In summary, a 308 is still going to put a hole in a deer from 300m away. I'm pretty happy with that. Honestly, rifle calibre know it alls are among the biggest flogs in the known universe 🙄
So according to you .308 sucks at a very particular niche (Deer hunting at 300m+) Which we know it is more than good enough at given the right choice of projectile. It is still easier to reload, more available and cheaper to purchase than any of the newer more fandangled cartridges out there but will kill 90% of Australian game and vermin with authority. Split the difference and use the money you save on .308 to become a better shooter. And you will find the cartridge becomes magically more lethal.
I have used the 308Win for 57 years for Whitetail Deer and feral hogs and it has been highly effective and very affordable and practical. Ammo is readily available and generally at a lower price point as are components WORLDWIDE including rural and isolated places. Killed innumerable deer with the majority bang flops with a high shoulder shot. 308Win also is appreciated for a longer barrel life than overbored calibers. I acknowledge that my terrain lends itself to close in shots and 250 to 300 yards in my locale would be for me long range.....so I fully understand your affinity for the 7mm Rem Mag and similar. If I hunted in open country I would probably change my tune. I like the economy of the 308 for my personal situation.
Well said bill. This guy spends too much time pawing over the ballistic charts. Your 250 - 300 yds is the max ''Ethical"range he eludes to anyway so the 308 dose the business. This nonsense reminds me of sitting around a fishing camp debating the best line and hooks to use. Hating a particular calibre? Weird.
Sorry man, it’s the Toyota aurion on the cartridge world, more than good enough for general use, inexpensive and reliable, nothing fancy, nothing super powerful or outstanding, but can surprise a lot of people that doubt it.
You make some good points when looking at the numbers at range but i personally have to smile when i hear the minimum suggested energy needed for some game, 1500ftp for elk/sambar and 1000ftp for deer is 70's American gun magazine fluff to sell the idea you need more guns and way more power than whats actually needed but "i get it", Sometimes you have to take a shot at a bad angle or through scrub and being over gunned may help, i dont know about you but i shoot shit with a big magnum in a hunting weight rifle compared to a standard cartridge? I do contract shooting as work and very rarely do i have to use anything bigger than 223rem and find the 308win to much often passing right through most game like fellow deer at typical range chest shots. The 308win its a really useful cartridge with a good maximum point blank range on bigger game, with its small powder capacity and large calibre you get good speed from a short barrel with only a little more recoil in a hunting weight rifle than tests show most shooters groups start to open up at. If i was shooting long range then yes a muzzle braked long barrel heavyweight rifle in a bigger, faster, higher bc calibre would be better but the all important good shot placement is harder to get at long range. Cheers Daryl
Thanks for the comment. Are you doing pest control or meat production? Because all the guys I've ever known who do it take headshots only (with 223 of course). Kinetic energy is a good benchmark, especially for those who are new to hunting and do not fully understand terminal ballistics. To be clear though, I'm using 1500J, which is 1100ft/lbs. Bullet construction and placement will always be king, but those who want 'an answer at a glance', energy levels give a means to comparing cartridges without all the extra fluff.
@fhuckoutdoors hey mate, sorry for not seeing your reply, I haven't done any harvest type shooting but I know a few guys that do and yep they take headshots as often as possible. I manly do culling work so I can shoot for the head or body. I use a few air and rimfire rifles mainly and a 223 rem for nearly everything else up to fellow deer and pigs. Large pigs are the toughest animal I come across so I use monolithic projectiles on them with the 223 or if I have to be quiet 308 subs are good inside 150 meters. There was a contract shoot for horses in vic last year that stipulated 30cal minimum and I found the barns ttsx 150grn would pass through braking both shoulders if inside 200 meters using the 308. I don't think the 308 is the be all and end all cartridge but the 308 is a powerfull and versatile round letting you load lightweight 3200+fps loads to heavy 200grn+ subs for quiet culling. I've found the projectile type much more important than the cartridge it's fired from. Cheers Daryl Webb
You preface this saying hunting circumstances. How often are you shooting deer past 100m? I exclusively hunt public land, no private access. I've never taken a deer past 100m. Infact, it's usually 30-50m. I use the 130gr TTSX from my 20" barrel @ 3050fps. Never lost a Sambar. If your a shit shot I suppose big cals are beneficial 🤣
With in 300 yards their not a lick of deifference between any of those rounds. If your range is 300 or less 308 is a awesome rouind and here in the east in the US thats a dam good round. If i were planing on shooting past 300 on a regular basis id use a flatter shooting round. Of the rounds you had listed the only 1 i might consider would be the 270 win but even then id most likely use a different round. I dont typicaly shoot past 300 so for me its a moot point at best. It really depends on what your wanting to do with the round and at what distance you want to hunt. In 308 i dont go above 165 grain but thats just me. Personaly my fav round is the 30-06 wich ive been useing for over 50 years. Yes i do use the 308 as well wich is more than enough with in 300 yard. Also 1 of the nice thing about 308 where i live it was the only and i do mean only center fire round you could find during that dam covid lock down they did. I understand why some dont like the 308 and somedo, Personaly id perfer the 7-08 over any of those you listed when it comes to those short rounds.
Interesting that you guys ran out of .308 over there. Here in Canada 308 was about the only thing I could ever find on the shelves, seemed to be the only ammo that was being produced in enough quantities that it would stay on the shelves longer than a day.
@@Marcus-jg4jb Thanks for your response, mostly just curious how the laws differ around the world. We're (Aus) pretty much restricted to what we can reasonably justify using in a 12 month period.
@@FerventReminder Interesting, that's wild. Here in Canada with regards to 'non-restricted' (hunting rifles and shotguns, essentially) once we have our licences we're mostly left on our own. I looked it up and I think we're able to store up to 225 kilograms of propellant, or the associated amount of ammo. So we technically have a limit, but not a practical one.
@@Marcus-jg4jb Damn, that's a hell of a lot more than us haha. I think we can have 5kg of propellant too--not sure if there's any interplay there with the aforementioned 12 month supply limit.
