KOF 94 is an interesting test subject, its the first and only in the series that loads all rounds in a big, single loading, I remember it took a long time, maybe a few minutes, but I can't remember which model we played it back then. It would have been nice a comparison here.
Enjoying these different platform retrospectives. iirc, I’m about 10 years younger than you SegaLordX, so while I remember stuff like the Neo•Geo consoles, they were permanently and eternally out of my price range at the time. It’s neat to see what I missed all those years ago. Keep up the great work.
@@SegaLordX I think it's one of the best things about this channel. So much of the history of this era of gaming is written by Xennials/Oregon Trail generation content creators. They do REMEMBER this period, but from the perspective of someone who was a kid at the time. It's very rare to hear from someone who was an adult, and had an adult's critical faculties then as well as now.
I'm always fascinated with Neo Geo's hardware line up. In reality the CD format was just there to keep the cost down, and make the systems accessible to the common person. Remember, the AES was originally designed for rental, so the cost of the carts was something not really thought about. I agree that late entries into the library didn't port that well. However, they also didn't compromise in frames of animation,. something done on the Saturn and PlayStation.
@@nighthawk0077 If you look at MVS or AES cartridges, you'll see that some of them were gigantic. They didn't hamstring themselves like the Nintendo 64. Garou, if I am correct was gigantic.
It's due to the lack of RAM on the Saturn and PlayStation. That's why with the Ram expansion the Saturn is almost perfect. If the PlayStation had Ram expansion it would also nearly be the same.
@@BurritoKingdom correct. The Neo Geo, 16 bit console and it's CD brother, which was released in 1994, same as the 32 bit Saturn and PlayStation, had 7 megs of ram. 4 alone being dedicated to the GPU. (Yes I know it was technically 24 but, however it used a 16 bit graphics data bus..which is the same reason the PC Engine/Turbo was considered 16 bit.)
@@jamesburchill7522 back in those days at 11 years old i thought that videogames would grow in multiples of 8. You know, 8-16-24-32-40 and so on. Knew so little...and and still do!
In my country we could rent these at a certain establishment per hour. Renting the neoogeo cd meant that a lot of that time was spent on loading screens. And there was no cdz version back then
Then again, the Neo Geo CD and CDZ were competing against the PlayStation and the Saturn. And the Neo Geo AES was extremely expensive, so of course it had better look superior to other 16-bit consoles.
I think neo geo released 3 home systems during the 90s. With the original neo geo cartridge system predating the debut of PlayStation and Saturn. All three neo geo home systems have more or less similar graphics. So yes I understand what you mean since this video is focusing on the cdz system and not the cartridge system but the graphics are still largely the same.
I’m so proud of myself! I was able to identify Galford’s theme during the Pulstar comparison 😅 Man, I used to play that game ALL THE TIME on my Genesis!
The Neo CD era was strange. I never understood why SNK and Sega didn't team up and just release the games on Saturn. I know SNK did release some but if they were at least partially involved in the development of the Saturn, they could have brought their library over without having to go at it alone by developing their own hardware. The CD system was still very expensive on launch, it just didn't make much sense.
You aren't kidding man...I mean Sega and SNK were so tight back then they were producing specialized RAM carts for KOF on the Saturn. Had SNK fully joined Sega I don't think it would have changed the outcome of the 5th generation but we would have gotten some incredible 2D games.
I played all the fighting games from the Neogeo on the Saturn and with kof97 the loading times was just fine, I can’t imagine how awful it was for those who get into the Neogeo cd with that game.
The Saturn version of The King of Fighters '97 required the 1MB or 4MB RAM cart (like most of the Neo Geo ports for Saturn) which is why loading times weren't much of an issue.
I'm glad I picked up a CDZ when I did (circa 2008). Considering what I paid for it and my NTSC games then and where prices are at now, I'm really lucky. My only complaint of the console is the censoring of the NTSC-region games...that and I wish that more of the Metal Slug games had been released for it (especially Metal Slug X).
I wonder if uni-bios works on the CD Neo Geo platforms AND if changing region would allow you to play the Asian version of those games like it works on the AES & MVS? Something maybe worth looking into?
I bought mine back in the day. Its pretty insanely priced now, but playing some of the best of NEO GEO on it is so worth it. The sprites and palettes are just gorgeous. Plus the music all CD quality.
Oh my god that loading for the character introduction would drive me nuts Like it totally. Looks like you should start playing and all they do is freaking pull their weapons out and bow to each other
I'm glad we don't had to suffer with load times on these games anymore. I got most of these on Nintendo Switch and they load super fast. The Breaker ports on Switch even had online play with hardly any lags.
In the '90s, I'dve been thrilled to get my hands on any available Neo Geo hardware. However, in 2003, I was able to get an AES, and in 2014 I found a great deal for an MVS cabinet. Having access to both cartridge versions, I'm out on the CD variants. I will say, though, if you're playing Neo Geo games, whether on cart, disc, emulation, or console ports, you're still doing yourself right!
