Building the FASTEST F1 RC Car
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 ก.ค. 2024
- Can I make this RC car faster with a ground-effect fan? Sponsored by World of Warships! Play World of Warships for FREE and unlock special D-Day missions here: wo.ws/4br7Vhz
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Can I get it on Xbox ??
Personally I unsubscribe from TH-camrs who love to lie. F1 is a racing division.... Convoluting it into what ever you want is dumb
@@RekySai 💀
@@RekySai F1 also refers to the chassis on the F1 car
Maybe a rubber skirt and tape at the bottom just to let it glide over the bumps?
FIND - A - TUNNEL (with a flat ceiling)
Every tunel has a ceiling, doesn't have to be flat either.
Build a tunnel with flat ceiling
@@junatah5903should be flat to drive this car on the ceiling I guess
@@ivanmirandawastaken just go to the London Underground on a slow day, plenty of flat tunnels there lol
There’s a guy trying to do that full scale and they’re building their own track for it. Project Air should do a scaled down version lol
If anyone is interested in fan cars, the McMurtry Spéirling recently broke track records, proving that ground effect is very effective under the right circumstances.
I was about to start yapping about this car when I saw your comment. Clearly a man of culture, or Carwow enjoyer
You can’t forget the Gordon Murray T.50 as well
the t.50 uses the fan in a very different way which only produces downforce at high speed and does little to increase the actual downforce of the car. it is mostly to make the car "stand out"
@@Losthewaronemus Bit of both 😉 But also had an interest in MyEnergi for a while.
Yes
James you MUST do a part 2 and see if you can get it to drive upside down! 🏎
Driver 61 YT channel
if you want to see someone do it for real.
hasn't done it YET but preparations are running for a year now.
and he is really adamant about that, he has surrounded himself with very smart F1 ppl to transform a Formula car into a specialized "upside down car".
he got a big building company to build a dedicated tunnel just for that.
I can't wait until he announces the date.
He needs to have a skirt on hinges. Which is how every car now days does it.
There is a BBC documentary called "Gentlemen, Raise Your Skirts". About the ground effect cars Williams had back then. No fan but shaped underfloor and the skirts were spring loaded carbon strips that could retract up and down into a slot so they could touch the track surface and follow the imperfections in the track. Check it out if you can, it's awesome if you like those old BBC doc's.
I remember that! Wow - that makes me feel old 👴
One of my fave quotes is from that, when Alan Jones complains about the ride quality of the car when they tried solid suspension. Frank Williams replies, "perhaps you could sit on your wallet, Alan?"
@@TheBillzilla The most gentlemanly burn ever. They don't make them like sir Frank anymore.
BBC💀
the long awaited sequel is here
Some suggestions:
How about a skirt made from a brush?
How about putting the ground effect tray on a separate set of suspensions from the main chassis? One irl example is the Lotus88
One I've been asking myself watching the video is what lead to the choice of a propeller instead of an impeller to evacuate the ground effect tray, as the latter is way better at producing a pressure difference?
That’s right, why a propeller instead of an impeller?
The brush idea is good but does add friction as it is in actual contact with the ground.
Windscreen wiper blades might be good source, have metal spine with rubber in them.
I think thick rubber would be the best bet! Maybe a bike inner tube, or a piece of old tire!
@@superbmediacontentcreator my reasoning would be that a brush is flexible enough to deal with rough terrain, while doing a reasonable job at blocking airflow. The brush hair would also be trimmed through usage, by contacting the ground, reducing friction and tuning the system over time.
The problem with a hard barrier as we saw in the video is that once it hits the ground the wheels suddenly lose traction, which could be reduced by using a brush skirt.
Some hovercraft designs use brush skirts, which is why I thought of it. Granted there they try to keep air in instead of out.
edit: I'm not sure where I saw it and cant find it atm.
I believe the Chaparral 2J had its skirt mounted to the suspension, not the chassis. This way the skirt stays flat with the wheels, and doesn't move with the body. Try mounting the skirt to the ends of the suspension near the ball joints, and I bet you'll have more consistent suction and longer lasting skirts.
