great article. nevertheless I am still confused if to take the k-ultra or the zp6. I mostly drink filter and most of the time ethiopia and kenia, mostly washed and some naturals. Also colombia and cost rica.I had own a comandante c40 mk4 and I don not know which of the 1zpresso would give me a worthy upgrade
I switched from my Comandante C40 to the K-ultra and boy do I enjoy it more. Its much faster, the UX is not even comparable and the coffee tastes just as good, if not even slightly better. I was previously using my C40 for some more expensive coffees where the roasters put up recipes with clicks guidance, but now that I've come to understand the grinder a bit better, it's much easier to dial in as well. Im getting really good results with your 6.5 switch recipe but also some coffees at around a whooping 8.5 for my orea low bypass filters. I love the Ultra, well worth the money if you're able to afford spending almost 300 bucks. Thanks for the review, it was enjoyable as always!
Hey would you also buy the X-Pro and ZP6? In this video, Asser said that they have different "tuning" for particular coffees so each grinder has their best cases
@@sriwahyanibudianingsih1534 Me? No, I will not buy the X-Pro or ZP6. I drink quite a bit of medium roasted coffee and from what I've read and heard, the ZP6 is mostly suggested and considered really great for (very) light roasted coffees. It is also hardly available around here and costs more than the K-Ultra. For the X-Pro, I just don't really see the point to get it since I own the Ultra already. Maybe if I start traveling a lot and the Ultra would be too heavy/bulky to move around.
I switched from my 5 years old c40 to new k ultra. Made side by side cupping test today. And c40 had better flavour, k ultra was a bit muted. Do you think it will get better after seasoning?
I went from a hario hand grinder to the k ultra, I even went to their retail location in Taipei to buy it. I’m pretty happy with it, my only complaint is that the carrying case is too big.
I think I called that out on that previous video that 1Zpresso claimed that the burr sets were different. I have the K-Ultra, but no comparison otherwise, so I'm glad this grinder was given another glance!
Good on you for revisiting your prior reviewed items. I see those LEVER espresso machines and it'd be great to find the cheapest manual grinder that would pair well with a CAFELAT Robot - maybe a K2 Kingrinder? Appreciate your honest reviews as always. Cheers from Manila!
Agree with what some commenters said about the speaker analogy. Understood it instantly. Music analogy really helps communicating coffee taste - altho there's a risk on sounding pretentious.
Good job dude, thank you! I really liked the speaker analogy (especially as I've been into hi-fi for waaaaaaay longer than I have coffee). One QA-related comment: the volume difference between the music on hold and your spoken section was enormous! I dropped in to the spoken section, adjusted the almost inaudible volume and then restarted the video and nearly blew my eardrums!
@@coffeechronicler I have some appreciation of the struggles with audio - I produce CDs for a local dancing school to use for performances in professional theatres. Thankfully, I don't have to go anywhere near video editing 😉😀
I got the K ultra as my first good grinder and it is sweet. No complaints, grind was good when I got it, usually at 6.5- 7.0 for my coffees. But after having it for a few months and it breaking in it grinds much more evenly. I now usually use 5.8-6.5 for most (in my v60), except truly dark roasts. The grind is now perfectly even to the eye as well. Planning on getting the bambino espresso machine to use with it.
if i use rok esspreso machine (non electric) is it good grinder? and how the durability? iwant to buy my 1st grinder, and worried if k ultra will break after 2month of use
@@stephanuswidjaja105the K ultra is not gonna break for a very long time. It is very sturdy and it chokes out the bambino espresso machine at setting 3. So it can 100% grind as fine as any espresso machine will need. I recommend the K ultra unless your only going to grind beans for espresso . Then you might check out the J Ultra, it is meant for espresso only. The K ultra does espresso and pour over grind sizes.
I like the speaker analogy, helps understand the differences pretty easily. With that said, do you think that upgrading from a JX Pro to a K Ultra would result in noticeable differences for pourover & aeropress?
It would be if you're brewing lighter roasts at a 1:16.6 ratio or higher. At lower extractions with more developed roasts it would be harder to tell the difference.
Great video. But I wish you would talk about espresso more within the 1Ezpresso range. It's difficult to choose one for, say, 70-80% espresso and occasional french press and moka pot brewing. Would the J-Max be too espresso focused? Does the K ultra work as a daily espresso grinder?
K is more suited to filter/french press due to the larger increments of clicks. The J is more suited to dialling in espresso but is more than capable of french press grind.. it’s just a matter of having to use more “clicks” to dial in the filter coffee. Slight changes with the burr for the J to get more fines for espresso, all in all I’m swaying more towards the J-Ultra personally.
Given I run HD600s (albeit out of a multibit DAC and a tube amp...) I think the ZP6 being more akin to studio monitors might actually be right up my alley, hah! Ordered one despite being conflicted between it, the J-ultra, and this K-ultra mainly because I'm indifferent to espresso and only do pour overs. Thanks for the video!
I have to say I had the same opinion with the K-line updates. I used to dismiss the entire line since I was unhappy with the original K Plus burr. Apparently the burr has changed from Plus to Max and now from Max to Ultra. Love the speaker analogy. It's the same one I've given to coffee friends who would ask about the Zp6. The Zp6 can really fall short at lower extractions where brews are just clean, one note, or light. I think they're best recommended for people who already know what kind of coffees they're interested in, and who have a preference for coffees and roast styles that reward pushing extraction.
