Lies of P is mechanically tighter and feels more responsive and more accurate than any FS game I've played. I'm glad someone had the balls to make a YT video saying that FS games are not unsurpassable.
This was easily my favorite game of 2023. It was tough, but I loved what Neowiz and R8 did with this title. The weapons, the story, the bosses, level design - it was all really well done. Like you said, the devs were really confident in this title and it shows. Thanks for the video!
Glad to see others who enjoy this game as much as I do, I almost felt crazy for enjoying it as much as and more than some of From’s own games. I agree that nostalgia seems to be the main reason many people hold onto the older games, but as someone introduced more recently but has platinum’d every release my nostalgia isn’t as big a factor and lets me see the games a bit more objectively. Can’t wait to see what Neowiz does next. Also, I’ve been obsessed with the soundtrack and have listened to it exclusively on loop since it dropped on Spotify in November.
Love your content man. Please keep putting out essays like this and don’t be discouraged by the lower amount of views on this one opposed to your Lords of the Fallen entry. You’re incredible at breaking down the mechanics and nuances of the souls-like genre, especially the boss fights. Look forward to the next video
Thanks for the video. I appreciate your thoughts on the game. You pointed out somethings I did not thing about. Lies of P was my favorite single player games of 2023. It's just so satisfying to play. I just loved the mechanics, the story, (most of) the bosses, the story/lore, and that it is 98% bug free at launch. I am eager for the DLC and hope that their follow up OZ game will be as interesting.
I loved this game so much. I’ve done for play throughs and it has gone into my souls rotation. I had the bizarre experience of beating nameless first try even though I’m really not great at lies. Archbishop took me like three hours to beat.
I love how everyone has their own bosses that they're naturally really good at with little practice. Mine was Nameless king in ds3 but the Lothric and lorian fight beats my ass every time lol
Love the part where you talk about the last optional boss. While Manus wasn’t impressive, his phase change was possibly the coolest power up I’ve ever seen in any Souls Like game
I will say, I don't think that the dodge-roll is bad or "meant" to be bad, I just think its not nearly as forgiving as intuitive as the Dark Souls and Elden Ring roll. It's not inherently bad, but it will feel worse if you're expecting the DS3 roll. I also think the fact that it turns into a side-step when locked on, which its harder to tell when the dodge starts since the animation isn't as obvious as the full on roll. Personally I think the dodge roll could have a few more i-frames than it currently does. Ideally blocking should be the least risky but least rewarding option. You can continually block but take some damage. Parrying should be the most risky and hardest to pull off but most rewarding, since it fully negates damage and builds up stance breaking. Ideally the dodge should fall in the middle, but it feels like its just slightly too tight, putting it closer to the timing required for the parry, throwing off that balance. If the point was to show you that the dodge should only be for positioning, like Sekiro, I feel like it should have worse i-frames to make it obvious that you should be parrying for most attacks. However, because it's useful enough but not as good as the Dark Souls dodge, I think it ends up just feeling awkward to use, rather than weak. If you are right, and the dodge was supposed to be bad, I definitely think they could have done better to make that apparent, but it doesn't feel like it was meant to be. Personally, I got used to it, but I would rather it remained the dodge roll at all times rather than the side-step when locked on, just for consistency's sake.
Those are all good points. Maybe I should have made it more clear, but I was just kinda glossing over it, but I was mostly referencing the dodge before you get the dodge link skill and the rolling from the ground skill feeling bad for newer players, who weren't familiar with sekiro style gameplay. Personally, I don't mind the dodge roll at all, and on some bosses, like manus, I almost exclusively use the dodge.
Your videos are fantastic. The amount of time and thought you put into them is clear. Keep it up man, you are as good as anyone I have watched. I believe!
It’s a good mix of dodging/rolling and deflections it feels great to do either or but especially deflections. This was my first soulslike and it didn’t take me long to get used to it so idk why people don’t like the deflection system.
8:52 to About the dodge, I never understood why people said the dodge was bad. What the game communicated to me is that we have multiple viable *options*, not that it was fundamentally designed to be beaten with deflections. The dodge is fine. Even at slightly heavy, it's functional. If you want more distance or something, try normal weight, or even light. And save Link Dodge for direction changes or uncertain timings on heavy enemy attacks. You can also act out of a dodge faster than out of a Perfect Guard. Even with the upgrade. There are trade offs to both. The dodge and the Perfect Guard are interchangeable and optional depending on the situation and each player's sensibilities. 1:01:50 Exactly my point when saying the game isn't all about the Perfect Guard. It doesn't mean Manus is badly designed, it means those attacks aren't necessarily for your inclination to deflect. You also miss several things by not using Fable Arts to create interesting interactions with his moveset. Not just the attack oriented ones, but the utility. I'm not sure if you even mentioned them in the video. People also overlook the normal guard. If you spec into the P Organ right, guarding is fantastic for the heaviest weapons in the game. Not only for the damage reduction, but because of the Guard Regain mechanic. If you guard certain lighter attacks, your Guard Regain will heal more HP than you initially lost. This seems to work up to NG+2. About the Black Rabbit Brotherhood and Stalker fights in general, Fulminis really works wonders for giving players breathing room. Any level of charge will stagger them, and higher charges will even launch them. Overall, great analysis video!
Totally agree. Anyone still having problems side-reading bosses with the double dodge upgrade doesn't know the game enough to be talking about its mechanics. I usually hate gatekeeping rhetoric like that but it is truly baffling to me how so many people seem to go the 'dodges are bad go deflection only' route and then calling the game bad because they ignore a fundamental part of it.
Counterpoint: the dodge is actually bad. It is worse than the Sekiro dodge in distance and in i-frames. And that is saying something because it is pretty weak in Sekiro.
@@pocketbacon9636 Your s last for nearly the whole dodge. I don't know where you're getting that info. And the s are the important part. If you want distance, you can go normal weight or light weight.
As someone who deliberately played Slightly Heavy during my first playthrough, I don't understand not agree with people saying that the dodge is bad. It's just the people were used to Bloodborne and Dark Souls 3's dodges to be their free and effortless way out of damage, instead of it demanding something out of the player.
The same stuff happened with Sekiro on release. The major difference is that Sekiro forced you focus more on deflecting everything while making dodge near useless and LoP leaves it to the player to whether dodge or parry or focus on both depending on the situation. It gives a choice like DS2's ADP but done better.
Yeah I watched the video and thought "wait what? Who said the dodge was bad?" The dodge is great. Maybe it was bad at launch and they patched it? Apparently there was a lot of difficulty tweaks post launch.
You can equip two weapons to fight the brotherhood guys if you chose the Dexterity preset at the beginning of the game. You use your main weapon against the eldest guy and the spear guy and you use the rapier against the other 2. The rapier is criminaly underrated against easily staggarable enemies, you can just keep using your heavy non charged attack, to poke the other 2 whenever they come close and cancel their attack animations while causing damage and keeping distance. It's really really fun to do this for some reason.
So glad to see you enjoyed Lies of P. I found your channel randomly just looking through some Elden Ring dlc reviews. ER was my first souls game.. I then went on to play BB, Sekiro, and all of the souls games. After playing Lies of P, I felt as though it had taken all the best parts of souls games and wrapped them up nice and neat (and innovating quite a bit on top of that). I managed to beat ER dlc without summoning as I like to do but I must say I found it predictable and not very enjoyable when it comes to bosses, which is a large reason I play these games. Even before the ER dlc came out, my most anticipated game was/is actually Lies of P dlc/Lies of P 2. I really wish the best for these developers and hopefully Fromsoft can pick up some obvious pointers from Neowiz + Round 8… My number one thing would be the more accessible parries. When you realize all you’re doing in ER for 90% of a fight is rolling around and making 0 progress towards killing the boss, it’s just so.. unfun lol
absolutely loved this game. originally came into it hoping just for good enough but got back an amazing quality experience that makes you want to do ng+
>Surpassed Souls I'm playing this right now and I've just beat King of Puppets. I think "surpassed" it's a strong word, but it's the first time I can say that a souls clone is as good as the other games. Finally something fresh and good.
Equal in quality and atmosphere of a typical Fromsoft game, but the combat and customization has actually taken a step forward imo. Holistically, however, I’m not ready to place it above the rest of their titles. I didn’t previously believe anyone could even replicate the formula this well
Fair enough. Personally, I do love the souls games, but something about this game really struck a cord with me. I have a lot of respect for the devs. Enjoy the rest of your playthrough!
I felt like Geppetto asking Carlo if he was a good father was a test. He was probably hoping Carlo would tell the truth meaning he was less likely to resist his father.
Great video. Can you make more in depth video about bosses/combat mechanics. i disagree with some takes about bosses but due to little elaboration I cannt see the entire point and there is more under the hood then just parry (for example dodge in LoP work similar to mikiri counter). Also have you played pvp in other souls games? I enjoyed NPC fights when approached as spacing/hitbox priority(staggering them out of attacks) challenge even 2nd BRB wasnt that bad.
Contextualizing the game's encounters with Carlo Collodi's work was really cool, I certaintly didn't pick those references up on my playthrough beyond the more well known parts of Pinnochio.
I am in a unique position because I finished this game before I tried any true fromsoft games. Now that I have finished Elden Ring as well I can finally compare. I might need to try some other fromsoft games, but so far I prefer Lies of P as the more focused expirience. I dislike arriving to a boss and not knowing if I am too strong or too weak. Lies of p is just constistently great all the way to the end.
First of all, would like to say great video, keep up the good work! And its a great game! Now I haven't played since before the first patch so I don't exactly know everything thats changed. I know they have edited the animations of a few of the enemies like bat cop, fire robot with the spade for example. I think is because they sorta realised it was an issue for the game and the move at 1:09:20 used to be unfair and its great if they've added a yellow glow to some of these red attacks... it shows they are willing to improve and learn from any mistakes they may make. I don't know if they edited King's Flame like they did with the normal enemy version of him but playing against him on release was problematic for me - the moveset of the boss is not overly complex and one can learn the fight and parry timings in a reasonable amount of time for sure and it does have some tells to the start ups but... for me, the Horah Loux fight is quite different because I can see how people can take issue with him especially first time around - he's very unpredictable and he does some really weird stuff but when I look at the animations themselves - I can see his foot start to move down before he slams it to give an example or I can see his arms move as he's slamming or his body jolt upwards for a grab, can see it at all times. Its tough first time around but I think the tells seem pretty fair - its enough for me to say you can naturally react to his moves and understand why you dodge when you dodge. For me with King's Flame its not the same when he's spinning around - one can learn to parry to the rhythm of his spins, learn the timing of start ups etc but I don't think one can naturally react to these moves. I think there's a fair bit of that in this game. Its the main issue I have in what is otherwise a great game and a worthy competitor to FromSoft - can't wait for the DLC. Edit: I should clarify I understand that there's tells like we can see the startup of an attack and we can see his arm start to move around his body but for me it lacks the polish of FromSoft's animations - including their delayed attacks or any unnatural movements their enemies make.
