Great review of the grinders. Going for an specific brand or feature could be though for the first acquisition. Several options to be evaluated !! Thanks !!
I’ve had the K-plus for a year now, some notes: 1- I was reluctant about the magnetic base at first but now it’s one of my favorite features. The trick of removing it super easily is twisting it as you do so. Otherwise it’s pretty solid. 2- Look for another grinder if you only want to use it for espresso. It takes about a minute of grinding, becomes super tough to grind with at espresso grind sizes (between 3 and 4), and the clicks are just way too big to adjust for espresso. With One click you can go from choking to a too fast flow.
I love how over the top my mom's grinder is she has a Kinu Phoenix. I got it for her when she was using a cheap hand grinder. She doesn't want any coffee gear out on the counters so she says no to electric grinders. Loved the video!
Man this is a handy video. I'll probably be going for the jmax myself, since it's mostly espresso I'm going for, and as much as I'd like a Comandante...the 150 dollar difference is a LOT when the results are this close.
Excellent review Kyle! Also the quality of shooting is amazing. I have been using C40 and I love the style, the feeling, and the quality of the cups. For espresso, I use 1zpresso JE-Plus. Fantastic 47mm burs, same jar as K-Plus. It takes 50 sec for 18 g but it is smooth, a real pleasure to use it. With 12,5 micra stepped adjustment is also very easy to dial in.
Too bad you didn't get the ZP6 in there. 😫 I bought a C40, Ode Gen2, & ZP6 at the same time. The C40 already got returned and the Ode isn't far behind. Still wanting to give a good shot at the SSP MP's before giving up on it. Thanks for the great presentation!
The C40 with all the different wooden veneers is easily the most aestetic hand grinder there is. I would already buy it just for it's decorative appearance. All the others look like the hunchbacks of Notre Dame in comparison.
The Apollo Grinder is a premium manual coffee grinder that fully justifies its reasonable price. This is perhaps the most beautiful manual coffee grinder currently produced. BPLUS has made some good choices in terms of user experience, and its grinding quality is not inferior to any other coffee grinder using a set of 48 mm millstones.
Very very interesting! 3x 1zpresso! I'm mostly interested in the 1zpresso JX, J-Max & K-Plus (coming from the little sibling, Q2). J-Max seems to be king of the three. Sadly all these 3 are so heavy/bulky that I kind of wanna stick with my Q2 (which I bought based on one of your previous comparisons). Overall a very comprehensive, interesting comparison! Thank you!
1Zpresso and Chesnut's grinders all are produced in China too! Honestly, the most well-rounded grinder would be the K-Plus for me... or the Kinu m47..of course, based purely on taste and grind consistency, but overall the mighty tree are the C40, Kplus and Kinu's line hahaha
I'm about 6 months into using the K-Plus and love it, I did some sieving tests to compare to my grinder with SSP Multipurpose burrs and the grind distribution of the K-Plus was actually tighter. I enjoy it for espresso too but find the lack of fines better suited to fast flow shots where puck integrity isn't as important.
@@KyleRowsell yep, I have both a DF64 and Ode with SSPs. While I do think I prefer the taste ever so slightly with SSP MP to the K-Plus, the distribution on the K-Plus was actually more unimodal.
Excellent video 👏 The phoenix grinds efficiently, consistently, and produces great coffee/espresso. Unfortunately the catch cup design is a huge flaw. I've replaced the catch cup and O-rings several times, and the phoenix m47 just can't hold more than 3 beans anymore. I've reached out to Kinu 5 times without response. So purchased another hand grinder a few weeks ago, and enjoy making coffee again. The Kinu was great for a year, and now it's unusable. I do not recommend. ***update**** I kept bugging them, and they eventually got back to me, had me make videos of the grinder failing, and eventually told me to go to a hardware store and buy rubber bands to hold it together. This conversation took a month, and I’m even more disappointed now.
i just got the comandante cause the reputation and community tilted me towards that one instead of the 1ZPresso. it was a close call for me. but i didnt feel like rabbit-trailing too much more lol. but im gonna need to get the Red Clix for the comandante if i truly wanna have a good all around off-grid grinder
Great comparison, Kyle! Would your recommend the K-Plus for someone who already has the Timemore C2? I want a grinder that could deliver a good pour over and a espresso. I leaning towards the J-MAX as well, since I could keep using the C2 for pour overs. What do you think?
I know the c40 is good but like the hifi hobby.. there's a cost of diminishing returns. You pay a lot for tiny improvements. I'm basing this off a comparison to the k ultra. It's a subjective.. but $100+ for probably a
Hey Kyle, I'm curious. Do you feel there are any electric grinders (for home use) that can grind for pour-over as effectively as the Comandante C40? (assuming med-dark roasts)?
When it comes to the Chestnut X, you said, "Would I buy it? Well, yeah, but I'll talk about it more at the end of this video." Then it seems you never did. What was the conclusion there? I feel like it makes it into the top grinder discussions, and even does great on analysis results, but no one seems to pick it--though, I feel like with a focus on espresso, it's frequently at a disadvantage as I feel most don't evaluate it and compare it as an espresso focused grinder.
What a great video Kyle. The wait was worthed. Keep up the great work man. Just one more question which one is your favorite espresso grinder? . I just have to add, some design decisions in 1zpresso line up is not clear for me. While this blind shaker catch cup is designed for portofilters and espresso, the K-plus has big adjustment mechanism for espresso and the j-max which is designed for espresso doesn't have that catch cup. I mean, why?😂🤦🏻♂️
For someone with a Hero S01 (Similar burr set as the Timemore C2) and having a mid year of experience with coffee, do you think i should go "budget" with the Normcore / JX or should i just break the bank and go for the Comandante C40? I feel like i reached a wall in the taste of my pourover coffee and have been experimenting with more and more specialty coffees but felt like i can't extract the best out of them which is frustrating. Awesome awesome videos Kyle, keep them coming ♥️ Edit: the Normcore version 1 is at 50$ so i might go try that one out.
It seems it got cut during editing. My mistake. I mentioned for the one wanting excellent build quality and aesthetics to match while being able to do espresso and filter, the X was a good choice.
