Reddit HATES MY TIER LIST! : (
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ธ.ค. 2023
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In this video I go over a funny response to someone asking for help on Reddit and getting trash talking my tier list/vague insight from the redditors.
#fireemblem #fireemblemengage #feengage - เกม
The user that said you “vomit” out content really irked me. Your consistent content helped me understand the game and stay engaged as the DLC and stuff came out. It’s the first game I’ve been able to efficiently handle maddening on. None of your videos felt low quality. You’re not very scripted and you’ll make a whole video about like one skill on one specific character, but you always have something new and interesting to say.
Agreed, nothing worse than generic content but he always has something to add.
Engage the first time Lunatic/Maddening been fun since they actually balanced the game this time.
@@PetraMacneary he doesn’t rate Alcryst high at all. Timerra he does but he has shown why she is good. It’s easy to see why everyone thinks Chloe is good. I did a maddening run where I invested in her and I had to restarted because she was making the game too easy.
When I was following your channel during the Triangle Strategy days, I always thought your analysis was pretty helpful and inciteful, even if I didn't agree. I love getting alternate perspectives backed by some data. I never minded the rate of content you were releasing. *shrug*
"Timera is good'
- A guy who does some math
"Timera is bad"
- A guy who does a lot of meth
You don’t seem to understand a whole lot of math either, it’s fine
@@PetraMacneary nobody asked for your reddit math.
Keep hate-watching until you figure smth out, Timerra is great and Etie is litteraly worse than Brunet, who at least comes with Silver equipment
You like DLC and starsphering trash growth units ? Great ! I don’t care and also stop stirring shit in the comments, I can’t believe you thought you had a point there.
If you still have skill issues a whole year after the game came out, that’s on you, don’t be petty in the comments section of someone who gets it and actually has 100ds of hours in actual runs and challenge runs.
Have fun your way, we are not interested in the way you play the game and keep your uninformed opinions to yourself
@@PetraMacnearyalso how you get into the final battle at internal level 40 ? You gotta be bad fait or stupid or both !
Get your shit together and play the actual game !
Gimme more of that passive-agressive energy, you’re in every comment trying to sound smart
Your math is wrong, your math is not a demonstration it’s flawed, thank you for trying, go back to your meth phd
@@PetraMacnearyI will say level 40 isn’t necessarily always gonna be accurate but it’s probably a good average when not using dlc. If we wanted to be complete I feel it’d be good to add at what level you reach certain break points but good job I guess on the math. And I guess it’s worth noting that when using dlc the average level will skyrocket so more things will work .
Reddit suffers from heavy echo chamber syndrome. I really appreciate channels like yours that actually tries to see what units are capable of instead of just parroting. Keep on the Timerra campaign, I’m gonna use her my next run because of it
So true. The echo chambers are deafening. No matter the community, it is consistently aggressive in protecting the popular safe opinion.
The beauty of looking at math when you're designing character builds is it disregards opinion entirely.
your tier lists have won me drafts where they called me a moron for taking timera or framme early
I know how it feels, i posted a clip of boucheron onerounding sombron 3 times on maddening, i just gave him a brave axe, a single energy drop, and lunar brace but people complained saying boucheron was "overinvested".
If anyone hogged all the kills it was actually Citrinne since she had Dire Thunder, she had more than 100 more kills than bouche
RIGHT it’s like “over investing” just means “spending more than 1 second’s thought” smh
Thoron with 4 staves citrine is better, way less investment, great damage from thoron and with momentum, she one shots everyone until past half way in the game and after that point does over 50% hp to most enemies for setting up kills and 4 staves at all times is nice to have to use when you need something. If you need hit rate, easy fix with lucina, lyn, or eirika engraves.
Boucheron is insane, his growths are fantastic - fast unit and with the highest build and highest dex - so he can both hit with axes, not be weighed down on axes, has a might passive that scales with speed and crits, and can use crit builds well. Axe griffin knight he can naturally keep double/quad all game so you can have that extra slot for axe power or lunar brace+ to one shot everything with a brave axe or can use the well axe for a crit build.
I think the biggest problem with unit tier discussions is that most people arguing haven't even done the bare minimum to prove their points and only go off of common consensus. I can bet you like 90% of these players haven't even used characters like Timmera and Anna in maddening and yet they still argue thier viability due to them not being top tier right off the bat.
They treat Engage like it’s a GBA FE game in terms of unit discussion where they could not be more apart. Unlike GBA FE, you can't just eyeball a unit's viabilty through pure stats and class, you have to understand how their stats, growths, sp, and skills interact with Engages systems and that involves more testing than they are willing to do (which is none).
So you end up with people that don't as much as humor your argument and make up excuses why you take is invalid with shit like "that units only good cause of favoritism", or "they're not good without investment" without substantiating an claim for where else those levels/sp should go.
Yeah i bet they just skip to the end and dont listen to any of his reasonings and say his list is shit. His Timerra build and Levin sword anna builds carried my madding run lmao.
Honestly "XYZ unit is bad without investment" has to be the biggest pitfall that people use.
It's like every single character including Alear needs investment to payoff long term. If you don't want to invest in a unit, don't run them.
Every unit if invested in will either help you progress towards a better unit, or... pay off towards end game.
.
@@PetraMacneary Damn, unlucky you then. Better luck next time
Welcome back! As an Engage LTCer, I can say that I’ve learnt quite a few things from your videos for my more casual/challenge playthroughs. For example Timerra, Framme and Anna are truly good units for no-ring-no-Somniel, even if they are bad for minimizing turncounts. I agree that we should keep an open mind and not dump on other people’s “hot takes” like some of those Reddit users. More understanding of other players can only lead to more understanding of the game
Reddit is where intellect goes to die.
I hang out on reddit and I endorse this message.
I think there's a lot of good discussion to be had on the subreddit but we're still in the "Engage bad, the meta is solved" phase for the game. We need to be patient for the rest to catch up.
