I learned a lot in this video because of your discussion of speaker impedance. I would love it if you could do a whole video explaining why some speakers have higher or lower impedance, and how it relates to other speaker qualities, such as efficiency. The whole topic is a bit of a mystery to me.
Obviously, speakers are manufactured at a specific impedence by choice, typically 16 or 8 ohms, though I've seen a lot of 4 ohm speakers in cars. In terms of power (watts), at the most simplistic level, power = volts × amps and you could look at ohms law to undestand how impedance (or resistence) affects amps at a particular voltage. That's kind of a DC take on it. It's a lot more complex in speakers and AC as frequency affects everything. Hopefully Danny will speak to this.
I found this interesting as well. Most people (myself included) have thought of Klipsch as efficient speakers that should be easy to drive. Apparently not true in every case.
My Denon receiver has an option to switch between 4 and 8 ohms. Also you can use eco mode with 8 ohms which does exactly the same, lower the voltage and thus current and power output. The audio quality suffers though, it aounds like an 8 bit dac on the old Commodore Amiga computers lol! My diy speakers crossovers, I've incorporated a lot of your advice in them, componemt choice, phase alignmemt, impedance etc. And it sounds great! Much better than the generic crossovers I was using temporarily obviously. Still using sandcast resistors but when I finally finish tweaking I'll get some high quality multi layer metal oxide resistors. Air core inductors and polycaps are already in place. Removed the steel parts from the binding posts and replaced with brass. I did notice that some mkt caps have steel in them, and some resistor leads are also magnetic. It's hard to avoid if even reputable brands carry such components.
You should NEVER set any receiver to anything but the highest ohm setting (usually 8 ohm), if it is adjustable, even if using 4 ohm speakers... the setting doesn't do what you think. I forget the details, but Audioholics made this very clear.
The players in my electric football set almost always went in circles, no matter how much I played with the plastic spikes underneath. Looked more like a square dance than a football game 😅
I had one of those electric football sets. Remember the foot ball was a piece of felt, and there was a kicker player too. I never got much out of playing with it, more fun with erector sets, or taking apart my transistor AM radios and messing with the adjustments LOL good times.
A btw comment. Hearing you "ting" that Klipsch chasis with a nail flick bought back memories. When I first opened 1 of a pair of Tannoy Lancaster speakers i'd bought s/h in the early-1990s & loved their all-round sound & above all previous, (I had e/stats & ribbon hybrids & other boxes before & after but i still remember the most magical musical moments (f.w.o.a.b.description.) coming from those Tannoys. But i was amazed at the engineering quality of those single 2'way 15"inch dual concentric structures, (tho the cabs were the cheapest lightweight boxes in their 15" D.C. range in dire need of bracing i gave them) They were built in 1969 according to the faded signed & dated test-pass labels stuck on their rears & worked fine until 2005'ish (a good 35'yr run from new!) when one developed a bass-rumble, i took the driver apart & the short story was: i slightly filed down all around the outer facing coil area progressively until it didnt rub anymore in the magnet gap, then it worked fine for another 15'ish years at all except very loud vollumes, with clean bass but then started to rumble again at any vol' so i've had to give up on them as i can't file the coil down further nor get the cone to move in a linear fashion by any other trickery so they're stashed away with 1 working driver, I shall miss them very much, nobody i contacted can put an original cone or a new chasis edge termination on the pair (for matching) as it's not the l8r foam type edging but something to take far longer explaining. But boy oh boy ...the quality of engineering in 1969, & the 'ting' of that klipsch chasis!
Right now the best speaker out is the Dutch & Dutch self powered. But yea. 14k . Passive…I’m still thinking DANNYS stuff especially with small or mid sized rooms.
Its really crazy how many HT systems are rated at 4ohms! The vast majority of AVRs are minimum 6ohm, why the 4 ohm revolution?? I've read that it's not as common as it used to be when u drive your amps way under rated ohmage, many AVRs now will either shut down in some sort of protection, or you will get horrible distortion. Which isn't so bad considering it used to be that u would literally cook your amps back in the day!. Still, that is some sort of industry planned obsolescence, I think. Great job as usual Danny!
@@1mctous Im not so sure if that is a full given but even so if it does give a bump in efficiency is not worth damaging your electronics. Sure, if true your volume might be louder, but your amps risk damage, protection, or distortion. That's like giving every car nitrous systems. You will be faster but you fuck up your engine in a month.
The Monoprice Monolith 365c (and the entire Monolith series) uses HDF (and not MDF)..., and so although not the thickest cabinets, the HDF material is quite bit harder/stiffer then MDF. Also (see Danny's other Monolith vids) the woofer baskets are a bit better than the Klipsch and don't ring as much (as Danny showed in this video when tapping on the Klipsch woofer basket). Lastly, although Danny is correct, Monoprice has designed and knows folks will most likely be crossing over the Monolith series of speakers at 80hz, thereby alleviating some of the power-handling concerns that Danny brought up should you drive any of the Monolith series of speakers Full-range. Even the 460T/465T towers should be crossed cover at 80 or worse case 60hz (IMO). Speaker upgrade kit here I come! 😍
I think you mean the Monolith THX series, right? This one is definitely HDF, but the Monpprice Monolith Audition and Encore series are all MDF I believe
It’s hot & humid in SE Louisiana not Texas Hot but just a little bit less but the high humidity is just kicks the uncomfortable level up a notch. Stay cool Texas Friends!
