Is the Tarmac SL8 as Aero as They Claim?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ต.ค. 2024
- Specialized recently released the new Tarmac SL8 Road Bike. They claim it's the most aero road bike they've ever produced and presented data to back it up. We looked at the results and were very surprised at what we found out.
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This channel should have WAAAAY more subscribers. Real non biased info and data. Great work.
lol I trust Hambini, he is a real engineer like myself and understands the science.
OMG i clicked on this video and I'm like "okay well let's see what this guy says, probably gonna say ya that the sl8 is faster or whatever" and low and behold...it's my bike fitter from 6 years ago!!! lol This guy is awesome. He is completely honest and will tell the truth. He's been around pros, real pros, like Peter Sagan. Finally, people like Peak Tourque and Ero sports making youtube an honest place to listen to FACTS!
I'd love to see different tt hemlets on the same rider and how that affects the decission making
Thanks for all the info and for all the hard work trying to inform us the people !!!
Tbh Cannondale lab 71 looks more aero and better in my eye
I guess? It’s still a mass produced modern carbon disc brake “road” bike.
Nothing special about it.
You mentioned that Specialized did not exaggerate the data numbers they released about the SL8 and that these are the honest and real numbers you should expect when buying this SL8 bike. That statement is not accurate, and it is misleading to consumers. These are not “Real World” numbers, meaning that the average consumer who would be buying and riding this bike is not riding at 27.96mph for 40km to be able to achieve the aero savings between the SL8 vs SL7. Those metrics are ONLY achievable by top-level elite Pro cyclists. Why doesn’t Specialized put out data numbers about the aero performance difference for the SL8 vs SL7 for speeds that an average person (Intermediate-Advanced) rider is actually riding at, (e.g. 14-22mph)? Specialized does not publish those numbers because there is probably zero or very little aero gains or speed gains when riding at those lower speeds. It all comes down to marketing and the average cyclist is most likely not going to get any speed or aero benefits from buying a more expensive SL8 vs the SL7. In terms of ride quality, that is something that the average cyclist “might” notice between the SL8 vs SL7 because the frames are built slightly different, and that is mostly in the head tube, rear triangle, and the bottom bracket area.
yeah honestly the average cyclist going 14-22 dont need the sl8 or sl7 though to be honest
I'd consider ground speed vs airspeed and revisit that assumption.
If you're looking to buy an 18k dollar bike for aero gains on your 15mph sunday morning solo ride. You must be really rich or dont have priorities right. Amateur races are going at 25mph easily.
If your avg is 14-22 then you should probably be looking in to an SL5
You do realize this bike is made for pro tour racing athletes first? They do ride at that speed all the time. It’s this bike first and foremost use case. For consumer you dont “need” to buy the top tier level in fact they made lower tier both frameset and full build thats more than half the price of the s works and their second tier is still lighter than other brands top tier offering.
Great Video! Had to subscribe immediately.
On the paint-job: I had a similar idea for my Spec Transition years ago. Had the frame painted matte black and all the wind-facing surfaces glow red fading out to the back. Basically like a black space-ship starting to glow during re-entry into the atmosphere...
Thats brilliant. any links to pics?
You should test the new Bianchi Oltre RC because they have some unreal data.
You guys just do more videos like this discussing bicycle aerodynamics. I work in a shop and I really feel bad for consumers who fall for marketing and buy these expensive bikes based of “data & numbers” published by the brands
I get you but just let them buy what they can afford, we all know that marketing is meant to make you believe you need something that you dont actually need.
position and fitness number 1 and 2. marginal gains is for the rich and the fit
You should do wind tunnel testing of it to see to compare the vengue to to it
The Ali express socks sty up on the leg the best. They're the ones with the double silicone bands at the top. Test those!
totally agree. surprisingly sticky on the leg.
Link?
almost forgot the SL6 i agree with you would be a nice bike, disc brake bikes are heavier and create just as much wind resistance when riding , rim brakes lighter for me faster
But - i am at the start of video. I care about Aero, but more about stiffness and bike moving forward under load - heavier riders (like 80kg). And the bike from the store - not one made for PROs. Aero is nothing if frame is moving under you and squeezing. Most of the time in the race you are behind someone, or in pack. The bigger difference than 4w is how you sit, if you try shorter cranks and as i wrote - if there is attack or peak - sprint, short uphil etc - if bike move forward and not to side. I swap SL7 for Canyon Aeoroad - i should have done it much earlier. It was life changing experience how fast and how Canyon is moving "forward" comparing to Atheos and SL7. It remind me of Venge and Vias i had.
