses to explain anything. they just talk assuming the viewers know.
card makers are turning seasonal events into year round buying opportunities.
This channel does but there are others that ho into the detail you want
This is a good point and one we should take into account. Getting more information out there can only help the hobby.
Please check out my channel with Jeff - Blabbin' 'Bout Slabbin'
and Scott;s channel - Scottie B Cards
for more information
thanks for watching!
The average buyer who gets a blaster had basically a 0% chance of seeing a Black parallel anyway, so they'll never miss it.
That being said, I'm sure Ty is right, some MBAs who've never bought a pack of cards are making decisions based on a spreadsheet.
It's the same in nearly every industry. Disney can't figure out how to make a Star Wars show without pissing off legacy fans. Amazon can't figure out how to adapt an established franchise without pissing off book readers. The wrong people are in decision-making positions.
My partner and i have bought cards together since we've been together, 10+ years. They've collected their whole life. We are down to Heritage and Ginter, mostly due to being priced out.
True, the back parallels aren’t in retail boxes anyway. (I think).
Chris here - I wanted the LOTR show to be good. I was so excited for it. But it just kind of isn’t.
That said, I do like Reacher. They’ve done a pretty good job with that one so far.
Rather see them get rid of Cosmic or Gilded than the Legacy sets.
💯💯💯💯
Noooooo, I need my chourio heritage!
😢
There would so many big red ink autos in high number…
Love all you guys and love the black parallels myself but Ty is absolutely right here. The vast vast majority of the hobby is not aware of any single particular flagship parallel let alone a specific one. The black parallel is beloved and important FOR A SMALL NUMEBR of passionate people. Keeping that parallel for those people is super important. But his underlying point and his estimate of % of interest is spot on
Jeff here: Thanks for watching and for the input! I just worry for the slippery slope. If they keep axing things and sets that “real collectors” care about, who are the people who open wax going to sell to??
Chris here - I struggle to grasp this idea. I really do. Is it possible people are shelling out $100+ on topps boxes and literally no clue what they're looking for? No idea what could be valuable? Like a scratch off lottery ticket in a foreign language?
I'd agree that the majority of collectors do no know about or care about most of the parallels - all the foils and nonsense. But to not know about the gold or black? It makes no sense.
@@SpitballinCards unfortunately I think so! For flagship specifically. Not to bash collectors or rippers here but just look at the pop report for base flagship non-parallel rookies. It’s obscenely high. The top rookies in 10s end up falling to prices below the cost to grade. That is indicative of a buying base for flagship that is largely uneducated on the big ideas let alone the nuances of parallel value
@@Blabbin_Bout_Slabbin totally agree
Great video! Lots of good thoughts, it was nice to have a lot of my own thoughts heard from you guys and nice to know a lot of collectors are on the same page about a lot of things.
Not bashing Ty, but I preordered a box of 2024 Update jumbo and hobby specifically to try to pull a black parallel of one of those big rookies. I ended up getting a Dylan Cease black parallel unfortunately, no big rookie. But I won’t be buying any flagship in the future if there are no black parallels to pull.
Yeah for me it doesn’t “kill” flagship but it will probably cause me to reduce my spend by 20-30% on 2025 flagship wax and by 75% on newer flagship singles.
And I bet they return next year as they’ll be happy to provide us one more parallel 😆
@@PhilmingtonPhil do you think the black parallel collector base is buying sealed flagship to rip for them though? You know the wax markets well so I’m curious if you think so bc my guess is fanatics figures black parallels is a completely isolated singles-market parallel and there’s no money in that for them
Chris here - I've never been lucky enough to pull a black! Dylan Cease - at least its an all star.... And yeah, I usually rip a box or two of Series 1 at the Burbank SHow in February, but this year we'll find something else.
@@KevinA-o6f This is a very interesting idea. That topps figures nobody who collects or cares about the topps black parallels rips or buys wax. They could see them as secondary market collectors only and therefore, not factor them into product decisions. Hmmm
@@SpitballinCards trust me I’m not saying that’s good! But it’s what I suspect. The annoying part is they probably will bring it back (as you’ve said maybe in series 2) but it kills continuity
They should realistically just cut the production of heritage down quite a bit. It would increase hit rates and could increase the appreciation for the product. Also, if they limited the amount of base in a hobby box, they could probably get breakers to rip it.
They better not cancel it to produce unlicensed football and basketball garbage
Yeah who is buying that stuff??
Would be a brutal decision.
@@Blabbin_Bout_Slabbina lot more people honestly.
What a great episode, love when folks get riled up. I will say i think Ty is more right than wrong about blacks. I think it's a mistake of course as people love it, but it’s not like they are getting rid of golds to 2025, I think a large majority of collectors have never ever seen a black patallel nevermind care about it.
Chris here - this feels insane to me. If you aren’t hoping to pull a black, what are you ripping a flagship box for?
The auto or relic for sure. Rare inserts of big names. Rookies of pretty much any color. Same as most boxes. Like I just don’t think most collectors really care about the black parallel, but a small number care about it A LOT. The Indy Day parallel is a much bigger deal in the more casual communities I’ve seen in that realm , and like last year’s black parallels were barely different than the base whereas the other ones really popped.
I love the black parallel but I'm with Ty on the amount of people in the hobby that will miss it. I think sometimes you guys get stuck in your own echochamber a little bit. Even if a few more than the 75 that can actually get one like seeing them on instagram they'll just move on to thinking about something else 5 minutes later
Chris here - I just don't know about this. Truly. When i rip a flagship box, a topps black is the number one thing I'm hoping to pull. And i know it's not just me.