Texas is a very large state with various different geographies and climate zones, so the term "Texas Hot" is a misnomer. Texas geographies vary from coastal regions along the Gulf of Mexico, to dense forest areas in the eastern part of the state (next to Louisiana), to the Texas Hill Country in the middle of the state, to the desert areas of West Texas. Texas even has numerous mountain peaks between 7000 to 8700 feet in elevation. If you are looking for really hot try Phoenix (expected to hit 113 F today, which is pretty normal for this time of year) or even Las Vegas (expected to hit 111 F today) not to mention Death Valley in CA where it will hit 121 F today.
@@Mark-rw3kw A few days ago the hottest spot in the country was a little town just West of us by about 38 miles. In Vernon, Texas they hit 113 a few days ago.
@@Mark-rw3kw yep very true but also there has been a weather effect recently of a large ridge of high pressure creating a heating effect over a large area of these different parts of Texas driving normal temperatures to abnormal levels. NOAA weather reports are beginning to suggest à weakening of this ridge which should lessen the abnormally high temperatures over the various parts of Texas. Yep the Desert Southwest will always have their characteristic heating but the phenomena of abnormally higher temperatures over large portions of Texas has created dangerous heat levels for many citizens of the Great State of Texas. Stay cool my Friends. 👍🏻
@@dannyrichie9743 I don't know about a few days ago (I don't have access to prior day temps), but the high temp today in Death Valley CA is expected to be 121 F. They don't call it Death Valley for nothing. In Phoenix, it is not at all unusual to reach 115 F in the summertime.
@@Mark-rw3kw Maybe they just happened to be cooler on that day, and not in Vernon. I can remember when my home town of Wichita Falls was the hottest place in the country a few times. www.extremeweatherwatch.com/cities/wichita-falls/highest-temperatures
I appreciate the level of detail you give in your analysis of speakers and why and how certain components make a difference. It seems you often talk about iron core inductors in a negative way. Would you always put an air core inductor on over an iron core even on the woofer?
The core will tend to cause some smearing effect. You can get away with them in ranges below 200Hz. However, when you get up into the midrange the effect can become unacceptable.
Hello Danny. Just a suggestion regarding impedance, I think that it would be very useful to your audience if you would show and discuss and explain the EPDR response curve with respect to frequency, and the local minimums in that curve, to better account for the combination of both impedance magnitude and phase. Vituixcad and REW are both capable of adding the EPDR curve as a third curve in the impedance response chart, along with curves for magnitude and phase.
Which is why my system uses separate amps for each channel. Yes, I have 4 amps for a 5.1 system that is mostly used as a 2.1 system. My rear and center channels are only used while watching movies.
Please consider doing an explanation of what you're referring to in your waterfall graphs. There are probably some newbies that would like to follow along with your videos but lack those basics. Still hoping you'll do an " off grid" system video
Damn youve confirmed to me that klipsch are terrible speakers, i thought they were but wow this confirms it 100% i recently listened to a pair of the front speakers that go with this center, damn they sounded like tin cans, very bright and grainy sounding.
I'm so glad that I live in the UK, thus making it a lot more difficult for me to source such crappy speakers - besides which, we have plenty of our own companies making equally atrocious - sounding gear!
Id like to point out the fact that when drivers play out of phase it does more than just make the range quiet. It actually creates an extremely uncomfortable, fatiguing effect where it feels like theres is this immense pressure on your ears whenever your listening to music with lots of information in that crossover range. Same thing happens when a subwoofer plays perfectly out of phase with your speaker. If you play a sine wave exactly at the frequency thats out of phase, you hear almost no sound but your ear drums feel like they’re going to explode. Very very fatiguing and almost painful even. I had the same experience when listening to certain songs on my klipsch rp-600ms which is why I ultimately returned them.
Thanks for your informative reviews. I noticed in many of your speaker crossover evaluations, you often find metal that a magnet will attract. I am curious as to why this is undesirable? Additionally, I bought some banana plugs ends for my speaker wire. But I noticed my magnet is attracted to them. I also noticed they negatively affected the sound quality. Why is that happening? Thank you
Yes! Electric Football, ... one of the best Christmas gifts ever. It was all in the orientation of the plastic hairs on the bottom of the players. Obnoxious sounding, ridiculously unplayable, yet still a cool, iconic game. It accompanied a handful of iconic games sharing the same form factor, ... tabletop hockey, Air Hockey, etc. We had most all of them! I remember ABC Monday Night Football, an x/y axis game, lighting up the result of the play. Very cool "computerized" result! Both offensive and defensive side select the play by their slider ... when both are ready, presss the button and the battery lights the bulb illuminating the text screen from below! My Dad dug all that stuff, thus we had 'em all. Even had the OG gaming rig, the Magnavox Odyssey. Sat at a table and played games all through the 60's and 70's. I recognize today I was exceedingly fortunate.