The Chaparral did this long before the F1 car you cited. The concept is valid but was outlawed because the fan throws stuff all over the following cars.
Was about to say the same thing. Can-Am allowed innovations like this because F1 had too many restrictions. Once proven, F1 adopted it.
@@benkirkland5354 As I was growing up I cheered this and the STP turbine car both of which failed for different technical reasons. Had they foreseen the things that ultimately killed them they would have revolutionized the sector before being simply "ruled off" the tracks. I think the electric boost shows the most promise in the near term for F1 unless that like the Grid Girls it gets banned...
As a gran turismo player, I remember having a lot of fun with this car
The Jim Hall's Chaparral 2J was also closer in concept to this than the Brab, as the on the 2J had a separate snowmobile engine, so fan rotation speed wasn't a direct relation of 'main' engine speed. More consistent 'suck' across the entire speed range of the car, rather than more 'suck' at higher main enginer RPM.
I'm sure it would throw a bunch of stuff around, but because it mostly made all of its downforce from the fan system if for whatever reason the suction between the car and the track, like a big enough bump or a skirt was broken it would lose all grip and be very dangerous. Imagine it just launching mid corner straight off the track. Great system in an ideal world but potentially deadly in a real world
The issue was you locked the suspension out. You effectively cancelled out the mechanical grip of the car. In turn, you also proved the effectiveness of the design. Double edged sword so to speak. You must have heard of the McMurty special right? If not....bro.... where have you been?
Mcmurty at goodwood is unreal. I thought it was fake.
@@deaddirt3214same! The first time I saw it I thought the playback speed was increased. And the car kind of looks like a cartoon, just the way it's shaped.
If my memory is correct the seal was made in more than 1 over lapping section so the road contact area could be worn away then slide down to replace it. Eg had a total loss section that lowers as it's warn away.
iirc, it was also sprung so the skirts stayed in contact with the road surface.
High pressure flexible 'tubular' perimeter skirt, low pressure chamber: Forget the walls, replace the skirting with something akin to a hovercraft skirt, but with the skirting pressurized to keep it inflated. I also suggest a tough material, as it will be in contact with the ground at high speeds.
You're right in concept but there is difficulty with this sort of thing at scale. There are just some technologies and materials that don't scale down well. This is the case with your skirting material. It is very heavy and thick and hard to reproduce at a small size and get the same robust survival enjoyed in a 1:1 environment.
Maybe the rubber squeegee from a wiper blade may work. Semi rigid but flexible/durable edge
Brush strips work too.
@@petearundel166Thats what I’m thinking! :D
I thought maybe a spring-loaded sliding door-style wall with a low friction material at the bottom might work, or just some replaceable steel bits.
You found what brabham found - it is really hard to get a good seal on a road surface. Passive underfloor ground effect ended up quite quickly outpacing the active design. Fun tho! And you didn't have an actual human driver experiencing the rapid fluctuations in the effect; the drivers were terrified by it.
I wouldn't say it outpaced the brabham because the brabham got banned after 1 race. If that car also got developed i reckon it would still stay ahead of the fanless ground effect cars.
@@neblolthecarnerd It only participated in one race, it was banned after the season but voluntarily not run, partly because of not seeing the point, but also because of practical issues - such as the fact it was connected to the engine's crankshaft. This meant shifting in corners would cause abrupt changes in traction and made it very dicey to drive at the limits.
@@iskierka8399 I thought the mutual agreement was kinda a more polite way of withdrawing so they didn't actually get banned until the rules got rewritten. Especially given how easily it won the race it did do.
Bernie Eccelstone already had his eye on taking over the running of the sport at that stage, he withdrew the car to stay pally with the organisers. I don’t think golden Murray and the rest of the team knew this at the time
@@neblolthecarnerd The Brabham was in Lotus' sights to get it banned after they sank so much R&D money into aero downforce, so I think you're right.
Edit: I also believe the Brabham team put a filter on it to fix the complaints of drivers getting slightly smoked out by the low levels of road dust and the few pebbles pelting their cars, and it only reduced the downforce slightly.