My GotY 2023. I love the Souls games especially Bloodborne but i am by no means good at them. I am however very patient and tenacious. Learning Lies of P was a total blast. There have been quite a few decent Souls likes but none of them had that Fromsoft 'feel' to them, there was always something off. However, with Lies of P, the combat was complex and different enough to be unique but it also makes sense. The animations have such weight to them and when your hits or the enemies' connect it feels like it happens at the right moment where it was insanely rare that a hitbox was wonky. And for that sweet adrenaline rush, there is next to nothing in gaming as potent as seeing enemies charge up that huge red fury attack and then blocking it based on your experience. Lies of P absolutely values your time and guides you toward getting better at the game consistently. The gameplay is amazing but they didn't forget to also make the level design, production design, graphic fidelity, and incredible sound and music top notch. I don't use the phrase very often in recent years, but i love Lies. It definitely enhanced my P-Organ. I do need to say that i absolutely despised Sekiro. The basic combat ideas just never clicked with me and i spent about 40 hours attempting to "get it". Even though Lies of P combat is very Sekiro-esque, i feel it is much more intuitive and fair whereas Sekiro just felt like difficulty for difficulty's sake, especially with retarded things like Dragonrot punishing you excessively while trying to learn the game. In Lies of P, the difficulty is high but you have multiple defensive options at any given moment rather than one. There is essentially no downside of dying multiple times to a boss or game section and i very rarely was unable to regain my Ergo en route to figuring the game out. So i think, at least in my experience, even if people didn't like Sekiro, they may still enjoy Lies of P.
I had no expectations purchasing this game. I remember on launch day I was debating with myself for around 4 hours before hitting purchase on steam. After 2 hours, I was hooked. After 40 hours I am devoted. This game was absolutely phenomenal. Minor criticisms on some enemies and how certain npc quests are hidden and can be unavailable after a boss is cleared (thanks a ton Adelina). I told my Souls enthusiast friend that this game is my favourite “Souls” game in general and he was dumbfounded. I still stand by this and will until Elden Ring DLC or later down the line when a new game releases. What a great game, and such a great analysis brother. Thank you for this.
Was interested in playing the game for a while, and finally did this week. And oh man, the game is just amazing, but I found a couple things to sour the experience. Firstly, ill say that the animations and level design in this game are amazing, level design in particular stayed so extremely consistent that i can only rate them based on aesthetic, in reality they all have top notch designs. The enemy variety is also pretty solid, puppet and monster segments switch seemlessly and at an appropriate time, so it doesnt feel stale, and also having merged puppets and monsters at the end part of the game is a breath a fresh air. I dont even need to say anything on the player toolkit, it speaks for itself, ive had infinetly more fun with using lies of p weapons and tools than i did on elden ring and ds3 (hell, maybe even sekiro). Now as for the not so nice things to say. Coming off around 1k hours in sekiro, with a few hundred hours shared between elden ring and ds3, i found this game surprising tricky to get into. Firstly, going from 12 to 8 parry frames is a big change (and yes, im aware that this was likely to incentivise you in using dodge too). That and the vast difference in enemy design compared to sekiro made for a somewhat odd experience where youre still thinking in the way of the other game, while in reality its a completely different experience. On its own, a different enemy design isnt exactly a problem, matter of fact i think that its necessary as it would be underwhelming to get more of the same thing. My issue stems from the fact that many of the attacks are very springy, and not just for malfunctioning puppets, but also for bosses which either dont, or barely express that broken puppet vibe like green monster, manus, nameless puppet, laxasia, and romeo where some attacks just dont feel right, especially as they are amplified by smaller parry window. Romeo is an especially great example of that, as he often switches his weapons positioning mid swing, making the experience a little unsatisfying. However, the best example and worst fight i could use as an example for cancer to learn movesets is p2 laxasia, call it a skill issue, but her teleporting and double hitboxes with shield got to me and it was the only time i spam rolled out of a boss fight. Id imagine my gripes are just that though, as you can learn the bosses and have a pretty good time, but its that learning process that i wish was handled better. Lastly those puppets that roll around and laugh have some of the worst hitbox timings ive seen in the game.
Yeah you mention the attacks being too springy - too abrupt. That’s like the main issue with this game but I must admit I haven’t played since the patches and they have edited some of the attack animations in the patch notes - like for some normal enemies like the bat cop and that fire robot thing that attacks you with the spade. Not sure if bosses have been edited though Really good game though - enjoy pretty much everything else
Honestly I don't like Laxasia phase 2 that much either. She seems to have been made for the spectacle and not the experience. I say that even though I suck at bosses that teleport lol
I played Sekiro only after beating Lies three times, so I'd like to ask you, as someone with the opposite experience, didn't you find Lies to be far easier than Sekiro in general? Aside from the super-delayed and multi-hit attacks, which you mention? I went into Sekiro after reading that Lies is harder, but Sekiro destroyed my ass hard for multiple hours until I finally "clicked" with it after the second Juzou fight in the Hidden Forest. The sheer variety of things you fight in Sekiro and their attacks (mikiri thrust/sweeps/dodgeables/grabs/lightning) makes it much more challenging, in my opinion. The true "dances" with Genichiro and Isshin or Owl Father are utterly stellar though, and for me, only Laxasia and Nameless in Lies of P reach that same level of perfection.
@@jesterofjuice5132 i think you might be mistaken about the nameless puppet. It wasn't Carlo's body. Apart from the fact that you can see it being completely a machine (when the head is chopped off, the legs and hands are clearly mechanical), the Nameless puppet's ergo description stated that it was the "first puppet made by the old man that was mounted with a P-Organ". It also states that "Its ergo efficiency was destructive, thus the nameless puppet was not chosen for the boy's body and sealed away". My take on why he's the final boss is that it's a very powerful puppet that could be relatively easy to control, and that was "personally made" by Geppetto. The fact that was discarded i think it's due to not being an appropriate vessel to "nurture Carlo's heart" due to its violent nature. As for why he uses it as a vessel to bring back Carlo, i think it's because the heart and the arm of god are the important parts and not the actual body (vessel) used for the "resurrection" (even though, considering that Carlo kills everyone in the bad ending, this could imply that he still gets affected by the violent/hateful nature of the nameless puppet's ergo. What are your thoughts on this?
@ Think you're asking Igor but I'll give my two cents on it as well. Sekiro's definitely harder as an overall game unless Lies of P's DLC has anything to say about that (A very hard DLC could edge it in P's favour) But... I think Sekiro with the attack animations is a bit more fair probably. I will say that Sekiro's parry window is more generous than Lies of P's so keep in mind when you're fighting enemies in Sekiro if you wanted to try multiple playthroughs of Sekiro as well.
I loved lies of p SO MUCH that I went back through it just to refight laxasia so I could reliably defeat her without taking damage. Haha. I like nameless puppet a lot too, but Laxasia is my favorite fight so.
I'm one of the masochists that decided to buy Lies of P without playing any other souls game beforehand (I played the first Dark Souls for several hours and quickly have up). The atmosphere and overall theme of the game won me over so I decided to take that risk - and I absolutely loved it. LoP gives you multiple options to help you with defeating bosses if you find them too difficult, like specters and throwables, and not get too discouraged at the same time. After a while I even started to regret using specters because the boss fights started to feel doable, and winning them with NPCs help was just not that satisfying anymore. So I quickly finished the first run, started the game once again, this time deciding not to use any help, and loved the game even more. It felt like I had to learn the bosses from scratch in some cases - especially the scrapped watchman, because if you use a specter in this fight, you completely avoid learning his movements and the NPC practically kills him for you. Now after I've completed several playthroughs, each time experimenting with new weapons and combat styles, I can honestly say that while the game may be too frustrating for some people, I would say whether you stick with it or not depends mostly on your attitude. If you buy LoP understanding that it is supposed to be that hard, that it has its own style and identity that you have to welcome, embrace and understand, then your chances of not quitting the game out of frustration will probably skyrocket. So, personally, I would recommend it even to inexperienced players only under one condition - you have to be patient.
Some remarks, I'm in the middle of my 5th playthrough. For me, this is on par with Sekiro for being fun and satisfying to play (never played bloodborne). No other game comes close. The deflect game is significantly more satisfying than the DS roll spamming. I'd say Lies is on par with FromSoft products; FromSoft just has a certain scope and grandeur in its settings that Lies can't match. You just don't get moments like seeing Anor Londo in the distance, walking over the Grand Archives rooftops, or seeing Liurnia or Leyndell spread out before you. That said, putting Lies of P up alongside Dark Souls 1 (might have become outdated mechanically, but it's a damn masterpiece regardless) is incredible praise in itself. Long?! Lies of P? I found it super short, even though I never skip any fights. That said, I've not played any other soulslikes aside from the new LotF, so I guess I'm probably not qualified to judge. I disagree with your assessment of Fox and Cat. They aren't friendly at all; Cat cons you off some souls early on, and in Malum District they're only using you to clear the path for them. I do forgive Cat... on NG. I prefer the ergo on subsequent NGs, and I'm of the sort that clears areas completely. Why would I skip fights, given that I'm playing the game for the fights? That brings me to the Rabbits. The Black Rabbit Brotherhood, and particularly the full gank fight, is one of the best fights in the game. Laxasia first, Nameless second, I'd have to rank Romeo third, and the Rabbits are right up there. Both of their ganks are better than every single gank fight in Elden Ring, and I'd say they're even better than O&S. Each brother has a distinct and unique moveset, poise, and ways to engage, and that makes the fight as exhilarating as Laxasia's autistic second phase. Maybe you should have been deflecting them and learning their movesets and how to exploit them, instead of just fishing for backstabs. :P Jokes aside though, I agree that ganks are a very delicate encounter type that's more likely to be done wrong than right, so your position is understandable. The arena in the second fight should have been slightly larger to allow you to better isolate the current brother. And yeah, the boss run for that one could be a little shorter, but we're saying that just because we've been spoilt by most of this game and Elden Ring. Remember the average DS boss run, like Taurus Demon or Abyss Watchers, to see how good we have it nowadays. Finally, I'd honestly recommend this to everyone. It's easier to beat than Sekiro, and the challenge it provides is actually going to force you to learn to be good at it. Consumables are also plentiful for the cases where one finds cheesing necessary (I confess I did it on my first run a few times), and the spectres trivialise bosses completely if you use them. This glowing review-you can almost think I'm a shill, I know-comes from a guy who got filtered by Parade Master when he played the demo. I then played the new LotF and it got me itching for a better game, and I'm not disappointed I gave myself the time to get used to Lies at the end. Note that I only played Sekiro after beating Lies on NG+2, and the funny thing is, after coming back from Sekiro, Nameless-who used to give me trouble-has suddenly become extremely easy. Lies's "deflect red attacks" game is trivial in comparison to the complexity and breadth of Sekiro.
