1 Hour Red Rust Bluing
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 มิ.ย. 2024
- In this video I make and rust blue some milling machine vise clamps. I rust blued them in about an hour. I use standard stuff found in the house: white vinegar, hydrogen peroxide, salt, a common degreaser and some dihydrogren monoxide (aka water). A nice black rust resistant coating is created on the parts - perfect for the home shop. A fellow Cancuk has a very good blog post and influenced me on the process: mypeculiarnature.blogspot.ca/...
While the process is easy, please make sure you take appropriate precautions. Wear gloves and safety goggles and watch out for burns. TSP can be nasty - if you don't want to use TSP there are safer alternatives.
You can read more on my blog at www.thecogwheel.net - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
"If you are married, that would be a hazard to your health".... Thanks for making my day!
That and the Dutch flag on ‘significantly cheaper’ Dutch people approve.
Especially if it includes a mother in law. 😂
This method is perfectly viable for naturally rusted stuff as well.
Just give it a good scrubbing in warm soapy water, rinse and boil it for a few minutes and the Fe3O4 conversion will take place!
Thank you for this video thecogwheel!
Something to be mindful of during this process is that the rusting phase will create magnetite and haematite. Boiling the part will convert haematite to magnetite, however it will not be a dense layer that magnetite usually forms. Which is why it is important to wipe away the loose haematite deposits. Also, the longer you wait for each rusting phase the thicker and more porous your final layer will be. This is a time consuming process because you have to limit each rusting phase to a very thin deposit or brush off 90% of the rust deposit since it was too loose to be useful.
interesting - thanks for the info!
I wouldn't have cared even if this didn't work, that intro sold me. Thanks for the video, really appreciate it!
Very Good! I will be using this on all my work from now on. Down here is south Texas we get cold fronts, then they back up as warm fronts, humidity will condense on everything in the shop. This will cut down on my rust remdiation A LOT!!!! Thank you.
Great mix of practical advise coupled with some of the scientific information that helps us all learn and understand - thanks!
I surfed the web to learn this process too. Did nearly the same as you on a single bit axe head. I think three times but only used cold tap water. I didn't know about immersing in hot to set black. Thanks for the tips.
Its taken me most of the weekend but I think I have it right and repeatable. I followed Justin's method and also read the blog he linked in the info and like he said and its read some changes may need to be made but on both instances its a really great start. The TSP was a great degreaser, follow Justin's amounts. I used both 3% & 6% hydrogen peroxide I found using 3% required an extra tablespoon of salt and required 1 less for the 6%. I used the same amount about quater of a cup. Heat it up as per the video. I used 8% acidic vinegar same times displayed in the video. I brushed it on as per the video, dried it off with a heat gun as per the video I just gently wiped of the bubbly bits before putting it in the boiling water. I live in Brisbane Australia and our tap water worked no differently than using demineralised water, I tried both. I followed Justin's instructions and ecthed the parts straight out of the water. Once etched I dried them off and followed the process from step 2 through to 5 until I was happy with the black oxide finish personal preference. If your strapped for time doing the final boil for 10 minutes works just as good as 20 minutes. Changing the water before the last boil isn't a must from what I tell it keeps the oil cleaner without transferring red oxide residue. I tried 3 types of oil soak, vegetable oil, mineral oil and new engine oil. Forget the engine must have something to do with the detergents in it. Vegetable oil worked well but mineral oil (baby oil) worked best. Oil soaking time didn't effect anything if I soaked overnight or soaked it until it cooled down. All in all in, my first time doing any black oxidising it was great fun i learnt so much about household chemicals, Justin's video has an excellent explanation and easy to follow process. All ingredients purchased from the supermarket except hydrogen peroxide i purchased that from my local chemist. Give it a try. Thanks for sharing it.
I'm here in the philippines, thanks for sharing such a wonderful info and works... Great skill..
Thanks for your hard work and effort!
Enlightening!! Super easy way to rust blue parts at home! Thx for the great info!
Just trying this and a big thanks for a simple straight forward video. This is much cheaper than cold bluing solution.
Worked perfectly for me. Thank you Sir! I learned a new skill today.
As a side note: I just rinsed the rusty paste off under the tap every time before I dunked it into the boiling water.
