As an INFP I don't think I only use my Ne while I'm interacting with other people, I use it while I'm interacting with myself or even just to have fun with myself in my head when I'm bored
I can relate to this. I'm an INFP too. My Ne feels like a fast acting conversation in my head, either talking to myself, talking to someone else or even me imagining the perspective of a person or character as they talk. As the words flow I go from one thought to the next. Inner dialogue and wordplay are a big part of it. Sometimes I open up to someone and start talking endlessly, but most of the time it stays as internal conversation or presents itself through text. Ne is very fun. Thinking and pondering things can be so much of a hobby for me that external stimuli (someone talking to me) can become a nuisance and bore me.
Yes, I found that my Ne is very useful in researching my genealogy. Or research in general. The “what ifs” keep the searches going forever and I am not speaking to anyone but myself. 😄 I have also noticed that Ne will find a pattern or connection THEN I’ll find research to support it. It’s like learning out of order. Lol!
@@jpfitness2242 Dario Nardi discovered that INFPs use their whole brain when listening to someone talk. I wonder if this is why we get annoyed when people interrupt our internal world. They are literally stealing all of our brain power. This is probably why we get so drained at social gatherings too.
Yes, INFPs can definitely be stubborn. OMG. I was married to one for 8 years and then dated another INFP for 7.5 years and I'm still friends with them both and they can both be very stubborn when they've got their value in their mind and you are coming up against it. They won't budge. You just have to accept their stance. But the way I see it, they are so flexible most of the time so I give them their stubbornness when they need it. It seems only fair. And usually they're being stubborn about something important to them so it's understandable.
I thought it was interesting that at first they spent a lot of time (particularly Amy) talking about Fi in a negative light because it was "illogical and stubborn". But as they were discussing they slowly realized that as it turns out, Fi is mainly stubborn, illogical, hard to manage when its lower in the stack (like it was for Amy) but it was Hilary and and Heidi who seemed like they had more control over it, reflecting on it consistently and being flexible to new values. So in an interesting way, its actually the ESTJ that may turn out to be more stubborn than the INFP, which goes against the stereotypes INFPs get.
Good insight. However, I am of the opinion this trait varies in people of all types really. I have heard ESTJ talk about things irl and they’re very set in stone/ inflexible and controlling, manipulating situations to fit their narrative, trying to bend reality to their will. But I am pretty sure anyone, at any given time, does that; they are just not self aware in the moment.
That's why the inferior functions are, in theory, a blindspot and a weakness. It's not that Te-doms see Fi-doms necessarily as stubborn. It's that they don't find themselves fitting that description, hence, they don't understand that perspective due to how often they repress that side of theirs and resort to making generalizations (which is standard Te cognition lol).
STJs actually have more inputs and insights in this video than I ever thought, I know them in real life who are very literal and factual. this is a great conversations with them 😍
Thank you!! Yes, STJs produce crystal clear insights when they like typology. The Te helps to clearly articulate their points, and their Si is able to tie it back to real-life examples.
I use my Ne when talking with other people, but mostly by pretending to talk with other people inside my head, I have entire conversation with people that they never know about XD - INFP
As a teacher, my classroom has a team of support staff and teaching staff. I'm an ESFJ, working with 2 other male and female ESTJ. It's wonderful! Our work ethics are impeccable and we get all the work done that's required. Love ESTJ workmates! 🔥🔥🔥
Woohoo! This vid has been in my “watch later” playlist for months and I finally got a chance to watch it. 😄 I love this grouping! Being an INFP, I have such cognitive admiration for ISTJs. Then hearing Heidi talk about Ne was amazing! Most types think our auxiliary functions are pretty good until we hear a dom talk about them. Lol! My Ne doesn’t see the amount of metaphors that hers does but it sees some specific ones that I add to my visual art. And Fi...what a mystery. 😉 I don’t particularly call Fi illogical. I mean yes it is if you are comparing it with Ti. In an interview with an INFP, Binyamin expressed a thought that Fi can sound like it has its own logic and I agree with that. For me, it is used so often that when I am making a decision it feels very methodical.
13:20 to 14:15 is everything to an ENFP. Well said Heidi! Reflection and learning from our own mistakes and seeing the opportunity in life lessons makes a great ENFP.
That's right Ryan! Everything is a one-shot deal when you have to manage your energy as much as we do. If I'm not getting it done right, then I'm not wasting my energy. It's far too precious to waste like that...for me.
Really great chat from the Delta quadra. It is so interesting to see how the same functions re-arranged make for 4 such different personality types. The 'get things done' xSTJs to the procrastinating xNFPs (I'm and INFP so I know all about this one). Very thoughtful insights from everyone and it was great to see that all of the types got their opportunity to contribute. Nice to see more of Amy's warmth show through in this talk.
I appreciate your thoughtful commentary on the chat, Meredith!! 🙂 I agree, the Delta quadra is so varied depending on the function order and the J/P difference. Thank you for watching & offering your INFP perspective!
