Thank you for the excellent video on Origen. Please remember that Augustine was placed on a high pedestal and Origen views were then forgotten by most, Augustine could not read Greek without assistance. Thank you all for the video much appreciated God Bless.
The belief system of Adamantius Origen included: Baptismal regeneration, including infant baptism Universalism, including salvation of the Devil Purgatory followed by reincarnation of the soul Jesus as a created being Adam, Even and Creation as mythical Communion being the real presence of Christ (transubstantiation)
Enjoyable presentation thanks. The prof has the kindest criticism of Origen's universal salvation/ apokatasasis doctrine I've heard from a detractor ie that it is too much from Platonism. But how can there be more in Plato than in Christ? Can Adam be greater than Christ? Death is no obstacle to salvation for He with the Omega Plan.
1 Timothy 4:10 - The New International Version (NIV) 10 That is why we labor and strive, because we have put our hope in the living God, who is the Savior of all people, and especially of those who believe. 1 Cor 15:22 for even as in Adam all die, so also in the Christ all shall be made alive
You mean Jeremiah 1:5? There God only says to Jeremiah that he "knew" him before forming him in the womb. This could refer to foreknowledge, it doesn't necessarily mean that his soul existed before the body.
I'd love to share your part about the 3 steps at the end but it shows a woman's breast , is any way you can make a shorter version and post it, I just want the best aspects of Origen , I did have a dream that basically I was being shown my life and a General came in a said said I need to take him and he said something about number two is no longer with us, then the people I was with were up set and he said I know with her we were ten steps ahead, then I asked him what do I do as we were walking then he said look up Orange Lopez and we'll find you and went into a room and it close and then I wrote the name down in another room repeatedly so I wouldn't forget, I knew I was in a dream, then in a dark room I heard their stupid , were gonna get the all , and on and on and on, but I continued writing . I think he meant Origen
Hi. I agree with Origen. He may be trying to explain that we are all Incarnated as an Eternal Soul, remembering nothing but onky having a moral compass. And, we are illusioned by unclean desire, emotions and many bad things that cause a Diablo. (Seperation of Union with God, with Family, with friends, wifh your true self) the soul is Eternal as everything from God from itself, less in quantity same in quality is of the same origin as God. God is present in all things and in all places, from itself. Everylasting, omnipresent. Therefore, we all already all knowing, vibebrating or at onement with the Logos (body of G-d). When we remove the multitude of created personalities (hinduism explains well, many faces of personalities) christians would maybe call them expressions of personality by thought and emotions, you will then begin to conciously approach and radiate with your true eternal soul self. The logos Humanized all of us here to self awaken by experience. Many people, part of human conciousness that are closer to being awakened will maybe reincarnate again by the grace of God to start a new life but with purpose. Origen was missubderstood. God can radiate through thr Nous (mind) of the those that are pure in heart, cleaned their attachments, egoisms, good and bad polarities. Like Buddhas teachings about desire and attachments. So is the talk about Sin. Christ has to explain to people in a method that the expression will make its way to the audience throughout the ages. Jesus christ is the humanized incatnation of the Logos, itself. The head of all conciousness. The body of the Trinity of God. Existing in you and everybody. Kiss and love all humanity, even your enemy for they live a life that we will all experience. Your inner soul knows already, sometimes those in near death will experience the light of MIND, the light of NOUS. But, the light of nous from Logos is only made for purpose. We are of the conciousness, and our body is the Temple of God. In our temple, the world lives inside of us. But we reside on the world. Chrck your heart, dont measure love, just express it, see past all darkness and bestow thr light of your heart onto all things, love and forgive and let go, never forget the lesson but forget the attachment. Jesus the logos is already part of our conciousness, slowly awakening you. Driving gamblers to fall, those fighting to get silent and to teach you by experience to let go. Self improve, be more experienced. Look at at your lives, who you were then and who you are now. Are you more experienced ? Who gave you that ? But, arent you an eternal soul already from God connected to Logos ? Let go of the biundaries of possibilities of this life. We are the conciousness, not the body. Ask why do children born have such atrong personalities? The conciousness is what is eternal, the body is temporary for purpose of expression of life, to gain self awakening. The karmaric function of good and bad, (not hindu style) but is always in purpose to learn from our own doing, in mind, heart and physical. The kingdom of heaven is inside of you. Ask and you will find. Question yourself, inside of you is the universe. Already awaiting to answer. You can receive answers rhen you clean from attachments, detaching from pain, sorrow, suffering hatred, stupid egoism, thinking high or lower. Self images, detach from all !!