I get why loudspeaker terminals should not be made from magnetic steel. But what about power cables and their connects or the sockets? Does that affect anything?
Good question. Loudspeaker terminal; If any magnetic interactions impact the signal feeding the loudspeaker they will be reproduced by the loudspeaker, ... or to the best ability of the loudspeaker. The line side; Whereas such impacts on the power, on the line side of the system, ... essentially all that's filtered out in each component's power supplies. Hope that helps.
@@FOH3663 Diodes, transistors, resistors and capacitor leads are not made of oxygen free, grain oriented, audiophile grade, mono crystal, cryogenically seasoned copper, but from copper clad, tin plated steel. These elements combine to produce the signal reaching gold plated, machine grade brass terminals at the back of equipment.
it's funny that manufacturers that spent years developing these products don't know what they're doing and Danny knows better. Of course "upgraders" have to make money somehow, what better way to make the products look bad to achieve that. Only specs and graphs alone don't make the perfect speaker, if i like the sound of my speakers that's what really matters, and that is a personal preference which is not measured in Ohms, Khz, or frequency charts.
Danny, though it would be costly, speaker manufacturers should run their designs by you before they offer their products to the general public who is becoming more educated about audio. You are an encyclopedia of loudspeaker design
Great video Danny , I just now started using center and surrounding channels , I went with 5 inch mark audio full range , and a 6 inch to compare. The result wad so shocking to a bunch of buddies that a center channel and surrounds was a small fraction of the cost of my home built , now they are coming at me to build them center and surround speakers . Why does the industry not take this approach?
Def some real Class D weather down there in Tejas! I feel for any Pass Labs customers down there thats for sure, lol. Monoprice holds no shame the designs are derivative of other brands.
I have a pair of old Klipsch bookshelves. In addition to your kit, would adding a wedge brace inside add any benefit to the sound in addition to the No Rez?
Got rid of my Klipsch center channel. So disappointed in the quality. And I have a lot of Klipsch. They owe it to us to up their game on these. Looks pretty, but falls short on sound. Come on Klipsch. Do or do not, there is no try.
Hi Danny! Are you ever going to design/ sell DIY Kits for an inwall application for home theater? This is an underserved market. Wishlist would be, high output capabilities and dynamics( around 105 db at 1m with low distortion) but would fit in a 4 - 6 inch depth stud bay.
I've thought about it, but there is no way of offering one and being able to guarantee the results. There are too many variables from how to mount them, how to stabilize them, how to deal with flimsy sheetrock, different amounts of surface area, varying stud centers, etc.
Another thing Danny , besided not getting a increase in power handling as well a increase of decibles in efficiency, what about running 2 4 ohm in series for a 8 ohm total impedance.
Hey Danny :-) I have maybe a dumb question. But maybe is it possible to wire the woofers in series instead of parallel and make it 8 ohms? And then of course make new crossover to it? Is it doable?
I'm not Richie, but my guess is that it could be doable. But the bass spl would be cut by at least a full 3 db over the entire driver's range - a tad too much. Aside from that, I must have missed the part where he mentions they're wired parallel. Are they? At 3.6 ohms, I forgive anyone who assumes so.
@@dannyrichie9743 Okay, but then it can be driven harder, becouse you will not have restrictions in resistor heat dissipation? Maybe for bass, but not for mid and tweet?
Those are both good questions. AFAIK, the answers should both be yes, in theory. And they say that, in theory, what works in theory should work in practice. But in practice, sometimes it doesn't.
Love your videos. Question: what gear are you using to capture the freq responses? For some reason I'm thinking you're using an Earthworks mic, but I cannot imagine what mic preamp you're using. Also, how do you verify the accuracy of your recording gear? Thanks.
I’ve always had an intense passion for speakers. Am I crazy to be thinking about buying a desktop cnc machine and building my own speakers? Unfortunately I live in a condo at the moment :( but I think a lot of the newer cncs aren’t very loud or messy
The total weight of the driver is irrelevant; if anything more mass means less resonance. A large magnet structure is generally a good thing: more magnet strength, more sensitivity; more magnet depth, a longer and more linear gap for larger x-max. What you think you're saying or mean to be talking about is the moving mass of the driver, which you did NOT feel when you picked up the whole thing. When it comes to sensitivity and upper frequency extension, and your impulse response / waterfall graphs, what can matter there is MOVING MASS, i.e. the weight of the cone, the voice coil, and to a lesser extent other moving parts (spider/surround), not the weight of the whole package. I know you're a smart guy and I respect what you do but man, this one is just obvious.