I have another ex who is an ESTJ and she is HILARIOUS, lways making people laugh And I loved how she always would motivate me to do the things I wanted to do when my inferior Se was not wanting to do stuff. Sometimes she'd push me too. Once she came for a visit (we're still friends even though we broke up 21 years ago) and we were sitting on my front porch enjoying the breeze and catching up on all the gossip of our friends and our personal lives and all of a sudden out of the blue, she looked up at my porch ceiling, took one look at the massive crossvine that I planted that was growing up and over my porch entrance and said, "I'm gonna tear that thing down". LOL I was like "You certainly are NOT" and we both started laughing. She was like "you can't leave that like that. It's an eyesore. I said "I LOVE that vine. It's a beautiful living thing! I planted it there so it would hang flowers over my steps". She said "well it has got to go". LOL She was half-kidding, knowing I was not going to budge. But she would have LOVED to take a rake to my poor vine and clean it all off my porch if I'd let her. We still get a good laugh about that.
Loved this talk, keep them coming Joyce! It’s so interesting to see the different flavours of Fi-Te Ne-Si represented here. As an ENFP, I loved collecting the new perspectives! It’s like having the same spice cabinet, but learning different ways to use them.
I'm gonna try not to type a book here, but I can't make any promises. First, I have INFP (myself), ESTJ (my wife), and ENFP (my daughter) all represented in my house, so this video is pretty cool to watch, and I have like 5 times. Second, I have Heidi's INFP and ENFP books and I love both of them! She's great. Third, I LOVE it when you have Amy on here, because she reminds me so much of my wife and she's also married to an INFP and I'm able to relate so much because of that. I especially related to when she talked about leaving the house on time lol. I'm notorious for not being ready when it's time to leave. I always have to grab my headphones and my books and my little things I have to have so I don't have to interact with people and I have a horrible relationship with time. My wife has now started telling me that we're leaving 20 minutes before she actually wants to leave, though I am working on getting ready the day before I know we have to go somewhere. I like how Amy said that she steals Fi from other people! I can definitely relate to that! My wife steals my FI all the time, but where she steals Fi, I steal Te. I'm terrible at prioritizing and motivation, so I use my wife's Te by letting her give me orders and tell me what to do and which to do first so that I don't have to get exhausted making all those decisions. I can go on autopilot and continue exploring my private world. I have a lot more to say, but I'll spare you. You guys are awesome
Any time I'm explaining my Fi and some people try to explain to me why I shouldn't feel like that with logical reasons... I just think that this person missed the whole point why I was telling them all of that, I don't need you to fix my feelings or the situation I'm in, after all of these years developing my Te (I have to admit life forced me to do so) I think I know how to find the solution and make things get better, I'm just sharing my experience with you It's not that I don't appreciate the fact that this person tried to help me, It's just that ignoring my fi just to get to a point doesn't help me in any way. It's almost impossible to me to get really close to a person if this person does this
I also resonate with Hilary and Heidi about how I live a lot in my fantasy world future. I imagine how it's going to be. I think that's got to be mixed with Ni but it's certainly full of Fi desires, hopes and dreams and values as well all wrapped up together for my future dream life. I live there all the time when I'm not at work or having to do my Se chores and such and then even then I slip into my fantasy future in my mind while doing chores. I used to think EVERYONE ended up where they wanted to be but as I learned about the cognitive functions I realized that's not by any means universal in people. For me it's pretty much a given and I'm so grateful for that.
As an Intp I find the Enfp attractive, You can connect my emotional dots, and I can connect your logical dots, often but true the dots can be really scattered. The Estj is also attractive for her organization of logical thoughts in an effective presentation, on the other hand its also intimidating. Istj is attractive for their keen recall of observations, but on the other hand we are impatient with its logical conclusion. The Infp for the exploratative aspect of their values, but we are are put off by it logical bias. Please Joyce do more of these Quadrants!
I believe there's a reason why INFP are so stubborn. It comes from two sources for us. First, our dominant Fi is very very sensitive. It leads us to holding our values to a higher esteem than anything else and also makes us sensitive to perceived insults. Once we feel insulted or wronged we reach for our inferior Te. The lower capacity of Te in a weak Te user is a monster. It demands absolute control. The Te feeds the feelings of the Fi and the Fi further validates the Te, creating what can feel like a temporary and shameful god complex - a complete ego trip. As for INFP and ESTJ conflict, it almost always stems from the INFP being offended. ESTJ is the most likely type to offend an INFP because of their inferior Fi use. Inferior Fi is very selfish at times (in some ESTJs, not all) and can lead the ESTJ to seem offensive in the INFPs eyes. Also the dominant Te might cause the ESTJ to ask more of the INFP than they want to give, and lead the INFP to feel that their individuality and freedom are under attack. ENTJ also have inferior Fi but will come off as less offensive to the INFP because the ENTJs lack of Si makes them less demanding and more go-with-the-flow. Also the Ni of the ENTP might be intriguing enough for the INFP to let interesting conversation take the place of the more sensitive, practical demands.
Ryan's question about Te and tribe focus was one I had as well when Amy mentioned that because I never think of myself as part of the tribe, except MAYBE part of gay culture since I am lesbian, but even then, not really. Even there I feel like an outsider. I feel like such a loner that it never really occurs to me what my role is in the tribe. My lifelong fantasy since I was a child was to live out in the mountains alone living in a harmonious relationship with nature. Te is what I use to think about how I want my life to go myself and then I do what I have to do in the tribe to fulfill my own goals to get that accomplished for myself. That being said, I DO have a drive to give back to the world in some big huge way but I am still trying to figure out what that looks like exactly. But other than that, I feel that I am separate from the tribe. My Te is there to help me attain my goals, not fulfill the expectations of the tribe, other than what is expected of me as a responsible member of society (e.g. holding down a job, mowing the grass, etc.)...things that are required to keep myself out of trouble with the tribe. So I guess I'm more acting in ways that allow me to do what i want while triggering the least tribe interference as possible.