The view you are presenting is dangerous because it compels you to look inward, to yourself, and detach yourself from everything assuming that all you need is within yourself. Christianity, on the contrary, teaches us to not focus on ourselves, to look up to Christ and follow him. Another problem with your view is the rejection and detachment of the physical. Christianity teaches us that the world is in a fallen state, but Christs incarnation shows us that redemption is possible, so we don't have to "free" ourselves from the body, in fact it teaches that just as Christ did we can resurrect and live in an embodied state forever with Him.
@ChumX100 all of Christianity is teaching to look inwards to clean our personality. Almost all parables are teaching us to remove the unwanted parts of our personality, and to co-vibrate or be Christ like in Love, compassion, understanding & our works. That is moving towards Christ Logos. Did you know that most early Church Fathers like Basil, Theodsis, etc all had learned Platonic lessons, Statoic, etc... then the old testament and then the new testament. Why were they focuse to getting the theologian to change how they think ? God made us in his image, meaning we are like Demi-Gods able to create and make a life on our own, even able to move mountains. And like Moses stated a natural law of Cause and effect, Eye 4 Eye it returns to you. Jesus said, we reap what we soe. Jesus told us the kingdom of heaven is within us, so Yes we have to clean not only our conciousness but our sub conciousness. These areas are more real than the world of forms in time and place, earth. The earth is the first heaven, its a heaven of gravity & electromagetism. And natural laws. Earth is NOT wasteful. Earth is home of Humans, it is made by God. There is no other force on earth other than God. Through the Free Will of God, natural laws like Cause & Effect occur, only through Christ Logos & Father can you be redeamed for your payment. (For stuff occuring in your conciousness & subconciousness) only through Christ Logos, The Burning Bush Moses spoke to , can you reach the father. The biggest illusion humanity has is to assume thate God isnt Omnipresent in all things, hearing & feeling even your own thoughts, ideas & emotions. And illusioned to think that The earths own time, place and space ia how God is limited. Forget this worlds forms, God is one particle can make another universe of forms and time that you are unable to conceive inside your mind. We need Christ because Christ Logos is compatible for Humanity to contact with the Father. The Father and him are one, but Christ is body of Absolute Godhead which is Expression of life, the Conciousness we comprehend. Christ is God. Looking within us to remove the unclean by focusing on the clean, and enhancing the clean by reasonable logic and thinking and in prayer with Christ Logos to remove the unclean elements to our personality can we begin to transfigure towards christ. Nobody can reject Christ in essence, christ is God, christ is already Omnipresent. If you reject Christ you also reject yourself. Be forewarned. Christ is what Jews look for in entire Old Testament, as he is the burning bush giving commandments, the Muslims have a confusion about the difference between Christ and God. But all these religions are somehow around the Christ. ...... look at early icons of saints, why do they ride the horse with a weapon with deamons below them. ? St. George spears the dragon, the dragon is the alter ego, the spear is throughts of reasoning and intellect aligned eith Christ in Love & harmony. Dont take the small fragment that the early chruch has which says that thr douter can operate through intellect, its true. Its the alter ego, the diablo. It is within us as a shadow self. But, you need to let go also by reasoning and logic with Christ. The dragon is our alter ego inflicted by an unclean spirit that is tempting us. They are created by us and empowered by other diablos (seperator of union of Love & alignment eith truth, the christ) .... they are speaking within you, making you feel their unclean feelings. Lust, egoism negative, wounded, blaming, unclean desire... you need to let go, like chanigng tmyour mind in difference between a grade 5 person and someone that is 50 years old. Learn, let go, and change... forgive and forget..... it is not without a proper lesson, given by God.