Yep, I know all of that. Did I make a blooper in there somewhere? It is easier to do than you think when the camera is rolling and you are trying to keep on going without pause.
Just a thought: Why GR not making your brand speakers??? I watched yesterday B&Wilkins Nautilus series factory production, there’s a two year wait to get and sell it for $70.000 for a pair LOL. I know for that price everything is about labor hours then a speaker itself but what about YOU ????? Yes, demographic catastrophe in United States isn't perfect time for business like this but.... You never know. How long we need to trust our ears to China made Klipsh or other speakers????
🤔Never understood the lure of polishing turds. If all the parts were good, the designs would probably be pretty good too, and you wouldn’t even need to think about any mods. If the drivers and crossovers are cheap, the whole box design probably isn’t much different in terms of quality. At that point, either get a better speaker, or design and build your own! 😉
@@dannyrichie9743 Ah yes, I do understand that sometimes that is indeed the case, but I wonder what percentage of the time that isn’t the case🤔 People are going to expect you to work magic for them in either case.😉
Mr. Danny I dare you to make a product from scratch, and I mean literally from scratch, that will compete with Klipsch. And I mean compete with Klipsch as in price, finish and sound quality. Just for the record, just about anyone can do what you're doing. I don't by any means consider you a genius, and if you are, please let us know what patents you are currently holding. Just about anyone can improve on someone else's finished product. So be careful about how you present these videos that you are making. You are coming across as a not so cool individual. Amir already tore apart some of your finished products and I can remember how badly you responded to that. I dare you to put together a couple models of speakers in a completely finished package that will compete against the likes of Klipsch in price, finish and sound quality. And after you do, please feel free to criticize all these manufacturers in the manner that you do!
First of all, Amir has no idea what he is doing. Secondly, I have designed a LOT of products from beginning to end that they have won pretty much every industry award from every magazine. That even includes a pair of speakers that launched at $199 a pair and won a LOT of awards including a few product of the year awards.
I learned a lot in this video because of your discussion of speaker impedance. I would love it if you could do a whole video explaining why some speakers have higher or lower impedance, and how it relates to other speaker qualities, such as efficiency. The whole topic is a bit of a mystery to me.
Obviously, speakers are manufactured at a specific impedence by choice, typically 16 or 8 ohms, though I've seen a lot of 4 ohm speakers in cars. In terms of power (watts), at the most simplistic level, power = volts × amps and you could look at ohms law to undestand how impedance (or resistence) affects amps at a particular voltage. That's kind of a DC take on it. It's a lot more complex in speakers and AC as frequency affects everything. Hopefully Danny will speak to this.
I found this interesting as well. Most people (myself included) have thought of Klipsch as efficient speakers that should be easy to drive. Apparently not true in every case.
My Denon receiver has an option to switch between 4 and 8 ohms. Also you can use eco mode with 8 ohms which does exactly the same, lower the voltage and thus current and power output. The audio quality suffers though, it aounds like an 8 bit dac on the old Commodore Amiga computers lol!
My diy speakers crossovers, I've incorporated a lot of your advice in them, componemt choice, phase alignmemt, impedance etc. And it sounds great! Much better than the generic crossovers I was using temporarily obviously. Still using sandcast resistors but when I finally finish tweaking I'll get some high quality multi layer metal oxide resistors. Air core inductors and polycaps are already in place. Removed the steel parts from the binding posts and replaced with brass. I did notice that some mkt caps have steel in them, and some resistor leads are also magnetic. It's hard to avoid if even reputable brands carry such components.
You should NEVER set any receiver to anything but the highest ohm setting (usually 8 ohm), if it is adjustable, even if using 4 ohm speakers... the setting doesn't do what you think. I forget the details, but Audioholics made this very clear.
My cousin had one of those football sets! Thank you for posting.
The players in my electric football set almost always went in circles, no matter how much I played with the plastic spikes underneath. Looked more like a square dance than a football game 😅
I had one of those in 1968 his comments brought back happy memories.
I had one of those electric football sets. Remember the foot ball was a piece of felt, and there was a kicker player too. I never got much out of playing with it, more fun with erector sets, or taking apart my transistor AM radios and messing with the adjustments LOL good times.
I had either the Steelers vs Rams or Steelers vs Cowboys...
Grumpy hot day, today?😀 some bite in the presentation today and AC on that. Love it. Keep em accurate!
A btw comment.
