@@CollaborativeDataAccounts I don't support censorship either, but it's on their streaming network. If they did it on a disc, I'd take issue with it, but channels and networks have always censored content. It's nothing new. I'd prefer they didn't, but I wouldn't call this particularly outrageous.
What's going on in Texas and Florida is the silencing of minority voices and re-writing of history, Book Banning, which has increased 1,100% since 2020 needs to be left in 1933 Germany, not 2023 America.
I don't think he's asserting that. However, creatives have a lot more pressure from their own peers than they do from hysterical southern bible bashers who have no industry power at all.
@@deepashtray5605 Of course! Look at the writers and painters putting out statements on Israel, like anyone cares what they think. This is one reason, I'm certain, that they love nothing better than attacking their own. It's one of the very few areas of life where they can make a tangible impact - blackballing someone because they have supposedly "problematic" views on a particular issue gives them a real power rush.
By this, I assume that you're referring to the ridiculous hysteria over state-imposed books about graphic sexual encounters in children's libraries? Nothing was cancelled there. Those books are widely available in adult libraries, retailers and online for anyone who wants to see them. But if you want to call teaching 5 year old Timmy about butt fucking multiple men in one night, then by all means, do it.
I like this a lot. I think there's a generational thing going on and he's right: that a lot of young people are trying to use the power of the lynch mob to choose what issues to support or scratch and that it is often done as virtue signalling rather than being an issue of significance. It is far better to openly discuss issues than to try to make them disappear or ban them. Censorship in the name of protecting overly-sensitive feelings seems like a step in the wrong direction. Hopefully cancel culture was just a fleeting fashion and sense will rear its head in due course.
This whole uproar about cancel culture is nonsense. They used to call it a boycott and it was what you did to avoid and discourage unethical, dangerous, disingenuous, people and companies. If your buddy wants to give another right wing fascist a pulpit at Simon and huckster, so he can quell his curiosity and make a buck, that’s his prerogative. If others find it objectionable and don’t buy the book that’s their prerogative. Not sure how him being gay somehow gives him a pass and by the way he’s sill punching down. The media in our country has been consolidated and basically controls the dialog in its content for both sides, and people want to piss and moan about cancel culture. It’s Pathetic, and anyone up in arms about it is a sucker.
At what people did he say or use his gayness as a pass? How is he punching down? The point being made is should a central government or media control what is said? Is that acceptable in a free society? You seem to think that's OK and take it for granted, so for you, you like things controlled and sanctioned, but many (if not most) don't.
Okay but I'd argue there was always only a small percentage of the population capable of doing debate on any one topic and it remains so today. If the problem is witch-hunting and dog-piling then the people contributing valuable pieces of information just gets drowned out. Even this interview with BEE is just an obvious platitude that people shouldn't need to hear but the lack of cultural centers and intellectual curiosity is directly caused by social media companies training people to offer lukewarm and virtue signaling opinions every night and day of our dwindling existence! Now is this a problem that can't be overcome? In some ways I think we are culturally cooked but I think in this case people just need to step back from letting social media govern so much of their literal existence and thoughts. Read the opinions of people you disagree with! God forbid we critique things on our own. It's incredibly easy to find holes in opinions these days because everything is based off of outrage and engagement.
It would be great if excellent writers like Mr. Ellis would show up at school board meetings where mental midgets are busy forbidding books to give the people and children threatened by this nuttery some backup.
Are you kidding??? Bret is a Right Winger, now. It's Right Wing Republicans who are banning books!! He supports a party that bans books and is anti-gay just to say he's "anti-woke." I would say he votes against his own interests, but he doesn't bother to vote or educate himself on any issues. His entire existence is watching porn, cooking shows, and going to dinner at expensive restaurants ... a pitiful existence, really, a total waste.
As long as he also does it for cases where conservatives lose their shit over books about LGBTQ people or racism. Conservatives have been some of the biggest crybaby hypocrites for cancel culture because they need to assert a certain patriarchal/white view of the world instead of introducing people of diverse backgrounds from a young age so kids can make up their own minds.