People, they all work! Shoot what you shoot best. I have personally been killing whitetails for a long time with the 308win. But I like others as well, like the (oh my shit) 22-250 of which I have killed a lot of deer with it too.
I agree with you that you should use what you shoot best. But please understand that Sambar deer, which I refer to in this video, are more comparable in size to Elk than Whitetail.
Been watching a few of your videos lately. Just curious, 2 years ago or so you pretty much praised the 308 in your 30 cal deer rifle video. Is that only because out of all available 30cal choices you think the 308 is best? Or back at that stage did you actually like 308 more than these other cartridges or didnt have enough experience with them? I shoot 308, got 2 of them and still think its great. Theres no point me moving to something else like 6.5 or 7mm08 as im already setup with 308. Knowing what I know now I probably wouldnt have chosen the 308 and would have gone with a 270 or 7mm08
I often recommend 308 to beginners because it's a fairly decent all around cartridge and great to learn marksmanship principles. What I tried to outline in this video is that it is outdone by pretty much every other cartridge out there. Lots of people claim it to be much better than it is, which is what actually annoys me... not the cartridge itself.
I don't mind the 308, yeah it drops like a stone but I've learnt to use it, it's really good in the scrub for pigs with heavy bullets. I don't think the deer really care if there hit by a 308 probably because there dead lol , A mate once said to me 9mm is a girls gun but in reality if you were hit by one it would likely be the last time you'd call it girly, hypothetically of course.
The 308 is like the equivalent of a toothy blowie. Yeah it's still a blowie but there's better out there. I would own one if I lived in bum fuck nowhere where the post office is also the gun shop, grocery shop, pub and brothel and didn't hand load because most places you can get projectiles and brass sent to your door. My go-to has always been 30-06 which was my first centrefire but will be using the 257 weatherby from now on as I'm not shooting massive deer but still have the a better option to turn to than the 308 if the opportunity pokes its head up to have a stab at a large red or sambar. Bloody good video mate!
I think the 243 is the best calibre because there’s not a ton of drop on it and it has enough power for deer in England but what are your thoughts on the 270 and 277 fury
308 works really well where I’m at biggest game. We hunt generally is Whitetail. If not, blackbear. You can have a shorter barrel, which is perfect for a Deerstand and it has plenty of knock down. I hardly ever see any 7 mm. 30.30 308 30.06 is the bread and butter.
*gets out the popcorn* 7RM - Testicles the size of tennis balls 300WM - Testicles the size of basketballs. QED 300WM is superior because I’m incredibly insecure in my masculinity.
Hey mate, I appreciate this a lot, especially as someone who’s new to hunting. I have a 308 and I enjoy it, but what company does a good rifle in 7mm, cheers man!
@@TheDECKFISH yep, I have a 7mm rem mag Tikka and its very accurate. I have not had the chance to drop anything with it yet but depending on how you handle recoil it would be best to try a few different loads to see which you like best. 155g works for me control wise.
@@TheDECKFISH like 3006 for me, I used 175g winchester 7mm and that was harsh, 155g is a nice place, but then again when there is a deer in front of you there really is no felt recoil as excitement takes over 🤣. Just depends how much you want to shoot at the range.
🇦🇺😎👍Every time I brought a new caliber people would say it was shit . So what I did was buy their caliber until the next person came along and said that’s shit 🤣and on and on and on🤣. . All sorted now 😎👍. He who buys the most calibers wins🏁Happy Sunday big fella🦘
I have a friend like that, always saying the Colt AR-15 in .223/5.56 is the best because that is what he owns. My response is it isn't effective for whitetail deer or black bear.
I use a 7mm magnum the farthest a deer has gone was maybe ten feet except one that ran downhill. I hunt public land so I don't want a deer running very far that is why I use the 7mm magnum. I think the farthest I have shot a deer was maybe fifty yards the closest was twenty feet away so trees get in the way and I have to basically walk up to the deer or a couple times had a bucket I sat on.
I get quality 270 and 3006 ammo cheaper than 308 at the moment. Decent 308 ammo still hasn't come back to my local shop after the CoVID fiasco. I prefer my .270 anyway I can stretch it out and still guarantee it will knock over whatever I'm aiming at.
308 is a 200yard timber round. Stop putting it ware its not ment to shine. The 308 hammers deer 200 and in. Especially good at 50 to 150 yards in the timber. Stacks of ammo in every shop in every good made. 308 rocks in the north east
You must be America. Sambar deer here in Australia are closer in size to Elk than your white tails... yet people here still think its good enough out to 5-600m. I agree with you, 308 is great for close range stuff.
@@fhckoutdoors yes i'm an American . north east, I disagree when people try to put the 308 up against long range calibers for comparison. It's capable of going long. But It's not ware 308 shines. I flip big 200 lb plus, whitetails over every year w a 308 . I use federal terminal accent ammo. Love that loading. But Im in the timber ware 75yards is a long shot In Here. That's ware 308 shines. Close range stalking
Checked out your video a couple of years ago on best 30 calibre rounds for Sambar, and the 308 seemed pretty capable….especially up to 300m which is as far as I’d shoot. So I bought one, and now you hate it! 😢
@@fhckoutdoorsthat is because all any Americans shoot now is 223 which if 308 is to weak for deer then whadaya tell the whole Lotta people who use 223
@@dawkinschmidt7053 For starters, 223 is not deer legal in many Australian states. And for the states that have no minimum deer caliber, I would say 223 is not ideal.
Awesome video again mate, ex Army and only shot 5.56 and 7.62 so just had .223 and .308 because that's what I thought was best. Good break down of the actual science.
Had a 308 didn’t mind it, sold it to a mate who had a buggered shoulder, have a 30-06 and a 300win mag and love them both… have been considering something 7mm
Reasons I hate the 308? Add on...cos ya can. The perfect round is... all of them. Worst round is...all of them. Whole road train full of yeah but variables so in the end, it doesn't matter cos some do some things better than others. Ideally I'd have one or two of everything & it'd matter even less. Two thumbs up.