Hearing you "ting" that Klipsch chasis with a nail flick bought back memories. When I first opened 1 of a pair of Tannoy Lancaster speakers i'd bought s/h in the early-1990s & loved their all-round sound & above all previous, (I had e/stats & ribbon hybrids & other boxes before & after but i still remember the most magical musical moments (f.w.o.a.b.description.) coming from those Tannoys. But i was amazed at the engineering quality of those single 2'way 15"inch dual concentric structures, (tho the cabs were the cheapest lightweight boxes in their 15" D.C. range in dire need of bracing i gave them) They were built in 1969 according to the faded signed & dated test-pass labels stuck on their rears & worked fine until 2005'ish (a good 35'yr run from new!) when one developed a bass-rumble, i took the driver apart & the short story was: i slightly filed down all around the outer facing coil area progressively until it didnt rub anymore in the magnet gap, then it worked fine for another 15'ish years at all except very loud vollumes, with clean bass but then started to rumble again at any vol' so i've had to give up on them as i can't file the coil down further nor get the cone to move in a linear fashion by any other trickery so they're stashed away with 1 working driver, I shall miss them very much, nobody i contacted can put an original cone or a new chasis edge termination on the pair (for matching) as it's not the l8r foam type edging but something to take far longer explaining. But boy oh boy ...the quality of engineering in 1969, & the 'ting' of that klipsch chasis!
Right now the best speaker out is the Dutch & Dutch self powered. But yea. 14k . Passive…I’m still thinking DANNYS stuff especially with small or mid sized rooms.
Its really crazy how many HT systems are rated at 4ohms! The vast majority of AVRs are minimum 6ohm, why the 4 ohm revolution?? I've read that it's not as common as it used to be when u drive your amps way under rated ohmage, many AVRs now will either shut down in some sort of protection, or you will get horrible distortion. Which isn't so bad considering it used to be that u would literally cook your amps back in the day!. Still, that is some sort of industry planned obsolescence, I think.
Great job as usual Danny!
4 ohms vs. 8 ohms bumps up the efficiency spec.
@@1mctous Im not so sure if that is a full given but even so if it does give a bump in efficiency is not worth damaging your electronics.
Sure, if true your volume might be louder, but your amps risk damage, protection, or distortion. That's like giving every car nitrous systems. You will be faster but you fuck up your engine in a month.
The Monoprice Monolith 365c (and the entire Monolith series) uses HDF (and not MDF)..., and so although not the thickest cabinets, the HDF material is quite bit harder/stiffer then MDF. Also (see Danny's other Monolith vids) the woofer baskets are a bit better than the Klipsch and don't ring as much (as Danny showed in this video when tapping on the Klipsch woofer basket). Lastly, although Danny is correct, Monoprice has designed and knows folks will most likely be crossing over the Monolith series of speakers at 80hz, thereby alleviating some of the power-handling concerns that Danny brought up should you drive any of the Monolith series of speakers Full-range. Even the 460T/465T towers should be crossed cover at 80 or worse case 60hz (IMO). Speaker upgrade kit here I come! 😍
I think you mean the Monolith THX series, right?
This one is definitely HDF, but the Monpprice Monolith Audition and Encore series are all MDF I believe
@@Ranguvar13 Correct, I speak to the entire Monoprice Monolith speaker line.
th-cam.com/video/JA2j1g_1uKM/w-d-xo.htmlsi=ZylMjA7XzD_VDiHL
Another great video as usual 👍
It’s hot & humid in SE Louisiana not Texas Hot but just a little bit less but the high humidity is just kicks the uncomfortable level up a notch. Stay cool Texas Friends!
Texas is a very large state with various different geographies and climate zones, so the term "Texas Hot" is a misnomer. Texas geographies vary from coastal regions along the Gulf of Mexico, to dense forest areas in the eastern part of the state (next to Louisiana), to the Texas Hill Country in the middle of the state, to the desert areas of West Texas. Texas even has numerous mountain peaks between 7000 to 8700 feet in elevation. If you are looking for really hot try Phoenix (expected to hit 113 F today, which is pretty normal for this time of year) or even Las Vegas (expected to hit 111 F today) not to mention Death Valley in CA where it will hit 121 F today.
@@Mark-rw3kw A few days ago the hottest spot in the country was a little town just West of us by about 38 miles. In Vernon, Texas they hit 113 a few days ago.
@@Mark-rw3kw yep very true but also there has been a weather effect recently of a large ridge of high pressure creating a heating effect over a large area of these different parts of Texas driving normal temperatures to abnormal levels. NOAA weather reports are beginning to suggest à weakening of this ridge which should lessen the abnormally high temperatures over the various parts of Texas. Yep the Desert Southwest will always have their characteristic heating but the phenomena of abnormally higher temperatures over large portions of Texas has created dangerous heat levels for many citizens of the Great State of Texas. Stay cool my Friends. 👍🏻
@@dannyrichie9743 I don't know about a few days ago (I don't have access to prior day temps), but the high temp today in Death Valley CA is expected to be 121 F. They don't call it Death Valley for nothing. In Phoenix, it is not at all unusual to reach 115 F in the summertime.
@@Mark-rw3kw Maybe they just happened to be cooler on that day, and not in Vernon. I can remember when my home town of Wichita Falls was the hottest place in the country a few times. www.extremeweatherwatch.com/cities/wichita-falls/highest-temperatures
It's only about 90 in Delaware but the humidity index is wet very wet.