@@coffeechronicler I'm just happy people around the world are enjoying what I was enjoying. I now hope they release the KS to really bring it to the 'affordable' bracket
I have to be honest: I have a Kingrinder K6 and a Timemore C2 (aftermarket plate gives three times as many clicks) and I can't really taste a difference unless I compare side by side. But I don't drink straight espresso. I like a short americano in a cortado glass. About 35 grams of espresso to 90 grams of water. Side by side the C2 has more body but to me the taste is very similar. So, I couldn't imagine I'd even begin to be able to tell the difference between the K-Max and K-Ultra. On the other hand, my wife drinks straight espresso and she seems to be able to tell when I use the C2. She makes this face that says, "my coffee tastes different" but when I ask her, she shrugs. The best I have ever gotten out of her is that it tastes stronger. I'd guess slightly more bitter. Anyway, I find these videos interesting. As always, thank you for sharing!
I have a C3 Pro, Jx-pro and Zp6. If you have the right water, they will taste hugely different. At least to my toungue. C3 has much less clarity, medium body and a lot of astringentcy, JX Pro has good clarity and big body while zp6 has medium-thin body, excellent clarity and no bitterness. But this is all in filter context.
This is not an unexpected conclusion. Concentration, extraction percentage, roast, and water all play a massive role if you want to tease out the small differences. I know a guy who won an international AeroPress competition with the C2, so it's not a bad grinder given the right circumstances.
Okay, I have an ESP now and it threw me for a loop. The shots taste way different than either of my hand grinders. More body, by a lot and significantly more astringency. It doesn't make a bad shot and it is way more convenient but I now apricate the value that my hand grinders offer more than I did before. I don't have the best palate in the world, so this has been quite eye opening for me. I know it isn't related to these grinders but at least now I think I have a better understanding of where people are coming from when they make comparisons. I think for experiments sake I am going to have to do a blind taste test at home, lol.
Haven't tried Apollo, only other grinders with the same burr (Kinu, 1zpresso Je) My guess is there will be a trade off with body/clarity and Apollo will make sweeter espresso, but more blended drip coffee.
Love your videos! I currently have a JX (not the Pro) and I am looking for an upgrade. I only do pour over / drip. Would you say a K-Ultra or a ZP6 special would be an upgrade from the JX?
Thanks! Yes, both are substantial upgrades. I'd only go for ZP6 if you're exclusively drinking very light roasts - for light and medium-light K Ultra is a bit more versatile.
First of all, thanks for all the great content! I have just been on vacation and used my Kinu m47 phoenix (with pour over burrs) to make 1L pour overs. Even though i grinded very coarse the brew stalled. This was very annoying and I had to make 2 separate 500ml pour overs instead. I find that the grinder is very capable when grinding 1-2 cup filters though. Now to the question. Have you had any experience with 1L pour over brews with the K-ultra? I am considering buying a new hand grinder that is more capable of making pour overs for 4-6 people. The ZP6 sounds interesting as well, but I thing the more rounded flavour profile and the design of K-ultra is more appealing to me.
I think that I may be odd in that I love hand grinding for espresso. I have K-Max. Is there a better espresso hand grinder? HG-1 Prime or HG-2? Helor 106? Or I need a big flat electric… 🤔
I just surprised myself by shelling out the cash for a K-Ultra to replace my C2. Although the Ultra is clearly a better grinder, with a much better UX, I wasn't blown away by my first cup as I'd hoped, given the price. I wonder if it needs seasoning. Asser, did you season your Ultra initially? If so , how exactly? And I wonder if/how much your change of heart was influenced by increased seasoning...
Congrats on the new grinder! Seasoning does play a role, but I find that conicals don't need that much. What can be tricky in the beginning when using a new grinder is that you have to find the extraction yield and strength where it tastes ideal. So compared to your previous grinder, you might want to go a bit finer and use less coffee to increase extraction yield.
@@coffeechronicler Thanks for the reply. So far I ran a 28oz box of minute rice through it, followed by a pound of old medium-dark Columbian. (Seasoning a manual is hard work.) My issue is actually that your (and most people's) K-Ultra recommendation of about 6.5 to 7 for pourover has seemed too fine. The light-roast natural Ethiopian has come out so astringent on 7 that I don't taste the blueberry that I actually did taste with the C2. I've read that seasoning makes a given grind setting coarser. So I wonder if that's part of the issue. When you say "conicals" don't need that much", I'm curious how much is enough. (I did read your review and seasoning comments/process for the Q2, but maybe the Q2 needs more seasoning than the K-Ultra?) Btw, a medium-light blend of Central American and African is coming out significantly less astringent at the same grind setting. I thought the lighter the roast, the finer the grind and the hotter the water. I guess that's generally but not always the case, and I just read that Ethiopian produces more fines than most other coffees. It's also still under 2 weeks since it was roasted, but my issue hasn't been sourness. I've been using a starting water temp of at least 96°C because it's light roast (lightest Counter Culture level), but maybe I should try lowering it to 94 or thereabouts.
Yes, natural Ethiopians tend to create the most fines of all, so here it can be necessary to grind coarser than usual, so try 7.5-8. Also, naturals extract easier than other processing types, so it's usually a good idea to use lower temperature and treat them more like medium roasts. About seasoning, it depends on each burr set. But specifically, for the K Ultra I don't think this should be a big concern.
Great Video as usual. i just have one question for you. Can you visually tell the difference between the k series and the k ultra except from the folding handle ???. I know the k has a red dot on the dial but does the k ultra have a white dot ?. Are the both grinders visually different ? Thanks
Thanks for the update! A quick question: I've got a J-Max for espresso, and boy it's tough to use, it requires lots of force to grind for espresso. I'm debating switching to either K-Max or K-Ultra for that reason, can't bear the effort anymore. Is there a big difference between the effort required for espresso between the J-Max and K-Max/Ultra? Or should I begin saving money for an electric grinder instead?