For someone that likes to call out people that don’t understand/pay attention to the game, you get a lot of the names wrong. Also, the story has a bunch of parallels to Bloodborne? So yeah stones and glass houses and all that.
Lies of P is an incredible achievement, and one of the non-FS games I would put up there with Miyazaki's work - the others being both Nioh 1 and 2. Speaking of Nioh, it's interesting that Team Ninja decided to collab with a developer that had never put out much of anything, came out of nowhere, and had zero experience with the genre. It's also quite astonishing that a development team with zero experience would put out such a polished, balanced game on their first try . It's not easy - see LotF. I have a feeling NeoWiz could be Team Ninja's sock puppet.
"It's not easy" nah, the lame souls formula is hella simple and shallow, anyone can do the same or even better (cue, Nioh), that's why there are so many souls-likes these days, it's a way easier formula than, say, making something like Monster Hunter, Dragon's Dogma, DMC, Bayonetta, Sifu, Nioh..
@@wallacesousuke1433 if it’s an easy formula, then why has nobody not named Lies of P ever come relatively close to the quality of a FromSoft title? Can you think of any? I can’t.
@@slintisbased huh? Nioh (not reaaaaally a souls like but whatever) has way better combat, Code Vein sold 3mi copies and its combat is on pair, potentially better than any souls game (would've been way better if it went the way of Nioh and were faster paced, combo-based), Lord of the Fallen "2" is easily on pair with Elden Ring in scope terms and destroys anything made by From graphically, Demon's remake humiliates the entire From's library, Mortal Shell looks on the same level or better than any pre-Bloodborne titles (also dont act like DS2 is any good lol and the second half of DS1 is disgusting, From even had to apologize... And OG Demons isn't really great and didnt age well) Only thing From excels at is lore and lore design, its combat is a laughable boring joke, literally poor man's Monster Hunter with 3D Metroidvania level design/progression, invisible walls and tons of ideas stolen from Berserk. You only put From on a high pedestal cuz you're a blind dummmmb fangirl, for any outsider with no bias, they are barely better than their clones and again, is basic formula is laughably simple and any nobody can put together a similar combat and sell a million copies cuz From stans have no standards and are easy cash cows. Also, Elden Ring is large as the ocean but deep as a pond, couldn't even force myself to beat it a second time, so boring and padded, so many recycled dungeons, ruins and bosses 😪😑 deffo not GOTY material (not that this means anything these days even Overwatch won it lol)
@@wallacesousuke1433didn’t even read half of the nonsense you wrote. Just saw “Lord of the Fallen is better than anything From has put out” and automatically knew I’m dealing with the mentally challenged. That opinion alone should disqualify you from speaking about video games, or anything at all for that matter, ever again.
@@slintisbased 🤣🤣🤣🤣pathetic clown, you seriously stopped before the part I wrote "graphically" and am acting like I have mental issues when you clearly are the one here who appear to have a few extra chromosomes? Anyway, From games are overrated clunky, repetitive trash, nothing but poor man's Monster Hunter combat on an Medieval Europe setting with tons of ideas ripped off of Berserk and 3D Metroidvania level design. Easiest formula to copy cuz it's so low-effort and simply an inferior twist on the original, better games From stole ideas from
Wholeheartedly disagree on your assessment of Simon Manus. None of the points you brought up are valid. His hitboxes are just as tight as any other boss, and his moves are really well telegraphed. The only attack I think is bullshit in phase 1 is the in air jump attack, and in phase 2, the amount of VFX can hide the boss, but that's it. I also disagree with your assessment that you're meant to play Lies of P like Sekiro and opt to deflect everything. The parry timings in Lies of P are much smaller than Sekiro. Enemies don't have long combos like Sekiro, and most importantly, Lies of P has much stronger action commitment, almost ripped from Dark Souls 1, soon as you start an attack you're locked into that animation, unlike Sekiro where you can animatiom cancel an attack into parry if you change your mind during the anticipation section of the animation. So no, in Lies of P, you're meant to use all the tools it gives you, block, dodge, and deflect, not just the latter.
i loved lies of p, definitely in my top 3 games in this genre, that said... DUDE WHAT'S YOUR PROBLEM WITH TRICK WEAPONS😢 they are so cool. it's my favorite aspect of Bloodborne
They're absolutely cool, but they just don't do all that much as a system. Most of them have useless transforms and only function in one state or the other. The transform combo of the saw spear and saw cleaver are pretty much the only instance of a weapon functioning better because of the system. I talked about it in more detail in my bloodborne video, but I think bloodborne would work better if, like sekiro, the saw cleaver was the only weapon, but you could upgrade it's transformed form into different weapons with different utilities.
@@jesterofjuice5132 I have over 500 hours on BB and i've done a playthroughs with pretty much every weapon (minus like 3 of them) and what you just said is simply wrong. Most of the time the transforming attack is one of the strongest attack of that weapon and for many weapons that can and SHOULD be used mid combo. To be more precise: hunter axe, tonitrus, chikage, burial blade, Amygdala arm, Saif, Boom Hammer , Church Pick , Rakuyo + the 2 you mentioned. It's rare for a weapon to have an objectively better form and that usually happen when there is a buff or damage type change involve. Sometimes the form charge come with additional buffs like in the case of the Threaded Cane where in the whip for it get the "serrated" attribute which is a 20% additional damage against beasts. It's a complex system that reward player from mastering that weapon. And while i can see a game when you only have 1 weapon that trasform in diffrerent forms but that isn't a demerit of Bloodborne. If anything, bloodborne should be praised for pioneering that system.
@@gianlucaangeliit’s in no way a complex system lol, you get one extra attack that does more damage and stagger that’s really about it. The AoW system in ER offers a lot more with the ability to jump over and low profile attacks, same with prosthetics and weapon arts in Sekiro. The trick weapon system is ultimately simplistic.
I Was looking forward to this video after you told us about it in the dark souls video, do you have a plan to do a video on elden ring ? Or the upcoming dlc for it. Also im hoping the comment section stays civilized considering the title xd
Yes! I was thinking my next project might be a largescale multi video analysis of elden ring leading up to the DLC. I'm so hyped about Shadow of the erdtree!
The reason the fight with the nameless puppet was optional is because the studio understands fans of Souls-borne ip's! They knew that fans would play it to experience that fight if they didn't on their 1st playthrough.
The dodge isn't bad and the game isn't made to be played with only perfect guard. Some boss attacks are easier dodged while others are easy to deflect. Not that you can't complete the game with just doing either or.
I played this at launch by only dodging and after six new game plus’s I rarely ever agreed with many of the negatives put against it. I never found the dodge system that bad and it’s especially great after upgrading it.
I’ve actually never finished Sekiro, put a few hours into it but got frustrated with the combat and fell off. For some reason I kept pushing through P though, and I’m glad I did cuz it’s the best new game I’ve played since Elden ring, definitely. Went back and replayed a couple souls games after beating P a few times and they all seem so easy in comparison, except late game Elden ring. Maybe I’ll actually give sekiro another shot now.
you may have heard it said, that sekiro is actually a rhythm game. when i approached it that way, everything fell into place and the fights were so exciting. not everyones cup of tea though.
I only played Sekiro after Lies of P, and I'm very happy that I did play it. It's the only souls game that gets close to lies of P in terms of being fun to play (deflect >>> roll spam, as much as I love DS1 and DS3 and ER to bits). Now I'm playing lies again and Nameless, which was giving me trouble in phase 2, is so hilariously easy now. I'd sugggest trying Sekiro again, it really does take a while to "click" with you, even if you've beaten Lies of P three times like I had, but once it clicks, you'll have the most fun you've had in souls games. At least I did.
I was terrible at sekiro for like two whole playthroughs and didn't like it much at first. Now its my second favorite souls game behind elden ring. You should definitely give it another shot
On sekiro mate, just spam l1 when you're getting attacked and eventually the parrying will click. After that just literally parry when you're getting attacked, then spam r1 when you're not getting attacked. Once that clicks mate, Sekiro becomes quite trivial.
I didn’t use consumables but I loved using the dodge I went in knowing that it would be harder if I used only dodge and I just decided eh why not though I did use the parry system throughout the early game
I got through the game just fine with quicksteps and didn't find this harder than your typical souls game. You can very much play like Bloodborne, the game has both systems fairly fleshed out, so people calling it a Bloodborne-like is a fair comparison.
Amazing review and agree with all the points, the only thing I gotta go against is you can beat the game with dodging instead of reflection. 😅 It's just hell lot more difficult but not impossible, on my second rerun I started to play the game similar to Seiko and it's easier however I'm aggressive as hell when it comes to souls like 😅 so it's not my play style. I love the fact the game gives you multiple ways to help not take damage and pretty snappy with either (especially with the p origin system)
The fact that we’re getting dlc of this & how those after credits left me sooo fucking curious man! Amazing analysis as always. I do disagree about Manus being a bad fight in its entirety, but it being the potential final boss is a downside considering how amazing the Nameless Puppet is.
Lies of p was great I loved it but, for 90% of the game I definitely only dodged and only guarded when I got cornered. I love sekiro its my favorite fromsift game.... Hated pg in this game. Im sure its a skill issue but the short window combined with the timing made me miserable. The only two playstyles I had fun with in this game weredodge while using heavies to stagger and one I call "bloodborne now with shields" where I put everything into defense and guard regain. I essentially out trade the bosses. By constantly gaining my health back. My point is I think you're wrong in saying its even a sekiro-like. Its souls in Italian. Where it enables variety of playstyles you just have to engage with the games mechanics to find them. Unlike sekiro which is by design restrictive.
I guess in my head the sekiro and P deflections feel mostly the same with some tweaking in timings. When I said that "you wont enjoy this game if you don't like sekiro style deflection games," I never thought that there would be people who like one deflection mechanic and dislike the other. That's an interesting perspective
First off, this video was well written and had a ton of funny jokes and references. Especially because im playing thru RE4 rn, so those RE4 jokes were hilarious. So much so that I can forgive you for pronouncing Krat as Krate 😂 I beat P 2 days ago so its all very recent to me, but the bosses I had an absolute nightmare time with was Walker Of Illusions and Door Guardian, Walker was the first boss I was forced to try throwables on, and realized how OP they are. The second boss I was forced to use throwables on was "Electric malenia" as you put it😂 Interesting how you hated the stalker fights, i personally thought them to be some of the best enemies in P. I was also super disappointed with Manus, felt like he was just a big dummy elden beast like boss with easily telegraphed moves.
