I really like this take. In the beginning of the character, she's a psychiatrist who abandons it all to become a full time clown. Then, in her more recent years, they like to emphasize that she is still a psychiatrist, she still has all her training and knowledge, but it still falls very much to the background as a chaos clown lady. Now we've come full circle as a strictly psychology based supervillain who just has a clown esthetic
I like this iteration of her, but I do also love her being certified insane and she is insane but also a therapist. 😂 She'll be like "You definitely were abused as a child, where did that start?"
I completely agree. Also like the fact she's never once said her trademark "Call me Harley, everyone does" line even while in her more bubbly public persona.
4:26 From what we hear in the show, I don't actually think Bruce was in any danger from Harley. She sees that Bruce's personality is hollow, a protective shell around a traumatized child. Bruce isn't a horrible person like the other elite (we know he's the biggest donor to the orphanage). And as she said, "I don't see you as a danger to yourself or others." I think Harley genuinely just wanted to help Bruce finally process that tragic night.
@@gyrrakavian It might've given her some hope in humanity to meet at least ONE wealthy person who wasn't greedy, or selfish. STILL, what she is doing to the ones that DO make her list isn't really the right thing to do (though, Harleen no doubt doesn't view herself as a villain, and actually believes that she is doing the right thing...which only makes her more dangerous.)
My friend and I came to the wrong conclusion that all of Quinn's victims were based on obscure villians. Though I do think a fascinating twist would be if she unintentionally creates The Joker. Perhaps some TV executives or something in entertainment. She works to break him like so many others. But when he hits the breaking point he becomes something she can't control or restrain.
that would be interesting. Having Harleen Quinzel create the joker through trying to punish and 'reform' someone and ending up creating the perfect storm of conditions for things to make the joker. A comedian and famous tv show personality given the archetype of the joker, forced to give up his wealth then 'die' by falling into a vat of chemicals... only he didn't die... he became bleached instead and was reborn. he thanks dr quinzel for making him the man he has become today, and takes a terrifying revenge upon the city by targeting people with deadly toxin and making it clear that his world view is not that the elite must die... but everyone in the city that made him. from the elites that harleen despises to people like harleen who abuses and manipulates peoples trust into serving her own ends. Harleen realising she has made a fatal error with one of her clients... but cannot figure out who they are because of how RADICALLY the joker has been altered psychologically. not to mention, harleen eventually realises she destroyed the file of the patient that would become the joker, unwitting making him a terrifying enigma. batman works with renee and harleen to try and identify the madman to stop him, only for the joker to out harleen's secret to renee, doing severe damage to their relationship. he doesn't want harleen dead or at his side... he wants her to be just as broken as she left him. to feel betrayed, tormented, stripped of worth, and discarded. A Monster in the eyes of gotham and the world... Just like she made him. after that... its up to her to decide if she wants to jump into a vat of the toxin... or face the world that would condemn her crimes and judge her as a monster. his introduction is with a broadcast of an old show that he highjacks to deliver his chilling message. that at a certain time, someone specific is going to die.
You know, this Harley’s fixation on punishing the rich and the powerful actually makes her VERY similar to most traditional depictions of Poison Ivy, which leaves me wondering what the writers will do if they end up adapting Ivy herself…
I do wonder if they will pursue an Ivy that goes more mad scientist, in that she identifies with plans more than humans. Reminds me of some of her more dsrker episodes that saw her use a guy to make "children" plant hybrids to do her bidding.
Harleys scheme was very reminiscent of a scheme Hugo Strange would pull. Especially the clinic he had in his pre crisis return in the 70s. The man difference is Harley had much more altruistic motivation by giving all the money away, while Strange is motivated by pure greed
Giving the money away? She had a bigass mansion to keep the "patients" in, a butler whos more than okay with all of this madness going in it and invites her dates to extremely exspensive places I belive the donations was just a small bit compared to amount she takes for herself
Ironically, I didnt watch the episodes in order at first so I missed the previous Hugo Strange mention and just thought they were combining Harley (who obviously doesn't have an existing "demake" version) and Strange into a single character. Which is weird, but I guess no weirder than what BTAS did with lumping (HEH) Clayfaces together.
I wonder of Tim is intentionally keeping the Joker out? The joker has dominated Batman stories lately. TAS. Life action. Videogames. The LEGO Batman movie. Even Harley own show. When he was there, he has created, commanded or manipulated nearly every villain, up to Luthor in Justice League. Harley was simply the most extreme case of being tied to joker. If he can divorce her character from the Joker, he can do it with all of them.
He appeared in the last scene of the last episode, so he's coming, I hope they do in an epic fashion like they did in movie The Dark Knight, I'd love see a storyline like that being used in In the classical Batman setting that the show takes place.
Maybe that is why they kept him out of this season specifically. He is too mentally powerful of a character in the narrative to not be "everywhere and nowhere" and too well-known to be left out of any even vaguely batman-related medium at this point, but the audience desperately needed a break from him.
The focus on Harley’s ability to psychologically analyze people was a really good way to freshen up her character. A lot of times you can forget she’s a psychologist and not miss anything so it was a great way to reinvent her.
Yeah, Harley is usually "psychologist that turned into evil clown" and here she's "psychologist with clown aesthetic" which is a freshing take on her. Glad they were able to combine both of her most interesting parts of her.
I agree, though I do think it treads on the toes of other rogues a bit. Scarecrow in specific; the whole "former psychologist uses their knowledge of the human brain to hurt people" thing is kinda his schtick.
@@swishfish8858 that’s like saying “Mad Hatter being insane is kinda treading on the toes of the Joker” or “Bane being a clever and skilled fighter is kinda treading on the toes of Rah’s Al Ghul” or “Killer Croc being an animal human hybrid kinda treads on the toes of Man Bat”, villains can have similar traits and still be different from one another
Theory Since Harley, in episode 5, did mention a "professor Crane" (no doubt a reference to Scarecrow), if he shows up later in series, I could see he and Harley having a team up, since they are both villains who mentally torture their victims, although Harley chooses those she thinks deserve it, while Crane, most likely will be like his comic book counterpart: more sadistic and torture people for his own pleasure and studies on fear.
No joke that was an original plot for a movie Scarecrow and Harley Quinn call Batman unchained But it was cancelled due to the Overwhelmingly negative movie Batman and Robin
@@sarumike-bb5ip Yeah. If I remember correctly, she would be established as Joker's daugther, wanting revenge on Batman for the death of her father (speaking of which, the film would also have Jack Nicholson reprising his role as Joker, showing as allucionation, alongside other rogues from previous films)
@@christiandauz3742 This could happen, but then Crsane would be way to similar to Harley Quinn. It would make more sense if Crane was more sadistic and torturing not just the corrupt elite members but also many other people, creating a contrast between him and Harley, who, despite her flaws, only punish those she feels deserve it.
I trust Bruce Timm enough with Harley to wonder if this is basically his "What if Harley still became a villain but never met the Joker?" scenario for her. The suggestion Harley might have been driven to do dodgy shit for the sake of psychology anyway, but without the Joker to egg her on and encourage an outrageous, completely amoral persona she ends up (by comic book standards) being a antagonist with a weaker visual gimmick whose heart is not really in being rampantly malicious for no reason. From the point of view of her own mental health I suppose it's a net win but her being weaker villain fodder because of it is why I can see people acting its of a loss for the comic book narrative. (At this point, I'd have more respect if they stick to that, but I worry the tease of the Joker in the season finale might mean a meet-up and Harley becoming a more outrageous, standard version of herself)
They’ve been pretty careful with it. I think even the joker will be different enough from his usual depictions like all the villains rewritten so far. If anything I predict they’re gonna make him like Joaquin phoenix’s maybe a lil
What I found interesting about this version is that she mentioned being mentored by Crane [i.e. Scarecrow], which speaks volumes for her views on ethics.
The reference to The Stress of Her Regard novel by Tim Powers comes from the fact that the story tells of Michael Crawford who is forced to leave his hometown when his bride’s life is ended by a sadistic vampire who claims Michael as her bridegroom. Together with a team of fictionalized versions of famous authors such as Byron, Keats, and Shelley, Michael embarks on a journey across Europe to stop the vampire who killed his bride before she continues gaining pleasure from torturing her victims’ minds, souls, and bodies. I guess Bruce Timm wanted Caped Crusader Harley Quinn to have similar personality traits to the vampire that kills Michael’s bride in the Stress of Her Regard book and maybe the psychological stress that Harley inflicts against her patients with her “regard” (i.e. her torture methods) is also a reference to that Tim Powers story. That’s what I gathered from the title being included in Batman Caped Crusader but I’m sure there’s more information about this reference to be found. 🤷♀️
I did some digging as well and it looks like there are numerous parallels: In Powers' book, supernatural creatures manipulate and inspire their human hosts, a theme mirrored by Dr. Harleen Quinzel's manipulation of her wealthy clients in the episode. This reflects a shared interest in the complex interplay between influence and control. Both works delve into the dual nature of characters. Powers' nephilim inspire creativity while causing harm, much like Harley Quinn's portrayal as both compassionate with her patients during her sessions with them in her office and when she's torturing them in her personal dungeon. While Powers incorporates historical figures like Byron and Shelley, the episode reinterprets classic characters from the Batman mythos, offering a fresh perspective akin to Powers' reimagining of the Romantic poets. Additionally, both the novel and the episode embrace gothic elements (in "Gotham" City no less), with Harley Quinn's menacing role enhancing the dark, atmospheric tone. Although not explicitly mentioned, the episode's plot involving the abduction of wealthy men potentially hints at the presence of secret organizations (which in this case would be the Court of Owls), reminiscent of the secret societies like the Carbonari in Powers' narrative. If this is true, Harley might turn out to be an anti-hero in future seasons, not only punishing the wealthy in Gotham for their greed and social negligence but also to potentially uncover some kind of secret nefarious plot she may have discerned from her interactions with them. Lastly, both stories explore the theme of obsession and its connection to creativity or genius, highlighting the costs and complexities of such intense relationships.
@@Primordial_Synapse that’s an amazing thesis you’ve made. It’s honestly really outstanding; thank you for sharing with us. Personally my enjoyment of Caped Crusader Harley Quinn has been enhanced thanks to your comment. I love it. Thank you again 💚💛
2.5 episodes of her being a practicing psychologist is basically three times the length she’s usually seen as a Doctor. Most other versions I can think of devoted like 15 minutes of an episode to pre-Joker Harley.
I do think the harley from her stand alone show is a pretty good therapist sort, considering she becomes batman's therapist.. but the characterization of everyone in that show is a little extra wacky, lol.
IDK, I think the Haley Cuoco Harley is a good psychologist, too. She helps not only Ivy, but Bruce and herself through a LOT of mental stuff in that cartoon.
5:58 Like Harley and Ivy's relationship, Renee was meant to be a lesbian from the beginning. It's just that again, 90s morality kept her in the closet.
Just ask the English dubs of Sailor Moon with the two cousins…. and never reconsider to check every scene that is meant for intimacy. WHATWERETHEYTHINKING?!?!
@reginaldcaine6161 The morality we're talking about is focused on the children, not society in general. Basically, it boils down to sheltering children from reality. A good example is the original Red Riding Hood. In it the wolf won and ate Red and Grandma since it was meant to teach a lesson about not talking to strangers. But parents had it censored to protect children.
