Another consideration for me is bleeding the brakes -- Shimano being mineral oil based is simple to deal with in bleeding my own brakes at home. It is a simple and safe job compared to dealing with SRAM which uses a much more hazardous fluid. Plus, I don't like the feel of SRAM.
Unfortunately, if your battery freezes, you are in trouble. Marie Soleil-Blas used SRAM AXS on the Tour Divide this year. Her batteries froze on a cold night, and she was left unable to shift the gears on her bike.
I would absolutely go with the SRAM mullet on a gravel bike. I went from mechanical to SRAM mullet. It is vastly superior. The thing about gravel riding, is that it can be hillier than you think if you've never done it. Gravel tends to have steeper punches than paved roads. Plus, the electronic is just so much more effective on gravel. It is so much better on quickly changing terrain.
Just a thought - imo especially for a novice, the price of replacement parts should be considered as much as or even more than purchase price. You’re gonna make mistakes. Break a derailleur tripping over a branch, wear out the drivetrain prematurely, change a headset and hub bearings cause you used a high pressure hose… that kind of stuff. Just my 2 cents 😉
A bit of a different perspective, perhaps from someone who is a little older and has accumulated a number of injuries over the years: I went on a gravel vacation in August. We did 236 miles of almost pure gravel in a week. I was riding a bike with mechanical GRX 820 shifting. I ended up getting a repetitive stress injury from the effort required to shift the rear derailleur (basically the cycling equivalent of tennis elbow). It's been 2.5 months and it hasn't healed yet. I've only hopped on the gravel bike once since then and it was immediately obvious that shifting was the cause. My road bike has Di2. No problems there. So, I'm in the process of switching from GRX on my gravel bike to a SRAM mullet setup. I know from experience with my roadbike that my hands are just less fatigued after a big ride (80+ miles). I really thought electronic shifting was gimmicky at first, but I have to say, I absolutely love it. Another note, Shimano has a problem with their rear mechanical brifters. The acute angle that the cable turns at causes premature wear. After around 3000 miles, the cable will start fraying inside the brifter. This will first manifest as difficulty shifting into your biggest gear until, eventually, the cable snaps. One thing I don't miss with Di2... replacing derailleur cables and fine-tuning the derailleur as the cable housing wears down. So, although I absolutely love Shimano, I'd lean toward the SRAM in this case.
I’ve run electronic and mechanical shifting, my road and mountain bikes are electronic, my gravel “adventure” bike is mechanical. I have had issues with electronic shifting. It’s no fun losing your shifting on a long ride, and the farther are from home, the worse it is. On my gravel bike I run a GRX 1x12 driveline with a 10~51 cassette. This gives you the same gear range as SRAM electronic systems, but is still less expensive. I’ve put thousands of miles now on my GRX driveline, and not had a single issue.
But SRAM has their mechanical Apex/Eagle option too, with a tiny bit wider range (10-52) As someone who is more interested in the MTB end of the gravel spectrum, another little advantage of SRAM is the availability of down to 34t direct mount chainrings from Wolftooth - they only go down to 36t for Shimano GRX. (yes I know there are other options for small chainring setups, such as a MTB crankset) I have my heart set on the Marin Headlands 2, which does have the Apex/Eagle drivetrain. I'd fit the Wolftooth 34t.
+1 on the brakes. IME the bleed process is pretty much the same for Sram. BUT the Dot fluid will need to be replaced in shorter intervals and your brakes will feel spongy quicker, simply because DOT fluid is hydroscopic and will get contaminated with water quicker until your brakes feel shit. I don't like that sort of fuzz as I feel it's just completely unnecessary. I dunno whether Sram did it for patent reasons. But I found that mineral oil brakes just keep on working almost indefinitely once they're set up properly. I do replace the mineral oil eventually. But rarely do I feel that I have to.
The key difference for me is the brakes, the Shimano brakes are really good and I’ve found them to be easier to service, bleed and find affordable parts for. Sram brake pads can be pricey.
I actully like the GRX 2X option.. on gravel you get good low range and on smoother you get the higher ring and closer cassette spacing. guess it depends on one's needs mostly and the right answer would be user-specific maybe.
I wouldn't say "wider gear range" is a benefit of SRAM. GRX can get up to 10-51. It all depends on what particular options are available on the bike you are buying. Don't let the cassette options hold you back, you can always swap later!