Bro. You don't have to prove yourself to anyone. You're a GOD at this game and your strategies have helped me( and others) tremendously. They're only giving you more advertisement.
Timerra is the litmus test for me and my friends' assessment of peoples' opinions about Engage - if they think Timerra is bad, they probably don't know what they're talking about and are just parroting the community tier list. She's so obviously strong that it's bizarre how much reddit hates her, but that's what happens when people don't experiment with units.
the person before me beat me to it. But yeah, there are other far more consistent ways to get the same results as timerra. I don't think timerra is bad, it's just she can pop off about half the time if you put investment in, it's just when she pops off she can hit crazy thresholds, but those crazy thresholds don't really matter. Still, she can get funny boss kills if you go for it, but other people can probably hit relevant thresholds without rolling for a proc skill.
Timerra is either the best bad unit ( leaning towards this one )or the worst good unit. She is entirely inconsistent since she is reliant on sandstorm. But with a sandstorm proc she’s a monster. She will do 0 damage to enemies very frequently and simultaneously be able to kill then with a proc. Where as alcryst at least should have enough damage to kill fliers timera won’t be killing anything without a proc ( which is why I’d call him the worst good unit just above timera). You can just use a unit that one rounds things normally. If you need to rely on a proc and that proc isn’t guaranteed for one rounding anything you are a bad unit. Alcryst notably has the distinction of having a very relevant enemy type he can one round easily so he has a consistent job he can do so he’s not exclusively a gamble
have you even used alcryst cause his damage consistently falls off even for taking out endgame fliers and is just a 0x2 unit(rarely since he cant meet double thresholds) who can kill 1 unit on PP while Timerra can tank/dodgetank multiple enemies and deal solid dmg or kill enemies entirely on EP.
@@migu6528 any unit can one round fliers with a forged magic bow using its raw might end game. The bow does all the work for alcryst just need to hit which he can consistently and maybe in extreme cases you’d maybe need a speed emblem or a high might engrave like Ike might be better instead. But coverts are generally your best Astra storm units anyway so chances are if you are using alcryst he has Lyn. Other speed emblems help too though or inherited skills from them. Like seriously you dont even really need a magic stat unless you want goofy 400 damage crits on a bow user with a capped magic stat. Lances have no such weapon that just has so much might that you don’t need stats to use it. Like seriously it’s 81 might vs fliers with a + 3 might engrave at +5 it doesn’t take much to make that one shot. That’s a whole heck of a lot. Great weapons you still have to be able to live the attacks the opponent hits you with first afterall and without something like Ike timera’s bulk isn’t enough with the fact that great weapons will usually get her doubled factored in at least on her own. And great weapons also don’t have effective damage which radiant bow has comparable might and does so it ends up with more raw might from the weapon. So no alcryst is a slot machine that can also do a useful function without needing to sell your soul for luck. Timera can only do the job of an Ike unit ( go into combat with like 5+ units and one round all of them with a 1-2 range weapon) with luck. She needs those sandstorm procs.
@@PetraMacneary I never said I was making an argument, so I don't know why you feel the need to interpret what I said as a failed attempt at a good argument. But as an actual argument - very few other units manage her level of mixed bulk and speed, and so even if she gets 0 sandstorm procs (which, statistically, is very unlikely when she's pulling 5 units and doubling some or all of them even on Maddening), she's still a very comfortable tank. Obviously, her player phase is pretty underwhelming a lot of the time without wells for Lance Power, and I don't play with wells personally - Sandstorm isn't very consistent when you're only making one or two attacks (or sometimes four with Brave Lance). But that's fine; it's very easy to make an extremely powerful player phase unit in Engage, but the powerful enemy phase units are actually pretty hard to come by. In other games, where solid mixed bulk is more common, or where enemy mages are less common and so physical bulk is all that's needed, Timerra would be decidedly mid - but the specific way Engage's units, both friendly and enemy, are structured makes Timerra very useful. In this game specifically, a unit with her set of characteristics is pretty rare. I think you're missing what actually makes Timerra good by saying that Sandstorm only proccing 40% of the time is the problem; if she has a 30-40% proc rate, and is making 10 attacks during an enemy phase, she's going to thin the herd of a given pack massively by getting 3 or 4 procs on average. Proc-based skills on a fast tank with good mixed bulk are good because they are guaranteed to get procs, unlike units such as Alcryst, who only gets 2 chances to get Luna and has no enemy phase.
Seeing that reddit thread, I'm suprised. Your videos have been very helpful. Discovering Framme and Anna's potential completely changed the game for me. Anna always ends up being an S-Tier unit for me, and Framme enables you to enemy phase half of your army for basically free.
Leave it to reddit to not know how to disagree with an opinion without throwing out insults and barely backing them up
The crazy thing is that FE twitter is even worse, significantly so.
This sort of reminds me of the old, what was it, Ike vs Kieran debate I think? Where one side is the meta and one side is just objectively right if you actually look at what they’re talking about. I’m really not good at building units in this game, balancing bond fragment use, etc in this game but I think what you’re saying makes a lot of sense. I’m definitely subscribing
I believe Ebenezer Scrooge said it best: "You keep Fire Emblem in your own way, and I'll keep it in mine." Something like that.
I enjoy the lack of actual discussion.
-Iced Coffee is wrong.
-Why?
-Because I was told Iced coffee is wrong.
Nice Argument. Well done.
I hate being WRONG!!! > : (
Dude the amount of times I'd sit in on a stream and people would be like. "Timmera bad" "I wish I could make timmera good" and I'm just sitting there soloing paralogues and end game. KEEP IKE ON HER and then depending on how you want to build her swap to Sigurd or just stay with Ike. It's not hard.
Yes. She's a BEAST with Sigurd! Fellow man of culture
@@Tboneslim dude I'm so sad cuz I'm doing an iron man and was definitely using her and she died on her recruit map cuz I couldnt see the extra enemy 😭
JADE???? Lmao I didn’t know that was your favorite unit… but I remember being skeptical of Timerra until your videos, her damage output is insane and she can be a great tank too. Like it’s kinda crazy seeing so many people rate her so low
A different criteria I use is DLC allowed. Specifically, I judge a unit on how good it is in maddening story playthrough+dlc paralogues+fell xenologue(most important for me since these are the hardest maps in the game) and assuming 3-7 turns per map.