@ztyran Or, hear me out... wolf attacks fucking stopped. Why have a grim story for kids, when it won't even help them? I'm not saying kids shouldn't see women who love women. What I am saying, is perhaps a straight man drawing gay women in their underwear IS inappropriate for kids. Remember, this guy isn't a "gay ally" or whatever people say theses days. The same guy who wants this, put Batman and Batgirl together all the time as a couple. Excuse me for not wanting my superhero to groom his bestfriend's daughter and fuck the "employee" under him. He is a creep who is doing this for creep reasons. It has nothing to do with gays, and everything to do with a straight guy drawing his fetishes for kids.
@@ztyranHonestly, I'd argue that was censorship done right. Same may even go with how the movie Alien changed its ending to something more ambiguous yet hopeful, which thankfully led to Aliens... which then led to Alien³, but that's another story entirely.
I really wish that instead of what happened, Harley brainwashed them is become, calender-man, that one pencil villan, condiment king, and other like loser villains
@@Napichoo4290 It's also worth noting that Eraser is actually an incredibly effective villain, he just has a dumb costume that makes him hard to take seriously
I know that a lot of people prefer Harley Quinn as the "manic pixie dream girl" but this version of the character that still takes inspiration from her being a psychiatrist is a breath of fresh air.
Okay, but imagine a blend of the two. Like this Harley becomes completley unhinged but also keeps up the psychological torture angle. That would be absolutely horrifying in the best possible way.
There a bit of that in that poison ivy and Harley queen animated serie. Harley is still the “manic pixie dream girl” but still as a couple of moments with her psychiatrist side showing. It’s not for everyone since it way more comedic then anything else but it’s a version of Harley that is allowed to be more then the typical battered woman I had to grew up watching so much appreciated to see more and more spin on these characters coming out.
As someone who is sick to death of seeing Harley Quinn absolutely everywhere, getting me to actually like this version is one of Caped Crusader's highest achievements.
I agree, I am so sick and tired of modern Harley that any twist on her character is welcomed, like seriously she has been stagnant ever since the new 52 and her anti hero status is flimsy at best, only reason she doesn't spend time in jail is that she signs up for the suicide squad every single time. Now if we can get a suicide squad piece of media that doesn't have her shoved into the team for no reason, then we are golden
I can't tell you how happy I am that this show went back to a more traditional Harley design. I've gotten so tired of the stripper look. It's also nice that this Harley leans more into her backstory as a psychiatrist, something that a majority of iterations tend to ignore.
@@alperenakdas3479 I've never liked that change, and refuse to acknowledge it as cannon to the show. Harley is much more interesting as someone who genuinely wanted to help people, but was ultimately manipulated by one of her patients into becoming a monster. It's the whole reason why her character in the show was so tragic. Taking that away robs Harley of a lot of sympathy, because it make it seem like she was already an awful person to begin with.
@@kamikazelemming1552 Also, a fairly nasty "pretty women are whores" trope/fetish that doesn't make any sense given the complexities of that profession; when college age women end up fucking their professors its generally a creepy one-sided power imbalance they're not eager about. Ironically, I'd argue it also takes away from the implicit danger of the Joker and the effect he can have on an otherwise intelligent professional.
Speaking of Jungian archetypes, I would argue that the Batman is not a Hero. Depending upon the version, he is usually a Rebel, as he is in this version, or a Sage as the Adam West Batman was. Most superheroes aren't Jungian heroes as the nature of the superhero genre gets in the way of a journey of self-discovery.
Awesome video, like always. Another thing to Harley said Cran was her collage professor. Cran aka the scarecrow experience on his students, maybe that influenced her to do the things she's doing it could be something they can expand in the future.
Did you spot the advert for his book in the newspapers Batman scoured through? I like the idea of The Scarecrow being a sefhelp guru, or a pop psychologist
Worry about the Joker more. I am sure the Joker in this show would take a certain level of inspiration from the 40s comics but judging by that seasonal end scene, he's still gonna be pretty dark.
Timm made Harley Quinn to be a one episode hench woman. Arleen Sorkin made her a fan favorite which created a legacy for all the variant Harleys. If Timm made Harley like this to begin with, she would've never made it out of the original animated series.
This version really feels like Hugo Strange without the weird back and forth they did with him (introduced as geneticist, suddenly psychiatrist...because? )
Seeing a more modern reimagining of Harley Quinn who isn’t attached to the Joker while also still keeping her as a villain *and* makes use of her psychological background was actually a very inspired choice. It also changes the whole context of the therapy sessions Bruce and her have, since she wasn’t actually trying to get him to open up about his trauma to help him, but instead to manipulate and take his wealth like with the other billionaires she’s counseled. But because of how guarded and closed-off Bruce is, it ended up unknowingly benefiting him when Harleen gives up due to not even her being able to scale the insurmountable walls he’s formed around himself. I feel totally bad for Montoya though, since the girl got stood up for reasons that she’ll most likely never end up learning about.😔
I disagree about her wanting to manipulate Bruce. In my opinion, she was testing him to see if he was rotten to the core and deserved punishment like her other patients, but she quickly notices that the playboy face Bruce Wayne wears was just a facade for trauma and wasn't his true nature. Her offer to keep doing the therapy sessions was genuine.
@@Yoru-ov1zvAgreed. She sounds genuinely concerned when she explicitly tells Bruce, "I don't think you're a danger to yourself or anyone else. But I also don't think we've made any progress together." I think we're supposed to keep that scene in mind when, two episodes later, she takes a much sterner tone with Emerson Collins as she prepares to restrain and lock him up. She knows Bruce is doing his best to keep up his carefree persona in spite of the trauma that triggered that one very public act of violence. He's clearly damaged, but very different from the powerful narcissists who whine about how awful all the people they see as being beneath them are.
I think the sequence of her trapping Batman and saying that she expects him to escape/not wanting to kill him has a lot happening, but when you break it down: Harley knows enough about Batman (most likely through the police investigations) and his exploits that she knows he goes after unusual cases. Harley has also figured that regardless of the odds, Batman usually comes out on top/her not really being aware of all the tricks up her sleeve. Trying to kill him will most likely end with him escaping somehow, but she's giving it a try anyways. My understanding of what Harley is saying, "You'll probably end up escaping this attempt to kill you anyways, and I don't really mind what you're doing, but I figured that if you're coming after these other guys, you were gonna come for me, and I don't want you bothering me. Since you'll probably end up escaping somehow, I'll at least get some time to escape before you catch up to me again. See you next time." Harley doesn't WANT to kill Batman, since he's basically enacting justice like her, but if he's going to get in her way, she needs to either kill him and succeed or get enough time to put some distance between the two of them so that he won't capture her.
I agree with your take Mr.Serum Lake having Harley Quinn be her own character not lusting after Joker or Poison Ivy while being a threat with a new color scheme is a proper way to reinvent the character I hope she turns up in future episodes
true, pairing her up with Ivy makes for some new stories, but it never sat right with me that she always has to be WITH someone, and her own personality was heavily affected by who she was with.
I genuinely loved this interpretation of Harley Quinn and feel she's just as valid ad any other interpretations of the character. We've had so many versions of Batman over the years, and as Denny O'Neil says, "None of them are right or wrong," so seeing this fresh take on Harley by one of her co-creators felt fresh. I loved how much agency she's been given and how far they leaned into her intelligence and deftness at her given profession.
The jester is the king servant judge, meaning he will judge the king for his action and make a fool out of his decision While being an advisor to make better judgement. This perfectly describes dr. Harley quin since she is basically that to her patients
I don’t fully get people crusading against Harley being dependent on people, even Bruce Timm being against it. Like yeah, it’s not a good thing that she’s dependent, but that’s the point, isn’t it? Harley is a great example of the dangers of dependence and abuse in relationships. Sure, I get people after a while would want to change that, and see her move on and grow, but the issue I have is a lot of people act like it was a mistake to make her like this in the first place, even though it’s an integral part of her character and serves a great purpose of showing the issues of dependence like I mentioned before.
Not that I’m saying this about caped crusader Harley, she’s fine. I’m only talking about people having issues with that aspect of original Harleys character
I agree with this. I, for one, didn’t really like this take on Harley. She wasn’t a very fun or really all that interesting character. It was just boring. A lot of what this Harley has done has been done better by other villains anyways. But, again, that’s just my own opinion.
@@the_realconspiracydino Sounds like you like BTAS Harley merely for entertainment value. And that has been the issue for the last decade. They didn't want to go deeper with her. Not until now.
I think there's an issue of people idolizing the "tragic romance" of her relationships. Harley Quinn is a character that's INCREDIBLY popular right now, more popular that anyone probably thought she'd be when she was being invented. And people find aspects of a character that's in vogue and emulate them. Her dependency is unhealthy and neither DC nor Timm want people glamorizing it. Just because you're smart enough not to do that, don't assume other people are.
The Harlequin episode is probably my third favorite in the series. Out of the two characters that were in Caped Crusader, Harley was handled better than Harvey Dent here. She was better handled on the plot showing her persona as Harleen Quinzel before revealing her true colors The Stress In Her Regard. Not only did she have a different but we finally have a Harley that uses his psychiatrist profession. Most iteraitons have her be a crazy criminal and never play into her intelligence, so we finally have that utilized. I also enjoyed her design even though the classic red and black suit will always be my favorite. I do feel I wished she used her kidnapped patients as goons more or start a ruckus. However I guess that's the point, unlike most of the Caped Crusader Rogues she's more intelligent. And her Va did a great job voice acting her. She may not Arleen Sorkin levels but she did a great jon balancing both personas of Miss Harleen Quinzel. So here is an unpopular opinion Harley is probably my most conflicted Batma Rogue. I pity her and yet I get annoyed by her everytime she appears on screen. I feel her backstory was nonsensical because I felt a psychiatrist would've acknowledge the Joker's mamipulation. (But Harleen The Comic and the Animated Harley Quinn series helped me understand why she became unstable even though I'm still annoyed.) I do agree she is the more redeemable out of the Batman Rogues but I feel DC has no clue what to do with Harley. Like her being an anti hero, anti villain or hero. And I do enjoy her relationship and time with Poison Ivy yet part of me feels while Poison Ivy is supportive of Harley, she's still a rogue so that means she's simply enabling Harley and both of them continue committing crime. Sure she is friendly to Harley but I feel Harley is so co dependent on Ivy it feels annoying. It doesn't help that Ivy becomes more heroic which while she isn't as vile compared to the Joker, I always saw her as an anti villain not a anti hero or heroine. Then there are so much depictions of Anti Heroine Harley with the DCU that I feel ruin the legacy of what made Harley great in the first place. Caped Crusader is not the definitive Harley but she is great. Not only is she one of the most successful reiterations her motive and tragedy make sense. She is kind of like Batman in a sense, but her methods are questionable in a sense. Perhaps we would learn more on Caped Crusader Harley's backstory in the second season. Who knows I'm looking forward to seeing more of this Jungian Jester.
Harley Quinn II is cool and all but I was frustrated by the glaring plothole that you can't just make the richest men in the city vanish and nobody notices.
That's right, folks, “Caped Crusader” has hit us with what is arguably the creepiest version of Harley Quinn ever put to screen. And yes, that IS primarily because we don’t have the Joker to thank for her creation this time. But I actually think it's worth noting how the show strongly hinted at her drawing inspiration from a completely different Batman villain (something this video didn't touch on), specifically in "Night of the Hunters", when Harley reveals that her Psychology Professor in college was none other than JONATHAN CRANE. While many of us who caught that reference may have simply laughed it off as just an amusing little Easter Egg, in the moment (present company included), you can DEFINITELY see the Scarecrow's influence in the way she operates. In addition to the physical and mental torture she inflicts on her victims, in order to make them psychologically dependent on her, she's also placing them in what is essentially their worst nightmare. See, these are all ludicrously wealthy men who only care about one thing...being ludicrously wealthy. And Harley is basically robbing them of that, imprisoning them in an environment where all their treasure and privilege amount to absolutely NOTHING. And for these men, what could POSSIBLY be more terrifying than THAT? At least, that's just MY thinking on it.