Mechanical shifting with GRX was not as smooth as with SRAM until they released the new GRX 820 1By this year, imo. The older GRX versions were not shifting and overall working as crispy as SRAM‘s mech groups. I am very happy with the regular SRAM Rival without all the electronics.
I don't know if I agree with the statement that mechanical is inherently more durable than electronic - the shifting mechanism at the lever is pretty complex with lots of small components that can break. I suffer from recency bias tho, my right (rear) 810 lever broke a few weeks ago - and whilst on a bikepacking trip of all times and places! I have been thinking whether to stick to mechanical or switch to Di2 since. I still skew for the former just because Di2, on my current bike, would prevent me from using seatposts such as Ergon's spring leaf or the Redshift.
Have a GRX 812 1x on my bike, fitted with an 11-46 SLX (I think) cassette. Been working like a charm for some 1000+ kilometers now. As much as I would like to try electronic just to have one cable less, I am somehow hesitant towards riding a bike with parts that I need to register online and update the firmware for 😂 BTW, been seeing a few people putting a Deore 5100 series 11-51 tooth 11 speed cassette on their bikes, having zero problems with GRX 812 managing it on shorter chainstays. So that is what I intend to try next. Down to 38t chainring upfront, with 51t in the back. If it works, it is a serious range on a relative cheap, and with good ol’ Shimano quality (and quirks).
Got to disagree with mechanical being more durable than electronic off road... Add mud into a mechanical shifter and cables and they'll clog eventually. Electronic won't. Saying that, I've seen problems with SRAM axs so I don't think I'd go down that route (but grx di2 is fantastic).
I have Shimano GRX on gravel bike, seriously it is limited on gears for a gravel/adventure bike. I’m swapping to Campagnolo Ekar, it has more gear options. I can’t fault the Shimano shifting though, smooth as silk, even after gloopy mud
@@nikpavlovic2770 thanks for the advice, I’m very used to the Campagnolo thumb shifters (I prefer that system) and have tried the Ekar set up and it’s excellent as you would expect, I also found it very comfortable. 👍
Specialité TA has a 44-28 option for GRX And with a 812 derailleur you can safely put a 40 (also works with a base 400 10spd), 42 or 46 in the rear (beware crosschaining in that case) but you do you, happy riding
@@tinatpasselepoivre I quite like the 1x set up idea. It’s ok most of time but plan on doing some more testing routes and bike packing, which is making me realise the Shimano 1x GRX is quite limited, on reflection I think Campagnolo have got a better series of solutions but I bought the bike as a package.
I'm on 2x grx for that reason and aside from a bit of hunting between chainring gears or solves the gear range issue without having a dinner plate cassette
If he wants range, he should just go 2x... 46/30 in the front, 11-42 or maybe only 11-36 in the rear and you're all set. The latter gives better jumps between gears and it's still enough for most things except maybe the steepest mountains while bike packing... Plus the 2x is faster in the flats.
Буду дуже вдячний за відповідь хоч вона трохи не по темі😅. У мене Merida Silex200 і я хочу перейти на нову трансмісію. І мій вибір стоїть між Grx2/10(гідро)або Apex 1/11 (механічні). Я хочу спробувати 1x замість 2x спереду але все ще переживаю. Як ви вважаєте що краще?
Hi Francis and Jimmy, for me Nathan should stay away from the Grx 11-42 cassette this system as far as I know cannot handle 10-51 cassette so no way for him to upgrade, any brand is ok as long as he gets 10-52 t for future proofing because the main difference between the 2 groupset you mentioned is the difference with the rear derailleur which its capability varies a lot with the 2 models you mentioned.
I've had grx 1by (40/50) with a garbaruk cage and a grx 400(46/30-34) and now on my new bike sram force gx mullet (40/52). Brake-Performance on grx 800 brifters and force brifters is about the same, when correctly set-up. Many people fuck up their brake setup with sram, because you have to de-gas the dot fluid and bleed it a second time after breaking in the brakes. Thats way easier with shimano. 2by sucks for bikepacking, to much gunk when riding through dirt and shitty weather. On 1by grx with garbaruk cage im on my third derailleur hanger, since the long cage is prone to bending it, especially when riding offroad, and on the second cable. 5000km on that rig. Sram mullet climbs the best out of the 3 variants, yet. The Electronic clutch saved my derailleur hanger twice already and the micro adjustment is a really nice Feature. Setup is easy as it can be. Only downside are the batteries. They discharge when wet. I prefer the sram brifters as of now and the xdr freehub standard is way more common than microspline. In the end it's just ergonomic preference, except for the freehub (go xd/r!)
