P0128 - Coolant Thermostat (Buick LaCrosse 3800)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ส.ค. 2024
- Ahhhhh another bulletproof GM 3800!
Owner says the Check Engine light is on, and he wants it fixed.
But before we throw any parts at it, let's diagnose it right and verify the repair, the PHAD way!
Enjoy!
Ivan
Lisle spill-free funnel:
www.amazon.com...
The GM 3800 Series engine is the best engine ever built. GM marketers destroyed the company, not the engineers.
Love the safety sandals.
GM should have never discontinued this engine. It was one of there best once they went back to the aluminum intake
I just got a 05 grand prix in a front end colision and fixed it up for cheap. I find myself going through a lot of your videos. Awsome content.
Thanks for the video. I am having trouble with my wonky heat guage on my Allure, and will have to have it checked out. I learned something from your very thorough blog. Good work.
I know this is 2 yrs old but it's helping me now on my 08 lacrosse 3.8. I think the car here and mine someone put in a 180 thermostat and it needs a 192. Great video, answers all my questions to repair. Thanks!
I knew you couldn't resist a little look see at the maf sensor, thanks Ivan that would have kept me up tonight
Fuel pressure regulators were famous for leaking into the vacuum line on those. That could explain the rich fuel trims especially since its when letting off the throttle with high vacuum in the intake.
Great thought! If it gets worse we'll check that too :)
Just change it, they are dirt cheap, as is that dexcool. Just because the manifold is aluminum will not save those lower intake gaskets. People like to blame dexcool but do not from suffecient maintenance. I dump mine every three to four years.
The Series III 3800 should be using a returnless system with the FP regulator being in the gas tank. So this isn't an issue to worry about.
@@Sangueffusor oh snap forgot about that!
yeah, but likely oil changed 9000000 miles ago and oil spanked with cruft from lack of clean burn ( bad O2,map.maf,gumed intake) around that year of all was known for intermittent MAP death, how do I know, loved it, random here and there hot non restarts, and wild random issues. i fixed, they sold and it went another 200K (on top the previous 200K lol)
Ivan you’re becoming the GM 3800 whisperer.
Anyone can be a gm 3800 whisperer. Wonderful engines.
did mine today easy to do never needed to bleed did it when engine was cold
A full time job during the week and diagnostics on the weekends, plus making videos. Your a busy man Ivan.
I need a vacation haha
Great engine there. Wish they'd still make stuff that good today!
Nice easy fix - love the rare occasion I get those ones, LOL! 😁 Nice work as always, Ivan! 👍🍻
Just did my thermostat on my 2008 Lacrosse after Watching this video. Very informal. Thanks a lot :)
I had a 1989 Buick Park Ave. I bought it with a seized engine. Installed a low mileage used engine. Ten minutes after i started driving it the transmission blew up.
I think the 3800 was way ahead of it's time for efficiency but I had more trouble with that car than anyone would believe but it ran well with lots of torque and was great on fuel.
One day on the way to work the engine developed a rod knock and within 2 miles it blew to pieces. I had checked the oil that morning and was full.
Crusher time!!!!
Wow sounds like a rare lemon 3800 haha
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics Although i bought it real cheap and was good body wise it was the last GM car i ever owned.
I think the first 3800s were weak and the newer ones were better although they created some new problems. I replaced a few engines in the older ones.
@23:37 "we have to watch out for deer around here" 😅 For sure we don't want to end up with a Deer Trouble Code ! 😋
I admire your diagnostics skills and customer ethic. I have been watching a lot of your videos. Cheers
Good tip on squeezing the hose before putting the stopper in the funnel.
Works every time!
23:15 -- The katydids are making their rasping call -- a sign that autumn is approaching.
A little PHAD with my coffee. Good morning Ivan!
Good morning Carlos!
Nothing like watching a master mechanic to start the day.
I got stung by the EGR burning a hole in the plastic intake back in the days of my wrenching youth... Hydrolocked the engine. Luckily, the 3800 is a stout little engine. Pulled the plugs and cranked it over. Slapped on a new intake and down the road it went.