10:30 it could be intentional because didn’t they INTEND to kill off Harley Quinn originally? She only stuck around for so long because the fans LOVED her.
Like it’s so BORING just to do the same tropes every time, why are people so angry that Batman a show about various people being brought to crime bc of outside factors has new perspectives of people? “Sure I can take communist superman but god forbid you make him black”
@@Strawberry_Cubes I think it is less, they dislike diversity - and more that writers just do diversity for the sake of it. Not do much or something interesting with it. Beyond, for example make a character gay and their entire personality is how 'gay' they are. This having happened multiple times across various media - it is a trigger almost; that when you hear diversity it would equal bad character writing for some people
@@mrgreen6980 but it’s not boring? Like I find this argument so annoying there’s a ton of straight relationships I find genuienly so snooze worthy in Batman and marvel yet no one’s really debating that “oh we need to stop making straight people now bc erm your just putting it in for the sake of straight people” Also no I disgree most the time I see “oh they never shut up about being gay/lgbt” they maybe say it once or they do like garnet out of su and yet it’s not boring. There’s also a lot of boring technical stuff like writers genuienly having to overstate it due to if they all did the Disney thing where they have one kiss it will just be censored everywhere. Also please state to me in this modern day where someone’s whole entire character was “their gay”
Are people really mad about her being a lesbian? She's already at least bi in the comics. To me she just falls flat as a character here. I just don't like alternate versions of characters at all though. If you're doing something so drastically different you may as well just make a new character in my opinion. Like they did with original Harley Quinn and a bunch of other characters in BTAS. Also, the diversity thing the other commenter mentioned does exist. They means it's boring because it's so blatant what they're doing, not because it's a lesbian or gay relationship. They made Mr. Freeze a lesbian in the Suicide Squad game for example. Besides that it's literally the same character. Not a big deal to me since the game sucks anyway, but it's so blatantly obvious they did it just to check a box. They made a gay version of Superman (Jonathan Kent) to check a box in the comics too and killed that run pretty quickly.
@@jt6404 I dunno. As for the sexual orientation thing. It was mostly as an example. As it is often, they just take a character - change something about them. Then act if that character has always been like that/thought like that/ or (insert some other personal opinion) that. All the while, not doing any writing or character development with such a change - as it happens in that media. A good example of changing something about a character and running with that - is Superman from Justice League: Gods and Monsters for example.
I prefer this Harley over the one we've been getting in the past 10 years. While I didn't like the costume at first, it's really grown on me. I just hope they KEEP her and Joker as separate characters.
I like how in many ways, they've brought in facets of the Batman's Hugo Strange, but with a counter-corruption spin compared to TB Strange's more curiosity-focused angle.
Harley being on her own sort of crusade for justice is an interesting twist. She's not enjoying hurting people like in her original version but she sees it as a thing she has to do. And I commented before about her color scheme possibly referencing greed, but now I think that, aside from being a visual change from her classic red, black and blues, it might be a subtle nod to her own view of herself. Green is a color that can be associated with sickness, and yellow with fear, so, for someone who is into archetypes and symbols, Harleen may be saying that she sees herself as sick (in the head) and scared (either of herself or others).
I think part of the reason Harley got hit with the backlash was that people kinda wanted her to be forced to stay in the "Mentally Unwell Sexy White Woman That Kisses Girls" box rather than be a more well rounded, reasonable character with different motivations and a character design they, let's be frank, found less attractive. They want their Suicide Squad Harley back. That's it.
I don't care that Harley was reinvented. This might be a controversial comment, but the original Harley Quinn ANNOYED me. So, I'm actually excited about this iteration.
Only tiny objections are that Harley Quinn is actually bisexual and the opposites of red and blue are green and orange, but otherwise, great vid! Update: Ah, you acknowledged her bisexuality.
I have to agree about the color objection. I think her costume is yellow and black, not yellow and green and I'm not sure why he viewed it that way. It doesn't help that she's standing in a dark basement or dark exterior, but I don't think it was meant to be seen as green.
Lowkey kind of love the weird power fantasy of this Harley take. She's an "eat the rich" lawful evil/vigilante type thay could evoke a very strong parallel to Batman or other heroes who fight crime outside the limits of law, as Harley herself is also technically fighting moral and ethical evil rather than "punishable in a court of law" and "chaotic evil" types. I kind of love that for her.
A Harley with no Joker additives is absolutely terrifying, like this is what i expect an Earth 3(Crime Syndicate) Harley to be like, shes not quite a villain but damn sure no where near a hero
The new version of Harley Quinn has been done well. She was a one dimensional with the Joker originally. She was given more personality before the end of the BTAS series(s), but still not a strong character. I think this time around she's finally be given justice. The new take on Harley is wonderful, and I look forward to seeing more of her.
@@maarekstele2998 Huh, I'm not sure I'd ever heard that before. If I have, I certainly had zero idea that it was being used as an insult. I am glad, though, that I'm not the only person who had to stop and ask what he was talking about.
It's funny. Deadpool is completely insane to a toony degree. And Punisher is a Law Breaking, unhinged, unapologetic Killer. We aren't suppose to glorify them as much as accept there character for what they are. Harley over the years has been change up several times. And we are constantly pushed to believe that she's justified of her actions or having a feeling of sympathy for her without question, because it's Harley. And don't get me started on Injustice Harley Quinn.
At the very least this Harley Quinn isn’t designed to be a fan service girl. She gets to be her own character with her own motivations not tied to The Joker.
I legit didn't realize she was supposed to be asian until you pointed it out in another video. Thought it was a character design thing since her eyes looked "regular" in her costume
I imagine if they ever decide to introduce the Joker in this series, Harley would start off seeing him as a pawn for her own scheme. He would play along as her henchman for a while, but slowly manipulating her along the way. Making her question her own beliefs until eventually he forces her to make a choice: him or her love Renee. From there would be up for the writers to decide.
I was wondering if you were going to note the "See You Next Tuesday" remark. It is simply incredible how different that word is between American English and Anglo/Aussie English. Similarly, the word "spastic" is just an adjective with no offensive connotation in America, but that's not the case elsewhere.
We can still use it in a medical sense, such as a spastic colon (why is that the first example that came to mind…) but, yeah, we’d never call a person that in this day and age.
There's also, pardon my English, *bollocks.* Sure is weird, that word being quite mild in the New World than in the Old World continents. Then again, we get its antithesis, c**t.
It's insanely refreshing to see a review of the new harley that isn't two aggressive dudes on their 'podcast' crying about how she's not likable enough or how she's too divergent. It feels like every single 'worst comic fan you've ever had to talk to' has had an insipid take about this character that boils down to "POC harley bad" or "woman bad"
I think that the Caped Crusader is ok, its no bad as much people say but isen't extremely good either. There was somethings that i found disapointing, one of them was Harley, i don't care about the changes on her look, but when i saw the trailer i thought that she will be more darker than she really was on the series. The ideia of using secrets to manipulate people was good, but the way they present was pretty goofy to me. I tought that she's gonna be like batman in a way, working on the shadows and appears out of nowhere with a deadly look to thraeth her victms of revealing there secrets if they don't make what she wants, making them think that maybe they were getting crazy asking themselves if she was real or not.
AGSHBSHAGDA thank you so much for making this video - When I first saw her, it was through the lens of an ignorant/biased lens of a guy who kept spouting about how this new dr harlequin would be awful because of this, or that, but through someone who has an unbiased view and actually went in to really see her true caped crusader version I *_LOVE_* her. I’m literally giddy, I LOVE villains like this- and I never usually get to see them as women, So thank you for opening my eyes because if not- I would have completely missed out on her 😭👍
I'd like to see a crossover with the 'victim' and the 'focused' characters, meeting. The 'older' Harley that we are all family with is more self-aware than she was when with Mistuh J. This newer Dr. Quinzel has stayed closer to her professional roots and MAY fill the 'Batman nemesis' role. At this point, I honestly don't care if we EVER get the Joker...
My only real complaint, and this is just for Bruce Tim as a whole, is that he gives everyone such giant shoulders. He might as well work for Warhammer and Warcraft because of how big those shoulders are. Outside of that, good Harley. Nice shake up.
This version of Quinzel seems to draw a lot from Professor Pyg. Both are driven to drastically altering people in the name of creating their own utopian vision; Pyg seeks to sculpt his visions of beauty and perfection, while Quinzel looks to create social justice by completely rewriting minds.
I still kinda feel like Harley being homosexual SHOULD be a big deal cuz yk doesn't the show take place in like the 40's? Would've been more interesting if she had to hide that part of herself due to the morality of the time
This version of Harley was my second favourite of the new takes on villains (after Onomatepia). Interesting to see a Joker-free take on the character. I got the "Right of Jesters" stuff but totally missed the Jungian bits.
Still love the OG Harley as the core new versions try to draw from but I also love this take on her! It's similar to how I love The Joker from 'The Batman' TV show. He's a solid and interesting take on the character. Wouldn't want that version all the time but it's great in it's own right.
The man we see in the king's garb we also see in therapy; his complaints seem to focus on the failings, unsuitability, and inferiority of his prospective heirs. A king loathed to give up power and avoiding his mortality by putting off the selection of a successor. I wonder if part of his detestation for his children comes from a physical disability, which may explain his legs being broken? Maybe this was part of his containment? Maybe it is also part of accelerating his breakdown, revealing that the other patients will be no source of comfort and aid. Additionally, he views his workers as serfs. He views himself as part of a modern feudalist structure and speaks in terms of deserving or being owed obedience and subjugation. Maybe the chain he is in is intended to resemble a throne in his mind? Make him detest and fear the power and wealth he so desperately holds onto? I find it likely all of those selected by Harley were selected for failure in personal and or professional relationships more so than failures of business ethics due to their punishments/treatments. The assignments they have been driven to likely reflect and lay bare an irrationality they are prone to or some breed of childhood trauma. The men were once powerful and likely made delusional and irrational demands of those around them. The man who desperately wants his pudding and not beans may have a childhood hangup or perhaps demanded positive outcomes before the work to produce those outcomes occurred. The man looking for the damaged light and the man writing the same phrase on the chalkboard over and over are likely having phrases spat back in their own faces. The line writer especially likely refuses to confront their own misdeeds and callousness. The Christmas elf looking for "the bad bulb" likely spent time looking for the one bad person within his company who was denying his perfect system or the such. A "bad bulb" can refer to a head or mind that is in some way wrong. I could see someone obsessed with optimization and a perfectly run system deciding all the small variables and inefficiencies are down to one person who contains and is the source of all errors.
i kinda wish this concept was used for like a genderbent hugo strange or something. i dont mind her not being attached to the joker but she just doesnt feel like harley quinn/have any of the personality and manerisms that make me like her. honestly if she still had her usual playful and spirited attitude she has as harleen while still in the costume i feel like thatd make her closer to what i like about the character AND serve to make her even more unsetteling if shes torturing ppl and still acting this way
It made sense because shes a high degree doctor trying to dig deep bruce’s head, she can manipulate everyone for her twisted experiment I like the direction they are going with I seen alot of harley x joker, i got tired of it I wanted to see different direction Dont get me wrong i like harley quinn Cant we just enjoy what we like?
Yep With the New 52 even revealed that Harley was born in Brooklyn (probably as a way to explain her New Jersey accent) and her family were linked to the Jewish mafia
Once again, this entire debacle reminds me of a question I once had. How many changes can you introduce before you fundamentally change a character into another one? There is a line here, but this issue is that it's rather blurry. I too question the idea of changing her character instead of making a new one.