These days GRX simply because SRAM has decided to become a boutique group set maker specializing in wireless transmission and is doing jack shit for mech or hydro setups anymore and when they add Brifters to CUES then F both of those!
@@alexanderh2715 they do versions of the cassette for HG and Sram XD freehubs , and they are available in all steel clusters or steel/aluminium. Shifting is good if not quite as crisp as the 2 big S brands
@@Andy-co6pn ah that should do it. I don't need an original cassette, I just want to ride my bike but it's less fun grinding with lower cadence up steep hills. Thanks :)
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Another consideration for me is bleeding the brakes -- Shimano being mineral oil based is simple to deal with in bleeding my own brakes at home. It is a simple and safe job compared to dealing with SRAM which uses a much more hazardous fluid. Plus, I don't like the feel of SRAM.
Agreed. You don’t need it, but when you consider cycling in below freezing weather, eTap AXS has sold me. So much better for shifting with cold hands.
The temperature dropping battery life by 50% in the meantime ...
Unfortunately, if your battery freezes, you are in trouble. Marie Soleil-Blas used SRAM AXS on the Tour Divide this year. Her batteries froze on a cold night, and she was left unable to shift the gears on her bike.
I would absolutely go with the SRAM mullet on a gravel bike. I went from mechanical to SRAM mullet. It is vastly superior. The thing about gravel riding, is that it can be hillier than you think if you've never done it. Gravel tends to have steeper punches than paved roads. Plus, the electronic is just so much more effective on gravel. It is so much better on quickly changing terrain.
exactly what I went for, every day of the week much better
There's mechanical SRAM mullet now as well (Apex/Eagle) Very hard to find it on OTS bikes though. (h/t to Marin - THANKYOU)
Just a thought - imo especially for a novice, the price of replacement parts should be considered as much as or even more than purchase price.
You’re gonna make mistakes. Break a derailleur tripping over a branch, wear out the drivetrain prematurely, change a headset and hub bearings cause you used a high pressure hose… that kind of stuff.
Just my 2 cents 😉
In the end I did a custom build with Gevenale, XT 2x11 customised with 44-28 + 11-42
Perfect and cheap with patience for second hand parts
A bit of a different perspective, perhaps from someone who is a little older and has accumulated a number of injuries over the years: I went on a gravel vacation in August. We did 236 miles of almost pure gravel in a week. I was riding a bike with mechanical GRX 820 shifting. I ended up getting a repetitive stress injury from the effort required to shift the rear derailleur (basically the cycling equivalent of tennis elbow). It's been 2.5 months and it hasn't healed yet. I've only hopped on the gravel bike once since then and it was immediately obvious that shifting was the cause. My road bike has Di2. No problems there. So, I'm in the process of switching from GRX on my gravel bike to a SRAM mullet setup. I know from experience with my roadbike that my hands are just less fatigued after a big ride (80+ miles). I really thought electronic shifting was gimmicky at first, but I have to say, I absolutely love it. Another note, Shimano has a problem with their rear mechanical brifters. The acute angle that the cable turns at causes premature wear. After around 3000 miles, the cable will start fraying inside the brifter. This will first manifest as difficulty shifting into your biggest gear until, eventually, the cable snaps. One thing I don't miss with Di2... replacing derailleur cables and fine-tuning the derailleur as the cable housing wears down. So, although I absolutely love Shimano, I'd lean toward the SRAM in this case.
I’ve run electronic and mechanical shifting, my road and mountain bikes are electronic, my gravel “adventure” bike is mechanical. I have had issues with electronic shifting. It’s no fun losing your shifting on a long ride, and the farther are from home, the worse it is. On my gravel bike I run a GRX 1x12 driveline with a 10~51 cassette. This gives you the same gear range as SRAM electronic systems, but is still less expensive. I’ve put thousands of miles now on my GRX driveline, and not had a single issue.