I agree with everything you said in this video. The bosses and combat mechanics are amazing (ignoring the stalker fights) and makes Bloodborne look like a joke. However, there is one reason I regard this game as inferior to Fromsoft and it's a point I'm surprised you didnt visit: the level design is extremely lackluster in my opinion. It's completely linear and mundane. The levels feel like funnels towards the bosses, and you very rarely feel lost and like you're exploring the area. The laziness in level design becomes very apparent towards the end where it's just a straightforward path to Manus littered with an army that everybody will just run past. Exploration and never knowing where you'll find the next bonfire is one of my favourite aspects of Souls games, and one that LoP sadly didn't address.
I mean it's not my favorite soulslike, but it does make the top 3: ds3, sekiro, lop, er, ds (haven't played the other titles yet and ds3 being top is mostly due to it being my first soulsgame and the bosses)
I can't beat Lies of P, or even get that far in due to my inability to properly time things I've tried again and again and sunk a fair amount of time into trying to learn parries/deflects and such, it's just not something that I can do Still love this game though and even I, as the shitter that I am, can realize this is a damn good game
I’m glad you enjoyed it. For me, the dodge does not give enough distance or i-frames, the enemy windups are way too vague for a parry centric combat scheme, and the parry timing is just too narrow a timeframe. bloodborne and Sekiro make you feel like a genius once you learn the systems. This never does that because the systems suck. Also, this is not a brave opinion. It’s the crowd opinion, which you’re welcome to. I just disagree. But still, I love your content. Take my like.
After getting used to Sekiro's parry system this game was so annoying in the beginning. Took me some time to realize that you actually need to hold the parry
Yeah, you do not have to take It as a Sekiro parry. Because you have to Remember that in Sekiro deflections are mandatory, here are optional (you can still Just Dodge). Having to hold down the button makes sure you cannot Just spam block and deflect everything.
@@DRKLRD-kv4cm Well it doesn't help that this game is obviously parry focused and how bad the dodging mechanic is. I wouldn't say parrying is mandatory in Sekiro, you can dodge your way out of most things although it's just not optimal at all.
Not really LoP's parry works just fine with a single tap you just need to stay in one place because it cancels out the animation if you move even just a little
@@chancetherappersburner6338 yes, but my point is that for a lot of attacks, if you can't manage to deflect them, you can just dodge them. I always beat victor the champion with only dodges, never did a single deflection
The "restrictive difficulty" was the best part about Lies of P. Too bad the devs succumbed to the cries of the streamers and so called "souls veterans" and nerfed it to the ground.
@@korsakovpodcastI like how scrubs assume people who are good at games don’t have a life lmao, not a single boss in LoP took me more than 15 tries on launch.
@@MakioGoHardio 15 tries means your record vs every boss is 1 win against 14 losses. Even if we believe every word people say about their win or lose records.
@@korsakovpodcast it doesn’t matter whether you believe it or not, what matters is that I spent less time and had more fun than you, the hardest boss for me was Laxasia who took me 15 tries and the other bosses didn’t take me nearly as long, this game was pretty easy all it tested was memorization not actual execution.
@@MakioGoHardio than me? i never said anything about my tries, i've beat the game miltiple times, now in NG+++, platinum etc. But you are right about memorization!
Its a fun game but it has almost no build variety, linear level design and standard lore. It was fun but I wont do another playthrough, I did a quality build so I got to use almost every weapon and was still overpowered. Saying this game is better than the classic Fromsoft games is a bold statement.
"dodge is supposed to bad" it's a strange opinion. If the devs of this game agreed with this, the real question would be: so why there is a roll in the first place? sekiro it's confident in it's design that revolves around a single main weapon, and that's it. BB has a joke item after a few hours of playtime wirh a passive agressive statement on shields (same thing handled with less finesse). So why P devs would make roll as a noobtrap on purpose?
For me personally, LoP is the first "souls" game I've actually completed. Not only that but I went back and did 2 more playthroughs too (NG+), I might even keep going just to try more weapons out. I previously played DS1, DS3 and Sekiro (which you don't even count as a souls game) but never completed any of them. Sekiro held me the longest but something about these games just didn't click. The only FromSoftware game I've actually finished is Armored Core 6 (Excellent game, hardly a soulslike though). Also you said you turned off voices just for the nameless puppet, but damn man, did you even listen to the ways the characters said things before that? I'm out here laughing at stuff like the city of "Crate", "Aldoro" with the missing vowel and "Fuecoco" which is a starter pokemon for generation 9. Then we've got Rosa "Isabella" street, the glorious "Lonzini" arcade and finally "Ve-nig-ni" who has abandoned being French (with their weird spelling convention) and instead gained the n-word pass. 🤣
Nah sorry Lies of P didnt do it for me. World design and the lore is neat but the combat is genuinely the MOST stiff combat in a souls like, objectively fucked
II think lies of p bosses are on par with ds3 and sekiro but I think it kind of falls behind for me when It comes to level/ world design. I also feel that the quantity of bosses is significantly lower than any of the fromsoft games.
This game has nothing from bloodborne? Pro do you even rally? rally mechanic? Trick weapon system? Land a heavy attack to stun the enemy? (Yes they are different, they are inspired by bloodborne) And many attack in this game is easier to dodge than to parry. Parry is very well designed, it is a high risk high reward but dodging is also very effective.
Thats i think probably sarcastic statement bcuz he is annoyed of so many people called it Bloodborne clone while the core mechanic is borrowed from Sekiro, its about breaking posture & parrying with your main weapon. Even tho the dodge is available, & you can upgrade the dodge, the main focus in this game is not the dodge. I'd say the dodge only there for people who don't like parry.
Its a OK game, i dont really get the hype for it, its my no4 soulslike from 2023. 1. Wolong, the combat is just fun, 2. Blasphenous 2 and 3rd jedi survivor, bugy but cool. But lies of p i really didnt get it
I love this game so much. But brotha man. Backwards ass logic. "If you didn't play the game the way I think you should, you didn't really play the game." "People will pointlessly say I LITERALLY JUST SAID THAT. but what I mean is. Not that." ...this isn't analysis.
lol no Lies of P was extremely mid, especially: level design, enemy design, most NPCs and NPC quests, dialogues / voice acting, story, and lore. I also cannot condone the art direction / graphics which is just out of the box what Unreal engine has to offer. The last level of the game was probably a highlight, the final boss was beyond cliché and stupid, the epilogue with Daddy G and Nameless Puppett was cool, and the MCU-like post-credit scene teasing a Wizard of Oz follow up was so out of place and cringe that it made me laugh and immediately close the game for good, never to be revisited. So it all ended like the rest of the game: as a rollercoaster of great to abysmal that unfortunately just left a sour taste after each playing sessions.
Dodge is clunky with not enough frames, parrying system in not even worth it (high risk low reward and only used for bosses actually). Defence is the worst part of the game.
I specifically meant the 3 games in the Dark souls series, and I stand by that claim. And I say that while being a huge fan of ds3. However, I believe that ds3 is pretty basic and slightly outdated compared to the modern games, even though it was incredibly well designed for its time.
@@jesterofjuice5132 i will agree to disagree. ive played all soul games and most soullikes. i thoroughly enjoyed lies of p and beat it. but it just doesn't compare to Elden ring or ds3 for me. it does beat ds1 and 2 for me as far as game design/mechanics go. I feel ds3 just had more to offer lore, enemy design, and build variety wise. Also I enjoy the souls pvp, so the invasion mechanic I'm a fan of. I do believe lies of p is phenomenal and i will gladly get dlc or a sequel, but im not going to replay it like i easily desire to with the souls series.
Why should I be careful lol the worst I can be is wrong, but I stand by what I said. Surpassed isn't even a negative thing when considering the game was building off of the souls games and Sekiro as a base. It took the formula, and added new mechanics with tight gameplay and placed in an interesting world. To me, the assumption is that it would surpass souls by nature of having those games as an example. The far more insulting situation is for a game like Lords of the fallen to copy souls almost exactly without adding anything interesting or well designed, and while falling on its face in terms of overall quality
Lies of P is mechanically tighter and feels more responsive and more accurate than any FS game I've played. I'm glad someone had the balls to make a YT video saying that FS games are not unsurpassable.
This was easily my favorite game of 2023. It was tough, but I loved what Neowiz and R8 did with this title. The weapons, the story, the bosses, level design - it was all really well done. Like you said, the devs were really confident in this title and it shows. Thanks for the video!
Thanks for watching!
It would have been my GOTY if ACVI didnt release the same year.
Glad to see others who enjoy this game as much as I do, I almost felt crazy for enjoying it as much as and more than some of From’s own games. I agree that nostalgia seems to be the main reason many people hold onto the older games, but as someone introduced more recently but has platinum’d every release my nostalgia isn’t as big a factor and lets me see the games a bit more objectively. Can’t wait to see what Neowiz does next. Also, I’ve been obsessed with the soundtrack and have listened to it exclusively on loop since it dropped on Spotify in November.
It's funny to me that two of my most memorable experiences in gaming was from Neowiz. First Lies of P and then SANABI.
Love your content man. Please keep putting out essays like this and don’t be discouraged by the lower amount of views on this one opposed to your Lords of the Fallen entry. You’re incredible at breaking down the mechanics and nuances of the souls-like genre, especially the boss fights. Look forward to the next video
Wrong.
Honestly this was probably one of the best video I have even spent an hour and a half listening too
Thanks for the hard work
Thanks for the video. I appreciate your thoughts on the game. You pointed out somethings I did not thing about.
Lies of P was my favorite single player games of 2023. It's just so satisfying to play. I just loved the mechanics, the story, (most of) the bosses, the story/lore, and that it is 98% bug free at launch.
I am eager for the DLC and hope that their follow up OZ game will be as interesting.
FINALLY!!! Someone else that noticed you can shorten the overheat status by rolling around!!
I love little details like that
Everyone noticed that. It tells you. What do you mean?
I loved this game so much. I’ve done for play throughs and it has gone into my souls rotation. I had the bizarre experience of beating nameless first try even though I’m really not great at lies. Archbishop took me like three hours to beat.
I love how everyone has their own bosses that they're naturally really good at with little practice. Mine was Nameless king in ds3 but the Lothric and lorian fight beats my ass every time lol
Love the part where you talk about the last optional boss.
While Manus wasn’t impressive, his phase change was possibly the coolest power up I’ve ever seen in any Souls Like game
Bro said "Domain Expansion for my 2nd phase".
Lies of P is both PEAK GAMING and PEAK BOOK ADAPTATION
Peak gaming? Someone here never played Nioh, Sekiro, Monster Hunter, DMC.....