The original Lotus car had sideboards mounted on slots so they would always adjust themselves to be touching the ground. Your front skirt-board doesn't need to create a perfect seal to the ground. If it's bouncing on the ground it will be slowing your car down. Some of the F1 cars used broom bristles to create a seal.
Fun fact. Gordon Murray (the designer of the BT46B fitted an aeroplanes altimeter in the cars so that it would show whether the underfloor was sealed. The drivers had a problem that the skirt would be damaged and they wouldn't know and suddenly find themselves going through a corner about 40mph quicker than they could without the ground effect and having a colossal crash. So if the altimeter was in the green they could push. If it wasn't they had to back off.
"tea, obviously"
James, engineering in the best British tradition.
Love to see this run on a basketball court where the floor was perfectly smooth. That would let it really corner.
Seems like for the skirt, some thing pliable but durable like silicone sheet would be good. Great vid as usual!
This is extremely sick, and you pulled it off so well! I have been thinking about doing something like this since seeing the Formula Student car from ETH Zürich use a similar approach for reaching 0-100km/h in under a second. IMO it's impressive how much extra downforce you ended up getting in a straight line on this.
To improve the seal on bumpy roads, maybe you could try a 3d printed flexible TPU base with a sort of skirt around it from thin PTFE that is too long and just bends out when the car is further to the ground, but then extends once it goes more above it or over a bump?
I like this concept a lot. Maybe you should try door brush seals for the skirt. First they are flexible, second durable and last you brush stones away in front of the car.
The problem with your idea is that the contact adds drag. What you are envisioning is a reverse hovercraft which is valid but hard to do at scale...
I think sprung segmented skirts would be best, its what Chaparral did with the 2J, and it worked beautifully. The only difficulty is doing so effectively at RC scales.
@@redmk3t You might want to read previous comments before bestowing us with your brilliance.
@superbmediacontentcreator The problem with your idea is that it's NOT valid on any scale. You probably shouldn't come up with ideas
@@redmk3t Iditol leaving a comment that matches their personality... stupid.
The part you missed, or couldn’t replicate from the original fan car, was the skirts moved up and down inside a channel in the sidepods so that they maintained the perfect hight to the road all the time, the last time I saw one it was effectively a draft excluder bolted to a piece of plastic that sat in the channel. I’m also fairly sure they didn’t completely enclose the skirts at the front (and probably the back) of the car as that was how they drew the air in to create the vacuum. There’s no way this is practical to do on that size of car but maybe a bigger one?
Actually, he could have achieved this with a spring-loaded frame under the vehicle with a segmented rolling edge. The challenge as I mentioned in a previous comment is that some materials just don't scale well and many solutions add drag from their contact with the surface. Remember the aggregate in the roadway is 1:1 not scaled to the car used for testing. This naturally hampers and intrudes on any of the solutions and improvements.
That sounds like the Lotus ground effect skirt solution. I've not seen the Brabham layout to be fair
@@TimInertiatic they all worked on the same principle, either a sheet of plastic or one with draft excluders on the bottom.
@@superbmediacontentcreator in this case, size matters then lol
@@testpilotian3188 Lol it sure does, because we know the Square-Cube law and the exponential relationship between velocity and fluid drag makes "RC Scale Speed" one of those measurements that don't mean anything. It not only affects the material properties, but the physical properties and the vehicle behavior. These RC cars also have a power to weight ratio that is immense compared to actual cars, the Traxxas Maxx V2 for example has just shy of a 1 to 1 power to weight ratio if my quick maths were right (and they may not be since I'm not full awake yet), weighing about 0.2 kilos but making 0.16 horsepower from a 6 volt, 20 amp peak draw.
Edit: Actually, its likely far above a 1 to 1 power to weight, now that I think about it. Since those things supposedly draw like up to 100 amps or more, and the motor gets to see the full 4s 16 or so volts, and that's 1.6kW, which means 2.15 horsepower. On a 200 gram vehicle. That's over a 10 to 1 power to weight ratio. Come on stupid brain, work with me today! The rocks ain't rocking right right now XD
Active suspension with this on an RC car would be awesome!!!
the small bits of debris, gravel and overall road roughness at the scale of your RC car, would be similar to trying to drive a formula car on a 4x4 off road trail. perhaps try testing again on a smoother airport runway?
its always good to see him upload and it makes my day
Imagine someone was just casually walking on the side of the road and then he hear a sound but he doesn't know what it exactly is and after he go around the corner, a fast tiny car suddenly goes right pass him, he stand there in awe but not even 5 seconds later he feels a sting on his right foot when he looked down, his right foot is gone.