Thats why I value anna, hortensia, panette so much.
-Anna is immortal with soren.
-Hortensia is already good for fast warp strats but most importantly she has enough res to solo the top left corner of the last map of fell xenologue. Ivy is generally a better unit but she doesnt have the survivability in that specific scenario.
-Panette is the best boss killer in dlc runs. Because she can most easily execute raging storm->attack->goddess dance->houses unite+ because her crits (if built correctly) can make up for the damage needed to clear. the dancer is normally used on hortensia.
I need to hear a good argument for Chloe being A tier and not S tier.
Pre Well Update, there is a very strong argument to be made for her being A Tier.
Essentially, her Str can be lacking. Chloé really shines with Lance Power, and the Well Lance.
That is why when the Game first came out, people were doing Lunar Brace Chloé builds because that was required to reach one round thresholds.
@@Blaze0070I guess knowing context of a tier list is super important. I didn't play the game pre-well but that's some good insight. I feel like on Levin sword she was OP on Maddening
Youre List was really solid in my opinion. I have 2 Maddening Runs. One with DLC Casual and one with no DLC CLASSIC. It still hard but your videos help me a lot to better understand this new fire emblem Mechanics. Haven't played since Fates. I Love Jade as General with IKE. Thanks for the Videos.
Love your videos ICG, your guides helped me beat Maddening the first time I tried it
The redditor making fun of Rosado would have a heart attack if they tried him lol and saw how good he is. People just can't admit how good Timerra is still to this day sadly because of her sandstorm on her picket class which is really good because she has good enough dex to use it plus dex books can help with that. Feel like some just can't admit some of their impressions on the game and cast were wrong. Thought reddit might have been better because when i scroll through most of them its not that bad aside from a few degenerate or toxic articles posted from time to time. Your takes are really solid nowadays. For me if stuff works it works and thats all i truly care about.
You didn’t vomit content, you were one of the first people to consistently release helpful content. I learned so much because of you these guys are haters lol
The Fogado stuff is always interesting to me because on my first run I just slapped a radiant bow on him and he just consistently helped more than Alcryst by taking out armors and wyverns... so I just went, "Oh seems like the best Archer"
Then I looked on the internet and saw wild stuff about him lol. Same with Timerra etc. I just used stuff that worked and had similar takes. Not a LTCer or anything though. Same with Anna, she's not necessary but it's pretty easy to get her online and I like money.
Been a while, I enjoy the FE Engage discussions, even if we disagree on some units:
Anna: I always admit I'm an Anna enjoyer, I admit she has a rough start, which you can fix with Micaiah, and I think almost every Anna enjoyer does that.
So the drawback here is that she takes the Micaiah exp away from other units to become a unit as good or even better than Pandreo, but I am willing to invest in Anna stonks.
Fogado: isn't it the Radiant Bow that is broken? But he ends up being the most efficient unit to use it as he starts in that bow class with actual magic stat.
Citrinne: so one half does Dire Thunder Builds, but that requires the bond ring exploit.
The other half does Mage Knight Citrinne and stack enough speed for her to double (usually with Lyn if the spd benchmark that map is very high), she draws enemies in with her low bulk, not seeing Bonded shield and then ORKO back.
I would not recommend for any new players, since this kind of build is more LTC centric as you only have 3-4 turns under Bonded shield
Timerra: well, we never agree on this, lol.
(Also the earth is flat, change my mind.)
On the topic of Micaiah exp, be honest, who else would you realistically give her to? On Maddening, the only early game unit’s you’re likely gonna use past chapter 11 are Alear, Chloe, and either Framme, Jean, or Anna depending on what kind of run you’re doing. Alear and Chloe both want combat exp, so it boils down to choosing either Framme, Jean, or Anna. No matter what, one of them is getting Micaiah, and the others are getting left in the dust. So really, there isn’t some big cost of “giving her to Anna takes away from units who need her”. Micaiah is only ever gonna end up on one of those three, and the only way that changes is if you’re deliberately doing a specific challenge run.
Plus, the idea that there’s an inherent cost to putting Micaiah on Anna means that same cost applies to literally any unit you put her on, so if you’re so worried about the “cost”, then just don’t use Micaiah at all so you no longer have that fake dilemma.
@@danielpatterson1576Louis and etie are both fine enough to bring to late game depending on how they are raised and armors notably always gain max great snackrifice exp. Getting Louis into halberdier can make him quite potent with proper positioning. And Chloe ideally wants to be in mage before gaining exp since her physical output sucks but she has a good enough magic growth with great speed in a similar vein as Anna ( but Anna has higher potential but a worse start) honestly the only character that’s unreasonable to train is boucheron of the early squad or maybe clanne. With how low the average strength of the cast is Alfred just having a strength stat is a reason to consider him if you want another unit in a class that’s good for units who need speed fixing as opposed to strength fixing. Most notably If you wanna build around cavalier bonded shield there are no good cavalier classes for units like Merin or lapis who have plenty of speed but insufficient strength/magic. And Celine’s nice because she can use both warp and a levin sword. The only thing bouch has is build and speed so I’m guessing if you really wanted to use him you are shooting for not being doubled while using a great weapon
@@ultimaterecoil1136 I was mainly talking about Micaiah priority. Sure, basically any of the early game units can be useable even in Maddening, but most of them want combat exp. Can Celine be good, sure, but she wants combat exp, not Micaiah. Can Alfred be good, sure, but he needs speed fixing, not Micaiah. The three I mentioned are the only early game units who really want Micaiah, and even then Framme comes in Martial Monk already so she doesn’t need Micaiah either.