There is no "intensity" to cancel culture anymore. I couldn't even tell you the last person who was "canceled". And it was never about power. It's about social media. It doesn't require anything to call out a person or a company, and if enough people do it, it creates a controversy. It's pretty simple, and its danger is overstated.
Prurience in arts that he alludes to is only one side to cancel culture, which emerged primarily in relation to sexual assaults and still is an important aspect of high profile people being cancelled. Whether it's right to fully cancel someone for these convictions once justice served is another issue. But I think both these main aspects should be mentioned and separated as much as possible, as often a generic retaliation against 'cancel culture' is used as a kind of defacto cry in defence of abuses of power for sexual gain. i.e. taking advantage of the unclear definition of this term, and muddying the waters even further.
Ok, yes and no on Mr. Ellis's point about Cancel Culture: Is it bad and anti-human- you betcha, but to say scrap it, and on the daily instead let leaders of corporations say my way or the highway is just as bad and anti-human. People spend A LOT of their time and energy at work. And their work feeds the functioning of the world. So yes, we need conversation- but we also need POWER, and that POWER doesn't need to rest in the hands of a few corporate CEOs OR in a groupthink mob. POWER needs to be shared; it can't be given, it must be respected.
He's not saying do away with accountability - that and cancel culture are distinct. The power should never be done because of someone's subjective emotions. It's clear here that he is saying power should be shared, part of that is letting us as adults make our own choices about what we can see and watch.
Imagine if he wrote American Psycho in the 2020s. Thank you BEE for speaking out against this evil anticulture Cancel mafia. You, along with Bukowski, Selby jr and Ellroy are my favorite modern writers. Thank goodness you all wrote before this sh'tf*ckery cancel mess.
Asinine. Everyone is free to say no to Cancel culture, just like everyone else is free to say no to listening to certain people/voices. As to S&S, it’s important for democracy that the people who make a business run have a say in what gets made
The fact that he admits he's the wrong person to ask about this at the end should have signaled to the interviewer and producers that this content is not even worth posting, especially considering that it will likely distract from anything of substance he might have said in the rest of the interview. You'd think a professional writer would be able to articulate a more compelling argument against something as dumb as cancel culture than "I don't like it" or "that worries me," but he doesn't, so why post it, except to get more views? Click-baiting and cancel culture are both ingredients in a politically toxic stew, and it's sad to see Louisiana Channel serving it.
Quite the opposite. I think someone who admits they they don't have all the answers and are uncomfortable being turned into a mouthpiece is showing a degree of rationality and, more importantly, humility that is totally lacking in an online discourse that rewards the opposite.
I think @shenanigans3710 makes an excellent point here. There is certainly 'substance' in acknowledging what you don't have the answers to and hopefully this excerpt encourages more objective and nuanced thinking among its viewers.
What are you doing ?Why musts Louisiana channel be slammed for this... They are fairly non-censured publishing all kinds of "strange" opinions - from voodoo to "I am to great for this world"...
Is he the only writer of note saying this? Comedians are leagues ahead of artists on this topic, if the people given status of art income are really the artists.
Did he say anything? Like who is this man? Omg did he just compare a racist using the Nword to black people using it in defense of the racist? Did he really just insinuate that it’s a double standard that it’s used in rap music by black people. This is so incredibly out of touch
No, he didn't say that. That would be different than a movie character in a well made movie using it as a realistic depiction of what that person would have said at the time. I guess that distinction was lost on you in your hurry to show how "in touch" you are but thanks for your reactionary virtue signalling. No credits due.
big feelings going on here, big spots on the sleeve, passionate, he does it again, he snapped his fingers and had those 300 heads on a silver platter, LET HIM, we have to let him, it's about power, it's about context, it's about integrity, walk with me, how long do you think these old fellas are gonna last without the jokes?, let him dish out the punishments, he listens to rap, let him listen, to Doja Cat, under the covers, just a big guy listening to his favorite tunes, little special word, ah yeah, it’s about context, you don’t believe me??, look, look at him right there, he's doing it right now, there's one airpod in his non-visible ear blasting Doja into his system, this is how he stays large, at large, he can't be defending freedom without the tunes
This reeks of a person with vast privilege who is unwilling to do the work to understand the context in which their privilege exists. Been trolling and trying to "trigger" millennials for so long that he has become an irrelevant sensationalist voice. He carries this nauseating confidence based of past successes but is ultimately quite rigid, frail and predictable. Out of the public eye? Loosing relevance? Release a controversial statement that the Guardian will pick up and chalk it up to "trolling" later. I enjoy the insight that the artists on Louisiana Channel provide into their own process but given the current state of the world posting a video of an old white dude talking about cancel culture seems a bit tone deaf and out of touch.