Heritage is a more niche set in the market. Whereas Platinum, Finest, Cosmic, Chrome, Chrome Black, Brooklyn, Gilded, Logofractor, Sapphire, Five Star, Museum Collection, Pristine, etc…all sort of serve the same market.
Get rid of the last 5 of those at least, there are way too many sets.
FYI Topps series 1 odds are out and they are brutal
Brutal is right
i dont know who is breaking this stuff. lol its awful to even try
It seems like they could still profit by slapping RC on Skenes and Jackson(s) cards in 2025 Heritage UNLESS there is some weird MLBPA protocol to that RC designation. It would still be those players first Heritage cards. I was waiting with great anticipation for High Number, knowing the key rookies in Update would be in the set.
Yes, 2024 Heritage Monster Boxes with the fun Blue Sparkle Chrome cards were about $35 over the holidays. They got my money more than once.
There is indeed.
Players can only have one year of rookie cards.
First heritage card is something, but it’s not a rookie card.
Does Platinum Anniversary go away also?
No idea!
I'm not too familiar with the Heritage product in boxes, so correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't a hobby box one auto or memorabilia? Personally, I don't care about anything in Heritage but the Heritage autos so I don't see why not just put it in Series 1 if they're promising the same thing - one auto or memorabilia. Like you said in the vid, streamline the hits. Maybe add Heritage chrome as SP in Series 1 later.
Also wanted to add is that I don't buy Series 1 but I'd consider it if there was the ability to get a Real One Auto
You are right about heritage hobby boxes - usually you just get a crappy relic.
Yeah we all want to keep the red inks around!
I have to agree with Ty. In my region Topps Black parallels, even the beloved 1st Bowman is not a thing when you get into the weeds with collectors and dealers in person. If you speak to the majority of people they have no desire to collect these cards.
Chris here - this is interesting. Certainly not everybody collects the same stuff. What’s the most popular stuff in your region?
Here to praise Ty, not bash. I think his take is correct. Still, this was a dumb move by Topps.
Jeff here: thanks for watching and seems like a popular take! 💪🏼
Make it hobby only and concentrate the hits
Topps Big Leauge is so midz! The kids today want sapphire chrome and Topps Dynasty! lol . Im am so ready for Spencer Strider to be a regular of this show again. people forget man just how good he is. I predict his prices will rise again at some point
Chris here - you know I hope so too!!
Big League is cheap -- boxes make great for gifts for 7-year-olds!😂
Maybe it is bigger picture and they are adjusting product offerings to better prepare for basketball and football licenses coming on line. Printing capacity may be a factor as they plan for 3 sports and sufficient products within each sport.
@19:00 tea-pot is right here... most casuals dont care.
The idea that a person would spend $100+ on a box of topps and have no idea or not care about what the best cards are, or what they should be looking for is really hurting my brain.
I don't know.
Gotta make room for clown basketball cards and bootleg football cards. Those will hold their value
Who is buying those??
@Blabbin_Bout_Slabbin exactly
I think Ty is more right than he is being given credit for. I never cared about any parallel and really wasn't aware of it until IG. I collected the sets I wanted, and I did not care or even want a gold colored or black colored border. I also didn't want chrome cards until very recently.
well, maybe check your collection for any big name topps black parallels you might have sitting in boxes!
Just chiming in to say I’ve been watching this channel for a year on and off and have been casually in the hobby for about two years (mostly ripping flagship) and I had never heard of the black parallel until this video. Not proud of this, just saying.
Chris here - I need to go lay down.
Jeff here: This is surprising to me as it was one of the first things I heard about when I came back in 2018, but maybe it was because that year’s black parallel design was especially iconic?
Come on Ty! Come on man!🤫
Chris here - I was shocked at his 99% number. Figured it would be maybe 10.
But based on the comments on this video, it’s closer to 50%, which blows my mind.
I get what T-pot is saying, Fanatics is thinking much bigger and not concerned so much about older traditional collectors that pc black parallels. Also, I believe it to be true the collectors 20 years old and younger as well as all the future collectors could care less about the black parallels when there is lava lamp and hot dog parallels. just saying... LOL
😂😂
I think some of the guys are equating value with notoriety among the masses. I Ty is closer to right about the black parallel. Doesn’t mean it’s a good decision though.
Hmm, maybe. But I do think that negative word of mouth on social media and negative sentiment is a pretty big cost for Topps and Fanatics to pay. There are a lot of people who collect those specific cards that have a large platform who are going to be peeved. So I definitely agree, a bad decision.
Chris here - I mean what else are we opening Topps Flagship packs and hoping to pull??
@@SpitballinCards Stars of MLB & Hotdog parallels - Duhhhh.
@@t-pott4504 hahahahhahaha
@ well I’ve never pulled one so I’m looking for stuff that’s attainable haha.
As for black I think it’s a little confusing as to the numbering to those not in the know and more so for football/basketball as Topps hasn’t been making cards for that many years. I hate to see it leave but can see some reasoning. Heritage going away though seems like it will alienate a lot more customers who enjoy the set collecting/nostalgic aspect.
I can see that, as the numbering changes annually. For the record, it's the number of years Topps has made baseball cards.
Yep I know it’s just not the most clear to everyone. Could have just set it to 75 perpetually though to alleviate confusion and kept the parallel. Lots of good ideas rather than just eliminating altogether.