Was wondering when this video would come, especially after your Lords of the Fallen video.
I hope it lives up to your expectations! Thanks for watching
I will say, I don't think that the dodge-roll is bad or "meant" to be bad, I just think its not nearly as forgiving as intuitive as the Dark Souls and Elden Ring roll. It's not inherently bad, but it will feel worse if you're expecting the DS3 roll. I also think the fact that it turns into a side-step when locked on, which its harder to tell when the dodge starts since the animation isn't as obvious as the full on roll.
Personally I think the dodge roll could have a few more i-frames than it currently does. Ideally blocking should be the least risky but least rewarding option. You can continually block but take some damage. Parrying should be the most risky and hardest to pull off but most rewarding, since it fully negates damage and builds up stance breaking. Ideally the dodge should fall in the middle, but it feels like its just slightly too tight, putting it closer to the timing required for the parry, throwing off that balance.
If the point was to show you that the dodge should only be for positioning, like Sekiro, I feel like it should have worse i-frames to make it obvious that you should be parrying for most attacks. However, because it's useful enough but not as good as the Dark Souls dodge, I think it ends up just feeling awkward to use, rather than weak. If you are right, and the dodge was supposed to be bad, I definitely think they could have done better to make that apparent, but it doesn't feel like it was meant to be. Personally, I got used to it, but I would rather it remained the dodge roll at all times rather than the side-step when locked on, just for consistency's sake.
Those are all good points. Maybe I should have made it more clear, but I was just kinda glossing over it, but I was mostly referencing the dodge before you get the dodge link skill and the rolling from the ground skill feeling bad for newer players, who weren't familiar with sekiro style gameplay. Personally, I don't mind the dodge roll at all, and on some bosses, like manus, I almost exclusively use the dodge.
@@jesterofjuice5132considering how many people i've Heard saying that LotF Is Better than Lies of P, i'm very Happy to see this
Your videos are fantastic. The amount of time and thought you put into them is clear. Keep it up man, you are as good as anyone I have watched. I believe!
It’s a good mix of dodging/rolling and deflections it feels great to do either or but especially deflections. This was my first soulslike and it didn’t take me long to get used to it so idk why people don’t like the deflection system.
Your channel should have way more subs and views
8:52 to About the dodge, I never understood why people said the dodge was bad. What the game communicated to me is that we have multiple viable *options*, not that it was fundamentally designed to be beaten with deflections. The dodge is fine. Even at slightly heavy, it's functional. If you want more distance or something, try normal weight, or even light. And save Link Dodge for direction changes or uncertain timings on heavy enemy attacks. You can also act out of a dodge faster than out of a Perfect Guard. Even with the upgrade. There are trade offs to both. The dodge and the Perfect Guard are interchangeable and optional depending on the situation and each player's sensibilities.
1:01:50 Exactly my point when saying the game isn't all about the Perfect Guard. It doesn't mean Manus is badly designed, it means those attacks aren't necessarily for your inclination to deflect. You also miss several things by not using Fable Arts to create interesting interactions with his moveset. Not just the attack oriented ones, but the utility. I'm not sure if you even mentioned them in the video.
People also overlook the normal guard. If you spec into the P Organ right, guarding is fantastic for the heaviest weapons in the game. Not only for the damage reduction, but because of the Guard Regain mechanic. If you guard certain lighter attacks, your Guard Regain will heal more HP than you initially lost. This seems to work up to NG+2.
About the Black Rabbit Brotherhood and Stalker fights in general, Fulminis really works wonders for giving players breathing room. Any level of charge will stagger them, and higher charges will even launch them.
Overall, great analysis video!
Totally agree. Anyone still having problems side-reading bosses with the double dodge upgrade doesn't know the game enough to be talking about its mechanics. I usually hate gatekeeping rhetoric like that but it is truly baffling to me how so many people seem to go the 'dodges are bad go deflection only' route and then calling the game bad because they ignore a fundamental part of it.
Counterpoint: the dodge is actually bad. It is worse than the Sekiro dodge in distance and in i-frames. And that is saying something because it is pretty weak in Sekiro.
@@pocketbacon9636 Your s last for nearly the whole dodge. I don't know where you're getting that info. And the s are the important part. If you want distance, you can go normal weight or light weight.
As someone who deliberately played Slightly Heavy during my first playthrough, I don't understand not agree with people saying that the dodge is bad. It's just the people were used to Bloodborne and Dark Souls 3's dodges to be their free and effortless way out of damage, instead of it demanding something out of the player.
The same stuff happened with Sekiro on release. The major difference is that Sekiro forced you focus more on deflecting everything while making dodge near useless and LoP leaves it to the player to whether dodge or parry or focus on both depending on the situation. It gives a choice like DS2's ADP but done better.
Yeah I watched the video and thought "wait what? Who said the dodge was bad?" The dodge is great. Maybe it was bad at launch and they patched it? Apparently there was a lot of difficulty tweaks post launch.
You can equip two weapons to fight the brotherhood guys if you chose the Dexterity preset at the beginning of the game. You use your main weapon against the eldest guy and the spear guy and you use the rapier against the other 2.
The rapier is criminaly underrated against easily staggarable enemies, you can just keep using your heavy non charged attack, to poke the other 2 whenever they come close and cancel their attack animations while causing damage and keeping distance. It's really really fun to do this for some reason.
So glad to see you enjoyed Lies of P. I found your channel randomly just looking through some Elden Ring dlc reviews. ER was my first souls game.. I then went on to play BB, Sekiro, and all of the souls games. After playing Lies of P, I felt as though it had taken all the best parts of souls games and wrapped them up nice and neat (and innovating quite a bit on top of that). I managed to beat ER dlc without summoning as I like to do but I must say I found it predictable and not very enjoyable when it comes to bosses, which is a large reason I play these games. Even before the ER dlc came out, my most anticipated game was/is actually Lies of P dlc/Lies of P 2. I really wish the best for these developers and hopefully Fromsoft can pick up some obvious pointers from Neowiz + Round 8… My number one thing would be the more accessible parries. When you realize all you’re doing in ER for 90% of a fight is rolling around and making 0 progress towards killing the boss, it’s just so.. unfun lol
wow...after commenting on your erdtree video im glad to see you love this game aswell!
absolutely loved this game. originally came into it hoping just for good enough but got back an amazing quality experience that makes you want to do ng+
>Surpassed Souls
I'm playing this right now and I've just beat King of Puppets. I think "surpassed" it's a strong word, but it's the first time I can say that a souls clone is as good as the other games. Finally something fresh and good.
btw I want to watch your video but I'm afraid of spoilers. I guess I'll save it for when I finish the game. (I'll preemptively give you a like)
i agree, they're the only team that understood the fromsoft formula.
Equal in quality and atmosphere of a typical Fromsoft game, but the combat and customization has actually taken a step forward imo. Holistically, however, I’m not ready to place it above the rest of their titles. I didn’t previously believe anyone could even replicate the formula this well
Fair enough. Personally, I do love the souls games, but something about this game really struck a cord with me. I have a lot of respect for the devs. Enjoy the rest of your playthrough!
@@jesterofjuice5132 >23:21 located right down the road
I'm watching it now. I see what you did there.
I felt like Geppetto asking Carlo if he was a good father was a test. He was probably hoping Carlo would tell the truth meaning he was less likely to resist his father.
Great video. Can you make more in depth video about bosses/combat mechanics. i disagree with some takes about bosses but due to little elaboration I cannt see the entire point and there is more under the hood then just parry (for example dodge in LoP work similar to mikiri counter).
Also have you played pvp in other souls games? I enjoyed NPC fights when approached as spacing/hitbox priority(staggering them out of attacks) challenge even 2nd BRB wasnt that bad.
Contextualizing the game's encounters with Carlo Collodi's work was really cool, I certaintly didn't pick those references up on my playthrough beyond the more well known parts of Pinnochio.
I am in a unique position because I finished this game before I tried any true fromsoft games. Now that I have finished Elden Ring as well I can finally compare. I might need to try some other fromsoft games, but so far I prefer Lies of P as the more focused expirience. I dislike arriving to a boss and not knowing if I am too strong or too weak. Lies of p is just constistently great all the way to the end.
First of all, would like to say great video, keep up the good work! And its a great game!
Now I haven't played since before the first patch so I don't exactly know everything thats changed. I know they have edited the animations of a few of the enemies like bat cop, fire robot with the spade for example. I think is because they sorta realised it was an issue for the game and the move at 1:09:20 used to be unfair and its great if they've added a yellow glow to some of these red attacks... it shows they are willing to improve and learn from any mistakes they may make.
I don't know if they edited King's Flame like they did with the normal enemy version of him but playing against him on release was problematic for me - the moveset of the boss is not overly complex and one can learn the fight and parry timings in a reasonable amount of time for sure and it does have some tells to the start ups but... for me, the Horah Loux fight is quite different because I can see how people can take issue with him especially first time around - he's very unpredictable and he does some really weird stuff but when I look at the animations themselves - I can see his foot start to move down before he slams it to give an example or I can see his arms move as he's slamming or his body jolt upwards for a grab, can see it at all times. Its tough first time around but I think the tells seem pretty fair - its enough for me to say you can naturally react to his moves and understand why you dodge when you dodge. For me with King's Flame its not the same when he's spinning around - one can learn to parry to the rhythm of his spins, learn the timing of start ups etc but I don't think one can naturally react to these moves. I think there's a fair bit of that in this game.
Its the main issue I have in what is otherwise a great game and a worthy competitor to FromSoft - can't wait for the DLC.
Edit: I should clarify I understand that there's tells like we can see the startup of an attack and we can see his arm start to move around his body but for me it lacks the polish of FromSoft's animations - including their delayed attacks or any unnatural movements their enemies make.
My GotY 2023. I love the Souls games especially Bloodborne but i am by no means good at them. I am however very patient and tenacious. Learning Lies of P was a total blast. There have been quite a few decent Souls likes but none of them had that Fromsoft 'feel' to them, there was always something off. However, with Lies of P, the combat was complex and different enough to be unique but it also makes sense. The animations have such weight to them and when your hits or the enemies' connect it feels like it happens at the right moment where it was insanely rare that a hitbox was wonky. And for that sweet adrenaline rush, there is next to nothing in gaming as potent as seeing enemies charge up that huge red fury attack and then blocking it based on your experience. Lies of P absolutely values your time and guides you toward getting better at the game consistently. The gameplay is amazing but they didn't forget to also make the level design, production design, graphic fidelity, and incredible sound and music top notch. I don't use the phrase very often in recent years, but i love Lies. It definitely enhanced my P-Organ.