I'm an immigrant and have lived within marginalised communities for most of my life. And I believe in absolute free speech. People who have been tested by life and have faced true adversity are not triggered by another individuals opinion.
@@mimad4923 You're conflating two things. Being an immigrant, living in marginalized communities, and facing adversity doesn't have much to do with this mans ability to not see past his own ego. In fact i'd say that this bootstrap mentality (that the more adversity you face and the harder you work the more you are able to deal with things that life throws at you and thus will achieve more success) that we are forced to adopt in marginalized communities actually dulls our senses to things that we should be outraged about. Free speech only extends so far as another persons rights. It is definitely a essential part of society but If free speech fuels and further proliferates hatred and bigotry (like it is allowed to do on social media and there internet) then it is no longer free speech.
@@wedthree facing adversity and carrying bucket-loads of trauma is not something people choose to do, it is something that people are forced to do. And I believe that, yes, those who have had to deal with a lot, are often more driven, empathic, resilient and grounded than those who have never had to fight for their right to even just survive. However, that doesn't mean that someone who hasn't experienced my trauma is not allowed to speak on the topic. I don't have to agree with them and heck, I don't even have to like what they say - but that shouldn't mean that they immediately need to stop expressing their views. If we all stop talking in fear of offending someone, where will we be?! If someone is choosing to use negative rhetoric in order to convey their opinions, that's on them. In fact, I think it just reflects back on who they are as a person and its plain for all to see.
No one has more privilege than the trust fund hipsters who write the columns you pretend are your own ideas. Absurd combination of insecurity, pretentiousness, self indoctrination and trying way too hard to identify with a responsibility free victim class thre sport. Give it a rest.
This is either deliberately disingenuous or he is that isolated from the reality of the world in totality that anything beyond soft furnishings and nice light is an inconvenience.
No it’s actually people who are quick to be offended by everything that are, more often than not, the ones who are isolated from the reality of the world. People who are truly suffering from racism for example are probably not the ones stewing about offensive language in a movie. They’re too busy living with it and dealing with it, and more often than not, they seem to realize the difference between reality and movies. Ellis is making a very nuanced point about censorship within the realm of art.
,,People shouldn't be canceling each other. They should
have a conversation.'' ❤👏
Tell that to them
this is gold
Literally this quote completely lacks substance. The only people being canceled these days are people who use slurs and violent offenders.
Wow. I was unaware of the Criterion censorship of The French Connection. That is alarming. 😞
I love that movie.
Criterion has sold out for some time as their fans are so fragile.
@@CollaborativeDataAccounts I don't support censorship either, but it's on their streaming network. If they did it on a disc, I'd take issue with it, but channels and networks have always censored content. It's nothing new. I'd prefer they didn't, but I wouldn't call this particularly outrageous.
It was Disney not Criterion
Dissent is essential. We are too polarized. We need to find common ground. Thank you sir 🙏🏼
Please release the whole interview :)
Great to hear BEE. We can do a non/cancel culture ... yes, we can!
Like what's going on in Texas and Florida? Cancel culture is not exclusive to any political ideology.
What's going on in Texas and Florida is the silencing of minority voices and re-writing of history, Book Banning, which has increased 1,100% since 2020 needs to be left in 1933 Germany, not 2023 America.
I don't think he's asserting that. However, creatives have a lot more pressure from their own peers than they do from hysterical southern bible bashers who have no industry power at all.
@@shenanigans3710 Creatives do tend to over inflate their sense of self importance.
@@deepashtray5605 Of course! Look at the writers and painters putting out statements on Israel, like anyone cares what they think. This is one reason, I'm certain, that they love nothing better than attacking their own. It's one of the very few areas of life where they can make a tangible impact - blackballing someone because they have supposedly "problematic" views on a particular issue gives them a real power rush.