@@danielpatterson1576 anyone can benefit from great sacrifice. Honestly I think Louis benefits more then most because the armor bonus to great sacrifice guarantees max exp great sacrifices. You can use it to catch jean up if you wait to train him till you’ve classed him into his endgame class line so he gets the most stats he can by making sure his class growths are fitting. You just don’t necessarily get the benefit of the healing. But mend early game can heal enough to be useful even on a no magic unit if you really need the extra healer. And obstruct is always handy
@@ultimaterecoil1136 but that doesn’t justify using Micaiah on Louis though, cause he’s already getting a ton of combat exp being your only bait tank till chapter 10. That’s a true waste of Micaiah when she can be used to catch up units like Jean or Anna who need her Great Sac exp to get 7-10 levels in just a couple maps.
Reddit seems to hate Ice and Coffee for some reason
Haven't played Engage, but you were the only one with good takes on Triangle Strategy when that came out. I'd trust ya
Your videos inspired me to actually try Maddening and also experiment original builds. I enjoy how your videos are a result of your actual work/effort and experiments. I think the reddit-type echo chambering limits the actual potential of this game, because when you get stuck with thinking in terms of the common builds/impressions, you’ll never develop the game/characters to their full potential.
Reddit is a propaganda machine designed to create a group consensus and echo chamber on every plausible topic. It is not a place for debate, it is a place to be indoctrinated.
the idea of basing the general tier list on ltc play is insane to me, because that would mean that half the units just don’t even go on the tier list because there’s no reason to ever use them. ltc is such a surgical and pre-planned approach to the game that a tier list based on it wouldn’t even really matter, because you just follow a predetermined set of instructions to get the same result every time. there’s no variance or reason to argue/rate different strategies when you’ve already gotten the turn count down to 1… and 99% of the player base are never going to play that way.
for real though, ive always played FE games on the easiest difficulty until i watched your vids. Engage has been the only FE game ive been able to beat on maddening and now its a cake walk because of your vids!!! thank you for your hard work!!!
Reddit users hate “wrong think.” It is incredible to witness. What you said about the popular fallacy is really accurate.
Lapis and Merrin have almost identical growths.
Stick Lapis on Wolf Knight and she pops off!
Lapis has an insane amount of supports, which helps being an avoid tank.
Plus she has more speed than Merrin and a better avoid tanking passive, Merrin's passive has some supportive aspect which is nice, but Lapis just has more avoid for herself which helps with avoid tanking - Micaiah engraved silver dagger for best avoid tank, silver dagger since it is ranged for counter attacking, with Lucina for dagger poison chain attacks.
Boucheron and Kagetsu are extremely similar in growths. Difference being Kagetsu gets +5 speed for -10 build and a very pointless passive unless you make him a mage cannoneer (he is quite good as a mage cannoneer)... but Boucheron between is +2 might passive which is very easy to proc (just give someone Lucina that is NOT Boucheron) and ability to use axes without getting weighed down on them means he can double/quad on axes, has the dex to hit with them and high dex also means high crit rate for crit builds, and the axes provide more might for a fast unit to deal damage in the end game.
[Boucheron best as an axe griffin knight, this keeps him fast the whole game for double/quad and he can provide some stave utility (no magic makes healing staves pretty bad, but he can still use rescue, obstruct, restore, etc. if you don't want him to have any healing staves). Trying out Sniper Boucheron with Chrom and Lunar Brace+ with Camilla and Corrin crit engraves to the killer and brave bows, it is working out pretty well, but axe griffin knight is his best class and Radiant Bow is best weapon in the game (which Boucheron cannot use).]
definitely showed me that framme was so easy to make so much more usable than I knew before.
I once said yunaka is mid unless you play on hard and someone corrected me saying even on maddening it’s easy for her to hit the 0% hit rate for enemies…. Just outting himself as playing on hard.
I hate to agree with Reddit. But not putting Lapis in S tier is a flop. She literally wrestles bears SMH. The only thing Iced Coffee is doing to a bear is maybe giving it indigestion.
I know Im posting multiple comments, haha. But I was one of the first ones to notice Celine was a terrible unit, lol. I made her like perfect min-maxed best build on maddening, and she barely did half damage to enemy units by end game, and could barely survive anything (that is, if she wasnt getting doubled and NOT surviving), and barely contributed to the game at all. I rarely could even find opportunities to use her. The best use I got out of her, was being a staff healbot. And even that, shes not great at. Or my other units were so unbelievably good, that she didnt even need to heal on MY turns. Leaving her out of her one job. She was basically a dead unit on my side from ch 15 onward. And that was celine in her BEST state. At best, imo, celine is C tier. And she only makes that since shes not outright a terrible unit I suppose, like cooking man, and because she has magic damage she can at least contribute if you REALLY need her to. Also, she IS good in the early game, but thats all.
The whole thing about Lapis being completely outclassed by Kagetsu isn't really true at all. I mean he's a better unit but Lapis does have plenty of things he doesn't:
-A useful personal skill
-Early access to Sword/Lance Power and Canter
-Access to more proficiences early on = more reclassing options early on
Is Kagetsu still better? Yes, be certainly is but Lapis has plenty of things Kagetsu doesn't that don't make her strictly worse, unlike Etie for instance who is strictly worse than her later-joining male counterpart, Amber. I don't think Lapis vs. Kagetsu is even that good of comparison, I think Lapis vs. Merrin is a better one. Merrin i'd say is still better because of her build lead but Lapis isn't very far off at all.
Hey Coffe, I have been watching your video's since the release of engage and would like to hear your thoughts comparing Three houses to Engage, which you prefer and why. Also where do you think the series should go from here? Should it be more like three houses world building or goofy like engage? Keep up the great work!
I can answer that for you. He prefers gameplay and when he plays game he plays Timerra. Engage is superior because of Timerra. 🎉
The only good reddit is the Fire Emblem Heroes reddit, the base FE reddit suuucks
Also do you have a step by step guide on making a good Anna build? I tried using her as a Wolf Knight and it didnt work out, so I want to try your Mage Knight build
I took the MK Anna advice, and she works really well. Then again, I haven't made it through the whole story yet so I could be wrong at some point.