Seeing you all talk together gave me so much to think about. I could relate to the points when you guys struggled to get an idea across and in those moments where the idea gets translated by one of the other members it was so clear. I never knew an istj but I have sudden great respect for how insightful Ryan is. I'm an infp and I get where Hilary is at just by when she would smile is response to certain statements. Heidi is always great in discussion, I really like her material! Oh and thank you Amy, I never had a clear idea as to what estjs were like. Not so scary after all =P
Hearing different perspectives on functions I also use was very interesting. 2 hours and I would still listen to more of this. Hope you are gonna do every quadra 😊
I'm with Ryan and Hilary on process over getting stuff done. I get very focused on the quality of the process because I can SEE how it's going to turn out and how my time will have been wasted if we do it haphazard and then have to go back and do it again, which will REALLY piss me off because I already am hypersensitive to effort and energy management. I run into this in real life where people just want to get it done and don't care much about the quality of the outcome and that drives me crazy because the end product is super important to me (as well as the energy management aspect). And so is my precious time that i don't want to waste on doing it wrong and then doing it again to get it right. I'd rather spend some extra time up front to plan it and do it right the first time (as much as possible - obviously things can't always be perfect). But I agree with Ryan, if you aren't going to do it right, then why do it at all. All that being said, I do understand that sometimes you just HAVE to get something done, in one form or another. But I remember my ex the ESTJ who would organize things in the house and really she would just end up moving piles around from one room to the next to the next or from one spot to another in the same room....ALL THAT EFFORT but the problem still existed. Whereas I would stop and LOOK at the whole situation, determine the best overall outcome and execute on that. It would take a bit more time up front but when I finish with it, then I'm really done with it because I've actually accomplished what was truly needed.
Great panel, Joyce! This one seemed to flow more smoothly than the Gamma Quadra one. Not sure if it was because the discussion was more structured or because Ne and Te have an easier time finding something to talk about. Or I'm just biased because it's my quadra, but anyway I really enjoyed it 😁 Looking forward to the next one :) Also, what Heidi said about ENFPs having the same day 100 times in a row and then never having it again is super accurate.
"Ne and Te have an easier time finding something to talk about." Yes! My guess is that Ne makes it easier to generate conversation, due to other thoughts leading to other ideas so seamlessly. 😃 Happy you liked the panel @Rainbow Kitschen.
@@JoyceMeng22 Oh, I love that Joyce. Hearing others ideas ALWAYS gives me something new to talk about. That's why I try to limit my talk time because I could literally comment on, or extend every topic or comment.
I enjoyed hearing Ryan's insights and I enjoyed noticing how he began sharing more as the talk went on. I love ISTJ vibe when we're in the same tribe! (ENFP) Echoing Heidi's finishing comments about ISTJs. I agree!!
I relate the most to Amy. My dad is an ESFP and I am an INTJ. I use my Te most of the times against his Se-Fi ideology because that's the best function I have to interact with people. I had tried developing my Se just for situations like these but it is just a hopeless function for me and so I had stopped doing so now. But then, Te is too harsh.
@JoyceMeng, I teared up when you’re ENFP told you you were irreplaceable. We tend (imho) to focus on what we love in people, their personal stories and deepness. Wisdom is a beautiful thing and sometimes an INFJ is a well of wisdom (it can go very wrong if misused, but I digress). For your friend to be upset as an ENFP shows how very fond they are for your wisdom and values (at least that’s how I understood it to mean). It can be very important that people understand me in general also, but when I know I can’t change or influence their perception, I can live with knowing they are choosing to misunderstand.
Love these guys....you can see the true experience and expertize genius here This is 3 years ago before we had a complete sense of subtypes they aee saying things that corelate to it or foreshadow Hiedi on Ne for example relaxed Ne and Blastic Ne holistic feminine Ne and Anlytic Masculine Ne The observation of frog on lillypads chart the course kind is in a sense refrencing to the Holistic Ne
I'm so confused about Amy taking Fi from other people and Heidi taking Si from others (like with her recipes). What about her wanting to do it HER way? I thought introverted functions came from within, from figuring things out for ourselves, not just taking what has already been determined? I know mine do, very much so. I think what Heidi was describing was actually Te. Not sure about Amy.
It's funny, I can relate to Amy's way of splitting everything in to separate variables. That way of looking at things rings true to me. Currently I'm optimizing my life (after a pretty long life crisis) on several fronts at the same time (because when you are working with personal growth, you tend to work on things topically, for instance, setting boundaries. And you need to set boundaries both in your personal and work life); friend, work, goals, family, etc. And I do view them as separate boxes (almost visually, on a timeline). For the next 3 month I will work on healing and training and personal relations, then job, figuring out what I want to do, after that (ie, getting a job that work on several parameters), I can begin to plan out the stuff that you can achieve when you have a stable life (good health, a job and a safe place to live).
42:41 as an INFP all I have to say is YEEEEEEESSSSSSS! EXACTLY! PROCESS HAS TO BE IRONED OUT VIA SI BEFORE I CAN TE ANYTHING! It actually causes physical anxiety for me if I don't have a good process to get things done, i just cannot do it.