Why do those claiming to be 'Christian' put so much faith in the teachings of any of the 'church Fathers'? Did not Jesus teach his 12 apostles the true gospel? Did not the Holy Spirit "Bring what I have taught you back to your minds"? So that the apostles could in turn pass that truth on to us? Did not Jesus half brother Jude write in (around 55 AD, years BEFORE th church fathers!) "The FAITH was delivered ONCE FOR ALL TIMES TO THE HOLY ONES" (Jude 3) The NT often warned of the teachings of those that followed that would corrupt the truth! ( Acts 20:28-30 ) Most 'church fathers' were not humble men like the apostles but educated philosophers!
We honor and trust the church fathers, for they have done a magnificent work as teachers of the faith. Their work includes interprating Scripture, spreading the gospel and defending Christianity from the enemies of the faith.
Interestingly, Origen stated in Justinian, Ep ad Mena, ( Mansi, 1X, 524) "God the Father, since He embraces all things, touches all things that exists....The Son is INFERIOR in relation to the Son....for he is SUBORDINATE to the Father. The Holy Spirit is still LOWER in Degree". Bit of a puzzle for the 'trinity' doctrine dont you think? ( Origen at least here shows preference to Holy scripture at 1 Corinthians 11:3 & 1 Cor 15:28) rather than pandering to greek philosophers which most of the post 2nd century 'church fathers' did
Genesis 2:7 God breathed into Adam and he became a living soul. So this thought of the soul existing outside creation. Isn’t Greek philosophy because the soul originated from God. Man’s physical nature was created but the soul was breathed from God to the physical body. Making the soul stand outside creation being passed from father to child in procreation. Subsequently all souls being cut off from God by man’s fall into sin. This is why Jesus breathed on the disciples giving them the Holy Spirit. Mending the break that happened at original sin. So I would disagree that he got this thought from Greek philosophy.
Elijah has returned, as prophesied, and testifies: Origen was correct MOST of the time, including on many issues that orthodox Christianity (and this video) lists as "heretical." Scripture supports those correct ideas, such as the pre-existence of the Soul. (See Jeremiah 1:5, and there are plenty of other places.) But orthodox Christianity has lost so much understanding that it doesn't even teach the true "Gospel" (GOOD NEWS) of Jesus Christ! (Paul called his incorrect version, which Christianity adopted, "my gospel.") So, my job is cut-out for me. EVERYONE'S job is cut out for them, for ALL IS FATED. "Even the very hairs of your head are all numbered." - JC Want to know more? This is a "stiff-necked" Age, so I doubt it! But all mysteries have been unveiled in these "end times": the end of the old Cycle of Time that the New Cycle may be born. And if you seek you shall find...
One of the most idolized heretics I have learned about since actually becoming a follower of Christ. He mixed with paganism, and preached a false gospel. He was well learned, well respected, but without Christ and the convictions of the Holy Spirit thus was loose on what he wrote about. God is no respecter of persons and based on Origens theology I don’t expect to see him in heaven. His false teachings have led many astray. Doesn’t matter how much he did if he thought water baptism and infant baptism has any part in being born again of the spirit… that’s a mockery to what the Holy Spirit does and a denial of how He does it. Praying for you all always, wake up. It’s all about trusting completely in Christs perfect and sufficient atonement, that he died for your sin, you personally, and that he rose the third day! Trust that he provided enough for you on the cross. Belief is from the heart. God will change your heart and desires. Nothing we do is good enough. Our best is vanity, our own righteousness as filthy rags to God who is holy. Don’t try to stain the work of Christ with your sinful works. Trust him and he’ll free you from this miserable wicked world filled with deception. I’m free in Christ, liberty and peace fill my being. I no longer have to question my end or my standing. Jesus did it all!
I have always loved this greatest theologian of all time and church doctor ❤ St ORIGEN PRAY FOR US
Amen
Thank you for the excellent video on Origen. Please remember that Augustine was placed on a high pedestal and Origen views were then forgotten by most, Augustine could not read Greek without assistance. Thank you all for the video much appreciated God Bless.
Thanks for watching
The belief system of Adamantius Origen included:
Baptismal regeneration, including infant baptism
Universalism, including salvation of the Devil
Purgatory followed by reincarnation of the soul
Jesus as a created being
Adam, Even and Creation as mythical
Communion being the real presence of Christ (transubstantiation)
Christ died for your sins.