Eureka filtro with an on/off power switch replacement, bellows hopper, and aftermarket dial replacement. I've owned a niche zero in the past and don't think it's much better than this setup
The J-Max is a bit wider/heavier, and the balance is not as good as Ultra or Max. So I find the latter ones way more comfortable to grind with. But if you're already tired of hand-grinding espresso, then it's probably worth thinking about going electric.
I've been debating upgrading my (2017) Baratza Virtuoso, and am thinking about the K-Ultra. I'm OK with the price as long as I can reasonably expect substantially better taste. Would you, in principle, predict an improvement? Thanks!
If the K-Ultra is 20 microns per click and the K-Max is 22 microns per click, then why are your settings the same between the two? Shouldn't a 6.0 on the K-Max be roughly equivalent to a 6.6 on the K-Ultra?
For someone considering upgrading from the vilfa svart and not really know what coffee they prefer, would the x ultra and the k ultra big big difference with each other? At kaffebox the price difference is about 1500kr.
You said K-Max setting for Aeropress is at 5. Do mind sharing your recipe? I do 6 with James Hoffmann recipe but use 14g rather than 11 with light roasts. Regarding the review, do you use the ssme recipe with each grinder or try to find the best recipe suited for each? Thank you!
Asser, love the channel. I thought you mention coffee bean oil in a recent video but I can’t seem to find that video again, could you please provide a link to it, thank you
Lol… thank you for the quick reply. I did pick up the K-Ultra recently on Amazon. I ordered in the morning and had the grinder on my door step before the end of the day. I’ve been watching your Chanel a little of a year now and the content has stepped up my coffee game dramatically. My morning coffee is very important to me…thank you again for all the great content. Btw- I really did enjoy the speaker / grinder comparisons - that was priceless.
I will need to test it. Got a lot of questions about it. My guess is that it will be almost on par, but perhaps with some quality/longevity issues down the line.
I think the math doesn't add up between K max and J max. K max has 90 clicks of 22 microns, giving a usable range of 90x0.022=1.98mm. J max has 450 clicks of 8 microns giving à usable range of 450x0.008=3.6 mm. So either the J max has almost double the usable range, or the steps of the K max are significantly larger than 22 microns
Got the k-ultra, brewed few shot and found a good dial at 1.8 for espresso (18g in/36g out). After the first cleaning and recalibration (I am right at the zero as starting setup) for the same beans I have to go 0.3 grains coarser. Is it possible the grinder wasn’t properly calibrated out of box or am I missing something?
Depends on your definition of "properly calibrated" :) There are two ways to calibrate - put the zero at the tightest possible setting (no more clicks possible without applying excessive force), or put the zero at the setting when the handle starts turning with resistance (a few more clicks past 0 are possible). Both can be a bit subjective, depending on your strength and sensitivity, but as long as you pick one way and stick to it, you should get consistent result. If doing things the way 1Zpresso recommends, you should put the 0 at the point when the handle starts turning with resistance. How much resistance, though? It's not an on/off switch... A good tip that I found in one reddit discussion: hold the grinder sideways and rotate the body. The right calibration setting is when the handle falls down by gravity alone at 0.1, but doesn't at 0.0. Calibrated like this, it's still possible to rotate the adjusting ring 2-3 extra clicks past 0. When I calibrated mine this way, I got the same result as my unit was from the factory. Check 1Zpresso's notes about "zero point" in the manual: 1zpresso.coffee/manual-kultra-en/ In the end it doesn't matter much, as long as you can set your 0 consistently, your personal grind settings should remain valid after each time you do the calibration. We can't guarantee that each unit comes from the factory calibrated in exactly the same way, so next time you get a new grinder, get to know it before your first brew. Disassemble the whole thing, find out how it's built, then reassemble and calibrate it. Only then start dialing in your grind settings.
@coffeechronicler - here's a question I haven't found an answer to on the internet - the high-end grinders all tend to grind with a high level of uniformity when it comes ti particle size. Assuming identical brewing methods and uniform grind size, why would high end grinders produce different flavor profiles/sweetness/clarity etc? Is there something about particle shape or other factors creating these differences?
It's a good question. I'm no coffee expert at all, but I would guess its about the level of uniformity (high end grinders can all have good uniformity, but still differ to what degree of uniformity they have). And yes, I think the particle shape also matters, because it effects the surface area. But thats just my guess 🙂
Hi thank you to your interest content for onestly please just can I have a question do you think the Comondante c40 it’s good to the filter coffee in a little cafe or do you prefer the 1zpresso k-ultra?
I am looking to upgrade from C3 grinder. I wish for more clarity as I do only pour over and mostly light roast. I wonder should I get flat burr (Ode 2), or conical burr (Lagom Mini, K plus, C40)? Since I'm a home user and switch beans almost daily, I worry a flat burr would have very high retention. Which grinder would you recommend?
Hi, thanks for the video! For the espresso grinding test what roast level beans are you using? I find it almost impossibly hard to grind my espresso dose at the 2.5-3 range, could it be light-roast issue? Or a defect?
I usually grind around 2.6. Medium/dark roast will take a bit of work, but light can be very tough. After some time your body mechanics will get used to the movement, and it will feel easier. But it is like a small workout :)
Have you used the Pietro Fiorenzato manual grinder? Any thoughts on it? I've been using the K-Plus for almost two years now and would really like to compare them, especially with M-Modal burrs. Great job, as usual! Cheers.
I have tried it, but the UX/price is just a deal breaker for me. Feels like Lido 3 and Handground had a baby. Not a good combo lol. If I was after something of that type I would 100% go for zp6 or a used Ode with SSP burrs.