Well then. Maybe I shouldn't have shot my last deer at 450y with factory hornady 150gr sst. Because the internet told me I couldn't. 🤷♂️ Was a terrible heart shot.
Never once in the video did I say you can't shoot a deer with 308. In fact I said it's very possible and gave examples. I just outlined that there are better cartridges out there.
I'm a .308 shooter but agree it's not the absolute best out there, I settled on it purely because my gun shop always has heaps of reloading components for it and a lot of rifle choices in .308 (I have limited access to only one gun shop). Even my longest cross gully shots at Sambar Stags have been with in my personal ethical range of 300m and have always recovered the animal. As a hand loader I find it very forgiving with powder charges and powder types as opposed to my old 300WM and 270W and the accuracy doesn't go to shit as easily. I use 150g without any obvious problems really. Also 308 tends to be less effected by barrel length according to my chrono. Ps. 308 does feel a bit boring compared to other stuff out there and I can't brag about it around the camp fire.😢
For me it’s really familiarity due to my time in the service as an Infantryman having copious amounts of LFX’s and just getting inoculated to these two commonly used calibers (5.56mm - 7.62mm) within the military.. It’s time for me to get out of my comfort zone and choose something different 🦌
@@fhckoutdoors Ha - no worries, mate. If it's quality hunting ammo it probably all works fine anyway; in my experience, choice of bullet matters a lot more than choice of cartridge (within reason) at typical hunting ranges.
@@mikegreen2214 Oh I definitely agree with that. These ballistic videos are all the rage at the moment, but terminal ballistics is far more applicable. I've got some videos coming out about that too.
@@fhckoutdoors Ha, for sure. It's like that with any hobby that involves gear; some people form extremely-strong opinions about specifications despite not really understanding the relevance or whether it even means anything in a given situation. In the camera world, a perfect term was coined for this sort of guy: "equipment measurbator".
Interesting thoughts. I own a tikka t3 varmint rifle in .308 set up for long range competition use. I fully understand that field use and range use vary significantly. When i bought my rifle, you could find brass and reloading components easily and I was working with a modest budget so the 308 was easy. The competition I shoot also insists that the cartridge must have a history of military use for the rifle to be legal under the competition rules.
factory twist rates traditionaly over time have been a 1-12 twist , this will max at a 190 grain bullet, well a sub sonic 200 grn may work in a 1-12 twist a 1-10 twist will work better
Energy doesn't really kill. What's more important, the bullet style and velocity on your target. Will your bullet actually function correctly at range? Tissue damage kills. Sorry, 30 cal and up kill better. 7mm and down are for the recoil sensitive😅 If one hates recoil, just use a 243 shooting DRT 95 gr bullets. It will drop an elk at 400 yards. Fact! Research it. The bullet kills, not energy! If one wants to shoot 500+, why fuck around with dinky cartridges? Step up a 300 or 338 RUM😅 Mine dump everything! As does my custom Tikka in 375 Ruger for stalking.
I almost bought a 308 but my mate told me how he had shot and not recovered 2 deer on 2 different occasions ( yeah yeah shot placement blah blah) anyway he upgraded to 300wm and has dropped every deer he's shot since! I ended up getting a 300wsm because it was available and in my budget at the time, I've had great results and never had to worry about not dropping a deer👍👍
You can load 308 way hotter than any factory ammo you can find. Also you're comparing a soft point to a ballistic tip if the 308 was a ballistic tip, it would stretch its energy out quite a bit further. In my 308 that i hunt with im loading 150grain ssts and out of a 20inch barrel they are chronographing about 2850. And thats just the middle of the road load. I could add quite a bit more powder and still be within pressure spec, if i wanted to load them as hot as is safe i bet i could get them going near 3000fps out of the muzzle. But 2850 is plenty for where i would be shooting. Killed a deer last year at over 500 yards and bullet went straight through the deer and an inch into a tree that was behind it. From what I've read 600 ft pounds of energy is acceptable to take a large deer according to my ballistics chart I've got 600 ft pounds of energy at 1000 yards personally i wouldn't take anything with much less than 1000 ft/pounds and that puts me in the 700-800 yard range. Which is about the maximum for my capabilities as a shooter. 308 as a cartridge is more capable than most hunters could take advantage of. I've seen so many hunters miss at even 200-300 yards. If you've got the skills and the need to hit a deer at 1000 yards 308 is never going to be the best for you you're gonna have less drop and more energy if you go with a magnum or even 6.5 creedmoor. Personally I've never seen a deer over 700 yards that i was willing to shoot at
Thanks for the Video, I’m just getting back into shooting again after a fkn long time off and automatically went 308 as the calibre I’d choose. Going to have a rethink before I settle on anything now. Thanks again.👍
Why is there this visual of ACE VENTURA TALKING OUT HIS ARS* SURPRISED YOU ARENT PLUGGING FOR THE HORNADY LIGHT MAGNUMS thats right they relabled them Superperformance loads I did not listen for long. Just wanted to say I am more persuaded by what works 150 gr 308 Federal Blue Box Remington 722 Leupold Optics DECADES OF SUCCESS BUT YOU GO RIGHT ON TALKING YOUR GUFF
Lol mate what are you even on about. I openly stated, if you had listened, that 308 is perfectly fine for short range work... but pointed out that there are better options out there if you are going for range. You tit.
