I would love to see a video of you taking the injectors for flow testing, maybe cylinder1 was bit lean?. Should you get separate egt sensors for each cylinder to monitor temps? And by the way, your m5x content is the best in all of youtube, I always look forward to your new video, keep up the good work man!!
Thank you! I will be testing the injectors in a later video with some more thoughts on this topic. Individual EGTs would be awesome but I am limited in what I am willing to invest in this car. I feel at these ~420hp levels I shouldnt need all this fancy instrumentation
Hydro lock if rev limiter is cut spark and no fuel cut,so it accumulates. i know that you can disable fuel and spark separately at different RPM to soften the power cut or promote turbo spool. Cylinder 1 is the reference for spark and fuel,knowing it's quite rich and E85 have 30 % more volume when stochiometric in the combustion chamber,you could think a too retarded ignition timing could cause hydrolock. Also a loose chain can also shake or cause interference between parts when you gain spark back after a rev limiter.
All great points! This failure wasnt on the rev limiter like the first one was thats where I am struggling. Several misfires in a row could maybe flood that cylinder out, I could see that a more likely cause
@@spankranchgarage The first piston broke under the ring grooves. Rings buckle if the ring gap of a NA engine is too small for boosted application. Piston crown will always fly up,pushed by the rings.
I’ve blown 3 engines (2 oil pump failures, 1 ringland) Got sick of rebuilding the bottoms end and I went JE pistons with eagle rods and have had good luck at 500hp
Lean cylinder or possible detonation? Destroyed piston at wrist pin, slung it into open intake valves next rev and then out the bottom where pin got lodged in pump? Check the injector and maybe cylinder for scar of pinched ring or something? If you can make it out from collateral damage.
All good points. I will test injectors. These rings were gapped and I go very conservative (loose) on those. This was only the second run of the (cool) night, I dont think heat was a factor here. This engine was running fantastic in Alabama where I was hot lapping non stop
I feel like you’re right at that sweet spot of power level that the engine can tolerate it, but certainly conditions might test that or fatigue it. A lot of the euro guys love the amp44/maxpp rod combo. They’re making 600+ in aluminum blocks for right around $1100 for pistons and rods. Wouldn’t be a bad idea to throw in new injectors (or at least check yours) fresh fuel filter and maybe even some fresh fuel just to eliminate the easiest and probably cheapest possibility.
the wrist pin having enough momentum to lodge itself into the oil pump would lead me to believe the piston itself let go first. i would flow test the INJ for sure. lmk if you want that m52
Spank-Ranch Build this block back on a budget replace the valves weld up the block, use the dremel tools and remove the burrs Replace the stock piston Rod And my only advise is to keep this low budget just install forged pistons with a lower compression You’re moving right into winter so welding that block up and showing the non believers it can be fixed and rip around the track once more will allow you to win the internet Showing how to face adversity and beat it And at the same time you find another engine to tinker with you can just drop in within 2 hrs if you find yourself really needing to use it
Man I love where your head is at with that! It would be super cool to fix this one. Unfortunately time is my most valuable asset right now. I cant afford to play around like that but I wish I could
Most likely the first cylinder had something in wrong proportion and as a consequence piston got out. Could it be the piston overheating? Is it possible that first fuel injector provide fuel not quite enough for that kind of high output load?
I will test the injectors and see whats up. Anything is possible. The thing about that is I would expect that problem to show up when things are hotter (The engine and the weather). This was a cool night and only the second lap, things werent smoking hot yet.
I think the piston broke defenitely these m50 rods are nearly indestructible, cast pistons are just not up to constant abuse in my opinion unless u running half bar boost, but it could also be a megasquirt problem aswell, id defenitely go forged pistons on my next m50 build, not worth the hassle
on a serious note, did it feel faster? maybe wastegate line failed and over boost broke the rod, otherwise the only thing i see causing that is hydro lock
It didnt feel any faster. I do have boost cut configured and working. Ive had this engine up at 480whp ~18psi before where it runs out of fuel pump and she didnt seem too upset. But who knows. I think these 28 year old pistons are tired of this stuff.
@@spankranchgarage yeah certainly so. I forgot you have a real ecu with boost cut and not ms41. I would definitely say it’s possible your old megasquirt could’ve hung an injector open due to a failing driver? Fuel locked it and cause it to let go. Or like you were saying, spark cut is violent and those old ecus are a constant cut so it’ll always be cyl 1 getting a cut. Could’ve made the piston crack and just blow its load out the bottom.