At first, I was not planning to watch the whole thing when I realized it was just raw loading comparisons, but then it got compelling a couple of minutes in. You do have a way with these things, SLX. Nicely done. I had heard both sides of the CDZ, that it made a big difference, or that it made a small difference that wasn't worthwhile. Seeing an actual comparison really clarified things. It seems to be a significant difference in most cases. I don't know what they were thinking with Last Blade 2, loading just the opening taunts like that. For KOF '98, at least you could play single play as well as team play. That would probably help if you were not in the mood for as many load times. Single makes it a traditional best-of-three round fighter, as I recall. Sure, it does hurt some of the appeal of KOF being a team fighter, but the gameplay is so strong that it would be worth playing either way. And you could play team play when you could deal with the loading.
I had the NEO CD for quite some time, the load times never really bothered me. But the games library really did. Worth the extra to pick up an MVS imo, never looked back.
I love The Neo Geo CDZ, the loading are faster x2 but I prefer the design of the Front loader. Loading on The Last Blade 1, 2 and Kof 99 with CDZ are long 😉😉😉 The best point for me, it’s the music game like kof94, 95, Samurai Spirits, Art of Fighting 2, Fatal Fury 3 😍😍😍
It is a shame the CDZ was released in Japan only as it sounds like it was a decent upgrade from the original CD. There is no getting around load times with any disc-based system. Though, I am glad we can now enjoy Neo Geo (CD) games on modern devices with minimal loading. A lot of the Neo Geo games still hold up wonderfully now!
I wish I saw this video 4 years ago before I paid a chunk of change for a CDZ. I still love having it, but I may not have bothered back then if I knew how bad those newer titles loaded. But at least I got to live my childhood dream of owning a Neo Geo console! Amazing video!
I find it interesting that most people don't realize that. There are actually options in the settings to help load times in some games. Probably has to do with the fact that they're weirdly named. I believe last blade actually does have some settings that will make the load time faster. like a less detailed character select screen and skip the battle intro.
@SegaLordX Very true, but I don't think many people know it even exists. Select a few games. It makes the unbearable bearable. But of course, with sd loaders now available, it doesn't really matter.
Dang, the Neo Geo CDZ does look pretty good while loading very faster than the Neo Geo CD had. Good thing that SNK had partner up with Hamster to rerelease the SNK Neo Geo games on modern consoles that I can grab them on the Nintendo Switch console. By the way, @Sega Lord X, do you think you can do a video of what Neo Geo games or any SNK arcade games are still missing on Hamster's Arcade Archives on Modern Platforms? I am currently grabbing to get any Neo Geo games on my Nintendo Switch through Nintendo Switch eShop that I don't have on my Neo Geo Mini International console since Terry Bogard's introduction to Super Smash Bros. Ultimate's Fighter Pass Vol. 1 made me introduced to SNK and picking up any Neo Geo games on the Nintendo Switch.
I dont have much nostalgia for the NeoGeo, but I still find the subject of the home systems fascinating. Thanks for putting this comparison together, I doubt it was very exciting getting footage. 😂
Great comparison! Have you ever considered doing a review of all the SNK game compilations that came out for PS2 like the AOF collection, Fatal Fury Vol 1 and 2, etc? Those were really great back then I loved how many of them let us use either cartridge or CD based soundtracks, with minimum to non-existent load times. It was like having the best of both the original NeoGeo and the CD based variants all on one disc.
Absolute fantastic video! Very informative! I own the model 2 top loader, and while the load times aren't great I still love it! I would love to buy a CDZ if they weren't so damn expensive!
The Sega Saturn killed the Neo Geo CD on arrival the original Neo Geo was a 2D beast in 1990 the problem was computer technology was moving at a crazy fast rate back then that by the time the Neo Geo CD launched Sega launched their own 2D power house the Saturn for a mainstream price which was already more powerful.
In the EU the PS1 killed it but it wasn't in the same market and couldn't do NEO Geo Games accurate to the arcade. I wish Saturn concentrated on 2D games.
I bought a Neo Geo CDZ, but by the time it was released in December '95, it felt like a last hurrah for 2D gaming on home consoles. The Saturn and the PS1 kind of still had one foot in 2D games, but by the time the N64 arrived in '96, it was over for a 2D console like the Neo Geo CDZ.
Not only 2D consoles but 2D games in general are getting ignore. Not only that but the arcade market is starting to dwindle too. With consoles surpassing arcade in power, most gamers no longer go there to play games anymore. With the Dreamcast and GameCube ability to give players arcade perfect experience at home with F-Zero GX, Soul Calibur, and Hydro Thunder there's no point in going to the arcade anymore.
I own a Neo Geo AES, CD and two arcade boards. Launching the first CD model with a single speed drive was truly a ridiculous mistake. Nevertheless, what a capable 2D powerhouse.
Doubt, if you owned or played an Arcade board or even the CD compared to a few of these you would know how ridiculous this video comparison is. 😂 Emukids all over this website fronting.