One question I really want to know, have you experienced grind size slippage in the K-Plus? (Not because of accidentally turning the grind adjustment) Every time after grinding, it is always a click or two away from perfectly calibrated.
@Ambrosios3 that's why I've bought a C40 MK3 to replace it. Never looked back ever. The quality of the grounds is better than the K-Plus, even though not by a huge margin. But the main thing is being able to communicate grind size very easily.
@@andreswong1889 C40 is no way more centered than Kplus. No way. I own both and Kplus is more stable but this doesn't mean that the C40 is not excellent. Both grinders are the best of the best
man, the K2-plus no longer has that wood color in your video : ( it's like they nixed it for 2022........ i was almost prepared to splurge on it partly on design/color alone!!
PS - If you're unsure about what setting a C40 Nitro Blade is on, we love using this technique to go back to zero and then dial in in a matter of seconds >>> th-cam.com/video/UN1X4ELC3-o/w-d-xo.html 😊👍
After hearing me say I wanted a grinder, as I wanted better tasting coffee, my girlfriend surprised me with the Comandante C40 for Christmas. Other than the occasional caramel, or seasonal spiced latte, she's not much of a coffee drinker. So you can imagine my surprise when I learned she had done thorough research on everything related to great tasting coffee and grinders. I think this video was one of the deciding factors for the Comandande C40 she chose. So, thank you, Kyle, and Comandante. It's truly a great grinder. ✨
Dear @@benjaminaustnesnarum3900 , thanks so much for your kind words and to you and your girlfriend for supporting us! So happy to hear that you're enjoying your C40 :). All the best from HQ here in Munich, Joe (PS, thanks Kyle too!)
Have you ever tried the KinGrinder K4 or K6? They seem well made but I don't find any serious reviews about them. In Canada, Eight Ounce Coffee seems to be the only place where we can find them.
I own a C40 and I love it for my filter coffee recipes. I also own a Knock Feldgrind that’s dialed in for espresso due to it stepless design. What sealed the deal with me was choosing small companies that make their products in-house with great detail by hand (Germany & Scotland).
Hey, I have the c40 and wanting the new Knock Feld47 for espresso. So you find your knock does a good job, e.g. better than a £409 electric grinder for instance? 😂
Awesome video Kyle! I've been waiting for it. I've all those hand grinders except the normcore. I understand what you say about C40 and K-plus. C40 is my favorite grinder for pour over and Kinu for espresso because it produces the best flavour! For daily uses I prefer the Brazilian grinder Bravo It (Do you know?). Of course, i really like JX pro and K Plus too. And I think the J-max is excellent, but they could put the JE burrs to have a exceptional espresso like Kinu! Thanks for sharing your results!
I own the kinu m47 classic, fellow ode, and comandante with red clix. When it comes to espresso I am not a fan of the comandante. I cant seem to get it dialed in with red clix. The kinu is great for espresso but id defiantly agree that it lacks in the terms of filter in comparison to the comandante. Thanks for the video
Always love the thorough detail of your videos Kyle . Bonus was the comedy sketch at the beginning.....which was great. I got a bit of a "Jerry Lewis....The Nutty Professor " vibe from it 😃
I'd just like to leave a comment for others like me that are considering the normcore v2. I watched this video 6 months ago and decided to buy it since I was looking for something I could take with me. I'll just leave my experience with using it daily, hoping it helps someone. After 6 months I can tell you its totally worth the price. It makes a great cup of filter coffee but its a little finicky for espresso, at least trying to dial in medium-light rostas (I tend to find darker roast more forgiving). I'd take a little more resolution, as you get maybe 4 clicks of adjustment for espresso. Even so, it is completely capable of doing espresso. I find that its easier to just adjust the dose slightly when I find myself between steps. It isn't the most ergonomic thing ever and I had the catch cup unscrew on me a few times while grinding since I tend to grip it around the top, but its not a big deal. I'm just writing this since it would have liked to know when I bought it.
I've been using my Kinu m47 Phoenix for the past 9 months and I love it. Many people complain about the thumb stop of the Simplicity or the Classic. Oddly, it is replaced with a much more comfortable piece of rubber on the cheaper Phoenix version. To me, the most important is the possibility to adjust very precisely the grind size. It's pretty much the only thing that matters to get the perfect cup of coffee. The Kinu does that perfectly thanks to its stepless adjustment system. By the way, I read somewhere that grind uniformity is not all. Some finer grounds are also needed.
Interesting! I’m still tossing up Kinu or C40. Apparently uniformity does matter for espresso. More uniformity equals a cleaner and more refined cup and less uniformity generally equals a better texture and mouth feel. I can’t say my palette is advanced enough for that, but some of it does come down to preference.
Nice vid. Got a C40. Feeling very happy right now! Good to know that the extra hassle, which I am aware of, does have a pay off. I'm a Flair user, and espresso is such a minefield of variables that I wouldn't always know if the way it tastes is down to the grinder, though when I hit it right, it's just great. But for pour-over, I have found the cups I get to be silky, smooth, juicy and well-rounded, just like you say, from day one. Great to hear that confirmed. I'll settle for great tasting coffee and a few extra cranks of the burrs.
Titanium coating is a marketing ploy. If the titanium is grinding better, it's because they're making their uncoated burrs worse on purpose. Titanium has lousy edge holding properties. It's a buzzword in this application. *I have a titanium bicycle. Its definitely better than steel for that application
I’ve been waiting for this video, with my finger poised over the ‘Add to basket’ button on various pages, and I’m delighted to say that you have clarified a number of options for me, so thanks. Only one I’m sorry wasn’t included was the 1Zpresso JE-Plus, which looks like a potentially slightly better option for someone who wants to do both pour overs but also wants to be able to dial in espresso when away from home. I actually think I prefer the K-Plus - just concerned about the fine adjustment for espresso. Thanks for a really thorough and enjoyable video as always.
Would love a review of the Kinu M47 filter burrs. I have owned one for 6 months now, but brew exclusively filter coffee, so would be great to know if the burrs are worth the investment.
Every competent person I know says their aren't. Comandante smokes any version of Kinu unfortunately. I have given Kinu so many chances but Comandante is way superior. I was thinking the filter burr set might be a good idea, but many people say they are even worse. And I mean people who usually brew with EK43, SSP burrs or Comandante, who definitely know their stuff.