They don't struggle with identity. They just don't consider it unless they either have to for the sake of efficiency or because it has been brought up as a value of someone/something they value. So, they need explanation of identity as a concept in general and even then their perception of it is very black/white, so intrinsically they tend to trust those identities that come from reliable sources they've deemed as valuable, e.g. country of origin, religion they were brought up in, sexuality as they've experienced it physically etc.
istj , intj, entp , estp interaction please. i have seen istj and entp are paired together even though they are so different. I want to know what thoughts they have on it.
Gama quadra next? We going in reverse order? 1:15:55 It is true Ti, that a tomato is a fruit. It is wrong Fi to put it in a fruit salad. 1:16:22 I have Fi in my 3rd slot. It doesn't change often, but I want to say that's because it's true. I make an effort to be as objective as possible, and I have on a number of occasions adjusted my Fi. But it is mostly static. 1:50:48 Spastic Ne is literally every ENFP meme about glitter bombs. 1:59:18 As an Ni user I like to brainstorm with Ne users too, but for me it's primarily to test my Ni, and as an added benefit there's the chance for a gem of an idea that far surpasses the idea I arrived at initially.
Ok so I’m confused when Hilary says at the start that she struggles with her Te and sees it preventing her from getting things done. What does getting things done have to do with Te in and of itself?
at times the STJs talked about high Fi users as if we can be burdensome and need to be “taken care of” by our friends-so much so that the STJ might set quotas! but in reality, the STJs and NFPs of the world both make accommodations for each other. in my experience, growing up ENFP in a more SJ-friendly school system/religious setting/work culture etc. was a burden in itself.
(INFP) I steal Te from others, yeah. T = "is" vs "is-not", so true/ false works, but so does 1 or 0. My hypothesis is that, fundamentally, logic is about discreteness between... things, at its very base (tangentially, really, how many people actually think about what logic -is-, even when it's such a general cultural and modern value to practise it? Ah, good old 5 wing...) F = good/ bad. Like/ dislike. It doesn't need more than that to apply to literally everything that logic does. An answer on a maths paper can be a good or bad answer, but it really takes logic to have that precise certainty and pin-point the discrete barrier between the opposing states. F is much more contiguous, and operates in terms more like subjective sense of temperature or pressure, but F has other strengths, like non-relative priority, which isn't an independent, a priori quality of logic. "Right/ wrong" is more Te and Fe in the same space. This bunch implicitly make a strong case for socionics duality relationships, by the by.
This is an excellent analysis @marcvesper!! I have seen Thinking being compared to as boolean algebra, and Feeling to measuring temperature. This would line up perfectly with what you wrote. :)
hmm we all steal our inferior static function if you if you reflect what Amy said which means for me I steal extroverted thoughts no wonder why it feels so easy to listen to someone who has authority of their rationality you trust your alignment to their conformity to rational until it becomes you. I don't know if that's a good deal or bad deal.
I think it is interesting how the two decision making doms have a hard time being in the energy of a function that is not their own for too long. Whereas the perceiver Doms tend to have more autonomy and less sensitivity to another person’s energy. They don’t externalize and feel threatened for long periods in the presence of functions they don’t value. It’s almost like they are unable to handle what the other does to their dominant function.
As an INFP I don't think I only use my Ne while I'm interacting with other people, I use it while I'm interacting with myself or even just to have fun with myself in my head when I'm bored
This is such a good point. Ne is so fascinating. Thanks for sharing about your experience with your extroverted intuition, María!
I can relate to this. I'm an INFP too. My Ne feels like a fast acting conversation in my head, either talking to myself, talking to someone else or even me imagining the perspective of a person or character as they talk. As the words flow I go from one thought to the next. Inner dialogue and wordplay are a big part of it. Sometimes I open up to someone and start talking endlessly, but most of the time it stays as internal conversation or presents itself through text.
Ne is very fun. Thinking and pondering things can be so much of a hobby for me that external stimuli (someone talking to me) can become a nuisance and bore me.
Yes, I found that my Ne is very useful in researching my genealogy. Or research in general. The “what ifs” keep the searches going forever and I am not speaking to anyone but myself. 😄 I have also noticed that Ne will find a pattern or connection THEN I’ll find research to support it. It’s like learning out of order. Lol!
@@jpfitness2242 Dario Nardi discovered that INFPs use their whole brain when listening to someone talk. I wonder if this is why we get annoyed when people interrupt our internal world. They are literally stealing all of our brain power. This is probably why we get so drained at social gatherings too.
Yeah, Ne is fun!!
I feel Amy loves her husband so much, it's beautiful how she speaks about him with so much light.
Yes, INFPs can definitely be stubborn. OMG. I was married to one for 8 years and then dated another INFP for 7.5 years and I'm still friends with them both and they can both be very stubborn when they've got their value in their mind and you are coming up against it. They won't budge. You just have to accept their stance. But the way I see it, they are so flexible most of the time so I give them their stubbornness when they need it. It seems only fair. And usually they're being stubborn about something important to them so it's understandable.
I thought it was interesting that at first they spent a lot of time (particularly Amy) talking about Fi in a negative light because it was "illogical and stubborn".
But as they were discussing they slowly realized that as it turns out, Fi is mainly stubborn, illogical, hard to manage when its lower in the stack (like it was for Amy) but it was Hilary and and Heidi who seemed like they had more control over it, reflecting on it consistently and being flexible to new values.
So in an interesting way, its actually the ESTJ that may turn out to be more stubborn than the INFP, which goes against the stereotypes INFPs get.