@@greenkoopa It's true that the Neo Geo released far too late. However, the earlier released Sega CD included everything the Genesis lacked. More powerful CPU, sprite scaling, more added sprites, ram, improved audio, etc. It's too bad that many of the released titles were simple cartridge versions with an fmv video. It had tons of potential.
As someone who owned the neo geo cd for years and played the heck out of it, when i finally did get a cdz I noticed the massively quicker load times difference right away. In my opinion if you’re going to own a neo geo cd, it’s the only version to get if not then stick with emulation
To be fair, I don't necessarily think the NEO GEO CDZ is particularly slow at all (it seem similar to Saturn and Playstation). What probably really stuck out to a lot of people with the NEO GEO CD in general was that SNK always showcased loading with a big neon sign saying, "hey, this sucks" with their generalized, boring loading screen in most of the games. If they could've masked the initial loading times with one or several cool "unskippable" animated splash screens I don't think a lot of people would've noticed it as much. and they could've also been smart about it. Masking loading screens with "vs.-animations", as well as tips and tricks between fights, as well as using things like "score counting". With those things in place, If they could pull that off I think people would have percieved the loading times as much shorter than they are perceived right now...
The problem was they never bothered to optimize the games for the new CD media which led to insane load times due to loading huge chunks of the game at once vs small pieces like most CD based games do. They either needed to heavily optimize the games or include a much faster loading CD drive which would have been insanely expensive at the time. Even with the 2X drive in the CDZ the load times were still way too long.
I am pretty sure that the fighting games load only chunks: the selected players and the background. CD based games had loading screens within the levels. I blame the Sony API and bad authoring software. Wouldn’t it be great in a racing game or side scroller when the CD reads in the scenery in the speed of a speed runner. Then adjust speed down below single speed and eventually rereads the scenery around you ( seeks one trace )? TIL that Morton mapping allows a similar technique for 2d maps. Maybe you could even map BSP trees onto the spiral . Some duplicates
The cartridge versions will always rule over the cd ones. Thankfully I picked up a good amount of mvs carts when they were dirt cheap, not possible now a days
This is a thing for really passionate collectors, between decent emulators and things like the arcade stick pro and the MiSTer FPGA, there are plenty of options that will give you a better bang for your buck. Heck, if you feel like you must own original hardware, a "consolized" MVS is the way to go. Sure, it's not as sleek and cool as the AES or even the CD/CDZ, but it won't cost you an arm and a leg.
Yeah, the CDZ had a 2x CD Rom drive so the loading was cut in half (as you can tell by the progress bars). So, for some games it didn't matter all that much. 5 seconds was cut down to 2.5. No biggie. But if you were waiting for a minute, then yeah shaving 30 seconds was a big deal.
I used to have 1 Neo Geo CD 1 Top Looder, with some games and the loading times were really terrible, but the quality of the games was so space shooter, fight games. Could really be seen. For various reasons I was forced to part with some systems and sometimes I regret selling my system and games. But for fans, if you own a Switsch, then check it out. in the E shop, I just bought a few titles, sometimes they also have games on offer that are 50% cheaper and gems like Last Blade 1 and 2, Blasing Star or the Neo Geo Fight Games are very playable, even for On the way, which I think is super nice.
Too many consoles came out at this time and we had the back end of micro computers in the UK as well as pc cd rom taking off it was AWESOME, Spoilt for choice
If youve got a mister FPGA, do a video on the 4x hack. It makes a huge difference on the games that support it, and with the addition of arranged soundtracks, games like neo turf masters with arranged soundtrack and 4x loading make loads virtually non existent and the best way to play the game now.
My first knee-jerk reaction to hearing about bad load times was "Back in the day, a few more seconds surely is worth not having to spend $200 per game!" But after watching the original video, and this one... yeah, all these frequent loads would have tested my patience a lot too. I wonder how viable it would have been to install a PC hard drive or equivalent into the original Neo Geo CD. It would have raised the price, but it could have completely eliminated this issue. Oh what could have been...
I didn't know anybody who played games other than the fighting games from NEO GEO. I don't remember seeing the CDZ load screens so I clearly never rented a CDZ.
I have the original top loader. After watching this video I'd love to get a cdz to see the notable difference myself. One thing I've heard about with the cdz is that it overheats rather quickly. I'd imagine a fan mod would need to be in order for longer play sessions.
The CDZ had a 2X speed CDROM, and indeed... it seemed to finish just as the older drive was at the half-way mark. Truth in advertising, whoda thunk it? Thanks Lordster! SEEEEEEEEEEEGAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!
On the later games it looks like it wasnt exactly linear... sometimes the speed looked a little bit less, or more, than 2x. Depends on the type of game, organization on the disc I guess.
I got a CDZ a few weeks ago, in preparation for going back to Japan this summer, to find more CD games. Though I wanna get a few cheaper AES games too.