Hope i'm not too late but from what i've seen Anna has two builds. The first one you get an early levin sword, get her on MK and inherit sword power 2/3 from Roy, then as you get Lyn you inherit spd+ on her. Ideally she should end up with spd+5 and sword power 4/5 by the endgame make sure to forge her levin sword to at least a +3/4, for emblems the most commonly used is Byleth as he has great availability and gives her two most important stats being spd and magic, another good one can be Celica but she has poor availability. Her second build heavily focuses on getting the most out of her passive, swap sword power with luck +8 from Byleth and max Byleth's bond lvl to 10 asap and equip him on her, she basically gets free 16 luck from him i remember her having something like 34 luck on chapter 15 already (maybe even higher) without sword power the levin sword is definetly less viable, you're better off with tomes like Elfire, Elwind and then during lategame Excalibur/Bolgannone. Hope this helps!
My Framme is just a hard carry, hard carry as Sage, hard carry as Enchanter, hard carry as Griffin Knight. Warrior she was a hard carry on, but she speed caps way too early as a warrior with less might than others, so better classes for her than Warrior (Sage/Mage Knight similar issue, but Framme as the highest speed cap in the game so she makes the best speedster tome user).
Goldmary is like Louis, but minus the strength and -2 damage taken passive; so goldmary is a louis that can ONLY tank, but cannot make kills unlike Louis where he can one shot everyone - especially with a little bit of lance power and lunar brace, using sigurd for momentum as well.
I think i end up liking Sniper Anna the best with Claude's +1 bow range ring and only using radiant bow and long bow; this makes radiant bow be bolganone, thoron, and excalibur at the same time.
My warrior Celine with Lyn is a hard carry, she is insanely good, you have not seen the potential of Celine plus her passive is pretty decent to have around. Decent magic to make use of Radiant Bow. I did inherit Lunar Brace+ for her too, but she is a fast Jade in terms of growths with a better passive.
Jean's best are focused stat classes.
Sage Jean (80% magic) - Thoron with 4 staves like Citrinne.
General Jean (60% strength 85% defense) - high strength high defense General, axe armour helps him get a lot of exp with Micaiah.
Sniper Jean (50% strength, only 20% magic, 95% dex, 60% speed) - he pops off very early as an archer with Radiant Bow for the early game and transitions into a critting machine with all of his dex.
Griffin Knight Jean (40% str, 50% mag, 80% speed) - Jean be fast boi!!
you are Mekka are the two most thoughtful gameplay focus analysis youtubers I know of when it comes to Fire Emblem, I feel like the problem of Reddit is that they rarely investigate on their own.
My favorite Unit ended up being Saphir, no particular real just had a REALLY bless run in hard and later I found it she was viable on maddening.
also about the warp conundrum, I feel like people complaning about multiwarp being limited literally didnt played Shadow Dragon and Awakening and just skip everything with warps and forged wing spear/galeforce everything.
My only real "complain" with your channel is that Im curious about seeing you play another fire emblem sometimes , like a chill regular FE8 ironman or something
Reddit is so frustrating for help ive dropped like 3 maddening runs by now from following some advice from there and all of it is either poorly explained or poorly holds up later on in the game (most characters had no damage fixing) might watch some of your vids for help
I'll argue with your vid, but you are a huge help with solutions to a lot of the characters and are pretty creative.
I have seen tier lists and unit breakdown videos of all kinds from so many different channels. One thing I will say is yours(and mine) are not widely shared views on units. I would honestly say 60% of the people making content around this game view Framme and Anna to be some of the worst units in the game. You and I both have experienced how gamebreakingly nuts they are and uniquely so, no other units in the game can do exactly what they do or better. Awesome video, awesome channel, keep up the great work man.
seriously man, as a fan watching your FE videos all the time!! ignore those salty idiots and keep doing what u love!
Pikmin 4 won best strategy game at the game awards for a reason.
It is GOTY
I saw the community vote trash Timerra and was vaguely aware you rates her highly so I was wondering what was up with that before. Haven't dabbled in Engage too much after launch so didn't look into it that deeply.
I like the concept of Timera as a more technical balanced tank with an very unique proc skill unlike most others, especially with the emblem system around. It's more interesting than Kagetsu and some other high tiers being a big ball of oddly balanced high offensive bases.
Many people mention trying Timerra but having a bad time, or stick to the sandstorm roulette with low regular attack argument. The very low build base is also a frequent concern. What do people do wrong with getting her going and building her?
Late to the party on this video, but considering I was hardcore into Three Houses right before Engage came out, it feels more like every OTHER FE content creator dropped the ball on it while you picked up the slack. That’s why you come up so easily when searching for Engage content.
You’ve been thorough and updated your opinions several times. Everyone else (as much as I respect them for their 3H takes) put out a single tier list when the game came out and ranked units low when they didn’t even use them.
Crying cause my Anna died in the paralouge Maddening and I thought I I’d at least get her in the end cause it wasn’t classic and I never lost her before
I use an anna in my current lunatic run where i instantly made her a swordmaster. She is my favorite, it is my favorite class in all FE. Gave her a levin sword and it's fun, gave it lyn engrave as well. Can decently dodgetank with support(s) and use corrin later for fog tiles. Oh no, not playing most optimally. Still is an excellent unit.
Oh I also run Etie because she is cool.
Tierlists are always retarded just do what's cool if you can't beat the game without "S tier" strats then the problem doesn't lie with the balance of the game.
Missed you bro!!!! Glad you to see you back
I mean everyone have different opinions based on their experiences with the characters. For example Diamant has been a clutch S tier unit for me in all 3 of my playthroughs. His lord class is so good and can tank the world for me once my generals start to drop off. But most other people put him in B.
Yeah, I had a similar experience with Alfred, and the opposite with Chloe. Alfred just hit spd every level, and I had a 30 str, 31 spd Alfred, at like lvl 8 promoted. This happened on 2 runs lol.