Great review as always!!! Do you think it's worth it to upgrade from JX-Pro to K-Ultra?, It will be 145 USD upgrade in my local store. I brew with Aeropress and picopresso. For Aeropress I brew 1:15 - 1:16 ratio and somethimes 1:8 concentrate to share with friends. For Espresso I wanted to know what is light roasted espresso should taste like so, I brew at 1:3 ratio with grind setting that almost chocked the machine but it's taste very acidic, is that normal? Thankyou
Thanks Shinapat! I think Jx Pro is only good for medium-dark and up espresso, so the Ultra would be a step up in that regard. I'm not sure how much better the Aeropress would taste, though.
Thank you for your reply! That explains why my coffee is slightly bitter when I want to push the extraction of the light roasted beans. I think I should start saving for the new gear lol.
Hi thx for your video, maybe you can help me is it noraml that my K ultra has more than 10 numbers i mean that i can go over one full turn 0 to 0 + 3,5 = arround 13.5 ? thx
Thanks for the review and some nice comparison within 1zpresso range. You compared kmax and k ultra for espresso, but if one were to consider between xpro s and k ultra, which is better for espresso? Also, is the Xpro's 12.5 micron setting vs K Ultra's 20 micron better in dialing in or impacts taste?
I'd have to more testing to be entirely conclusive, but will say that X-Pro is a smidge sharper in terms of taste and that the microns difference doesn't really come into play, because 20 is still fine.
I have to say. Sad to hear 1zpresso has input on the editorial process for this video. I wish you had said that upfront in the video rather than just in the description where most people don't look. While your J-Ultra video says they Did Not have input even though both times they sent you the device, i still think its harder for me to trust your reviews going forward, especially for 1zpresso. Can you understand that reasoning or can you provide reasoning why 1zpresso had influence on your editorial process for the K-ultra and not the J-Ultra?
There was missing a "NO" in that sentence - not sure how I missed that during upload, but it's fixed now. 1Zpresso has never tried to influence my reviews. There are quite a few other brands that will send out a list of talking points and suggestions for comparisons, or try to assert influence in other ways, but 1zpresso is not one of them. It's actually for that reason I have a document that brands must agree to before sending review units. It's up to you if you decide what you trust or not, but my channel/blog gives plenty of criticism - also to 1Zpresso. For example, I didn't give a particularly good review to the most recent X Ultra. If you find my blog post, you'll see that I prefer the old X Pro.
@@coffeechronicler Thank you for clarifying. I wish I had been more charitable and asked you whether it was a mistake. In any case, I am happy it was a mistake. Editing my own writing is a nightmare so I understand.
Copyright law is a highly complex topic, where there's a blurry line between inspiration and copies. Every company builds on the work of its predecessors, and that's good as long as it's not a rip-off. This is ALSO true for Comandante. Take a look at the burrs they used in their MK1 and MK2 grinders. Hardly their own design. What about SSP burrs? It would be a boring coffee world without Cast and MP's. They might be close to Mahlkonig's and Ditting's design, but we would never have the same burrs in 64 mm size if SSP didn't make them. K Ultra's burrs are different to the Nitro blades (grind a lot faster) and don't have any mention of nitro steel or similar things, so I see no problem.
@@coffeechronicler There's certainly a legal battle going on so I'll leave those arguments to the lawyers. As far as the K-series burr designs go, one would have to be blind to ignore the similarities. I can't support a company like that .
*See my big 1Zpresso ranking* ➡coffeechronicler.com/best-1zpresso-grinder-overview/
great article. nevertheless I am still confused if to take the k-ultra or the zp6. I mostly drink filter and most of the time ethiopia and kenia, mostly washed and some naturals. Also colombia and cost rica.I had own a comandante c40 mk4 and I don not know which of the 1zpresso would give me a worthy upgrade
What do you mean by high extraction?
I switched from my Comandante C40 to the K-ultra and boy do I enjoy it more. Its much faster, the UX is not even comparable and the coffee tastes just as good, if not even slightly better.
I was previously using my C40 for some more expensive coffees where the roasters put up recipes with clicks guidance, but now that I've come to understand the grinder a bit better, it's much easier to dial in as well. Im getting really good results with your 6.5 switch recipe but also some coffees at around a whooping 8.5 for my orea low bypass filters.
I love the Ultra, well worth the money if you're able to afford spending almost 300 bucks.
Thanks for the review, it was enjoyable as always!
Thanks for sharing! I agree, can't beat the UX of the Ultra.
@@coffeechronicler From C40 to K-max and happy dude here :)
Hey would you also buy the X-Pro and ZP6? In this video, Asser said that they have different "tuning" for particular coffees so each grinder has their best cases
@@sriwahyanibudianingsih1534 Me? No, I will not buy the X-Pro or ZP6. I drink quite a bit of medium roasted coffee and from what I've read and heard, the ZP6 is mostly suggested and considered really great for (very) light roasted coffees. It is also hardly available around here and costs more than the K-Ultra. For the X-Pro, I just don't really see the point to get it since I own the Ultra already. Maybe if I start traveling a lot and the Ultra would be too heavy/bulky to move around.
I switched from my 5 years old c40 to new k ultra. Made side by side cupping test today. And c40 had better flavour, k ultra was a bit muted. Do you think it will get better after seasoning?
Thanks for this review, i'm a big fan of this brand, i think keeping my K-max for medium dark roast and ZP6 for light roast
I went from a hario hand grinder to the k ultra, I even went to their retail location in Taipei to buy it. I’m pretty happy with it, my only complaint is that the carrying case is too big.
they actually have a retain location? i regularly travel to Taiwan but didnt know this
I think I called that out on that previous video that 1Zpresso claimed that the burr sets were different. I have the K-Ultra, but no comparison otherwise, so I'm glad this grinder was given another glance!
Yup, different but still very similar. But this just goes to show that burrs can be unpredictable sometimes.