But SRAM has their mechanical Apex/Eagle option too, with a tiny bit wider range (10-52)
As someone who is more interested in the MTB end of the gravel spectrum, another little advantage of SRAM is the availability of down to 34t direct mount chainrings from Wolftooth - they only go down to 36t for Shimano GRX. (yes I know there are other options for small chainring setups, such as a MTB crankset)
I have my heart set on the Marin Headlands 2, which does have the Apex/Eagle drivetrain. I'd fit the Wolftooth 34t.
I’ve been on GRX 800 1X for two years now and three months ago changed the 11-42 to an 11-46 which is great.
+1 on the brakes. IME the bleed process is pretty much the same for Sram. BUT the Dot fluid will need to be replaced in shorter intervals and your brakes will feel spongy quicker, simply because DOT fluid is hydroscopic and will get contaminated with water quicker until your brakes feel shit. I don't like that sort of fuzz as I feel it's just completely unnecessary. I dunno whether Sram did it for patent reasons. But I found that mineral oil brakes just keep on working almost indefinitely once they're set up properly. I do replace the mineral oil eventually. But rarely do I feel that I have to.
Once you ride on electronic shifting, it’s hard to go back to mechanical cables.
No it is not.
The key difference for me is the brakes, the Shimano brakes are really good and I’ve found them to be easier to service, bleed and find affordable parts for. Sram brake pads can be pricey.
I like my sram rival a lot but the brakes still need a lot of grip strength. Don't know about grx in comparison
I actully like the GRX 2X option.. on gravel you get good low range and on smoother you get the higher ring and closer cassette spacing. guess it depends on one's needs mostly and the right answer would be user-specific maybe.
I wouldn't say "wider gear range" is a benefit of SRAM. GRX can get up to 10-51. It all depends on what particular options are available on the bike you are buying. Don't let the cassette options hold you back, you can always swap later!
2x always… 1x and higher range of casette means more wear of crankset. 2x is more universal and works like charm even on my GRX600 crankset
Mechanical shifting with GRX was not as smooth as with SRAM until they released the new GRX 820 1By this year, imo. The older GRX versions were not shifting and overall working as crispy as SRAM‘s mech groups. I am very happy with the regular SRAM Rival without all the electronics.
My GRX 2x11 shifts flawlessly, I don't care for sram double tap. Feels clunky
I have friends who like double tap but personal preference - it feels slow to move the lever that far. I'm not a fan.
Wireless shifting is quite addictive-if you're used to it, no doubt GRX would not be an option
I don't know if I agree with the statement that mechanical is inherently more durable than electronic - the shifting mechanism at the lever is pretty complex with lots of small components that can break. I suffer from recency bias tho, my right (rear) 810 lever broke a few weeks ago - and whilst on a bikepacking trip of all times and places! I have been thinking whether to stick to mechanical or switch to Di2 since. I still skew for the former just because Di2, on my current bike, would prevent me from using seatposts such as Ergon's spring leaf or the Redshift.
Have a GRX 812 1x on my bike, fitted with an 11-46 SLX (I think) cassette. Been working like a charm for some 1000+ kilometers now. As much as I would like to try electronic just to have one cable less, I am somehow hesitant towards riding a bike with parts that I need to register online and update the firmware for 😂
BTW, been seeing a few people putting a Deore 5100 series 11-51 tooth 11 speed cassette on their bikes, having zero problems with GRX 812 managing it on shorter chainstays. So that is what I intend to try next. Down to 38t chainring upfront, with 51t in the back. If it works, it is a serious range on a relative cheap, and with good ol’ Shimano quality (and quirks).
Do it! Update the firmware once whilst under warranty and then don't touch it again and that risk goes away.
Got to disagree with mechanical being more durable than electronic off road... Add mud into a mechanical shifter and cables and they'll clog eventually. Electronic won't. Saying that, I've seen problems with SRAM axs so I don't think I'd go down that route (but grx di2 is fantastic).
Isn't Rival also available in a mechanical version? But only as one-by?
Yeah I have it and it's awesome
And there's also Apex (1X)
I have Shimano GRX on gravel bike, seriously it is limited on gears for a gravel/adventure bike. I’m swapping to Campagnolo Ekar, it has more gear options. I can’t fault the Shimano shifting though, smooth as silk, even after gloopy mud
try the hoods first, they have a bump where they join the bars, not as comfortable as the shimano plus the gear change is weird.