I think the piston let go again. Maybe it isn't just one thing. Could cylinder 1 be slightly lean causing more heat on the piston to the point where it expands enough to prevent the wrist pin from rotating smoothly then since the casting it weak it pulls away from the rod and it takes itself apart from there. If you didn't have gapped rings you would probably see the piston fail differently from the same scenario. Maybe all this stuff is just getting old, who knows.
Good points. Injector testing will tell some of that story I hope. The strange thing is this was a cool night and only my second lap. I was burying the temp gauge in alabama hot lapping in hotter weather for 2 days without an issue.
if it was your tune, youd have lost a piston conventionally. melted a hole through it until you lost compression sorta stuff. Sudden catastrophic failure is prob rod. 420hp aint much though, rpm is mean to things regardless of power, i dunno how many rs you r'in
I only spin it to 6750RPM. This failure was in a very high torque zone maybe 5K rpm or so, I wasnt on the limiter. This engine did see potentially hours of rev-limit time previous to this failure however. Id expect the road race guys that sustain very high RPM would see these failures more often but they dont seem to
Hmmm. You are right to be looking for a root cause. Multiple engines same outcome. Time to have a serious look at your tuning. These engines don't grenade under 500 unless you are part of the problem.
I am thinking about that... But what in the tune could cause this? Its batch injection/Waste spark. Nothing is cylinder specific. Plus the first engine ran for 8 years at that power level before blowing... this one only 2 years. I would expect a tuning issue to rear its head much sooner.
@@spankranchgarage Damned if I know what's causing the issue. You have an issue that is accumulating over time. Pulling the head and inspecting each season might give you a clue as to what is going on. I don't know if you are accumulating damage from lean condition or overreving or some combination of other shit that is inducing wear until failure. You need to open the next engine up to look for clues before it blow up.
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that pump with that wrist pin belongs in a museum lmao
I would love to see a video of you taking the injectors for flow testing, maybe cylinder1 was bit lean?. Should you get separate egt sensors for each cylinder to monitor temps? And by the way, your m5x content is the best in all of youtube, I always look forward to your new video, keep up the good work man!!
Thank you! I will be testing the injectors in a later video with some more thoughts on this topic. Individual EGTs would be awesome but I am limited in what I am willing to invest in this car. I feel at these ~420hp levels I shouldnt need all this fancy instrumentation
Hydro lock if rev limiter is cut spark and no fuel cut,so it accumulates.
i know that you can disable fuel and spark separately at different RPM to soften the power cut or promote turbo spool.
Cylinder 1 is the reference for spark and fuel,knowing it's quite rich and E85 have 30 % more volume when stochiometric in the combustion chamber,you could think a too retarded ignition timing could cause hydrolock.
Also a loose chain can also shake or cause interference between parts when you gain spark back after a rev limiter.
All great points! This failure wasnt on the rev limiter like the first one was thats where I am struggling. Several misfires in a row could maybe flood that cylinder out, I could see that a more likely cause
@@spankranchgarage The first piston broke under the ring grooves.
Rings buckle if the ring gap of a NA engine is too small for boosted application.
Piston crown will always fly up,pushed by the rings.
That drift clip in the beginning was incredible
I’ve blown 3 engines (2 oil pump failures, 1 ringland) Got sick of rebuilding the bottoms end and I went JE pistons with eagle rods and have had good luck at 500hp
Lean cylinder or possible detonation? Destroyed piston at wrist pin, slung it into open intake valves next rev and then out the bottom where pin got lodged in pump? Check the injector and maybe cylinder for scar of pinched ring or something? If you can make it out from collateral damage.
All good points. I will test injectors. These rings were gapped and I go very conservative (loose) on those. This was only the second run of the (cool) night, I dont think heat was a factor here. This engine was running fantastic in Alabama where I was hot lapping non stop
I feel like you’re right at that sweet spot of power level that the engine can tolerate it, but certainly conditions might test that or fatigue it. A lot of the euro guys love the amp44/maxpp rod combo. They’re making 600+ in aluminum blocks for right around $1100 for pistons and rods. Wouldn’t be a bad idea to throw in new injectors (or at least check yours) fresh fuel filter and maybe even some fresh fuel just to eliminate the easiest and probably cheapest possibility.
Ill test the injectors for sure. Maybe just maybe ill drain the tank for the new engine lol.
the wrist pin having enough momentum to lodge itself into the oil pump would lead me to believe the piston itself let go first. i would flow test the INJ for sure. lmk if you want that m52
Was definitely going to say the same thing !!!!