Good insight. However, I am of the opinion this trait varies in people of all types really. I have heard ESTJ talk about things irl and they’re very set in stone/ inflexible and controlling, manipulating situations to fit their narrative, trying to bend reality to their will. But I am pretty sure anyone, at any given time, does that; they are just not self aware in the moment.
That's why the inferior functions are, in theory, a blindspot and a weakness. It's not that Te-doms see Fi-doms necessarily as stubborn. It's that they don't find themselves fitting that description, hence, they don't understand that perspective due to how often they repress that side of theirs and resort to making generalizations (which is standard Te cognition lol).
STJs actually have more inputs and insights in this video than I ever thought, I know them in real life who are very literal and factual. this is a great conversations with them 😍
Thank you!! Yes, STJs produce crystal clear insights when they like typology. The Te helps to clearly articulate their points, and their Si is able to tie it back to real-life examples.
I use my Ne when talking with other people, but mostly by pretending to talk with other people inside my head, I have entire conversation with people that they never know about XD - INFP
Amy provides such good information, as INFP i appreciate it.
Thanks.
The Delta Quadra in socionics, if I'm not mistaken.
As a teacher, my classroom has a team of support staff and teaching staff. I'm an ESFJ, working with 2 other male and female ESTJ. It's wonderful! Our work ethics are impeccable and we get all the work done that's required. Love ESTJ workmates! 🔥🔥🔥
It’s important to see how opposite personality types relate and contrast, because they’re out perfect mirrors, thank you Joyce! I love your videos
Thanks for watching, Ms Yasmine!🙂 So glad to know you enjoy the videos!!
Lol Ryan kinda reminds me of how some cops talk like -INFP here
Yeah lol and Istjs apparently make good cops 😆 I’m also an infp 🙂
ISTJ tend be straight up stereotypical ISTJ, and yes, like a lot of cops and also military.
100% relate to figuring things out as I speak and needing someone to talk to who won't be offended by clumsy mistakes etc.
Yess. The Te-Ne struggle is real!
Literally and I feel so restricted when someone gets offended by that
I feel lucky to have a husband who tolerates me 😆
Woohoo! This vid has been in my “watch later” playlist for months and I finally got a chance to watch it. 😄 I love this grouping! Being an INFP, I have such cognitive admiration for ISTJs. Then hearing Heidi talk about Ne was amazing! Most types think our auxiliary functions are pretty good until we hear a dom talk about them. Lol! My Ne doesn’t see the amount of metaphors that hers does but it sees some specific ones that I add to my visual art.
And Fi...what a mystery. 😉 I don’t particularly call Fi illogical. I mean yes it is if you are comparing it with Ti. In an interview with an INFP, Binyamin expressed a thought that Fi can sound like it has its own logic and I agree with that. For me, it is used so often that when I am making a decision it feels very methodical.
13:20 to 14:15 is everything to an ENFP. Well said Heidi! Reflection and learning from our own mistakes and seeing the opportunity in life lessons makes a great ENFP.
Very nice idea getting all the heroes together
Haha thanks, I try!!
Hey
That's right Ryan! Everything is a one-shot deal when you have to manage your energy as much as we do. If I'm not getting it done right, then I'm not wasting my energy. It's far too precious to waste like that...for me.
Really great chat from the Delta quadra. It is so interesting to see how the same functions re-arranged make for 4 such different personality types. The 'get things done' xSTJs to the procrastinating xNFPs (I'm and INFP so I know all about this one). Very thoughtful insights from everyone and it was great to see that all of the types got their opportunity to contribute. Nice to see more of Amy's warmth show through in this talk.
I appreciate your thoughtful commentary on the chat, Meredith!! 🙂 I agree, the Delta quadra is so varied depending on the function order and the J/P difference. Thank you for watching & offering your INFP perspective!
I have another ex who is an ESTJ and she is HILARIOUS, lways making people laugh And I loved how she always would motivate me to do the things I wanted to do when my inferior Se was not wanting to do stuff. Sometimes she'd push me too. Once she came for a visit (we're still friends even though we broke up 21 years ago) and we were sitting on my front porch enjoying the breeze and catching up on all the gossip of our friends and our personal lives and all of a sudden out of the blue, she looked up at my porch ceiling, took one look at the massive crossvine that I planted that was growing up and over my porch entrance and said, "I'm gonna tear that thing down". LOL I was like "You certainly are NOT" and we both started laughing. She was like "you can't leave that like that. It's an eyesore. I said "I LOVE that vine. It's a beautiful living thing! I planted it there so it would hang flowers over my steps". She said "well it has got to go". LOL She was half-kidding, knowing I was not going to budge. But she would have LOVED to take a rake to my poor vine and clean it all off my porch if I'd let her. We still get a good laugh about that.
Thank you so much for having this interview! I watch a lot of your videos and this one might just be my favorite!
-INFP
So glad you especially liked this one, Kiseo Chan! 🙂
Loved this talk, keep them coming Joyce!
It’s so interesting to see the different flavours of Fi-Te Ne-Si represented here. As an ENFP, I loved collecting the new perspectives! It’s like having the same spice cabinet, but learning different ways to use them.
A spice cabinet! That's a lovely way to put it. xD I'm happy you liked the episode, Krystal.