I appreciate the level of detail you give in your analysis of speakers and why and how certain components make a difference. It seems you often talk about iron core inductors in a negative way. Would you always put an air core inductor on over an iron core even on the woofer?
The core will tend to cause some smearing effect. You can get away with them in ranges below 200Hz. However, when you get up into the midrange the effect can become unacceptable.
Hello Danny. Just a suggestion regarding impedance, I think that it would be very useful to your audience if you would show and discuss and explain the EPDR response curve with respect to frequency, and the local minimums in that curve, to better account for the combination of both impedance magnitude and phase.
Vituixcad and REW are both capable of adding the EPDR curve as a third curve in the impedance response chart, along with curves for magnitude and phase.
Yes, the EPDR curve is confusing to me.
The football players @400Hz could be a new industry standard for enclosure integrity 😁👍
Kind regards from Turkey 👍🇹🇷
The electric football joke was hysterical. I loved that game.
Which is why my system uses separate amps for each channel. Yes, I have 4 amps for a 5.1 system that is mostly used as a 2.1 system. My rear and center channels are only used while watching movies.
Please consider doing an explanation of what you're referring to in your waterfall graphs. There are probably some newbies that would like to follow along with your videos but lack those basics. Still hoping you'll do an " off grid" system video
Damn youve confirmed to me that klipsch are terrible speakers, i thought they were but wow this confirms it 100% i recently listened to a pair of the front speakers that go with this center, damn they sounded like tin cans, very bright and grainy sounding.
Oh WOW. I had one of those football tables. Yikes! We're old. Thanks for the memory.
Yes we are.
The last thing you need in Texas is another sand cast resistor radiating heat!
Iron core inductors…
I'm so glad that I live in the UK, thus making it a lot more difficult for me to source such crappy speakers - besides which, we have plenty of our own companies making equally atrocious - sounding gear!
Id like to point out the fact that when drivers play out of phase it does more than just make the range quiet. It actually creates an extremely uncomfortable, fatiguing effect where it feels like theres is this immense pressure on your ears whenever your listening to music with lots of information in that crossover range. Same thing happens when a subwoofer plays perfectly out of phase with your speaker. If you play a sine wave exactly at the frequency thats out of phase, you hear almost no sound but your ear drums feel like they’re going to explode. Very very fatiguing and almost painful even. I had the same experience when listening to certain songs on my klipsch rp-600ms which is why I ultimately returned them.
Everytime you say "monolith speakers" I had a slight giggle 😁.
Anyway, thanks for the video and good luck with the weather
It is a Monolith THX 365 speaker. Monolith speakers are made by Monoprice.
klipsch has catered to the Amazon customer for quite some time with this series.
good on them, but they should stop trying to fool them.
Klipsch must be bribing every single Hi-Fi review channel on TH-cam because the bad reviews are few and far between.
Texas in summer? wow i feel your pain, luckily i live in the UK stays pretty average in temperatures
Thanks for your informative reviews. I noticed in many of your speaker crossover evaluations, you often find metal that a magnet will attract. I am curious as to why this is undesirable? Additionally, I bought some banana plugs ends for my speaker wire. But I noticed my magnet is attracted to them. I also noticed they negatively affected the sound quality. Why is that happening? Thank you
Ferrous material will hold a residual charge and cause audible smearing.
@@dannyrichie9743 Very cool that you take the time to answer. Thank you.
Yes! Electric Football, ... one of the best Christmas gifts ever.
It was all in the orientation of the plastic hairs on the bottom of the players.
Obnoxious sounding, ridiculously unplayable, yet still a cool, iconic game.
It accompanied a handful of iconic games sharing the same form factor, ... tabletop hockey, Air Hockey, etc. We had most all of them!
I remember ABC Monday Night Football, an x/y axis game, lighting up the result of the play.
Very cool "computerized" result!
Both offensive and defensive side select the play by their slider ... when both are ready, presss the button and the battery lights the bulb illuminating the text screen from below!
My Dad dug all that stuff, thus we had 'em all.
Even had the OG gaming rig, the Magnavox Odyssey.
Sat at a table and played games all through the 60's and 70's.
I recognize today I was exceedingly fortunate.
“House Sound” 😂
Danny, show us on the doll here where Klipsch hurt you.
Based on this data Klipsch hurt a lot of people
Good one lol🤣🤣
Thanks. What would be the main difference if you put the woofers in series to lift the impedance?
It's a good idea no side effects other than a slight drop in volume with solid state amps
Have the designers of the Monoprice speakers compansated for the increased Q-value due to the series resistor?
Maybe they just needed to increase that Q-value.
I get why loudspeaker terminals should not be made from magnetic steel. But what about power cables and their connects or the sockets? Does that affect anything?
Yes it does. That's why some of us hotrod our equipment,
Good question.
Loudspeaker terminal;
If any magnetic interactions impact the signal feeding the loudspeaker they will be reproduced by the loudspeaker, ... or to the best ability of the loudspeaker.
The line side;
Whereas such impacts on the power, on the line side of the system, ... essentially all that's filtered out in each component's power supplies.