There’s no hope in the pope.
You need to understand that you’re the sinner for whom Christ died.
Have a nice day.
It's wild hearing catholic theology in an aussie accent. So used to NE american accents and romance lang accents. Good content!
Origen was Orthodox-the Germans hadn’t created the Catholic Church yet.
@@ROCdave5861 My mistake. Thanks for the clarification
I'd recommend Robert Wild's "A Catholic Reading Guide to Universalism" and "Purgatory: The Logic of Total Transformation" by Jerry Walls.
Enjoyable presentation thanks. The prof has the kindest criticism of Origen's universal salvation/ apokatasasis doctrine I've heard from a detractor ie that it is too much from Platonism. But how can there be more in Plato than in Christ? Can Adam be greater than Christ? Death is no obstacle to salvation for He with the Omega Plan.
I believe Adam is y
The earliest form of Jesus
1 Timothy 4:10 - The New International Version (NIV)
10 That is why we labor and strive, because we have put our hope in the living God, who is the Savior of all people, and especially of those who believe.
1 Cor 15:22
for even as in Adam all die, so also in the Christ all shall be made alive
Sorry but the idea that soul was created before the body is found in the book of the prophet Jeremia, way before Plato poped out 😊
You mean Jeremiah 1:5? There God only says to Jeremiah that he "knew" him before forming him in the womb. This could refer to foreknowledge, it doesn't necessarily mean that his soul existed before the body.
Contemplation of the logos
I'd love to share your part about the 3 steps at the end but it shows a woman's breast , is any way you can make a shorter version and post it, I just want the best aspects of Origen , I did have a dream that basically I was being shown my life and a General came in a said said I need to take him and he said something about number two is no longer with us, then the people I was with were up set and he said I know with her we were ten steps ahead, then I asked him what do I do as we were walking then he said look up Orange Lopez and we'll find you and went into a room and it close and then I wrote the name down in another room repeatedly so I wouldn't forget, I knew I was in a dream, then in a dark room I heard their stupid , were gonna get the all , and on and on and on, but I continued writing .
I think he meant Origen
Hi. I agree with Origen. He may be trying to explain that we are all Incarnated as an Eternal Soul, remembering nothing but onky having a moral compass. And, we are illusioned by unclean desire, emotions and many bad things that cause a Diablo. (Seperation of Union with God, with Family, with friends, wifh your true self) the soul is Eternal as everything from God from itself, less in quantity same in quality is of the same origin as God. God is present in all things and in all places, from itself. Everylasting, omnipresent. Therefore, we all already all knowing, vibebrating or at onement with the Logos (body of G-d). When we remove the multitude of created personalities (hinduism explains well, many faces of personalities) christians would maybe call them expressions of personality by thought and emotions, you will then begin to conciously approach and radiate with your true eternal soul self. The logos Humanized all of us here to self awaken by experience. Many people, part of human conciousness that are closer to being awakened will maybe reincarnate again by the grace of God to start a new life but with purpose. Origen was missubderstood. God can radiate through thr Nous (mind) of the those that are pure in heart, cleaned their attachments, egoisms, good and bad polarities. Like Buddhas teachings about desire and attachments. So is the talk about Sin. Christ has to explain to people in a method that the expression will make its way to the audience throughout the ages. Jesus christ is the humanized incatnation of the Logos, itself. The head of all conciousness. The body of the Trinity of God. Existing in you and everybody. Kiss and love all humanity, even your enemy for they live a life that we will all experience. Your inner soul knows already, sometimes those in near death will experience the light of MIND, the light of NOUS. But, the light of nous from Logos is only made for purpose. We are of the conciousness, and our body is the Temple of God. In our temple, the world lives inside of us. But we reside on the world. Chrck your heart, dont measure love, just express it, see past all darkness and bestow thr light of your heart onto all things, love and forgive and let go, never forget the lesson but forget the attachment. Jesus the logos is already part of our conciousness, slowly awakening you. Driving gamblers to fall, those fighting to get silent and to teach you by experience to let go. Self improve, be more experienced. Look at at your lives, who you were then and who you are now. Are you more experienced ? Who gave you that ? But, arent you an eternal soul already from God connected to Logos ? Let go of the biundaries of possibilities of this life. We are the conciousness, not the body. Ask why do children born have such atrong personalities? The conciousness is what is eternal, the body is temporary for purpose of expression of life, to gain self awakening. The karmaric function of good and bad, (not hindu style) but is always in purpose to learn from our own doing, in mind, heart and physical. The kingdom of heaven is inside of you. Ask and you will find. Question yourself, inside of you is the universe. Already awaiting to answer. You can receive answers rhen you clean from attachments, detaching from pain, sorrow, suffering hatred, stupid egoism, thinking high or lower. Self images, detach from all !!