I have been using the J-max for a few months now, and overall for an espresso hand grinder it’s the best in the market for $200. The only problems I have had with it is reassembling the the top nut. It’s an awkward grip to get real tight enough bc if you don’t you’ll start skipping gears when grinding. Also, (this is an issue with all hand grinders not just the j-max) is that I recommend using medium to dark roasts bc lighter roasts can be quite the workout on your arms to grind those hard light roasted beans. Which is an issue bc most specialty coffees come in lighter roasts these days. But if you want a high quality espresso grinder and don’t want to spend $500 plus on an electric one, the J-max will make great espresso.
How do you feel about the Kingrinder K grinder series? There's the K2, K4 and K6 but would like to know your thoughts on it. Looks great as it's competing directly with 1Zpresso for price, fit and finish. Great video! Thanks for narrowing down some more good hand grinders.
The quality of you videos are awesome! I bought the 1zpresso jx after watching your review and I love it. Great to see content like this from a fellow Ontarian
I know in my mind (not my heart) that just because I have a JX Pro it doesn't have to be included in every 1Zpresso related video. I was fine with that until you mentioned the upcoming video on grind size translations! That is what I get for watching great review videos about products I have no intention of buying. Now I have to deal with the rest of my day. I guess I will go make some coffee.
I currently use the Timemore C3 for my v60. I would really like to upgrade my grinder from the C3 to the Comandante MK4. Unfortunately, it's too expensive for me, it's worth about a month's salary 😶😶. I'm saving money for the upgrade, and hopefully, I'll be able to purchase the Comandante MK4 soon.
I used Essentia bottled water to brew my FogBuster Summit Sunrise coffee absolutely delicious cup! I have found that some of those little health food stores with all the vitamins carry some excellent bottled water compared to the big brands. But for home use, I prefer RO water with Bodybio E-Lyte electrolytes for best water for coffee.
I think the j max is better the the k plus. The j series makes better espresso. And that’s all I use grinders for. If I want plain coffee would rather have a Kurieg over and pot brewed coffee.
Hi! Long time viewer but first time commenter. One of my favorite thing about the C40 is how often it is used as a reference to grind size. Grind size was one of the biggest frustrations for me getting into coffee because of how poorly defined things like "medium" and "medium fine" are. I've found the C40 is widespread enough that recipes will often mention how many clicks on the C40 taking the guesswork out of grind size that comes with many of these other grinders.
Great video Kyle! I've really enjoyed my K Plus for the past 10 months or so, and for all the reasons you mentioned. You're so right about the Commandante's community advantage too. One of the things I've noticed is when on forums or videos hearing other C40 owners share their clicks is a really nice benefit when starting out trying to better understand grind settings. Have you thought about sharing more on the setting equivalents you've found between the various grinders? I'd certainly be interested to know your ranges on the KPlus for various methods :)
I have the Normcore and I absolutely love it! I love the speed it grinds at (which my dad kept going on about lol) and just how uniform the grinds are for a unit of its price range. Thoroughly enjoyable to use and very well made. Great review!
Yeah, Normcore does really well. I own Normcore V1 and V2, comandante C40 and JX-pro from 1Zpresso Have to say these are amazing grinders. C40 & JX-pro are very very similar in taste. In fact the JX-pro brings a bit more sweetness to the front and is a tiny bit less acidic than the C40, but can't choose one over the other for pour over TBH That being said, Normcore (entry level) does exceptionally well for such a low price and build quality is just great.
@@lightandthesungod well, worth mentioning that Normcore grinders are really good and uniform. So much that i use them for traveling and my brews (aeropress) taste amazing. Very nice and rich flavor, no complains at all and the whole package with a quality carrying case, brush and blower is just GREAT! From a certain point you start comparing grinders instead of replacing them. And here is my point. Normcore does incredibly well to be an
@@manuelpenaruiz3694 exactly! for everything coarser than espresso, the normcore smashes it out of the park! if it had enough adjustment to dial in for espresso properly it would probably be one of the best manual grinders out there
I pop the handles off put a nut on threads and use my drill to grind. There is no way I'm hand grinding my 1st cup unless backpacking. works great. choose low speed.... a less torque-y model than my cordless 20 Volt drill would be desirable.........Hmmm A cordless Dremel???? Chuck is mighty small on those. Or I find a trained monkey and replace handle.
Need improvement on the introduction. Quickly explain what the purpose of the video is. quickly explain subject for newbies and why the features and important.
Great video. I have the Timemore Chestnut X myself. I kinda wish you had included the Apollo BPlus grinder, as I think that one is as good, if not better than the Timemore Chestnut X. Look into that one for a future video.
Hi Kyle, thanks for your video! How do you compare K-max and K-plus? I am kind of torn in between these two to choose. I like the look of K-max more as it’s slimmer and somehow thus more sleek. Also I am not into espresso, but more for the pour over, so I don’t have to have that removable bottom feature. Would you say K-Max is the same as K-plus but just slimmer and without that removable bottom feature?
I have the J Max and use it mostly for Pour Overs... I'm in love! It is great to grind and it doesn't feel that you are taking too much time, rather (as he mentioned), it feels like you are getting something done (30g every morning). The taste is incredible (maybe because of the panamenian coffees I get to enjoy) and the notes feel rich and it's like the notes start to explode (something I rarely experience in a cafe/coffee shop). Hahaha maybe it's the whole experience of making and sharing coffee but I don't regret getting my J Max for Pour Overs! 😄
Hello! I was curious how well the Jmax is for Pour overs , was concern coz of the 8.8 microns maybe it was too much of leap for it, I mainly do espresso and pour overs . Haven’t read/seen a lot about Jmax used for pour overs, only for espresso
@@BonEE008 Hi! There is a channel that explains in depth the J Max (is the best review I've seen so far) TMB - The Majestic Bean Channel. I just brew my pour over and it's really tasty. What Kyle mentioned in his review (if I got it right) is that to change from espresso to pour over is quite difficult because there are a lot of clicks, was corrected in this video when he mentioned that there is a pyramid below the ring that will allows you to know how many rotations you have. The last thing is that once you receive it I will recommend you to adjust the ring to 0. That way you will be precise in your measurements. It is easy to take apart for cleaning and put it all back together.