By this, I assume that you're referring to the ridiculous hysteria over state-imposed books about graphic sexual encounters in children's libraries? Nothing was cancelled there. Those books are widely available in adult libraries, retailers and online for anyone who wants to see them.
But if you want to call teaching 5 year old Timmy about butt fucking multiple men in one night, then by all means, do it.
I like this a lot.
I think there's a generational thing going on and he's right: that a lot of young people are trying to use the power of the lynch mob to choose what issues to support or scratch and that it is often done as virtue signalling rather than being an issue of significance. It is far better to openly discuss issues than to try to make them disappear or ban them. Censorship in the name of protecting overly-sensitive feelings seems like a step in the wrong direction. Hopefully cancel culture was just a fleeting fashion and sense will rear its head in due course.
You are wrong and his example about black people is incredibly racist
Anazing Writer Like no other !
This whole uproar about cancel culture is nonsense.
They used to call it a boycott and it was what you did to avoid and discourage unethical, dangerous, disingenuous, people and companies.
If your buddy wants to give another right wing fascist a pulpit at Simon and huckster, so he can quell his curiosity and make a buck, that’s his prerogative. If others find it objectionable and don’t buy the book that’s their prerogative.
Not sure how him being gay somehow gives him a pass and by the way he’s sill punching down.
The media in our country has been consolidated and basically controls the dialog in its content for both sides, and people want to piss and moan about cancel culture. It’s Pathetic, and anyone up in arms about it is a sucker.
define 'dangerous.'
We should be cancelling the minority and tell them to fuck off. Meanwhile youtube censors comments like this.
@@chrisquinn9104 sad Lidl sin bin panto
At what people did he say or use his gayness as a pass?
How is he punching down?
The point being made is should a central government or media control what is said? Is that acceptable in a free society? You seem to think that's OK and take it for granted, so for you, you like things controlled and sanctioned, but many (if not most) don't.
Doja Cat being his example killed me
The art of discussion and debate with people of other opinions is becoming...lost.
Okay but I'd argue there was always only a small percentage of the population capable of doing debate on any one topic and it remains so today. If the problem is witch-hunting and dog-piling then the people contributing valuable pieces of information just gets drowned out. Even this interview with BEE is just an obvious platitude that people shouldn't need to hear but the lack of cultural centers and intellectual curiosity is directly caused by social media companies training people to offer lukewarm and virtue signaling opinions every night and day of our dwindling existence! Now is this a problem that can't be overcome? In some ways I think we are culturally cooked but I think in this case people just need to step back from letting social media govern so much of their literal existence and thoughts. Read the opinions of people you disagree with! God forbid we critique things on our own. It's incredibly easy to find holes in opinions these days because everything is based off of outrage and engagement.
It would be great if excellent writers like Mr. Ellis would show up at school board meetings where mental midgets are busy forbidding books to give the people and children threatened by this nuttery some backup.
it is sad that lack of free speech is one of the few things the left and right agree on
Are you kidding??? Bret is a Right Winger, now. It's Right Wing Republicans who are banning books!! He supports a party that bans books and is anti-gay just to say he's "anti-woke." I would say he votes against his own interests, but he doesn't bother to vote or educate himself on any issues. His entire existence is watching porn, cooking shows, and going to dinner at expensive restaurants ... a pitiful existence, really, a total waste.
What he said is incredibly racist
As long as he also does it for cases where conservatives lose their shit over books about LGBTQ people or racism. Conservatives have been some of the biggest crybaby hypocrites for cancel culture because they need to assert a certain patriarchal/white view of the world instead of introducing people of diverse backgrounds from a young age so kids can make up their own minds.
There is no "intensity" to cancel culture anymore. I couldn't even tell you the last person who was "canceled". And it was never about power. It's about social media. It doesn't require anything to call out a person or a company, and if enough people do it, it creates a controversy. It's pretty simple, and its danger is overstated.
Can't wait to get home and turn on my Doja Cat Rap CD.