It's Bruce Timm's character, he literally invented the concept of the character. If there is one human being alive today who gets to decide what is and is not Harley, it is Bruce Timm, her creator and author. This is the equivalent of telling an author who wrote a book you like that he or she doesn't get to have input on their character.
This really isn’t too different than the original, a girl driven to do crime due to her profession as a psychologist, using a jester based moniker to terrorize the citizens of Gotham
@@ParadoxicalThird I'm sorry to burst your buble, but Bruce Timm didn't create Harley Quinn, Paul Dini did. Bruce himself only provided the classic costume and that was it. He has even said multiple time that he doesn't like Harley and doesn't even understand why she's so popular in the first place. His only other great contribution to the character was Harley SA Nightwing because haha, r*pe is funny.
I think this is a really unique and interesting take on Harley Quinn. It's a nice direction and a cool character, as well as having some interesting interactions with Batman.
I was loving the show, but this was the episode I dreaded going into it, because Harley has been so intrinsically tied to the joker for most of my life that I knew they'd have to really wow me with the attempt to separate her from him completely, without any mention of him. And seeing as the dull and boring Telltale Harley was the only example of this previously in media (where they actually kind of flipped the script and had HER corrupt the Joker to an extent), I didn't have high hopes But wow, was I wrong. They blew me away with this new Harley, and she's done fantastically well and built up wonderfully. I can't say I particularly care for her jester outfit from an artistic standpoint, I think the yellow and green, while a cheeky opposite to the red and blues of her prior costumes, is a bit of a gauche combination, and the third hat tail just throws the entire silhouette off in my opinion, but I love that she operates completely differently when she's in costume and out of costume, not unlike Bruce himself--versus prior Harleys always being high energy goofballs.
Something I've never been too happy with is how comic book writers tend to forget that Harley Quinn started out as a psychiatrist, someone who spends an impressive amount of time and dedication to learning about the human mind, its chemical processes, and how it manifests. Often, she is depicted as a bit of a dope (an airhead). And I know she's trying to imitate the Joker as a way of garnering his affection, but it comes off as so superficial in a way that feels less intentional and more like the writer's forgot she's supposed to be pretty smart (or observant of other people). At least, in this version, she bases her entire identity around her profession.
I love how Dr. Harlequin contrasts Batman himself in this show. While Batman uses brawn violence to stamp out crime and corruption in the Gotham underbelly, Harley Quinn uses mind and manipulation to break the corrupt and amoral of Gotham’s upper elites. Both with their charismatic outer shell and never-smiling costumed alter ego.
Something I really like about this take on Harley is the parallel's there are between her and Batman. Neither fully hide their faces, only obscuring them with the cowl and face paint. Maybe showing that they never fully show who they are at all times. Her being self-aware of her own mental issues and using them in a dark, yet ultimately altruistic manor for Gotham can also be compared to Batman using his own pain to drive him to save others.
6:35 -- Speaking of which, it took me awhile, but it hit me that Mr. Collins is based upon a two-time Batman villain, the Monarch of Menace. A video somewhere around here titled "This Villain DESTROYED Batman" will tell you his complete story, but essentially, he has the same "I'm royalty" attitude that Collins uses, plus the red with white edging cloak that he wore.
I do wonder if She had one of those weird torture traps in mind for Bruce. Outwardly he does not present as misanthropic like the other wealthy men in her "Care", he's literally only there by court order for punching a guy who bad mouthed his mom. But even this version of Harley is not exactly stable or right minded, and she could trap him anyway to "share the wealth" in a way
Lol, In the movie of the Tennage Mutant Ninja Turtles and Batman Joker calls Harley "Nurse Quinn" and she gets pissed and refuses to help, finally he cedes and calls her "Doctor Quinn" and she responds "Damn Right I am!".
I think it was Jesterbell who pointed it out; Harley being changed so much might not be such a good idea as she represents a struggle that real people develop; a dependence on their abusers. Say what you will, this version of Harley is so different they would have been better off making a new character and promoting her instead.
That's a very general assumption. The story itself doesn't suffer at all from having Harleen be the culprit. Though I do want the later episodes to explore her reasons a lot more because "she was just fed up with how messed up her rich clients were" doesn't work for me. What would motivate her to be the one punishing them in gruesome and disturbing ways?
But Mad Hatter isn’t a psychologist or ever cared about psychological profiling, he’s just a demented hypnotist with an obsession with Alice In Wonderland
Glad to see you doing a video on this version of the character! I'm actually working on my own video on the show so I'm happy to enjoy your video on it!
This version is such a different take, but I absolutely love it, because this version of her takes what we know of her and flips it upside down, giving us a fresh take that we needed. Harleen Quinzel in Caped Crusader, as a therapist, she's fun, upbeat and easygoing, she's what you picture Harley Quinn as nowadays, but as Harley Quinn or "The Jester", she's articulate, cunning, manipulative, etc. She's everything you don't see Harley Quinn as now. She's putting her smarts out there and actually using her skills in psychiatry to good use, which is rare to see her do, unless she's Harleen in other media and she really isn't that bad of a person as well, considering she was willing to go save Barbara Gordon, who was innocent and didn't do anything, she has so much good, it's just she uses her capabilities to do wrong things, even though the outcomes are turning greedy men into actually decent people who are willing to help the less unfortunate. I actually enjoyed this Harley waaaay more then what we got now, she's really a breath of fresh air.
To note first, I like this version of Harley But honestly, I don't quite see the problem with a problematic tragic relationship like the one OG Harley had with the Joker Joker is an evil bastard and his relationship with Harley is clearly depicted as bad, as long as it's not portrayed as a good thing. I don't see why it'd be a taboo to have the bastard be a bastard when it comes to his relationships
Every complaint everyone has for this new harley just proves bruce timm’s point and the point of those trying to separate her from joker unsuccessfully or not. I love the awesome observations you and others in the comments have
With Quinn id personally like to see only two things, either one or both would be cool 1. Orgin reversal (NOT ROLE REVERSAL, just the orgins) instead of The Joker creating Harley, Harley creates the Joker, since she has a tendency to break the minds of her 'paitients' and have them take off weird roles like a baby man and a pharaoh 2. complety seperate, they dont even KNOW about eachother (unless/until they see about one another in the news or shit like that), The Joker doesnt care about Harley and Harley doesn't care about The Joker, now im not saying never let them interact, in fact interactions between what could be a manipulative character and someone whose basically a prodigy when it comes to seeing through that crap would be interesting. This is just me spit balling because I LOVE The Joker and Harley as characters but i hate how they're paired, id love to see them interact without the whole domestic violance thing
I love how when she's brought in to profile Batman you can read everything she says about Batman as a projection of her secret identity.
Perfectly put.
Holy shit good point
It’s funny I didn’t see that till now
@@Numbabu me neither!
The area where she keeps her victims locked up has some fascinating parallels with the Bat Cave, complete with its own Alfred.
Good observation! I have to assume that Hastings’ usefulness is the only reason Harleen didn’t persuade him to off himself!
@@SerumLake joker does appear in caper crusader in one episode in a brear blink and youll mist it moment.
I really like this take.
In the beginning of the character, she's a psychiatrist who abandons it all to become a full time clown.
Then, in her more recent years, they like to emphasize that she is still a psychiatrist, she still has all her training and knowledge, but it still falls very much to the background as a chaos clown lady.
Now we've come full circle as a strictly psychology based supervillain who just has a clown esthetic
I wish this version of Harley blackmailed the rich elite of the 1930s to give most of their wealth to the poor!
also poor and study with a beca for his gymnastics...
@@christiandauz3742 What do you think the rich elites hiring the poors do? Now they would be out of a job.
@@christiandauz3742 Fucking what? What do you think the fall out of that would, be? They're still the elite. You're just creating new money elite.
I like this iteration of her, but I do also love her being certified insane and she is insane but also a therapist. 😂 She'll be like "You definitely were abused as a child, where did that start?"
Not gonna lie, this version has enough menace that it feels... 'right' to call her Dr. Harlequin instead of Harley
Just call her "Jester".
That is her alternate name in this show.
I wouldn't mind if they reused this version of the character under a different name, like The Jester, or such.
When talking about her in my own stuff I found myself referring to her as Harlequin instead of Harley.🤷♂️😆
Tbh, I've just been calling her The Harlequin
It sounds menacing.
I completely agree. Also like the fact she's never once said her trademark "Call me Harley, everyone does" line even while in her more bubbly public persona.
4:26 From what we hear in the show, I don't actually think Bruce was in any danger from Harley. She sees that Bruce's personality is hollow, a protective shell around a traumatized child. Bruce isn't a horrible person like the other elite (we know he's the biggest donor to the orphanage). And as she said, "I don't see you as a danger to yourself or others." I think Harley genuinely just wanted to help Bruce finally process that tragic night.
I imagine it was also a tremendous relief to her to have one of Gotham's elites that wasn't a POS as a patient.
So she gives bruce a heartwarming message while she's a psychotic killer?
@@gyrrakavian It might've given her some hope in humanity to meet at least ONE wealthy person who wasn't greedy, or selfish.
STILL, what she is doing to the ones that DO make her list isn't really the right thing to do (though, Harleen no doubt doesn't view herself as a villain, and actually believes that she is doing the right thing...which only makes her more dangerous.)
Ngl, this Harley actually scares me. Red/Black Harley is unnerving, I need to keep my eye on her, green/gold Harley knows how to hurt people.
She might eat you.
She can brainwash a guy under a short time, she most definitely can
Green 💚 and Gold 🥇? wasn't it black and gold
@@itsblitz4437 Why did you pull out the emoji’s as sample colours
@@Eelectrik just to make a point. Also Harley Quinn outfit is black 🖤 and gold 🪙. Just to make it clear.
My friend and I came to the wrong conclusion that all of Quinn's victims were based on obscure villians. Though I do think a fascinating twist would be if she unintentionally creates The Joker. Perhaps some TV executives or something in entertainment. She works to break him like so many others. But when he hits the breaking point he becomes something she can't control or restrain.
Now that would be pretty fucking cool
that would be interesting.
Having Harleen Quinzel create the joker through trying to punish and 'reform' someone and ending up creating the perfect storm of conditions for things to make the joker. A comedian and famous tv show personality given the archetype of the joker, forced to give up his wealth then 'die' by falling into a vat of chemicals... only he didn't die... he became bleached instead and was reborn. he thanks dr quinzel for making him the man he has become today, and takes a terrifying revenge upon the city by targeting people with deadly toxin and making it clear that his world view is not that the elite must die... but everyone in the city that made him. from the elites that harleen despises to people like harleen who abuses and manipulates peoples trust into serving her own ends. Harleen realising she has made a fatal error with one of her clients... but cannot figure out who they are because of how RADICALLY the joker has been altered psychologically. not to mention, harleen eventually realises she destroyed the file of the patient that would become the joker, unwitting making him a terrifying enigma. batman works with renee and harleen to try and identify the madman to stop him, only for the joker to out harleen's secret to renee, doing severe damage to their relationship. he doesn't want harleen dead or at his side... he wants her to be just as broken as she left him. to feel betrayed, tormented, stripped of worth, and discarded. A Monster in the eyes of gotham and the world... Just like she made him. after that... its up to her to decide if she wants to jump into a vat of the toxin... or face the world that would condemn her crimes and judge her as a monster.
his introduction is with a broadcast of an old show that he highjacks to deliver his chilling message. that at a certain time, someone specific is going to die.