Hi! Thanks for the great review. I am looking to upgrade my Hario Skerton Plus, my friend recently got a 1Zpresso JX and I've been able to test it and I am very impressed with it. I know JX is capable of grinding for espresso with its 12 um step, even if less precise than the JMax. Would you say the Normcore v2 with doubled number of steps per turn could do an alright job grinding for espresso, or would it still fall short in that department? I mainly brew pourover and aeropress, with an occasional moka pot, but I would like to get a manual espresso maker such as the Flair at one point, I would love to have one grinder suitable for both espresso and the alternative methods.
Wow! This is one the unicorn comparison videos that I'm sure many many people will be waiting for !! Great work Kyle. You did a great job to keep this video digestible despite being so long and thorough! I have a K-Plus and my friend has a C40. The C40 is super nice but no way I could give up the grind speed, catch cup, and ease of grind adjustment with the K-Plus. As for taste, both are good , it was hard to tell any real difference but we only did a very brief tasting.
Hey, I'm here to tell you what's the REAL difference between the Kplus and the C40: durability C40 doesn't have the fancy Hi-Tech adjustment mechanism of the K series but trust me it will last for generations. Can't say the same about the Kplus. The adjustment mechanism is delicate (mine was spilled with water and boom... It's damaged. No joke, it's broken) I used to own a Jxpro. Then stepped up to Kplus and dude... Regret I did. At least the Jxpro can be washed with water and soap and will Never let you down.
Great video once again, I loved it until you came with the Normcore, I won’t go into to much detail here, I was the winner of that grinder and all I can say is that the built quality of the grinder is atrocious, I would not recommend that grinder to anyone, I also own the Timemore C2, not great but much better than the Normcore, sorry I had to say it🤷♂️, but otherwise great content.👍
Great video Kyle! I have a C40 and can't wait for your future video with the red clix...it's hard to get it in argentina and want to know whether it worths the money.
Can you compare with the lido og grinder? I haven’t seen one done especially how you review the grinders, price, taste, nuances, convenience/ practicality. Thanks in advance. I’m on the edge of getting one.
Sift Test:
Ground at 800 Microns
C40
Time: 1.15
Boulder: 0.5
Sweet Spot: 17.1
Fine: 1.9
85.5%
K-Plus
Time: 0.37
Boulder: .5
Ss: 17.6
Fine: 1.5
88%
Chestnut X
Time: 1.15
Boulder: 0.9
SS: 17:7
Fine: 1
88.5%
Kinu:
Time: 0.50
Boulder: 1.3
SS: 17.4
Fine: 0.7
87%
JMAX:
Time: 0.57
Boulder: 0.6
SS: 18.1
Fine: 0.6
90%
JX
time: 0.55
B: 1.1
Ss: 16.9
F: 0.9
84.5%
Normcore:
time: 0.44
Boulder: 1.8
SS: 16.5
Fine: 1.2
82.5%
👀
Not sure if you did a comparison to the JX-Pro?
Are you considering to review the arco grinder when it comes out? I love the idea of adding the other Kyle to the video tho!
Great review of the grinders. Going for an specific brand or feature could be though for the first acquisition. Several options to be evaluated !! Thanks !!
Which would you choose, the 1Zpresso K Plus or Fellow Ode?
I’ve had the K-plus for a year now, some notes:
1- I was reluctant about the magnetic base at first but now it’s one of my favorite features. The trick of removing it super easily is twisting it as you do so. Otherwise it’s pretty solid.
2- Look for another grinder if you only want to use it for espresso. It takes about a minute of grinding, becomes super tough to grind with at espresso grind sizes (between 3 and 4), and the clicks are just way too big to adjust for espresso. With One click you can go from choking to a too fast flow.
The m47 classic is built like a military rifle, and the micro adjustment is unbeatable for espresso.
I love how over the top my mom's grinder is she has a Kinu Phoenix. I got it for her when she was using a cheap hand grinder. She doesn't want any coffee gear out on the counters so she says no to electric grinders. Loved the video!
Great video, Kyle! Thanks for the shout-out 😀🙏 Happy grinding everyone!
My pleasure! All the best!
Another amazing video Kyle! Congratulations on the 3rd Wave sponsorship! That's huge
Thank you! I’m a huge fan of their products so it seems like a natural fit!
Man this is a handy video.
I'll probably be going for the jmax myself, since it's mostly espresso I'm going for, and as much as I'd like a Comandante...the 150 dollar difference is a LOT when the results are this close.
Excellent review Kyle! Also the quality of shooting is amazing. I have been using C40 and I love the style, the feeling, and the quality of the cups. For espresso, I use 1zpresso JE-Plus. Fantastic 47mm burs, same jar as K-Plus. It takes 50 sec for 18 g but it is smooth, a real pleasure to use it. With 12,5 micra stepped adjustment is also very easy to dial in.
Thanks for the thoughts!!
what makes you prefer the JE-Plus over the C40 for espresso, when it comes to taste?
Too bad you didn't get the ZP6 in there. 😫 I bought a C40, Ode Gen2, & ZP6 at the same time. The C40 already got returned and the Ode isn't far behind. Still wanting to give a good shot at the SSP MP's before giving up on it.
Thanks for the great presentation!
Well done Kyle. Great job on the video. I think I go with Kplus as well.
Thanks for watching!
Would really love your take on KINGrinder, specifically, the K2 and K4
The C40 with all the different wooden veneers is easily the most aestetic hand grinder there is. I would already buy it just for it's decorative appearance. All the others look like the hunchbacks of Notre Dame in comparison.
Missing out Orphan Espresso Lido OG. There is a wonderful grinder back to field with step and step less grind setting.
The Apollo Grinder is a premium manual coffee grinder that fully justifies its reasonable price. This is perhaps the most beautiful manual coffee grinder currently produced. BPLUS has made some good choices in terms of user experience, and its grinding quality is not inferior to any other coffee grinder using a set of 48 mm millstones.