I'm gonna try not to type a book here, but I can't make any promises. First, I have INFP (myself), ESTJ (my wife), and ENFP (my daughter) all represented in my house, so this video is pretty cool to watch, and I have like 5 times. Second, I have Heidi's INFP and ENFP books and I love both of them! She's great. Third, I LOVE it when you have Amy on here, because she reminds me so much of my wife and she's also married to an INFP and I'm able to relate so much because of that. I especially related to when she talked about leaving the house on time lol. I'm notorious for not being ready when it's time to leave. I always have to grab my headphones and my books and my little things I have to have so I don't have to interact with people and I have a horrible relationship with time. My wife has now started telling me that we're leaving 20 minutes before she actually wants to leave, though I am working on getting ready the day before I know we have to go somewhere. I like how Amy said that she steals Fi from other people! I can definitely relate to that! My wife steals my FI all the time, but where she steals Fi, I steal Te. I'm terrible at prioritizing and motivation, so I use my wife's Te by letting her give me orders and tell me what to do and which to do first so that I don't have to get exhausted making all those decisions. I can go on autopilot and continue exploring my private world. I have a lot more to say, but I'll spare you. You guys are awesome
It's amazing how the dynamic in this panel reflects the one in your household, Phillip!! Thank you for sharing :) this is all wonderful to know!
Any time I'm explaining my Fi and some people try to explain to me why I shouldn't feel like that with logical reasons... I just think that this person missed the whole point why I was telling them all of that, I don't need you to fix my feelings or the situation I'm in, after all of these years developing my Te (I have to admit life forced me to do so) I think I know how to find the solution and make things get better, I'm just sharing my experience with you
It's not that I don't appreciate the fact that this person tried to help me, It's just that ignoring my fi just to get to a point doesn't help me in any way. It's almost impossible to me to get really close to a person if this person does this
Seems like STJs are comfortable staying the same forever. NFP are constantly evolving themselves, they are change.
I also resonate with Hilary and Heidi about how I live a lot in my fantasy world future. I imagine how it's going to be. I think that's got to be mixed with Ni but it's certainly full of Fi desires, hopes and dreams and values as well all wrapped up together for my future dream life. I live there all the time when I'm not at work or having to do my Se chores and such and then even then I slip into my fantasy future in my mind while doing chores. I used to think EVERYONE ended up where they wanted to be but as I learned about the cognitive functions I realized that's not by any means universal in people. For me it's pretty much a given and I'm so grateful for that.
As an Intp I find the Enfp attractive, You can connect my emotional dots, and I can connect your logical dots, often but true the dots can be really scattered. The Estj is also attractive for her organization of logical thoughts in an effective presentation, on the other hand its also intimidating. Istj is attractive for their keen recall of observations, but on the other hand we are impatient with its logical conclusion. The Infp for the exploratative aspect of their values, but we are are put off by it logical bias. Please Joyce do more of these Quadrants!
Love the analysis @Bory Man!! :) Definitely, more quadrant videos to come.
I have to say, the Delta Quadra are my people 😊. -INFP
Yess! Delta quadra represent.
I believe there's a reason why INFP are so stubborn. It comes from two sources for us.
First, our dominant Fi is very very sensitive. It leads us to holding our values to a higher esteem than anything else and also makes us sensitive to perceived insults. Once we feel insulted or wronged we reach for our inferior Te. The lower capacity of Te in a weak Te user is a monster. It demands absolute control. The Te feeds the feelings of the Fi and the Fi further validates the Te, creating what can feel like a temporary and shameful god complex - a complete ego trip.
As for INFP and ESTJ conflict, it almost always stems from the INFP being offended. ESTJ is the most likely type to offend an INFP because of their inferior Fi use. Inferior Fi is very selfish at times (in some ESTJs, not all) and can lead the ESTJ to seem offensive in the INFPs eyes. Also the dominant Te might cause the ESTJ to ask more of the INFP than they want to give, and lead the INFP to feel that their individuality and freedom are under attack.
ENTJ also have inferior Fi but will come off as less offensive to the INFP because the ENTJs lack of Si makes them less demanding and more go-with-the-flow. Also the Ni of the ENTP might be intriguing enough for the INFP to let interesting conversation take the place of the more sensitive, practical demands.
Ryan's question about Te and tribe focus was one I had as well when Amy mentioned that because I never think of myself as part of the tribe, except MAYBE part of gay culture since I am lesbian, but even then, not really. Even there I feel like an outsider. I feel like such a loner that it never really occurs to me what my role is in the tribe. My lifelong fantasy since I was a child was to live out in the mountains alone living in a harmonious relationship with nature. Te is what I use to think about how I want my life to go myself and then I do what I have to do in the tribe to fulfill my own goals to get that accomplished for myself. That being said, I DO have a drive to give back to the world in some big huge way but I am still trying to figure out what that looks like exactly. But other than that, I feel that I am separate from the tribe. My Te is there to help me attain my goals, not fulfill the expectations of the tribe, other than what is expected of me as a responsible member of society (e.g. holding down a job, mowing the grass, etc.)...things that are required to keep myself out of trouble with the tribe. So I guess I'm more acting in ways that allow me to do what i want while triggering the least tribe interference as possible.
I like Heidi.
Same here, Ande. 🙂
*simps for heidi*
I loved this. I'm an INFP, my wife is an INTJ, and my sister is an ENFP. It was very much like sitting with family. Good stuff.
I love how Amy is very forthcoming with her thoughts and understanding. Great discussion from the whole panel.
Amy is an untapped pool of wisdom in the type community :D Happy you liked her thoughts, Dawn!!