That would be such DELICIOUS IRONY.
@@Motleydoll451-r5r I would LOVE if this was the plot for Joker. I sweet twist on Harley's and Joker's relationship.
Harleen thought that she's doing the right thing, only for her to release too late that she have made a DIY supervillain.
You know, this Harley’s fixation on punishing the rich and the powerful actually makes her VERY similar to most traditional depictions of Poison Ivy, which leaves me wondering what the writers will do if they end up adapting Ivy herself…
I do wonder if they will pursue an Ivy that goes more mad scientist, in that she identifies with plans more than humans. Reminds me of some of her more dsrker episodes that saw her use a guy to make "children" plant hybrids to do her bidding.
Harleys scheme was very reminiscent of a scheme Hugo Strange would pull. Especially the clinic he had in his pre crisis return in the 70s. The man difference is Harley had much more altruistic motivation by giving all the money away, while Strange is motivated by pure greed
Good observation. She also has an entirely different set of monster men!
Giving the money away? She had a bigass mansion to keep the "patients" in, a butler whos more than okay with all of this madness going in it and invites her dates to extremely exspensive places
I belive the donations was just a small bit compared to amount she takes for herself
The mansion belonged to “the Butler”, Mr Hastings, another one of her clients who she had brainwashed.
Ironically, I didnt watch the episodes in order at first so I missed the previous Hugo Strange mention and just thought they were combining Harley (who obviously doesn't have an existing "demake" version) and Strange into a single character. Which is weird, but I guess no weirder than what BTAS did with lumping (HEH) Clayfaces together.
@@SerumLake damn how did i miss that? Mistake on my behalf but my poiny still stands
I wonder of Tim is intentionally keeping the Joker out?
The joker has dominated Batman stories lately. TAS. Life action. Videogames. The LEGO Batman movie. Even Harley own show.
When he was there, he has created, commanded or manipulated nearly every villain, up to Luthor in Justice League.
Harley was simply the most extreme case of being tied to joker. If he can divorce her character from the Joker, he can do it with all of them.
You really need to watch the final scene of Season 1
No, he can't be kept out. He'll be all over season 2, looks like.
He appeared in the last scene of the last episode, so he's coming, I hope they do in an epic fashion like they did in movie The Dark Knight, I'd love see a storyline like that being used in In the classical Batman setting that the show takes place.
Maybe that is why they kept him out of this season specifically. He is too mentally powerful of a character in the narrative to not be "everywhere and nowhere" and too well-known to be left out of any even vaguely batman-related medium at this point, but the audience desperately needed a break from him.
Simple Timm said it himself. He says there's too many straight white men. A stupid reason tbh
The focus on Harley’s ability to psychologically analyze people was a really good way to freshen up her character. A lot of times you can forget she’s a psychologist and not miss anything so it was a great way to reinvent her.
Yeah, Harley is usually "psychologist that turned into evil clown" and here she's "psychologist with clown aesthetic" which is a freshing take on her. Glad they were able to combine both of her most interesting parts of her.
I agree, though I do think it treads on the toes of other rogues a bit. Scarecrow in specific; the whole "former psychologist uses their knowledge of the human brain to hurt people" thing is kinda his schtick.
@@swishfish8858 that’s like saying “Mad Hatter being insane is kinda treading on the toes of the Joker” or “Bane being a clever and skilled fighter is kinda treading on the toes of Rah’s Al Ghul” or “Killer Croc being an animal human hybrid kinda treads on the toes of Man Bat”, villains can have similar traits and still be different from one another
Theory
Since Harley, in episode 5, did mention a "professor Crane" (no doubt a reference to Scarecrow), if he shows up later in series, I could see he and Harley having a team up, since they are both villains who mentally torture their victims, although Harley chooses those she thinks deserve it, while Crane, most likely will be like his comic book counterpart: more sadistic and torture people for his own pleasure and studies on fear.
No joke that was an original plot for a movie Scarecrow and Harley Quinn call Batman unchained But it was cancelled due to the Overwhelmingly negative movie Batman and Robin
I think Crane will be morally grey like this new Harley
Crane would be using fear to fight injustice
@@sarumike-bb5ip Yeah. If I remember correctly, she would be established as Joker's daugther, wanting revenge on Batman for the death of her father (speaking of which, the film would also have Jack Nicholson reprising his role as Joker, showing as allucionation, alongside other rogues from previous films)
@@christiandauz3742 This could happen, but then Crsane would be way to similar to Harley Quinn. It would make more sense if Crane was more sadistic and torturing not just the corrupt elite members but also many other people, creating a contrast between him and Harley, who, despite her flaws, only punish those she feels deserve it.
...Why does this make me suspect that CC's Harley really is the daughter of the Joker?
I trust Bruce Timm enough with Harley to wonder if this is basically his "What if Harley still became a villain but never met the Joker?" scenario for her. The suggestion Harley might have been driven to do dodgy shit for the sake of psychology anyway, but without the Joker to egg her on and encourage an outrageous, completely amoral persona she ends up (by comic book standards) being a antagonist with a weaker visual gimmick whose heart is not really in being rampantly malicious for no reason.
From the point of view of her own mental health I suppose it's a net win but her being weaker villain fodder because of it is why I can see people acting its of a loss for the comic book narrative.
(At this point, I'd have more respect if they stick to that, but I worry the tease of the Joker in the season finale might mean a meet-up and Harley becoming a more outrageous, standard version of herself)
They’ve been pretty careful with it. I think even the joker will be different enough from his usual depictions like all the villains rewritten so far. If anything I predict they’re gonna make him like Joaquin phoenix’s maybe a lil
Agreed.
What I found interesting about this version is that she mentioned being mentored by Crane [i.e. Scarecrow], which speaks volumes for her views on ethics.
I hope not
With that, hope the Joker is actually her magnum opus when it comes to having a pawn. Her Darth Vader, in regards.
She's very menacing.
I like this take on the character, is a very good alternate.
Elseworlds are for this kind of experimentation.
The reference to The Stress of Her Regard novel by Tim Powers comes from the fact that the story tells of Michael Crawford who is forced to leave his hometown when his bride’s life is ended by a sadistic vampire who claims Michael as her bridegroom. Together with a team of fictionalized versions of famous authors such as Byron, Keats, and Shelley, Michael embarks on a journey across Europe to stop the vampire who killed his bride before she continues gaining pleasure from torturing her victims’ minds, souls, and bodies. I guess Bruce Timm wanted Caped Crusader Harley Quinn to have similar personality traits to the vampire that kills Michael’s bride in the Stress of Her Regard book and maybe the psychological stress that Harley inflicts against her patients with her “regard” (i.e. her torture methods) is also a reference to that Tim Powers story. That’s what I gathered from the title being included in Batman Caped Crusader but I’m sure there’s more information about this reference to be found. 🤷♀️
Thanks for sharing!
@@SerumLake You're welcome
I did some digging as well and it looks like there are numerous parallels:
In Powers' book, supernatural creatures manipulate and inspire their human hosts, a theme mirrored by Dr. Harleen Quinzel's manipulation of her wealthy clients in the episode. This reflects a shared interest in the complex interplay between influence and control.
Both works delve into the dual nature of characters. Powers' nephilim inspire creativity while causing harm, much like Harley Quinn's portrayal as both compassionate with her patients during her sessions with them in her office and when she's torturing them in her personal dungeon.
While Powers incorporates historical figures like Byron and Shelley, the episode reinterprets classic characters from the Batman mythos, offering a fresh perspective akin to Powers' reimagining of the Romantic poets. Additionally, both the novel and the episode embrace gothic elements (in "Gotham" City no less), with Harley Quinn's menacing role enhancing the dark, atmospheric tone.
Although not explicitly mentioned, the episode's plot involving the abduction of wealthy men potentially hints at the presence of secret organizations (which in this case would be the Court of Owls), reminiscent of the secret societies like the Carbonari in Powers' narrative. If this is true, Harley might turn out to be an anti-hero in future seasons, not only punishing the wealthy in Gotham for their greed and social negligence but also to potentially uncover some kind of secret nefarious plot she may have discerned from her interactions with them.
Lastly, both stories explore the theme of obsession and its connection to creativity or genius, highlighting the costs and complexities of such intense relationships.
@@Primordial_Synapse that’s an amazing thesis you’ve made. It’s honestly really outstanding; thank you for sharing with us. Personally my enjoyment of Caped Crusader Harley Quinn has been enhanced thanks to your comment. I love it. Thank you again 💚💛
@@pgplumsparkle Thank you for your encouraging comment. Just let me know if any of my information is inaccurate.
I just wish we had seen her interact more with Bruce and Montoya in the show. Those were her most interesting scenes in my opinion.
Yes! I completely agree.
I think the same
I think this might be the first version of Harley who is actually a good psychologist
2.5 episodes of her being a practicing psychologist is basically three times the length she’s usually seen as a Doctor. Most other versions I can think of devoted like 15 minutes of an episode to pre-Joker Harley.
I do think the harley from her stand alone show is a pretty good therapist sort, considering she becomes batman's therapist.. but the characterization of everyone in that show is a little extra wacky, lol.
IDK, I think the Haley Cuoco Harley is a good psychologist, too. She helps not only Ivy, but Bruce and herself through a LOT of mental stuff in that cartoon.
Yeah, in "The Batman," for example, she was a flashy TV psychiatrist before becoming a villain, practically a quack.
5:58 Like Harley and Ivy's relationship, Renee was meant to be a lesbian from the beginning. It's just that again, 90s morality kept her in the closet.
Just ask the English dubs of Sailor Moon with the two cousins…. and never reconsider to check every scene that is meant for intimacy. WHATWERETHEYTHINKING?!?!
I don't think the 90's hated gays lmao. Tatu was huge on MTV and did you see the music video for 'All the Things She Said'?
@reginaldcaine6161 The morality we're talking about is focused on the children, not society in general. Basically, it boils down to sheltering children from reality. A good example is the original Red Riding Hood. In it the wolf won and ate Red and Grandma since it was meant to teach a lesson about not talking to strangers. But parents had it censored to protect children.
@ztyran Or, hear me out... wolf attacks fucking stopped. Why have a grim story for kids, when it won't even help them? I'm not saying kids shouldn't see women who love women. What I am saying, is perhaps a straight man drawing gay women in their underwear IS inappropriate for kids. Remember, this guy isn't a "gay ally" or whatever people say theses days. The same guy who wants this, put Batman and Batgirl together all the time as a couple. Excuse me for not wanting my superhero to groom his bestfriend's daughter and fuck the "employee" under him. He is a creep who is doing this for creep reasons. It has nothing to do with gays, and everything to do with a straight guy drawing his fetishes for kids.
@@ztyranHonestly, I'd argue that was censorship done right. Same may even go with how the movie Alien changed its ending to something more ambiguous yet hopeful, which thankfully led to Aliens... which then led to Alien³, but that's another story entirely.
I really wish that instead of what happened, Harley brainwashed them is become, calender-man, that one pencil villan, condiment king, and other like loser villains
Well we DID see King Tut, so that's something.
The pencil man’s name is Eraser,who has a VERRY snazzy suit
@@Napichoo4290okay, I thought so but I was thinking of that MHA dude Eraser Head, so it confused me
@@Napichoo4290 It's also worth noting that Eraser is actually an incredibly effective villain, he just has a dumb costume that makes him hard to take seriously
@@captainkawaii666angle man
I know that a lot of people prefer Harley Quinn as the "manic pixie dream girl" but this version of the character that still takes inspiration from her being a psychiatrist is a breath of fresh air.