Great solution for home bluing. Thanks for showing.
5 lbs Sodium Hydroxide (lye), 2 1/2 lbs Sodium Nitrate and 1 gallon distilled water. Mix together and bring up to around 300 degrees (be careful when mixing because it generates heat) and put your parts to be blued in for around 20 mins and rinse off and coat with oil and your done. You can use Ammonium Nitrate instead of Sodium Nitrate but that releases toxic ammonia gas so best to do that outside. Ammonium nitrate can be found in the CVS brand instant cold packs.
You are a CHAMPION!!!🏆
300° Celsius or the Fahrenheit measurement? And thank you for the recipe - i heard it is the only one which is easy and fast. And cheap.
Big thanks from Germany.
sorry that is 300 degrees Fahrenheit.
do some research before you attempt this. this mixture reacts badly with aluminum. I mix it in a stainless steel pot and I put water in first and add the other ingredients one at a time and just a little at a time until it is dissolved in the water.@@kevinmullner4280
As a Dutchman I'm happy to find the easy and cheap bluing method. Thank you
same here
@@user-py5qq4ht8l inderdaad
Great video, looking forward to give it a try. Thank you
Hello, thank you so mutch for your video. I just finish to blue a part with your technique. Result amazing. Thanks.
Black oxide coatings on tools are my favorite. Nicely done sir.
BTW Justin, how is the DRO perfroming?
I agree Warren. Classic look. Thanks for the support.
So far so good. I think I got my money out of it already.
Beautiful results. I am definitely going to try it.
Great video. Thanks for taking time to post
I cant believe I haven't heard about this sooner. I'll give this a try myself. Thanks!
the hydrogen peroxide can rust the parts too quickly and cause pitting, which might not be much of a concern for clamps but it's good to keep in mind. there are some rust bluing methods that employ peroxide, but for saline solutions and a durable even coat of black iron oxide; coat the parts in the saline and leave in the shop overnight/until copper colored, boil, remove non-adherent black oxide with mild abrasives and minimal force, and repeat that process until the desired finish is reached. second pass of rust bluing will be bronze-colored, so on and so forth.
This is an informative awesome video. Its amazing what those Canadians can accomplish lol!
Hi, thank you for sharing this process. Amazing. I have tried it today and I am stunned by the results. After the 3rd boil, I tried buffing the parts lightly with fine steel whool. This works great, it really brings the deep colours out. Also, it seemed that after steel whooling, the next layer was more uniform. So, I did a few more and the parts look fantastic!
That's calling carding the rust - I believe gunmakers did that between every bout in the rust cabinet. You can also use a nylon brush and a drill.
@@SantiagoArraga can I use a sand paper to do the same?
@@arshakmohammed7028 Will probably be too abrasive unless you go to 5000+ grit sandpaper. I do not have experience with that.
great music and information, cheers from Florida, Paul
Great, now I need a hotplate, money money money... lol, jk. Great video, not many options around here to find cold bluing solutions and stuff. Always a pleasure to learn new things, thanks for the video 👍😁👍.
hahaha dihyro.. good one.. didnt even notice at first. i was like ok some chemical. Beautiful results in little time with simple and safe chemicals. Thanks
Thanks for watching!
Finally I found a rust bluing tutorial! great! thanks for that.
What I want to achieve is brown rust patina like you find on old door knobs. Let's see if this process can be used.
Nicely done. Informative!
Thanks Paul.
Nicely done Justin!
ATB, Robin
Thanks Robin!
This is magical. I am trying to black out my motorcycle and for the usual nuts and bolts I just buy new ones that come in black. But there's this one pesky brake lever part that's very specific to the bike that you can only get it in silver. I was contemplating spray painting it but it's a functional moving part, so I don't wanna gunk-up a life-saving mechanism. I think your process is perfect for this purpose. I think i might just do that side that's visible just to preserve as much material strength as possible.
consider Ceracoating,used on guns and rifles,very thin,and long lasting,matt finish.
Great demonstration and excellent results!! I've done this a few years ago on an axe head and some other small homemade (ugly) tools, I had good results with a mixture of just H2O2 and table salt for my rust-inducing solution, but it wasn't as fast acting as yours!