Very very interesting! 3x 1zpresso! I'm mostly interested in the 1zpresso JX, J-Max & K-Plus (coming from the little sibling, Q2). J-Max seems to be king of the three. Sadly all these 3 are so heavy/bulky that I kind of wanna stick with my Q2 (which I bought based on one of your previous comparisons).
Overall a very comprehensive, interesting comparison! Thank you!
1Zpresso and Chesnut's grinders all are produced in China too! Honestly, the most well-rounded grinder would be the K-Plus for me... or the Kinu m47..of course, based purely on taste and grind consistency, but overall the mighty tree are the C40, Kplus and Kinu's line hahaha
Kinu is produced in bulgaria if i am not mistaken to add to your list.
@@keulengnomdererste2850 romania hahah
I'm about 6 months into using the K-Plus and love it, I did some sieving tests to compare to my grinder with SSP Multipurpose burrs and the grind distribution of the K-Plus was actually tighter. I enjoy it for espresso too but find the lack of fines better suited to fast flow shots where puck integrity isn't as important.
Thanks for sharing! I didn’t realize SSP had a burr set for the k plus? Now I’ve got some more testing to do 🥲
@@KyleRowsell no kyle, he means he tested it with his another grinder that using ssp mp.
@@SAMUEL-zc2mv clearly I need another coffee. Thanks! Ha
@@KyleRowsell yep, I have both a DF64 and Ode with SSPs. While I do think I prefer the taste ever so slightly with SSP MP to the K-Plus, the distribution on the K-Plus was actually more unimodal.
Just picked up my JX grinder, really loving it !
Your comparison videos are really the best I enjoyed them all
Ah thanks so much!!
Sad the Lido ET did not make the list, seriously an amazing espresso grinder.
Probably the best bang for your buck for espresso grind, if you can deal with the size and the locking ring.
It's crazy how people are paying 400 bucks for a metall cylinder, with a few bits and bobs
Excellent video 👏
The phoenix grinds efficiently, consistently, and produces great coffee/espresso. Unfortunately the catch cup design is a huge flaw. I've replaced the catch cup and O-rings several times, and the phoenix m47 just can't hold more than 3 beans anymore.
I've reached out to Kinu 5 times without response.
So purchased another hand grinder a few weeks ago, and enjoy making coffee again.
The Kinu was great for a year, and now it's unusable. I do not recommend.
***update****
I kept bugging them, and they eventually got back to me, had me make videos of the grinder failing, and eventually told me to go to a hardware store and buy rubber bands to hold it together. This conversation took a month, and I’m even more disappointed now.
Which of these besides the 1zpresso will grind Turkish powdered coffee?
i just got the comandante cause the reputation and community tilted me towards that one instead of the 1ZPresso. it was a close call for me. but i didnt feel like rabbit-trailing too much more lol. but im gonna need to get the Red Clix for the comandante if i truly wanna have a good all around off-grid grinder
Great comparison, Kyle! Would your recommend the K-Plus for someone who already has the Timemore C2? I want a grinder that could deliver a good pour over and a espresso. I leaning towards the J-MAX as well, since I could keep using the C2 for pour overs. What do you think?
J max produces more fines than JX or JX-pro
If you want and all rounder grinder for any method, then the JX-pro is an easy choice.
I know the c40 is good but like the hifi hobby.. there's a cost of diminishing returns. You pay a lot for tiny improvements. I'm basing this off a comparison to the k ultra. It's a subjective.. but $100+ for probably a
Awesome review sir! Very informative
Thanks for watching!
Hey Kyle, I'm curious. Do you feel there are any electric grinders (for home use) that can grind for pour-over as effectively as the Comandante C40? (assuming med-dark roasts)?
I'm afraid not
When it comes to the Chestnut X, you said, "Would I buy it? Well, yeah, but I'll talk about it more at the end of this video." Then it seems you never did. What was the conclusion there? I feel like it makes it into the top grinder discussions, and even does great on analysis results, but no one seems to pick it--though, I feel like with a focus on espresso, it's frequently at a disadvantage as I feel most don't evaluate it and compare it as an espresso focused grinder.
Thanks for this great comparison, Kyle! Which one do you think produced the best espresso shot? And what about the JE-Plus?
Great video! Can you please do a comparison between these manual grinders and the top electric grinders like the Niche Zero in term of flavor?
I’ll look into it!
love the content . I have Kinu m47 phoenix its an amazing grinder and good investments I ever did , unfortunately we have small community .
What a great video Kyle. The wait was worthed. Keep up the great work man. Just one more question which one is your favorite espresso grinder?
.
I just have to add, some design decisions in 1zpresso line up is not clear for me. While this blind shaker catch cup is designed for portofilters and espresso, the K-plus has big adjustment mechanism for espresso and the j-max which is designed for espresso doesn't have that catch cup. I mean, why?😂🤦🏻♂️
kinggrinder K6 !
For someone with a Hero S01 (Similar burr set as the Timemore C2) and having a mid year of experience with coffee, do you think i should go "budget" with the Normcore / JX or should i just break the bank and go for the Comandante C40? I feel like i reached a wall in the taste of my pourover coffee and have been experimenting with more and more specialty coffees but felt like i can't extract the best out of them which is frustrating.
Awesome awesome videos Kyle, keep them coming ♥️
Edit: the Normcore version 1 is at 50$ so i might go try that one out.
Thanks for watching!
Thanks for the vid, very informative. The Amazon link rates the Normcore @ 25 grams. Do you know which is correct, 20 vs 25?
It can do 20 grams easily and 25 grams very tediously.
Would upgrading to a JX from a Hario Mini Slim be considered a upgrade?
Yes absolutely
Did I miss it or did you not say why you would buy Chestnut at the end like you said you would? Cheers great videos, thank you so much for them!
It seems it got cut during editing. My mistake.
I mentioned for the one wanting excellent build quality and aesthetics to match while being able to do espresso and filter, the X was a good choice.
Swell vid!
Thanks!
One question I really want to know, have you experienced grind size slippage in the K-Plus? (Not because of accidentally turning the grind adjustment) Every time after grinding, it is always a click or two away from perfectly calibrated.