Okay, but imagine a blend of the two. Like this Harley becomes completley unhinged but also keeps up the psychological torture angle.
That would be absolutely horrifying in the best possible way.
Yes and im tired of the sexualized harley quinn of suicide squad and her lastest versions and her air head actitude. So this is refreshing
There a bit of that in that poison ivy and Harley queen animated serie. Harley is still the “manic pixie dream girl” but still as a couple of moments with her psychiatrist side showing.
It’s not for everyone since it way more comedic then anything else but it’s a version of Harley that is allowed to be more then the typical battered woman I had to grew up watching so much appreciated to see more and more spin on these characters coming out.
As someone who is sick to death of seeing Harley Quinn absolutely everywhere, getting me to actually like this version is one of Caped Crusader's highest achievements.
I thought she wasn't harley
I agree, I am so sick and tired of modern Harley that any twist on her character is welcomed, like seriously she has been stagnant ever since the new 52 and her anti hero status is flimsy at best, only reason she doesn't spend time in jail is that she signs up for the suicide squad every single time. Now if we can get a suicide squad piece of media that doesn't have her shoved into the team for no reason, then we are golden
That's sort of cuz it's a radically different take.
Fr
@@mateushenriquepinheiro3197 we getting something like that in creature commandos atleast. Dc has a real boner for suicide squad lately....
I can't tell you how happy I am that this show went back to a more traditional Harley design. I've gotten so tired of the stripper look.
It's also nice that this Harley leans more into her backstory as a psychiatrist, something that a majority of iterations tend to ignore.
Harley was never a good psychiatrist irc. She cheated her way to become one (in btas tie in comics at least)
@@alperenakdas3479
I've never liked that change, and refuse to acknowledge it as cannon to the show. Harley is much more interesting as someone who genuinely wanted to help people, but was ultimately manipulated by one of her patients into becoming a monster. It's the whole reason why her character in the show was so tragic. Taking that away robs Harley of a lot of sympathy, because it make it seem like she was already an awful person to begin with.
@@kamikazelemming1552 yeah that comic really did take alot from her character in BTAS
@@kamikazelemming1552If they didn’t bother to show it in the series it’s not canon to me lol
@@kamikazelemming1552 Also, a fairly nasty "pretty women are whores" trope/fetish that doesn't make any sense given the complexities of that profession; when college age women end up fucking their professors its generally a creepy one-sided power imbalance they're not eager about.
Ironically, I'd argue it also takes away from the implicit danger of the Joker and the effect he can have on an otherwise intelligent professional.
Speaking of Jungian archetypes, I would argue that the Batman is not a Hero. Depending upon the version, he is usually a Rebel, as he is in this version, or a Sage as the Adam West Batman was. Most superheroes aren't Jungian heroes as the nature of the superhero genre gets in the way of a journey of self-discovery.
Thanks for sharing your insight, I appreciate it 🫡
nice to see someone else Speak of the Jungian Archetypes. Batman Does reflect the Rebel in this version i always pictured Superman as The Innocent
Awesome video, like always. Another thing to Harley said Cran was her collage professor. Cran aka the scarecrow experience on his students, maybe that influenced her to do the things she's doing it could be something they can expand in the future.
Did you spot the advert for his book in the newspapers Batman scoured through? I like the idea of The Scarecrow being a sefhelp guru, or a pop psychologist
@SerumLake I did not. Thanks for letting me know that does sound pretty interesting.
@@SerumLakeI did and it gives me hope that she's not actually dead and may be the reason that scarecrow comes to gotham.
*Looks at the title card: Awesome, a whole video essay dedicated to Giant Hostile Baby Man Person, the greatest Batman villain of them all!
I mean, he scares the hell out of ME at least 😂
@@metaloverlord7465 Watch John Waters' "A Dirty Shame" and you'll walk away completely desensitized to that image.
On the plus side, seems the algorithm liked it. Plus, it's not quite clickbaity in hindsight.
Giant Hostile Baby Man Person?
You mean, some parts of the fandom?
@@darthva31 good one!!!
I really enjoyed this version of Harleen. It's so refreshing--she's actually scary in her jester form
Since timm made harley quinn and made her scary imagine what would look if bruce timm made a scary and mature version of the condimint king 💀
Worry about the Joker more.
I am sure the Joker in this show would take a certain level of inspiration from the 40s comics but judging by that seasonal end scene, he's still gonna be pretty dark.
Probably be closer to the Jack Nicholson version
I can see him using a homemade, highly corrosive hot sauce that (when aerosolized) can cause severe bleeding from the eyes, nose, mouth, and esophagus
Great. Now I want it...
Timm made Harley Quinn to be a one episode hench woman. Arleen Sorkin made her a fan favorite which created a legacy for all the variant Harleys. If Timm made Harley like this to begin with, she would've never made it out of the original animated series.
This version really feels like Hugo Strange without the weird back and forth they did with him (introduced as geneticist, suddenly psychiatrist...because? )
Man must just have a lot if hobbies
Seeing a more modern reimagining of Harley Quinn who isn’t attached to the Joker while also still keeping her as a villain *and* makes use of her psychological background was actually a very inspired choice. It also changes the whole context of the therapy sessions Bruce and her have, since she wasn’t actually trying to get him to open up about his trauma to help him, but instead to manipulate and take his wealth like with the other billionaires she’s counseled. But because of how guarded and closed-off Bruce is, it ended up unknowingly benefiting him when Harleen gives up due to not even her being able to scale the insurmountable walls he’s formed around himself. I feel totally bad for Montoya though, since the girl got stood up for reasons that she’ll most likely never end up learning about.😔
I disagree about her wanting to manipulate Bruce. In my opinion, she was testing him to see if he was rotten to the core and deserved punishment like her other patients, but she quickly notices that the playboy face Bruce Wayne wears was just a facade for trauma and wasn't his true nature. Her offer to keep doing the therapy sessions was genuine.
Bruce is an actual patient because he actually cares about people. Karma literally saves him from being imprisoned
@@Yoru-ov1zvAgreed. She sounds genuinely concerned when she explicitly tells Bruce,
"I don't think you're a danger to yourself or anyone else. But I also don't think we've made any progress together."
I think we're supposed to keep that scene in mind when, two episodes later, she takes a much sterner tone with Emerson Collins as she prepares to restrain and lock him up.
She knows Bruce is doing his best to keep up his carefree persona in spite of the trauma that triggered that one very public act of violence. He's clearly damaged, but very different from the powerful narcissists who whine about how awful all the people they see as being beneath them are.
I think the sequence of her trapping Batman and saying that she expects him to escape/not wanting to kill him has a lot happening, but when you break it down:
Harley knows enough about Batman (most likely through the police investigations) and his exploits that she knows he goes after unusual cases. Harley has also figured that regardless of the odds, Batman usually comes out on top/her not really being aware of all the tricks up her sleeve. Trying to kill him will most likely end with him escaping somehow, but she's giving it a try anyways. My understanding of what Harley is saying, "You'll probably end up escaping this attempt to kill you anyways, and I don't really mind what you're doing, but I figured that if you're coming after these other guys, you were gonna come for me, and I don't want you bothering me. Since you'll probably end up escaping somehow, I'll at least get some time to escape before you catch up to me again. See you next time."
Harley doesn't WANT to kill Batman, since he's basically enacting justice like her, but if he's going to get in her way, she needs to either kill him and succeed or get enough time to put some distance between the two of them so that he won't capture her.
I agree with your take Mr.Serum Lake having Harley Quinn be her own character not lusting after Joker or Poison Ivy while being a threat with a new color scheme is a proper way to reinvent the character I hope she turns up in future episodes
Probable returns with Crane
true, pairing her up with Ivy makes for some new stories, but it never sat right with me that she always has to be WITH someone, and her own personality was heavily affected by who she was with.
I genuinely loved this interpretation of Harley Quinn and feel she's just as valid ad any other interpretations of the character. We've had so many versions of Batman over the years, and as Denny O'Neil says, "None of them are right or wrong," so seeing this fresh take on Harley by one of her co-creators felt fresh. I loved how much agency she's been given and how far they leaned into her intelligence and deftness at her given profession.
The jester is the king servant judge, meaning he will judge the king for his action and make a fool out of his decision While being an advisor to make better judgement. This perfectly describes dr. Harley quin since she is basically that to her patients
I don’t fully get people crusading against Harley being dependent on people, even Bruce Timm being against it. Like yeah, it’s not a good thing that she’s dependent, but that’s the point, isn’t it? Harley is a great example of the dangers of dependence and abuse in relationships. Sure, I get people after a while would want to change that, and see her move on and grow, but the issue I have is a lot of people act like it was a mistake to make her like this in the first place, even though it’s an integral part of her character and serves a great purpose of showing the issues of dependence like I mentioned before.
Not that I’m saying this about caped crusader Harley, she’s fine. I’m only talking about people having issues with that aspect of original Harleys character
I agree with this. I, for one, didn’t really like this take on Harley. She wasn’t a very fun or really all that interesting character. It was just boring. A lot of what this Harley has done has been done better by other villains anyways. But, again, that’s just my own opinion.
She’s been removed from her dependency on others for a long time, it’s changed and evolved into something greater than a Joker fan girl
@@the_realconspiracydino Sounds like you like BTAS Harley merely for entertainment value. And that has been the issue for the last decade. They didn't want to go deeper with her. Not until now.
I think there's an issue of people idolizing the "tragic romance" of her relationships. Harley Quinn is a character that's INCREDIBLY popular right now, more popular that anyone probably thought she'd be when she was being invented. And people find aspects of a character that's in vogue and emulate them. Her dependency is unhealthy and neither DC nor Timm want people glamorizing it. Just because you're smart enough not to do that, don't assume other people are.
The Harlequin episode is probably my third favorite in the series. Out of the two characters that were in Caped Crusader, Harley was handled better than Harvey Dent here. She was better handled on the plot showing her persona as Harleen Quinzel before revealing her true colors The Stress In Her Regard. Not only did she have a different but we finally have a Harley that uses his psychiatrist profession. Most iteraitons have her be a crazy criminal and never play into her intelligence, so we finally have that utilized. I also enjoyed her design even though the classic red and black suit will always be my favorite. I do feel I wished she used her kidnapped patients as goons more or start a ruckus. However I guess that's the point, unlike most of the Caped Crusader Rogues she's more intelligent. And her Va did a great job voice acting her. She may not Arleen Sorkin levels but she did a great jon balancing both personas of Miss Harleen Quinzel.
So here is an unpopular opinion Harley is probably my most conflicted Batma Rogue. I pity her and yet I get annoyed by her everytime she appears on screen. I feel her backstory was nonsensical because I felt a psychiatrist would've acknowledge the Joker's mamipulation. (But Harleen The Comic and the Animated Harley Quinn series helped me understand why she became unstable even though I'm still annoyed.) I do agree she is the more redeemable out of the Batman Rogues but I feel DC has no clue what to do with Harley. Like her being an anti hero, anti villain or hero. And I do enjoy her relationship and time with Poison Ivy yet part of me feels while Poison Ivy is supportive of Harley, she's still a rogue so that means she's simply enabling Harley and both of them continue committing crime. Sure she is friendly to Harley but I feel Harley is so co dependent on Ivy it feels annoying. It doesn't help that Ivy becomes more heroic which while she isn't as vile compared to the Joker, I always saw her as an anti villain not a anti hero or heroine. Then there are so much depictions of Anti Heroine Harley with the DCU that I feel ruin the legacy of what made Harley great in the first place.