Absolutely love Neo geo the one console I regret getting rid of now was my AES I only had Art of fighting 2 games where just far too expensive back then, but looking back now Dan I wish I boxed it up and put into storage
The CDZ was my first Neo console. The loading wasn't my biffest issue with the CD systems, it was the Library. (How could they have King of the Monster 2 but not 1?!) I have an MVS system now and I'm much happier. Even the AES was missing arcade titles. I do miss some of the CD remixed music though
If someone had told me back then that in the future you'd be able to play Neo Geo arcade games through Mame on your phone or tablet for free with no slowdown whatsoever I wouldn't have believed it. I'm still impressed today! Hook that baby up to a TV with an arcade stick and you're in retro paradise. I think kids today are spoiled with PS5's and the likes. They'll never know the pain of not being able to afford a single cartridge of Metal Slug let alone the dam console!?
I enjoy these comparisons. Honestly the issue was jumping the gun during the generation. It's all good though, though i wish we had things like the RAM cart on the Japanese Saturn. Oh well. Now we load them up on SSDs!
I had the front loader i never had that much issues but i did hate that they could have gone with a 20x or 52x but some how found a 1x somewhere in the world and at the price they had it was wrong
So what have we learned from all this? Games that load frequently are a problem no matter which Neo Geo CD system you play them on. The CDZ has a 2X drive so it can be slightly more tolerable at times. By the way, the in-game "load times" mentioned for Sengoku 2 is the drive seeking the music tracks, which is also somewhat faster on the CDZ.
"I won't sugar coat it. You are about to see a video about load times." I would subscribe again if I could.
SLX: Loading times suck
Also SLX: Here’s a video of load screens
Me: Sure, I’ll watch.
Ninja Combat and Cyber-Lip are two of the most underrated Neo Geo games!
l like how he puts Mai Shiranui on every Neo Geo thumbnail.
Nothing says Neo Geo like Mai.
@@SegaLordXbewbs.
Only SLX could make a video about load times and it still be worth watchin.
I never expected to be watching a whole video just about two loading screens and which one is faster. 😩
Love your avatar ! Umbrella
@@thaddeousmaximussussex7014 Your pic is awesome too. I am a dad also. Dads are Awesome. 😎👍💯
And knowing who wins!
KOF 94 is an interesting test subject, its the first and only in the series that loads all rounds in a big, single loading, I remember it took a long time, maybe a few minutes, but I can't remember which model we played it back then. It would have been nice a comparison here.
"I won't sugar coat it, you are about to see a video about load times" jokes on you I'm into that shit!
Another great video brother!
To me, the Neo Geo CD was always kind of like settling for a Mustang when you wanted a Ferrari.
Mustangs are still pretty cool though. If I could I would own both!
I feel like is closer to getting and adapted VW beetle when you wanted a Porsche
Enjoying these different platform retrospectives. iirc, I’m about 10 years younger than you SegaLordX, so while I remember stuff like the Neo•Geo consoles, they were permanently and eternally out of my price range at the time. It’s neat to see what I missed all those years ago. Keep up the great work.
Thank you. Appreciate the comment.
@@SegaLordX I think it's one of the best things about this channel. So much of the history of this era of gaming is written by Xennials/Oregon Trail generation content creators. They do REMEMBER this period, but from the perspective of someone who was a kid at the time. It's very rare to hear from someone who was an adult, and had an adult's critical faculties then as well as now.
I'm always fascinated with Neo Geo's hardware line up. In reality the CD format was just there to keep the cost down, and make the systems accessible to the common person. Remember, the AES was originally designed for rental, so the cost of the carts was something not really thought about. I agree that late entries into the library didn't port that well. However, they also didn't compromise in frames of animation,. something done on the Saturn and PlayStation.
I always thought CD's became popular because of the huge 640MB storage space. At the time catridges could only handle a few MB
@@nighthawk0077 If you look at MVS or AES cartridges, you'll see that some of them were gigantic. They didn't hamstring themselves like the Nintendo 64. Garou, if I am correct was gigantic.
It's due to the lack of RAM on the Saturn and PlayStation. That's why with the Ram expansion the Saturn is almost perfect. If the PlayStation had Ram expansion it would also nearly be the same.
@@BurritoKingdom correct. The Neo Geo, 16 bit console and it's CD brother, which was released in 1994, same as the 32 bit Saturn and PlayStation, had 7 megs of ram. 4 alone being dedicated to the GPU.
(Yes I know it was technically 24 but, however it used a 16 bit graphics data bus..which is the same reason the PC Engine/Turbo was considered 16 bit.)
@@jamesburchill7522 back in those days at 11 years old i thought that videogames would grow in multiples of 8. You know, 8-16-24-32-40 and so on. Knew so little...and and still do!
In my country we could rent these at a certain establishment per hour. Renting the neoogeo cd meant that a lot of that time was spent on loading screens. And there was no cdz version back then
Never heard of the CDZ. That's why I've loved this channel the past 5 years- always consistent and engaging quality content! Thank you SLX!
Been trying to sell mine for quite some time. But the CD's aren't exactly interesting now that the console can emulate on a phone I guess. Oh well. 😝
Same here! I knew about the CD but thought it was a one-and-done. Thanks Sega Lord X!