This is epic, ur an awesome creator, don’t stop being awesome!
You are so inspiring for young engineers/aviators. Keep doing your thing!
engineering helper.. _put a ring on it james_
Most under appreciated creator on the platform. Great project!!
Cut rubber strip from bicycle tube, and use it as floor vaccum seal for tray.
The rubber squeegee from a wiper blade may have enough durability to last. It could allow for a small travel to be added back into the suspension to help with its jumpiness
Yeah, rubber is the way to go. Much more flexible and durable than foamboard.
From what I studied, the vaccum skirts on the bt46b were attatched to the suspension so that they'd always stay level despite the body movement.
As always, great video! Keep inspiring builders, young and old (you got me back into the hobby and building fun creations after a 30 year break)! Thanks again!
Damn it... It's all over the screen now 😕
😆🤣
Tf is bro talking about 💀🤣
Under a minute gang
Nobody cares gang
💀
Just a suggestion but maybe you could get a leaf blower and blow off the road as much as possible to have a nice smooth and consistent surface to test on .. maybe remove some variables?... Love the videos keep it up 👍
If you scaled up the small bumps and cracks in the road it would be like taking a life size F1 down a gravel road. Surprised it worked as well as it did.
So so bad clickbait title 👍
i'm an f1 nut and i know back in the day they had a semi rigid skirt that would bounce inside a receiver style channel, i wonder if you could construct something like that and try t again.
despite the porpoising as soon as that fan cut off it was going straight to the scene of the accident, awesome look, need a 2.0 video
Excellent video, as always. No theatrics, unnecessary sounds or emojis. Just a logical, well edited video. Thanks. Waiting for the next one.
I enjoy doing RC experiments from time to time too. Subscribed
Although this might be hard to accomplish, but there was a design on the chaparral 2j regarding the side skirts. The 2j was a fan car, but had issues with maintaining proper suction. The car had a mechanism where the skirts would move up and down as it was linked to the suspension, preventing it from scraping against the track surface
Great project again! This is exactly my thought for pushing the next level of the RC car speed challenges. Down force with little drag penalty. Also hub motors to remove the drive train issues and be able to use gyro stabilised DTC to keep it straight. Tyres are the only unanswered question.
Fold of thin kevlar for the skirt? Maybe fibreglass but would be less durable.
Also might get better results from an odd numbered blade fan?
8:58 You were right the first time around. That, my friend, is a ship, not a boat. When it turns it leans to the outside. Boats lean into the curve.
I'm about 1 minute into the video
I had always wondered why no one has tried to do this with an RC car 👏👍😁. I'm already loving the video 🤤
You should test this in a gym or any place with polished concrete. Additionally, the skirt could probably be made out of overlapping flexible "tongues" that angle backwards and can bend when pressed down. Combat robots often use this as a flexible wheel system that's difficult to damage.
amazing videos as always!i hope to get at least somewhat near your skill one day!
Man this channel keeps racking up one crazy project after another
Love your experiments on here..top content ❤
Great video, I'm sure Adrian Newey would be proud
A softer skirt, like one printed from TPU or made of rubber, might help. Something that can take the impact and deform to the shape of the road, rather than bouncing the car off the wheels.
Also, i beg of you, if you're already going down this path, consider adding a second set of steering wheels at the front like the famous Tyrell P34 :P It might genuinely help with cornering.
Great video yet again 😃
The original F1 cars used thick rubber to seal the edges, but they used springs so they could move a bit through the undulating surfaces.
Might be worth looking into 😊
The skirts on F1 cars were moveable pieces slotted into the sides which would allow for the sealing over bumps. I'd love to see you build more on this idea, maybe trying more skirt materials, or even changing the fan duct shape.