Caped Crusader is not the definitive Harley but she is great. Not only is she one of the most successful reiterations her motive and tragedy make sense. She is kind of like Batman in a sense, but her methods are questionable in a sense. Perhaps we would learn more on Caped Crusader Harley's backstory in the second season. Who knows I'm looking forward to seeing more of this Jungian Jester.
Harley Quinn II is cool and all but I was frustrated by the glaring plothole that you can't just make the richest men in the city vanish and nobody notices.
That's right, folks, “Caped Crusader” has hit us with what is arguably the creepiest version of Harley Quinn ever put to screen. And yes, that IS primarily because we don’t have the Joker to thank for her creation this time. But I actually think it's worth noting how the show strongly hinted at her drawing inspiration from a completely different Batman villain (something this video didn't touch on), specifically in "Night of the Hunters", when Harley reveals that her Psychology Professor in college was none other than JONATHAN CRANE. While many of us who caught that reference may have simply laughed it off as just an amusing little Easter Egg, in the moment (present company included), you can DEFINITELY see the Scarecrow's influence in the way she operates. In addition to the physical and mental torture she inflicts on her victims, in order to make them psychologically dependent on her, she's also placing them in what is essentially their worst nightmare. See, these are all ludicrously wealthy men who only care about one thing...being ludicrously wealthy. And Harley is basically robbing them of that, imprisoning them in an environment where all their treasure and privilege amount to absolutely NOTHING. And for these men, what could POSSIBLY be more terrifying than THAT?
At least, that's just MY thinking on it.
Quite a stark contrast, from the BTAS version who was herself a doctor at before the Joker brainwashed her.
She already gave in to him so he
Had no need to brainwash her.
To be honest, as far as psychology is concerned, she wasn't super great in the original.
This one is more proficient in that regard.
10:30 it could be intentional because didn’t they INTEND to kill off Harley Quinn originally? She only stuck around for so long because the fans LOVED her.
"Who are you? I'm you with therapy"
“I can take a evil murder scarecrow that puts fear toxin over Gotham every Sunday but I DRAW THE LINE AT A LESBIAN”
Like it’s so BORING just to do the same tropes every time, why are people so angry that Batman a show about various people being brought to crime bc of outside factors has new perspectives of people?
“Sure I can take communist superman but god forbid you make him black”
@@Strawberry_Cubes I think it is less, they dislike diversity - and more that writers just do diversity for the sake of it. Not do much or something interesting with it.
Beyond, for example make a character gay and their entire personality is how 'gay' they are. This having happened multiple times across various media - it is a trigger almost; that when you hear diversity it would equal bad character writing for some people
@@mrgreen6980 but it’s not boring? Like I find this argument so annoying there’s a ton of straight relationships I find genuienly so snooze worthy in Batman and marvel yet no one’s really debating that “oh we need to stop making straight people now bc erm your just putting it in for the sake of straight people”
Also no I disgree most the time I see “oh they never shut up about being gay/lgbt” they maybe say it once or they do like garnet out of su and yet it’s not boring.
There’s also a lot of boring technical stuff like writers genuienly having to overstate it due to if they all did the Disney thing where they have one kiss it will just be censored everywhere.
Also please state to me in this modern day where someone’s whole entire character was “their gay”
Are people really mad about her being a lesbian? She's already at least bi in the comics. To me she just falls flat as a character here. I just don't like alternate versions of characters at all though. If you're doing something so drastically different you may as well just make a new character in my opinion. Like they did with original Harley Quinn and a bunch of other characters in BTAS.
Also, the diversity thing the other commenter mentioned does exist. They means it's boring because it's so blatant what they're doing, not because it's a lesbian or gay relationship. They made Mr. Freeze a lesbian in the Suicide Squad game for example. Besides that it's literally the same character. Not a big deal to me since the game sucks anyway, but it's so blatantly obvious they did it just to check a box. They made a gay version of Superman (Jonathan Kent) to check a box in the comics too and killed that run pretty quickly.
@@jt6404 I dunno. As for the sexual orientation thing. It was mostly as an example.
As it is often, they just take a character - change something about them. Then act if that character has always been like that/thought like that/ or (insert some other personal opinion) that.
All the while, not doing any writing or character development with such a change - as it happens in that media.
A good example of changing something about a character and running with that - is Superman from Justice League: Gods and Monsters for example.
I prefer this Harley over the one we've been getting in the past 10 years. While I didn't like the costume at first, it's really grown on me. I just hope they KEEP her and Joker as separate characters.
I think this version of Harley is partners with Crane instead
I kinda want her to see what they do with Joker and Harley
I like how in many ways, they've brought in facets of the Batman's Hugo Strange, but with a counter-corruption spin compared to TB Strange's more curiosity-focused angle.
Harley being on her own sort of crusade for justice is an interesting twist. She's not enjoying hurting people like in her original version but she sees it as a thing she has to do.
And I commented before about her color scheme possibly referencing greed, but now I think that, aside from being a visual change from her classic red, black and blues, it might be a subtle nod to her own view of herself. Green is a color that can be associated with sickness, and yellow with fear, so, for someone who is into archetypes and symbols, Harleen may be saying that she sees herself as sick (in the head) and scared (either of herself or others).
I think part of the reason Harley got hit with the backlash was that people kinda wanted her to be forced to stay in the "Mentally Unwell Sexy White Woman That Kisses Girls" box rather than be a more well rounded, reasonable character with different motivations and a character design they, let's be frank, found less attractive.
They want their Suicide Squad Harley back. That's it.
I don't care that Harley was reinvented. This might be a controversial comment, but the original Harley Quinn ANNOYED me. So, I'm actually excited about this iteration.
Honestly I agree original Harley was
annoying & got worse, this Harley isn't Harley at all though.
The 90s harley was ok the later versions were so annoying that i like this New versión more
Only tiny objections are that Harley Quinn is actually bisexual and the opposites of red and blue are green and orange, but otherwise, great vid!
Update: Ah, you acknowledged her bisexuality.
I have to agree about the color objection. I think her costume is yellow and black, not yellow and green and I'm not sure why he viewed it that way. It doesn't help that she's standing in a dark basement or dark exterior, but I don't think it was meant to be seen as green.
Lowkey kind of love the weird power fantasy of this Harley take. She's an "eat the rich" lawful evil/vigilante type thay could evoke a very strong parallel to Batman or other heroes who fight crime outside the limits of law, as Harley herself is also technically fighting moral and ethical evil rather than "punishable in a court of law" and "chaotic evil" types. I kind of love that for her.
The jester theme fits any incarnation of Harley Quinn as it's a play off the word Harlequin
I always love when they lean into her intellegence.
A Harley with no Joker additives is absolutely terrifying, like this is what i expect an Earth 3(Crime Syndicate) Harley to be like, shes not quite a villain but damn sure no where near a hero
The new version of Harley Quinn has been done well. She was a one dimensional with the Joker originally. She was given more personality before the end of the BTAS series(s), but still not a strong character. I think this time around she's finally be given justice. The new take on Harley is wonderful, and I look forward to seeing more of her.
3:50 wait, im American and i honestly (besides my horrid luck on Tuesdays) never seen that kind of phrase as an insult
"see you Next Tuesday" (C.U.N.T) im not calling you or anyone else that i just think that's what he meant
I never even knew that phrase existed before now
@@maarekstele2998 now i get it very subtle.
@@maarekstele2998 Huh, I'm not sure I'd ever heard that before. If I have, I certainly had zero idea that it was being used as an insult. I am glad, though, that I'm not the only person who had to stop and ask what he was talking about.
And my friends still not believe my English comprehension comes from TH-cam, thanks for the lesson
When I saw the redesign, I had hopes now hearing about the character I think she might be my favorite Harley
Dr. Quinn: Menacing Woman
id watch that show
More of an antihero than villain don't @ me, if deadpool and punisher can get the title with shit they pull then so should this version of Harley.
It's funny. Deadpool is completely insane to a toony degree. And Punisher is a Law Breaking, unhinged, unapologetic Killer. We aren't suppose to glorify them as much as accept there character for what they are. Harley over the years has been change up several times. And we are constantly pushed to believe that she's justified of her actions or having a feeling of sympathy for her without question, because it's Harley. And don't get me started on Injustice Harley Quinn.
At the very least this Harley Quinn isn’t designed to be a fan service girl. She gets to be her own character with her own motivations not tied to The Joker.
I legit didn't realize she was supposed to be asian until you pointed it out in another video. Thought it was a character design thing since her eyes looked "regular" in her costume
I imagine if they ever decide to introduce the Joker in this series, Harley would start off seeing him as a pawn for her own scheme. He would play along as her henchman for a while, but slowly manipulating her along the way. Making her question her own beliefs until eventually he forces her to make a choice: him or her love Renee. From there would be up for the writers to decide.
I was wondering if you were going to note the "See You Next Tuesday" remark. It is simply incredible how different that word is between American English and Anglo/Aussie English. Similarly, the word "spastic" is just an adjective with no offensive connotation in America, but that's not the case elsewhere.
We can still use it in a medical sense, such as a spastic colon (why is that the first example that came to mind…) but, yeah, we’d never call a person that in this day and age.
There's also, pardon my English, *bollocks.* Sure is weird, that word being quite mild in the New World than in the Old World continents.
Then again, we get its antithesis, c**t.
It's insanely refreshing to see a review of the new harley that isn't two aggressive dudes on their 'podcast' crying about how she's not likable enough or how she's too divergent. It feels like every single 'worst comic fan you've ever had to talk to' has had an insipid take about this character that boils down to "POC harley bad" or "woman bad"
I think that the Caped Crusader is ok, its no bad as much people say but isen't extremely good either. There was somethings that i found disapointing, one of them was Harley, i don't care about the changes on her look, but when i saw the trailer i thought that she will be more darker than she really was on the series. The ideia of using secrets to manipulate people was good, but the way they present was pretty goofy to me. I tought that she's gonna be like batman in a way, working on the shadows and appears out of nowhere with a deadly look to thraeth her victms of revealing there secrets if they don't make what she wants, making them think that maybe they were getting crazy asking themselves if she was real or not.
See you next Tuesday = insult
Because
C (see)
U (you)
N (next)
T (Tuesday)
AGSHBSHAGDA thank you so much for making this video -
When I first saw her, it was through the lens of an ignorant/biased lens of a guy who kept spouting about how this new dr harlequin would be awful because of this, or that, but through someone who has an unbiased view and actually went in to really see her true caped crusader version I *_LOVE_* her.
I’m literally giddy, I LOVE villains like this- and I never usually get to see them as women,
So thank you for opening my eyes because if not- I would have completely missed out on her 😭👍
I'd like to see a crossover with the 'victim' and the 'focused' characters, meeting. The 'older' Harley that we are all family with is more self-aware than she was when with Mistuh J. This newer Dr. Quinzel has stayed closer to her professional roots and MAY fill the 'Batman nemesis' role. At this point, I honestly don't care if we EVER get the Joker...
My only real complaint, and this is just for Bruce Tim as a whole, is that he gives everyone such giant shoulders. He might as well work for Warhammer and Warcraft because of how big those shoulders are. Outside of that, good Harley. Nice shake up.
This version of Quinzel seems to draw a lot from Professor Pyg. Both are driven to drastically altering people in the name of creating their own utopian vision; Pyg seeks to sculpt his visions of beauty and perfection, while Quinzel looks to create social justice by completely rewriting minds.
I still kinda feel like Harley being homosexual SHOULD be a big deal cuz yk doesn't the show take place in like the 40's? Would've been more interesting if she had to hide that part of herself due to the morality of the time
Maybe it's more like the Incredibles, where that movie has a lot of 60s vibes but isn't explicitly set in the 60s
This version of Harley was my second favourite of the new takes on villains (after Onomatepia). Interesting to see a Joker-free take on the character. I got the "Right of Jesters" stuff but totally missed the Jungian bits.