The Tarmacs prioritize climbing ability first with more of a spinner style cadence and then have gradually become more and more aero, which is fine, but I'm a heavier rider as well and sprint oriented, not a climber, and prefer to play to my strengths with a big gear grinder setup and more aero frame, even slightly heavier for the bikes ability to absorb bumps and hold speed. Weight, cadence, riding style, race strategy all come into play when selecting your weapon, they're all good bikes, but it's the Venge all day for me.
Amazing video!!! I'm wondering if most of the aero savings on the SL8 is from the new Rapide Integrated bar/stem
Specialized don’t hide the fact that that’s where the main gain is
@@neilbuckley5796 if that’s the case I’ll just upgrade my Venge with the new Rapide cockpit 😋
@@airguillo31 if it works for you mate!
For the average club rider rider at 18-20mph are the marginal gains even marginal gains? The SL7 is also a beautiful bike, perhaps one of the most beautiful bikes ever made. imho
the main problem with these bikes is one we are not pro cyclists ,and the speed at which you have to see the results are not for the average rider, that said positioning on your bike , wheel upgrade , have tried a pair of hyper 45 mm carbon wheels carbon spokes with ceramic bearings, they are faster than my bontrager 50mm aerolus wheel set, on a segment of 26.2 km previous time was 42:00 avg of 37.6 km/hr in 2015 with my tarmac expert and mavic krysium wheel set at the age of 56yrs, fast forward to 2022 same distance of 26.2km with the hyper wheels 39 :45 a tarmac frame of 2019 , avg of 39.7 km/hr at 63 yrs young and that is riding 58 km to switch the wheels and tires for the trail , project over the winter is to install ceramic bottom bracket and possibly a set of new wheels , and for a monkey wrench in the comments i have switched out my regular tubes for TPU tubes , they do run harder however for myself i find they are faster rolling , anyway long way of saying upgrading the wheel set will help most anyone , and rim brakes for me are my choice , if i was riding in europe probably would opt for disc hyd, brakes i love climbing its the way down that can be tricky , i mean we do not have the luxury of closed roads like the pro 's
Didn't they claim the new handlebar got to 4 watts of saving? If so then the frame is dead even with the previous one?
Yes, you're right
@@dainiusvysniauskas2049 My thought is if you put that cockpit on the Venge it would be faster. No way that frame is faster.
And once you put an out front mount, it s provably 1 or 2 watts if that
@@Martin-ls9bz Lol. 20$ socks do better than that.
@fastorfiction are you including the SwissSide calf sleeves in your next comparison video?
No, their aero claims are the same results we're getting from a few different brands. Nothing special to be honest. I chose Surpas because I have seen some interesting results and heard of other results from some of the pro triathletes who've tested with them.
Don't see a purpose of this video except repeating what specialized says? Where are the claimed facts?
"Realistic data"? C'mon. 45kmh/28mph isn't realistic for the vast majority of riders. Even in race conditions, where the bulk of your time is behind another's wheel, one wonders if the aero gains of the SL8 really help all that much, even at high speeds. And with some saying that the large majority of the aero gains come from the new cockpit - which you can slap on an SL7 - does it make much sense to credit the SL8 overall as more aero?
All of these SL8 Aero and Performance gains data is just more creative marketing by Specialized. Like the slogan they came out with when they released the SL7, “One bike to rule them all”. That slogan was Specialized’s way of claiming that the SL7 was the same performance of the Venge and an SL6 combined. Anyone who has ridden a Venge and the SL7 will tell you that the SL7 does not feel as good as the Venge. The Venge is more snappy, faster accelerating, and holds its speed way better than the SL7. Also, lots of SL6 owners have said that the SL6 rides much better than the SL7. Impressive wind tunnel data is one thing, but real world bike feel and handling is what most of us truly care about.
I’m confused (as always). You have a slide where you list power output as 300 watts, and a .3000 CdA - is that bike + rider? You then drop down to a CdA of .2956 again same question, is that bike + rider? My question is if that is a 1.47% drop in drag of just the bike or bike + rider. If it’s just the bike then it’s a marginal gain (you have very wide margins), if it’s bike + rider, the gains of just the bike must be significant. I ask this because you start with a power number which only makes sense if it’s bike + rider, or it’s an e-bike.
If it’s aero gains of bike alone, where do the aero socks go?
Aero.... Well, legs and torso is a big setback when it is all zimmerd down. The frame dont do this much to win any advantage irl. Weight and Aero on wheels does more.