I have been waiting for this video for so long
Glad to see you revisiting this project👍
Imagine the ideal track. When you make the care smaller, everything else gets bigger. If everything was smooth, flat, and sticky, I'd love to see an rc car race of practically mini f1.
Great job!!!
To overcome the weight issue - powering the fan by the differential/ an output shaft would be ideal. Might be complicated but it bet you can pull it off!
I geek over aerodynamics in cars. This is no exception.
Very nice project! Congrats! Next step you can try to seal the bottom with 3mm thick rubber and test it on a smooth surface like a flat parking area... I'm shure you will have great results..
I have been watching TH-cam since it began . This is the ABSOLUTE BEST video EVER. Thank you SIR! Society needs you to be a teacher. The education system in every country needs to hire you as an online mandatory teaching lesson.
Really should have started from propeller design if you're going to build fan assemblies from a selection of options. Having a lower RPM higher torque motor (different KV rating to prevent heat loading via efficiency loss, which is why the 10 blade fan made the motor draw power beyond what it can handle heat wise, but made more vacuum) helps you run propeller designs more optimized for efficiently creating static pressure, so you'll get more pressure difference for a given electrical output. PC fans and boat propellers both take static pressure vs. air volume into consideration.
Material for the skirts must have a low elastic deformation force, with a high elasticity limit to account for all the rocks and road debris. Making it as thin as possible without distortion also helps. Or, keep the foam and run it indoors on a clean surface.
Yes thank you. You're the only comment I could find that mentioned KV. I think Optimizing for a KV with a sustained desirable RPM with the 10 blade fan of a more static optimized blade design is the key. I also think that for the skirt the foam should be a single piece with a large void cut out of it for more strength. Maybe ad some kind of thin tubular uhmwpe edge to it for wear resistance. or maybe a skirt like on actual hover crafts. Hope he makes a v2 of this video.
It might be complicated, but the chaparral's fan car had the skirts somehow linked to the suspension so it stays in the right attitude, might help you with the consistency around the corners. There are so many details about those fan cars and active aero in general, have fun going down that rabbit hole!
I always enjoy your videos and having Emily's input is wonderful. The gal seems to have a good head on her shoulders. What's next? Maybe a car that turns into a plane and flies with the assistance of rocket motors?
For the skirt you could try some flexible rubber like a hovercraft, or perhaps some brush material like a paint brush. Try soft or hard bristles and see if there's a difference.
I imagine you want something soft enough to adjust to the road surface without losing too much air pressure, although losing some air pressure might be preferable to losing traction on the tyres.
Ay the car has returned!
Try using a multiple-skirt design with the semi-rigid skirt construction. If you have 2, 3, or more layers to your skirt, you will reduce the probability venting your vacuum, as you will need all layers of the skirt to be simultaneously compromised.
Use a bicycle tube for the sealing membrane. Make the bottom slightly smaller than the top and use a Kevlar string to give the bottom a slight rigidity to it. Similar to a hovercraft design. The tube rubber can better deal with the roughness and the string on the bottom edge will coax it to maintain its shape better. Thats my suggestion for the skirt. Very decent results nonetheless.
Subscribed immediately, freaking awesome channel!
Stuff made here with RC stuff!
Fantastic work, James! Really well done!!! 😃
Stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊
Fantastic idea for a car, and keeping Britain tidy.....kinda cool a car that cleans the track😊
Also make the skirt from brushes.....narrow and long
Imagine the rear edf installed on 1-axis servo controlled mount to provide some thrust vectoring. Ofc it would require some flexible sleeve to keep ground effect low pressure -side from leaking.
Or maybe some active aero added to this car to help with cornering stability, and top speed (with drag reduction system).
I’m just throwing some stupid ideas, but keep up your awesome work! 🙂
Hi, I personally loved your F1 RC car project, so I'd like to give you some ideas: maybe you can add some sort of plank, like actual F1 Cars, to reduce the minimum distance from the ground of car's floor to avoid skirts damaging and maybe try some TPU 3D printed skirts to improve the vacuum effect. Have a good day!
my guess: since you have independent suspension, make a 4 part skirt with a flexible cross, so wheels can still independently move, and the skirt gets closer to the road.