Prurience in arts that he alludes to is only one side to cancel culture, which emerged primarily in relation to sexual assaults and still is an important aspect of high profile people being cancelled. Whether it's right to fully cancel someone for these convictions once justice served is another issue. But I think both these main aspects should be mentioned and separated as much as possible, as often a generic retaliation against 'cancel culture' is used as a kind of defacto cry in defence of abuses of power for sexual gain. i.e. taking advantage of the unclear definition of this term, and muddying the waters even further.
I agree with his sentiment even though I have found most of his literature very disturbing and morally ambivalent, it's very focused on the Benjamins
And the dead end in every 🎉
Pretty much all my favourite authors got banned or prosecuted at some point. Whitman, Bret, Burroughs, Cubby Selby.
I don't agree with anything he says yet i enjoy listening to him speak.
Which part do you disagree with and why?
Ok, yes and no on Mr. Ellis's point about Cancel Culture: Is it bad and anti-human- you betcha, but to say scrap it, and on the daily instead let leaders of corporations say my way or the highway is just as bad and anti-human. People spend A LOT of their time and energy at work. And their work feeds the functioning of the world. So yes, we need conversation- but we also need POWER, and that POWER doesn't need to rest in the hands of a few corporate CEOs OR in a groupthink mob. POWER needs to be shared; it can't be given, it must be respected.
He's not saying do away with accountability - that and cancel culture are distinct. The power should never be done because of someone's subjective emotions. It's clear here that he is saying power should be shared, part of that is letting us as adults make our own choices about what we can see and watch.
Imagine if he wrote American Psycho in the 2020s. Thank you BEE for speaking out against this evil anticulture Cancel mafia. You, along with Bukowski, Selby jr and Ellroy are my favorite modern writers. Thank goodness you all wrote before this sh'tf*ckery cancel mess.
Love shards. Thanks for being awake
He's not awake.
Well said.
Asinine. Everyone is free to say no to Cancel culture, just like everyone else is free to say no to listening to certain people/voices. As to S&S, it’s important for democracy that the people who make a business run have a say in what gets made
This is legit the craziest thing I've ever read. The guy sweeping the floors at nasa gets to modify the rocket? No, just no.
Everybody vote and don't just agree with people and comment.
This whole interview is grossly decontextualized Does our art and media not have real life repercussions?
i bet this man is on datalounge.
Bret looks like priest in some way haha
You forgot to mention Mark Twain.
🙏🏻
Winston''s job in George Orwell's Nineteen Eighty-Four was the continual editing of archived media to fit the current narrative.
I love Bret. He’s brilliant.
The fact that he admits he's the wrong person to ask about this at the end should have signaled to the interviewer and producers that this content is not even worth posting, especially considering that it will likely distract from anything of substance he might have said in the rest of the interview. You'd think a professional writer would be able to articulate a more compelling argument against something as dumb as cancel culture than "I don't like it" or "that worries me," but he doesn't, so why post it, except to get more views? Click-baiting and cancel culture are both ingredients in a politically toxic stew, and it's sad to see Louisiana Channel serving it.
Quite the opposite. I think someone who admits they they don't have all the answers and are uncomfortable being turned into a mouthpiece is showing a degree of rationality and, more importantly, humility that is totally lacking in an online discourse that rewards the opposite.
I think @shenanigans3710 makes an excellent point here. There is certainly 'substance' in acknowledging what you don't have the answers to and hopefully this excerpt encourages more objective and nuanced thinking among its viewers.
What are you doing ?Why musts Louisiana channel be slammed for this... They are fairly non-censured publishing all kinds of "strange" opinions - from voodoo to "I am to great for this world"...
Is he the only writer of note saying this? Comedians are leagues ahead of artists on this topic, if the people given status of art income are really the artists.
preach it.
100% right
Literally are you serious? With what he said about black people?… you agree with that
Did he say anything? Like who is this man?
Omg did he just compare a racist using the Nword to black people using it in defense of the racist? Did he really just insinuate that it’s a double standard that it’s used in rap music by black people. This is so incredibly out of touch
No, he didn't say that. That would be different than a movie character in a well made movie using it as a realistic depiction of what that person would have said at the time. I guess that distinction was lost on you in your hurry to show how "in touch" you are but thanks for your reactionary virtue signalling. No credits due.