I totally agree , I'm not saying their shit but I wouldn't buy a 308... I have a 30-06 and a 300wsm and in my opinion they are a lot better cartridge than the " got to get a 308 " ... 😂😅😂
Me too brno 270 with hornady superformance 130 grain 3200 fps never needed ever second shot but having said that any 308 round aint shit ask all dead soldiers long past they wont reply but they are very dead
First of all, if you're going to talk trash about a cartridge and attempt to use ballistics to represent your reasoning you should probably make sure that the information you present is at least accurate. You used a 150 grain sp 308 load running 2820fps and stated that it was a hot load and that the average 308 150 grain loads are in the mid to high 2700fps range. That is absolutely false because the vast majority of 308 150 grain factory loads produce 2800+fps and hot loads like Hornady's 150 grain sst superformance produce 3000fps. The only factory 150 grain 308 load that I've ever seen that produces less than 2800fps is the Nosler e-tip load @2750fps. For 165 grain loads you again used a 308 sp and a load only doing 2700fps when Nosler has at least two 165 grain 308 loads that clock in at 2800fps. Same story with 180 grain 308 loads, you used a sp load doing 2620 and said that it was the hottest load you could find when buffalo bore makes hotter loads than that. Another thing I want to make clear is that all of the hotter loads I'm mentioning are all achieving those velocities from a 24" barrel just like the loads you mentioned. Secondly, let's talk about your obvious bias against the 308 in your cartridge comparisons. As I stated above, all of the bullets you used for comparing the 308 to other cartridges were soft points with relatively low ballistic coefficients and you compared other cartridges using bullets like the Hornady eldx, which have considerably better ballistic coefficients. Are you trying to tell us that all 308 cartridges are being loaded with soft point and that more modern bullets with higher ballistic coefficients aren't available in 308 loads? That would obviously be false too because every single one of the faster loads that I've mentioned are built using bullets with much better ballistic coefficients than those soft points, thus they'll produce and maintain much better ballistic performance compared to the soft point loads both at the muzzle as well as downrange. You either did this out of ignorance or out of bias and I highly doubt it was out of any ignorant lack of knowledge in regard to there being better 308 loads available. The last thing I'm going to mention is that a handloader can achieve much better performance from the 308 than any of the mediocre loads you displayed in this video and I know this to be absolute fact from firsthand experience. You can hate all you want but it will never change the fact that the 308 is an excellent cartridge or that you've told lies and attempted to hide information in this video.
Surprised you didnt put the 6.5PRC as a comparison. Its obviously smaller being 6.5 so I can see why but its ballistics are crazy good especially when taking felt recoil into consideration. 280AI another good one though we could obviously go on forever haha there's so many 😍
the 6.5PRC isn't legal for Sambar in Victoria, so makes sense to ditch it given that there are more Sambar in Victoria than any other deer (and I believe old mate is from Vic)
@@MartianLivesMatter I can understand from a practical pov, if game warden bloke comes up to you in the field how is he going to know energy and velocity for all these chamberings? He just goes 'its long enough and the bullet is big enough, job done'
@@Archfile375 shouldn't be a game warden if he doesn't know these things. And it's easy enough to do a web search if he doesn't know. And if out of reception he can take details and photo of cartridge and follow up.
@@MartianLivesMatter I think you're overthinking it a little. Someone made a rule, it's adequately simple to enforce and adequate for humane deer dispatch so it works. I'm not for or against it. It is what it is. I'm just explaining why op didn't review 2506 or 6.5mm something
It's a good medium game calibre and there are reasons it's popular - however it is the white Commodore and Glock 17 of the calibre world and like them it's effective but boring. 😂
The point of this whole speal is the 308 is popular, effective can load it up or down. You neglect Superperformance Hornady 150 cooks at 3000 in 308 out of mine is 2988. But point is the 308 is popular effective and important and you are not that is why you star the show in the 308 name. Meaning nobody knows or cares about you.
7.62x51~ .308 is not a target cartridge it is a war cartridge meant to kill or wound 300m to 500 m when developed. hunting and targets are afterthoughts
Thanks for giving your reasons why u think it’s a rubbish round. U know the saying about opinions and arseholes. Felt like u needed to after flatly saying something is shit without elaborating. I was especially curious since you owned a 308 yourself. By the way, “50 million” was just a figure of speech mate. Don’t take it literally 🙄 point was it’s mega popular. No one really cares about Joules of energy. What cal is best for you depends on what type of hunting you’re doing. That’s the bottom line. Thanks for the vid 👍
I know '50 million' is a figure of speech... so is 'pulled it out of your bottom'. There are 50 million people who do give a shit about joules. Thanks for the inspiration for the video.
Don’t know why you would prefer a .270 over the .308 it’s honestly worse and you instantly loose brain cells when you touch one 🤣. Also completely agree with you on the 7mm Rem Mag it’s awesome
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You chose the shittest 150gr .308 projectile to compare to the better ones in the other calibers.
Thankyou! Really irked me how unbalanced this comparison was
Is 308 still an adequate cartridge for shooting at random trees?
Yes
How many opportunities do you get to shoot large sambar stags out past 600m in Victoria?
In summary, a 308 is still going to put a hole in a deer from 300m away. I'm pretty happy with that.
Honestly, rifle calibre know it alls are among the biggest flogs in the known universe 🙄
Beethoven had his critics too. See if you can name two of them... that's right, you can't.
@@fhckoutdoors Abbe Stadler and Dionys Weber. I had to Google that but.......Beethoven preferred 7mm cos he was German.
So according to you .308 sucks at a very particular niche (Deer hunting at 300m+) Which we know it is more than good enough at given the right choice of projectile.
It is still easier to reload, more available and cheaper to purchase than any of the newer more fandangled cartridges out there but will kill 90% of Australian game and vermin with authority.
Split the difference and use the money you save on .308 to become a better shooter. And you will find the cartridge becomes magically more lethal.
I have used the 308Win for 57 years for Whitetail Deer and feral hogs and it has been highly effective and very affordable and practical.
Ammo is readily available and generally at a lower price point as are components WORLDWIDE including rural and isolated places. Killed innumerable deer with the majority bang flops with a high shoulder shot. 308Win also is appreciated for a longer barrel life than overbored calibers.
I acknowledge that my terrain lends itself to close in shots and 250 to 300 yards in my locale would be for me long range.....so I fully understand your affinity for the 7mm Rem Mag and similar. If I hunted in open country I would probably change my tune.
I like the economy of the 308 for my personal situation.
Well said bill. This guy spends too much time pawing over the ballistic charts. Your 250 - 300 yds is the max ''Ethical"range he eludes to anyway so the 308 dose the business.
This nonsense reminds me of sitting around a fishing camp debating the best line and hooks to use.
Hating a particular calibre? Weird.