Thank you for this message.
The view you are presenting is dangerous because it compels you to look inward, to yourself, and detach yourself from everything assuming that all you need is within yourself. Christianity, on the contrary, teaches us to not focus on ourselves, to look up to Christ and follow him.
Another problem with your view is the rejection and detachment of the physical. Christianity teaches us that the world is in a fallen state, but Christs incarnation shows us that redemption is possible, so we don't have to "free" ourselves from the body, in fact it teaches that just as Christ did we can resurrect and live in an embodied state forever with Him.
@ChumX100 all of Christianity is teaching to look inwards to clean our personality. Almost all parables are teaching us to remove the unwanted parts of our personality, and to co-vibrate or be Christ like in Love, compassion, understanding & our works. That is moving towards Christ Logos. Did you know that most early Church Fathers like Basil, Theodsis, etc all had learned Platonic lessons, Statoic, etc... then the old testament and then the new testament. Why were they focuse to getting the theologian to change how they think ? God made us in his image, meaning we are like Demi-Gods able to create and make a life on our own, even able to move mountains. And like Moses stated a natural law of Cause and effect, Eye 4 Eye it returns to you. Jesus said, we reap what we soe. Jesus told us the kingdom of heaven is within us, so Yes we have to clean not only our conciousness but our sub conciousness. These areas are more real than the world of forms in time and place, earth. The earth is the first heaven, its a heaven of gravity & electromagetism. And natural laws. Earth is NOT wasteful. Earth is home of Humans, it is made by God. There is no other force on earth other than God. Through the Free Will of God, natural laws like Cause & Effect occur, only through Christ Logos & Father can you be redeamed for your payment. (For stuff occuring in your conciousness & subconciousness) only through Christ Logos, The Burning Bush Moses spoke to , can you reach the father. The biggest illusion humanity has is to assume thate God isnt Omnipresent in all things, hearing & feeling even your own thoughts, ideas & emotions. And illusioned to think that The earths own time, place and space ia how God is limited. Forget this worlds forms, God is one particle can make another universe of forms and time that you are unable to conceive inside your mind. We need Christ because Christ Logos is compatible for Humanity to contact with the Father. The Father and him are one, but Christ is body of Absolute Godhead which is Expression of life, the Conciousness we comprehend. Christ is God. Looking within us to remove the unclean by focusing on the clean, and enhancing the clean by reasonable logic and thinking and in prayer with Christ Logos to remove the unclean elements to our personality can we begin to transfigure towards christ. Nobody can reject Christ in essence, christ is God, christ is already Omnipresent. If you reject Christ you also reject yourself. Be forewarned. Christ is what Jews look for in entire Old Testament, as he is the burning bush giving commandments, the Muslims have a confusion about the difference between Christ and God. But all these religions are somehow around the Christ. ...... look at early icons of saints, why do they ride the horse with a weapon with deamons below them. ? St. George spears the dragon, the dragon is the alter ego, the spear is throughts of reasoning and intellect aligned eith Christ in Love & harmony. Dont take the small fragment that the early chruch has which says that thr douter can operate through intellect, its true. Its the alter ego, the diablo. It is within us as a shadow self. But, you need to let go also by reasoning and logic with Christ. The dragon is our alter ego inflicted by an unclean spirit that is tempting us. They are created by us and empowered by other diablos (seperator of union of Love & alignment eith truth, the christ) .... they are speaking within you, making you feel their unclean feelings. Lust, egoism negative, wounded, blaming, unclean desire... you need to let go, like chanigng tmyour mind in difference between a grade 5 person and someone that is 50 years old. Learn, let go, and change... forgive and forget..... it is not without a proper lesson, given by God.