I’d take my consolized MVS any day of the week. Seeing those loading screens on Pulstar is enough to drive one crazy! It’s super fast on the MVS.
Sega Lord X And The Neo Geo
Man those sprites are so big and nice to look at compared to its 16 bit competitors.
Then again, the Neo Geo CD and CDZ were competing against the PlayStation and the Saturn. And the Neo Geo AES was extremely expensive, so of course it had better look superior to other 16-bit consoles.
I think neo geo released 3 home systems during the 90s. With the original neo geo cartridge system predating the debut of PlayStation and Saturn.
All three neo geo home systems have more or less similar graphics. So yes I understand what you mean since this video is focusing on the cdz system and not the cartridge system but the graphics are still largely the same.
You are right though as you are more technical. I'm the one who deviate and thought of the neo geo cartridge system instead of the cdz system.
Neo Geo was all about sprites. Even the background layers are made of sprites.
Neo geo came out in April 1990. It was five years ahead of PlayStation
I’m so proud of myself! I was able to identify Galford’s theme during the Pulstar comparison 😅 Man, I used to play that game ALL THE TIME on my Genesis!
Galford's theme wasn't in Pulstar though. SLX was just overlaying it in the video for some bizarre reason.
Load screens don't have sound. I added music for ambience.
@@Marcus_K Lol, I probably wasn’t clear. He had it playing during the game footage, that’s all.
Am a video game geek I not only appreciated this, I loved it.
The Neo CD era was strange. I never understood why SNK and Sega didn't team up and just release the games on Saturn. I know SNK did release some but if they were at least partially involved in the development of the Saturn, they could have brought their library over without having to go at it alone by developing their own hardware. The CD system was still very expensive on launch, it just didn't make much sense.
Ur forgetting that saturn is the one of the largest in the solar system already when sega first a glint in the womb’s eye
The Neo Geo was always primarily an arcade board. In the arcades the Neo Geo lasted until 2004. The home versions were a sideshow in comparison.
You aren't kidding man...I mean Sega and SNK were so tight back then they were producing specialized RAM carts for KOF on the Saturn. Had SNK fully joined Sega I don't think it would have changed the outcome of the 5th generation but we would have gotten some incredible 2D games.
I guess SNK wanted all the profit from the sales instead of giving SEGA a cut
Mass production brought the cost of the drive itself down ( mechanics, laser ). Like with SegaCD and pcEngine the huge cache ( RAM ) is expensive.
I played all the fighting games from the Neogeo on the Saturn and with kof97 the loading times was just fine, I can’t imagine how awful it was for those who get into the Neogeo cd with that game.
The Saturn version of The King of Fighters '97 required the 1MB or 4MB RAM cart (like most of the Neo Geo ports for Saturn) which is why loading times weren't much of an issue.
@@ScottWozniak the 1mb is enough. If we use the 4mb there is some glitches sometimes ( especially in metal slug and kof )
@@sega-re-trop-vieux KoF '97 should not glitch with a proper 4MB RAM cart. Kof '96 only works with the 1MB.
We did, gotta say the cdz did make a difference.
I'm glad I picked up a CDZ when I did (circa 2008). Considering what I paid for it and my NTSC games then and where prices are at now, I'm really lucky. My only complaint of the console is the censoring of the NTSC-region games...that and I wish that more of the Metal Slug games had been released for it (especially Metal Slug X).
I wonder if uni-bios works on the CD Neo Geo platforms AND if changing region would allow you to play the Asian version of those games like it works on the AES & MVS? Something maybe worth looking into?
I bought mine back in the day. Its pretty insanely priced now, but playing some of the best of NEO GEO on it is so worth it. The sprites and palettes are just gorgeous. Plus the music all CD quality.
I didn't know such a thing existed beyond the standard Neo Geo and Neo Geo CD. Then again, I've never known anyone who owned a Neo Geo back then.
I've started playing the aca versions of neo geo games on my xbox as ive always been a fan but now i really want a cdz after watching this
Oh my god that loading for the character introduction would drive me nuts
Like it totally. Looks like you should start playing and all they do is freaking pull their weapons out and bow to each other
I'm glad we don't had to suffer with load times on these games anymore. I got most of these on Nintendo Switch and they load super fast. The Breaker ports on Switch even had online play with hardly any lags.
In the '90s, I'dve been thrilled to get my hands on any available Neo Geo hardware. However, in 2003, I was able to get an AES, and in 2014 I found a great deal for an MVS cabinet. Having access to both cartridge versions, I'm out on the CD variants. I will say, though, if you're playing Neo Geo games, whether on cart, disc, emulation, or console ports, you're still doing yourself right!