Ivan. A bit coincidental, in that I changed the engine coolant temperature sensor today on my 2007 Buick Lacrosse. (OEM) However, it is the dreaded 3.6ltr engine, :-) Had a DTC code of P0480. Believe it or not, I worked on the Buick under "a shade tree," as I live in a Senior Citizens Independent living facility with no garage work area available. (that makes me a shade tree mechanic, right! )
I've had this car for 12 years and it has been a fairly dependable car. Bought it with 29K on the clock, now has around 166K. Change oil religiously at no more than 4K. I think that's what has saved me. :-) Your maintenance techniques have really improved my maintenance. Many thanks.
Yup you are officially a shade tree mechanic! I love working outside in the shade as well 😁
Hello our 2007 lacrosse has a code for coolant temp sensor, where is it located? Thank you for your help.
Aluminum intake manifold? Whoa.
My thesis advisor had the original 3800 in a Buick LaCrosse from 2000, I think? Maybe it was a 1999. I rode in it once. It was very nice. I had a 1990 Buick Skylark for several years until the rust took her from me (a moment of silence, please) with the Tech 4 Cast iron torque master. 33 mpg at 70 mph.
Was the pre-1993 3800 like in the Silhoutette called the "Series 0" then? Has an aluminum manifold and no silly EGR to dilute the incoming air!
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics I'm not sure about that. Don't know when they started using the terminology Series X. My 1998 GP was a Series II and this was embossed on the plastic engine cover. Ivan, if you ever come upon a 3800 with leaking intake gaskets due to the Dexcool problem both GM and Fel-Pro make aluminum gaskets to replace the nylon OEM ones.
I like Fel-Pro gaskets. Especially the Subaru replacement sets. Every one that I have done has stayed bone-dry!
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buick_V6_engine
Great video Ivan. If you have heat coming from the vents at idle. You have no air pockets in the system.
I have this as well, and secondary air injection unit out of parameters and running lean... Gotta fix these
Love the safety sandals!😜
My favorite summer time footwear, Dan ;)
If the MAF is reading high, I guess that makes it easier to trip the P0128 if it is comparing the coolant temp to total amount of air that has been burned, it will think the engine has consumed more air than it really has and expect it to warm up faster
I like them thermostats with the little jiggle pins. They never vapor lock(the jiggle pin relieves pressure) so ya shouldn’t have to relieve radiator pressure due to the thermostat being closed and air being in the system. Gotta feeling changing the thermostat is gonna fix the catalyst issue also. Might not be a bad idea to clean the MAF sensor. We had a series II 3800 and the gas mileage was not so good.
TIP: to avoid flooding your engine bay with coolant you should loosen the radiator cap beneath your car to drain some coolant out into a catch pan. If you use a clean catch pan you can just pour it back into the overfill cap.
Only Scotty Kilmer reuses coolant from a drain pan haha :)
My mom has the 2005 LaCrosse 3.8L and she just recently had the P0420 which was caused by a failed ignition module (3rd one in 2 years!). So not only did she have to have the ignition module replaced she also had to have the catalytic converter replaced because the engine miss was dumping raw fuel down the exhaust and killed the cat. That was an EXPENSIVE bill! She had to have cat replaced because it wasn't passing the emissions test for her to get the car re-registered.
Nice and easy repair! Wish it was like mine lol😂😂😂. Maf sensor is finicky to get it to behave, I'm with you on tat one. Lol. Nice video!
I've noticed that the newer design ACDelco PF47E filter takes longer to prime after an oil change (and I prime the filter before I install it by pouring oil into it). I have discontinued using those "E-core" filters (made by Champion Laboratories) and only use the OE "Classic Design" PF47. It seems to me that that indicates that those filters have a major design flaw that restricts oil flow. They're easy to identify because they have that extra stamped-steel piece on the base with eight holes in it. The "Classic Design" GM PF47 filter has six large holes in a thick base plate and is GM part number 19256042. They prime immediately after start-up, just as you'd expect.
love my funnel like that.pirate air exhaust leak??nice job.
Yeah those funnels are legit. I love mine too.
Well it's much happier than it was ivan :-D
Shame that sensor was moulded into the tube :-(, makes cleaning harder than it should be.