Hope that helps.
@@FOH3663Oh Dear! Wait till you figure out what components leads in your amp/source are made of ...
@@paulb4661
Will you elaborate, I don't know what you're referring to.
@@FOH3663 Diodes, transistors, resistors and capacitor leads are not made of oxygen free, grain oriented, audiophile grade, mono crystal, cryogenically seasoned copper, but from copper clad, tin plated steel. These elements combine to produce the signal reaching gold plated, machine grade brass terminals at the back of equipment.
Danny can we do a video sometime on dual concentric speakers by tannoy they are great speakers very well liked in Uk and Japan
it's funny that manufacturers that spent years developing these products don't know what they're doing and Danny knows better. Of course "upgraders" have to make money somehow, what better way to make the products look bad to achieve that. Only specs and graphs alone don't make the perfect speaker, if i like the sound of my speakers that's what really matters, and that is a personal preference which is not measured in Ohms, Khz, or frequency charts.
I just bought the 365c thx hoping it sounds better then my 12 yr old center
Favorite game as a kid, electric football.. 😂🍿✌
Danny, though it would be costly, speaker manufacturers should run their designs by you before they offer their products to the general public who is becoming more educated about audio. You are an encyclopedia of loudspeaker design
Or just run it by literally any competent speaker designer.
You are like the Munroe of speaker reviews !
Great video Danny , I just now started using center and surrounding channels , I went with 5 inch mark audio full range , and a 6 inch to compare. The result wad so shocking to a bunch of buddies that a center channel and surrounds was a small fraction of the cost of my home built , now they are coming at me to build them center and surround speakers . Why does the industry not take this approach?
See our LGK 2.2 model. gr-research.com/product/lgk-2-2-kit-single/ Our LGK driver sounds MUCH better than the drivers from Mark Audio too.
@@dannyrichie9743 Well, of course you're not going to say a competitor's speaker driver sounds better lol
@@RennieAsh I would if it did, but it is not even close. We have measurements on theirs too. They are rough.
Def some real Class D weather down there in Tejas! I feel for any Pass Labs customers down there thats for sure, lol. Monoprice holds no shame the designs are derivative of other brands.
Pass Labs owner here. Yeah, sux having a "space heater" on top of it being 100+ degrees outside. Need to move to AK.
I have a pair of old Klipsch bookshelves. In addition to your kit, would adding a wedge brace inside add any benefit to the sound in addition to the No Rez?
It wouldn't hurt.
Would Micca speakers be too cheap for a budget 7.1 in wall system?
I've got quite a few speakers, pity can't send them in. Also I guess you couldn't test bipole/dipole/tripole speakers?
Can you show us pre and post upgrade frequency responses on these monolith speakers?
The upgrade will be a parts for parts value for value swap. So the measured response will not change.
Got rid of my Klipsch center channel. So disappointed in the quality. And I have a lot of Klipsch. They owe it to us to up their game on these. Looks pretty, but falls short on sound. Come on Klipsch. Do or do not, there is no try.
Can you review in wall speakers?
If you can't afford klipsch go with monoprice its still rock
HA! HA! Electric football, brilliant!
Hi Danny! Are you ever going to design/ sell DIY Kits for an inwall application for home theater? This is an underserved market.
Wishlist would be, high output capabilities and dynamics( around 105 db at 1m with low distortion) but would fit in a 4 - 6 inch depth stud bay.
I've thought about it, but there is no way of offering one and being able to guarantee the results. There are too many variables from how to mount them, how to stabilize them, how to deal with flimsy sheetrock, different amounts of surface area, varying stud centers, etc.
Another thing Danny , besided not getting a increase in power handling as well a increase of decibles in efficiency, what about running 2 4 ohm in series for a 8 ohm total impedance.
If the company was willing to have a second version of the woofers made then simply paralleling two 16 ohm woofers would be ideal.
404c or the new 404c m ii?
Klipsch didn’t re-design their crossovers, YOU GUYS DID!! lol
Hey Danny :-) I have maybe a dumb question. But maybe is it possible to wire the woofers in series instead of parallel and make it 8 ohms? And then of course make new crossover to it? Is it doable?
I'm not Richie, but my guess is that it could be doable. But the bass spl would be cut by at least a full 3 db over the entire driver's range - a tad too much.
Aside from that, I must have missed the part where he mentions they're wired parallel. Are they? At 3.6 ohms, I forgive anyone who assumes so.
It would then be about 14 ohms and the sensitivity would drop to a level that the mid and tweeter would have to be brought down to match it.
@@dannyrichie9743 Okay, but then it can be driven harder, becouse you will not have restrictions in resistor heat dissipation? Maybe for bass, but not for mid and tweet?
@@peterpida1840 If they were wired in series then certainly their would be no resistor limiting power, but that is not a good solution.
What speakers is better for music between 1,500 each one.
" between 1,500 each one?"
Wouldn't it be good to just put the bass speakers in series for 4,6ohms?