One of my more favorite videos from this year. I had no idea the difference was that pronounced
At first, I was not planning to watch the whole thing when I realized it was just raw loading comparisons, but then it got compelling a couple of minutes in. You do have a way with these things, SLX. Nicely done. I had heard both sides of the CDZ, that it made a big difference, or that it made a small difference that wasn't worthwhile. Seeing an actual comparison really clarified things. It seems to be a significant difference in most cases. I don't know what they were thinking with Last Blade 2, loading just the opening taunts like that. For KOF '98, at least you could play single play as well as team play. That would probably help if you were not in the mood for as many load times. Single makes it a traditional best-of-three round fighter, as I recall. Sure, it does hurt some of the appeal of KOF being a team fighter, but the gameplay is so strong that it would be worth playing either way. And you could play team play when you could deal with the loading.
High Score Girl the manga and anime series perfectly described the early CD games of the early to mid 90s.
LONG LOAD TIMES!!!!!!
I’m almost sure that most of us subscribers have watched much nerdier videos. I’m happily watching now.
Just picked up my first saturn with daytona on a trade today because you got me so interested. Thanks SLX
I had the NEO CD for quite some time, the load times never really bothered me. But the games library really did. Worth the extra to pick up an MVS imo, never looked back.
I love The Neo Geo CDZ, the loading are faster x2 but I prefer the design of the Front loader. Loading on The Last Blade 1, 2 and Kof 99 with CDZ are long 😉😉😉
The best point for me, it’s the music game like kof94, 95, Samurai Spirits, Art of Fighting 2, Fatal Fury 3 😍😍😍
Awesome concept for a video! Great execution as well! Great video SLX!
It is a shame the CDZ was released in Japan only as it sounds like it was a decent upgrade from the original CD. There is no getting around load times with any disc-based system. Though, I am glad we can now enjoy Neo Geo (CD) games on modern devices with minimal loading. A lot of the Neo Geo games still hold up wonderfully now!
i'll take any retro loading screen times vs current updates time
Ugh, games should never have updates. Nasty revisionist s***...
I sure am addicted to video game history 😊
I wish I saw this video 4 years ago before I paid a chunk of change for a CDZ. I still love having it, but I may not have bothered back then if I knew how bad those newer titles loaded. But at least I got to live my childhood dream of owning a Neo Geo console! Amazing video!
I find it interesting that most people don't realize that. There are actually options in the settings to help load times in some games. Probably has to do with the fact that they're weirdly named. I believe last blade actually does have some settings that will make the load time faster. like a less detailed character select screen and skip the battle intro.
In some games, yes, but it doesn't help as much as you'd think. The load times are still long and often in those games.
@SegaLordX Very true, but I don't think many people know it even exists. Select a few games. It makes the unbearable bearable. But of course, with sd loaders now available, it doesn't really matter.
Why am I perfectly happy to sit and watch slow loading screens tonight? What have you done to me, SLX?
I appreciate it.
Dang, the Neo Geo CDZ does look pretty good while loading very faster than the Neo Geo CD had. Good thing that SNK had partner up with Hamster to rerelease the SNK Neo Geo games on modern consoles that I can grab them on the Nintendo Switch console.
By the way, @Sega Lord X, do you think you can do a video of what Neo Geo games or any SNK arcade games are still missing on Hamster's Arcade Archives on Modern Platforms? I am currently grabbing to get any Neo Geo games on my Nintendo Switch through Nintendo Switch eShop that I don't have on my Neo Geo Mini International console since Terry Bogard's introduction to Super Smash Bros. Ultimate's Fighter Pass Vol. 1 made me introduced to SNK and picking up any Neo Geo games on the Nintendo Switch.
I dont have much nostalgia for the NeoGeo, but I still find the subject of the home systems fascinating. Thanks for putting this comparison together, I doubt it was very exciting getting footage. 😂
Great comparison! Have you ever considered doing a review of all the SNK game compilations that came out for PS2 like the AOF collection, Fatal Fury Vol 1 and 2, etc? Those were really great back then I loved how many of them let us use either cartridge or CD based soundtracks, with minimum to non-existent load times. It was like having the best of both the original NeoGeo and the CD based variants all on one disc.
Absolute fantastic video! Very informative! I own the model 2 top loader, and while the load times aren't great I still love it! I would love to buy a CDZ if they weren't so damn expensive!
The Sega Saturn killed the Neo Geo CD on arrival the original Neo Geo was a 2D beast in 1990 the problem was computer technology was moving at a crazy fast rate back then that by the time the Neo Geo CD launched Sega launched their own 2D power house the Saturn for a mainstream price which was already more powerful.
In the EU the PS1 killed it but it wasn't in the same market and couldn't do NEO Geo Games accurate to the arcade. I wish Saturn concentrated on 2D games.
I do have some neo geo CD games on my Wii home brew. It’s pretty sweet!
It's 2023 and I'm watching loading screens and enjoying it
I bought a Neo Geo CDZ, but by the time it was released in December '95, it felt like a last hurrah for 2D gaming on home consoles. The Saturn and the PS1 kind of still had one foot in 2D games, but by the time the N64 arrived in '96, it was over for a 2D console like the Neo Geo CDZ.
Not only 2D consoles but 2D games in general are getting ignore. Not only that but the arcade market is starting to dwindle too. With consoles surpassing arcade in power, most gamers no longer go there to play games anymore. With the Dreamcast and GameCube ability to give players arcade perfect experience at home with F-Zero GX, Soul Calibur, and Hydro Thunder there's no point in going to the arcade anymore.