Good on you for revisiting your prior reviewed items. I see those LEVER espresso machines and it'd be great to find the cheapest manual grinder that would pair well with a CAFELAT Robot - maybe a K2 Kingrinder?
Appreciate your honest reviews as always. Cheers from Manila!
Agree with what some commenters said about the speaker analogy. Understood it instantly. Music analogy really helps communicating coffee taste - altho there's a risk on sounding pretentious.
Good job dude, thank you! I really liked the speaker analogy (especially as I've been into hi-fi for waaaaaaay longer than I have coffee). One QA-related comment: the volume difference between the music on hold and your spoken section was enormous! I dropped in to the spoken section, adjusted the almost inaudible volume and then restarted the video and nearly blew my eardrums!
Thanks for the kind words! And sorry about the audio - I tried to edit the audio in a separate app, so that's probably why the levels got mixed up.
@@coffeechronicler I have some appreciation of the struggles with audio - I produce CDs for a local dancing school to use for performances in professional theatres. Thankfully, I don't have to go anywhere near video editing 😉😀
I got the K ultra as my first good grinder and it is sweet. No complaints, grind was good when I got it, usually at 6.5- 7.0 for my coffees. But after having it for a few months and it breaking in it grinds much more evenly. I now usually use 5.8-6.5 for most (in my v60), except truly dark roasts. The grind is now perfectly even to the eye as well. Planning on getting the bambino espresso machine to use with it.
if i use rok esspreso machine (non electric) is it good grinder?
and how the durability?
iwant to buy my 1st grinder, and worried if k ultra will break after 2month of use
@@stephanuswidjaja105the K ultra is not gonna break for a very long time. It is very sturdy and it chokes out the bambino espresso machine at setting 3. So it can 100% grind as fine as any espresso machine will need. I recommend the K ultra unless your only going to grind beans for espresso . Then you might check out the J Ultra, it is meant for espresso only. The K ultra does espresso and pour over grind sizes.
喜歡1Z K-Ultra！
還在尋找等待新出一支1Z改款讓歸零動作能像泰摩栗子X-lite這麽簡單就更完美了。
Please please do a video on which 1zpresso grinder is best for Aeropress? For some strange reason nobody’s covered it!
I like the speaker analogy, helps understand the differences pretty easily. With that said, do you think that upgrading from a JX Pro to a K Ultra would result in noticeable differences for pourover & aeropress?
It would be if you're brewing lighter roasts at a 1:16.6 ratio or higher. At lower extractions with more developed roasts it would be harder to tell the difference.
Great video. But I wish you would talk about espresso more within the 1Ezpresso range. It's difficult to choose one for, say, 70-80% espresso and occasional french press and moka pot brewing. Would the J-Max be too espresso focused? Does the K ultra work as a daily espresso grinder?
K is more suited to filter/french press due to the larger increments of clicks. The J is more suited to dialling in espresso but is more than capable of french press grind.. it’s just a matter of having to use more “clicks” to dial in the filter coffee. Slight changes with the burr for the J to get more fines for espresso, all in all I’m swaying more towards the J-Ultra personally.
Given I run HD600s (albeit out of a multibit DAC and a tube amp...) I think the ZP6 being more akin to studio monitors might actually be right up my alley, hah! Ordered one despite being conflicted between it, the J-ultra, and this K-ultra mainly because I'm indifferent to espresso and only do pour overs. Thanks for the video!
I have to say I had the same opinion with the K-line updates. I used to dismiss the entire line since I was unhappy with the original K Plus burr. Apparently the burr has changed from Plus to Max and now from Max to Ultra.
Love the speaker analogy. It's the same one I've given to coffee friends who would ask about the Zp6. The Zp6 can really fall short at lower extractions where brews are just clean, one note, or light. I think they're best recommended for people who already know what kind of coffees they're interested in, and who have a preference for coffees and roast styles that reward pushing extraction.
Thank you for your kind words, Mark. It means a lot, especially coming from the guy who played a key role in the ZP6 revival!
@@coffeechronicler I'm just happy people around the world are enjoying what I was enjoying. I now hope they release the KS to really bring it to the 'affordable' bracket
As an audiophile who has gone down the coffee rabbit hole.. I appreciate this review. :)
K Ultra it is for me. 😊
I have to be honest: I have a Kingrinder K6 and a Timemore C2 (aftermarket plate gives three times as many clicks) and I can't really taste a difference unless I compare side by side. But I don't drink straight espresso. I like a short americano in a cortado glass. About 35 grams of espresso to 90 grams of water. Side by side the C2 has more body but to me the taste is very similar. So, I couldn't imagine I'd even begin to be able to tell the difference between the K-Max and K-Ultra. On the other hand, my wife drinks straight espresso and she seems to be able to tell when I use the C2. She makes this face that says, "my coffee tastes different" but when I ask her, she shrugs. The best I have ever gotten out of her is that it tastes stronger. I'd guess slightly more bitter.
Anyway, I find these videos interesting. As always, thank you for sharing!
Yo! I have the C3 for pour over and K6 for espresso. I love seeing people with our set up!
I have a C3 Pro, Jx-pro and Zp6. If you have the right water, they will taste hugely different. At least to my toungue. C3 has much less clarity, medium body and a lot of astringentcy, JX Pro has good clarity and big body while zp6 has medium-thin body, excellent clarity and no bitterness. But this is all in filter context.
This is not an unexpected conclusion. Concentration, extraction percentage, roast, and water all play a massive role if you want to tease out the small differences. I know a guy who won an international AeroPress competition with the C2, so it's not a bad grinder given the right circumstances.