I can't see the elements being so fragile that a tiny soft brush could not be used, it's in a wind tunnel and that would not be too smooth lol.
I bet one of those tiny watercolour brushes would work, maybe an experement with a maf that does not respond to a normal clean maybe.
Ivan, here's a shout out from a new subscriber who saw you work on some videos (esp the Lesabre with the bad coil packs. Used to have almost the same car lol) with Eric O. at SMA. You guys are so sharp and are a great help to ever-learning DIY'ers like me. Thanks for all your effort on the videos!!
Thank you for the motivational comment, DIY Dave! Welcome to PHAD!
Excellent video Ivan.
The ol’ reliable 3800 V6. The best motor GM ever made!
I love tha t motor, easy to work on they last forever, and have good power for a simple pishrod v6
Thank You sir. I have the same car and need to do my thermostat.
Welcome back!
I think I would have checked to see how dirty the air filter was first but that's me.
if i remember well, the threshold temperature for the computer to determine when the engine is hot or cold is 176F. If the engine rich normal operating temperature and all the sudden goes under 176F for two consecutive warm-ups it will set P0128, as well when running for a certain amount of time never rich normal operating temperature[176F].
Clean the Maf sensor. Clean the throttle body with carb cleaner and use the industrial swabs. Long qtips that you can buy. Reset the throttle angle and you should be good. I cleaned a throttle body on 08 chevy 3500 box truck and it cured the hard shifting and stalling problem. Then reset the throttle angle and it ran good.
Im having issues with mine running lean, coolant temp and secondary air injection unit incorrect flow ..
Needs a good flush to be done. They are a fantastic engine if maintenance is performed on a regular basis
Nothing like the Good ‘OL 3800...supercharged ones were fun!
Sure were! My Monte Carlo with the 3.8 supercharged accelerated like a fully loaded corvette lol sure do miss those
Dex-kil is starting to gunk up the radiator filler neck. Replace with regular green Prestone
Did the thermostat fix the loud exhaust sound? I’m having the same issue with my ‘08 and the only code coming up is the PO128…
Good stuff!!
You were checking the temperature rise when the car was stationary. This way it always gets warmed up quick, cause no air flow through the radiator. When driving, the temperature must have been rising veeery slowly and wasn't getting even to the 170*F, that is why it set the code I believe.
No coolant flow through the radiator when it's warming up while the thermostat is closed, so wouldn't matter if there's air going through it :)
Ivan,
Great fix and video - thank you! BTW what type of lined gloves do you wear? Noticed them in several of your videos.
God bless
Paul
Rich is usually normal/intentional if there is an issue with warmup (or if the ECU thinks there is).
I need to see how to replace the thurmastat on a Buick with a 3.6 engine
My experience with this is the car will be back to you in 6 months for the same problem. The reason being the computer tolerance is too narrow and or the part will start to wear in and the error code will return even though the car will not overheat.
I dunno. I've never had one come back.
Maybe in another 10 years!
Awesome engine. Thanks!
I took this sensor out but not as since it won't go back in a cooler sensor
With all the great scanners you use, Do the Dealerships Scanners give them more information. Are there hidden PIDS that you cant see with your equipment.
Thought the bonus footage would be ....How to remove a Deer from your windshield, and cooking up some tasty steaks.
It's amazing how close aftermarket scanners can get to the OEM ones in terms of functionality. Plus they are usually faster and more user-friendly!
I need help you no where is thermostat located Buick lacrosse 2007
correct me if im wrong but a dirty air mass would make it lean not rich.....
You are correct.
Rich at idle, lean under load :)
@@blockbertus so instead -11 it would be +11 lt because the oxigen sensor detect to mutch oxigen and try add fuel?
I got p0128 on my 08 lacrosse replaced thermostat and coolant sensor. Now code came back on along with p0171 😩
Ivan,another good one quick and simple. Did the fuel trim eventually self learn or set a code? What was the short term? It’s a total of both to set the code correct? Just wondering if it was OK. Have a good one 👍👍👍
Seemed to have gotten better after the MAF cleaning for sure. Maybe not ideal, but good enough :)
I have a 2007 Buick LaCrosse and I'm having fuel economy issues wondering if it could be the best air flow sensor or anything else you might suggest I'm getting 14.9 miles to the gallon in the city
Nice job
Nice video.If this was a dirty MAF would your fuel trims not have been positive?