I know I am an INFP, but every time I see a video like this I realise how accurate it is haha
Seeing you all talk together gave me so much to think about. I could relate to the points when you guys struggled to get an idea across and in those moments where the idea gets translated by one of the other members it was so clear. I never knew an istj but I have sudden great respect for how insightful Ryan is. I'm an infp and I get where Hilary is at just by when she would smile is response to certain statements. Heidi is always great in discussion, I really like her material! Oh and thank you Amy, I never had a clear idea as to what estjs were like. Not so scary after all =P
Lovely video and lovely human beings! Thank you for sharing ⛄
Happy you liked watching, @Melisa Segura! :)
Hearing different perspectives on functions I also use was very interesting. 2 hours and I would still listen to more of this. Hope you are gonna do every quadra 😊
Every quadra will be tackled, rest assured. 😃 Thanks for watching it all the way through, Ilona! Now that's quality dedication.
Fi and Ti-doms are constantly refining. Are Si and Ni-doms the same way?
I'm with Ryan and Hilary on process over getting stuff done. I get very focused on the quality of the process because I can SEE how it's going to turn out and how my time will have been wasted if we do it haphazard and then have to go back and do it again, which will REALLY piss me off because I already am hypersensitive to effort and energy management. I run into this in real life where people just want to get it done and don't care much about the quality of the outcome and that drives me crazy because the end product is super important to me (as well as the energy management aspect). And so is my precious time that i don't want to waste on doing it wrong and then doing it again to get it right. I'd rather spend some extra time up front to plan it and do it right the first time (as much as possible - obviously things can't always be perfect). But I agree with Ryan, if you aren't going to do it right, then why do it at all.
All that being said, I do understand that sometimes you just HAVE to get something done, in one form or another. But I remember my ex the ESTJ who would organize things in the house and really she would just end up moving piles around from one room to the next to the next or from one spot to another in the same room....ALL THAT EFFORT but the problem still existed. Whereas I would stop and LOOK at the whole situation, determine the best overall outcome and execute on that. It would take a bit more time up front but when I finish with it, then I'm really done with it because I've actually accomplished what was truly needed.
Great panel, Joyce! This one seemed to flow more smoothly than the Gamma Quadra one. Not sure if it was because the discussion was more structured or because Ne and Te have an easier time finding something to talk about. Or I'm just biased because it's my quadra, but anyway I really enjoyed it 😁 Looking forward to the next one :)
Also, what Heidi said about ENFPs having the same day 100 times in a row and then never having it again is super accurate.
Hahaha me too. I thought I was just biased, because I relate to this functions well, I can't seem to follow in Gamma Quadra. 🤣
"Ne and Te have an easier time finding something to talk about."
Yes! My guess is that Ne makes it easier to generate conversation, due to other thoughts leading to other ideas so seamlessly. 😃 Happy you liked the panel @Rainbow Kitschen.
@@JoyceMeng22 Oh, I love that Joyce. Hearing others ideas ALWAYS gives me something new to talk about. That's why I try to limit my talk time because I could literally comment on, or extend every topic or comment.
I enjoyed hearing Ryan's insights and I enjoyed noticing how he began sharing more as the talk went on. I love ISTJ vibe when we're in the same tribe! (ENFP) Echoing Heidi's finishing comments about ISTJs. I agree!!
I relate the most to Amy. My dad is an ESFP and I am an INTJ. I use my Te most of the times against his Se-Fi ideology because that's the best function I have to interact with people. I had tried developing my Se just for situations like these but it is just a hopeless function for me and so I had stopped doing so now. But then, Te is too harsh.
Aww Heidi! I follow you since yeaaars ago on FB. Hiii everyone🙋🏽♀️
Uwuuu. Thank you for this video joyce! Love it 😍 this is very informative and useful. I get to know how my functions really works. ENFP
You're so welcome! Glad it was informative, Ko ling ☺️☺️☺️
@JoyceMeng, I teared up when you’re ENFP told you you were irreplaceable. We tend (imho) to focus on what we love in people, their personal stories and deepness. Wisdom is a beautiful thing and sometimes an INFJ is a well of wisdom (it can go very wrong if misused, but I digress). For your friend to be upset as an ENFP shows how very fond they are for your wisdom and values (at least that’s how I understood it to mean).
It can be very important that people understand me in general also, but when I know I can’t change or influence their perception, I can live with knowing they are choosing to misunderstand.
Love these guys....you can see the true experience and expertize genius here
This is 3 years ago before we had a complete sense of subtypes they aee saying things that corelate to it or foreshadow
Hiedi on Ne for example relaxed Ne and Blastic Ne holistic feminine Ne and Anlytic Masculine Ne
The observation of frog on lillypads chart the course kind is in a sense refrencing to the Holistic Ne
I'm so confused about Amy taking Fi from other people and Heidi taking Si from others (like with her recipes). What about her wanting to do it HER way? I thought introverted functions came from within, from figuring things out for ourselves, not just taking what has already been determined? I know mine do, very much so. I think what Heidi was describing was actually Te. Not sure about Amy.
I've come to the conclusion that my English teacher is an ESTJ
Great video! I agree with the contamination of introverted processes comment you made
🙂 So glad you liked that comment about introverted functions, Blaine!! Thanks for watching.