Sorry man, it’s the Toyota aurion on the cartridge world, more than good enough for general use, inexpensive and reliable, nothing fancy, nothing super powerful or outstanding, but can surprise a lot of people that doubt it.
308 is cheap. Best cartridge is 165gr nosler Ballistic tips.
7mm rem mags make too much noise.
Not as loud as your 416 mate haha
@fhuckoutdoors It might scare the deer but it frightens the hell out of me.
@@mchughcb Hahaha
You make some good points when looking at the numbers at range but i personally have to smile when i hear the minimum suggested energy needed for some game, 1500ftp for elk/sambar and 1000ftp for deer is 70's American gun magazine fluff to sell the idea you need more guns and way more power than whats actually needed but "i get it", Sometimes you have to take a shot at a bad angle or through scrub and being over gunned may help, i dont know about you but i shoot shit with a big magnum in a hunting weight rifle compared to a standard cartridge?
I do contract shooting as work and very rarely do i have to use anything bigger than 223rem and find the 308win to much often passing right through most game like fellow deer at typical range chest shots.
The 308win its a really useful cartridge with a good maximum point blank range on bigger game, with its small powder capacity and large calibre you get good speed from a short barrel with only a little more recoil in a hunting weight rifle than tests show most shooters groups start to open up at.
If i was shooting long range then yes a muzzle braked long barrel heavyweight rifle in a bigger, faster, higher bc calibre would be better but the all important good shot placement is harder to get at long range.
Cheers Daryl
Thanks for the comment. Are you doing pest control or meat production? Because all the guys I've ever known who do it take headshots only (with 223 of course).
Kinetic energy is a good benchmark, especially for those who are new to hunting and do not fully understand terminal ballistics. To be clear though, I'm using 1500J, which is 1100ft/lbs. Bullet construction and placement will always be king, but those who want 'an answer at a glance', energy levels give a means to comparing cartridges without all the extra fluff.
@fhuckoutdoors hey mate, sorry for not seeing your reply,
I haven't done any harvest type shooting but I know a few guys that do and yep they take headshots as often as possible. I manly do culling work so I can shoot for the head or body.
I use a few air and rimfire rifles mainly and a 223 rem for nearly everything else up to fellow deer and pigs. Large pigs are the toughest animal I come across so I use monolithic projectiles on them with the 223 or if I have to be quiet 308 subs are good inside 150 meters.
There was a contract shoot for horses in vic last year that stipulated 30cal minimum and I found the barns ttsx 150grn would pass through braking both shoulders if inside 200 meters using the 308.
I don't think the 308 is the be all and end all cartridge but the 308 is a powerfull and versatile round letting you load lightweight 3200+fps loads to heavy 200grn+ subs for quiet culling.
I've found the projectile type much more important than the cartridge it's fired from.
Cheers Daryl Webb
You preface this saying hunting circumstances. How often are you shooting deer past 100m? I exclusively hunt public land, no private access. I've never taken a deer past 100m. Infact, it's usually 30-50m. I use the 130gr TTSX from my 20" barrel @ 3050fps. Never lost a Sambar. If your a shit shot I suppose big cals are beneficial 🤣
Mate everyone knows public deer have hearing problems the elite deer are all in private property😊
More deer have been shot in Australia with .308 than any other cartridge!!
With in 300 yards their not a lick of deifference between any of those rounds. If your range is 300 or less 308 is a awesome rouind and here in the east in the US thats a dam good round. If i were planing on shooting past 300 on a regular basis id use a flatter shooting round. Of the rounds you had listed the only 1 i might consider would be the 270 win but even then id most likely use a different round. I dont typicaly shoot past 300 so for me its a moot point at best. It really depends on what your wanting to do with the round and at what distance you want to hunt. In 308 i dont go above 165 grain but thats just me. Personaly my fav round is the 30-06 wich ive been useing for over 50 years. Yes i do use the 308 as well wich is more than enough with in 300 yard. Also 1 of the nice thing about 308 where i live it was the only and i do mean only center fire round you could find during that dam covid lock down they did. I understand why some dont like the 308 and somedo, Personaly id perfer the 7-08 over any of those you listed when it comes to those short rounds.
Interesting that you guys ran out of .308 over there. Here in Canada 308 was about the only thing I could ever find on the shelves, seemed to be the only ammo that was being produced in enough quantities that it would stay on the shelves longer than a day.
Do you Canadians have ammo limits? Purchase or storage?
@@FerventReminder I think there is a possession limit but I don't know what it is off the top of my head.
@@Marcus-jg4jb Thanks for your response, mostly just curious how the laws differ around the world.
We're (Aus) pretty much restricted to what we can reasonably justify using in a 12 month period.
@@FerventReminder Interesting, that's wild. Here in Canada with regards to 'non-restricted' (hunting rifles and shotguns, essentially) once we have our licences we're mostly left on our own.
I looked it up and I think we're able to store up to 225 kilograms of propellant, or the associated amount of ammo. So we technically have a limit, but not a practical one.
@@Marcus-jg4jb Damn, that's a hell of a lot more than us haha. I think we can have 5kg of propellant too--not sure if there's any interplay there with the aforementioned 12 month supply limit.
People, they all work! Shoot what you shoot best. I have personally been killing whitetails for a long time with the 308win. But I like others as well, like the (oh my shit) 22-250 of which I have killed a lot of deer with it too.
I agree with you that you should use what you shoot best. But please understand that Sambar deer, which I refer to in this video, are more comparable in size to Elk than Whitetail.
Been watching a few of your videos lately. Just curious, 2 years ago or so you pretty much praised the 308 in your 30 cal deer rifle video. Is that only because out of all available 30cal choices you think the 308 is best? Or back at that stage did you actually like 308 more than these other cartridges or didnt have enough experience with them? I shoot 308, got 2 of them and still think its great. Theres no point me moving to something else like 6.5 or 7mm08 as im already setup with 308. Knowing what I know now I probably wouldnt have chosen the 308 and would have gone with a 270 or 7mm08
I often recommend 308 to beginners because it's a fairly decent all around cartridge and great to learn marksmanship principles. What I tried to outline in this video is that it is outdone by pretty much every other cartridge out there. Lots of people claim it to be much better than it is, which is what actually annoys me... not the cartridge itself.