I own a Neo Geo AES, CD and two arcade boards. Launching the first CD model with a single speed drive was truly a ridiculous mistake. Nevertheless, what a capable 2D powerhouse.
I feel the same about the Sega CD. Granted that came out a few years earlier so...wtf neo geo
Doubt, if you owned or played an Arcade board or even the CD compared to a few of these you would know how ridiculous this video comparison is. 😂 Emukids all over this website fronting.
@@greenkoopa It's true that the Neo Geo released far too late. However, the earlier released Sega CD included everything the Genesis lacked. More powerful CPU, sprite scaling, more added sprites, ram, improved audio, etc. It's too bad that many of the released titles were simple cartridge versions with an fmv video. It had tons of potential.
@@ridiculous_gamingwas so disappointed they didn’t put the super scaler games on Sega CD
@@stevenqbosell I agree 100 percent.
As someone who owned the neo geo cd for years and played the heck out of it, when i finally did get a cdz I noticed the massively quicker load times difference right away. In my opinion if you’re going to own a neo geo cd, it’s the only version to get if not then stick with emulation
To be fair, I don't necessarily think the NEO GEO CDZ is particularly slow at all (it seem similar to Saturn and Playstation). What probably really stuck out to a lot of people with the NEO GEO CD in general was that SNK always showcased loading with a big neon sign saying, "hey, this sucks" with their generalized, boring loading screen in most of the games. If they could've masked the initial loading times with one or several cool "unskippable" animated splash screens I don't think a lot of people would've noticed it as much. and they could've also been smart about it. Masking loading screens with "vs.-animations", as well as tips and tricks between fights, as well as using things like "score counting". With those things in place, If they could pull that off I think people would have percieved the loading times as much shorter than they are perceived right now...
Should compare it to Street Fighter 2 on the PS1.
I bought my CDZ back in 1996. I'm so glad that I chose it instead of N64.
Have you tried with a neo CD sd loader? Makes a world of difference.
@@teamdoa of course not, but have been available last few years now. My neo CD has gotten more use since I installed it.
I watch your videos every morning before work 5am eastern time lol
The problem was they never bothered to optimize the games for the new CD media which led to insane load times due to loading huge chunks of the game at once vs small pieces like most CD based games do.
They either needed to heavily optimize the games or include a much faster loading CD drive which would have been insanely expensive at the time. Even with the 2X drive in the CDZ the load times were still way too long.
I am pretty sure that the fighting games load only chunks: the selected players and the background.
CD based games had loading screens within the levels. I blame the Sony API and bad authoring software. Wouldn’t it be great in a racing game or side scroller when the CD reads in the scenery in the speed of a speed runner. Then adjust speed down below single speed and eventually rereads the scenery around you ( seeks one trace )?
TIL that Morton mapping allows a similar technique for 2d maps. Maybe you could even map BSP trees onto the spiral . Some duplicates
@@ArneChristianRosenfeldt I did not understand a thing you just said 😅
The cartridge versions will always rule over the cd ones. Thankfully I picked up a good amount of mvs carts when they were dirt cheap, not possible now a days
How cheap ? Personally MVS carts have never really been "cheap" lol.
I got Windjammers and Crossed Swords for like 30-40 bucks. I've checked the boards they aren't bootlegs either
11:37 wow, this is insane. I couldn’t deal with that.
Ive never even met a person that owned a neogeo console. The games are amazing though.
Nice video but this thing might be hard to find and the prices might cause more pain than any loading time ever can.
This is a thing for really passionate collectors, between decent emulators and things like the arcade stick pro and the MiSTer FPGA, there are plenty of options that will give you a better bang for your buck. Heck, if you feel like you must own original hardware, a "consolized" MVS is the way to go. Sure, it's not as sleek and cool as the AES or even the CD/CDZ, but it won't cost you an arm and a leg.
Yeah, the CDZ had a 2x CD Rom drive so the loading was cut in half (as you can tell by the progress bars). So, for some games it didn't matter all that much. 5 seconds was cut down to 2.5. No biggie. But if you were waiting for a minute, then yeah shaving 30 seconds was a big deal.
If they had successful popular franchise games I would of wanted a neo geo CD
I really enjoy your videos, keep them coming, SLX !
I had a CDZ. The loading still killed me, especially in fighting games. Just so many loading screens. I’ll stick with my consolized MVS.
I wish neo geo would've added a ram/rom slot for the cdz to alleviate the loading time.
I would play the cdz for the arranged cd quality sound tracks over the aes versions.
As a collector this machine is a must have for me.i own all 3 neo cd machine and i like the most is front loader
Excellent!
Man… I don’t have enough patients to even resist fast forwarding through this video
Those fighting sprites are amazing though
to think were actually sitting here watching loading screens by choice ❤😂
Damn the CD Z is a huge improvement over the original Neo Geo CD in loading times.