I do need to say that i absolutely despised Sekiro. The basic combat ideas just never clicked with me and i spent about 40 hours attempting to "get it". Even though Lies of P combat is very Sekiro-esque, i feel it is much more intuitive and fair whereas Sekiro just felt like difficulty for difficulty's sake, especially with retarded things like Dragonrot punishing you excessively while trying to learn the game. In Lies of P, the difficulty is high but you have multiple defensive options at any given moment rather than one. There is essentially no downside of dying multiple times to a boss or game section and i very rarely was unable to regain my Ergo en route to figuring the game out. So i think, at least in my experience, even if people didn't like Sekiro, they may still enjoy Lies of P.
"It definitely enhanced my P-Organ," haha classic. I wish I would have thought of that and put it in the video
Man, your channel is peak!!!, suscribed!!
I had no expectations purchasing this game. I remember on launch day I was debating with myself for around 4 hours before hitting purchase on steam. After 2 hours, I was hooked. After 40 hours I am devoted. This game was absolutely phenomenal. Minor criticisms on some enemies and how certain npc quests are hidden and can be unavailable after a boss is cleared (thanks a ton Adelina).
I told my Souls enthusiast friend that this game is my favourite “Souls” game in general and he was dumbfounded. I still stand by this and will until Elden Ring DLC or later down the line when a new game releases.
What a great game, and such a great analysis brother. Thank you for this.
Crate.
my top favorite souls/soulslike games are Elden Ring and Lies of P. Lies of P is so freaking good.
We have similar taste. My next video will be the beginning of a series analyzing Elden ring
Was interested in playing the game for a while, and finally did this week. And oh man, the game is just amazing, but I found a couple things to sour the experience.
Firstly, ill say that the animations and level design in this game are amazing, level design in particular stayed so extremely consistent that i can only rate them based on aesthetic, in reality they all have top notch designs. The enemy variety is also pretty solid, puppet and monster segments switch seemlessly and at an appropriate time, so it doesnt feel stale, and also having merged puppets and monsters at the end part of the game is a breath a fresh air. I dont even need to say anything on the player toolkit, it speaks for itself, ive had infinetly more fun with using lies of p weapons and tools than i did on elden ring and ds3 (hell, maybe even sekiro).
Now as for the not so nice things to say. Coming off around 1k hours in sekiro, with a few hundred hours shared between elden ring and ds3, i found this game surprising tricky to get into. Firstly, going from 12 to 8 parry frames is a big change (and yes, im aware that this was likely to incentivise you in using dodge too). That and the vast difference in enemy design compared to sekiro made for a somewhat odd experience where youre still thinking in the way of the other game, while in reality its a completely different experience.
On its own, a different enemy design isnt exactly a problem, matter of fact i think that its necessary as it would be underwhelming to get more of the same thing. My issue stems from the fact that many of the attacks are very springy, and not just for malfunctioning puppets, but also for bosses which either dont, or barely express that broken puppet vibe like green monster, manus, nameless puppet, laxasia, and romeo where some attacks just dont feel right, especially as they are amplified by smaller parry window. Romeo is an especially great example of that, as he often switches his weapons positioning mid swing, making the experience a little unsatisfying. However, the best example and worst fight i could use as an example for cancer to learn movesets is p2 laxasia, call it a skill issue, but her teleporting and double hitboxes with shield got to me and it was the only time i spam rolled out of a boss fight.
Id imagine my gripes are just that though, as you can learn the bosses and have a pretty good time, but its that learning process that i wish was handled better.
Lastly those puppets that roll around and laugh have some of the worst hitbox timings ive seen in the game.
Yeah you mention the attacks being too springy - too abrupt. That’s like the main issue with this game but I must admit I haven’t played since the patches and they have edited some of the attack animations in the patch notes - like for some normal enemies like the bat cop and that fire robot thing that attacks you with the spade. Not sure if bosses have been edited though
Really good game though - enjoy pretty much everything else
Honestly I don't like Laxasia phase 2 that much either. She seems to have been made for the spectacle and not the experience. I say that even though I suck at bosses that teleport lol
I played Sekiro only after beating Lies three times, so I'd like to ask you, as someone with the opposite experience, didn't you find Lies to be far easier than Sekiro in general? Aside from the super-delayed and multi-hit attacks, which you mention?
I went into Sekiro after reading that Lies is harder, but Sekiro destroyed my ass hard for multiple hours until I finally "clicked" with it after the second Juzou fight in the Hidden Forest. The sheer variety of things you fight in Sekiro and their attacks (mikiri thrust/sweeps/dodgeables/grabs/lightning) makes it much more challenging, in my opinion. The true "dances" with Genichiro and Isshin or Owl Father are utterly stellar though, and for me, only Laxasia and Nameless in Lies of P reach that same level of perfection.
@@jesterofjuice5132 i think you might be mistaken about the nameless puppet. It wasn't Carlo's body. Apart from the fact that you can see it being completely a machine (when the head is chopped off, the legs and hands are clearly mechanical), the Nameless puppet's ergo description stated that it was the "first puppet made by the old man that was mounted with a P-Organ". It also states that "Its ergo efficiency was destructive, thus the nameless puppet was not chosen for the boy's body and sealed away". My take on why he's the final boss is that it's a very powerful puppet that could be relatively easy to control, and that was "personally made" by Geppetto. The fact that was discarded i think it's due to not being an appropriate vessel to "nurture Carlo's heart" due to its violent nature. As for why he uses it as a vessel to bring back Carlo, i think it's because the heart and the arm of god are the important parts and not the actual body (vessel) used for the "resurrection" (even though, considering that Carlo kills everyone in the bad ending, this could imply that he still gets affected by the violent/hateful nature of the nameless puppet's ergo.
What are your thoughts on this?
@ Think you're asking Igor but I'll give my two cents on it as well.
Sekiro's definitely harder as an overall game unless Lies of P's DLC has anything to say about that (A very hard DLC could edge it in P's favour)
But... I think Sekiro with the attack animations is a bit more fair probably. I will say that Sekiro's parry window is more generous than Lies of P's so keep in mind when you're fighting enemies in Sekiro if you wanted to try multiple playthroughs of Sekiro as well.
I loved lies of p SO MUCH that I went back through it just to refight laxasia so I could reliably defeat her without taking damage. Haha. I like nameless puppet a lot too, but Laxasia is my favorite fight so.
"All of you did use the dragon katana didn't you" -yup hahahaha and now also we got the azure dragon crescent glaive which is also busted 🤣🤣🤣
The katana is super fun to use lol
@@84rinne_moo yup we know that already it’s a hwando
I'm one of the masochists that decided to buy Lies of P without playing any other souls game beforehand (I played the first Dark Souls for several hours and quickly have up). The atmosphere and overall theme of the game won me over so I decided to take that risk - and I absolutely loved it. LoP gives you multiple options to help you with defeating bosses if you find them too difficult, like specters and throwables, and not get too discouraged at the same time. After a while I even started to regret using specters because the boss fights started to feel doable, and winning them with NPCs help was just not that satisfying anymore. So I quickly finished the first run, started the game once again, this time deciding not to use any help, and loved the game even more. It felt like I had to learn the bosses from scratch in some cases - especially the scrapped watchman, because if you use a specter in this fight, you completely avoid learning his movements and the NPC practically kills him for you.
Now after I've completed several playthroughs, each time experimenting with new weapons and combat styles, I can honestly say that while the game may be too frustrating for some people, I would say whether you stick with it or not depends mostly on your attitude. If you buy LoP understanding that it is supposed to be that hard, that it has its own style and identity that you have to welcome, embrace and understand, then your chances of not quitting the game out of frustration will probably skyrocket. So, personally, I would recommend it even to inexperienced players only under one condition - you have to be patient.
Some remarks, I'm in the middle of my 5th playthrough. For me, this is on par with Sekiro for being fun and satisfying to play (never played bloodborne). No other game comes close. The deflect game is significantly more satisfying than the DS roll spamming. I'd say Lies is on par with FromSoft products; FromSoft just has a certain scope and grandeur in its settings that Lies can't match. You just don't get moments like seeing Anor Londo in the distance, walking over the Grand Archives rooftops, or seeing Liurnia or Leyndell spread out before you. That said, putting Lies of P up alongside Dark Souls 1 (might have become outdated mechanically, but it's a damn masterpiece regardless) is incredible praise in itself.
Long?! Lies of P? I found it super short, even though I never skip any fights. That said, I've not played any other soulslikes aside from the new LotF, so I guess I'm probably not qualified to judge.
I disagree with your assessment of Fox and Cat. They aren't friendly at all; Cat cons you off some souls early on, and in Malum District they're only using you to clear the path for them. I do forgive Cat... on NG. I prefer the ergo on subsequent NGs, and I'm of the sort that clears areas completely. Why would I skip fights, given that I'm playing the game for the fights?
That brings me to the Rabbits. The Black Rabbit Brotherhood, and particularly the full gank fight, is one of the best fights in the game. Laxasia first, Nameless second, I'd have to rank Romeo third, and the Rabbits are right up there. Both of their ganks are better than every single gank fight in Elden Ring, and I'd say they're even better than O&S. Each brother has a distinct and unique moveset, poise, and ways to engage, and that makes the fight as exhilarating as Laxasia's autistic second phase. Maybe you should have been deflecting them and learning their movesets and how to exploit them, instead of just fishing for backstabs. :P
Jokes aside though, I agree that ganks are a very delicate encounter type that's more likely to be done wrong than right, so your position is understandable. The arena in the second fight should have been slightly larger to allow you to better isolate the current brother. And yeah, the boss run for that one could be a little shorter, but we're saying that just because we've been spoilt by most of this game and Elden Ring. Remember the average DS boss run, like Taurus Demon or Abyss Watchers, to see how good we have it nowadays.
Finally, I'd honestly recommend this to everyone. It's easier to beat than Sekiro, and the challenge it provides is actually going to force you to learn to be good at it. Consumables are also plentiful for the cases where one finds cheesing necessary (I confess I did it on my first run a few times), and the spectres trivialise bosses completely if you use them.
This glowing review-you can almost think I'm a shill, I know-comes from a guy who got filtered by Parade Master when he played the demo. I then played the new LotF and it got me itching for a better game, and I'm not disappointed I gave myself the time to get used to Lies at the end. Note that I only played Sekiro after beating Lies on NG+2, and the funny thing is, after coming back from Sekiro, Nameless-who used to give me trouble-has suddenly become extremely easy. Lies's "deflect red attacks" game is trivial in comparison to the complexity and breadth of Sekiro.
Great video! I love your content
A+
For someone that likes to call out people that don’t understand/pay attention to the game, you get a lot of the names wrong. Also, the story has a bunch of parallels to Bloodborne? So yeah stones and glass houses and all that.