@Ambrosios3 that's why I've bought a C40 MK3 to replace it. Never looked back ever. The quality of the grounds is better than the K-Plus, even though not by a huge margin. But the main thing is being able to communicate grind size very easily.
@Ambrosios3 that's not a quality defect. It's called tolerance and it's absolutely normal to any machine/mechanism
Have you read the manual?
@@andreswong1889 C40 is no way more centered than Kplus. No way. I own both and Kplus is more stable but this doesn't mean that the C40 is not excellent. Both grinders are the best of the best
final verdict on the Chestnut?
man, the K2-plus no longer has that wood color in your video : ( it's like they nixed it for 2022........ i was almost prepared to splurge on it partly on design/color alone!!
It took over a minute to grind on the C40? Was your wife doing the grinding? lol
How come the JX grind time is much slower in this comparison compared to the budget grinder comparison video
Ground at 800 microns vs 1100 in that video
@@KyleRowsell Thanks for the clarification, keep up the good work
Hey there Kyle, we're so happy that you love coffees brewed with your C40 Nitro Blade 🙏😊. All the best to you from all the team here in Munich!
PS - If you're unsure about what setting a C40 Nitro Blade is on, we love using this technique to go back to zero and then dial in in a matter of seconds >>> th-cam.com/video/UN1X4ELC3-o/w-d-xo.html 😊👍
Thanks friends!
After hearing me say I wanted a grinder, as I wanted better tasting coffee, my girlfriend surprised me with the Comandante C40 for Christmas.
Other than the occasional caramel, or seasonal spiced latte, she's not much of a coffee drinker.
So you can imagine my surprise when I learned she had done thorough research on everything related to great tasting coffee and grinders.
I think this video was one of the deciding factors for the Comandande C40 she chose.
So, thank you, Kyle, and Comandante. It's truly a great grinder. ✨
Dear @@benjaminaustnesnarum3900 , thanks so much for your kind words and to you and your girlfriend for supporting us! So happy to hear that you're enjoying your C40 :).
All the best from HQ here in Munich,
Joe
(PS, thanks Kyle too!)
It's beautiful but I can't justify the price.
Have you ever tried the KinGrinder K4 or K6? They seem well made but I don't find any serious reviews about them. In Canada, Eight Ounce Coffee seems to be the only place where we can find them.
It's absolutely insane the price of grinders....for what they do, DAMN!!!
I own a C40 and I love it for my filter coffee recipes. I also own a Knock Feldgrind that’s dialed in for espresso due to it stepless design. What sealed the deal with me was choosing small companies that make their products in-house with great detail by hand (Germany & Scotland).
Hey, I have the c40 and wanting the new Knock Feld47 for espresso. So you find your knock does a good job, e.g. better than a £409 electric grinder for instance? 😂
Awesome video Kyle! I've been waiting for it. I've all those hand grinders except the normcore. I understand what you say about C40 and K-plus. C40 is my favorite grinder for pour over and Kinu for espresso because it produces the best flavour! For daily uses I prefer the Brazilian grinder Bravo It (Do you know?). Of course, i really like JX pro and K Plus too. And I think the J-max is excellent, but they could put the JE burrs to have a exceptional espresso like Kinu! Thanks for sharing your results!
Thank you for this thoughtful comment!
I own the kinu m47 classic, fellow ode, and comandante with red clix. When it comes to espresso I am not a fan of the comandante. I cant seem to get it dialed in with red clix. The kinu is great for espresso but id defiantly agree that it lacks in the terms of filter in comparison to the comandante. Thanks for the video
This must be one of the most detailed hand grinders review out there! Great job
Thanks Alan!
Always love the thorough detail of your videos Kyle . Bonus was the comedy sketch at the beginning.....which was great. I got a bit of a "Jerry Lewis....The Nutty Professor " vibe from it 😃
Ah thanks so much!!
I'd just like to leave a comment for others like me that are considering the normcore v2. I watched this video 6 months ago and decided to buy it since I was looking for something I could take with me.
I'll just leave my experience with using it daily, hoping it helps someone.
After 6 months I can tell you its totally worth the price. It makes a great cup of filter coffee but its a little finicky for espresso, at least trying to dial in medium-light rostas (I tend to find darker roast more forgiving). I'd take a little more resolution, as you get maybe 4 clicks of adjustment for espresso. Even so, it is completely capable of doing espresso. I find that its easier to just adjust the dose slightly when I find myself between steps.
It isn't the most ergonomic thing ever and I had the catch cup unscrew on me a few times while grinding since I tend to grip it around the top, but its not a big deal.
I'm just writing this since it would have liked to know when I bought it.
I've been using my Kinu m47 Phoenix for the past 9 months and I love it. Many people complain about the thumb stop of the Simplicity or the Classic. Oddly, it is replaced with a much more comfortable piece of rubber on the cheaper Phoenix version. To me, the most important is the possibility to adjust very precisely the grind size. It's pretty much the only thing that matters to get the perfect cup of coffee. The Kinu does that perfectly thanks to its stepless adjustment system.
By the way, I read somewhere that grind uniformity is not all. Some finer grounds are also needed.
Interesting! I’m still tossing up Kinu or C40. Apparently uniformity does matter for espresso. More uniformity equals a cleaner and more refined cup and less uniformity generally equals a better texture and mouth feel. I can’t say my palette is advanced enough for that, but some of it does come down to preference.
@@ryannicholls3372 Yo, not sure if you've made up your mind yet but if you're thinking espresso, go the Kinu all day.
Nice vid. Got a C40. Feeling very happy right now! Good to know that the extra hassle, which I am aware of, does have a pay off.
I'm a Flair user, and espresso is such a minefield of variables that I wouldn't always know if the way it tastes is down to the grinder, though when I hit it right, it's just great. But for pour-over, I have found the cups I get to be silky, smooth, juicy and well-rounded, just like you say, from day one. Great to hear that confirmed.
I'll settle for great tasting coffee and a few extra cranks of the burrs.
Glad to hear it!