Anyone know what to do if the posts tops strip and you can't unscrew them?
Could have some dirty injectors causing a stream and not a mist. Also the fuel pressure regulator diaphragm could be leaking fuel into the intake from the vacuum hose on the regulator. T'stats are so common for staying open causing that code. However that's better than staying closed! What happened to the cat code?
Good Job.
Good thought on the injectors. Maybe it will be back one day with a rich code and we'll diagnose that one too!
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics before I retired, I used to borrow the OTC injector cleaner tool, and I bought my own OTC liquid cleaner for the tool. Using compressed air, turning off the fuel pump, shutting off the fuel return line and running this solution through the injectors and it AMAZED ME how the vehicle ran after that. I think the tool was OTC #7000. My follow up to that was add Chevron Techron to the fuel, no more than two times between oil changes. It's instructed so on the bottle.
OR start using Chevron with Techroline and skip the Techron bottles. It worked!
No coolant change? This would have been a good time.
Ya would have a perfect time
The customer would rather replace his lower intake gaskets.
Why bother after 100K , a intake gasket , plastic elbow, radiator , or water pump is likely going to fail and flush itself whether coolant is new or used anyhow
@@1fnjo790
You change the coolant because it degrades over time. Over heating kills engines and transmissions.
Does that car have a oil pressure light aswell as a message
Didn't see one. I'll take a light or oil psi gauge over some smart message any day of the week!
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics ya because you can see it actually works
sensor thermostat 07 Buick lacrosse cxl 3.8 v6 replacement You said you changed the sensor I don't know why you didn't show that. Because I would of like to see it being done and Not Just talked about and all you TH-camrs do that!! You showed the replacement of the thermostat because that easiest to fix. I know I have worked on mine for two hours and still can't get a wrench NOR a socket(s) onto it to get it out!! And still haven't got it out!!
Aloha Dr Ivan🤙Cheers🍷
You forgot the hole in the exhaust and the catalytic converter
The customer didn't ask Ivan to address those problems. Presumably Ivan mentioned them to the customer, and, if the customer can afford it, those repairs will be the subject of a future video.
@@kevinbyrne4538 yes he's a good man doesn't sell you things you can't afford or need until it gets real bad
You need an under the hood light . Motion sickness.
Yip engine under hood (where else) means a good hang-up long bright light or LED magnetic inspection wand a must have!
Don't scrimp with the pennies Ivan for such everyday items.
Old video, but you forgot to put the thermostat bolt through the lug time stamp 14:16 that holds the cable in place.
The one good thing about pre bankruptcy gm vehicles is most of their common failure and poorly designed parts are pretty easy and cheap to replace
Poorly designed might be a little harsh, stuff does wear out, no telling how it has been driven or taken care of
Is the trim off because its trying to heat the up a bad cat. Was there an exhaust leak?
Lots of variables here. It sounded like it had a small exhaust tick when cold.
Clean burn@ temp.
if you bypass the elec fan get it going non stop the temp of the engine will not reach the spec.for the test.faster test to do
Nope, that will just keep the radiator cold; shouldn't affect thermostat opening point :)
this test is for testing the termostat that not closing :)
still liking that little launch bluetooth scanner? I'm thinking about getting one.
Yeah it's great! Use the link in this video to get a discount on Amazon: th-cam.com/video/WEFq1DsBkro/w-d-xo.html
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics thnx!
for some reason those no-spill funnels never fit the gm plastic rad caps properly. Event hough the cap states GM
Fits perfectly after small modification 😁
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics how'd you mod it?
@@cyoungso trim some plastic off the adapter
Wait .. did you just fire the parts cannon without checking that the old thermostat was bad, first?
Did you watch the video? I proved that it was opening too early! :D Parts sniper rifle FTW!
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics I watched all through the bonus. At no point did I see you put the thermostat in a pot of hot water with a thermometer in the water to test the action of the bimetal spring.