You’re cooked
@@Plz8662 how fried does your brain have to be to think this is a decent comment. Talk about stupid
Lies of P is an incredible achievement, and one of the non-FS games I would put up there with Miyazaki's work - the others being both Nioh 1 and 2. Speaking of Nioh, it's interesting that Team Ninja decided to collab with a developer that had never put out much of anything, came out of nowhere, and had zero experience with the genre. It's also quite astonishing that a development team with zero experience would put out such a polished, balanced game on their first try . It's not easy - see LotF. I have a feeling NeoWiz could be Team Ninja's sock puppet.
"It's not easy" nah, the lame souls formula is hella simple and shallow, anyone can do the same or even better (cue, Nioh), that's why there are so many souls-likes these days, it's a way easier formula than, say, making something like Monster Hunter, Dragon's Dogma, DMC, Bayonetta, Sifu, Nioh..
@@wallacesousuke1433 if it’s an easy formula, then why has nobody not named Lies of P ever come relatively close to the quality of a FromSoft title? Can you think of any? I can’t.
@@slintisbased huh? Nioh (not reaaaaally a souls like but whatever) has way better combat, Code Vein sold 3mi copies and its combat is on pair, potentially better than any souls game (would've been way better if it went the way of Nioh and were faster paced, combo-based), Lord of the Fallen "2" is easily on pair with Elden Ring in scope terms and destroys anything made by From graphically, Demon's remake humiliates the entire From's library, Mortal Shell looks on the same level or better than any pre-Bloodborne titles (also dont act like DS2 is any good lol and the second half of DS1 is disgusting, From even had to apologize... And OG Demons isn't really great and didnt age well)
Only thing From excels at is lore and lore design, its combat is a laughable boring joke, literally poor man's Monster Hunter with 3D Metroidvania level design/progression, invisible walls and tons of ideas stolen from Berserk.
You only put From on a high pedestal cuz you're a blind dummmmb fangirl, for any outsider with no bias, they are barely better than their clones and again, is basic formula is laughably simple and any nobody can put together a similar combat and sell a million copies cuz From stans have no standards and are easy cash cows.
Also, Elden Ring is large as the ocean but deep as a pond, couldn't even force myself to beat it a second time, so boring and padded, so many recycled dungeons, ruins and bosses 😪😑 deffo not GOTY material (not that this means anything these days even Overwatch won it lol)
@@wallacesousuke1433didn’t even read half of the nonsense you wrote. Just saw “Lord of the Fallen is better than anything From has put out” and automatically knew I’m dealing with the mentally challenged. That opinion alone should disqualify you from speaking about video games, or anything at all for that matter, ever again.
@@slintisbased 🤣🤣🤣🤣pathetic clown, you seriously stopped before the part I wrote "graphically" and am acting like I have mental issues when you clearly are the one here who appear to have a few extra chromosomes?
Anyway, From games are overrated clunky, repetitive trash, nothing but poor man's Monster Hunter combat on an Medieval Europe setting with tons of ideas ripped off of Berserk and 3D Metroidvania level design. Easiest formula to copy cuz it's so low-effort and simply an inferior twist on the original, better games From stole ideas from
Wholeheartedly disagree on your assessment of Simon Manus. None of the points you brought up are valid. His hitboxes are just as tight as any other boss, and his moves are really well telegraphed. The only attack I think is bullshit in phase 1 is the in air jump attack, and in phase 2, the amount of VFX can hide the boss, but that's it.
I also disagree with your assessment that you're meant to play Lies of P like Sekiro and opt to deflect everything. The parry timings in Lies of P are much smaller than Sekiro. Enemies don't have long combos like Sekiro, and most importantly, Lies of P has much stronger action commitment, almost ripped from Dark Souls 1, soon as you start an attack you're locked into that animation, unlike Sekiro where you can animatiom cancel an attack into parry if you change your mind during the anticipation section of the animation. So no, in Lies of P, you're meant to use all the tools it gives you, block, dodge, and deflect, not just the latter.
i loved lies of p, definitely in my top 3 games in this genre, that said...
DUDE WHAT'S YOUR PROBLEM WITH TRICK WEAPONS😢 they are so cool. it's my favorite aspect of Bloodborne
They're absolutely cool, but they just don't do all that much as a system. Most of them have useless transforms and only function in one state or the other. The transform combo of the saw spear and saw cleaver are pretty much the only instance of a weapon functioning better because of the system.
I talked about it in more detail in my bloodborne video, but I think bloodborne would work better if, like sekiro, the saw cleaver was the only weapon, but you could upgrade it's transformed form into different weapons with different utilities.
@@jesterofjuice5132 I have over 500 hours on BB and i've done a playthroughs with pretty much every weapon (minus like 3 of them) and what you just said is simply wrong. Most of the time the transforming attack is one of the strongest attack of that weapon and for many weapons that can and SHOULD be used mid combo.
To be more precise: hunter axe, tonitrus, chikage, burial blade, Amygdala arm, Saif, Boom Hammer , Church Pick , Rakuyo + the 2 you mentioned.
It's rare for a weapon to have an objectively better form and that usually happen when there is a buff or damage type change involve.
Sometimes the form charge come with additional buffs like in the case of the Threaded Cane where in the whip for it get the "serrated" attribute which is a 20% additional damage against beasts.
It's a complex system that reward player from mastering that weapon.
And while i can see a game when you only have 1 weapon that trasform in diffrerent forms but that isn't a demerit of Bloodborne. If anything, bloodborne should be praised for pioneering that system.
@@gianlucaangeli Beast Cutter + Its transformation attacks are slept on I feel as well.
@@gianlucaangeliit’s in no way a complex system lol, you get one extra attack that does more damage and stagger that’s really about it.
The AoW system in ER offers a lot more with the ability to jump over and low profile attacks, same with prosthetics and weapon arts in Sekiro.
The trick weapon system is ultimately simplistic.
I Was looking forward to this video after you told us about it in the dark souls video, do you have a plan to do a video on elden ring ? Or the upcoming dlc for it. Also im hoping the comment section stays civilized considering the title xd
Yes! I was thinking my next project might be a largescale multi video analysis of elden ring leading up to the DLC. I'm so hyped about Shadow of the erdtree!
This is my favorite souls game. I like this far more than darksouls and yes Elden Ring,but that's just me.
Nah that’s extremely valid, the dark souls games had really bad gameplay and were carried by level and art design.
The reason the fight with the nameless puppet was optional is because the studio understands fans of Souls-borne ip's! They knew that fans would play it to experience that fight if they didn't on their 1st playthrough.
The dodge isn't bad and the game isn't made to be played with only perfect guard.
Some boss attacks are easier dodged while others are easy to deflect. Not that you can't complete the game with just doing either or.
I played this at launch by only dodging and after six new game plus’s I rarely ever agreed with many of the negatives put against it. I never found the dodge system that bad and it’s especially great after upgrading it.
This is easily my favorite game. The only game where i hit max level and am on ng 10.
I’ve actually never finished Sekiro, put a few hours into it but got frustrated with the combat and fell off. For some reason I kept pushing through P though, and I’m glad I did cuz it’s the best new game I’ve played since Elden ring, definitely. Went back and replayed a couple souls games after beating P a few times and they all seem so easy in comparison, except late game Elden ring. Maybe I’ll actually give sekiro another shot now.
you may have heard it said, that sekiro is actually a rhythm game. when i approached it that way, everything fell into place and the fights were so exciting. not everyones cup of tea though.
I only played Sekiro after Lies of P, and I'm very happy that I did play it. It's the only souls game that gets close to lies of P in terms of being fun to play (deflect >>> roll spam, as much as I love DS1 and DS3 and ER to bits). Now I'm playing lies again and Nameless, which was giving me trouble in phase 2, is so hilariously easy now. I'd sugggest trying Sekiro again, it really does take a while to "click" with you, even if you've beaten Lies of P three times like I had, but once it clicks, you'll have the most fun you've had in souls games. At least I did.
I was terrible at sekiro for like two whole playthroughs and didn't like it much at first. Now its my second favorite souls game behind elden ring. You should definitely give it another shot
On sekiro mate, just spam l1 when you're getting attacked and eventually the parrying will click. After that just literally parry when you're getting attacked, then spam r1 when you're not getting attacked. Once that clicks mate, Sekiro becomes quite trivial.
@@Astrophobia88sekiro is better than souls combat.
yess sir yes sir
the kings flame WHAT? lol
I didn’t use consumables but I loved using the dodge I went in knowing that it would be harder if I used only dodge and I just decided eh why not though I did use the parry system throughout the early game
I got through the game just fine with quicksteps and didn't find this harder than your typical souls game. You can very much play like Bloodborne, the game has both systems fairly fleshed out, so people calling it a Bloodborne-like is a fair comparison.
lies of p is my favourite game of all the soulslike games, and that includes fromsoft games btw
Amazing review and agree with all the points, the only thing I gotta go against is you can beat the game with dodging instead of reflection. 😅 It's just hell lot more difficult but not impossible, on my second rerun I started to play the game similar to Seiko and it's easier however I'm aggressive as hell when it comes to souls like 😅 so it's not my play style. I love the fact the game gives you multiple ways to help not take damage and pretty snappy with either (especially with the p origin system)
The fact that we’re getting dlc of this & how those after credits left me sooo fucking curious man! Amazing analysis as always. I do disagree about Manus being a bad fight in its entirety, but it being the potential final boss is a downside considering how amazing the Nameless Puppet is.
Lies of p was great I loved it but, for 90% of the game I definitely only dodged and only guarded when I got cornered. I love sekiro its my favorite fromsift game.... Hated pg in this game. Im sure its a skill issue but the short window combined with the timing made me miserable. The only two playstyles I had fun with in this game weredodge while using heavies to stagger and one I call "bloodborne now with shields" where I put everything into defense and guard regain. I essentially out trade the bosses. By constantly gaining my health back. My point is I think you're wrong in saying its even a sekiro-like. Its souls in Italian. Where it enables variety of playstyles you just have to engage with the games mechanics to find them. Unlike sekiro which is by design restrictive.
I guess in my head the sekiro and P deflections feel mostly the same with some tweaking in timings. When I said that "you wont enjoy this game if you don't like sekiro style deflection games," I never thought that there would be people who like one deflection mechanic and dislike the other. That's an interesting perspective
This game surprised me so much. Its absolutely amazing. I thought it was miles better than TotK which was kind of a letdown last year.