@@fhckoutdoors Thanks for the reply. Now I can see where your coming from.
I don't mind the 308, yeah it drops like a stone but I've learnt to use it, it's really good in the scrub for pigs with heavy bullets. I don't think the deer really care if there hit by a 308 probably because there dead lol , A mate once said to me 9mm is a girls gun but in reality if you were hit by one it would likely be the last time you'd call it girly, hypothetically of course.
The 308 is like the equivalent of a toothy blowie. Yeah it's still a blowie but there's better out there. I would own one if I lived in bum fuck nowhere where the post office is also the gun shop, grocery shop, pub and brothel and didn't hand load because most places you can get projectiles and brass sent to your door. My go-to has always been 30-06 which was my first centrefire but will be using the 257 weatherby from now on as I'm not shooting massive deer but still have the a better option to turn to than the 308 if the opportunity pokes its head up to have a stab at a large red or sambar. Bloody good video mate!
I think the 243 is the best calibre because there’s not a ton of drop on it and it has enough power for deer in England but what are your thoughts on the 270 and 277 fury
308 works really well where I’m at biggest game. We hunt generally is Whitetail. If not, blackbear. You can have a shorter barrel, which is perfect for a Deerstand and it has plenty of knock down. I hardly ever see any 7 mm. 30.30 308 30.06 is the bread and butter.
There's 2 reasons why I'd buy a .308; F-class target shooting since its a very popular category or a scout rifle because....apocalypse
*gets out the popcorn*
7RM - Testicles the size of tennis balls
300WM - Testicles the size of basketballs.
QED 300WM is superior because I’m incredibly insecure in my masculinity.
Hey mate, I appreciate this a lot, especially as someone who’s new to hunting.
I have a 308 and I enjoy it, but what company does a good rifle in 7mm, cheers man!
Tikka.
@@fhckoutdoors thanks man! I’ll looking into picking one up!
@@TheDECKFISH yep, I have a 7mm rem mag Tikka and its very accurate. I have not had the chance to drop anything with it yet but depending on how you handle recoil it would be best to try a few different loads to see which you like best. 155g works for me control wise.
@@bestestusername how does it kick compared to 30-06 or 308?
@@TheDECKFISH like 3006 for me, I used 175g winchester 7mm and that was harsh, 155g is a nice place, but then again when there is a deer in front of you there really is no felt recoil as excitement takes over 🤣. Just depends how much you want to shoot at the range.
"pulled that out your bottom" ha ha why did that sound so polite?
🇦🇺😎👍Every time I brought a new caliber people would say it was shit . So what I did was buy their caliber until the next person came along and said that’s shit 🤣and on and on and on🤣. . All sorted now 😎👍. He who buys the most calibers wins🏁Happy Sunday big fella🦘
Winner winner chicken dinner 😊
I have a friend like that, always saying the Colt AR-15 in .223/5.56 is the best because that is what he owns. My response is it isn't effective for whitetail deer or black bear.
Missed opportunity to title this video
"3 0 Hate"
My first was a 308 😂
I use a 7mm magnum the farthest a deer has gone was maybe ten feet except one that ran downhill. I hunt public land so I don't want a deer running very far that is why I use the 7mm magnum. I think the farthest I have shot a deer was maybe fifty yards the closest was twenty feet away so trees get in the way and I have to basically walk up to the deer or a couple times had a bucket I sat on.
I am a 3006 guy but use the 308 and there are so many loads available for both they are ridiculously good.
I get quality 270 and 3006 ammo cheaper than 308 at the moment. Decent 308 ammo still hasn't come back to my local shop after the CoVID fiasco. I prefer my .270 anyway I can stretch it out and still guarantee it will knock over whatever I'm aiming at.
I shoot comp at 1000 yard 168gr eld-m 2820 ft/sec out of a 26" barrel and hit consitantly sub MOA
Well said
308 is a 200yard timber round. Stop putting it ware its not ment to shine. The 308 hammers deer 200 and in. Especially good at 50 to 150 yards in the timber. Stacks of ammo in every shop in every good made. 308 rocks in the north east
You must be America. Sambar deer here in Australia are closer in size to Elk than your white tails... yet people here still think its good enough out to 5-600m. I agree with you, 308 is great for close range stuff.
@@fhckoutdoors yes i'm an American . north east, I disagree when people try to put the 308 up against long range calibers for comparison. It's capable of going long. But It's not ware 308 shines. I flip big 200 lb plus, whitetails over every year w a 308 . I use federal terminal accent ammo. Love that loading. But Im in the timber ware 75yards is a long shot In Here. That's ware 308 shines. Close range stalking
Checked out your video a couple of years ago on best 30 calibre rounds for Sambar, and the 308 seemed pretty capable….especially up to 300m which is as far as I’d shoot. So I bought one, and now you hate it!
😢
It is capable... just not as capable as others on the market. My main gripe is that people talk about 308 like its bloody 50cal.
@@fhckoutdoors thanks for responding and point taken
@@fhckoutdoorsthat is because all any Americans shoot now is 223 which if 308 is to weak for deer then whadaya tell the whole Lotta people who use 223
@@dawkinschmidt7053 For starters, 223 is not deer legal in many Australian states. And for the states that have no minimum deer caliber, I would say 223 is not ideal.
Awesome video again mate, ex Army and only shot 5.56 and 7.62 so just had .223 and .308 because that's what I thought was best. Good break down of the actual science.
Had a 308 didn’t mind it, sold it to a mate who had a buggered shoulder, have a 30-06 and a 300win mag and love them both… have been considering something 7mm
Reasons I hate the 308?
Add on...cos ya can.
The perfect round is... all of them.
Worst round is...all of them.
Whole road train full of yeah but variables so in the end, it doesn't matter cos some do some things better than others.
Ideally I'd have one or two of everything & it'd matter even less.
Two thumbs up.