Same thing with Chloe, but the opposite: at lvl 9 promoted, even Jean had higher str than her, at a lower IL. Hell, 2 of my mages had better str than her.
2nd run, she was even worse. Benched her for both runs.
Was very surprised to see the ratings on the 2 of them.
Timerra was a guaranteed deploy every map on both runs, and finished 3rd in kills both runs.
This was all before any dlc or the well too, and no grinding
"General" thinking about units doesn't effect my experience with them at all.
Still, an in depth analysis of every unit and how to use, will at least cause me to consider other units/strategies
It's funny because on my first run I use Timerra and she was insanly strong. Then I saw the general consensu that she was bad and I didn't understand ><
I also saw that Ivy was very strong, so I try her and I find her trash xD.
Now I have more knowledge on the game but I agree that some take on reddit are wild
welcome back coffee bro
What is it with social media websites always being filled with negative type of people?
Did you buy the dlc or do you have some effective way to get rid of the overpowered bonuses they force into your inventory? Aside from somniel and class system burnout, me having to accurately dispose of these stupid extra resources every time has lessened my motivation to replay the game.
Create a new user Acount on the switch, then use that so you won’t have to deal with the dlc. Wish they added an option to just turn it off, but this is the next best choice.
@@lucg4005 Thank you! Is that all I need to do? I assume this requires a physical copy of the game which I have.
hi mister coffee
They would think higher of it if ashe was s tier
Your placement of Anna in S tier reminds me of the way I have to explain that Zihark is completely busted in Radiant Dawn if you know what you're doing and pair him with Volug so they are both busted dodge tanks.
Clearing a chapter faster is usually harder then going slow(except for warp skips) and so Fe-Elitists rank characters higher that allow you to more easily beat the game in a fast way.
As you stated your tier list does not really focus on that so its like comparing apples and peas.
Engage allowing many different build/unit/emblem combinations makes it very hard to tier the characters. For example I personally rate Citrinne A+ because I know a specific build that works incredible for her. But i get why other people rate her lower cause with most other builds she is just average.
Citrinne is S tier because of her low investment, you master seal her into Sage, give her Thoron with 4 staves, canter and momentum are very easy to obtain because of the well and she is done for the entire game. Now you can give exp to your tanks and carries.
How is it harder to clear chapters faster? You have fewer moves to calculate. Especially as you enter mid-end game the game becomes very easy to warpskip. I could only really see certain early-early middlegame chapters in engage being harder to LTC. It also depends on if you are allowed to do every paralogue, and how you can milk free XP for levels on chapters where you have more than a turn, if you are abusing meals/other things etc.
I've seen LTCs where they basically cheat and make low % crits guaranteed so it works, so a lot of shady things going on and big egos over what boils down to a moderately difficult single player game series at best.
Engage endgame literally spawns infinite reinforcements on the final chapter if you play too slow, CH24 has turn limit, CH25 forces you to fight an absurd amount of enemies to progress. CH21 has a lot of reinforcement spam in the first 5-7 turns, if you beat it in one turn, you can completely ignore that entire huge open fight and all the army movement/calculation it entails.
I am not a fan of this idea that playing faster is harder because it is faster, endgame engage maps, especially when running new units/builds/team comps, are much harder than running the same units you are using to on the builds you've always used, running tactics that generally work each map. Also once someone figures out decent map tactics to beat maps quickly you can just follow the steps. Unless you are new/the game just came out and no one knows anything yet, it just isn't true that playing faster = harder.
Beating complex unknown situations is always going to be harder than known tactics, builds, and good units.
@@IcedCoffeeGaming I think we have a clear misunderstanding here. So let me explain my thoughts in detail:
I wasn't talking about LTC and specifically wrote (except Warp Skips). If you are following a Guide step by step, rely on criticals or abuse the AI or any other cheese than I don't consider them a better player in general.
Not including above tactics playing faster makes the game harder for sure. You expose yourself to more enemies each phase by moving all your units as far as possible but still have to keep them save. You can't lure out enemies one by one since that is very slow and in most maps you have to spread out your units instead of grouping them altogether to route all enemies faster. Basically you have to optimize how much damage you can deal on enemy phase and how much your units can survive. So there is LOTS of Calculations involved. Especially without Rewinding Turns. Moving Ike/Roy-Tank into the enemies hoping he survives and if not just rewinding is not very skillful.
Why are you assuming players using known tactics to clear the maps faster? Usually players have different teams and you have to make tactics that YOUR team can actually do which depends heavily on Builds and Stats. Why are you assuming playing fast means following a guide or strategy?
Yes some maps force you to go faster with reinforcements, still beating all the enemies between you and your goal is harder when you want to accomplish that in even less turns.
And I'm not saying rushing a map to clear it without caring about getting exp I'm usually talking about clearing the map AND get all the exp in a fast efficient way.
"Moving Ike/Roy-Tank into the enemies hoping he survives and if not just rewinding is not very skillful. "
How is spending a lot of time to calculate out damage skillful? Time consuming =/= skill. Also if I were to do an LTC I would be testing a lot of things and seeing what works and what doesn't, so the process would resemble trial and error more so over calculation for hours until I got the result I wanted.
You can calculate for hours to get the result you want, but spending less time testing things is just expedient. Neither is really skillful. If you know exactly how enemies will attack using game knowledge and understand stats, levels, breakpoints, etc and can calculate out fast moves that are safe before moves are made, you aren't really employing tactical skill. You are problem solving a series of moves before the moves are made then following steps based on math. Is doing basic math high skill? I think evaluating difficult positions and beating them is more high skill.
I do challenge runs where I limit what I can do/have access to, and they are more random/chaotic. Also as a streamer, I am not going to sit in a spreadsheet for a few hours to figure out which moves I should be making on which chapters as that is bad content and no one wants to watch that.
@@IcedCoffeeGaming Sure play however you like. I wasnt trying to offend you, was just trying to say that playing faster is harder in general. All my points I made for that purpose not to disregard other ways to play the game.