Thanks for your support! 🙌🥰
Titanium coating is a marketing ploy. If the titanium is grinding better, it's because they're making their uncoated burrs worse on purpose. Titanium has lousy edge holding properties. It's a buzzword in this application. *I have a titanium bicycle. Its definitely better than steel for that application
I’ve been waiting for this video, with my finger poised over the ‘Add to basket’ button on various pages, and I’m delighted to say that you have clarified a number of options for me, so thanks. Only one I’m sorry wasn’t included was the 1Zpresso JE-Plus, which looks like a potentially slightly better option for someone who wants to do both pour overs but also wants to be able to dial in espresso when away from home. I actually think I prefer the K-Plus - just concerned about the fine adjustment for espresso.
Thanks for a really thorough and enjoyable video as always.
The JE-plus is unfortunately discontinued, grab one while you can! ;-)
So glad to help!
K Plus
JE Plus
M47 Pheonix
Mainly for espresso and occasionally pour over. What should i get ?
Thxs
AWESOME VIDEO. There is a Brazilian hand grinder that is better than All of them. BRAVO HAND GRINDER !!!!!! Hard to get but worth the efford. .
Would love a review of the Kinu M47 filter burrs. I have owned one for 6 months now, but brew exclusively filter coffee, so would be great to know if the burrs are worth the investment.
Every competent person I know says their aren't. Comandante smokes any version of Kinu unfortunately. I have given Kinu so many chances but Comandante is way superior. I was thinking the filter burr set might be a good idea, but many people say they are even worse. And I mean people who usually brew with EK43, SSP burrs or Comandante, who definitely know their stuff.
newer model of k plus or k max according to lance hendrick perform better then c40 what your review is kplus new model really that good ?
I have been using the J-max for a few months now, and overall for an espresso hand grinder it’s the best in the market for $200. The only problems I have had with it is reassembling the the top nut. It’s an awkward grip to get real tight enough bc if you don’t you’ll start skipping gears when grinding. Also, (this is an issue with all hand grinders not just the j-max) is that I recommend using medium to dark roasts bc lighter roasts can be quite the workout on your arms to grind those hard light roasted beans. Which is an issue bc most specialty coffees come in lighter roasts these days. But if you want a high quality espresso grinder and don’t want to spend $500 plus on an electric one, the J-max will make great espresso.
It would be nice too see (and hear) those grinders in action instead of so much talking.
How do you feel about the Kingrinder K grinder series? There's the K2, K4 and K6 but would like to know your thoughts on it. Looks great as it's competing directly with 1Zpresso for price, fit and finish.
Great video! Thanks for narrowing down some more good hand grinders.
They are expensive for my wallet but I'll go with the Normcore. Thanks for the video and recommendation!
The quality of you videos are awesome! I bought the 1zpresso jx after watching your review and I love it. Great to see content like this from a fellow Ontarian
Thanks Samuel! It’s my joy!
I know in my mind (not my heart) that just because I have a JX Pro it doesn't have to be included in every 1Zpresso related video. I was fine with that until you mentioned the upcoming video on grind size translations! That is what I get for watching great review videos about products I have no intention of buying.
Now I have to deal with the rest of my day. I guess I will go make some coffee.
amazing video!
would love to see the kingrinder k6 in that mix
I currently use the Timemore C3 for my v60. I would really like to upgrade my grinder from the C3 to the Comandante MK4. Unfortunately, it's too expensive for me, it's worth about a month's salary 😶😶. I'm saving money for the upgrade, and hopefully, I'll be able to purchase the Comandante MK4 soon.
I used Essentia bottled water to brew my FogBuster Summit Sunrise coffee absolutely delicious cup!
I have found that some of those little health food stores with all the vitamins carry some excellent bottled water compared to the big brands. But for home use, I prefer RO water with Bodybio E-Lyte electrolytes for best water for coffee.
I think the j max is better the the k plus. The j series makes better espresso. And that’s all I use grinders for. If I want plain coffee would rather have a Kurieg over and pot brewed coffee.
Did you finish the calculator?
Hi! Long time viewer but first time commenter. One of my favorite thing about the C40 is how often it is used as a reference to grind size. Grind size was one of the biggest frustrations for me getting into coffee because of how poorly defined things like "medium" and "medium fine" are. I've found the C40 is widespread enough that recipes will often mention how many clicks on the C40 taking the guesswork out of grind size that comes with many of these other grinders.
Hi Josiah! Thanks for commenting! Complete agree - it’s one of the greatest strengths of the c40
Totally agree. I choose it because it is kind of the de facto standard and the reference for the tons of videos and recipes all over around.
Great video Kyle! I've really enjoyed my K Plus for the past 10 months or so, and for all the reasons you mentioned. You're so right about the Commandante's community advantage too. One of the things I've noticed is when on forums or videos hearing other C40 owners share their clicks is a really nice benefit when starting out trying to better understand grind settings. Have you thought about sharing more on the setting equivalents you've found between the various grinders? I'd certainly be interested to know your ranges on the KPlus for various methods :)
X2
Bump
Yes a relative comparison to grind size settings between the 2 would be a godsend
Timemore don't offer/honour any warranty - something to keep in mind! If it breaks - nothing you can do.
I wasn’t aware of this. Thanks!
I have the Normcore and I absolutely love it! I love the speed it grinds at (which my dad kept going on about lol) and just how uniform the grinds are for a unit of its price range. Thoroughly enjoyable to use and very well made. Great review!
Thanks for watching!
Yeah, Normcore does really well. I own Normcore V1 and V2, comandante C40 and JX-pro from 1Zpresso
Have to say these are amazing grinders. C40 & JX-pro are very very similar in taste. In fact the JX-pro brings a bit more sweetness to the front and is a tiny bit less acidic than the C40, but can't choose one over the other for pour over TBH
That being said, Normcore (entry level) does exceptionally well for such a low price and build quality is just great.
@@manuelpenaruiz3694 if I could afford a commandante or a JX-Pro I wouldn’t even be talking about the normcore 😭
@@lightandthesungod well, worth mentioning that Normcore grinders are really good and uniform. So much that i use them for traveling and my brews (aeropress) taste amazing. Very nice and rich flavor, no complains at all and the whole package with a quality carrying case, brush and blower is just GREAT!