Well then. Maybe I shouldn't have shot my last deer at 450y with factory hornady 150gr sst. Because the internet told me I couldn't. 🤷♂️
Was a terrible heart shot.
Never once in the video did I say you can't shoot a deer with 308. In fact I said it's very possible and gave examples. I just outlined that there are better cartridges out there.
@fhuckoutdoors all I hear is I need to buy more guns and I'm sticking to it.
I'm a .308 shooter but agree it's not the absolute best out there, I settled on it purely because my gun shop always has heaps of reloading components for it and a lot of rifle choices in .308 (I have limited access to only one gun shop). Even my longest cross gully shots at Sambar Stags have been with in my personal ethical range of 300m and have always recovered the animal. As a hand loader I find it very forgiving with powder charges and powder types as opposed to my old 300WM and 270W and the accuracy doesn't go to shit as easily. I use 150g without any obvious problems really. Also 308 tends to be less effected by barrel length according to my chrono.
Ps. 308 does feel a bit boring compared to other stuff out there and I can't brag about it around the camp fire.😢
Access to one gunshop? In Queensland you can get firearms sent to your house. Other states you can get them sent to a dealer.
@@ckg1776 Done that in the past but have had bad luck with sight unseen purchases, I'm a magnet for stuff turning up damaged or nqr in some way.
For me it’s really familiarity due to my time in the service as an Infantryman having copious amounts of LFX’s and just getting inoculated to these two commonly used calibers (5.56mm - 7.62mm) within the military.. It’s time for me to get out of my comfort zone and choose something different 🦌
The loads seem a bit cherry-picked. I mean, yeah - obviously an ELD bullet is going to outperform a low-BC soft-point at long range. 😋
They are actually the loads my mates use... but shhhhh dont tell them that.
@@fhckoutdoors Ha - no worries, mate.
If it's quality hunting ammo it probably all works fine anyway; in my experience, choice of bullet matters a lot more than choice of cartridge (within reason) at typical hunting ranges.
@@mikegreen2214 Oh I definitely agree with that. These ballistic videos are all the rage at the moment, but terminal ballistics is far more applicable. I've got some videos coming out about that too.
@@fhckoutdoors Ha, for sure. It's like that with any hobby that involves gear; some people form extremely-strong opinions about specifications despite not really understanding the relevance or whether it even means anything in a given situation.
In the camera world, a perfect term was coined for this sort of guy: "equipment measurbator".
I only got a 308 because I'm left handed and it's all they had in a left hand rifle.
I like the 308 after firing 5.56 uh I was talking about target not hunting my butt doesn't hurt thanks for the video
Interesting thoughts. I own a tikka t3 varmint rifle in .308 set up for long range competition use. I fully understand that field use and range use vary significantly. When i bought my rifle, you could find brass and reloading components easily and I was working with a modest budget so the 308 was easy. The competition I shoot also insists that the cartridge must have a history of military use for the rifle to be legal under the competition rules.
factory twist rates traditionaly over time have been a 1-12 twist , this will max at a 190 grain bullet, well a sub sonic 200 grn may work in a 1-12 twist a 1-10 twist will work better
Energy doesn't really kill. What's more important, the bullet style and velocity on your target. Will your bullet actually function correctly at range? Tissue damage kills. Sorry, 30 cal and up kill better. 7mm and down are for the recoil sensitive😅 If one hates recoil, just use a 243 shooting DRT 95 gr bullets. It will drop an elk at 400 yards. Fact! Research it. The bullet kills, not energy! If one wants to shoot 500+, why fuck around with dinky cartridges? Step up a 300 or 338 RUM😅 Mine dump everything! As does my custom Tikka in 375 Ruger for stalking.
I don't care for 308 either, but if you like it, go for it!
I almost bought a 308 but my mate told me how he had shot and not recovered 2 deer on 2 different occasions ( yeah yeah shot placement blah blah) anyway he upgraded to 300wm and has dropped every deer he's shot since! I ended up getting a 300wsm because it was available and in my budget at the time, I've had great results and never had to worry about not dropping a deer👍👍
Now we need a video on why you dislike 6.5 creedmoor!😂 disclaimer I don’t own that caliber and have no skin in the game.
Challenge accepted
A also cannot wait for this video. The 6.5 is the vegan cyclist of cartridges
love the Science, love the comments, love ya content!
300wsm is what .308 shouldve been, same way 4k 4:2:0 is what 1080p 4:4:4 shouldve been little techno curve ball atcha lol
You can load 308 way hotter than any factory ammo you can find. Also you're comparing a soft point to a ballistic tip if the 308 was a ballistic tip, it would stretch its energy out quite a bit further.
In my 308 that i hunt with im loading 150grain ssts and out of a 20inch barrel they are chronographing about 2850. And thats just the middle of the road load. I could add quite a bit more powder and still be within pressure spec, if i wanted to load them as hot as is safe i bet i could get them going near 3000fps out of the muzzle. But 2850 is plenty for where i would be shooting. Killed a deer last year at over 500 yards and bullet went straight through the deer and an inch into a tree that was behind it.
From what I've read 600 ft pounds of energy is acceptable to take a large deer according to my ballistics chart I've got 600 ft pounds of energy at 1000 yards personally i wouldn't take anything with much less than 1000 ft/pounds and that puts me in the 700-800 yard range. Which is about the maximum for my capabilities as a shooter. 308 as a cartridge is more capable than most hunters could take advantage of. I've seen so many hunters miss at even 200-300 yards. If you've got the skills and the need to hit a deer at 1000 yards 308 is never going to be the best for you you're gonna have less drop and more energy if you go with a magnum or even 6.5 creedmoor. Personally I've never seen a deer over 700 yards that i was willing to shoot at
Oi! You leave my cheap powershoks alone 😂 they shoot awesome out of my tikka
🤣🤣🤣
Thanks for the Video, I’m just getting back into shooting again after a fkn long time off and automatically went 308 as the calibre I’d choose. Going to have a rethink before I settle on anything now. Thanks again.👍
Why is there
this visual of
ACE VENTURA
TALKING OUT HIS ARS*
SURPRISED YOU ARENT PLUGGING FOR THE HORNADY
LIGHT MAGNUMS
thats right
they relabled them Superperformance loads
I did not listen for long.