As for calculating stuff for a long time. Thats usually not the case. A good player can compare SPD checks pretty fast and estimate dmg done. Only if I'm unsure if a unit survives I will do exact calculations which is not the case most of the time.
I play Fire Emblem since forever its my favorite game series so I'm very passionate about discussion stuff like that.
I personally play faster now and do Iron mans and other runs because I want new harder challenges. And from my experience if I try to beat a map fast its a lot harder.
My original point was everybody plays the game different so their personal tier list is hard to compare to other peoples. Thats why you should always state the context in which you are rating the units (which you did)
But saying playing faster is easer I disagree.
I like offensive Martial Master Fogado because hes got good speed, strength, and magic
And its fun to punch
Who would have thought a smol child would be arguably the best magic user.
Look as much as i disagreed with you on Roland you by far have the best analysis of the game i have seen.
still crazy to me people can say Timerra is bad. I gave her build plus 4 and she consistanly double with Brionac
The legend returns
I totally get why you would be frustrated with some people on reddit since they like to live in some kind of echo chamber. Some just like to be pricks for no reason other than they feel like it and want to be lazy with their answers to someone’s question.
Obviously everyone’s tier list is more or less going to be different and subjective based on the meta and their personal experience. DLC does complicate tier list because you can make anyone who is a scrub pretty good and make someone who is already great phenomenal.
Like for example Framme makes a case for best supporting unit in the game if she was an enchanter. Dagger/Convoy access with items to spam as AoE healing with the Qi Adept perks on top of that. She can effectively use Lucina or Micaiah as an emblem for 100% bonded shield and poison inflicting dual assist (could be wrong about that bit so feel free to correct me if I am wrong). Or great sacrifice while healing status effects.
Things like obviously have an impact on the game to where it curb stomps even maddening.
I see this post on reddit and was really disappointed by it. Especially since there is a good chance the person asking will benefit from your tier list and videos than reddit since they are skewed toward strategies the player will not want to use because LTC took off to make the game more difficult. There is a middle area where the game becomes easier because you are pooling resources into fewer units, but still not pushing for lowest possible turn, but at that point, any character is equally viable, and growth units are superior, which is counter to the LTC philosophy.
I very much enjoy and respect your tier lists man. You are very knowledgeable about the game and definitely have the experience and know what you’re talking about. Let the haters and people who don’t know wtf their talking about do what they do. Fogado and Timerra are Easily S tier as is Alcryst for that fact of the matter (for the same reason;Luna/Sandstorm) that dude doesn’t know what he’s talking about lmao if you have a PRETTY GOOD chance to chunk an opponent for HALF his resistance’s, that’s broken plain and simple. It’s not hard to easily abuse that (Brave Weapons/pump Dex) and bust the skill wide open. I do think Hort is easy S tier though as well. Big Personality and World Tree plus Flier class is just too damn good.
Getting Triangle Strategy flashbacks FR
Ngl i was thinking of giving the game anotehr shot because of your video's. I simply had no time ima start on maddening but no perma death because of inexperience lol
Relax bro, i made guides (For a completely unrelated game), posted it on reddit, with data+proof and being like top 6 in the entire server and reddit users still thought it was useless information lol. People don't understand the purpose of guides or tier lists and if they hate them good for them people just get upset and cry at people who make content who cares. Nobody is telling you how to play a video game in the first place. If you like making guides just keep doing what you love doing, your videos are good.
I can only find your tier lists too it’s not just him
People just love to hate, your content is great.
It happens, you can't please everyone
I recall coming across this post but I didn't really have that much knowledge of Engage (Conquest over-specialist here lol), so I didn't comment.
Some people are deeply dogmatic I think. Kind of like the Vaike stuff, or how people lived and died by Ike being a good unit in PoR for quite a while.
Analyzing numbers is good and all, but most people do not do a good job analyzing the context behind those numbers. Anna is bad, but with minimal investment she can become great. Timerra has really good overall stats, but doesnt meet any thresholds. But this is Fire Emblem Engage where stats are incredibly easy to fix. Resulting in a unit that is damn good at damn near everything.
If people would stop putting the same 2 skills on everyone, they might find themselves discovering significant power boosts they didn't even know existed.
On what planet is Anna not on everyones S-tier list? How is that even a hot take?
I'v tried the Jean investment, it's terrible for the costs and doesn't really pay off much IMO. But Anna doesn't require almost any investment at all! Just use her on your team, make her a Sage, and she will completely own everything by Chapter 14. Her speed, mag, and money making is insane! I would really hardly ever call her an investment character.
Jena is solid as a second chain guard user early on when you’re still mostly using the Firene cast but I’ve never liked him as a combat unit tbh. Kagetsu Merin and Panette run circles around him.
Anna on mage knight though carried a lot of my maddening run. Became very very solid after 1-2 chapters
Haha, lol I love how you dislike citrine. How often I. get into arguments about citrine. Honestly I have even better experiences with Celine (who isnt even that great either) as at least that one can surive a little. Citrine just never doubles and suuuuuuuucks.
Another one I often hear is S tier is Louis and as soon someone calls him S tier I immediatly assume they either use DLC or don't play on maddening. He is too slow and has far too low res to tank effectively on maddening.
Of course they do, you don’t put Anna and Timerra in bottom tier lol. Most of their FE user base mindlessly just insist those 2 are irredeemably bad, and you’re “dumb if you think otherwise”.
Only real arguments I hear are “blah high investment!” But even after pointing out how it isn’t an issue for those two at least in this game, then they just loop back to repeating their investment is too high or insulting you
Welcome back, m8.