From a certain point you start comparing grinders instead of replacing them. And here is my point. Normcore does incredibly well to be an
@@manuelpenaruiz3694 exactly! for everything coarser than espresso, the normcore smashes it out of the park! if it had enough adjustment to dial in for espresso properly it would probably be one of the best manual grinders out there
So you dialled in for the Commandante it tasted the best?
I pop the handles off put a nut on threads and use my drill to grind. There is no way I'm hand grinding my 1st cup unless backpacking. works great. choose low speed.... a less torque-y model than my cordless 20 Volt drill would be desirable.........Hmmm A cordless Dremel???? Chuck is mighty small on those. Or I find a trained monkey and replace handle.
I would like to watch m47 pour over burr review. & compared to comandante
I’ll look into it!
Need improvement on the introduction. Quickly explain what the purpose of the video is. quickly explain subject for newbies and why the features and important.
I highly recommend the kinu m47. Its my daily and I love it. Its super consistent and the stepless adjustment has become a must have for me.
Is that light a reference to Romans 1:16? ;)
Possibly 😁
@@KyleRowsell nice!
Try the 1zpresso zp6 special. Then tell me if c40 still king.
Great video. I have the Timemore Chestnut X myself. I kinda wish you had included the Apollo BPlus grinder, as I think that one is as good, if not better than the Timemore Chestnut X. Look into that one for a future video.
Hi Kyle, thanks for your video! How do you compare K-max and K-plus? I am kind of torn in between these two to choose. I like the look of K-max more as it’s slimmer and somehow thus more sleek. Also I am not into espresso, but more for the pour over, so I don’t have to have that removable bottom feature. Would you say K-Max is the same as K-plus but just slimmer and without that removable bottom feature?
I'm really hesitating between the K-Ultra and the Kinu M47 Simplicity.
On the topic, you speak briefly, but on every other subject, you speak at length.
Be interesting to see how the Kickstarter Knob Grinder will compare. Only design I’ve seen to do away with the central shaft.
Another grinder to sift 😭
I have the J Max and use it mostly for Pour Overs... I'm in love! It is great to grind and it doesn't feel that you are taking too much time, rather (as he mentioned), it feels like you are getting something done (30g every morning). The taste is incredible (maybe because of the panamenian coffees I get to enjoy) and the notes feel rich and it's like the notes start to explode (something I rarely experience in a cafe/coffee shop).
Hahaha maybe it's the whole experience of making and sharing coffee but I don't regret getting my J Max for Pour Overs! 😄
Awesome! I will get mine in 2 weeks for my birthday for pour over, moka and espresso. I think I've made the right choice.
@@jesadag1150 Yes! I hope you can enjoy it as much as I do. I also bought it as a birthday present! 😄
Hello! I was curious how well the Jmax is for
Pour overs , was concern coz of the 8.8 microns maybe it was too much of leap for it, I mainly do espresso and pour overs . Haven’t read/seen a lot about Jmax used for pour overs, only for espresso
@@BonEE008 Hi! There is a channel that explains in depth the J Max (is the best review I've seen so far) TMB - The Majestic Bean Channel.
I just brew my pour over and it's really tasty. What Kyle mentioned in his review (if I got it right) is that to change from espresso to pour over is quite difficult because there are a lot of clicks, was corrected in this video when he mentioned that there is a pyramid below the ring that will allows you to know how many rotations you have.
The last thing is that once you receive it I will recommend you to adjust the ring to 0. That way you will be precise in your measurements. It is easy to take apart for cleaning and put it all back together.
@@Carlos_Vasquez thank you I did actually saw his video before.
If you want to save money, the best choice would be linglong R1 or kingrinder k6.
Absolutely!
Where did you get that Weber Workshop like looking second dosing bin from? I can’t find it anywhere.
Hi!
Thanks for the great review. I am looking to upgrade my Hario Skerton Plus, my friend recently got a 1Zpresso JX and I've been able to test it and I am very impressed with it. I know JX is capable of grinding for espresso with its 12 um step, even if less precise than the JMax. Would you say the Normcore v2 with doubled number of steps per turn could do an alright job grinding for espresso, or would it still fall short in that department?
I mainly brew pourover and aeropress, with an occasional moka pot, but I would like to get a manual espresso maker such as the Flair at one point, I would love to have one grinder suitable for both espresso and the alternative methods.
Nomcore v2 is absolutely capable of espresso grinds.
Wow! This is one the unicorn comparison videos that I'm sure many many people will be waiting for !!
Great work Kyle.
You did a great job to keep this video digestible despite being so long and thorough!
I have a K-Plus and my friend has a C40. The C40 is super nice but no way I could give up the grind speed, catch cup, and ease of grind adjustment with the K-Plus.
As for taste, both are good , it was hard to tell any real difference but we only did a very brief tasting.
Thanks for the thoughts and kind words!
Hey, I'm here to tell you what's the REAL difference between the Kplus and the C40: durability
C40 doesn't have the fancy Hi-Tech adjustment mechanism of the K series but trust me it will last for generations. Can't say the same about the Kplus. The adjustment mechanism is delicate (mine was spilled with water and boom... It's damaged. No joke, it's broken)
I used to own a Jxpro. Then stepped up to Kplus and dude... Regret I did. At least the Jxpro can be washed with water and soap and will Never let you down.
Great video once again, I loved it until you came with the Normcore, I won’t go into to much detail here, I was the winner of that grinder and all I can say is that the built quality of the grinder is atrocious, I would not recommend that grinder to anyone, I also own the Timemore C2, not great but much better than the Normcore, sorry I had to say it🤷♂️, but otherwise great content.👍
What do you think about the normcore v2 with the 44mm burrs? It has a higher capacity!
Good morning! How about now with the K plus discontinued. Is a K Ultra still better than comandante ?
Great video Kyle! I have a C40 and can't wait for your future video with the red clix...it's hard to get it in argentina and want to know whether it worths the money.
Can you compare with the lido og grinder? I haven’t seen one done especially how you review the grinders, price, taste, nuances, convenience/ practicality. Thanks in advance. I’m on the edge of getting one.
Oh nooooo. He should have also broken them down as best for drip coffee and best for espresso… great video though.
Hello Kyle! Great job. Have you ever thought about reviewing the Lido OG grinder? It was almost no reviewed in english.
Awesome! The content people are asking for!