Same. Although my favorite take on these show’s villains is Nocturna, not Onomatopoeia.
Still love the OG Harley as the core new versions try to draw from but I also love this take on her!
It's similar to how I love The Joker from 'The Batman' TV show. He's a solid and interesting take on the character. Wouldn't want that version all the time but it's great in it's own right.
The man we see in the king's garb we also see in therapy; his complaints seem to focus on the failings, unsuitability, and inferiority of his prospective heirs. A king loathed to give up power and avoiding his mortality by putting off the selection of a successor. I wonder if part of his detestation for his children comes from a physical disability, which may explain his legs being broken? Maybe this was part of his containment? Maybe it is also part of accelerating his breakdown, revealing that the other patients will be no source of comfort and aid. Additionally, he views his workers as serfs. He views himself as part of a modern feudalist structure and speaks in terms of deserving or being owed obedience and subjugation. Maybe the chain he is in is intended to resemble a throne in his mind? Make him detest and fear the power and wealth he so desperately holds onto?
I find it likely all of those selected by Harley were selected for failure in personal and or professional relationships more so than failures of business ethics due to their punishments/treatments. The assignments they have been driven to likely reflect and lay bare an irrationality they are prone to or some breed of childhood trauma. The men were once powerful and likely made delusional and irrational demands of those around them.
The man who desperately wants his pudding and not beans may have a childhood hangup or perhaps demanded positive outcomes before the work to produce those outcomes occurred.
The man looking for the damaged light and the man writing the same phrase on the chalkboard over and over are likely having phrases spat back in their own faces. The line writer especially likely refuses to confront their own misdeeds and callousness. The Christmas elf looking for "the bad bulb" likely spent time looking for the one bad person within his company who was denying his perfect system or the such. A "bad bulb" can refer to a head or mind that is in some way wrong. I could see someone obsessed with optimization and a perfectly run system deciding all the small variables and inefficiencies are down to one person who contains and is the source of all errors.
Thanks. I don't understand the "bad bulb" bit.
i kinda wish this concept was used for like a genderbent hugo strange or something. i dont mind her not being attached to the joker but she just doesnt feel like harley quinn/have any of the personality and manerisms that make me like her. honestly if she still had her usual playful and spirited attitude she has as harleen while still in the costume i feel like thatd make her closer to what i like about the character AND serve to make her even more unsetteling if shes torturing ppl and still acting this way
I just hope they don't connect this version of Harley to their version of Joker, I think it would undermine this version of Harley
Well for now. it looks like they haven't. Harley left town and Joker seemed to Arrived in Gotham recently.
@@spottedslash4256 I know, but I'm just saying that they should keep it where if Harley returns she doesn't go with Joker
It made sense because shes a high degree doctor trying to dig deep bruce’s head, she can manipulate everyone for her twisted experiment
I like the direction they are going with
I seen alot of harley x joker, i got tired of it
I wanted to see different direction
Dont get me wrong i like harley quinn
Cant we just enjoy what we like?
Wait, mainline Harley's JEWISH?! That's news to me!
Yep With the New 52 even revealed that Harley was born in Brooklyn (probably as a way to explain her New Jersey accent) and her family were linked to the Jewish mafia
Once again, this entire debacle reminds me of a question I once had.
How many changes can you introduce before you fundamentally change a character into another one?
There is a line here, but this issue is that it's rather blurry.
I too question the idea of changing her character instead of making a new one.
It's Bruce Timm's character, he literally invented the concept of the character. If there is one human being alive today who gets to decide what is and is not Harley, it is Bruce Timm, her creator and author. This is the equivalent of telling an author who wrote a book you like that he or she doesn't get to have input on their character.
This really isn’t too different than the original, a girl driven to do crime due to her profession as a psychologist, using a jester based moniker to terrorize the citizens of Gotham
@@ParadoxicalThird
You're assuming I said he couldn't. I was just asking at what point does a character stop resembling themselves?
@@ParadoxicalThird I'm sorry to burst your buble, but Bruce Timm didn't create Harley Quinn, Paul Dini did. Bruce himself only provided the classic costume and that was it. He has even said multiple time that he doesn't like Harley and doesn't even understand why she's so popular in the first place. His only other great contribution to the character was Harley SA Nightwing because haha, r*pe is funny.
@@pablocardoso7830
Oh, really?
I think this is a really unique and interesting take on Harley Quinn. It's a nice direction and a cool character, as well as having some interesting interactions with Batman.
Dear god THANK YOU for calling out those mouth breathers who throw temper tantrums whenever there's a DC character that isn't white or straight
I was loving the show, but this was the episode I dreaded going into it, because Harley has been so intrinsically tied to the joker for most of my life that I knew they'd have to really wow me with the attempt to separate her from him completely, without any mention of him. And seeing as the dull and boring Telltale Harley was the only example of this previously in media (where they actually kind of flipped the script and had HER corrupt the Joker to an extent), I didn't have high hopes
But wow, was I wrong. They blew me away with this new Harley, and she's done fantastically well and built up wonderfully. I can't say I particularly care for her jester outfit from an artistic standpoint, I think the yellow and green, while a cheeky opposite to the red and blues of her prior costumes, is a bit of a gauche combination, and the third hat tail just throws the entire silhouette off in my opinion, but I love that she operates completely differently when she's in costume and out of costume, not unlike Bruce himself--versus prior Harleys always being high energy goofballs.
Something I've never been too happy with is how comic book writers tend to forget that Harley Quinn started out as a psychiatrist, someone who spends an impressive amount of time and dedication to learning about the human mind, its chemical processes, and how it manifests. Often, she is depicted as a bit of a dope (an airhead). And I know she's trying to imitate the Joker as a way of garnering his affection, but it comes off as so superficial in a way that feels less intentional and more like the writer's forgot she's supposed to be pretty smart (or observant of other people).
At least, in this version, she bases her entire identity around her profession.
I love how Dr. Harlequin contrasts Batman himself in this show. While Batman uses brawn violence to stamp out crime and corruption in the Gotham underbelly, Harley Quinn uses mind and manipulation to break the corrupt and amoral of Gotham’s upper elites. Both with their charismatic outer shell and never-smiling costumed alter ego.
Something I really like about this take on Harley is the parallel's there are between her and Batman. Neither fully hide their faces, only obscuring them with the cowl and face paint. Maybe showing that they never fully show who they are at all times. Her being self-aware of her own mental issues and using them in a dark, yet ultimately altruistic manor for Gotham can also be compared to Batman using his own pain to drive him to save others.
Love the video, it's such interesting take on caped crusader's Harley
6:35 -- Speaking of which, it took me awhile, but it hit me that Mr. Collins is based upon a two-time Batman villain, the Monarch of Menace. A video somewhere around here titled "This Villain DESTROYED Batman" will tell you his complete story, but essentially, he has the same "I'm royalty" attitude that Collins uses, plus the red with white edging cloak that he wore.
It took me a second to get the "see you next Tuesday" joke. Never heard that one before, that's clever.
I didn’t get it. Could you explain?
@@Victor-qx3vx "See you" can be read as "C U", and "next Thursday" gives you "N T". Put 'em together and you get a naughty word.
@@DragonaxFilmsoh ok. Thanks.
I figured that was the word British/australians used as punctuation but I couldn’t find it there.
I do wonder if She had one of those weird torture traps in mind for Bruce. Outwardly he does not present as misanthropic like the other wealthy men in her "Care", he's literally only there by court order for punching a guy who bad mouthed his mom. But even this version of Harley is not exactly stable or right minded, and she could trap him anyway to "share the wealth" in a way
A woman wearing pink is a subtle nod to them being homosexual?
Total video essay youtuber take
I don't get it, either.
I assume it has something to do with them MATCHING. I might be wrong. 🤷
@@Maziko_Lee the way he said it made it seem as if he was referencing a common thing in animation
Lol, In the movie of the Tennage Mutant Ninja Turtles and Batman Joker calls Harley "Nurse Quinn" and she gets pissed and refuses to help, finally he cedes and calls her "Doctor Quinn" and she responds "Damn Right I am!".
I really like the change they did with Harley in Caped Crusader, it feels really fresh.
I think it was Jesterbell who pointed it out; Harley being changed so much might not be such a good idea as she represents a struggle that real people develop; a dependence on their abusers. Say what you will, this version of Harley is so different they would have been better off making a new character and promoting her instead.
Personally, I think it would of fit better if it was The Mad Hatter
That's a very general assumption.
The story itself doesn't suffer at all from having Harleen be the culprit.
Though I do want the later episodes to explore her reasons a lot more because "she was just fed up with how messed up her rich clients were" doesn't work for me.
What would motivate her to be the one punishing them in gruesome and disturbing ways?
But Mad Hatter isn’t a psychologist or ever cared about psychological profiling, he’s just a demented hypnotist with an obsession with Alice In Wonderland
@@KingNerdius Exactly. He didn't have altruistic Goals. He was a Man lost in his thoughts and delusions.
@@spottedslash4256 and?
Glad to see you doing a video on this version of the character! I'm actually working on my own video on the show so I'm happy to enjoy your video on it!
1:49 They do realize that not all Jewish people are Ashkenazi Jewish people, right?
Nasty species
This version is such a different take, but I absolutely love it, because this version of her takes what we know of her and flips it upside down, giving us a fresh take that we needed.
Harleen Quinzel in Caped Crusader, as a therapist, she's fun, upbeat and easygoing, she's what you picture Harley Quinn as nowadays, but as Harley Quinn or "The Jester", she's articulate, cunning, manipulative, etc. She's everything you don't see Harley Quinn as now. She's putting her smarts out there and actually using her skills in psychiatry to good use, which is rare to see her do, unless she's Harleen in other media and she really isn't that bad of a person as well, considering she was willing to go save Barbara Gordon, who was innocent and didn't do anything, she has so much good, it's just she uses her capabilities to do wrong things, even though the outcomes are turning greedy men into actually decent people who are willing to help the less unfortunate.
I actually enjoyed this Harley waaaay more then what we got now, she's really a breath of fresh air.
the worst part is that this is prolly someone’s fantasy
To note first, I like this version of Harley
But honestly, I don't quite see the problem with a problematic tragic relationship like the one OG Harley had with the Joker
Joker is an evil bastard and his relationship with Harley is clearly depicted as bad, as long as it's not portrayed as a good thing. I don't see why it'd be a taboo to have the bastard be a bastard when it comes to his relationships
It takes a very good writer to write a toxic dynamic in a semi-realistic way that doesn't romanticize it.
first fresh iteration of this character since she premiered
Every complaint everyone has for this new harley just proves bruce timm’s point and the point of those trying to separate her from joker unsuccessfully or not. I love the awesome observations you and others in the comments have
This was an amazing review!
With Quinn id personally like to see only two things, either one or both would be cool
1. Orgin reversal (NOT ROLE REVERSAL, just the orgins) instead of The Joker creating Harley, Harley creates the Joker, since she has a tendency to break the minds of her 'paitients' and have them take off weird roles like a baby man and a pharaoh
2. complety seperate, they dont even KNOW about eachother (unless/until they see about one another in the news or shit like that), The Joker doesnt care about Harley and Harley doesn't care about The Joker, now im not saying never let them interact, in fact interactions between what could be a manipulative character and someone whose basically a prodigy when it comes to seeing through that crap would be interesting. This is just me spit balling because I LOVE The Joker and Harley as characters but i hate how they're paired, id love to see them interact without the whole domestic violance thing