Seems like saying something is garbage without any proper reasoning or arguments is a larger problem with certain parts of the fire emblem community
Random passerby here. I’m not very knowledgeable about what units are viable or not in engage. But I am open to trying stuff out and hearing about a units viability. I feel like instead of shunning your tier list since it doesn’t agree with theirs, maybe they should look more into why you actually believe certain units are strong. One guy even told them you basically only run maddening, yet they still can’t understand why you don’t have the same tier list as they do. Maybe it’s cause you’ve played the game more and have better understanding of how a unit works. Maybe it’s cause they haven’t given some units a chance yet. Could be a few things. Game hasn’t been out for a full year yet, it’s not like the game has been 100% figured out yet (I think). Just my opinion (sorry for the ramble).
Like 98% of characters are viable if you know how to build them right. (aka Vander good to set up your army to make kills up to, and including, the Yunaka map and sucks after that point)
Coffee likes jack of all trades that are fast, I like having very focused characters and play around their strength (not as a stat) to make their strength insanity strong which comes at the cost of they have a larger weakness so the other units in the comp need to overcome that weakness with their own strengths.
Coffee likes making units that are decent at everything, but never great which results in their weaknesses not being as prevalent.
Most unit disagreements are just proxies for criteria disagreements. Reddit leans heavily towards LTC and low investment builds. Your list is reasonable for your criteria.
Well the game isnt that hard to break to begin with, so I dont understand why they on redit stress so much about you saying 'this character is broken let me show you how' and then they say 'well the other characters also breaks the game' well no shit sherlock...
you tell em ICG
I disagree with your tier lists, but I'd like to see you have a video with someone else. Jonoabo would probably be interested, as he does a lot of collab videos.
Tus videos son geniales, la gente en redes sociales es muy tóxica. Lo mejor es no dedicarles atención ni tiempo, viven amargados y quieren amargar a los demás.
I play engage a lot and your guide are really good and helped me better understand the game, so now i can help my friends with builds instead of ranting online on how you suck or smth Iol
I will be honest i have never been able to get timera online and honestly i just struggle to get her exp but besides timera the rest of the units u suggest r generally amazing
While it’s kinda cheating using the tiki dragon with sandstorm timera is pretty nuts
Fire emblem games where you can make everyone do everything make unit discussion more difficult and more toxic.
Sadly made the same experience in different Fire Emblem communities regarding your Tier-Lists. I believe it's because you don't clarify the meaning of the tiers enough. When you rated Timerra S-Tier for example, people were malding over the fact that she is only S-Tier after some fixing / building. While S-Tier by definition covers units that are good on their own before fixing, your personal S-Tier mentions units that are good, after effort or fixing. I think most people don't understand that you're not going after the regular Tier List design. Also, they just don't fact check and parrot stuff. The evidence is clear, they can just build it themselves and run it, it will hilariously carry them but they are ignorant or lazy ^^ Most of them wouldn't even look at guides and tier lists, if they were able to do the proper thinking to rate units on their own. This eliminates most of their credibility.
I think old school S tier means good by default, even in the metagame the best units want emblems/passives to enable them
Kagetsu imo, is even nearly the best unit in the game. Sure hes "S rank", but imo, hes only like, provisionally S rank. Like hes S rank by default. In truth, Kagetsu is kinda hard to use. Hes stuck on swordmaster for awhile, and sm is a terrible ass class that does nothing. Hes prepromoted during a time in the game when its VERY hard for him to gain exp. Even during that time, Kagetsu barely kills anything, and late game, if hes still on sm, struggles to kill anything. Really Kagetsu is hamstrung by his starting class pretty badly, and never really gets out of that rut unless you heavily invest into him. Now, hes still "S rank" just due to his ridiculous stats, but thats it. If it werent for those, then Kagetsu would probably be low tier in fact, since his class sucks, hes hard to level. He doesnt really kill anything on his own, etc etc.
REDDIT?!? BLEGH
Hortensia is a great zero investment pure support unit that only uses 5 staves, outside of that she is not very good.
The definitive heal bus
I am convinced these people don't play the game. Any time you get confronted with these people with strong opinions that can't give examples of why they think that in their own gameplay, they don't actually play the game in Maddening mode. I do not like Timerra as a character, I feel like her character is meat, fun, poke stuff unga doonga and it's not very fleshed out. Typical shallow engage character imo. But coffee's takes on her are spot on. She is a fucking MONSTER in all of my playthroughs with very little effort on maddening. If you play the game, you know it's false.
Great Sack?
imo: games are fun and sometimes it’s fun to spend time with the game and not try to beat it as quickly as possible ☹️
The vocal people on Reddit seem to be LTC players??? They want the best thing right now but idk I like puzzles and it’s fun for me to figure out what matches best with which unit. But then again I also waste money on outfits to make everyone at the Somniel into a cult so 😅
Edit to add: lol Reddit really just is the home of bad attitude. I hate it when posts asking for advice just get clogged with everyone complaining about something.
Taking the topic of Timerra and Anna aside, what I cannot understand the most is that I see a lot of them saying "Citrinne is A tier". Please, Citrinne can't even double. She is probably worse than mage knight Lapis in my opinion
THANKS FOR SHOPPING THANKS FOR SHOPPING THANKS FOR-
Saying Generals are bad because they die to mages is like saying flliers are bad because they die to archers, bad take and bad argument.
Generals don't care about being doubled, they either take little damage or zero damage, so they just one shot with their Silver Greataxe/Greatlance, the only way they get attacked in the end game is because of enemy backup units otherwise they are ignored. Even if they are ignored, you make use of their wall tanking capabilities and have your backline safely kill off the enemy army from behind your tanks.
Hector Madeline be doubling with her Tomahawk, everyone dies by this, and requires no RNG unlike Timerra to do it... if she too tanky, you whip out the brave axe to cut fools down - use of ike and roy engraves to weigh down the axes and gives more might too with heavy attack damage. Use of HIT+30 required otherwise good luck hitting people with Madeline on axes.
speaking as an armor enjoyer I personally think their bigger weakness is low move, the res thing really isn't that big of a deal since units like panette also have res problems, typically having good res is a niche in this game since if you actually look at caps many classes have around 20 res
@@pandabanaan9208 sigurd or boots for the generals, the low movement to engage is why they are so good in engage