Remember that rc cars are still downscaled. Driving on a normal asphalt road would scale up to like a cobblestone like surface. Perhaps a soft, flexible rubber profile could be worth a try. Quite cheap and more durable than the foam. Also, it could dampen bouncing.
Been waiting for ages, Brilliant vid
You should try brush for your ground affect set up. The use a bristle bush for sealing the bottom of garage doors etc. make the brush 1” thick the entire way around and that should work.
The rubber from a bike wheel tube might be good for the skirt since it's flexible and coulsd run along the ground without much damage.
JIMNY! very good watch and well done on your further progress.
I have an idea, attach a section of a bicycle inner tube to the perimeter of the bottom plate. If the ground below the car is uneven, the inner tube will allow the flexibility in the skirt to keep a good vacuum under the vehicle
Next time, consider using a leaf blower to clean the road first :D. Awesome video
You could use the rubber that seals doors to improv the skirt
It’s good to see engineering at work. Good stuff
Five minutes looking at an old Lotus in a Goodwood paddock or the pits at Silverstone on a heritage day would have helped you immensely with this. Plus the fan was supposed to cool the engine, right? I think you could do with making it 'for cooling'.
Your assistant is a welcome addition to the show, not sure about the sponsor though.
I would recommend attaching the skirts to the suspension so that it moves with the suspension rather than the chassis, but this is really sweet!
as another user said: you need the suspension. also, try to make a skirt of many independent springs that are airproof.
The skirt should be make out of those brushes they use to seal gaps under doors. Basically a long toothbrush.
From the beginning, looking at your preview videos, I could see that the cornering test was going to be flawed because of the rocks and the uneven surface. It would be cool to see you try this again on a track surface that is smoother and figuring out the perfect ride height. Good job on the video
when the F1 engineers were trying to make the fan cars work the best material they found for the skirt s was aluminum or Lexan . they even tried using brushes but they where a lot heavier then the other option . the chaparral 2J was the fastest with it's floating skirt that worked with arms connected to the suspension to keep the skirt tight to the road. but trying to make this work on a model car would be a nightmare .
Love the Wii Sports/Japan in a nutshell -font used in the past few videos
@12:22 That's exactly why fans like in the Brabham was prohibited :D if it fails mid corner you just fly away :D
I saw the 2J run at the Monterey Historics. The snowmobile engine and fans were really loud.
If you ever revisit this project maybe you could try some silicone draught excluder tape for the skirts. Specifically the variety that goes on the bottom of doors with a silicon skirt and a 3M adhesive strip on the top. Would provide a more flexible seal with the road surface and would be pretty durable. Can be found in most DIY shops for pretty cheap.
It will also work well with the aluminium skirt bracket system you had. Just punch a hole through the silicone tape and bolt it on to the bracket with some nuts and washers. Probably necessary because I don't think the tape's adhesive alone would be enough to hold it on under all that friction.
Cool test run. It would be interesting to see what a skirt made from something like a bicycle inner tube would do.
Try using flat framing from nylon or teflon to keep the contact with ground.
Keep that framing suspended from wheels using some impregnated fabric.
Maybe even try using some sort of secondary thin short strips of fabric on the framing to compensate for smaller imperfections on the road.
I would add some aluminum or fiberglass screening on top of the mesh which will prevent rocks or foam from bring sucked into the fan. Great first test. Looking forward to next test run.
When I saw this the only thing I could think of was Delrin. Strong with low friction. Combined with a spring (maybe like an apex seal spring from a rotary engine) would help to keep the skirt in contact with the ground. Low friction with increased longevity.
Another thing that would be interesting to try would be to just put some drone motors with reversed props on top of the car. No need to worry about a seal and it woukd even work well off road.
when i first heard about this formula 1 car i had some ideas of my own but testing them on a life size car was never going to be in my price range so you have given me a good idea, thanks
Might wanna try plastic painters tarp, construction trash bags or sheets of rubber. Perhaps multiple layers too
Your skirt is fixed. Replace with a “sliding skirt”. As the shape of the surface changes the skirt moves up and down maintaining the ground effect.