I used to have 1 Neo Geo CD 1 Top Looder, with some games and the loading times were really terrible, but the quality of the games was so space shooter, fight games. Could really be seen. For various reasons I was forced to part with some systems and sometimes I regret selling my system and games. But for fans, if you own a Switsch, then check it out. in the E shop, I just bought a few titles, sometimes they also have games on offer that are 50% cheaper and gems like Last Blade 1 and 2, Blasing Star or the Neo Geo Fight Games are very playable, even for On the way, which I think is super nice.
Awesome comparison. Love the Neo Geo episodes.
You make great content. I really enjoy your videos. I never owned a Sega growing up so these fill me in on what I missed out on.
Much appreciated! Thanks for watching.
You missed out on some wonderful memories. Things were so new,and exciting. Our imaginations ran wild.
Too many consoles came out at this time and we had the back end of micro computers in the UK as well as pc cd rom taking off it was AWESOME, Spoilt for choice
Yo, thanks once again for the vids!
I really just sat through a ton of load screens. LOL!
I remember a time in the early 90s when emulators like mame didn't support sound on their neo geo games lol.
1:12 incredible line
If youve got a mister FPGA, do a video on the 4x hack. It makes a huge difference on the games that support it, and with the addition of arranged soundtracks, games like neo turf masters with arranged soundtrack and 4x loading make loads virtually non existent and the best way to play the game now.
Proud MAME adopter since the 90's for this very reason.
My first knee-jerk reaction to hearing about bad load times was "Back in the day, a few more seconds surely is worth not having to spend $200 per game!"
But after watching the original video, and this one... yeah, all these frequent loads would have tested my patience a lot too.
I wonder how viable it would have been to install a PC hard drive or equivalent into the original Neo Geo CD. It would have raised the price, but it could have completely eliminated this issue. Oh what could have been...
I didn't know anybody who played games other than the fighting games from NEO GEO. I don't remember seeing the CDZ load screens so I clearly never rented a CDZ.
is there a way to upgrade cd drives on old game systems? Because I would see that would help the read
times on the systems.
I have the original top loader. After watching this video I'd love to get a cdz to see the notable difference myself.
One thing I've heard about with the cdz is that it overheats rather quickly. I'd imagine a fan mod would need to be in order for longer play sessions.
my CDZ was softmodded by the previous owner... he drilled some holes in the back of it and put feet under the console
The CDZ had a 2X speed CDROM, and indeed... it seemed to finish just as the older drive was at the half-way mark. Truth in advertising, whoda thunk it? Thanks Lordster! SEEEEEEEEEEEGAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!
On the later games it looks like it wasnt exactly linear... sometimes the speed looked a little bit less, or more, than 2x. Depends on the type of game, organization on the disc I guess.
Labour of love right here
I got a CDZ a few weeks ago, in preparation for going back to Japan this summer, to find more CD games. Though I wanna get a few cheaper AES games too.
Awesomeness video please do more thanks 👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
Absolutely love Neo geo the one console I regret getting rid of now was my AES I only had Art of fighting 2 games where just far too expensive back then, but looking back now Dan I wish I boxed it up and put into storage
I know it's not original hardware, but it would be great to have a comparison between the front/top loader, CDZ and Dreamcast.
Thanks!
Thank you my friend.
The CDZ was my first Neo console. The loading wasn't my biffest issue with the CD systems, it was the Library. (How could they have King of the Monster 2 but not 1?!) I have an MVS system now and I'm much happier. Even the AES was missing arcade titles. I do miss some of the CD remixed music though
Yeap but at the same time the NeoGeo CD does had a few games that NeoGeo AES and MVS doesn't had such as Samurai Shodown RPG.
If someone had told me back then that in the future you'd be able to play Neo Geo arcade games through Mame on your phone or tablet for free with no slowdown whatsoever I wouldn't have believed it. I'm still impressed today! Hook that baby up to a TV with an arcade stick and you're in retro paradise. I think kids today are spoiled with PS5's and the likes. They'll never know the pain of not being able to afford a single cartridge of Metal Slug let alone the dam console!?
I'd be interested to see what you think of the 4X loading times on the Mister core
I can tell you that its very good and fast
OMG the loading times are nightmare fuel
I enjoy these comparisons. Honestly the issue was jumping the gun during the generation. It's all good though, though i wish we had things like the RAM cart on the Japanese Saturn.
Oh well. Now we load them up on SSDs!
I had the front loader i never had that much issues but i did hate that they could have gone with a 20x or 52x but some how found a 1x somewhere in the world and at the price they had it was wrong
Did anyone make an ODE for the NeoCD or the CDZ? I wonder how that compares
I had no idea there was a cd system for neo geo.
So what have we learned from all this?
Games that load frequently are a problem no matter which Neo Geo CD system you play them on. The CDZ has a 2X drive so it can be slightly more tolerable at times.
By the way, the in-game "load times" mentioned for Sengoku 2 is the drive seeking the music tracks, which is also somewhat faster on the CDZ.
What is the background music around 12:00-13:30