Okay, I have an ESP now and it threw me for a loop. The shots taste way different than either of my hand grinders. More body, by a lot and significantly more astringency. It doesn't make a bad shot and it is way more convenient but I now apricate the value that my hand grinders offer more than I did before. I don't have the best palate in the world, so this has been quite eye opening for me.
I know it isn't related to these grinders but at least now I think I have a better understanding of where people are coming from when they make comparisons. I think for experiments sake I am going to have to do a blind taste test at home, lol.
How does the J-Max compare with the: K-Max and Ultra varieties?
I have compared these grinders to my favorite grinder, the BPlus Apollo? I wonder how the BPlus would stand up?
Haven't tried Apollo, only other grinders with the same burr (Kinu, 1zpresso Je) My guess is there will be a trade off with body/clarity and Apollo will make sweeter espresso, but more blended drip coffee.
Love your videos! I currently have a JX (not the Pro) and I am looking for an upgrade. I only do pour over / drip. Would you say a K-Ultra or a ZP6 special would be an upgrade from the JX?
Thanks! Yes, both are substantial upgrades. I'd only go for ZP6 if you're exclusively drinking very light roasts - for light and medium-light K Ultra is a bit more versatile.
First of all, thanks for all the great content!
I have just been on vacation and used my Kinu m47 phoenix (with pour over burrs) to make 1L pour overs. Even though i grinded very coarse the brew stalled. This was very annoying and I had to make 2 separate 500ml pour overs instead. I find that the grinder is very capable when grinding 1-2 cup filters though. Now to the question. Have you had any experience with 1L pour over brews with the K-ultra? I am considering buying a new hand grinder that is more capable of making pour overs for 4-6 people. The ZP6 sounds interesting as well, but I thing the more rounded flavour profile and the design of K-ultra is more appealing to me.
I think that I may be odd in that I love hand grinding for espresso. I have K-Max. Is there a better espresso hand grinder? HG-1 Prime or HG-2? Helor 106? Or I need a big flat electric… 🤔
Thank for the video. If I’m using clever dripper. What the setting for k ultra? 6 or 7? I use medium roast coffee.
I have the same exact question so hope you reply me if got an answer
@@baghdadlibrary9047 start from 6 and see. Its usually between 6 to 7
I just surprised myself by shelling out the cash for a K-Ultra to replace my C2. Although the Ultra is clearly a better grinder, with a much better UX, I wasn't blown away by my first cup as I'd hoped, given the price. I wonder if it needs seasoning. Asser, did you season your Ultra initially? If so , how exactly? And I wonder if/how much your change of heart was influenced by increased seasoning...
Congrats on the new grinder! Seasoning does play a role, but I find that conicals don't need that much. What can be tricky in the beginning when using a new grinder is that you have to find the extraction yield and strength where it tastes ideal. So compared to your previous grinder, you might want to go a bit finer and use less coffee to increase extraction yield.
@@coffeechronicler Thanks for the reply. So far I ran a 28oz box of minute rice through it, followed by a pound of old medium-dark Columbian. (Seasoning a manual is hard work.) My issue is actually that your (and most people's) K-Ultra recommendation of about 6.5 to 7 for pourover has seemed too fine. The light-roast natural Ethiopian has come out so astringent on 7 that I don't taste the blueberry that I actually did taste with the C2. I've read that seasoning makes a given grind setting coarser. So I wonder if that's part of the issue. When you say "conicals" don't need that much", I'm curious how much is enough. (I did read your review and seasoning comments/process for the Q2, but maybe the Q2 needs more seasoning than the K-Ultra?) Btw, a medium-light blend of Central American and African is coming out significantly less astringent at the same grind setting. I thought the lighter the roast, the finer the grind and the hotter the water. I guess that's generally but not always the case, and I just read that Ethiopian produces more fines than most other coffees. It's also still under 2 weeks since it was roasted, but my issue hasn't been sourness. I've been using a starting water temp of at least 96°C because it's light roast (lightest Counter Culture level), but maybe I should try lowering it to 94 or thereabouts.
Yes, natural Ethiopians tend to create the most fines of all, so here it can be necessary to grind coarser than usual, so try 7.5-8.
Also, naturals extract easier than other processing types, so it's usually a good idea to use lower temperature and treat them more like medium roasts.
About seasoning, it depends on each burr set. But specifically, for the K Ultra I don't think this should be a big concern.
@@coffeechronicler Thanks. Actually using 8.5-9. Better, but the blueberry is elusive.
So one should get each ZP6, X-Pro, and K-Ultra to anticipate for each particular beans (light roasts, medium roasts, and whatnot)?
Not necessarily, just wouldn't get ZP6 unless very dedicated to pour over with light roast single origin. X Pro and K are solid all-rounders.
Great Video as usual. i just have one question for you.
Can you visually tell the difference between the k series and the k ultra except from the folding handle ???.
I know the k has a red dot on the dial but does the k ultra have a white dot ?.
Are the both grinders visually different ?
Thanks
Which would you recommed mostly for aeropress? Thanks for sharing this update!
K-Ultra and X Pro are more suited for brews with body and texture
how do they compare to something like the Kingrinder K6? a very popular and cheaper option
Thanks for the update! A quick question: I've got a J-Max for espresso, and boy it's tough to use, it requires lots of force to grind for espresso. I'm debating switching to either K-Max or K-Ultra for that reason, can't bear the effort anymore. Is there a big difference between the effort required for espresso between the J-Max and K-Max/Ultra? Or should I begin saving money for an electric grinder instead?
Do you grind light roasts? They are tough to grind with the K-Max as well.
Get an electric grinder and if u drink filter you can just upgrade the jmax to zp6. The $350 electric grinder matket has a ton of good options.