I completely agree that you had the diagnosis right, but you didn't actually test the thermostat before replacing it. I think people could have benefitted from seeing how to actually test for a failure rather than making an "educated" guess.
In this instance, I think that the low cost of the thermostat and ease of replacement justify firing the parts cannon, but I also think that about a lot of other situations where you go into really detailed troubleshooting.
Don't get me wrong; I love what you do and watching here. But at the same time, I think you might be a bit too down on the parts cannon - especially considering you use it, too (case and point). I think it's usually worth doing a financial examination of the cost (T&M) of diagnosis vs the cost of firing the cannon.
Stephen Dee Ivan I think Stephen has made some good points- not to mention the cost of a Snap-On Verus scanner!! Great videos as usual Ivan
Easy to change, until the bolts snap off in the intake like one I did years ago then I questioned my own sanity and made up my own 4 letter words after
Couldn't the exhaust leak affect the downstream O2??
Sure could.
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics that's what I was thinking thanks for confirmation Ivan keep up the informative and entertaining videos!
Just change “ON” command on the pcm with hp tuners
Have you been to mechanic school or you learn by your own?
Self-taught with help from friends :)
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics that is so cool iven
Anyone have any ideas on a 2005 Toyota Corolla issue where it idles around 750 feels a little rough. Turn on AC idles up to 900 - 1000 and idles smooth. Been chasing this for a while. Replaced the intake gasket, maf sensor, new plugs, cleaned intake valve and cleaned injectors with fuel injector cleaner poured in gas tank. Sometimes when you let off gas pedal quickly the rpm's dip to 500 but go back up to around 700 - 750. Still a slightly rough idle. Driving me nuts.
Maybe egr issues, worth inspection that item, usually sets a related codes.
Clean the throttle body.
Look at the TPS position at idle. Cleaning the throttle body is step #1 when addressing idle issues :)
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics Yes I cleaned the throttle body. I called it the intake valve. I need to dust off my scan tool and check TPS position as well as fuel trims. Any tips for making an adapter for fuel pressure gauge that goes on a Toyota? I want to do the fuel injector flow test and leak down test.
You could have clamped the hose first before removing the thermostat housing. And then you would have less radiator fluid leaking out. Also you should replace the thermostat temperature sensor while you're right there also. I have a 2008 Buick Lucerne with a 3.8 engine yes they are the Fantastic engines but the sensors are the worst of the all. Everyday damn sensor goes in the car and it's expensive for sensors. Sensors suck in any car but for some reason the Buick Lucerne is known for the sensors to go and also front engine mounts are known to go in the car is also I've already replaced two of them within three years
I disagree on the easiest to remove thermostat. I'll raise the thermostat on my Discovery 2. 3 Clamps loose, out it comes, new one in, 3 clamps tight done. Less than 2 minutes.
i Had the same code Buick regal it was the Thermostat
I mean great heat coming from the vents
For whatever reason, GMs from about 96-07 seem to be hypercritical about t-stat codes on FWD cars. 1.8, 1.9 Saturns, 3.1-3.4 Chevy's, and 3.8 Buicks. Also some Northstars.. Seems only a GM stat will do for longevity. Aftermarkets are too 'loose' in their specs.
intake manifolds and head gaskets POOFED out, chiensium/mexinesium gaskets ftw...
should we blame the union stooges for any of this? ( yeah, very likely part of the reason) although not their fault due to upstream pocket padding ( collegiate sheeple anyone) they all think money is free, grows on trees and the lower stooges will slave for them, NOPE! now what will they do?
Nott enough lower stooges exist nor care to slave work for them and the ones that do? not at that wage level they've all inflated it too....
LOL ony the thermostat? doubtfull....
didn't use Motorad thermostat? shame!
I've been bitten by motorad on a Subaru. OEM only!
exhaust leak is effecting cat performance
ford 4.6 easiest
The Jeep 4.0L I6 was pretty easy as well. Didn't have a beauty cover to remove either.
1989 GMC 5.7L Pickup is very easy.
You stuff around like an old woman.
1st