Having the part warm works very well and I've found brushing it on is quicker than dunking the parts. Also hydrogen peroxide doesn't actually have that long of a shelf life. You need fresh stuff for it to work quickly.
Vinegar, bleach and salt mix will rust steel very quickly, especially if warmed.
Sorry I can't remember the mix ratio.
5% vinegar is what you normally use for pickling called 50 grain you can get 10% called 100 grain at the store too.
Been rust blueing for years with nitric acid.
This is an excellent video.
keep up the good work. love the pod cast
Thanks man! Love the Timberjack. I actually worked at the plant where it was built for a little while (it was then owned by John Deere).
I miss your contents so much I'm back to re-watch your old videos again, hope you are safe and ok!
Stay tuned ... big project about to drop
@@thecogwheel can't wait!
Steam works great and it's fast for rusting.
Great idea I need to try this out myself
Thanks!
great info on the Bluing, Thanks!
You are welcome!
I like the rust bluing, going to try that out.
The old 'Brown Bess' blunderbuss were rust-blued, but the rusting chemistry was different.
Antimony salts were commonly used...you'd get a deep purple-brown finish.
Was common to 'scald' steel parts using cooking oil after they were colored...like seasoning a frying-pan.
Great video thank you
Looks easy as hell.thank you.
Btw after etching would that solution added with coroded steel wool give more thickness at once?thanks again.
Nicely done. Most impressed w 11+k subs and no ads! Loved the music. Electrolysis to convert the red iron oxide to black iron oxide might work more painlessly. I know it removes "rust" and the parts look black afterwards, but I'm not sure it's actually converting Fe2O3 to Fe3O4.
Thanks for the video.
Worked great
Nice vid! the Dutch flag when saying the word cheap... awesome ;-) (i am Dutch)
Good video. Thanks
Thanks for sharing it! I'm gonna try it with my old cast iron pan. Would it work start by boiling a rusted piece (not the pan) as first step?
TSP is known as "sugar soap" in the civilized world for those who are not USAINS :)
so in America, one may simply add plain sugar to plain dish soap?
Will this work on stainless steel, like socket head cap screws that you want to have a black finish on, for appearances? Thanks. Great video and can't wait to try it.
thanks for sharing!
Would placing the parts straight into a container with the peroxide mix for a few minutes and then in to the hot water work at making the end result quicker and easier or just destroy the parts, thank you for your video
I like this process. How do you scale it up to boil parts that cannot fit into a rice cooker/hotpot? I have a farriers rasp and a drawknife that need doing.
Terrific thanks
You can do traditional bluing at home! It’s no more caustic than using draino to unclog a drain. In addition, it produces a hell of a lot nicer finish than this method.
Thanks for nice video. What is the abrasion resistance?
I MISS THE PODCAST!
I have better luck using gun bluing and a torch. While it's hot, I put it in burnt motor oil. I use 0000 steel wood to clean the parts up. It takes about 3 treatments. I do a final dip in clean motor oil and use a rag. I made a hitch pin for my riding mower to pull my lawn aerator. It'll last about a month, but I still got some rust on it. The only thing that helps is using a clearcoat finish.
I use a vinegar, salt, hydrogen peroxide bath to etch some of my carbon steel knives. May try doing a vinegar etch and then a hot hydrogen peroxide and salt bath in the future to see how it compares.
Any idea what temp is the conversion happening at? And can you get the conversion using time rather than temp, or some other process / chemical? I'd be iffy boiling a blade that had a handle already attached, that's asking for the epoxy / handle material to be compromised. (I'll often take the blades out of the acid bath and put them straight into a tank of water for a few hours, seems to "set" the etch. That or bring them right in the house and run hot water over the blade for about a minute, that seems to have the same effect).
How passive layer can turn red again when you brush it ? also use amonium nitride for elevating water boiling temp.
Question; did you use distilled/demineralized water or just regular tap water? My tap water has a lot of minerals so I'm curious if that makes a difference.
Edit: I guess I should have watched the video all the way through before asking questions
Ty very much
final, a homebrew recipe! 3 questions:
1) is the etch absolutely necessary? look to do some close tolerance parts, would rather not etch. (yes I know the blue is also effecting tolerances)
2) why not dip the parts? you'd have to mix new solution each coat, or maybe just each batch if your quick. be a lot quicker & prob more even, no?