Eureka filtro with an on/off power switch replacement, bellows hopper, and aftermarket dial replacement. I've owned a niche zero in the past and don't think it's much better than this setup
The J-Max is a bit wider/heavier, and the balance is not as good as Ultra or Max. So I find the latter ones way more comfortable to grind with. But if you're already tired of hand-grinding espresso, then it's probably worth thinking about going electric.
@@BatPotatoes That must be with the old espresso-focused burr, right? How difficult is it to install the switch replacement?
Which 1zpresso for a newcomer to pour over if price irrelevant?
I've been debating upgrading my (2017) Baratza Virtuoso, and am thinking about the K-Ultra. I'm OK with the price as long as I can reasonably expect substantially better taste. Would you, in principle, predict an improvement? Thanks!
If the K-Ultra is 20 microns per click and the K-Max is 22 microns per click, then why are your settings the same between the two? Shouldn't a 6.0 on the K-Max be roughly equivalent to a 6.6 on the K-Ultra?
For someone considering upgrading from the vilfa svart and not really know what coffee they prefer, would the x ultra and the k ultra big big difference with each other? At kaffebox the price difference is about 1500kr.
You said K-Max setting for Aeropress is at 5. Do mind sharing your recipe? I do 6 with James Hoffmann recipe but use 14g rather than 11 with light roasts.
Regarding the review, do you use the ssme recipe with each grinder or try to find the best recipe suited for each? Thank you!
Do these get through beans easier than my varia hand grinder? Produces better tasting coffee for pour overs?
Asser, love the channel. I thought you mention coffee bean oil in a recent video but I can’t seem to find that video again, could you please provide a link to it, thank you
Thanks! I did an april's fool prank about coffee bean oil and think that's the only time I have ever mentioned it. Sorry about that:)
Lol… thank you for the quick reply. I did pick up the K-Ultra recently on Amazon. I ordered in the morning and had the grinder on my door step before the end of the day. I’ve been watching your Chanel a little of a year now and the content has stepped up my coffee game dramatically. My morning coffee is very important to me…thank you again for all the great content. Btw- I really did enjoy the speaker / grinder comparisons - that was priceless.
Very well comparison👏👏👏
What do you think of these grinders against a less expensive kingrinder k6
I will need to test it. Got a lot of questions about it. My guess is that it will be almost on par, but perhaps with some quality/longevity issues down the line.
I'm planning to buy this grinder to grind for Turkish coffee and cold brew, and I might grind for espresso later, is it good for these purposes ?
I think the math doesn't add up between K max and J max. K max has 90 clicks of 22 microns, giving a usable range of 90x0.022=1.98mm. J max has 450 clicks of 8 microns giving à usable range of 450x0.008=3.6 mm. So either the J max has almost double the usable range, or the steps of the K max are significantly larger than 22 microns
Got the k-ultra, brewed few shot and found a good dial at 1.8 for espresso (18g in/36g out).
After the first cleaning and recalibration (I am right at the zero as starting setup) for the same beans I have to go 0.3 grains coarser.
Is it possible the grinder wasn’t properly calibrated out of box or am I missing something?
Depends on your definition of "properly calibrated" :)
There are two ways to calibrate - put the zero at the tightest possible setting (no more clicks possible without applying excessive force), or put the zero at the setting when the handle starts turning with resistance (a few more clicks past 0 are possible). Both can be a bit subjective, depending on your strength and sensitivity, but as long as you pick one way and stick to it, you should get consistent result.
If doing things the way 1Zpresso recommends, you should put the 0 at the point when the handle starts turning with resistance. How much resistance, though? It's not an on/off switch... A good tip that I found in one reddit discussion: hold the grinder sideways and rotate the body. The right calibration setting is when the handle falls down by gravity alone at 0.1, but doesn't at 0.0. Calibrated like this, it's still possible to rotate the adjusting ring 2-3 extra clicks past 0. When I calibrated mine this way, I got the same result as my unit was from the factory. Check 1Zpresso's notes about "zero point" in the manual: 1zpresso.coffee/manual-kultra-en/
In the end it doesn't matter much, as long as you can set your 0 consistently, your personal grind settings should remain valid after each time you do the calibration.
We can't guarantee that each unit comes from the factory calibrated in exactly the same way, so next time you get a new grinder, get to know it before your first brew. Disassemble the whole thing, find out how it's built, then reassemble and calibrate it. Only then start dialing in your grind settings.
@coffeechronicler - here's a question I haven't found an answer to on the internet - the high-end grinders all tend to grind with a high level of uniformity when it comes ti particle size. Assuming identical brewing methods and uniform grind size, why would high end grinders produce different flavor profiles/sweetness/clarity etc? Is there something about particle shape or other factors creating these differences?
It's a good question. I'm no coffee expert at all, but I would guess its about the level of uniformity (high end grinders can all have good uniformity, but still differ to what degree of uniformity they have). And yes, I think the particle shape also matters, because it effects the surface area.
But thats just my guess 🙂
Hi thank you to your interest content for onestly please just can I have a question do you think the Comondante c40 it’s good to the filter coffee in a little cafe or do you prefer the 1zpresso k-ultra?
The taste will be quite similar, but the UX is nicer on K-Ultra
@@coffeechroniclerso please do you prefer the k-max or the k-ultra?
I am looking to upgrade from C3 grinder. I wish for more clarity as I do only pour over and mostly light roast. I wonder should I get flat burr (Ode 2), or conical burr (Lagom Mini, K plus, C40)? Since I'm a home user and switch beans almost daily, I worry a flat burr would have very high retention. Which grinder would you recommend?
Hi, thanks for the video! For the espresso grinding test what roast level beans are you using? I find it almost impossibly hard to grind my espresso dose at the 2.5-3 range, could it be light-roast issue? Or a defect?