@@nikpavlovic2770 thanks for the advice, I’m very used to the Campagnolo thumb shifters (I prefer that system) and have tried the Ekar set up and it’s excellent as you would expect, I also found it very comfortable. 👍
Specialité TA has a 44-28 option for GRX
And with a 812 derailleur you can safely put a 40 (also works with a base 400 10spd), 42 or 46 in the rear (beware crosschaining in that case)
but you do you, happy riding
@@tinatpasselepoivre I quite like the 1x set up idea. It’s ok most of time but plan on doing some more testing routes and bike packing, which is making me realise the Shimano 1x GRX is quite limited, on reflection I think Campagnolo have got a better series of solutions but I bought the bike as a package.
I'm on 2x grx for that reason and aside from a bit of hunting between chainring gears or solves the gear range issue without having a dinner plate cassette
If he wants range, he should just go 2x... 46/30 in the front, 11-42 or maybe only 11-36 in the rear and you're all set. The latter gives better jumps between gears and it's still enough for most things except maybe the steepest mountains while bike packing... Plus the 2x is faster in the flats.
This! Exactly this!
Буду дуже вдячний за відповідь хоч вона трохи не по темі😅.
У мене Merida Silex200 і я хочу перейти на нову трансмісію.
І мій вибір стоїть між Grx2/10(гідро)або Apex 1/11 (механічні).
Я хочу спробувати 1x замість 2x спереду але все ще переживаю.
Як ви вважаєте що краще?
Grx 1/11 гідравліка
If you want easier maintenance go GRX. If you want wider gear range and easier shifting go SRAM.
Hi Francis and Jimmy, for me Nathan should stay away from the Grx 11-42 cassette this system as far as I know cannot handle 10-51 cassette so no way for him to upgrade, any brand is ok as long as he gets 10-52 t for future proofing because the main difference between the 2 groupset you mentioned is the difference with the rear derailleur which its capability varies a lot with the 2 models you mentioned.
It handles 11-51 m5100 on my bike without any modification on the rd.
It is all anout the Brakes, bleeding a Shimano needs 10 minutes, Sram.....20 minutes min.
Wolf tooth goat link gives you grx with cassette up to 51 teeth. Problem solved.
Shimano is best. Just built better in my 28 years experience of wrenching on bikes.
I’ve been racing gravel for two seasons now in the US on SRAM AXS - zero issues.
GRX all day. No need for electric.
I've had grx 1by (40/50) with a garbaruk cage and a grx 400(46/30-34) and now on my new bike sram force gx mullet (40/52).
Brake-Performance on grx 800 brifters and force brifters is about the same, when correctly set-up. Many people fuck up their brake setup with sram, because you have to de-gas the dot fluid and bleed it a second time after breaking in the brakes. Thats way easier with shimano.
2by sucks for bikepacking, to much gunk when riding through dirt and shitty weather. On 1by grx with garbaruk cage im on my third derailleur hanger, since the long cage is prone to bending it, especially when riding offroad, and on the second cable. 5000km on that rig.
Sram mullet climbs the best out of the 3 variants, yet. The Electronic clutch saved my derailleur hanger twice already and the micro adjustment is a really nice Feature. Setup is easy as it can be. Only downside are the batteries. They discharge when wet.
I prefer the sram brifters as of now and the xdr freehub standard is way more common than microspline.
In the end it's just ergonomic preference, except for the freehub (go xd/r!)
Shimano over SRAM anytime 😎
These days GRX simply because SRAM has decided to become a boutique group set maker specializing in wireless transmission and is doing jack shit for mech or hydro setups anymore and when they add Brifters to CUES then F both of those!
I've swapped out the sram rival 1x 11-42 cassette on my bike with a Sunrace 11-46. Gives a really good gear range and works with the sram rival mech.
I need to do that too. The 42 isn't enough for me as a heavy rider
@@alexanderh2715 they do versions of the cassette for HG and Sram XD freehubs , and they are available in all steel clusters or steel/aluminium. Shifting is good if not quite as crisp as the 2 big S brands
@@Andy-co6pn ah that should do it. I don't need an original cassette, I just want to ride my bike but it's less fun grinding with lower cadence up steep hills.
Thanks :)