Its all just marketing at the end of the day. The rider makes the difference. Having a proper fit is cheaper than a 19.000$ bike.
When i went bikepacking i had a 30kg bike (trek emonda) that wasnt aero. I still dropped a group of older riders on 10k bikes on a climb. Its how light and strong the rider is. On the flats its about how aero that rider can get while also being strong
@Sylens1 - With all things being equal (same weigh rider and same fitness level and aero position), the SL8 will be a faster bike than the SL7 if the rider can generate the power and watts needed to ride at 27.96mph for 40km and beyond.
Its the cockpit aka integrated bar and stem most amateurs won't want for expense and lack of tunability that is the net 4 watts saved which in the cosmos is noise aka nebula.
Specialized biggest challenge with the SL8 aside from not cracking steerers and putting riders on their heads at high speeds due to a woefully delinquent cable routing retainer that creates a stress concentration at the top of the steerer neck...is weight reduction.
Word up to you non mechanical engineers. Universally, frame weight reduction and aerodynamics are 'almost' mutually exclusive. Why is that? Because for adequate strength aka force relative to least deflection aka tube strength, round tubes are stronger than tubes shaped like airplane wings which cut the wind better. You can prove this yourself in a simple home experiment with household objects. That means a bike manufacturer can make a round tube aka Atheos lighter than a more wing shaped tube aka SL8 for the same force/deflection aka strength. Think more round tube Giant TCR for sweet spot of compliancy and stiffness or Atheos for lightest bikes relative to strength. Neither will win the aero prize...but the TCR in particular is 'close enough' which David Arthur proved with his wind tunnel testing. A very daunting taste for engineers to make a bike more aero and take 125 grams out of it made from the same material aka high modulus carbon fiber which was the charter for the SL8. That is why even with the ugly speed sniffer bump in front, the frame itself of the new SL8 is no more aero than the SL7...because to remove weight from the frame, other tube sections on the SL8 had to be made 'rounder' which makes it look more like the Atheos.
In engineering, there is no free lunch.
To summarize, the reason to choose a SL8 over a SL7 is the headtube cable routing where they redesigned the cable retainer. Specialized has a history of dubious engineering and should have never released the SL7 design for production because it was unsafe. Pro tip to SL7 owners, remove your steerer which is a huge PITA due to brake hose routing and perform an inspection under bright light and magnification to see if you have micro cracking of the steerer tube. The amount of stress on the steerer of a given SL7 is a function of:
1. quantity of spacers under the stem.
2. amount of hose slack through the steerer
3. SL7 frame size
4. Rider strength. Peter Sagan will flex the handlebar and steerer at 1500 watts in a full out sprint more than mere mortals but there are plenty of large men that can stress a steerer to extreme.
we also run a fast tt bike
Best way to get more aero is to lose 5 lbs
It sure doesn't look aero.
It's as fast as the sl7 with the same handlebar and wheels.
Pure marketing BS, a SL8 rider....when his turn to PULL he hide and we are going down the slope!!
90% 🐂💩 IMO
It's ugly thats is certain
yep. slap the new handlebars on the SL7 and you got a better looking bike with exact same performance.
except its heavier and less aero?@@8rk
aero difference is handlebar only not frame. This is according to Specialized own claims. They claimed 4w difference with roval handlebar. SL8 also claimed 4w more aero than SL7. So you do the math.
"Heavier" if you think this much different matters, I hope you're 130lbs climber. Otherwise who in the world cares?
@@8rkif you have a head unit the one piece handlebar won't save that much
@@Martin-ls9bz Not sure where you got "save money" from? It's a stupidly expensive bike whether you go SL7 or SL8. I don't think the person buying that is trying to save money.
I think SL8 frame is much uglier than SL7. So If you get a Roval bar on an SL7 you both have the aero performance AND the better looks (IMO)
If you care about weight, SL8 isn't the bike to get anyway. The new Factor O2 VAM is lighter AFAIK.
Well all I know is Cannondale says the SystemSix is “The fastest bike in the world. Period.”. Then Canyon says the Aeroad is “The fastest bike on the road. Raced by the top talent in pro cycling. Pure Speed.”. Lastly Specialized says about the SL8 that “Nothing is faster than the Tarmac SL8 thanks to a combination of aerodynamics, lightweight, and ride quality previously thought impossible.”. All taken from the manufacturer’s website and these are just some examples, I am sure there are more and hope people share. But this is just BS and wonder if big brands are trying to cash out before mainland China gets more and more of the pie. It is pretty much a wrap for wheels, which is why they don’t cost as much as they did a few years ago.
@hambini