Just wanted to say
I am more persuaded by what works
150 gr 308
Federal Blue Box
Remington 722
Leupold Optics
DECADES OF SUCCESS
BUT YOU GO RIGHT ON TALKING YOUR GUFF
Lol mate what are you even on about. I openly stated, if you had listened, that 308 is perfectly fine for short range work... but pointed out that there are better options out there if you are going for range. You tit.
I totally agree , I'm not saying their shit but I wouldn't buy a 308... I have a 30-06 and a 300wsm and in my opinion they are a lot better cartridge than the " got to get a 308 " ... 😂😅😂
Free speech, that's democracy. Keep having fun, I have a 308 and a 270 but prefer the 270 but who gives a shit.
Me too brno 270 with hornady superformance 130 grain 3200 fps never needed ever second shot but having said that any 308 round aint shit ask all dead soldiers long past they wont reply but they are very dead
First of all, if you're going to talk trash about a cartridge and attempt to use ballistics to represent your reasoning you should probably make sure that the information you present is at least accurate. You used a 150 grain sp 308 load running 2820fps and stated that it was a hot load and that the average 308 150 grain loads are in the mid to high 2700fps range. That is absolutely false because the vast majority of 308 150 grain factory loads produce 2800+fps and hot loads like Hornady's 150 grain sst superformance produce 3000fps. The only factory 150 grain 308 load that I've ever seen that produces less than 2800fps is the Nosler e-tip load @2750fps. For 165 grain loads you again used a 308 sp and a load only doing 2700fps when Nosler has at least two 165 grain 308 loads that clock in at 2800fps. Same story with 180 grain 308 loads, you used a sp load doing 2620 and said that it was the hottest load you could find when buffalo bore makes hotter loads than that.
Another thing I want to make clear is that all of the hotter loads I'm mentioning are all achieving those velocities from a 24" barrel just like the loads you mentioned.
Secondly, let's talk about your obvious bias against the 308 in your cartridge comparisons. As I stated above, all of the bullets you used for comparing the 308 to other cartridges were soft points with relatively low ballistic coefficients and you compared other cartridges using bullets like the Hornady eldx, which have considerably better ballistic coefficients. Are you trying to tell us that all 308 cartridges are being loaded with soft point and that more modern bullets with higher ballistic coefficients aren't available in 308 loads? That would obviously be false too because every single one of the faster loads that I've mentioned are built using bullets with much better ballistic coefficients than those soft points, thus they'll produce and maintain much better ballistic performance compared to the soft point loads both at the muzzle as well as downrange. You either did this out of ignorance or out of bias and I highly doubt it was out of any ignorant lack of knowledge in regard to there being better 308 loads available.
The last thing I'm going to mention is that a handloader can achieve much better performance from the 308 than any of the mediocre loads you displayed in this video and I know this to be absolute fact from firsthand experience.
You can hate all you want but it will never change the fact that the 308 is an excellent cartridge or that you've told lies and attempted to hide information in this video.
Surprised you didnt put the 6.5PRC as a comparison. Its obviously smaller being 6.5 so I can see why but its ballistics are crazy good especially when taking felt recoil into consideration. 280AI another good one though we could obviously go on forever haha there's so many 😍
the 6.5PRC isn't legal for Sambar in Victoria, so makes sense to ditch it given that there are more Sambar in Victoria than any other deer (and I believe old mate is from Vic)
@@Archfile375 I find it kind of silly regulating based on calibre not energy especially when using modern projectiles.
@@MartianLivesMatter I can understand from a practical pov, if game warden bloke comes up to you in the field how is he going to know energy and velocity for all these chamberings? He just goes 'its long enough and the bullet is big enough, job done'
@@Archfile375 shouldn't be a game warden if he doesn't know these things. And it's easy enough to do a web search if he doesn't know. And if out of reception he can take details and photo of cartridge and follow up.
@@MartianLivesMatter I think you're overthinking it a little. Someone made a rule, it's adequately simple to enforce and adequate for humane deer dispatch so it works. I'm not for or against it. It is what it is. I'm just explaining why op didn't review 2506 or 6.5mm something
It's a good medium game calibre and there are reasons it's popular - however it is the white Commodore and Glock 17 of the calibre world and like them it's effective but boring. 😂
Too many shooters crap on like 308 is a 20mm cannon.
The point of this whole speal is the 308 is popular, effective can load it up or down. You neglect Superperformance Hornady 150 cooks at 3000 in 308 out of mine is 2988. But point is the 308 is popular effective and important and you are not that is why you star the show in the 308 name. Meaning nobody knows or cares about you.
7.62x51~ .308 is not a target cartridge it is a war cartridge meant to kill or wound 300m to 500 m when developed. hunting and targets are afterthoughts
your awsome I love watching your channel, you don't care about idiots or wankers
Fighting you in comments
Thanks for giving your reasons why u think it’s a rubbish round. U know the saying about opinions and arseholes. Felt like u needed to after flatly saying something is shit without elaborating. I was especially curious since you owned a 308 yourself. By the way, “50 million” was just a figure of speech mate. Don’t take it literally 🙄 point was it’s mega popular. No one really cares about Joules of energy. What cal is best for you depends on what type of hunting you’re doing. That’s the bottom line. Thanks for the vid 👍
I know '50 million' is a figure of speech... so is 'pulled it out of your bottom'.
There are 50 million people who do give a shit about joules. Thanks for the inspiration for the video.
@@fhckoutdoors don’t know too many people that hunt with a spreadsheet, but interesting none the less. You’re welcome for the inspo 👍
I think 308 really BS. I pick 30 06 over the 308
Don’t know why you would prefer a .270 over the .308 it’s honestly worse and you instantly loose brain cells when you touch one 🤣. Also completely agree with you on the 7mm Rem Mag it’s awesome
Someone can’t read numbers or understand the .308 is a shit box. get over it.
As soon as your lips start moving i know you are talking shit .never again