The Monolith cabinet has the curved sides, so this does reduce the standing waves on the inside, and is stiffer that it otherwise would be?
Those are both good questions. AFAIK, the answers should both be yes, in theory. And they say that, in theory, what works in theory should work in practice. But in practice, sometimes it doesn't.
They are loaded with enough polyfill to handle internal standing waves. It will also help resonance issues a little, but they are still pretty flimsy.
@@dannyrichie9743 That's what I was guessing, pretty much.
It's been unbearable here in TX.
It’s 1:20 pm in central Texas and it’s 85 degrees.
Love your videos.
Question: what gear are you using to capture the freq responses? For some reason I'm thinking you're using an Earthworks mic, but I cannot imagine what mic preamp you're using.
Also, how do you verify the accuracy of your recording gear? Thanks.
I am using the professional version of the Clio measuring system.
@@dannyrichie9743 thanks for your response.
I’ve always had an intense passion for speakers. Am I crazy to be thinking about buying a desktop cnc machine and building my own speakers? Unfortunately I live in a condo at the moment :( but I think a lot of the newer cncs aren’t very loud or messy
GR has full kis and support
There is no getting around loud. The noise is just something you'll have when cutting any material with a high speed bit
My Klipsch fronts sound best off axis. 🤣
You're just just giving credit where credit is due, I didn't think you were endorsing the product in the slightest.
What do you like?
Systems that get out of the way and let me hear the music.
The total weight of the driver is irrelevant; if anything more mass means less resonance. A large magnet structure is generally a good thing: more magnet strength, more sensitivity; more magnet depth, a longer and more linear gap for larger x-max.
What you think you're saying or mean to be talking about is the moving mass of the driver, which you did NOT feel when you picked up the whole thing. When it comes to sensitivity and upper frequency extension, and your impulse response / waterfall graphs, what can matter there is MOVING MASS, i.e. the weight of the cone, the voice coil, and to a lesser extent other moving parts (spider/surround), not the weight of the whole package.
I know you're a smart guy and I respect what you do but man, this one is just obvious.
Yep, I know all of that. Did I make a blooper in there somewhere? It is easier to do than you think when the camera is rolling and you are trying to keep on going without pause.
It’s pretty hard make something worse than Klipsch.
Just a thought: Why GR not making your brand speakers???
I watched yesterday B&Wilkins Nautilus series factory production, there’s a two year wait to get and sell it for $70.000 for a pair LOL. I know for that price everything is about labor hours then a speaker itself but what about YOU ????? Yes, demographic catastrophe in United States isn't perfect time for business like this but.... You never know.
How long we need to trust our ears to China made Klipsh or other speakers????
64k 💪
Rapping on steel basket.
Attach to baffle, rap again, and tell me it's gonna be audible
4 Ohms...OUCH!
🤔Never understood the lure of polishing turds.
If all the parts were good, the designs would probably be pretty good too, and you wouldn’t even need to think about any mods. If the drivers and crossovers are cheap, the whole box design probably isn’t much different in terms of quality. At that point, either get a better speaker, or design and build your own! 😉
Sometimes the drivers are not bad and the box is workable. With some upgrades here and there, the results can be very good and low cost.
@@dannyrichie9743
Ah yes, I do understand that sometimes that is indeed the case, but I wonder what percentage of the time that isn’t the case🤔
People are going to expect you to work magic for them in either case.😉
19 mm = 3/4"
Oh, then it was not 19mm.
Nobody mentions the horrible vinyl wrap used by Klipsch. Even a fly can leave a scratch. And it looks ugly like a garbage bag.
This guy takes an exciting topic and bores the living CRAP out of me.
What's the definition of insanity again... Klipsch. Amazing the name still sells this junk...
Your video titles says Monoprice, yet your lips say monolith... :0
Monoprice is the company and Monolith is this series of speakers.
@@dannyrichie9743 thx
You talk way too much and say nothing ..I have you at 1.5x speed and I cannot imagine having to listen at normal speed.
great and pretty predictable result
Mr. Danny
I dare you to make a product from scratch, and I mean literally from scratch, that will compete with Klipsch. And I mean compete with Klipsch as in price, finish and sound quality. Just for the record, just about anyone can do what you're doing. I don't by any means consider you a genius, and if you are, please let us know what patents you are currently holding.
Just about anyone can improve on someone else's finished product. So be careful about how you present these videos that you are making. You are coming across as a not so cool individual. Amir already tore apart some of your finished products and I can remember how badly you responded to that.
I dare you to put together a couple models of speakers in a completely finished package that will compete against the likes of Klipsch in price, finish and sound quality. And after you do, please feel free to criticize all these manufacturers in the manner that you do!
First of all, Amir has no idea what he is doing.
Secondly, I have designed a LOT of products from beginning to end that they have won pretty much every industry award from every magazine. That even includes a pair of speakers that launched at $199 a pair and won a LOT of awards including a few product of the year awards.