3 its been a few years now, how's the finish holding up?
I'm having a problem where whenever I finish step 5 and go back to step 2, the vinegar eats through the blackened steel and leaves me with bare steel again. Any suggestions?
I've always used a heated mixture of salt and vinergar and soaked the parts in it until the desired color is acheived then rinse with soada water and thoroughly dry and oil. It's much safer and no worry of embrittlement on hardened parts.
Is it safe to blue a steel plate and then eat off of it your cooked food?
In this case yes as long as its cleaned off well enough afterwards. Nothing used in this method is especially toxic and should all be gone by the time the part is finished, what's left is basically just black rust, so iron.
If anything, the moisture/oils/acids etc from food might hurt the finish over time though but it should act just like cast iron cookware, so with some maintenance and cleaning practices it should hold up just fine.
There are other bluing methods I wouldn't eat off of however this one is safe. Just use mineral oil to finish it instead of something toxic like gun or motor oil.
@@JSnyder49428 mineral oil is the same as gun oil is the same as car oil.
Bad idea. Without oil to keep the water away, you'll get blooms of red rust fairly quickly. If you use vegetable oil throughout, it should be food safe, but it'll scratch where you use your knife, and the blue will also very rapidly rust where there's salts, vinegar, or any other acid. Putting it through a dishwasher could be an interesting experiment!
@@NigelTolley No. They aren't.
Mineral oil is food safe. Motor oil, even the conventional kinds, are loaded with toxic additives you definitely wouldn't want to rub into your cutting board. Most gun oils aren't even real oils at all, but most often some sort of synthetic and/or silicone based lubricant.
This is essentially no different from eating out of a seasoned cast iron skillet.
@@NigelTolley um, no. oil used on guns has a specific set of properties, including viscosity.
I want to blue-black some screws I bought from the hardware store. They are shiny, probably a cad coating. Will your procedure work or do I need to d0 something first to get rid of the coating?
Yes, distilled water works just fine
The question was, does it work better, and I think it depends on how many and what type minerals are in your tap water. Where I live tap and distilled work the same.
When you say it can effect the hardness in metal will it be more than the slow rust bluing process?
This is similar to Mark Lee rust bluing. What volume is the hydrogen peroxide used in the video?
This process does not affect the form of the steel? size? Specially, if there’s fine threads on the part that is being process?
so what happens if you start by degreasing and then boil the parts and add the peroxide to the boiling water?
Nice work. You mentioned hydrogen embrittlement on harder steels, what did you make your clamps out of? Thanks. R.J.
Thanks RJ. The clamps are just medium carbon steel with no hardening. I make a fair bit of home shop tooling out of it and I have no issues. Hard parts would be like Rc40 or greater. You can mitigate the dangers of hydrogen embrittlement through a post baking process in a conventional cooking oven but that was more detail than I wished to fit in.
id like to see a video on this subject
@@thecogwheel Would you bake in the oven after each application or at the very end of the whole process? I'd like to use this to blue knife blades. Thanks!
Hydrogen embrittlement is a problem with 1000N/mm² + Steels.
It´s when hydrogen in the water difuses into the steel structure and makes it brittle to a point where the steel develops cracks or can simply easily brake later on.
This happens often in a galvanic bath, when coating parts.
Should you use high strength steel (bigger than the 1000N/mm²) you have to bake it no later than 2h after the process.
In general this is a very complex topic, to proper understand it you need some knowledge in metallurgy. I am a mechanical engineer and I know this issues exists but even I don´t fully know how exactly it works.
Nice!
Thanks Jim.
Great video! Do you think can be done on guns?
Would this finish be suitable for my jeep bumpers? They are raw steel atm. I think it'll look cool after it weather's a while just curious about rust prevention. I live in the desert by the way
What is the strength of you hydrogen peroxide? Also I tried this, and the results are very patchy, it does not give a uniform coat, even after very thorough degreasing. The black stuff can also be wiped off by hand. What could I do wrong?
Just imagine what a boon to Zerust turning this into aerosol can product would be!
what salt do you mix with hydrogen peroxide? and what temp do you boil ?