Why do those claiming to be 'Christian' put so much faith in the teachings of any of the 'church Fathers'? Did not Jesus teach his 12 apostles the true gospel? Did not the Holy Spirit "Bring what I have taught you back to your minds"? So that the apostles could in turn pass that truth on to us? Did not Jesus half brother Jude write in (around 55 AD, years BEFORE th church fathers!) "The FAITH was delivered ONCE FOR ALL TIMES TO THE HOLY ONES" (Jude 3) The NT often warned of the teachings of those that followed that would corrupt the truth! ( Acts 20:28-30 ) Most 'church fathers' were not humble men like the apostles but educated philosophers!
We honor and trust the church fathers, for they have done a magnificent work as teachers of the faith. Their work includes interprating Scripture, spreading the gospel and defending Christianity from the enemies of the faith.
Interestingly, Origen stated in Justinian, Ep ad Mena, ( Mansi, 1X, 524) "God the Father, since He embraces all things, touches all things that exists....The Son is INFERIOR in relation to the Son....for he is SUBORDINATE to the Father. The Holy Spirit is still LOWER in Degree". Bit of a puzzle for the 'trinity' doctrine dont you think? ( Origen at least here shows preference to Holy scripture at 1 Corinthians 11:3 & 1 Cor 15:28) rather than pandering to greek philosophers which most of the post 2nd century 'church fathers' did
Genesis 2:7 God breathed into Adam and he became a living soul. So this thought of the soul existing outside creation. Isn’t Greek philosophy because the soul originated from God. Man’s physical nature was created but the soul was breathed from God to the physical body. Making the soul stand outside creation being passed from father to child in procreation. Subsequently all souls being cut off from God by man’s fall into sin. This is why Jesus breathed on the disciples giving them the Holy Spirit. Mending the break that happened at original sin. So I would disagree that he got this thought from Greek philosophy.
Says the idiot who has obviously never read Plato!!!!
Elijah has returned, as prophesied, and testifies: Origen was correct MOST of the time, including on many issues that orthodox Christianity (and this video) lists as "heretical." Scripture supports those correct ideas, such as the pre-existence of the Soul. (See Jeremiah 1:5, and there are plenty of other places.) But orthodox Christianity has lost so much understanding that it doesn't even teach the true "Gospel" (GOOD NEWS) of Jesus Christ! (Paul called his incorrect version, which Christianity adopted, "my gospel.") So, my job is cut-out for me. EVERYONE'S job is cut out for them, for ALL IS FATED. "Even the very hairs of your head are all numbered." - JC Want to know more? This is a "stiff-necked" Age, so I doubt it! But all mysteries have been unveiled in these "end times": the end of the old Cycle of Time that the New Cycle may be born. And if you seek you shall find...
One of the most idolized heretics I have learned about since actually becoming a follower of Christ. He mixed with paganism, and preached a false gospel. He was well learned, well respected, but without Christ and the convictions of the Holy Spirit thus was loose on what he wrote about.
God is no respecter of persons and based on Origens theology I don’t expect to see him in heaven. His false teachings have led many astray. Doesn’t matter how much he did if he thought water baptism and infant baptism has any part in being born again of the spirit… that’s a mockery to what the Holy Spirit does and a denial of how He does it.
Praying for you all always, wake up. It’s all about trusting completely in Christs perfect and sufficient atonement, that he died for your sin, you personally, and that he rose the third day! Trust that he provided enough for you on the cross. Belief is from the heart. God will change your heart and desires. Nothing we do is good enough. Our best is vanity, our own righteousness as filthy rags to God who is holy. Don’t try to stain the work of Christ with your sinful works. Trust him and he’ll free you from this miserable wicked world filled with deception. I’m free in Christ, liberty and peace fill my being. I no longer have to question my end or my standing. Jesus did it all!
Rediculas speculation on the part of this woman with nothing to back up her suppositions!
Ridiculous
Origen was a semi pagan
By the standard of his time, so was Jesus. 😉
The entire world is pagan... Try again.
Jesus a pagan? Eh? I don't see that at all.