110% that piston let go first when the bottom end of the rod is fine
Yeah ill hit you up about that spare motor
Spank-Ranch Build this block back on a budget replace the valves weld up the block, use the dremel tools and remove the burrs
Replace the stock piston Rod
And my only advise is to keep this low budget just install forged pistons with a lower compression
You’re moving right into winter so welding that block up and showing the non believers it can be fixed and rip around the track once more will allow you to win the internet Showing how to face adversity and beat it
And at the same time you find another engine to tinker with you can just drop in within 2 hrs if you find yourself really needing to use it
Man I love where your head is at with that! It would be super cool to fix this one. Unfortunately time is my most valuable asset right now. I cant afford to play around like that but I wish I could
Haha that video with the chain slapping is hilarious.
I’d say forged piston and oem non vanos rods to keep a budget
Wow I was NOT expecting you to say (and show) it still ran after that carnage lol. Wild!
Yup! Isnt that crazy?
Agreed, Cyl 1 probably went lean and melted piston.
Most likely the first cylinder had something in wrong proportion and as a consequence piston got out. Could it be the piston overheating? Is it possible that first fuel injector provide fuel not quite enough for that kind of high output load?
I will test the injectors and see whats up. Anything is possible. The thing about that is I would expect that problem to show up when things are hotter (The engine and the weather). This was a cool night and only the second lap, things werent smoking hot yet.
new favorite youtuber
Definitely time for some bad boy pistons
I think thats the plan!
I think the piston broke defenitely these m50 rods are nearly indestructible, cast pistons are just not up to constant abuse in my opinion unless u running half bar boost, but it could also be a megasquirt problem aswell, id defenitely go forged pistons on my next m50 build, not worth the hassle
I agree with you. These pistons only put up with so much abuse before they call it quits
commented before the video was over. with the 350hp setup it sounds like you need to copy and paste my stock ecu setup
on a serious note, did it feel faster? maybe wastegate line failed and over boost broke the rod, otherwise the only thing i see causing that is hydro lock
It didnt feel any faster. I do have boost cut configured and working. Ive had this engine up at 480whp ~18psi before where it runs out of fuel pump and she didnt seem too upset. But who knows. I think these 28 year old pistons are tired of this stuff.
@@spankranchgarage yeah certainly so. I forgot you have a real ecu with boost cut and not ms41. I would definitely say it’s possible your old megasquirt could’ve hung an injector open due to a failing driver? Fuel locked it and cause it to let go. Or like you were saying, spark cut is violent and those old ecus are a constant cut so it’ll always be cyl 1 getting a cut. Could’ve made the piston crack and just blow its load out the bottom.
Forged internals and more boost! That turbo should flow damn near 500hp. Let her eat
I think the piston let go again. Maybe it isn't just one thing. Could cylinder 1 be slightly lean causing more heat on the piston to the point where it expands enough to prevent the wrist pin from rotating smoothly then since the casting it weak it pulls away from the rod and it takes itself apart from there. If you didn't have gapped rings you would probably see the piston fail differently from the same scenario. Maybe all this stuff is just getting old, who knows.
Good points. Injector testing will tell some of that story I hope. The strange thing is this was a cool night and only my second lap. I was burying the temp gauge in alabama hot lapping in hotter weather for 2 days without an issue.
AMP 44 are good but there have been difficulties getting them because of the war since they are made in Russia.
if it was your tune, youd have lost a piston conventionally. melted a hole through it until you lost compression sorta stuff. Sudden catastrophic failure is prob rod. 420hp aint much though, rpm is mean to things regardless of power, i dunno how many rs you r'in
I only spin it to 6750RPM. This failure was in a very high torque zone maybe 5K rpm or so, I wasnt on the limiter. This engine did see potentially hours of rev-limit time previous to this failure however. Id expect the road race guys that sustain very high RPM would see these failures more often but they dont seem to
Needs more beer
Hmmm. You are right to be looking for a root cause. Multiple engines same outcome. Time to have a serious look at your tuning. These engines don't grenade under 500 unless you are part of the problem.
I am thinking about that... But what in the tune could cause this? Its batch injection/Waste spark. Nothing is cylinder specific. Plus the first engine ran for 8 years at that power level before blowing... this one only 2 years. I would expect a tuning issue to rear its head much sooner.
@@spankranchgarage Damned if I know what's causing the issue. You have an issue that is accumulating over time. Pulling the head and inspecting each season might give you a clue as to what is going on. I don't know if you are accumulating damage from lean condition or overreving or some combination of other shit that is inducing wear until failure. You need to open the next engine up to look for clues before it blow up.
No ATI harmonic damper. Is my guess.
В следующем видео, говори по-русски, простоя плохо понимаю английский.
💂
I wish I could speak Russian!
jz and link ecu :D
HMMMMMM. Need more beers to think about that...