💯👏
big feelings going on here, big spots on the sleeve, passionate, he does it again, he snapped his fingers and had those 300 heads on a silver platter, LET HIM, we have to let him, it's about power, it's about context, it's about integrity, walk with me, how long do you think these old fellas are gonna last without the jokes?, let him dish out the punishments, he listens to rap, let him listen, to Doja Cat, under the covers, just a big guy listening to his favorite tunes, little special word, ah yeah, it’s about context, you don’t believe me??, look, look at him right there, he's doing it right now, there's one airpod in his non-visible ear blasting Doja into his system, this is how he stays large, at large, he can't be defending freedom without the tunes
Look at the images that come up when you google this man. Literally speaks for itself
Beautiful.
lol ok what does he know exactly though
Thankfully, I don’t take seriously the things people say while wearing sweat pants.
Thankfully they don’t care what you think either.
😂sweats r very comfortable. Ur nuts
This reeks of a person with vast privilege who is unwilling to do the work to understand the context in which their privilege exists. Been trolling and trying to "trigger" millennials for so long that he has become an irrelevant sensationalist voice. He carries this nauseating confidence based of past successes but is ultimately quite rigid, frail and predictable. Out of the public eye? Loosing relevance? Release a controversial statement that the Guardian will pick up and chalk it up to "trolling" later. I enjoy the insight that the artists on Louisiana Channel provide into their own process but given the current state of the world posting a video of an old white dude talking about cancel culture seems a bit tone deaf and out of touch.
I'm an immigrant and have lived within marginalised communities for most of my life. And I believe in absolute free speech. People who have been tested by life and have faced true adversity are not triggered by another individuals opinion.
@@mimad4923 You're conflating two things. Being an immigrant, living in marginalized communities, and facing adversity doesn't have much to do with this mans ability to not see past his own ego. In fact i'd say that this bootstrap mentality (that the more adversity you face and the harder you work the more you are able to deal with things that life throws at you and thus will achieve more success) that we are forced to adopt in marginalized communities actually dulls our senses to things that we should be outraged about. Free speech only extends so far as another persons rights. It is definitely a essential part of society but If free speech fuels and further proliferates hatred and bigotry (like it is allowed to do on social media and there internet) then it is no longer free speech.
@@wedthree facing adversity and carrying bucket-loads of trauma is not something people choose to do, it is something that people are forced to do. And I believe that, yes, those who have had to deal with a lot, are often more driven, empathic, resilient and grounded than those who have never had to fight for their right to even just survive. However, that doesn't mean that someone who hasn't experienced my trauma is not allowed to speak on the topic. I don't have to agree with them and heck, I don't even have to like what they say - but that shouldn't mean that they immediately need to stop expressing their views. If we all stop talking in fear of offending someone, where will we be?! If someone is choosing to use negative rhetoric in order to convey their opinions, that's on them. In fact, I think it just reflects back on who they are as a person and its plain for all to see.
Not sure he's lost relevance? Latest book has been very well received. His points are valid regarding outrage culture.
No one has more privilege than the trust fund hipsters who write the columns you pretend are your own ideas. Absurd combination of insecurity, pretentiousness, self indoctrination and trying way too hard to identify with a responsibility free victim class thre sport. Give it a rest.
This is either deliberately disingenuous or he is that isolated from the reality of the world in totality that anything beyond soft furnishings and nice light is an inconvenience.
He’s absolutely right
No it’s actually people who are quick to be offended by everything that are, more often than not, the ones who are isolated from the reality of the world. People who are truly suffering from racism for example are probably not the ones stewing about offensive language in a movie. They’re too busy living with it and dealing with it, and more often than not, they seem to realize the difference between reality and movies. Ellis is making a very nuanced point about censorship within the realm of art.
You didn't say anything there? No really that was totally devoid of substance and this retort in turn is by it's very nature of no substance
@@cpanczakWRONG
@@matthewrocca4197Wrong ... but thanks for your thoughts on racism, Privileged White Male
It's funny because when they cancel someone or something, the other side does the same to them...they really do not like it! lol