First off, this video was well written and had a ton of funny jokes and references. Especially because im playing thru RE4 rn, so those RE4 jokes were hilarious. So much so that I can forgive you for pronouncing Krat as Krate 😂
I beat P 2 days ago so its all very recent to me, but the bosses I had an absolute nightmare time with was Walker Of Illusions and Door Guardian, Walker was the first boss I was forced to try throwables on, and realized how OP they are. The second boss I was forced to use throwables on was "Electric malenia" as you put it😂
Interesting how you hated the stalker fights, i personally thought them to be some of the best enemies in P. I was also super disappointed with Manus, felt like he was just a big dummy elden beast like boss with easily telegraphed moves.
4:55 you can dodge your way through if your not a coward
Have to clarify I love this game I hate parrying in souls/ souls adjacent games
I disagree but I respect the take
The Trashman disagrees
Elden ring is better, but lies of p is definitely a close second or even better if you don’t like open worlds.
This whole game is a certified hood classic. Mechanically perfect in every way.
52:59
yeah, yeah, yeah. X]
I agree with everything you said in this video. The bosses and combat mechanics are amazing (ignoring the stalker fights) and makes Bloodborne look like a joke. However, there is one reason I regard this game as inferior to Fromsoft and it's a point I'm surprised you didnt visit: the level design is extremely lackluster in my opinion. It's completely linear and mundane. The levels feel like funnels towards the bosses, and you very rarely feel lost and like you're exploring the area. The laziness in level design becomes very apparent towards the end where it's just a straightforward path to Manus littered with an army that everybody will just run past. Exploration and never knowing where you'll find the next bonfire is one of my favourite aspects of Souls games, and one that LoP sadly didn't address.
I mean it's not my favorite soulslike, but it does make the top 3: ds3, sekiro, lop, er, ds (haven't played the other titles yet and ds3 being top is mostly due to it being my first soulsgame and the bosses)
I can't beat Lies of P, or even get that far in due to my inability to properly time things
I've tried again and again and sunk a fair amount of time into trying to learn parries/deflects and such, it's just not something that I can do
Still love this game though and even I, as the shitter that I am, can realize this is a damn good game
Finally someone who has the balls to say that this game is straight up better than all the souls games and not just soulslikes
Not elden ring or Sekiro
@@lyk6i it’s better than Elden Ring but nothing really compares to Sekiro
its not better than the souls game
Agree
Game looks lame
I’m glad you enjoyed it. For me, the dodge does not give enough distance or i-frames, the enemy windups are way too vague for a parry centric combat scheme, and the parry timing is just too narrow a timeframe. bloodborne and Sekiro make you feel like a genius once you learn the systems. This never does that because the systems suck. Also, this is not a brave opinion. It’s the crowd opinion, which you’re welcome to. I just disagree. But still, I love your content. Take my like.
Yeah dawg I figured it was known that Lies is based on 19th century France which looks NOTHING like Bloodborne that’s more Gothic Victorian England
for a seemingly pretty high IQ dude your pronunciation of words is absurd lmao good shit tho I like ur content
I get tongue tied super easy and don't care enough to get perfect takes when recording lol
Hello, why did you private your new Elden Ring video? I was in the middle of watching it :(
Sorry, I was embarrassed about the audio quality. I'm trying to fix it now
Tonitrus dude. Tontritus sounds like an illness
After getting used to Sekiro's parry system this game was so annoying in the beginning. Took me some time to realize that you actually need to hold the parry
Yeah, you do not have to take It as a Sekiro parry. Because you have to Remember that in Sekiro deflections are mandatory, here are optional (you can still Just Dodge).
Having to hold down the button makes sure you cannot Just spam block and deflect everything.
@@DRKLRD-kv4cm Well it doesn't help that this game is obviously parry focused and how bad the dodging mechanic is.
I wouldn't say parrying is mandatory in Sekiro, you can dodge your way out of most things although it's just not optimal at all.
Not really LoP's parry works just fine with a single tap you just need to stay in one place because it cancels out the animation if you move even just a little
@@chancetherappersburner6338 yes, but my point is that for a lot of attacks, if you can't manage to deflect them, you can just dodge them. I always beat victor the champion with only dodges, never did a single deflection
Theatre kids 😂 I’m screaming
The "restrictive difficulty" was the best part about Lies of P. Too bad the devs succumbed to the cries of the streamers and so called "souls veterans" and nerfed it to the ground.
nobody cares about nerds that makes 200 tries to beat one boss calling it a skill
@@korsakovpodcastI like how scrubs assume people who are good at games don’t have a life lmao, not a single boss in LoP took me more than 15 tries on launch.
@@MakioGoHardio 15 tries means your record vs every boss is 1 win against 14 losses. Even if we believe every word people say about their win or lose records.
@@korsakovpodcast it doesn’t matter whether you believe it or not, what matters is that I spent less time and had more fun than you, the hardest boss for me was Laxasia who took me 15 tries and the other bosses didn’t take me nearly as long, this game was pretty easy all it tested was memorization not actual execution.
@@MakioGoHardio than me? i never said anything about my tries, i've beat the game miltiple times, now in NG+++, platinum etc. But you are right about memorization!
Its a fun game but it has almost no build variety, linear level design and standard lore. It was fun but I wont do another playthrough, I did a quality build so I got to use almost every weapon and was still overpowered. Saying this game is better than the classic Fromsoft games is a bold statement.
It's better than most of them to be fair.
Gonna come back to this after i play it. I have a fallout fix at the moment lol
"dodge is supposed to bad" it's a strange opinion. If the devs of this game agreed with this, the real question would be: so why there is a roll in the first place?
sekiro it's confident in it's design that revolves around a single main weapon, and that's it. BB has a joke item after a few hours of playtime wirh a passive agressive statement on shields (same thing handled with less finesse). So why P devs would make roll as a noobtrap on purpose?
U should try salt and sanctuary
For me personally, LoP is the first "souls" game I've actually completed. Not only that but I went back and did 2 more playthroughs too (NG+), I might even keep going just to try more weapons out. I previously played DS1, DS3 and Sekiro (which you don't even count as a souls game) but never completed any of them. Sekiro held me the longest but something about these games just didn't click. The only FromSoftware game I've actually finished is Armored Core 6 (Excellent game, hardly a soulslike though).
Also you said you turned off voices just for the nameless puppet, but damn man, did you even listen to the ways the characters said things before that? I'm out here laughing at stuff like the city of "Crate", "Aldoro" with the missing vowel and "Fuecoco" which is a starter pokemon for generation 9. Then we've got Rosa "Isabella" street, the glorious "Lonzini" arcade and finally "Ve-nig-ni" who has abandoned being French (with their weird spelling convention) and instead gained the n-word pass. 🤣
The level design does fall off at the end imo.
I like Lords of the Fallen....There I said it! lol
To each their own brudda
@@jesterofjuice5132 I was mostly just joking...It wasn't the worst game ever but it certainly wasn't on par with Lies of P...
28:43
bwahahaha
Nah sorry Lies of P didnt do it for me. World design and the lore is neat but the combat is genuinely the MOST stiff combat in a souls like, objectively fucked
wdym by stiff?
@@BrovarSpirytushe means he’s bad at the game
II think lies of p bosses are on par with ds3 and sekiro but I think it kind of falls behind for me when It comes to level/ world design.
I also feel that the quantity of bosses is significantly lower than any of the fromsoft games.
You can't surpass souls. They will always be the kings of the genre they defined.
No....its definitely not. Its like a poor mans dark souls
This game has nothing from bloodborne? Pro do you even rally? rally mechanic? Trick weapon system? Land a heavy attack to stun the enemy? (Yes they are different, they are inspired by bloodborne)
And many attack in this game is easier to dodge than to parry. Parry is very well designed, it is a high risk high reward but dodging is also very effective.
Thats i think probably sarcastic statement bcuz he is annoyed of so many people called it Bloodborne clone while the core mechanic is borrowed from Sekiro, its about breaking posture & parrying with your main weapon. Even tho the dodge is available, & you can upgrade the dodge, the main focus in this game is not the dodge. I'd say the dodge only there for people who don't like parry.
Its a OK game, i dont really get the hype for it, its my no4 soulslike from 2023. 1. Wolong, the combat is just fun, 2. Blasphenous 2 and 3rd jedi survivor, bugy but cool. But lies of p i really didnt get it
Bloodborn set in victorian London for sure not Italy (its yarnam but like its mimimicking london 100%)
I love this game so much.
But brotha man. Backwards ass logic. "If you didn't play the game the way I think you should, you didn't really play the game."
"People will pointlessly say I LITERALLY JUST SAID THAT. but what I mean is. Not that."
...this isn't analysis.
lol no
Lies of P was extremely mid, especially: level design, enemy design, most NPCs and NPC quests, dialogues / voice acting, story, and lore.
I also cannot condone the art direction / graphics which is just out of the box what Unreal engine has to offer.
The last level of the game was probably a highlight, the final boss was beyond cliché and stupid, the epilogue with Daddy G and Nameless Puppett was cool, and the MCU-like post-credit scene teasing a Wizard of Oz follow up was so out of place and cringe that it made me laugh and immediately close the game for good, never to be revisited. So it all ended like the rest of the game: as a rollercoaster of great to abysmal that unfortunately just left a sour taste after each playing sessions.
The only good tier list is mine.
ER
LOP
Sekiro
DS3
BB
DeS
DS1
DS2
Dont read German Pinnochio XD
Dodge is clunky with not enough frames, parrying system in not even worth it (high risk low reward and only used for bosses actually). Defence is the worst part of the game.
It was good but not the best imo
Surpassed all soul games? Yeah….no. Surpassed atleast one? Probably.
I specifically meant the 3 games in the Dark souls series, and I stand by that claim. And I say that while being a huge fan of ds3. However, I believe that ds3 is pretty basic and slightly outdated compared to the modern games, even though it was incredibly well designed for its time.
@@jesterofjuice5132 i will agree to disagree. ive played all soul games and most soullikes. i thoroughly enjoyed lies of p and beat it. but it just doesn't compare to Elden ring or ds3 for me. it does beat ds1 and 2 for me as far as game design/mechanics go. I feel ds3 just had more to offer lore, enemy design, and build variety wise. Also I enjoy the souls pvp, so the invasion mechanic I'm a fan of. I do believe lies of p is phenomenal and i will gladly get dlc or a sequel, but im not going to replay it like i easily desire to with the souls series.
Definitely not better than souls games your insane 😂😂
Woah woah woah woah woah now, come on... "surpassed"? Be careful with that wording.
Why should I be careful lol the worst I can be is wrong, but I stand by what I said. Surpassed isn't even a negative thing when considering the game was building off of the souls games and Sekiro as a base. It took the formula, and added new mechanics with tight gameplay and placed in an interesting world.
To me, the assumption is that it would surpass souls by nature of having those games as an example.
The far more insulting situation is for a game like Lords of the fallen to copy souls almost exactly without adding anything interesting or well designed, and while falling on its face in terms of overall quality