I usually grind around 2.6. Medium/dark roast will take a bit of work, but light can be very tough. After some time your body mechanics will get used to the movement, and it will feel easier. But it is like a small workout :)
I don't get it, I see 10 numbers but it says 120 settings?
Id be curious about your thoughts on the pietro grinder 😊
Only tried it once. For me it's simply too awkward for daily use.
Have you used the Pietro Fiorenzato manual grinder? Any thoughts on it? I've been using the K-Plus for almost two years now and would really like to compare them, especially with M-Modal burrs. Great job, as usual! Cheers.
I have tried it, but the UX/price is just a deal breaker for me. Feels like Lido 3 and Handground had a baby. Not a good combo lol. If I was after something of that type I would 100% go for zp6 or a used Ode with SSP burrs.
How do they compare to the Commandante?
I sold my C40 a while ago, so no direct comparison but at least as good flavor-wise. Everything about UX is better.
Great review as always!!!
Do you think it's worth it to upgrade from JX-Pro to K-Ultra?, It will be 145 USD upgrade in my local store.
I brew with Aeropress and picopresso.
For Aeropress I brew 1:15 - 1:16 ratio and somethimes 1:8 concentrate to share with friends.
For Espresso I wanted to know what is light roasted espresso should taste like so, I brew at 1:3 ratio with grind setting that almost chocked the machine but it's taste very acidic, is that normal?
Thankyou
Thanks Shinapat! I think Jx Pro is only good for medium-dark and up espresso, so the Ultra would be a step up in that regard. I'm not sure how much better the Aeropress would taste, though.
Thank you for your reply!
That explains why my coffee is slightly bitter when I want to push the extraction of the light roasted beans. I think I should start saving for the new gear lol.
Have you compared it vs the J-Ultra? (for espresso)
I wonder if 8 microns is overkilling or not
Stay tuned😉
@@coffeechroniclercan’t wait ❤
@coffeechronicler would appreciate a comparison to the JE-Plus as well!
can you do a filter comparison between the zp6 and Kinu M47 (with & without pour over burrs)
Im upgrading from a JX (non-pro) for use in pourover (v60) and espresso (flair58). Would the best options be a K-Max or ZP6 & J-Max?
Zp6 doesn't work for espresso. I'd go for K Ultra or Max for multipurpose 👍
Hi thx for your video, maybe you can help me is it noraml that my K ultra has more than 10 numbers i mean that i can go over one full turn 0 to 0 + 3,5 = arround 13.5 ? thx
Thanks for the review and some nice comparison within 1zpresso range. You compared kmax and k ultra for espresso, but if one were to consider between xpro s and k ultra, which is better for espresso?
Also, is the Xpro's 12.5 micron setting vs K Ultra's 20 micron better in dialing in or impacts taste?
I'd have to more testing to be entirely conclusive, but will say that X-Pro is a smidge sharper in terms of taste and that the microns difference doesn't really come into play, because 20 is still fine.
How would you grade it against x pro, that you said was as good as high end grinders?
They're the same level, just better UX on K Ultra
I was struggling to decide which grinder to buy: K-Ultra or X-Pro. I finally ended up sacrificing the magnetic catch cup and got the X-Pro
Can't go wrong with either. X-Pro is almost too cheap.
@@coffeechronicler yeah I got it on Prime day for only $120...but I really wanted that magnetic catch cup 😆
@@mikepanton Don't look now (at the X-Ultra) 😬
@@benadlin 🤦🏻♂️ if I paid full price, I'd be pretty upset about that 😅
Coming from a JX using 4:6 method on light roast coffee, will there be a big difference when using a K ultra?
k6 save some $
I have to say. Sad to hear 1zpresso has input on the editorial process for this video. I wish you had said that upfront in the video rather than just in the description where most people don't look. While your J-Ultra video says they Did Not have input even though both times they sent you the device, i still think its harder for me to trust your reviews going forward, especially for 1zpresso. Can you understand that reasoning or can you provide reasoning why 1zpresso had influence on your editorial process for the K-ultra and not the J-Ultra?
There was missing a "NO" in that sentence - not sure how I missed that during upload, but it's fixed now. 1Zpresso has never tried to influence my reviews. There are quite a few other brands that will send out a list of talking points and suggestions for comparisons, or try to assert influence in other ways, but 1zpresso is not one of them. It's actually for that reason I have a document that brands must agree to before sending review units.
It's up to you if you decide what you trust or not, but my channel/blog gives plenty of criticism - also to 1Zpresso. For example, I didn't give a particularly good review to the most recent X Ultra. If you find my blog post, you'll see that I prefer the old X Pro.
@@coffeechronicler Thank you for clarifying. I wish I had been more charitable and asked you whether it was a mistake. In any case, I am happy it was a mistake. Editing my own writing is a nightmare so I understand.
It looks like 1zpresso not only took the Commandante handle design, but also the burr design. I have a hard time supporting a company like that.
Copyright law is a highly complex topic, where there's a blurry line between inspiration and copies. Every company builds on the work of its predecessors, and that's good as long as it's not a rip-off. This is ALSO true for Comandante.
Take a look at the burrs they used in their MK1 and MK2 grinders. Hardly their own design.
What about SSP burrs? It would be a boring coffee world without Cast and MP's. They might be close to Mahlkonig's and Ditting's design, but we would never have the same burrs in 64 mm size if SSP didn't make them.
K Ultra's burrs are different to the Nitro blades (grind a lot faster) and don't have any mention of nitro steel or similar things, so I see no problem.
@@coffeechronicler There's certainly a legal battle going on so I'll leave those arguments to the lawyers. As far as the K-series burr designs go, one would have to be blind to ignore the similarities. I can't support a company like that .
how do they compare to something like the Kingrinder K6? a very popular and cheaper option