Great video, what type of oil do you use at the end?
looks like common mineral oil. you can get it easily from the drug store (sold as laxative)
I've been looking for a guide on how to do this for ages.. - didn't even know what it was called. Thanks for this. H2O is toxic if you have too much of it. I don't know how much is too much but you need to be careful with it if you have kids or small pets who might confuse it with plain old water. I bet some people didn't know that but it's true (I didn't know it but was always kind of wary of the stuff).
Thanks Stelios. Really have to watch out for that dihydrogen monoxide.
I've rust blued 4 or 5 firearms now and it takes about 20 hours per gun. The commercial rusting solutions they sell take about 3 hours to work with the gun suspended in a hot moist environment. I don't understand why your home-made solution works so fast!
Got an old s&w model 36 that I just cold blued and it came out like crap...think I might try this with it
Some steels work better than others. Rust bluing might take longer but the results maybe worth some additional effort. In Canada cod bluing is hard to buy at a reasonable price.
Did you ever do this. Im about to do it to a ruger redhawk that i bought used that someone painted
@@thecogwheel Also, cold bluing is not robust at all, and does not offer good corrosion resistance
this method will be very useful to me in making dark chainmail.
mind if i mirror this on my channel?
Can you use this method on hardened knife steel like 1084 ?
Its about the 5th time I've watched this video (this time copying the process into my shop notebook) and I just noticed that your Hot Air Gun is PowerFist... I got one of the 1st ones, and it is yellow... So, where abouts are you?
Hi, What hydrogen peroxide percentage did you use for this process.
Can i just throw my rusty wrenches into boiling water, and the rust will convert into black rust? That would be a great method to refurbish old tools! Gonna try it tomorrow.
Great bluing technique ! I'm going to try it. Up to now, I've been using a jeweler's patination product, which works very quickly, but it's toxic, so your approach should be better. BTW, the TSP isn't great for the environment. Thanks again for the videos and be careful with that dihydrogen oxide (aka oxygen dihydride).
Thanks Len. Yes TSP isn't the greatest, but you could use any degreaser. Still looking out for the MSDS and hazard sheet for oxygen dihydride....
would a salted lemon work for a rust solution?
Sir, I followed the steps carefully, but with any slight rubbing with my finger, the black color starts to disappear, and that happened after applying 7 layers.
What would you recommend doing before or after this process to give it a shiny gloss, like polishing with sandpaper?
You can't polish after or the blue will come right off! All polishing just come before. Most people will say this process is not good for high polish surfaces and there is no need to go higher than a 400 grit sandpaper.
Does this work with steel or iron?
I've been using a linseed oil/turpentine/Johnsons Paste wax/beeswax/japan dryer mixture for a black finish on my forgings. I wonder if this might be better? How mechanically durable is the finish?
That could be a good video for you to put up!
@@NigelTolley Sadly I don't have the production skills. I enjoyed your video brother.
Justin,
Will this work on mild steel? I tried it a week or so ago on 1018 and it didn't really seem to take.
Yes! Mild steel is one of the more common applications for this
Any reason not to dunk the parts in the nacl/h2o2?
Heat the blocks up with a torch then dip them in oil, blackens instantly and rust proofs them.
I believe another name that the give stronger acetic acid is cleaning vinegar, though I've never been able to find anything stronger than ordinary vinegar in New Zealand. I might try distilling it at some stage
I've thought about distilling it as well. Someday.
@@thecogwheel hey fellas if you still interested in acquiring vinegar on steroids my tip is Find In your area EUROPEAN food store with decent inventory form Eastern Europe and youll have your Vinegar at 33% , Hungary, Serbia, Croatia,etc,in our lil beehive of countries jammed together almost all of us have 20-33% vinegar only available in stores.. when i 1st tried Canada vinegar umm..(3or 5 %?) i thought someone trick me with lemon water.. hope i was able to help..thanks for a very thoughtful video and sharing the knowledge..
hydrochloric makes metal black too I wonder if this would make the blueing work better .
It does but it is rather nasty. I like this process because it is very straightforward. Everything is a trade off but I like non toxic for the home shop.
makes sense to be safer I was always a risk taker playing it safe was never my way ,you can image the life my parents had too deal with lol.