It's funny, I can relate to Amy's way of splitting everything in to separate variables. That way of looking at things rings true to me. Currently I'm optimizing my life (after a pretty long life crisis) on several fronts at the same time (because when you are working with personal growth, you tend to work on things topically, for instance, setting boundaries. And you need to set boundaries both in your personal and work life); friend, work, goals, family, etc. And I do view them as separate boxes (almost visually, on a timeline). For the next 3 month I will work on healing and training and personal relations, then job, figuring out what I want to do, after that (ie, getting a job that work on several parameters), I can begin to plan out the stuff that you can achieve when you have a stable life (good health, a job and a safe place to live).
When Ryan said " I Don't Care" I DIED laughing lol.
Such a great conversation!
Joyce, next time when you're going through a function, can you go in in order from dominant to inferior?
Great content, thanks!!
Great suggestion! Absolutely. I'll do that next time. :)
🧡
I was going to say this as well, it makes a lot of sense to me as an INFP with tertiary Si and inferior Te like "this is how it should be" haha.
42:41 as an INFP all I have to say is YEEEEEEESSSSSSS! EXACTLY! PROCESS HAS TO BE IRONED OUT VIA SI BEFORE I CAN TE ANYTHING!
It actually causes physical anxiety for me if I don't have a good process to get things done, i just cannot do it.
So do ESTJ's in general struggle with identity? It doesn't seem healthy to take it from someone else alone. What is the growth answer for this?
They don't struggle with identity. They just don't consider it unless they either have to for the sake of efficiency or because it has been brought up as a value of someone/something they value. So, they need explanation of identity as a concept in general and even then their perception of it is very black/white, so intrinsically they tend to trust those identities that come from reliable sources they've deemed as valuable, e.g. country of origin, religion they were brought up in, sexuality as they've experienced it physically etc.
My girlfriend is an ENFP and she never stops smiling like Heidi no matter what LOL
what's your type?
istj , intj, entp , estp interaction please. i have seen istj and entp are paired together even though they are so different. I want to know what thoughts they have on it.
Gama quadra next? We going in reverse order?
1:15:55 It is true Ti, that a tomato is a fruit. It is wrong Fi to put it in a fruit salad.
1:16:22 I have Fi in my 3rd slot. It doesn't change often, but I want to say that's because it's true. I make an effort to be as objective as possible, and I have on a number of occasions adjusted my Fi. But it is mostly static.
1:50:48 Spastic Ne is literally every ENFP meme about glitter bombs.
1:59:18 As an Ni user I like to brainstorm with Ne users too, but for me it's primarily to test my Ni, and as an added benefit there's the chance for a gem of an idea that far surpasses the idea I arrived at initially.
Insanely thoughtful commentary on the video, Lazix. The next function group is most likely Ti-Fe-Si-Ne 🙂
Guys, this was so funny to watch. I laughed out loud. ENFP sx/sp
I'm curious about Hilary enneagram
Can you do this with the gamma quadra, if you already havnt?
Coming next month! 🙂
Ok so I’m confused when Hilary says at the start that she struggles with her Te and sees it preventing her from getting things done. What does getting things done have to do with Te in and of itself?
Why is it so much more harmonious than the Ni FI Se Te group discussion on Joyce's Channel?
I'm guessing it's the Ne that's helping them get along! They keep thinking about idea after idea non-stop. It helps build rapport 🙂
And now we know 1hr :21 min onwards its because of subtypes would love to know more in that direction
at times the STJs talked about high Fi users as if we can be burdensome and need to be “taken care of” by our friends-so much so that the STJ might set quotas! but in reality, the STJs and NFPs of the world both make accommodations for each other. in my experience, growing up ENFP in a more SJ-friendly school system/religious setting/work culture etc. was a burden in itself.
Agree, great comment! We do accommodate each other majorly
(INFP) I steal Te from others, yeah.
T = "is" vs "is-not", so true/ false works, but so does 1 or 0. My hypothesis is that, fundamentally, logic is about discreteness between... things, at its very base (tangentially, really, how many people actually think about what logic -is-, even when it's such a general cultural and modern value to practise it? Ah, good old 5 wing...)
F = good/ bad. Like/ dislike. It doesn't need more than that to apply to literally everything that logic does. An answer on a maths paper can be a good or bad answer, but it really takes logic to have that precise certainty and pin-point the discrete barrier between the opposing states. F is much more contiguous, and operates in terms more like subjective sense of temperature or pressure, but F has other strengths, like non-relative priority, which isn't an independent, a priori quality of logic.
"Right/ wrong" is more Te and Fe in the same space.
This bunch implicitly make a strong case for socionics duality relationships, by the by.
This is an excellent analysis @marcvesper!! I have seen Thinking being compared to as boolean algebra, and Feeling to measuring temperature. This would line up perfectly with what you wrote. :)
hmm we all steal our inferior static function if you if you reflect what Amy said which means for me I steal extroverted thoughts no wonder why it feels so easy to listen to someone who has authority of their rationality you trust your alignment to their conformity to rational until it becomes you. I don't know if that's a good deal or bad deal.
I think it is interesting how the two decision making doms have a hard time being in the energy of a function that is not their own for too long.
Whereas the perceiver Doms tend to have more autonomy and less sensitivity to another person’s energy. They don’t externalize and feel threatened for long periods in the presence of functions they don’t value.
It’s almost like they are unable to handle what the other does to their dominant function.
Delta quadra 😊
Enfp never fails to make me laugh.
Ooops, my enfp boyfriend calls me miss stuborn 😅. I'm infp
Istj and estj knowledgeable about the MBTI??
The part of the ESTJ every INFP wants to see. 1:05:23
9:15 differences begin by individual / group
12:45 lol
1:39:45
1:02:24